ZIPP Wheel Bearings are destroying my brain.
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- Опубліковано 10 вер 2024
- Have you got a problem with the wheel bearings of your ZIPP 303 or 303s bearings with the 176D hubs? This is why you need to fit genuine ZIPP Bearings, but are they really 61903 size?
Useful Links:
ZIPP 176D Service Manual
www.sram.com/g...
ZIPP Spare Parts Catalogue
www.sram.com/g...
Fast Forward Ryot Wheels with DT SWISS Hubs
www.ffwdwheels...
@ffwdwheels #bikemechanic #ZIPP303 #ZIPPWHEELS #ZippBearings #61903 #roadbikes
The Zipp Bearings have different coloured seals because one side is a fully contacting seal (the outside) the non contacting seal goes on the inside. This is their effort to get a compromise between sealing and low drag. they are often labelled as LU and LB on the full and non contacting seals respectively. LU and LB are NTN designations.
61903 is the same as 6903. The first is ISO numbering, the latter is JIS numbering. Enduro bearings and other bike ones generally won't work because they are unlabelled C3 clearance. I have supplied loads of NTN and nobody has complained and I use them on my own ZIPP. Just be aware, the market is full of fakes and there are plenty of suppliers who are supplying bearings which are labelled as brand X and turn out to be brand "noname" made in China with an NTN sticker on them.
For the DT hubs, some of their bearings are mislablled for example they use an 18x30x7 and label it as a 6903. I personally hate them but everyone is different! Hope that helps.
Wouldn´t it be possible to measure ZIPP bearings, ID and OD, and compare the numbers with proper bearing makers figures and tolerances?? One manufacturer should be the best fitting. Rgr
Thank you. Still not sure why they creak when fitted the wrong way round though.
big fan of your work! you're the most knowledgeable orange squirrel i've ever seen @Hambini
@@Mapdec Dump the originals. Probably especially made in Umptown, China to Zipp specifications by a no name maker. What about if the outer ring is conical? Small OD outwards, bearing could wobble in bearing recession? Large OD outwards, can´t? Rgr
@@Mapdec Mine tend to creak sometimes i put a little tab of grease on the right cap the area that touch the rear hanger
The thing with the different color bearing seals is usually to indicate which side has what kind of sealing.
There is multiple different types or amounts of lips on the seals and the better they are sealed the more seal drag they have.
Bike wheel manufacturers try to balance the level of sealing vs seal drag in an effort to market to the wattage driven customers.
So the hybrid solution is to have the outside facing seal a better sealed one to fight the elements and the internal seal a less draggy one to just hold in the grease.
EDIT. Damn it, Hambini was 2 minutes faster with the answer
Thank you. Any idea why they creak the wrong way round?
@@Mapdec I haven't broken one apart to see how the bearings are made but there could be a difference inside the bearing as to which way it is meant to be preloaded sideways. That could explain the difference in results based on installing orientation. Just a speculation though as I haven't serviced any Zipp wheel hubs lately.
Taking off the less sealed bearing seal and stuffing the bearing with more grease might help with creaks if they are due to the bearing being dry-ish on the inside. I've seen some bearings squeal due to next to no grease on the inside.
Usually greasing all contact surfaces between hub and bearing and bearing and axle is enough to get rid of creaks. I usually tend to see corroded bearings being stuck into the hub or onto the axle due to corrosion between materials made worse by inserting water and washing agents or road salt into the mix.
Bearings are quite a hot topic lately as some hub brands suffer from speccing the cheapest bearings they can find and then those bearings literally destroy themselves and fall apart inside the hub. One notable example is the Shimano 3-pawl MicroSpline freehub bearings that tend to disintegrate and then eject themselves in pieces from between the axle and the cassette lockring.
Of course the user of the bike must be quite negligent to not notice anything going on.
wow, so much drag from rubber seal ....
I fitted some NTN bearings (suppled by a French 5 year old) into a set of Zipp 303 rim brake wheels earlier this year with no issues fitting or after whilst riding.
Yep. Some success with SKF and NTN for sure.
I have a dt240s hubset for 15 years, still runs like new on original bearings...Phil Wood wheels for over 20 years...runs better than new!
companies MUST supply parts for their products. answer is don't buy ZIPP/SRAM .
