I swear, Kieran as a character is absolutely beautiful. I believe his character arc is overall one of the best ones that Pokémon has done. It still baffles me that Game Freak was able to pull such a literal 360 in character so flawlessly. It's actually amazing. It's part of the reason why I voice the fella so much.
Jerk rivals have all fallen flat on their faces because, it is impossible to take them seriously when you just whoop their asses every time you run into them. They just come off as sore losers in denial that they suck and have a 0-11 track record against you. Keiran actually solves that problem entirely by making his entire character arc revolve around the fact that he can't score a single win against you.
Underrated comment. A lot of people in the community hate friendly rivals and love jerk rival like Silver, Gladion, and of course Blue. But what they don’t realize is that their characters are what makes them compelling, not whether they’re friendly or jerks. A jerk rival can just be as bad as a friendly rival.
In Kieran's defence, he was right to masterball terapagos, like, he woke terapagos up just to see him go straight forward to us. That is a lotta damage
Honestly Kieran and Hop(who goes through something Similar) Made me think of just How Scary the Player must be from an Outside POV. Like yeah,we are great because Pokemon is a Game that has Mechanics that we can use to our Advantage,But imagine how terrifying Our player must be from an outsider view. -They can Catch Any Pokemon,Legendaries included. -They Win almost every Battle.usually very easily. -They can befriend Any person and Pokemon…Mostly Just because.(with some of them getting explanations) -if they play on Switch Style they can predict a Pokemon that will come in -They are essentially the Best Trainer in their Regions able to Command Perfectly each species that they caught And many more. In a lot of ways Our Player must be some kinda of…Eldrich Horror when thought deep enough.
I always found Kieran such a unique character in Scarlet and Violet. In fact, he became my favorite character because of how he never gives up on becoming a strong trainer just like the main character. Although it's such a shame that other people have mixed feelings about him just because they think he's just a little kid who should be put in their place.
I LOVE Kieran so much. I'm autistic and I tend to get more attached to fictional characters that others but Kieran is really special for me. I felt (still feel) such a genuine connection with him. I was really enjoying befriending him and spending the night at the festival with him..then Ogerpon happened. I felt like a jerk during this DLC. I wanted to tell him about Ogerpon right away and I was heart broken when the game forced me to lie and keep lying. it felt like I was doing him so dirty. he was such a sweetheart right up until that point. I get that he'd likely had still been angry if Ogerpon still chose us instead of him but at least he would have had a fair chance to also bond with her. she was only afraid of him imo bc his vibes where already off by the time they met. he was bitter and hurt from being lied to, and also had his own energy tainted with the loyal 3's energy. I relate to his struggles, when I was a teen and even current day. we share not only alot of physical features but emotional as well. it made me feel very seen as I havent experienced a character quite this close to my heart before. its nice to see someone do a proper character analysis and not just slam him constantly becuase he is such a great character. I'd be over the moon if they use him in any future projects and I really hope he's eventually added to Masters EX. Kieran is definetly my fictional character equevanlent of a soul mate lets put it that way. I got my dream ending to Indigo Disk, and Mochi Mayhem was such a treat lol I love how his arc ended despite not being satisfied with how no one really apologizes to Kieran. I know Kierans not ALL innocent but he was wronged alot too especially by Carmine and pc. I wish I could have at least told him I was sorry for everything as well. great video man!
Kieran as a character is someone I find myself relating to in more ways than I was expecting. Like him I was a shy kid who had trouble making friends, being all around generally awkward and not exactly knowing how to approach people. While at first I didn’t really have an obsession with being the best at games, when I eventually did met people in my life that had similar interests like Pokemon smash bros, playing against them sparked drive in me to be better and get on their level. I can confidently say now that I eventually did (and thankfully never developed an obsession that made me a jerk and push them away).
