Who is your favorite character in ZZZ so far? This video turned into a character study halfway through when I was writing this script, so I had to wrangle it back to fit an 8-minute video. That's why it took longer to make. Let me know if you guys want to see longer videos! Music: - Kevin MacLeod - Darkest Child - Zenless Zone Zero - Dripfest Website - Text Me Records - Hit Me On My Way - Joel Steudler - Red Room - Joel Steudler - Blackest Sea - Yasumu - Left Behind - RAGE - Book the Rental Wit It
@PiggyPog-y8k Haha! Ellen is literally a sloth demon in shark form. Her IDGAF personality is outright amusing. She's also the only character so far who has two models: one for casual and one for combat.
Hmmm... each one is growing on me. So far, the Belobog Crew is up there. Anton is such a bro it's comical, Ben tries to be the "mature" adult of the bunch, Grace is hilariously into those robots and Koleda is clearly putting up a brave front to hide some past trauma.
@@John_II Yeah! Belobog is the only one that really feels like family. You kinda see them bickering and supporting each other all the time. We haven't seen that in the other groups yet.
@@FeyHunt I think the Cunnings Hares are sort of like a dysfunctional family. :P But "family" is a good word for Belobog. The "found family" to be exact. Come to think of it, that's why I love Belle and Wise - they remind me of my younger siblings. :)
@@John_II Oh I think Cunning Hares is like "The bros going to paint the town red on Saturday!" kind of thing. They have that air of reckless youth to them. And Victoria Housekeeping is more like a dysfunctional family. You got the uncle, the auntie who can't cook, a shy kid, and a bored kid. 😆
One thing that i enjoy about Jane is also how its clear how her background translates to her brand of inteligence, her being a behavioral expert in criminal psychology makes sense when you see her trying to jab people with different stimuli, whether it is making them uncomfortable via seduction, flirting or touching them to show their powerlessness you also get moments where she will feed their egos, threaten them by making them think of bad outcomes and she does it in both her missions and daily interactions, her mask of the doctor with the world of patients only slips when someone does something different, like Seths self sacrifice and Tomiya expressing genuine admiration for her as a person, even her voice lines have her talk about research subjects.
Yes! It's part of her charm! I think she's leaning more on the "tortured smart person" trope, where her great abilities in her job isolate her from the regular people. She is great at her job, but she gets very lonely at times. Those Trust Events really sold that point.
What helped is that the supporting antagonists were fairly simple but not completely unbelievable allowing more attention to be put on her and not completely complicate the story
Yes, precisely! There is a recent push in all media today where all villains must be complex and multi-layered. That's simply not true. Villains are meant to serve the theme of the story. Razor is evil, that's it. He doesn't need a sob backstory. He served his purpose to showcase where Jane and Seth could shine.
5:10 A small correction. Razor still planned to promote Jane but he wanted to do it in a way that would solidify the power dynamics between them and in the Mountain Lions gang by having Jane lose on purpose at Razor's order; ie, having her stop showing off in front of his goons and undermining his leadership. He even promised to have her treated at a hospital for any wounds if she complied. This is a really neat part of the whole episode to me because, as we've been in Jane's head the whole time, we know her need to plan ahead and improvise to hiccups on her plan means she has a fair bit of paranoia and as such, both she and us the players at first think Razor had figured out the spy gig and that's why he suddenly turned on Jane; but nah, its because the guy was salty about losing face in front of his men. Being an egotistical jerk, he'd bit the bait hook, line and sinker and didn't doubt that Jane wanted to have a position of power in the gang. He really just wanted to metaphorically collar her lol. Since Jane acts defiant (probably well past the point of wanting to continue the ruse any longer), Razor tries to beat her up to make her submit, which is when Seth interferes, and the rest is history. That aside, I think your point stands. Jane is very human, very intelligent but also prone to fallibility due to having to work on so much assumption that it sometimes gets away from her and she's forced to improvise a lot.
Thank you for the kind words! Hmmmm, I would argue that Razor lied there. He's not stupid. He knew that his gang had been on the NEPD radar for a long time. He should already know that Jane was also a wanted criminal by the NEPD. If he sent him to the hospital, she would just get arrested instead. Either way, he managed to get rid of her. And yes, that's why Jane did say "a broken clock is still right twice a day". Razor reached the wrong conclusion, but the result is still the same. Also, he probably felt threatened that Jane might replace him as the leader since she managed to rally everyone to her cause very easily, even overpowering their fear of him. Gang coup d'etat is a highly likely scenario for him. Or maybe all of my interpretations here are a stretch, I don't know.
I'd honestly argue it's a case of both. He's smart, yes. But he also very clearly had an ego. It felt like the two idea's just coincided as when she interferes with Seth being killed. That was the moment that finalized his plan to have Jane lose and be hospitalized. Like think from his pov. If she follows his order, then she will not have such a spotlight to overshadow him anymore since like you said, she would just get arrested. If she declines then he has an excuse to get rid of her.
You hit it right on the nail. There are two main reasons she works. First, ZZZ is down-to-earth despite its fantastical setting with animal people and purple domes that turn people into monsters. Characters are at most stronger than normal human. There is no mind-reader, no future sight, no time-travel, no parallel universes. It basically levels the competition, and it forces the writers to show her smarts by truly outsmarting others. Which lead to the second reason, we got her POV to follow along. The plan was A but Seth didn't get the memo so now it's B. Razor showed up unexpectedly so now it's C. The goons were kinda dumb so now it's D. So on and so forth.
Perfectly summarized! Those are two parts where I love Undercover RnB. The sad part was that it's kinda short... Hopefully we'll see her more next time!
In other Hoyo games, there were instances where we had been given the impression that such and such were smart. But, the story failed to showcase it and it ended up on two extremes. First extreme, it completely takes away the stakes and the character's existence can be taken as the writer's deus ex machina to fix whatever he wants after the story rolled. An example of this is HSR's Elio and his goons. His future sight just werks and if any of his goons is present you can expect an infodump of the writer justifying his plot twists however he wants. Second extreme, the writer wrote himself into a corner by writing a(n implied) smart character and he took his ability away for silly reasons. An example of this is Dottore from Genshin. I still roll my eyes when I remember they wrote him with the ability to have parallel thinking to the point he's outplaying everyone and the writer had him delete it without properly showcasing it. I think it took about 6-7 in-game hours (3 months irl) for the writer to backtrack on it lol Anyway, these are why ZZZ's grounded setting is pivotal. Everyone has to be on a level ground for some to raise above. In this case they did good with Jane.
@@so-toa9758 Oh my gosh... is that how they handled Elio in HSR? I stopped playing once Belobog was done. A character "who can see the future" is such a goldmine for a villain character! Of course, it does take a lot of work to write the story around it, just like in Undercover RnB. I guess the writers are either not skillful, or they are not given enough time and resources to do their thing. Also, Il Dottore is... weird to me. Back then, I wasn't as narratively literate as I am now, but I don't feel he's a real threat in Sumeru. He never had a chance to be. An Agent Smith character would be very cool to fight against. Definitely a better idea than having Balladeer in Sumeru. I guess my decision to stop playing both games is justified. There are some people who told me that Genshin gets better in Fontaine, and that HSR gets better at Penacony. But if this is how they'll do it, I'll stick to ZZZ.
So on Elio and the Stellaron Hunters: the chapter after Belobog, the first visit to Luofu, starts the angle that the Hunters aren't villains but anti-heroes willing to be labelled criminals. While the individual members have their own goals that Elio's predictions (his "scripts") will help them achieve, Elio himself is allegedly working to prevent the destruction of the known universe. In Luofu proper, while the Hunters seemingly "attack" they're really just acting as bait so the Astral Express will get involved with the incident happening there so the Luofu's higher ups will become indebted to the Express. Later in Penacony, "SAM" is sent there with vague instructions that ultimately lead to teaming up with the Express to stop the incident brewing there. So basically, Elio's scripts work as a wacky way to justify complicated machinations by saying Elio saw it happen so he sent a Hunter in to ensure the script would come true in a manner most convenient for the Hunters. This is meant to contrast with the Trailblazer who supposedly can defy fate but this angle isn't used anywhere but Kafka's Companion Quest afaik. In a way, Ellio is like the author's self insert railroading the plot. The Hunters are very popular with the fandom so this is a hot take but I personally don't think it makes for interesting storytelling when you have a future-sighting character who is basically on your side but willing to get his hands dirty so you don't have to, since there's essentially no narrative tension once you know fate will work itself out in your favor because this random dude you keep hearing about but never see has a whole squad of "fixers" on a dispatch hotline.
@@tsf9600 Yeah, I agree! You're right in saying that Elio is the author's projection into the story itself. It also cheapens the achievements of the Astral Express crew, by saying that everything they did was foretold I guess technically you can argue that narrative tension doesn't really exist in a live-service game, since you already know that the Trailblazer will always succeed. They are not allowed to die. But, by projecting into Elio, they made the thread of the story feel artificial. So why does Elio need to exist? He literally breaks the fourth wall. Traditionally, "the prophecy" trope was made to create narrative tension. There's a question "Can X defy their fate? Or can't they?". However, Elio removes all that tension from the story. Theoretically, he was supposed to alter events to his advantage, but in reality... he made events happen from nothing. I don't know where they are going with that... What's the payoff for him existing in the story? To me, whatever payoff he's cooking wouldn't be enough to justify his existence.
I also love how they let the characters be their character. Its like Jane is going to do her thing but adding Seth into the mix with his unique decision making and personality made everything different.