There´s more reasons NOT to buy SRAM. Rgr
SRAM doesn't supply parts?
@@Charles-kc2vt My gravel pal uses Force 1x11. The plastic shite part that pulls the wire to the rear derailleur cracked, making it onespeed. Do you think shite SRAM could supply a new plastic part, or do my pal order a new brifter? Hint: total cost would be around £200,00.. Rgr
Good luck wiih shimtmano then. You gonna end up with the same problem. And good luck if your local distributor doesnt supply it, because shitmano is geoblocked across the globe from online orders.
@@playmoreguitar5393 never had any support issues with Shimano in the UK unlike SRAM who are really unhelpful and only want to communicate with dealers.
I used to work in a shop in the USA. We had the same problem with zipp wheels years ago.
When we contacted zipp about this they said play was normal…
At least they are now acknowledging the problem - well done - good diagnosis.
Leave it to hambini to leave such thorough response. Dude knows everything there is to know on the subject of bike components.
Also recommend FFWD wheels. I bought some 60mm carbon clinchers from them over 4 years ago and they are still going strong, never gone out of true. Fitted with DT180 hubs they’ve only needed one set of bearings and were changed cheaply at my LBS
As Hambini said, use NTN or NSK bearings. I am an engineer for NSK and both brands mentioned are the leaders for quality and MFG control. For NSK its either 6903VV, non contact seals, or 6903DDU, contact seals
Thanks V10. I have never tried NSK, I am not sure the best place to buy them. We have used NTN, they sometimes work, but often dont.
I have legacy Zipp wheels from when they were still made in Indiana. I use NTN bearings from Hambini, and they work excellent and without issue.
Zipp 303S comes with Chinese no name bearings (cost reduction). After 8 months the bearings had to be changed - same issues, wobbling. I was lucky I got my hands on some original zipp bearings, replaced them and all is well since then.
Hopefully the SRAM team will do this. Let’s see what happens.
Looking forward to seeing the outcome. I’ve just purchased a pair of 303s wheels with the XDR rear and have just received the tyres to fit on them . I saw lots of good reviews on these until this vid and these comments 😢. If worst came to worst could I swap out the zip hubs for better quality ones and reuse the rims assuming that replacement zipp bearings don’t solve the apparent issue they seem to have . I was looking forward to using them to .
I had a set of 303 Firecrest but got rid of them within a year. The bearings might have seals but the seals and the grease don't tolerate any wet weather whatsoever. They are not manufactured to run in outside applications in my view. 3 months was the best life I got from rear wheel bearings and I only used the bike in the summer. That's 2 sets in one season and less than 2000 miles. I know weight weenies will buy Zipps but the lack of weight comes at a cost. The bearings are under-sized to cut down on weight. Buy something else and take a minor weight penalty to get some reasonable life out of your hubs.
They sure don’t last long in the English Lake District.
… proprietary bearings that are rarer than Unobtainium...that sounds like a great idea 😏
Apparently, they’re not proprietary.
Have been running 303s in my Litespeed cherohala all road for about 2 years now without issues. Matter of fact just got an another set so I can swap gravel/road set up. Hope the second set holds as well as the first one.
I have never as a mechanic for 12 years bought or installed a Zipp branded bearing. They are not special or proprietary. Orientation is purely related to sealing. Lots of bearings are made with one contact and one non-contact seal. DT Swiss (TPI) bearings are like this too.
TPI Taiwan is a joint venture and technical cooperation with NTN Corporation, Japan.
Zipp bearings wore out within 2k km of riding, changed to Newmen supplied bearings . No issues except for a little higher drag.
Thank you for bringing this bearing issue to my attention. Good work Paul!
Crazy this is still a thing with Zipp. I bought a pair of 404s about 10 years ago and exhibited the same issues- eventually replaced. Fast forward 7 years, I bought a new set of Zipps that had a DT-Swiss hub. Never had a hub issue again.