Kieran notable for pretty much being the first NPC to question why the player gets all the legendaries. Him catching Terapagos was Kieran trying to prevent you from having him only for that to backfire horribly
It takes them 9 generations to make them a trainer who is like me. This video helped me a lot. Since I never really had (luckily) that problem that I am that harsh to my friends or partner but I still want to make friends with people going to conventions since I escaped my terrible job. And I'll do it in a Kieran cosplay. So I hope I'll gain moe strength to be myself
I was so moved by the Pokémon DLC’s, solely because of Kieran and Carmine. At first I HATED them, but going into the blue berry academy I was SOOO excited to see my friends again. And Kierens decent into a bully was heartbreaking. Great video!! Earned my sub!
IMO Kieran doesn’t deserve any hate that ppl give to him and ppl are wayyyyy too harsh towards someone who we literally lied to not once, not twice but MULTIPLE TIMES!!
I'd like to disagree with the notion that Kieran is in any way like Bede. bede is arrogant, self-centred, and hates Hop because Hop isn't like him. Kieran is the polar opposite. Kieran hates himself, and anything that reminds him of himself. That's why he pushes himself so hard. He hates being himself, so he wants to be us. That's why he snaps out all the time, he snaps out at those showing signs of weakness, because that reminds him of himself. I know this because I've lived a life very similar to his. Almost every autistic person has. That's why he changes when we remind him he's needed how he is. Once he gets told that, which presumably he's never heard before from anyone, given how harsh Carmine and Drayton are.
I absolutely hate it when people boil Kieran’s character down to just an incel. They’re outright ignoring his character development. That’s like saying Blue is just a sore loser or Silver is just a jerk.
I swear the whole idea for Kieran was, “Let’s create a new character suffering from low self esteem……. Now let’s make a two part dlc…… and give the new character the shaft throughout both parts…..” I mean bruh, both stories were basically the middle finger for this one character!
And yet another person who fails to notice the awful mentally abusive way Carmine treats him. He's a victim of her mental abuse, and he was forced to repress his anger and frustration because well... you've seen the way Carmine reacts whenever he expresses himself. And then this Mary Sue protagonist shows up and befriends him, only to lie to him and steal his childhood dream for him, something he can't do anything about because that person is much stronger than him. This is a last straw for him. He can't handle the anger and frustration that he was forced to repress for all these years anymore, and just like a balloon that you slowly fill with water until reaches its breaking point, Kieran explodes (the water is the anger and frustration if that wasn't obvious). I believe Ogerpon should have went with him. Try to see things from Kieran's point of view. There's no one who knows Ogerpon better than him. He had a feeling the story wasn't what it seemed before anyone else, and it's his childhood dream to befriend Ogerpon. Surely he's more deserving than the liar and traitor who sides with a mental abuser and who never struggles for anything. Would you let Ogerpon under the care of someone like that ? Meanwhile Kieran tried his absolute best to be worthy of Ogerpon's respect. What he does in the Indigo Disk is not right, but his feelings are valid. Also he learns from his mistakes, apologizes, and tries to make up for them. Also that thing about losers he tells the League Club member is a projection of his own insecurities that WE mostly caused. Basically "If you're not strong enough, you're a loser". He wasn't strong enough to accomplish his lifelong dream and prevent us from stealing it from him, and he thinks his old self is a loser. This also shows his lack of self esteem since he's still talking about himself when he says that, even if it's his old self. At the same time we have Carmine, a mental abuser who never learns that what she does is wrong, never apologizes, and never tries to make up for being one of the main reasons why Kieran turned out the way he did in the Indigo Disk. You're wondering why he would distance himself from her now that he has the confidence to do so ? She was awful to him for years. Whenever he tries to express himself, she yells and he's scared of her. Though, his anger and frustration are a mask he uses to protect himself from people who hurt him, like Carmine, and he probably makes the few interactions he has with her as short as possible because he's still scared of her deep down, which on its own is a good reason to want to stay away, but also he doesn't want her to get to him and break his mask. But his mask does start to break in Area Zero. Speaking of Area Zero, his scream during the Terapagos fight is so powerful. We saved his life earlier, and he starts to realize he isn't alone as he thinks. But now he realizes what he's done and