Definitely! You can also argue that despite Seth's presence ruining all of Jane's plans, he does make it alright in the end. It's debatable if Jane could finish the mission alone with all the surprises she got from Razor. I don't know if I want to make a video dedicated to Seth, but I do respect him. He's a dependable friend. If you ever got caught as a proxy, he's the officer you want to arrest you.
@@FeyHunt Seth's personality was so surprising to me, I thought he would just be this badass cop with cat ears you know, that's what I thought from his charadesign, but he's so different from what I expected. These new characters never fail to surprise me, I love this game
@@joker8042 Yeah! He actually carry a lot of baggage too if you get into his Trust Events. He was born in a rich family, but also had issues with his brother. I think that's a cue for future character.
Jane's writing felt so good to me, the cutscene where she manages to convince all the grunts and make the leader change his mind is just so great. I was not a fan of her design at first, but after playing through her story mission I just fell in love with the character. Definitely one of the best written, if not the best written character in the game.
The part that I really love about Jane's characterization is that she was shown to have worries of her own. She's not perfect, far from it. She really just does her job so well that when problems arise, even in a pinch, she makes the right adjustments. And even if those adjustments come back to bite her (like the final stretch of the special mission), she's not quick to just throw everything away. And she's even capable of showing her frustrations right at the face of incoming doom, a rare thing among "Smart" characters in a lot of stories. She's quite human, for a Rat Thiren with all that rizz Kinda spoiler for Jane's Trust events: Even in trust events as well as her trust cutscenes, we are shown that she's not "better than thou". She's just like everyone else, doing her job the best that she can (if "everyone else" was also an infiltration specialist).
Well said! She's not flawless and the writers gave us the chance to see what's inside her mind. That feels rather intimate. One of the things that crossed my mind when I was playing is "How did she become who she is right now? How did someone so caring take on this job?" We didn't get the full answer to that question aside from several hints in her free-roaming section.
@@FeyHunt indeed, even just the fact that we are led to wonder how she became who she is today is telling enough how compelling of a character Jane is. You just can't help but be invested and root for her in summary, Jane really is a character worth rooting for
Oh god... You have uncovered a long repressed memory. She's probably the worst writing for smart character ever. Tell, don't show in the worst way possible.
@@xXSamir44Xx Ironically, she is a good example of how to make a fake smart character. By keep telling the players that she's smart, but never being able to show it. I know that is probably unintentional, but it's just funny to me.
@@xXSamir44Xx That line always reminds me of the meme where the coach is asked about their strategy for the game, and says "Our goal is to prevent the opposing team from scoring any points, while we ourselves score many points."
Thank you for the kind words! PubSec characters are great so far! Let's hope for more buddy cop quests! Having Jane and Seth pair up properly would be very interesting. Or Zhu Yuan and Seth as a young vs experienced buddy cop would also be interesting!
This was a really good video diving kinda deep into Jane was really cool, kinda made me said when she came out and all some people were saying is that all she was just a overly sexualized character and getting when she’s such really well written character , I also find it interesting when she was interrogating that person in her trailer when she thought back to what happened she characterized Jane as something very scary and predatory. I just think it’s a cool juxtaposition for Jane to be a rat thiren an animal that is notoriously preyed upon and also be in the situations she’s in where she has to play the prey to catch her prey if that makes sense
Thank you for the kind words! She's quite funny because every marketing material for her is all about her femme fatale side, but none about her vulnerabilities. I think that's where people's initial knee-jerk reactions came from. This is one of many reasons why I don't watch promotional content on ZZZ channel. Sometimes it's misleading or outright spoilers.
I love her design ofc But this video is why she is my new favorite character. And it’s characters like these, why I actually pay attention to the story compared to the other hoyo games (didn’t play HSR much)
Cheers! Glad I can convince someone that she's a great character! I also didn't manage to latch on to a lot of Hoyoverse's characters beyond their looks (cute, hot, etc). ZZZ is truly something special 😄😄
The story in HSR is absolutely amazing imo. It's the first time some "random Gacha game" (what it was to me at the time) actually gripped me with its story, lore and characters. I personally haven't played HI3rd and I'm sure now someone else will tell me the same thing about that game now. 😂
@@ThorsShadow I do agree that HSR story is captivating when it works well. Belobog chapter is great in concept, but the execution is a bit flawed. The thing that prevented me from going with it was the gameplay. I really don't like HSR's gameplay due to the lack of satisfaction from it. HI3rd can be good... but you better prepare yourself for a long Visual Novel presentation. It's an old game, with barely any open world until you're like 80 hours in. If you do endure it, some parts of it are great.
i love how jane is envious of the mc siblings being able to frankly show their feelings. she also yearns the warm and cozy feeling of random play shown in her character trust mission. we can see the endearing side of her past all the jiggly physics and sus trailers.
I hope Hoyo uses Jane more in the story in the future! As much as I like that they are friends, I would love to see Belle/Wise assist her in the future so the friendship can really grow into something more than just a side thing from the main story. While Jane is definitely up there as one of my favs in ZZZ, my top favs are the OG Cunning Hares Nicole, Anby, and Billy. What I find interesting is that potentially the best hidden stories reside under our noses in the three starting characters. They all share some mysterious history that leave room for further development (and possibly S-Tier versions of their characters, but that’s me chugging major copium). Anby has her mysterious connection to S11 and Obol Squad (and the reason for her defection). Billy has his mysterious past as an Uber deadly robot mercenary for the Sons of Calydon. Lastly Nicole has her mysterious past with her wealthy adoptive family and why she left them. They’re all a bunch of relatable dummies with dark pasts and I cannot wait to see their pasts catch up with them in the main story!
Indeed! Jane would be amazing if the siblings decided to reveal their true identity. It will be a killer matchup: the legendary hacker Phaethon, the absolute best spy Jane Doe, and the insane AI Fairy. They can get to anywhere if they want to.
The real challenge comes when they try to portrait a character from mc's perspective. Jane easily has the best agent quest in zzz. But if we look at the other agent quest which tell the story from our perspective... Man it's not even close. Although the lycaon one is decent, but it's far from this. Edit: wording mistake
Yeah, and that's going to be topic for the next video! All of ZZZ Agent Stories are crap when compared to the main quest. I'm kinda tired of having these NPC story quests too.
Firstly, great video analysis of Jane doe. You put a lot of my thought's in a video format. Jane is NOT just a fan service character (contrary to what SOME people may say she is). I'd also like to add on to a comment to what you said at 3:45 using an example you used earlier in the video, Kafka. By this I mean. An example of a character doing this and it working. Not just from a logical standpoint of "yeah that makes sense" but also a writing one. While I won't say it's perfect, it is still an example of it being done.The ability to tell the future (from Elio) is never quite used as a crutch for her writing. When she is on screen, she is never really utilized like a plot device to ensure thing's go a certain way. No. While we don't know the full extent of Elio's script's, how precise they are in the details, or even how close she follows them (or the other stelleron hunter's too), it never feels cheap when she has a "it's in the script" moment's. That's because she is orchestrating for these thing's to happen or making them come into reality. Moving people to places or organizing event's to ensure they are at the right place at the right time. That's what makes it work. Cause it is not always set in stone (as seen in her quest), but she still has to work for these plans to make them come to fruition. Merely knowing what happens will not always make it happen. She has to move factor's or manipulate them to allow for that future to come into being. That's why it's always a guessing game on whenever she is actually acting genuine, following the script, or manipulating you for a future step. It may not lead to high stakes tension, although the allure of how mysterious she is and what's she's up to allows you to keep your eye on her without it feeling forced. Because you also want to see how thing's unfold. It also help's that she always has a touch for theatrics.
Thank you for the kind words! Kafka is... interesting in concept. I haven't had the chance to see her in action beyond the intro in Herta's Space Station. HSR's gameplay is just not for me. But from what I heard about Elio, I'm not a big fan of his inclusion in the story. His underlings are all very interesting though: A hacker that can hack reality, a femme fatale, a cursed, and a super soldier. Sounds like a bunch of misfits.
Jane's love of skating isn't a quirk. It's an explanation of the way she fights. Jane is a superhuman brain. She just doesn't seem like one. No one can actually improvise that fast without break. And that's okay. Holmes, the modern prototype of the big brain, relied on never actually telling anyone what was going on in his head. That's fun but it gets old. Jane, OTOH, is often showing her hand, either in internal dialogue or in her actions. (See her PV. It seems like she's just molesting that poop mouse thiren, but she's actually testing her. She's trying to work out if this is someone she can work with. When it turns out there's more work to be done, Jane has worked out the answer is no. This one can lie and bluff, true. But she falls apart under unexpected pressure. This is thematic with Jane feeling lonely. She's surrounded by people she can trust but she can't take any of them with her into the field. And being covert, that means she spends a lot of time alone. Jane is not, imo, the cypher she's made out to be. The writing team made a big deal of saying a good lie is fabricated atop the truth in the Nekomata/Ollie adventure. Jane's manipulations and expression matches her inner voice. She does what she does for reasons consistent with who we learn she is. These elements weave into the ways she decieves her opponents. She's refreshing because of how little time she spend decieving the audience. She only directly does so twice: ordering Seth flooded with water, throwing Seth's accomplice from the roof. In this, she feels more grounded. Overall, a good character analysis. I obviously disagree with some of it but character interpretation is personal. Disagreement is the point. I like what you did because I don't agree with all of it. It's something to think about, and it gives a wider view of what/who Jane could be.
Nice analysis! Yes, now that you mention it, her moveset does make sense from ice skating. I'm not familiar with that field so I didn't notice it earlier. She just looks like a regular gymnast to me. That being said, which one is the real Jane to you? Is it the femme fatale? Or is it the lonely girl? I'm leaning more on the latter. But I guess we'll never know for certain until we have more stories. Maybe she's like Batman and Bruce Wayne kinda guy.