Latest zipp stuff aint it they blow up and pop spokes wayyyy too easy, its like mavic hubs they are also shocking awesome video keep it coming :)
I had to replace my bearings after five (5) months of use. I wash my bike every 100 miles with a bucket of soapy water and spray it off with a garden hose. I don't use a high-pressure hose, and the bearings were already rusted. SRAM wouldn't help with the issue. I have a set of Roval Terra CL with DT Swiss 350 hubs and have never had any issues. Don't buy Zipp, unless you want to deal with problems IMO.
I have had this EXACT issue on my 303 FC. After 6mo of use the bearings seized and I had to jump through hoops to get the warrantied. SRAM's advice to me was "don't wash the bike and don't ride in the rain". I don't ride in the rain and it's not like I wash the bike after every ride. FFWD 5 more months later and boom the same thing happened. Hub felt like gears were skipping and wonky. Opened it up, bearings were just sitting in water and all corroded. Had to spend like 170.00 for replacement everything. FWD again 3 mo after that, riding along and boom spoke broke out of the nipple part with a crack where the nipple is. I weight 140lbs so it's not like there was abuse.. Never ever ever again will I buy zipp wheels. Will migrate over to Roval or Enve.
Got a set of FF40 two years ago, no flashy decals just stealth Black, run on DT swiss 240 hubs...run true & sweet. 100% recommend plus the bag they come in is superb.
I think my next wheels will be Fast Forward thanks to your suggestion.
Im just about buying this wheelset but after seeing this video it makes me think the other way
My Novatec bearings have 4,000 hard miles on them (county roads, I weigh 200lbs, and I regularly do 20 mile + descents @45+mph). I only had to regrease the rear hub once because it locked up (riding in wet conditions etc).
My fix? Shimano hubs! Loose balls and cones baby!! 2 cone wrenches, a jar of dura ace grease and I SET THE PRELOAD..like new forever--screw sealed bearings..pro mechanics love shimano hubs because you can actually work on them yourself with a couple of wrenches..and no wait for new balls--thanks to my hairdresser Mr. Ham....🤣
Dura Ace hubs are amazing to be fair.
That is what I am thinking to do with my zipp cognition v2 hubs if I have a problem 😃 Even ultegra level should be enough since I have been ruding ultegras for the last years with no issues at all. Shimano hubs are rock solid…
Hopefully zipp does the right thing to address these problems
Will keep you updated
saved me buying a set of Firecrests. Thanks.
And that my friends is why I use Chris King hubs (built into a rim of choice)...... No word of a lie, I've had 10years of regular use (in the Lake District) and still going strong! 👍
Expensive, Yes, but you get what you pay for! 👍 🚴♂️
They are the best hubs for sure. The only draw back is that not many shops will service them, not that need servicing very often, but when they do, it can be a pain.
@@Mapdec
Yeah, they use their own bearings which you're better off buying from the US directly. Not to mention the special hub tools, both of which I have.
Expensive, Yes!. But since 2008 when I started using CK hubs, headsets and BB's, I've only had to use the MTB hub tool twice! and the R45 tool once in the "Crosser"
I've literally gone through more rims than bearings.......
No word of a lie! 👍 🚴♂️
@@andystone5487 totally believe you. Headsets can go though several bikes before worn out too.
I have had R45's running for a decade too, and they are very good. Managed to easily self-service them at home without the special tools, as it's possible to flush out the drive rings/ bearings without fully removing them. Haven't got to the point where they ever needed the full tear down. They're not totally perfect though, the flange width is conservative compared to alternatives. Just changed over to a BlackFriday set of Bora'like Fulcrum's, and out of the box the finishing quality is some of the best this bike snob has ever seen...ride quality is exceptional too. Like the R45, the cup&cone should be long lasting with regular attention, and on the record type hubs the bearing surfaces can be fully replaced. Much better system for damp climates than cartridges in Zipp's etc...
I ride 303s and after arround 800km of only paved roads the bearings in the back hub where completly rusty and dead. I felt diassapointed for a wheelset that set me down 1,2k in germany. Replaced the bearings myself and until now eaverything seems fine.
Again very interesting and informative. I’m definitely going to look at Fast Forward now because of your recommendation and that they are made in the EU. Cheers.
Thanks Kevin
@@Mapdec Thanks Mapdec....I'm going to order FF's for winter riding. Do you mind if I tell them you suggested them?.
Sure. Let us know how you get on.