feels guilty. His lack of self esteem hits him at full force. He even calls himself useless. But then we call out to him. And his scream when he joins the fight is powerful because you can feel that he finally sets all of his anger, pain and frustration free after all this time, and it's liberating for him. He feels a weight leave his shoulders and he isn't blinded by his anger anymore. I love Kieran so much because I relate to his pain, to what he goes through, to the anger he had to repress, just like I had to because of my toxic parents (hopefully I got away before I completely exploded like Kieran did, though I had a harder and harder time containing it before I left. I was basically at the state Kieran was when he punched the Loyal Three's shrine. To a point where he didn't explode yet, but he has a hard time containing all that anger, and it starts to show. But as I said I hopefully got away before it got worse. I'm still affected by what they did to me though. I'm unable to do things by myself because they were overcontrolling (just like Carmine is by the way) and did everything for me. And I have low self esteem because the way I was, the things I liked, it was never good enough for them (and Kieran also has low self esteem, likely for the same reason). There's also the favoritism. My sister was always better than me at basically everything, and they didn't mentally abuse her. So I was wondering what I was doing wrong. Why wasn't I worthy of being treated well ? Turns out I was always worthy, but my parents are awful people. It's the same way Kieran sees the player. Why are they so much better than I am at battling ? Why is Carmine nice to them while she's awful to me ? Do I not deserve to be treated well ? Am I just not good enough ? He is good enough, Carmine is just toxic, and the only way to be happy is to get away from people like her. That's what eventually happened with me. It may still be far from perfect, but I'm much happier since I got away from my abusive parents.
Okay but try to see things from Ogerpon's view. Ogerpon was a Pokemon that was ostracized from the people of Kitakami for *decades,* and only felt comfortable once they found someone, the player, who wasn't from that land just like their previous trainer. It doesn't matter if Kieran really wanted to befriend Ogerpon, because Ogerpon had no idea of Kieran's existence, and even if she did she only saw Kieran as another person from Kitakami and was afraid of them. What Kieran had with her was a parasocial relationship. Ogerpon didn't owe Kieran anything.
@@afro025 That's only because our character is a Mary Sue and of course Ogerpon likes us. But Kieran understands Ogerpon's feelings on a personal level. He knows what it's like to be an outcast. Sure she's afraid of him at first, but that could have changed after he told the village the truth about Ogerpon. He's the sole reason why she's accepted by the village now.
@@Oceane1803 Why do you think it's better to force a Pokemon to be caught by a Trainer they don't want to be with? Even after Kieran helps Ogerpon be accepted by the village, she still doesn't feel entirely comfortable with him, and rather be with someone from outside of Kitakami. Sure Kieran understands Ogerpon to an extent, but that doesn't mean Kieran *deserves* her because of that. What you're saying about Kieran is *literally* the definition of a parasocial relationship. "Parasocial relationships are one-sided relationships, where one person extends emotional energy, interest and time, and the other party, the persona, is completely unaware of the other's existence." You're treating Ogerpon like some trophy Kieran deserves to receive, rather than a character with her own feelings and emotions. It's no different than one of Pokemaine's twitch subs thinking that they deserve Pokemaine more than her bf, all because they've been her fan for longer. Kieran’s definitely not a bad person at all, and I'm not trying to say that, but it’s selfish for Kieran to think Ogerpon should have chosen him solely because he's wanted her since childhood, and he even acknowledges as much in the game.
@@afro025 Yeah but Kieran doesn't want to catch Ogerpon originally. He was just fine with bringing her back to her cave. He only objects when Ogerpon says she wants to be caught by us. He doesn't want to catch Ogerpon to keep her for himself, he wants to prevent us, someone he doesn't see as deserving of being her partner (with good reasons), from catching her. If she didn't want to come with us, she could have stayed there and slowly warmed up to Kieran. But since we're a Mary Sue who quite literally inserts themselves in Kieran's story, of course she wants to come with us. And hey, our character constantly catches Pokémon that try to escape the Poké Balls we throw at them, meaning they don't want to be caught, and we have to weaken them enough until they're not strong enough to escape the Ball. And then the Poké Balls turns them docile and friendly. Sure that's wrong, but if we're allowed to do it, why not Kieran ? Clearly this isn't considered a moral issue in the Pokémon World.