@@FeyHunt The latter. The fatale is who Jane wanted to be in my headcanon. She got her wish, and it turned out to be less fulfilling than she thought. It's like a beautiful dress, or a tailored suit. It makes you look great, it says something real about you, but it is always and fundamentally something you put on, not the real you. You might love it. It might even become part of your identity. But it's still a mask, even if it's intention is to call attention to what's underneath. I think Jane loves her femme fatale"outfit" so much that she would never willingly take it off. But she's looking for people who can see through the first impression that outfit gives without loosing their cool. You noted that she can see through the "door man's" bluster to identify the coward beneath. She probably liked Seth seeing through her cover to recognize her "potential" but she wants connection with someone who understands what they can sense in others and can use it with a soft touch. Seth can see the real Jane under the fatale outfit, but he has the subtlety and low key vibe of active road maintenance. Jane wants partners who are willing and able to join her on the ice. Like a figure skater, she's performing femme fatale, and she wants someone to share the performance with. Someone who understands how and when to boost her into the air and where to be to catch her, especially when she decides to break from the choreography and improvise. She's lonely because she has yet to find a "skater" who can keep up with her. So, I think Jane enjoys the act she puts on. The "real" Jane is neither lonely nor fatale. She's a performer. But the lonely girl is more real than the fatale performance. Of course, this is my headcanon. I just like the idea that Jane has this depth. I think the writers are intentional creating contrasting parallels between the giant mouse (rat Jane) and the little kitty (cat Nekomiya) so I think the lonely rat is supposed to parallel and contrast with cat who has a new family. But that might just be me being all "Anby-Neko Doe best girl." Maybe I just see what I want to see.
@@samgordon9756 Very interesting interpretation! I'm honestly fine if this is the Jane they wanted to go with. They just need to show it in future stories and trust events. But I think you give Seth too much credit. That first interrogation scene is hilarious because Jane thought he could see that she's an undercover agent, but it turns out Seth was being too sappy. I think he said that to everyone else in the gang too without proper reasons. It was more about "I know you're better than this" pep talk. If Seth said that after Jane spared him from Razor, he would have a somewhat decent reason to believe that. This is also consistent with hiim being dense with social situations, like one of his trust event where he get interviewed by a reporter. He's not one who can see subtle hints.
@@FeyHunt I actually love that interpretation of Seth. My view of him is now updated to match. Maybe humanity really is worth it. Maybe Seth is a bit perceptive. Maybe Seth is as taken with his headcanon as I am with mine. The one certain thing is Seth sees the spark of redemption in everyone because Seth is an all second chances kind of guy. He's Constable Benton Fraser. He's Superman. I repeat myself there. Seth is out on the streets because he believes pubsec exists to save everyone it can, including the bad guys. Now I can see Jane getting her hopes up because Seth seems to see, only to be disappointed when she finds out that Seth is only right about her because that's his answer about everyone.😆 Thank you!
@@samgordon9756 Haha, no problem! He's definitely a guy I can respect! We can expect his viewpoint to be shaken when we eventually meet his jaded older brother.
i think Zhu yuan and Seth are written very well although at a glance from trash anime watchers they might look like uncompromising characters that follow the law no matter what they have major personality differences although they are both hardheaded
Yep, they have a solid foundation for characterization. They just need to have a story to showcase their true abilities, have their convictions tested. Both can be amazing at that.
Haha! I never wear a wig before, but shouldn't there be a hair covering under the fake scalps to hide your real hair? It's definitely NOT supposed to work like that! 😂
Two things: First of all, great video, loved it! Very well explained on how the writing worked, though I am surprised you did not mention the whole thing with muscle relexant/water, that was for me the first clue "oh yeah this lady is actually smart smart", It is pretty unambiguously clever to abuse the fact that cruelty makes people act stupid (and in her context make it a believable move among the gnag) to move a chess piece (Seth being the kind of straight forward thinker that probably wouldn't think about trying pulling on the ziptie before being told to) just to the point where she felt like she needed him. On that note, I am curious what you think about Sherlock Holmes in FGO. Not necessarily as the same thing as Jane, but how his brand of "inhumanly smart" actually works to be interesting rather than something annoying like pretty much most superhuman smart characters where you get perpetually annoyed with them. Second: I hear a bit of reverb in your talk, as a tip i have learned from working with that, get yourself a blanket and have it over your head while recording voiceover to make your voice crisper. You could, of course, get yourself some kind of soundbreakers in your room too, but that is more expensive than that, so do try that if it works for you :P
Heya, thanks for the comments! I didn't include it because though the muscle relaxant was pretty obvious to most people. She pretended to be mean while also doing something else entirely. Plus, the explanation she gave him is based on real life fact, but massively exaggerated. I haven't watched or played FGO at all, so I don't want to talk about things I haven't personally experienced. Though, I heard that Fate series have pretty good writing. I'm interested to give their animes a try someday. As for the reverb, I'm surprised you can hear that. This is actually the first time I have someone telling me about it. I will consider that in the future!
@@FeyHunt It's less something you hear outright but is a feature of texture to your voice i recognise from having dealt with this kind of stuff before :P It's not a massive issue, but that is a thing you kinda learn with time
@@Mirro18 Yeah, I'm still kinda new to this audio stuff. I got a cheap Elgato Mic several months ago, and the sound does improve a lot from my cheap 20$ headphone. But I got overwhelmed by the settings. Maybe I should learn more to tweak it later.
My favorite character so far is Billy, honestly. And it's not really because of his over the top persona, but that's amusing as well. I like that his persona seems like, well, a "persona". He is overanimated, to the point of it being not really feeling genuine. And I feel like his act isn't really for other people, but mostly for himself. Whatever he has tucked away in his past, he wants to stay far, far away from it. Criminals don't make horror stories about you and deem you a "flee on sight" individual for no reason. Whoever the "Starlight Knight" is, the "Original Billy", let's call him, is someone the current Billy does not want anything to do with anymore. Maybe the "Starlight Knight" was Billy before he passed the "Forbidden Fruit" test. Just pure programming as a killing machine. Man, imagine if the "Starlight Knight" is an S-rank variant of Billy. Wouldn't that be cool?
Yeah! Billy is interesting now you put it that way. He always has a mysterious aura around him, but he's stuck as a comic relief sidekick. If the next update with Sons of Calydon puts him on center stage, I bet we'll get an awesome story out of him. There must be a reason why he decided to leave his "big sister" Caesar. I hope he's one of those "crouching tiger, hidden badass" characters. You don't want him to get serious, or you'll be dead.
@@FeyHunt It definitely feels like both Billy and Anby have that capacity to be serious killing machines but choose not to tap into that part of their brains. Honestly, it’s what makes the Cunning Hares the most interesting (and my favorite) faction in ZZZ.
@@devilsadvocate22289 Oh definitely! The only thing that prevented me from fully loving Cunning Hares was the fact they got too easily tricked by Nekomata. The writing kinda conveyed them as stupid morons when they're supposed to be a badass team. And I really dislike how Nekomata is handled in the story too. My personal favorite is still Belobog since they have this "family" vibe with them.
Really? If I remember it well, the newspaper said that the Mountain Lions gang was arrested, but not specifically Razor, even though he's on the front cover. If he does survive, then what were all those gang members mad about when Jane and Seth went to the exit?
One of my favorite parts of the Undercover RnB story was how Jane is not omnipotent or invincible. In fact, it was Seth's earnestness which made a convert out of the Mountain Lion defector, who ultimately brought PubSec in as the cavalry to save the day at the end. I love that Hoyo was able to avoid so many story/character pitfalls when writing Jane, it's too easy to write a Mary Sue character instead of one that players can admire, empathize with, and even fear, all in one package. PS Jane is still very much an enigma to me. I do not see her final Trust mission as some cozy 'making you breakfast' fantasy. She essentially infiltrated Phaeton by taking advantage of their trust, and it's suspicious that all her 'getting up early to prep' was only for cup noodles. It's far more likely she was snooping around, perhaps just to satisfy her curiosity, or perhaps just to investigate future potential threats.
@@Vasharan Yeah, she's not perfect, and that's what makes her perfect 🥰🥰 I don't see if she's doing it intentionally in her Trust Event. The summary page in her Knock Knock profile seems pretty sincere: "To her, 'sweet dreams' and 'let's eat breakfast' are two significant phrases". She actually did collapsed. Her first Trust Event might be her showing off to Phaethon, but I don't think she's faking the final act. Is there a chance that she improvised to snoop around when she had the chance? Maybe. But it's not because she planned it all along.
As an aspiring writer, I always struggle with making smart characters, making the mistake of making the characters around the smart one a bit dumber (which I instantly regret and then start rewriting everything), so this video gives me a lot to analyze. Thanks !
Haha, indeed! That's the line I want to put into this video but eventually got cut out. Explaining that requires me to delve deeper into how to write a proper smart character step by step, which falls out of the scope for an 8-minute video
Is he now...? I haven't got the chance to review his agent story again, but wasn't his plan was to contact those gangs beforehand and caught them off guard? If I do miss his big brain move, please do let me know so I can pay closer attention! I do plan on making Agent Story videos in the near future.
@@comrad3892 Well yes, I would say our PubSec bros are also keeping tabs on us, especially Qingyi. To be clear, he did have his own aura of mystery and intellect, but the story hadn't given us a chance to delve into his way of thinking. He could be a great smart character too if they choose to do so.