I have had the same issue on a new pair of Zipp 303S, play in the rear axle from new.
Two rides in, one damp ride and the non-drive side bearing is shot, no grease and rusted to hell.
Despite your advice I just couldn't be bothered returning them on warranty.
The Zipp bearings are hardly super prescision German/Swiss bearings, but cheap as chips CW Bearings from China.
Really dissapointing, but at £650 for the pair they can only be considered budget wheels, what do you expect?
Replaced them in 10 minutes with genuine NTN LLB non contact sealed bearings and the wheels are transformed.
No creaks, no play, just super magic carpet ridding beauties.
For the £650 paid, plus a couple of new bearings they are now absolutely outstanding, performing way above the discounted price level.
PS Thanks Hambini for the over axle adapter.
Do all these disc hubs have a design issue which kills the non-drive side bearing.
The rotor retaining cap lets in water which sits between the cap and bearing with no where to go.
Not sure even a full contact seal bearing can cope with that in a damp climate, then stored in a damp garage?
Give me good old angular contact cup-and-cone wheel bearings I can adjust. I've seen c/c bearings get gritty to the point of barely turning, but I've never encountered a set I couldn't resurrect by changing out the balls. Even a hub with mildly pitted races can be made usable with a little TLC. Small wonder Shimano and Campagnolo have used them for so long.
Bravo. Well done.
I'm glad I bought some Ffwd Ryot 55s after your recommendation.... And I got a bargain BF sale, £975 Happy days 👌👌
Wow. That’s cheaper than I got mine!
I've used SKF bearings on my 2018 Zipp 303 firecrest without issues. I also used an Enduro 6903 on the rear wheel, the one close to the freehub, no problems.
Yes, I said in vid, some success with SKF not 100% though. Sometimes they still give out a little squeak.
The cup and cone system allowed side loads and radial loads and was adjustable for pre load but not very well sealed and required regular maintenance. Having cassette bearings requires a tolerance (sliding) fit between the axle and bearing so it's always on the edge of being too loose. The cup and cone system didn't have this problem as the inner bearing race (cone) was threaded onto the axle and locked in place. The outer bearing race (cup) was an interference fit in the hub so nice and secure, any play could be taken up by adjusting the cones. They kept dirt and water out as long as they packed with the correct grease.
They are quickly rusting crap which was always too tight or too loose and never really running round.
Having worked in the motor industry (thankfully left now) for 25 years. Manufacturers do run out of parts unfortunately. Also most bike / car companies don't make any parts at all and rely on suppliers (who can run out of materials to make things too).
Absolutely crazy that you have to have zipp only bearings at £72!
I know right!
Thanks for sharing your experience. Really a shamethat Zipp is not able to use durable bearings. As I have read similar comments elsewhere, it seems to be a widespread problem with Zipp wheels. Therefore I will ask my dealer before buying the next bike, whether it is possible to swap the wheelset. DTSwiss is my favorite.
Got 6903 Enduro bearings, they are perfectly fine since a few thousand k.
I have zipp 303 nsw disc from 2017.they were made in USA.
I have 30000 km with them,not a single isue,bearings are still like new,never been trued.it seems like newer zipps,made in taiwan are not like they were 5 years ago.
For crisakes don't buy parts with proprietary bearings, people.
To anyone that says "it is a standard 61903 bearing" well, clearly it isn't if you can't use a standard off the shelf NTN bearing.
If the bearings are advertised as being standard but they can't be replaced with standard bearings, is that not a violation of UK consumer protection law?
The bigger picture is don't buy bicycles with proprietary parts. Getting harder all the time.
I have my 303s for over 2 years, ridden around 10000km. Luckily my bearings are still ok. 😅
I guess you live somewhere dry.
I had similar issue with prime wheels creaking, it was the axle not the bearings which I tried about half a dozen types. Also had same issue with Fulcrums labelling bearings incorrectly on an 18mm ID.
Lastly I doubt Zipp make their own bearings, they will be generic ones but what’s crucial will be fitting the correct way round for the two different seal types/inner and outer 👍🏻
I used to work at a component manufacturer. Getting the bearings, axles, hubs to fit together while managing each tolerance is difficult. I asked our head PM how DT Swiss does it: “I have no idea”
Also, fun fact, spoke tension can affect the hub’s bearing bore - yay ultralight wheels(hubs) with few spokes at very high tension - boooo 32 hole open pros on solid hubs!!!