@@Oceane1803 Alright you're half right, but also half wrong. You're right that Kieran didn't want to catch Ogerpon originally, he only really wanted to be friends with her, and only wants to capture her once she decides to go with the player. However, where you're wrong is the reason for Kieran doing this. He doesn't view the player as less deserving than him, in fact, the reason why he goes on this downward spiral is because he views *himself* as less worthy than the player. The player is strong, the player can make friends, while he isn't strong, and he struggles to make friends. Like honestly, I have no idea where you get the idea that Kieran doesn't view us as deserving of Ogerpon, when his dialogue and actions show the exact opposite lol. And Kieran directly acknowledges that trying to fight for who gets to catch Ogerpon is wrong, and is ignoring her own feelings on the matter, treating her like a trophy to be won. Kieran isn't fighting to "protect" Ogerpon from the player, he's fighting to want to have Ogerpon all for himself. Also, that is not how Pokeballs work, and a *lot* of Pokemon fans misunderstand this as well, it's not just you. It's been explained within the games and the anime and other supplementary material, but the act of catching a Pokemon is consensual. Wild Pokemon decide if you're a good enough Trainer by battling you, and once you weaken them enough to prove you are capable of fighting a Pokemon of their caliber, you can catch them. Pokeballs don't turn a Pokemon docile and friendly. They even outright explain this once again in the most recent anime series, Pokemon Horizons (episode 4). The only way to catch a Pokemon without their consent is through the Master Ball, which is what Kieran does to Terapagos.
I love Kieran and I absolutely hate how his arc was ruined by the lame Terapagos boss fight. It could have been so much more but no. Scarlet and Violet can’t have good things without fucking them up with poor game design
Let me know your thoughts in the comments! Any points you agree with? Disagree with? Any rivals you have as favorites?
I swear, Kieran as a character is absolutely beautiful. I believe his character arc is overall one of the best ones that Pokémon has done. It still baffles me that Game Freak was able to pull such a literal 360 in character so flawlessly. It's actually amazing. It's part of the reason why I voice the fella so much.
Jerk rivals have all fallen flat on their faces because, it is impossible to take them seriously when you just whoop their asses every time you run into them. They just come off as sore losers in denial that they suck and have a 0-11 track record against you.
Keiran actually solves that problem entirely by making his entire character arc revolve around the fact that he can't score a single win against you.
Hahaga so true, game freak finally acknowledging the trauma of us as the main characters absolutely DECAMATING the in game characters is refreshing AF
Underrated comment. A lot of people in the community hate friendly rivals and love jerk rival like Silver, Gladion, and of course Blue. But what they don’t realize is that their characters are what makes them compelling, not whether they’re friendly or jerks. A jerk rival can just be as bad as a friendly rival.
In Kieran's defence, he was right to masterball terapagos, like, he woke terapagos up just to see him go straight forward to us. That is a lotta damage
Honestly Kieran and Hop(who goes through something Similar)
Made me think of just How Scary the Player must be from an Outside POV.
Like yeah,we are great because Pokemon is a Game that has Mechanics that we can use to our Advantage,But imagine how terrifying Our player must be from an outsider view.
-They can Catch Any Pokemon,Legendaries included.
-They Win almost every Battle.usually very easily.
-They can befriend Any person and Pokemon…Mostly Just because.(with some of them getting explanations)
-if they play on Switch Style they can predict a Pokemon that will come in
-They are essentially the Best Trainer in their Regions able to Command Perfectly each species that they caught
And many more. In a lot of ways Our Player must be some kinda of…Eldrich Horror when thought deep enough.
I always found Kieran such a unique character in Scarlet and Violet. In fact, he became my favorite character because of how he never gives up on becoming a strong trainer just like the main character.
Although it's such a shame that other people have mixed feelings about him just because they think he's just a little kid who should be put in their place.
I LOVE Kieran so much. I'm autistic and I tend to get more attached to fictional characters that others but Kieran is really special for me. I felt (still feel) such a genuine connection with him. I was really enjoying befriending him and spending the night at the festival with him..then Ogerpon happened. I felt like a jerk during this DLC. I wanted to tell him about Ogerpon right away and I was heart broken when the game forced me to lie and keep lying. it felt like I was doing him so dirty. he was such a sweetheart right up until that point. I get that he'd likely had still been angry if Ogerpon still chose us instead of him but at least he would have had a fair chance to also bond with her. she was only afraid of him imo bc his vibes where already off by the time they met. he was bitter and hurt from being lied to, and also had his own energy tainted with the loyal 3's energy.