And yet we get really humanizing scenes where he tries to lipread and gets it wrong, then goes and takes lip reading classes because he's super embarrassed LMAO
@@FeyHuntI feel like his main claim to being smart is his ability to either have every skill (blimp piloting, acting, electrician stuff, reading lips) or learn it in like a day (chuunibyou speak). idk about mastermind, but his intelligence is crazy high. he doesn't come off like a mary sue because he fails (he wasn't fast enough to get through the closing door in the ballet twins, his lip reading isn't perfect, and obviously there are things he doesn't know until he learns them), but he does come off as a super smart guy.
And than compare Jane Doe to SHE HALK: Why can I control myself so easily while Halk trained to control himself for a decade? because i am strong independent woman thats why!!! I am better in everything, always succeed always win, no matter what happening in world.
Oh god... She-Hulk is a joke show. Never had any intention to watch it. The moment I saw that clip she claimed she is threatened every day when walking to work, that's it. I'm out. Not even mentioning the twerk scenes.
@@FeyHunt Exactly! Jane Doe, Kafka, Raiden, this is Strong independent females, they feel humanly smart, alive, proactive, She halk and every other woke characters with comically hyper exaggerated "independence" feels more like jokes.
@@metaversguy This is why I rejected western media right now, games or movies. Embrace eastern games! Here, all the girls are beautiful inside and out and fanservice is plenty!
I'd like to speak up for Paimon a little. While her primary role is to yap about the current situation, I'd contend that she does so with an extra level of innocence while also speaking on behalf of the Traveller, thus making Traveller's own voice completely redundant but at the same time different from our own thoughts. I'm not sure if Paimon's writing was ever changed since the earlier chapters but I found myself consistently impressed by her input as long as I view her as a very precocious 8-10 year old child. And that means she was written only to be as smart as a child can reasonably be but throws out some really good observations from time to time, like young children tend to do, to our surprise.
@@owa1985 If you like her for what she is, that's totally fine. It's your preference. I am just pointing out her role in the story is unnecessary. She effectively replaced the Traveler's speech, summarize everything we just heard, and make unnecessary quips that don't contribute to the story. You can easily combine both Paimon and the Traveler into a single character and it will make a better and more cohesive chatacter.
@@FeyHunt That's my point though. Traveller and Paimon are in fact one character. Paimon speaks for Traveller and Traveller acts for Paimon. As for the summarizing thing, I suspect they wrote that in because the devs know that all we do is mash the next button on dialogue scenes (which I have lost count of the times I accidentally skipped vital dialogue) and I've always been pleasantly surprised by Paimon's own insights when she summarises. Ngl, if my kid can yap like Paimon, I'd be a proud parent.
@@owa1985 True. I don't know the exact proportions of Genshin's playerbase who hates Paimon, but I do notice a significant portion of it also voiced the same opinion as mine. So let us agree to disagree. I can argue inefficiencies and horrible storytelling all I want. But at the end of the day, it all comes down to preference. I prefer my games to have efficient writing. If Genshin devs and the majority of the players don't want that to change, then there's no reason for them to change.
@@FeyHunt I think it's probably more nuanced than that. Imagine if Paimon suddenly doesn't behave like Paimon on the next patch. That would be even weirder, tbh. And besides, who the heck cares what the rest of the player base thinks? The point is that like you said, you can see the merit of both opinions but it's probably more important that regardless of which side of the fence you fall on, it's not at all based on whether more people like that side of the fence. But I must apologise that I forgot to tell you that I appreciate your videos including this one, even if we don't share the same opinion. Everything you said about Jane, I totally agree with and more than that, your observations on why she is well written is spot on, to the point that I'll probably refer to this video whenever I would either write or criticise a character I want to appear as "smart" in the future. TL;DR: Please don't let this little point about Paimon memery take away from your good work here, k?
@@owa1985 Oh no no, I don't take offense to your points here. It's just something I disagree with. Totally normal! You didn't do anything wrong. You defended your arguments and I don't want to push it further than I should. I see that it all comes down to preference and I don't have anything else to add. Attacking arguments is fine, but attacking preferences can be insulting. So that's why I said: "agree to disagree" since our preferences are different. I enjoy these kinds of discussions. Please don't let this disagreement dissuade you from making more based comments in the future! 😄😄
some stuff in her quest felt very convineint for the plot like not all cops knowing she was a secret agent, the drukards she used to get into the neos building, or the fissures that allowed the lion gang member to survive the fall. they feel like weird plot excuses that took me out of the story. but imo zenless has never set an expectation of perfect realism which allows the story to be a little wacky and lets the audience focus on what matters, in this case being janes intricate planning and the glimpses of her real personality
Seth fucked up her plan much more than he helped. If Jane didn't have to save Seth, she could have just become Razor's bodyguard and slit his throat while he slept. The drunk people and portals, I agree! Although honestly, there should really be a covert entrance to the police station anyway :p I think the drunk people were just there to show how she can improvise moreso than being pivotal to the plot - it could have easily been cut out and the story would be intact.
Yeah, you can see it as ZZZ being itself. There is a certain comical element to it, especially with Razor pausing to wait for Jane and Seth to speak up. But to add to the discussion... not all cops knew she was a secret agent is a detriment to her. I did cut this from the video, but the general rule of writing is this: "Conveniences that get your character into trouble are good, but conveniences that get your character out of trouble are bad". Had Seth been informed, he would've stayed in the smoke and let Jane escape as planned. I do agree with @ddd8828. The drunkards are just to give her a chance, but she still has to work to use it. Meanwhile, the guy surviving the fall is bullcrap, physically speaking. You can write a story where he actually died and have Jane deal with the aftermath. It could be more interesting, actually. How would she deal with collaterals in her mission?
Alright Here I am again my bit**ing, Now compare this undercover agent in ZZZ with undercover agent present a ahhhhh..... Genshin 2.0 called Yinlin moving in broad daylight and performing undercover operations for the public safety bureau (idk if its called that but its something like that) and holds an elite position in it. WTF did the writer was thinking when writing a undercover story. Its like written by someone who has never once read or watched any and I mean any Undercover related stuff. seriously whoever was incharge of the that story needs to attend some classes on how to write basic stories and worldbuilding. The ending to that story was absolutely hilarious, mind booglingly stupid. The so called bad guy some magically erased her records from her employer's database and now no one can even recognize her as the member of that bureau. That means the entire time her employer or the head of PSB was blind when he/she hired Yinlin for the role of undercover agent. Not to mention crappy backstory they gave to yinlin. Its just pains me to even write this comment. THIS IS THE SAME DEV THAT WROTE EYE WATERING CHAPTER IN PUNSHING:GRAY RAVEN. (again asking u to review it highly suggested if u to critically analyze Genshin 2.0) She was being Portrayed as this BATMAN of the JINZHOU city, the scarlet knight in the shadows, yet she is given this treatment like she does not even matter in the world anymore. Are u kidding me? Her character trailer showed more promises than her entire foolishly written story. There were no stakes, there were no severe consequences, there were no repercussions and she is just silently killed off in the distance. IF THEY REALLY HAD TO DELETE HER FROM THE MAIN STORY, then atleast could have done it in a more effective manner, like The bad guy could have leaked that the OVERLORD HAREM MC was kidnapped by YINLIN A MEMBER OF THE OFFICIAL UNDERCOVER AGENCY to the midnight rangers/patrollers thereby giving her a bad reputation, making her a most wanted in all of Jinzhou or maybe the New Federation or whatever the hell that is or just leaking that she is a undercover agent in the general public. CREATE SOME STAKES GODDAMIT. and then on the other hand we have Jane dough, write of the bat she is not even once seen in the general public first and foremost rule of being an undercover agent. And only interacts with them if need arises. This story was written with actual thought put into it. Jane had to make it up to the top into that gang's members and had to gain the trust while she was only doing it alone, no OVERLORD HAREM ARISING FROM ASHES TO SAVE THE RAT FROM THE LIONS. Seth and the site workers' kidnaping only made it even more difficult for Her to act on her own cuz now she had to look after the site workers and Seth who is a complete novice in NEPS or Buffoon for short. She had to make it snappy and there was hint of tensions everytime and when she called for the duel when one gang member was seemingly executed for helping the kidnapped by jane herself, that freaking created a tension in the atmosphere of the chapter, she had to be ruthless in her actions. And the duel happens where the leader was already planning on killing the rat with his own hands rather than making her his right hand. Even though its a cliché story it works for her story and then in her character trailer we learn that all the members captured one got away and the leader was seemingly missing and also she was the gang's leader in the reports. There fore creating another reason for her to be in hiding once more carry out the next mission. Plus the romance b/w Jane and Seth worked wonders here. Unlike Yinlin also bootlicking THE OVERLORD HAREM MC like the bajjilion other boot lickers in the city ohhh sorry the world of genshin 2.0
and before u start to state that u are neutral cuz story writing takes time. DUDE they had 2 years two whole freaking years. in CBT1 she was connected to whining aix and had much better plot focused story. According to some leaks or rumors the writer are same as PGR where they can write glorious chapters yet in this game they complete toddlers when it comes to write a single cohesive line of a story. its not like they inexperienced or anything, me a long time player of PGR knows what they are capable of yet they are doing the exact opposite.
Haha, I always love your unhinged rant! But yes, I do agree wholeheartedly. 10 minutes into Yinlin's Companion Story and I already see the cracks everywhere. She can't even make a proper excuse to let her off the hook. She has to display her Patroller badge. That failed in so many different ways. This is exactly why I haven't fully played the entire Companion Story in WuWa. I just don't have the motivation to do it. They don't have writers for this game, do they?