I would probably say... experience... Interesting point you make.
I would just glue the races in place using something like Loctite 641 (medium strength) or even 243. Threadlocker actually works pretty well, considering the relatively light loads experienced by bicycle hubs. Gluing the races in place is preferable to the opposite problem of an interference fit that is too tight. That really does destroy the races since they are pretty thin on these light bearings. Clean the mating surfaces with IPA, install, then wait an hour or so for a complete cure. Doesn't have much effect on future disassembly either. $.02
Retaining compound is a short term fix in some cases.
Just bought a pair of Hunt wheels fingers crossed they stand up to the marketing.
They got a whole lot better in the last year.
@Mapdec Cycle Works Great to know. I've only got a basic set to see how they fair.
Ha ha,
1. Zipp has a long standing reputation for poor hubs, i am talking decades.
2. Here in Australia we asked zipp for DTswiss hubs, Zipp wouldn't fit them.
3. SRAM have a reputation for poor QC
4. Send all the wheels back, SRAM do this so you have no evidence to take legal action. This is standard compliant response, all companys do this.
5. Don't buy Zipp wheels, they are not worth the money.
Can we say that "firecrest" is becoming "firecrap". 😁
no lie zipp bearings and hubs are one of my least favorite oem bearings, so many times do I have customers with lateral movement in there front and rear hubs
Very interesting.
Not Zipp but I had a similar creaking noise with a set of Reynold Strike 62mm, and also eventually with a set of vision metron 55’s.
Thank You Bionic Rider
I've been told by my bearing supplier that the outer races measure different from standard sizing but the standard seals fit so they use these for cost savings. Problem being you can't go by the numbering in the seal and have to rely on measurements.
Yes. And it sucks that that put 61903 all over their service info
This is not uncommon. Many wheels from big companies do this with their OEM wheel sets.
Had this on 2 pairs of 303 wheels in 12 months of riding and no bearings available for months…I wrongly figured the hubs would be UK winter proof but really not turning out that way. Need to wash the bike after every ride this time of year and never jet wash just normal garden hose low pressure, dry and lube. Think part of the trouble is keeping the bikes in a garage which is always going to be slightly damp. Dehumidifier should help but really thought these wheels would be more reliable.
Sorry you caught this vid too late. Thanks for sharing David
I think the seals are not good, sounds like water and dirt gets in it wipes the bearing fast. I used to have the the same problem on durace 7700 bottom bracket riding in rain.
Zero problems using Enduro XD-15 bearings in my Cognition hubs. Seems like false correlation to me.
Same problem here with a rear Zipp Moto 3Zero wheel with less than 1 year of barely use. Contacted Zipp and the problem was the XD body, changed bearings and nothing. I hadto spend 100USD in a new XD body, I willreplace them with a pair of new Hope5 hubs when available. Zipp hubs are a PIA
Nice wheels, shame about the hubs
Mine did the exact same thing inside of 6 months. I noticed it a couple of weeks after riding Unbound. The last two hours of that race was in the rain. Shop pulled the bearings and one of them was rusted and completely seized. I don't think the shop replaced them with Zipp bearings but now I wonder if they should have. The shop lost the shim so I am not confident they replaced them correctly.
Awkward moment ahead. Sorry
303s is not US made and this is the issue. My 202 tubular with 77/177 hubs, 302 tubeless with 76/176, and 404 firecrest with ZR1 are flawless
Ive got 2021 303 firecrest wheelset.. 3 weeks in and bearings walkd out.
Now on my 6th set of bearings mix of skf and ntn but the Chinese chocolate hubs are the main problem. Bad tolerances amd workmanship. Zipp and sram both wouldnt cover any thing for me at a few weeks old at the time.
They didn’t warranty!?!!
How long is the replacement interval (on average) for a standard steel bearing in a road bike? Assuming bike has never been washed with pressure washer.
Hard to say. Most folk are disappointed if they don’t get at least a year of regular riding from a set of bearings.
which hub should a heavy rider 290lbs , which hubs would you go with 28H...Onyx Vesper, White Industries or Hope RS4 ?