I relate to his struggles, when I was a teen and even current day. we share not only alot of physical features but emotional as well. it made me feel very seen as I havent experienced a character quite this close to my heart before. its nice to see someone do a proper character analysis and not just slam him constantly becuase he is such a great character. I'd be over the moon if they use him in any future projects and I really hope he's eventually added to Masters EX. Kieran is definetly my fictional character equevanlent of a soul mate lets put it that way.
I got my dream ending to Indigo Disk, and Mochi Mayhem was such a treat lol I love how his arc ended despite not being satisfied with how no one really apologizes to Kieran. I know Kierans not ALL innocent but he was wronged alot too especially by Carmine and pc. I wish I could have at least told him I was sorry for everything as well.
great video man!
Oh hi Tenshi :)
Not surprised to find you here.
Kieran as a character is someone I find myself relating to in more ways than I was expecting. Like him I was a shy kid who had trouble making friends, being all around generally awkward and not exactly knowing how to approach people. While at first I didn’t really have an obsession with being the best at games, when I eventually did met people in my life that had similar interests like Pokemon smash bros, playing against them sparked drive in me to be better and get on their level. I can confidently say now that I eventually did (and thankfully never developed an obsession that made me a jerk and push them away).
Kieran notable for pretty much being the first NPC to question why the player gets all the legendaries. Him catching Terapagos was Kieran trying to prevent you from having him only for that to backfire horribly
It takes them 9 generations to make them a trainer who is like me. This video helped me a lot. Since I never really had (luckily) that problem that I am that harsh to my friends or partner but I still want to make friends with people going to conventions since I escaped my terrible job. And I'll do it in a Kieran cosplay. So I hope I'll gain moe strength to be myself
I was so moved by the Pokémon DLC’s, solely because of Kieran and Carmine. At first I HATED them, but going into the blue berry academy I was SOOO excited to see my friends again. And Kierens decent into a bully was heartbreaking. Great video!! Earned my sub!
IMO Kieran doesn’t deserve any hate that ppl give to him and ppl are wayyyyy too harsh towards someone who we literally lied to not once, not twice but MULTIPLE TIMES!!
Great video :00
Ive been dying to find more Kieran content, especially content thats analysing him. Cant wait for the next videos!!!
Thanks so much! Great to hear you enjoyed the video!
Good video. I was waiting to see if someone has done a video of Kieran.
I'd like to disagree with the notion that Kieran is in any way like Bede. bede is arrogant, self-centred, and hates Hop because Hop isn't like him.
Kieran is the polar opposite.
Kieran hates himself, and anything that reminds him of himself. That's why he pushes himself so hard. He hates being himself, so he wants to be us. That's why he snaps out all the time, he snaps out at those showing signs of weakness, because that reminds him of himself. I know this because I've lived a life very similar to his. Almost every autistic person has. That's why he changes when we remind him he's needed how he is. Once he gets told that, which presumably he's never heard before from anyone, given how harsh Carmine and Drayton are.
I love Kieran's development. Showing way more character than past rivals.
Also, 9:52 😁😆
I absolutely hate it when people boil Kieran’s character down to just an incel. They’re outright ignoring his character development. That’s like saying Blue is just a sore loser or Silver is just a jerk.
Kieran was the next N in my opinion and I wanna see sooo much more of him
Kieran is my favorite pokemon rival... too bad that he couldn't have been in a better game
Sad how they couldn't extend good writing to carmine.
Martinez Jose Brown Brenda Jackson Jason
I swear the whole idea for Kieran was, “Let’s create a new character suffering from low self esteem……. Now let’s make a two part dlc…… and give the new character the shaft throughout both parts…..” I mean bruh, both stories were basically the middle finger for this one character!
And yet another person who fails to notice the awful mentally abusive way Carmine treats him.