@@FeyHunt and they proudly call it the genshin killer my ass. Man this horrendous writing made me Leave the game. I would have cut them some slack for copying Genshin impact but no this game is not for story enjoyers like u and me. It's lamely, lazily and greedily put together soulless copied sheit show that that only appeal to exhuasted ex genshin players or just casual players who don't give a f about story. Seeing pretty animated graphics is enough eye candy for them and KURO is cashing that very aspect so they don't give a sheit about making a good story. They rewrote the entire CBT1, well written story just for the sake of making it appeal to simps and coomers in the gacha community. But still the defenders claim that it's going to become a huge game yeah let's see what we have in the game a yae miko copy who just wanna bang the MC and is drooling over the Overlord MC, zhi Zhi haha whose story is about being creative, being urself and being honest while the game itself is copying entirely from Genshin impact, ahh yes a character exists in this game who is not even once mentioned.in the story once no he does not even exist in that world to Begin with, what do we have in the future a copied HSR character called swan which had coomers and simps drooling over rn. I don't need freebies, I need a quality game for fk sake. I don't play the game just for the sake of combat alone. I wanna see myself immersed in that stupid little fantasy far away from the real world and this game has zero immersion to begin with. Combat alone won't be able to carry it.
I disagree with the way she is shown to be human she is unlucky but that's out of her control she rarely shows signs of weakness that's why i find her pretty flat
Huh... Did we play the same story? As I said in the video, she did show regrets and doubts many times in the quest. The most noticeable part is her wishing the guy she threw was alright, and how she interacts with the objects in the free-roaming section.
@FeyHunt you know what you're right I really did like how they wrote her thoughts In the free roam section made her feel grounded and especially the part where she hoped the guy she threw off a building is great and the part where she gets caught by razor her moments of weakness are immediately overshadowed by showcases of her wit
There are some lore significance if you really squint on it. But yeah, I think this is what we can expect from special episodes. They act more like Agent stories than main stories
i like to imagine the special episode still has some merit as it attempts to showcase what the character is as a set-up (especially since shes the smart character who are mostly prone to pitfalls) so when she eventually shows up in the main plot later on its as if we can intuit that she might cook something up in the off-chance theres an even more intelligent antagonist that they might need her specialty for
@@sigma0184 Good point! Maybe we do need her to be introduced before the main story to fully understand her. If that's true, then the next chapter with her might start with a bang and go straight into the action. That's gotta be exciting!
Well... I would say my praises are well-adjusted for what the story was. They earned my respect for trying to do something better than most gacha games. But feel free to disagree if there are parts you hated. I do have mine as well. The only way for gacha game story to improve is if we celebrate when they do right, and criticize them when they do wrong. Next video might be criticism time!
Who is your favorite character in ZZZ so far?
This video turned into a character study halfway through when I was writing this script, so I had to wrangle it back to fit an 8-minute video. That's why it took longer to make. Let me know if you guys want to see longer videos!
Music:
- Kevin MacLeod - Darkest Child
- Zenless Zone Zero - Dripfest Website
- Text Me Records - Hit Me On My Way
- Joel Steudler - Red Room
- Joel Steudler - Blackest Sea
- Yasumu - Left Behind
- RAGE - Book the Rental Wit It
@PiggyPog-y8k Haha! Ellen is literally a sloth demon in shark form. Her IDGAF personality is outright amusing. She's also the only character so far who has two models: one for casual and one for combat.
Hmmm... each one is growing on me. So far, the Belobog Crew is up there. Anton is such a bro it's comical, Ben tries to be the "mature" adult of the bunch, Grace is hilariously into those robots and Koleda is clearly putting up a brave front to hide some past trauma.
@@John_II Yeah! Belobog is the only one that really feels like family. You kinda see them bickering and supporting each other all the time. We haven't seen that in the other groups yet.
@@FeyHunt I think the Cunnings Hares are sort of like a dysfunctional family. :P
But "family" is a good word for Belobog. The "found family" to be exact.
Come to think of it, that's why I love Belle and Wise - they remind me of my younger siblings. :)
@@John_II Oh I think Cunning Hares is like "The bros going to paint the town red on Saturday!" kind of thing. They have that air of reckless youth to them.
And Victoria Housekeeping is more like a dysfunctional family. You got the uncle, the auntie who can't cook, a shy kid, and a bored kid.
😆
One thing that i enjoy about Jane is also how its clear how her background translates to her brand of inteligence, her being a behavioral expert in criminal psychology makes sense when you see her trying to jab people with different stimuli, whether it is making them uncomfortable via seduction, flirting or touching them to show their powerlessness you also get moments where she will feed their egos, threaten them by making them think of bad outcomes and she does it in both her missions and daily interactions, her mask of the doctor with the world of patients only slips when someone does something different, like Seths self sacrifice and Tomiya expressing genuine admiration for her as a person, even her voice lines have her talk about research subjects.
Yes! It's part of her charm! I think she's leaning more on the "tortured smart person" trope, where her great abilities in her job isolate her from the regular people. She is great at her job, but she gets very lonely at times. Those Trust Events really sold that point.
What helped is that the supporting antagonists were fairly simple but not completely unbelievable allowing more attention to be put on her and not completely complicate the story
Yes, precisely! There is a recent push in all media today where all villains must be complex and multi-layered. That's simply not true. Villains are meant to serve the theme of the story. Razor is evil, that's it. He doesn't need a sob backstory. He served his purpose to showcase where Jane and Seth could shine.
"She feels very real and rounded"
TRUE, I can SEE that.
It bounced! I repeat, it bounced!
5:10 A small correction. Razor still planned to promote Jane but he wanted to do it in a way that would solidify the power dynamics between them and in the Mountain Lions gang by having Jane lose on purpose at Razor's order; ie, having her stop showing off in front of his goons and undermining his leadership. He even promised to have her treated at a hospital for any wounds if she complied.
This is a really neat part of the whole episode to me because, as we've been in Jane's head the whole time, we know her need to plan ahead and improvise to hiccups on her plan means she has a fair bit of paranoia and as such, both she and us the players at first think Razor had figured out the spy gig and that's why he suddenly turned on Jane; but nah, its because the guy was salty about losing face in front of his men. Being an egotistical jerk, he'd bit the bait hook, line and sinker and didn't doubt that Jane wanted to have a position of power in the gang. He really just wanted to metaphorically collar her lol.
Since Jane acts defiant (probably well past the point of wanting to continue the ruse any longer), Razor tries to beat her up to make her submit, which is when Seth interferes, and the rest is history.
That aside, I think your point stands. Jane is very human, very intelligent but also prone to fallibility due to having to work on so much assumption that it sometimes gets away from her and she's forced to improvise a lot.
Thank you for the kind words!
Hmmmm, I would argue that Razor lied there. He's not stupid. He knew that his gang had been on the NEPD radar for a long time. He should already know that Jane was also a wanted criminal by the NEPD. If he sent him to the hospital, she would just get arrested instead. Either way, he managed to get rid of her.
And yes, that's why Jane did say "a broken clock is still right twice a day". Razor reached the wrong conclusion, but the result is still the same. Also, he probably felt threatened that Jane might replace him as the leader since she managed to rally everyone to her cause very easily, even overpowering their fear of him. Gang coup d'etat is a highly likely scenario for him.
Or maybe all of my interpretations here are a stretch, I don't know.
I'd honestly argue it's a case of both. He's smart, yes. But he also very clearly had an ego. It felt like the two idea's just coincided as when she interferes with Seth being killed. That was the moment that finalized his plan to have Jane lose and be hospitalized. Like think from his pov. If she follows his order, then she will not have such a spotlight to overshadow him anymore since like you said, she would just get arrested. If she declines then he has an excuse to get rid of her.
@@Nekomon. That's correct. Either way, he wanted Jane to either submit or die. That final scene was his final straw.
You hit it right on the nail. There are two main reasons she works.
First, ZZZ is down-to-earth despite its fantastical setting with animal people and purple domes that turn people into monsters. Characters are at most stronger than normal human. There is no mind-reader, no future sight, no time-travel, no parallel universes. It basically levels the competition, and it forces the writers to show her smarts by truly outsmarting others.
Which lead to the second reason, we got her POV to follow along. The plan was A but Seth didn't get the memo so now it's B. Razor showed up unexpectedly so now it's C. The goons were kinda dumb so now it's D. So on and so forth.
Perfectly summarized! Those are two parts where I love Undercover RnB. The sad part was that it's kinda short...
Hopefully we'll see her more next time!
In other Hoyo games, there were instances where we had been given the impression that such and such were smart. But, the story failed to showcase it and it ended up on two extremes.
First extreme, it completely takes away the stakes and the character's existence can be taken as the writer's deus ex machina to fix whatever he wants after the story rolled. An example of this is HSR's Elio and his goons. His future sight just werks and if any of his goons is present you can expect an infodump of the writer justifying his plot twists however he wants.
Second extreme, the writer wrote himself into a corner by writing a(n implied) smart character and he took his ability away for silly reasons. An example of this is Dottore from Genshin. I still roll my eyes when I remember they wrote him with the ability to have parallel thinking to the point he's outplaying everyone and the writer had him delete it without properly showcasing it. I think it took about 6-7 in-game hours (3 months irl) for the writer to backtrack on it lol
Anyway, these are why ZZZ's grounded setting is pivotal. Everyone has to be on a level ground for some to raise above. In this case they did good with Jane.
@@so-toa9758 Oh my gosh... is that how they handled Elio in HSR? I stopped playing once Belobog was done. A character "who can see the future" is such a goldmine for a villain character! Of course, it does take a lot of work to write the story around it, just like in Undercover RnB. I guess the writers are either not skillful, or they are not given enough time and resources to do their thing.