Ideally... A DT Swiss 240 with steel freehub 'upgrade'. Out of those 3 I would go Hope RS4.
Anyone have any opinions or dealings with Tune?
Could the reason be that they are ANGULAR CONTACT bearings? Hence the directional placement, And that this the reason normal ball bearings blow up and have play? On assembly the bearing are put on pressure towards the center of the hub and normal bearing will wear out quickly. Also the pressure on the assembly will cancel the play with angular contact bearings, but as normal bearings will not stand sideways pressure will flex and case vibrations?
They are wrong code for AC. Defo radial. I’ve checked. The direction appears to be down to how the seal is held in place.
Does this issue occur with the 303 Firecrest?
You still have to use the correct bearings. I know a few on here say otherwise, but I can not tell you how many times we have sold tiny annoying creaks by just fitting the proper Zipp bearings. Baffles me.
Spent months researching carbon wheels. Finally decided and purchased the 303s only 2 weeks ago and not even fitted them on the bike yet . After seeing this I’m now wondering if I’ve made a bad decision?
Although one of my reasons for buying was zipps lifetime warranty .
Hopefully the follow up vid will show how that warranty works. Did you not see our vids on the 303s from when it was launched?
I watched your unboxing / first look video . And attempt to inflate the gp5000.
I’ve put Pirelli p zero on the rims and went up first time with a track pump , which I wasn’t expecting .
I’ve only really found praise for the 303s online …. Until now 😬
Haha. That was a time when the GP5000 was the tyre to have but they didn’t have a hookless version. It was the question everyone asking back then. 🤣.
Look forward to seeing how the warranty issue goes. Surely if hubs are. Stuffed after only a handful of rides , the whole wheelset is unfit for purpose ?
Thanks for the replies 👍🏻
I have checked with zipp dealer in singapore. Bearing is not under warranty due to manufacturer error.
My zipp 303s wheel bearings failed in under six months ... they're rubbish
Mine too, l don't the seals work!
Is the situation still the same. Wich bearings should i buy now?
If in doubt, buy the genuine Zipp bearings.
Would you recommend Fast forward tyro ? Are the a budget version on ryot?
I haven’t seen a set, so it would be wrong to comment really.
Maybe wheel building is not dead. White industry hubs are fast paired with cx-ray and nice toroidal aero rim.
Wheel building has sadly become quite cost prohibitive these days. We still build lots of wheels, but that FFWD is the sort of thing we would usually build. We can’t get close to that price though, and the build quality is the same as a builder could achieve. Arguably better as they have calibrated rigs for detension and testing.
I’ve had the same probs with my set of wheels Zipps, after just a few months. Sent them back to the retailer (Mantel) and was told I would need to pay as it’s my fault! Excessive cleaning….was the reason. I’ve been cleaning all my wheels; Enve, Roval…the same way and never had a problem. In the end I gave up and paid myself.
I don’t think Mantel did much to help you there. 😞
@@Mapdec I agree, never bought again from Mantel or actually Zipp whelels. Great video btw.
@@cycling7553 thank you.
I have the exact same problem with my Zipp 303s wheels. Lots of lateral play in the axle and the bearings are basically ruined after a month of riding from new.
I hope this helps. There is a follow up vid that explains the fix
hi, nice video. can 1 use tubes on these wheels? or just tubeless tires?
Thank you. You should consult the manual. They are hookless and so require tubeless tyres that are specified suitable for hookless rims.
I rode 15,000 miles on CeramicSpeed Zipp-4 coated bearings in my Zipp 454 NSW Disc gen1 Disc Wheelset. Not a single problem. Still no play in either hub after four years.
454 is totally different, and an excellent wheel set.
@@Mapdecim running 303s for 25000km and had no problems yet 🤷♂️. Maybe I'm just lucky
Just fit NTN bearings about £10 each
My 303 F bearings (after 1100km ride) are fine, but the free hub pawls rusted and bonded everything in place, so no engagement. Again, only 1100km and I'm looking for a new ZR1 hub, with shipping is nearly 100 euros.
And Zipp customer service replied: it depends on weather conditions. The silliest response one could get. Even for every single kilometer of ride there was rain, seals should be working.