He's a victim of her mental abuse, and he was forced to repress his anger and frustration because well... you've seen the way Carmine reacts whenever he expresses himself.
And then this Mary Sue protagonist shows up and befriends him, only to lie to him and steal his childhood dream for him, something he can't do anything about because that person is much stronger than him.
This is a last straw for him. He can't handle the anger and frustration that he was forced to repress for all these years anymore, and just like a balloon that you slowly fill with water until reaches its breaking point, Kieran explodes (the water is the anger and frustration if that wasn't obvious).
I believe Ogerpon should have went with him. Try to see things from Kieran's point of view. There's no one who knows Ogerpon better than him. He had a feeling the story wasn't what it seemed before anyone else, and it's his childhood dream to befriend Ogerpon.
Surely he's more deserving than the liar and traitor who sides with a mental abuser and who never struggles for anything. Would you let Ogerpon under the care of someone like that ? Meanwhile Kieran tried his absolute best to be worthy of Ogerpon's respect.
What he does in the Indigo Disk is not right, but his feelings are valid. Also he learns from his mistakes, apologizes, and tries to make up for them.
Also that thing about losers he tells the League Club member is a projection of his own insecurities that WE mostly caused. Basically "If you're not strong enough, you're a loser".
He wasn't strong enough to accomplish his lifelong dream and prevent us from stealing it from him, and he thinks his old self is a loser. This also shows his lack of self esteem since he's still talking about himself when he says that, even if it's his old self.
At the same time we have Carmine, a mental abuser who never learns that what she does is wrong, never apologizes, and never tries to make up for being one of the main reasons why Kieran turned out the way he did in the Indigo Disk.
You're wondering why he would distance himself from her now that he has the confidence to do so ? She was awful to him for years. Whenever he tries to express himself, she yells and he's scared of her.
Though, his anger and frustration are a mask he uses to protect himself from people who hurt him, like Carmine, and he probably makes the few interactions he has with her as short as possible because he's still scared of her deep down, which on its own is a good reason to want to stay away, but also he doesn't want her to get to him and break his mask.
But his mask does start to break in Area Zero. Speaking of Area Zero, his scream during the Terapagos fight is so powerful. We saved his life earlier, and he starts to realize he isn't alone as he thinks.
But now he realizes what he's done and feels guilty. His lack of self esteem hits him at full force. He even calls himself useless. But then we call out to him. And his scream when he joins the fight is powerful because you can feel that he finally sets all of his anger, pain and frustration free after all this time, and it's liberating for him. He feels a weight leave his shoulders and he isn't blinded by his anger anymore.
I love Kieran so much because I relate to his pain, to what he goes through, to the anger he had to repress, just like I had to because of my toxic parents (hopefully I got away before I completely exploded like Kieran did, though I had a harder and harder time containing it before I left.
I was basically at the state Kieran was when he punched the Loyal Three's shrine. To a point where he didn't explode yet, but he has a hard time containing all that anger, and it starts to show. But as I said I hopefully got away before it got worse.
I'm still affected by what they did to me though. I'm unable to do things by myself because they were overcontrolling (just like Carmine is by the way) and did everything for me.
And I have low self esteem because the way I was, the things I liked, it was never good enough for them (and Kieran also has low self esteem, likely for the same reason).
There's also the favoritism. My sister was always better than me at basically everything, and they didn't mentally abuse her. So I was wondering what I was doing wrong. Why wasn't I worthy of being treated well ? Turns out I was always worthy, but my parents are awful people.
It's the same way Kieran sees the player. Why are they so much better than I am at battling ? Why is Carmine nice to them while she's awful to me ? Do I not deserve to be treated well ? Am I just not good enough ?
He is good enough, Carmine is just toxic, and the only way to be happy is to get away from people like her. That's what eventually happened with me. It may still be far from perfect, but I'm much happier since I got away from my abusive parents.
Okay but try to see things from Ogerpon's view. Ogerpon was a Pokemon that was ostracized from the people of Kitakami for *decades,* and only felt comfortable once they found someone, the player, who wasn't from that land just like their previous trainer. It doesn't matter if Kieran really wanted to befriend Ogerpon, because Ogerpon had no idea of Kieran's existence, and even if she did she only saw Kieran as another person from Kitakami and was afraid of them. What Kieran had with her was a parasocial relationship. Ogerpon didn't owe Kieran anything.