Also, Il Dottore is... weird to me. Back then, I wasn't as narratively literate as I am now, but I don't feel he's a real threat in Sumeru. He never had a chance to be. An Agent Smith character would be very cool to fight against. Definitely a better idea than having Balladeer in Sumeru.
I guess my decision to stop playing both games is justified. There are some people who told me that Genshin gets better in Fontaine, and that HSR gets better at Penacony. But if this is how they'll do it, I'll stick to ZZZ.
So on Elio and the Stellaron Hunters: the chapter after Belobog, the first visit to Luofu, starts the angle that the Hunters aren't villains but anti-heroes willing to be labelled criminals. While the individual members have their own goals that Elio's predictions (his "scripts") will help them achieve, Elio himself is allegedly working to prevent the destruction of the known universe.
In Luofu proper, while the Hunters seemingly "attack" they're really just acting as bait so the Astral Express will get involved with the incident happening there so the Luofu's higher ups will become indebted to the Express. Later in Penacony, "SAM" is sent there with vague instructions that ultimately lead to teaming up with the Express to stop the incident brewing there.
So basically, Elio's scripts work as a wacky way to justify complicated machinations by saying Elio saw it happen so he sent a Hunter in to ensure the script would come true in a manner most convenient for the Hunters. This is meant to contrast with the Trailblazer who supposedly can defy fate but this angle isn't used anywhere but Kafka's Companion Quest afaik. In a way, Ellio is like the author's self insert railroading the plot.
The Hunters are very popular with the fandom so this is a hot take but I personally don't think it makes for interesting storytelling when you have a future-sighting character who is basically on your side but willing to get his hands dirty so you don't have to, since there's essentially no narrative tension once you know fate will work itself out in your favor because this random dude you keep hearing about but never see has a whole squad of "fixers" on a dispatch hotline.
@@tsf9600 Yeah, I agree! You're right in saying that Elio is the author's projection into the story itself. It also cheapens the achievements of the Astral Express crew, by saying that everything they did was foretold
I guess technically you can argue that narrative tension doesn't really exist in a live-service game, since you already know that the Trailblazer will always succeed. They are not allowed to die. But, by projecting into Elio, they made the thread of the story feel artificial. So why does Elio need to exist? He literally breaks the fourth wall.
Traditionally, "the prophecy" trope was made to create narrative tension. There's a question "Can X defy their fate? Or can't they?". However, Elio removes all that tension from the story. Theoretically, he was supposed to alter events to his advantage, but in reality... he made events happen from nothing.
I don't know where they are going with that... What's the payoff for him existing in the story? To me, whatever payoff he's cooking wouldn't be enough to justify his existence.
I also love how they let the characters be their character. Its like Jane is going to do her thing but adding Seth into the mix with his unique decision making and personality made everything different.
Definitely! You can also argue that despite Seth's presence ruining all of Jane's plans, he does make it alright in the end. It's debatable if Jane could finish the mission alone with all the surprises she got from Razor.
I don't know if I want to make a video dedicated to Seth, but I do respect him. He's a dependable friend. If you ever got caught as a proxy, he's the officer you want to arrest you.
@@FeyHunt Seth's personality was so surprising to me, I thought he would just be this badass cop with cat ears you know, that's what I thought from his charadesign, but he's so different from what I expected. These new characters never fail to surprise me, I love this game
@@joker8042 Yeah! He actually carry a lot of baggage too if you get into his Trust Events. He was born in a rich family, but also had issues with his brother. I think that's a cue for future character.
Jane's writing felt so good to me, the cutscene where she manages to convince all the grunts and make the leader change his mind is just so great. I was not a fan of her design at first, but after playing through her story mission I just fell in love with the character. Definitely one of the best written, if not the best written character in the game.
@@joker8042 Heck yeah! She's so well-written for this game! Looking forward to see more of her in future stories!
5:29 "She is a human", my brain: RRRRRAT
Haha! If I did say she's just a regular rat... I think you guys would have A LOT of questions about how I know so much about rat psychology. 🤣🤣
The part that I really love about Jane's characterization is that she was shown to have worries of her own. She's not perfect, far from it. She really just does her job so well that when problems arise, even in a pinch, she makes the right adjustments. And even if those adjustments come back to bite her (like the final stretch of the special mission), she's not quick to just throw everything away. And she's even capable of showing her frustrations right at the face of incoming doom, a rare thing among "Smart" characters in a lot of stories. She's quite human, for a Rat Thiren with all that rizz
Kinda spoiler for Jane's Trust events:
Even in trust events as well as her trust cutscenes, we are shown that she's not "better than thou". She's just like everyone else, doing her job the best that she can (if "everyone else" was also an infiltration specialist).
Well said! She's not flawless and the writers gave us the chance to see what's inside her mind. That feels rather intimate. One of the things that crossed my mind when I was playing is "How did she become who she is right now? How did someone so caring take on this job?"
We didn't get the full answer to that question aside from several hints in her free-roaming section.
@@FeyHunt indeed, even just the fact that we are led to wonder how she became who she is today is telling enough how compelling of a character Jane is. You just can't help but be invested and root for her
in summary, Jane really is a character worth rooting for
Hoyo has come a long way since Kokomi
Oh god... You have uncovered a long repressed memory. She's probably the worst writing for smart character ever.
Tell, don't show in the worst way possible.
"Our goal is to hit the enemy hard while minimising casulties." I know the line cane from her trailer, but it has haunted me for years.
@@xXSamir44Xx Ironically, she is a good example of how to make a fake smart character. By keep telling the players that she's smart, but never being able to show it. I know that is probably unintentional, but it's just funny to me.
@@xXSamir44Xx That line always reminds me of the meme where the coach is asked about their strategy for the game, and says "Our goal is to prevent the opposing team from scoring any points, while we ourselves score many points."
I agree with everything you said, and I hope, due to zzz's intertwined nature, we can get more of pubsec later in the story!
Thank you for the kind words! PubSec characters are great so far! Let's hope for more buddy cop quests!
Having Jane and Seth pair up properly would be very interesting. Or Zhu Yuan and Seth as a young vs experienced buddy cop would also be interesting!
This was a really good video diving kinda deep into Jane was really cool, kinda made me said when she came out and all some people were saying is that all she was just a overly sexualized character and getting when she’s such really well written character , I also find it interesting when she was interrogating that person in her trailer when she thought back to what happened she characterized Jane as something very scary and predatory. I just think it’s a cool juxtaposition for Jane to be a rat thiren an animal that is notoriously preyed upon and also be in the situations she’s in where she has to play the prey to catch her prey if that makes sense
Thank you for the kind words! She's quite funny because every marketing material for her is all about her femme fatale side, but none about her vulnerabilities. I think that's where people's initial knee-jerk reactions came from.
This is one of many reasons why I don't watch promotional content on ZZZ channel. Sometimes it's misleading or outright spoilers.
I love her design ofc
But this video is why she is my new favorite character. And it’s characters like these, why I actually pay attention to the story compared to the other hoyo games (didn’t play HSR much)
Cheers! Glad I can convince someone that she's a great character! I also didn't manage to latch on to a lot of Hoyoverse's characters beyond their looks (cute, hot, etc). ZZZ is truly something special 😄😄
The story in HSR is absolutely amazing imo. It's the first time some "random Gacha game" (what it was to me at the time) actually gripped me with its story, lore and characters.
I personally haven't played HI3rd and I'm sure now someone else will tell me the same thing about that game now. 😂
@@ThorsShadow I do agree that HSR story is captivating when it works well. Belobog chapter is great in concept, but the execution is a bit flawed. The thing that prevented me from going with it was the gameplay. I really don't like HSR's gameplay due to the lack of satisfaction from it.
HI3rd can be good... but you better prepare yourself for a long Visual Novel presentation. It's an old game, with barely any open world until you're like 80 hours in. If you do endure it, some parts of it are great.
i love how jane is envious of the mc siblings being able to frankly show their feelings. she also yearns the warm and cozy feeling of random play shown in her character trust mission. we can see the endearing side of her past all the jiggly physics and sus trailers.
@@maheee Yeah! And damn, this girl is really need some hugs and headpats. She just came in half-concious! 😄😄
I hope Hoyo uses Jane more in the story in the future! As much as I like that they are friends, I would love to see Belle/Wise assist her in the future so the friendship can really grow into something more than just a side thing from the main story.
While Jane is definitely up there as one of my favs in ZZZ, my top favs are the OG Cunning Hares Nicole, Anby, and Billy. What I find interesting is that potentially the best hidden stories reside under our noses in the three starting characters. They all share some mysterious history that leave room for further development (and possibly S-Tier versions of their characters, but that’s me chugging major copium). Anby has her mysterious connection to S11 and Obol Squad (and the reason for her defection). Billy has his mysterious past as an Uber deadly robot mercenary for the Sons of Calydon. Lastly Nicole has her mysterious past with her wealthy adoptive family and why she left them.
They’re all a bunch of relatable dummies with dark pasts and I cannot wait to see their pasts catch up with them in the main story!
Indeed! Jane would be amazing if the siblings decided to reveal their true identity. It will be a killer matchup: the legendary hacker Phaethon, the absolute best spy Jane Doe, and the insane AI Fairy. They can get to anywhere if they want to.
The real challenge comes when they try to portrait a character from mc's perspective. Jane easily has the best agent quest in zzz. But if we look at the other agent quest which tell the story from our perspective... Man it's not even close. Although the lycaon one is decent, but it's far from this.