I don’t think any hubs, apart from chris king are really very weather sealed, but Zipp do corrode very fast for sure.
I also highly rate FFWD wheels. I got a set of rim brake tubeless clinchers for more than six years. They took a lot of beating an are still good as new. I disagree with your assessment on brass nipples. Being a wheelbuilder myself, I've been using brass nipples only. But Sapim's Polyax aluminium nipples are so well anodized that corrosion is a non issue. I've got many carbon wheels with no corrosion issues going fine for years now. AND: Wheels are much easier to build with aluminium nipples because they thread much easier when the spoke tension gets high. Unless you're riding your wheels on salty winter roads without cleaning them regularly, brass nipples are not a requirement. I only use them on heavy duty and commuter wheels now.
Guess it depends on your climate. A big part of our work is cutting spokes out of wheels that have corroded in place and are suffering breakage after breakage.
@@Mapdec I'm located in Germany and I do get a lot of wet weather and the occasional deep winter with salty roads. Like I said: I did have that issue, too. I know that Enve suffered this problem severely and switched to brass nipples for this reason. But in my experience, a good quality aluminium nipple like Sapim's polyax will not have this problem because it is that durable. It only really happens where the anodization is either scratched or of bad quality and the bare aluminium contacts the carbon. And with Sapim nipples it doesn't really happen anymore. I do understand however that some people want to play it safe.
I really hope FFWD is paying you for this! Good video though...
lol. Nope.
I notice u said that enduro bearings don’t work. I was wondering why there matching bearings does not work in this wheel set
Hey Ryan. There is a comment from Hambini above that explains better. Basically they are a different fit tolerance, learning they will fit a bit loose and start to creak.
@@Mapdec ah ok. Cause my set crapped out after about 500km n replaced with enduro n not a single drama since.
Good channel
Thanks.
New Zipp bearings are chinese trash made,my first 2012 303 Firecrest set have WIB swiss made bearings that last a long long time fast forward 2019 my 2 set of 303 Firecrest disc
came with the chinese ones dont last 6 months change it with NTN bearings working flawlessly
Cheers for another informative video. Any recommendations on deep Carbon Wheelsets for heavier riders?
Speak to a wheel builder, is my best advice.
@@Mapdec what would you recommend as to some alloy rims. Are Mavic Pro’s still a good buy? Thinking of Hope RS4’s to compliment then?
Cheers for all the videos. Glad to have found your channel😊👍
Mavic open pro rims are light but they are flexible and need some skill to build. I like the Pacenti Forza alu.
@@Mapdec I need rim brake version with 32 spoke count. Would you recommend Hope RS4 for road with the Forza rims? Would you build for me?
@@JamesSocialCycling of course James. Call or email the shop and let’s see what we can do.
Thanks for sharing. Hopefully ZIPP can fix this problem.
Do you have any experience with Parcours wheels?
Thank you. I can’t recall ever working on Parcours. Sorry
@@Mapdec Not a problem! Just wondering.
Can't believe zipp still don't make decent hubs.
Been working on Zipp wheels for 10 years+. Overrated, overpriced. Bearings a freehubs will always let you down prematurely. It begs the question, how do they get away with this crap?
Have the same issue and just found some mavic bearings in the spares box that look like they will work - labelled 6903 LU, NTN, C3 with 1-sided seal. Spent goddam months thinking it was either creaking from BB30a or chainset until I tried the wheels on a different bike.
Might work. The LU means single seal. NTN is the brand. Nice brand too. C3 is the clearance between balls and race. Let us know how you get on
Anyone have spoke rub on their modern Zipp j bend wheelsets, 303 Firecrest, 353 NSW?
You will get a lot of replies to this. It isn’t spoke rub. It sounds like it, you’ll swear it is, but I can guarantee it will be the axle and bearings.
I was just at the FFWD site and for rim brake carbon, I didn’t see them offering DT hubs, just their own hubs.
That’s a shame.
I wrote to them thru their contact page to ask about it, as they ask if you want any special changes done, so we’ll see what they say back.