@@afro025 That's only because our character is a Mary Sue and of course Ogerpon likes us. But Kieran understands Ogerpon's feelings on a personal level. He knows what it's like to be an outcast.
Sure she's afraid of him at first, but that could have changed after he told the village the truth about Ogerpon. He's the sole reason why she's accepted by the village now.
@@Oceane1803 Why do you think it's better to force a Pokemon to be caught by a Trainer they don't want to be with? Even after Kieran helps Ogerpon be accepted by the village, she still doesn't feel entirely comfortable with him, and rather be with someone from outside of Kitakami. Sure Kieran understands Ogerpon to an extent, but that doesn't mean Kieran *deserves* her because of that. What you're saying about Kieran is *literally* the definition of a parasocial relationship. "Parasocial relationships are one-sided relationships, where one person extends emotional energy, interest and time, and the other party, the persona, is completely unaware of the other's existence."
You're treating Ogerpon like some trophy Kieran deserves to receive, rather than a character with her own feelings and emotions. It's no different than one of Pokemaine's twitch subs thinking that they deserve Pokemaine more than her bf, all because they've been her fan for longer. Kieran’s definitely not a bad person at all, and I'm not trying to say that, but it’s selfish for Kieran to think Ogerpon should have chosen him solely because he's wanted her since childhood, and he even acknowledges as much in the game.
@@afro025 Yeah but Kieran doesn't want to catch Ogerpon originally. He was just fine with bringing her back to her cave. He only objects when Ogerpon says she wants to be caught by us.
He doesn't want to catch Ogerpon to keep her for himself, he wants to prevent us, someone he doesn't see as deserving of being her partner (with good reasons), from catching her.
If she didn't want to come with us, she could have stayed there and slowly warmed up to Kieran. But since we're a Mary Sue who quite literally inserts themselves in Kieran's story, of course she wants to come with us.
And hey, our character constantly catches Pokémon that try to escape the Poké Balls we throw at them, meaning they don't want to be caught, and we have to weaken them enough until they're not strong enough to escape the Ball.
And then the Poké Balls turns them docile and friendly. Sure that's wrong, but if we're allowed to do it, why not Kieran ? Clearly this isn't considered a moral issue in the Pokémon World.
@@Oceane1803 Alright you're half right, but also half wrong. You're right that Kieran didn't want to catch Ogerpon originally, he only really wanted to be friends with her, and only wants to capture her once she decides to go with the player.
However, where you're wrong is the reason for Kieran doing this. He doesn't view the player as less deserving than him, in fact, the reason why he goes on this downward spiral is because he views *himself* as less worthy than the player. The player is strong, the player can make friends, while he isn't strong, and he struggles to make friends. Like honestly, I have no idea where you get the idea that Kieran doesn't view us as deserving of Ogerpon, when his dialogue and actions show the exact opposite lol.
And Kieran directly acknowledges that trying to fight for who gets to catch Ogerpon is wrong, and is ignoring her own feelings on the matter, treating her like a trophy to be won. Kieran isn't fighting to "protect" Ogerpon from the player, he's fighting to want to have Ogerpon all for himself.
Also, that is not how Pokeballs work, and a *lot* of Pokemon fans misunderstand this as well, it's not just you. It's been explained within the games and the anime and other supplementary material, but the act of catching a Pokemon is consensual. Wild Pokemon decide if you're a good enough Trainer by battling you, and once you weaken them enough to prove you are capable of fighting a Pokemon of their caliber, you can catch them. Pokeballs don't turn a Pokemon docile and friendly. They even outright explain this once again in the most recent anime series, Pokemon Horizons (episode 4). The only way to catch a Pokemon without their consent is through the Master Ball, which is what Kieran does to Terapagos.
I love Kieran and I absolutely hate how his arc was ruined by the lame Terapagos boss fight. It could have been so much more but no. Scarlet and Violet can’t have good things without fucking them up with poor game design