Edit: wording mistake
Yeah, and that's going to be topic for the next video! All of ZZZ Agent Stories are crap when compared to the main quest. I'm kinda tired of having these NPC story quests too.
Firstly, great video analysis of Jane doe. You put a lot of my thought's in a video format. Jane is NOT just a fan service character (contrary to what SOME people may say she is). I'd also like to add on to a comment to what you said at 3:45 using an example you used earlier in the video, Kafka. By this I mean. An example of a character doing this and it working. Not just from a logical standpoint of "yeah that makes sense" but also a writing one. While I won't say it's perfect, it is still an example of it being done.The ability to tell the future (from Elio) is never quite used as a crutch for her writing. When she is on screen, she is never really utilized like a plot device to ensure thing's go a certain way. No. While we don't know the full extent of Elio's script's, how precise they are in the details, or even how close she follows them (or the other stelleron hunter's too), it never feels cheap when she has a "it's in the script" moment's. That's because she is orchestrating for these thing's to happen or making them come into reality. Moving people to places or organizing event's to ensure they are at the right place at the right time. That's what makes it work. Cause it is not always set in stone (as seen in her quest), but she still has to work for these plans to make them come to fruition. Merely knowing what happens will not always make it happen. She has to move factor's or manipulate them to allow for that future to come into being. That's why it's always a guessing game on whenever she is actually acting genuine, following the script, or manipulating you for a future step. It may not lead to high stakes tension, although the allure of how mysterious she is and what's she's up to allows you to keep your eye on her without it feeling forced. Because you also want to see how thing's unfold. It also help's that she always has a touch for theatrics.
Thank you for the kind words! Kafka is... interesting in concept. I haven't had the chance to see her in action beyond the intro in Herta's Space Station. HSR's gameplay is just not for me.
But from what I heard about Elio, I'm not a big fan of his inclusion in the story.
His underlings are all very interesting though: A hacker that can hack reality, a femme fatale, a cursed, and a super soldier. Sounds like a bunch of misfits.
Jane's love of skating isn't a quirk. It's an explanation of the way she fights.
Jane is a superhuman brain. She just doesn't seem like one. No one can actually improvise that fast without break. And that's okay.
Holmes, the modern prototype of the big brain, relied on never actually telling anyone what was going on in his head. That's fun but it gets old. Jane, OTOH, is often showing her hand, either in internal dialogue or in her actions.
(See her PV. It seems like she's just molesting that poop mouse thiren, but she's actually testing her. She's trying to work out if this is someone she can work with. When it turns out there's more work to be done, Jane has worked out the answer is no. This one can lie and bluff, true. But she falls apart under unexpected pressure.
This is thematic with Jane feeling lonely. She's surrounded by people she can trust but she can't take any of them with her into the field. And being covert, that means she spends a lot of time alone.
Jane is not, imo, the cypher she's made out to be. The writing team made a big deal of saying a good lie is fabricated atop the truth in the Nekomata/Ollie adventure. Jane's manipulations and expression matches her inner voice. She does what she does for reasons consistent with who we learn she is. These elements weave into the ways she decieves her opponents.
She's refreshing because of how little time she spend decieving the audience. She only directly does so twice: ordering Seth flooded with water, throwing Seth's accomplice from the roof. In this, she feels more grounded.
Overall, a good character analysis. I obviously disagree with some of it but character interpretation is personal. Disagreement is the point. I like what you did because I don't agree with all of it. It's something to think about, and it gives a wider view of what/who Jane could be.
Nice analysis! Yes, now that you mention it, her moveset does make sense from ice skating. I'm not familiar with that field so I didn't notice it earlier. She just looks like a regular gymnast to me.
That being said, which one is the real Jane to you? Is it the femme fatale? Or is it the lonely girl? I'm leaning more on the latter. But I guess we'll never know for certain until we have more stories. Maybe she's like Batman and Bruce Wayne kinda guy.
@@FeyHunt The latter. The fatale is who Jane wanted to be in my headcanon. She got her wish, and it turned out to be less fulfilling than she thought.
It's like a beautiful dress, or a tailored suit. It makes you look great, it says something real about you, but it is always and fundamentally something you put on, not the real you. You might love it. It might even become part of your identity. But it's still a mask, even if it's intention is to call attention to what's underneath.
I think Jane loves her femme fatale"outfit" so much that she would never willingly take it off. But she's looking for people who can see through the first impression that outfit gives without loosing their cool.
You noted that she can see through the "door man's" bluster to identify the coward beneath. She probably liked Seth seeing through her cover to recognize her "potential" but she wants connection with someone who understands what they can sense in others and can use it with a soft touch. Seth can see the real Jane under the fatale outfit, but he has the subtlety and low key vibe of active road maintenance.
Jane wants partners who are willing and able to join her on the ice. Like a figure skater, she's performing femme fatale, and she wants someone to share the performance with. Someone who understands how and when to boost her into the air and where to be to catch her, especially when she decides to break from the choreography and improvise.
She's lonely because she has yet to find a "skater" who can keep up with her.
So, I think Jane enjoys the act she puts on. The "real" Jane is neither lonely nor fatale. She's a performer. But the lonely girl is more real than the fatale performance.
Of course, this is my headcanon. I just like the idea that Jane has this depth. I think the writers are intentional creating contrasting parallels between the giant mouse (rat Jane) and the little kitty (cat Nekomiya) so I think the lonely rat is supposed to parallel and contrast with cat who has a new family.
But that might just be me being all "Anby-Neko Doe best girl." Maybe I just see what I want to see.
@@samgordon9756 Very interesting interpretation! I'm honestly fine if this is the Jane they wanted to go with. They just need to show it in future stories and trust events.
But I think you give Seth too much credit. That first interrogation scene is hilarious because Jane thought he could see that she's an undercover agent, but it turns out Seth was being too sappy. I think he said that to everyone else in the gang too without proper reasons. It was more about "I know you're better than this" pep talk. If Seth said that after Jane spared him from Razor, he would have a somewhat decent reason to believe that.
This is also consistent with hiim being dense with social situations, like one of his trust event where he get interviewed by a reporter. He's not one who can see subtle hints.
@@FeyHunt I actually love that interpretation of Seth. My view of him is now updated to match. Maybe humanity really is worth it. Maybe Seth is a bit perceptive. Maybe Seth is as taken with his headcanon as I am with mine. The one certain thing is Seth sees the spark of redemption in everyone because Seth is an all second chances kind of guy.
He's Constable Benton Fraser. He's Superman. I repeat myself there. Seth is out on the streets because he believes pubsec exists to save everyone it can, including the bad guys.
Now I can see Jane getting her hopes up because Seth seems to see, only to be disappointed when she finds out that Seth is only right about her because that's his answer about everyone.😆
Thank you!
@@samgordon9756 Haha, no problem! He's definitely a guy I can respect! We can expect his viewpoint to be shaken when we eventually meet his jaded older brother.
Everything Jane has is the exact opposite of sister sage in the boys season 4. Great analysis
Thank you for the kind words! I haven't checked out The Boys yet. I heard it is good.
sister sage feels dumb as hell
i think Zhu yuan and Seth are written very well
although at a glance from trash anime watchers they might look like uncompromising characters that follow the law no matter what
they have major personality differences although they are both hardheaded
Yep, they have a solid foundation for characterization. They just need to have a story to showcase their true abilities, have their convictions tested. Both can be amazing at that.
the biggest plot hole is how she's wearing a wig on top of her hair as her under cover disguise.
Haha! I never wear a wig before, but shouldn't there be a hair covering under the fake scalps to hide your real hair? It's definitely NOT supposed to work like that! 😂
Two things: First of all, great video, loved it! Very well explained on how the writing worked, though I am surprised you did not mention the whole thing with muscle relexant/water, that was for me the first clue "oh yeah this lady is actually smart smart", It is pretty unambiguously clever to abuse the fact that cruelty makes people act stupid (and in her context make it a believable move among the gnag) to move a chess piece (Seth being the kind of straight forward thinker that probably wouldn't think about trying pulling on the ziptie before being told to) just to the point where she felt like she needed him.
On that note, I am curious what you think about Sherlock Holmes in FGO. Not necessarily as the same thing as Jane, but how his brand of "inhumanly smart" actually works to be interesting rather than something annoying like pretty much most superhuman smart characters where you get perpetually annoyed with them.
Second: I hear a bit of reverb in your talk, as a tip i have learned from working with that, get yourself a blanket and have it over your head while recording voiceover to make your voice crisper. You could, of course, get yourself some kind of soundbreakers in your room too, but that is more expensive than that, so do try that if it works for you :P
Heya, thanks for the comments! I didn't include it because though the muscle relaxant was pretty obvious to most people. She pretended to be mean while also doing something else entirely. Plus, the explanation she gave him is based on real life fact, but massively exaggerated.
I haven't watched or played FGO at all, so I don't want to talk about things I haven't personally experienced. Though, I heard that Fate series have pretty good writing. I'm interested to give their animes a try someday.
As for the reverb, I'm surprised you can hear that. This is actually the first time I have someone telling me about it. I will consider that in the future!
@@FeyHunt It's less something you hear outright but is a feature of texture to your voice i recognise from having dealt with this kind of stuff before :P It's not a massive issue, but that is a thing you kinda learn with time
@@Mirro18 Yeah, I'm still kinda new to this audio stuff. I got a cheap Elgato Mic several months ago, and the sound does improve a lot from my cheap 20$ headphone. But I got overwhelmed by the settings. Maybe I should learn more to tweak it later.
My favorite character so far is Billy, honestly. And it's not really because of his over the top persona, but that's amusing as well. I like that his persona seems like, well, a "persona". He is overanimated, to the point of it being not really feeling genuine. And I feel like his act isn't really for other people, but mostly for himself. Whatever he has tucked away in his past, he wants to stay far, far away from it.