@@GNX157 On the FFWD website it for the RYOT 44 wheelset "You want to save extra weight in combination with a higher precision and stiffness? Then the DT 240 hubs with the improved EXP ratchet system may be the best choice!" So they certainly provide DT Swiss hubs still
Keep us informed. I hope they help.
@@kidkarbon4775, I’m looking at the rim brake carbon roads, and they’re not showing a DT hub as an option.
SRAM is a company based in on profit not quality, might work for a bit , but their engineering is not very good . The focus is getting money from you , same as Boing airplanes , their reason for being is misguided. I tried RED back in the 2000’s this ethos was obvious back then , seems it’s still the same .
Had the same problem. Shit bearings...
I'm bored of cartridge bearings in hubs. Getting a set of branded internet wheels rebuilt with Shimano hubs. My previous wheels had DT hubs, they lasted OK with SKF bearings in, but still ended up having to replace bearings a couple of times a year, if you ride year round cup and cone just work!
What sort of conditions are your riding in? My 240s hubs are at 8k miles on original bearings and feel like new.
@@davidgeorge9233 I mostly do Audax type riding, long days away from main roads, mudguards on most of my bikes and I do go out in the wet. 12500km YTD, 11500km last year how much of that is turbo miles not sure but a fair chunk.
Dura Ace hubs are bloody amazing.
@@Mapdec any knowledge about if they use brass nipples? I’ve looked at dura ace but wasn’t sure btwn those and ffwd.
Agreed, I've a set of GRX wheels, after a winter of use grease looked like new. The other wheels that did the same sort of work are an OEM set of DT swiss, and another set of OEM wheels with Novatech hubs, both go through freehub bearings fast in the wet. I actually wonder if the mudguard stays direct water into the axle?
Thank you for sharing this. I am in the process of putting together a build for a new bike and was going to get the 303 FC DB wheels. Now I will have to rethink this choice. I live in the Philippines and need gear that lasts thru abuse, or can be easily serviced. Not sure Zipp fits either of those requirements now.
Not a great choice. Maybe consider Shimano Dura Ace hubs and build.
Or just get wheels with proper hubs with angular contact bearings. Bearings lasts significantly longer and you can adjust your preload. Especially helpful to mitigate rotor rubbing under load after a few thousands kilometers.
Very true
Any suggestions of such hubs, preferable light ones 24 holes for road?
@@erik.landen DT Swiss 180. Shimano Dura Ace,
@@Mapdec naah DTSWISS is cartridge bearing as well. High-end Campagnolo (Fulcrum) hubs are pretty light angular hubs, so are Dura-Ace and Ultegra. Chris Kings are also angular, but not very light, but not so heavy.
Interesting information and another excellent video/advice. Hambini recommended Farsport wheels but I am hesitant since I don't know what kind of bearings they use and when I used their "Contact Us" link on Farsport's website, and asked about what would be the procedure if I had to send them back (to China). No response. Yeah that makes me want to avoid Farsport. And now I will avoid Zipp as well.
Wonder how good Enve wheels support are?
Enve are ok as long as you live by the letter of their tech docs. Even fitting the wrong rim tape will land you in trouble.
Zipp rims are superb. Zipp hubs are absolute trash. My recommendation is go to a reputable wheel builder and have a pair built with something like some White Industries hubs.
Check Hambini
I've got wheels and hubs that are over forty years old that are still running on their original bearings. So what's wrong with this new bike tech? The way I see it, is that someone took the existing so called sealed bearing tech (probably Phil Wood) and miss-applied it to the bicycle hub, claiming it to be better and maintenance free. Problem is, most sealed bearing aren't intended to work in that angular capacity or to that level of precision so maybe the bicycle industry should stop going down that rabbit hole. Funny, the cup and cone aren't so bad after all. It was a simple elegant solution. Seems kind of like the car industries extensive use of plastics on engines. The obsolescence clock is ticking.
For sure. Cup and cone still very much has its place.
effing SRAM
Sram products are the best...avid brakes super...🤣🤣like other products...well made in asia🤣
Worked in a shop for years and Zipp bearings were always trash.
Meanwhile I have a pair of Superteam Chinese carbon wheels that I paid $275 for, they've got over 10,000 miles on them and they're as true as day one and running perfectly. Stop spending money on these insanely overpriced wheels and buy smart.