Criminals don't make horror stories about you and deem you a "flee on sight" individual for no reason.
Whoever the "Starlight Knight" is, the "Original Billy", let's call him, is someone the current Billy does not want anything to do with anymore. Maybe the "Starlight Knight" was Billy before he passed the "Forbidden Fruit" test. Just pure programming as a killing machine.
Man, imagine if the "Starlight Knight" is an S-rank variant of Billy. Wouldn't that be cool?
Yeah! Billy is interesting now you put it that way. He always has a mysterious aura around him, but he's stuck as a comic relief sidekick. If the next update with Sons of Calydon puts him on center stage, I bet we'll get an awesome story out of him. There must be a reason why he decided to leave his "big sister" Caesar.
I hope he's one of those "crouching tiger, hidden badass" characters. You don't want him to get serious, or you'll be dead.
I absolutely love Billy being silly and comical 😂
@@FeyHunt It definitely feels like both Billy and Anby have that capacity to be serious killing machines but choose not to tap into that part of their brains. Honestly, it’s what makes the Cunning Hares the most interesting (and my favorite) faction in ZZZ.
@@devilsadvocate22289 Oh definitely! The only thing that prevented me from fully loving Cunning Hares was the fact they got too easily tricked by Nekomata. The writing kinda conveyed them as stupid morons when they're supposed to be a badass team. And I really dislike how Nekomata is handled in the story too.
My personal favorite is still Belobog since they have this "family" vibe with them.
I thought Razor died, but apparently he was arrested, saw it in the newspaper, so he could come back, theorically speaking.
Huh. He looked...really dead to me too. Maybe a coverup??
Really? If I remember it well, the newspaper said that the Mountain Lions gang was arrested, but not specifically Razor, even though he's on the front cover.
If he does survive, then what were all those gang members mad about when Jane and Seth went to the exit?
Wuh. I missed that she wanted to play at the Arcade but was lonely. I wish we could invite her there like we can with Billy ;~;
Maybe someday! We did get to watch movies with her, and she did say she missed doing that too. One step at a time!
Music in your intro made me think i was about to watch a Dead Meat kill count video.
Haha! That's kinda the vibe that girl felt like when being interrogated by Jane as well!
One of my favorite parts of the Undercover RnB story was how Jane is not omnipotent or invincible. In fact, it was Seth's earnestness which made a convert out of the Mountain Lion defector, who ultimately brought PubSec in as the cavalry to save the day at the end.
I love that Hoyo was able to avoid so many story/character pitfalls when writing Jane, it's too easy to write a Mary Sue character instead of one that players can admire, empathize with, and even fear, all in one package.
PS Jane is still very much an enigma to me. I do not see her final Trust mission as some cozy 'making you breakfast' fantasy. She essentially infiltrated Phaeton by taking advantage of their trust, and it's suspicious that all her 'getting up early to prep' was only for cup noodles. It's far more likely she was snooping around, perhaps just to satisfy her curiosity, or perhaps just to investigate future potential threats.
@@Vasharan Yeah, she's not perfect, and that's what makes her perfect 🥰🥰
I don't see if she's doing it intentionally in her Trust Event. The summary page in her Knock Knock profile seems pretty sincere: "To her, 'sweet dreams' and 'let's eat breakfast' are two significant phrases". She actually did collapsed.
Her first Trust Event might be her showing off to Phaethon, but I don't think she's faking the final act.
Is there a chance that she improvised to snoop around when she had the chance? Maybe. But it's not because she planned it all along.
As an aspiring writer, I always struggle with making smart characters, making the mistake of making the characters around the smart one a bit dumber (which I instantly regret and then start rewriting everything), so this video gives me a lot to analyze. Thanks !
Thank you for the kind words! It's such an honor to inspire other writers! Good luck with your writings!
@@FeyHunt Thanks ! You make the best ZZZ story analysis content out there, so keep up the great work ;)
@@alexsanderivan6511 Haha, thank you! That's a high praise! I'll keep making more then! In fact, there's a new video just published right now!
The smartest character is only as smart as their writer
Haha, indeed! That's the line I want to put into this video but eventually got cut out. Explaining that requires me to delve deeper into how to write a proper smart character step by step, which falls out of the scope for an 8-minute video
Jane is smart, but I feel like Lycaon is on some 5d chess shit
Is he now...? I haven't got the chance to review his agent story again, but wasn't his plan was to contact those gangs beforehand and caught them off guard?
If I do miss his big brain move, please do let me know so I can pay closer attention! I do plan on making Agent Story videos in the near future.
@@FeyHunt he's shown to keep our tabs on us and knows that we're deep into something much bigger
@@comrad3892 Well yes, I would say our PubSec bros are also keeping tabs on us, especially Qingyi.
To be clear, he did have his own aura of mystery and intellect, but the story hadn't given us a chance to delve into his way of thinking. He could be a great smart character too if they choose to do so.
And yet we get really humanizing scenes where he tries to lipread and gets it wrong, then goes and takes lip reading classes because he's super embarrassed LMAO
@@FeyHuntI feel like his main claim to being smart is his ability to either have every skill (blimp piloting, acting, electrician stuff, reading lips) or learn it in like a day (chuunibyou speak). idk about mastermind, but his intelligence is crazy high. he doesn't come off like a mary sue because he fails (he wasn't fast enough to get through the closing door in the ballet twins, his lip reading isn't perfect, and obviously there are things he doesn't know until he learns them), but he does come off as a super smart guy.
The video essays have started. It's so over zzz bros.
@@goblez5900 Do you find anything bad with my videos? I'm open to feedback.
It took a rat to show us humanity
Well said! After so many "smart" characters Hoyoverse created, Jane is the only one who works well and is written well.
And than compare Jane Doe to SHE HALK:
Why can I control myself so easily while Halk trained to control himself for a decade? because i am strong independent woman thats why!!! I am better in everything, always succeed always win, no matter what happening in world.
Oh god... She-Hulk is a joke show. Never had any intention to watch it.
The moment I saw that clip she claimed she is threatened every day when walking to work, that's it. I'm out. Not even mentioning the twerk scenes.
@@FeyHunt Exactly! Jane Doe, Kafka, Raiden, this is Strong independent females, they feel humanly smart, alive, proactive, She halk and every other woke characters with comically hyper exaggerated "independence" feels more like jokes.
@@metaversguy This is why I rejected western media right now, games or movies. Embrace eastern games! Here, all the girls are beautiful inside and out and fanservice is plenty!
I'd like to speak up for Paimon a little. While her primary role is to yap about the current situation, I'd contend that she does so with an extra level of innocence while also speaking on behalf of the Traveller, thus making Traveller's own voice completely redundant but at the same time different from our own thoughts. I'm not sure if Paimon's writing was ever changed since the earlier chapters but I found myself consistently impressed by her input as long as I view her as a very precocious 8-10 year old child. And that means she was written only to be as smart as a child can reasonably be but throws out some really good observations from time to time, like young children tend to do, to our surprise.
@@owa1985 If you like her for what she is, that's totally fine. It's your preference. I am just pointing out her role in the story is unnecessary.
She effectively replaced the Traveler's speech, summarize everything we just heard, and make unnecessary quips that don't contribute to the story.
You can easily combine both Paimon and the Traveler into a single character and it will make a better and more cohesive chatacter.
@@FeyHunt That's my point though. Traveller and Paimon are in fact one character. Paimon speaks for Traveller and Traveller acts for Paimon.
As for the summarizing thing, I suspect they wrote that in because the devs know that all we do is mash the next button on dialogue scenes (which I have lost count of the times I accidentally skipped vital dialogue) and I've always been pleasantly surprised by Paimon's own insights when she summarises.
Ngl, if my kid can yap like Paimon, I'd be a proud parent.
@@owa1985 True. I don't know the exact proportions of Genshin's playerbase who hates Paimon, but I do notice a significant portion of it also voiced the same opinion as mine.
So let us agree to disagree. I can argue inefficiencies and horrible storytelling all I want. But at the end of the day, it all comes down to preference. I prefer my games to have efficient writing. If Genshin devs and the majority of the players don't want that to change, then there's no reason for them to change.
@@FeyHunt I think it's probably more nuanced than that. Imagine if Paimon suddenly doesn't behave like Paimon on the next patch. That would be even weirder, tbh.
And besides, who the heck cares what the rest of the player base thinks? The point is that like you said, you can see the merit of both opinions but it's probably more important that regardless of which side of the fence you fall on, it's not at all based on whether more people like that side of the fence.
But I must apologise that I forgot to tell you that I appreciate your videos including this one, even if we don't share the same opinion. Everything you said about Jane, I totally agree with and more than that, your observations on why she is well written is spot on, to the point that I'll probably refer to this video whenever I would either write or criticise a character I want to appear as "smart" in the future.
TL;DR: Please don't let this little point about Paimon memery take away from your good work here, k?
@@owa1985 Oh no no, I don't take offense to your points here. It's just something I disagree with. Totally normal!
You didn't do anything wrong. You defended your arguments and I don't want to push it further than I should. I see that it all comes down to preference and I don't have anything else to add. Attacking arguments is fine, but attacking preferences can be insulting. So that's why I said: "agree to disagree" since our preferences are different.
I enjoy these kinds of discussions. Please don't let this disagreement dissuade you from making more based comments in the future!
😄😄
WELL IF SHE WERE A BAD SMART CHARACTER I WOULD BE HERE DISCUSSIN' IT WIT YER NOW WOULD I?
@@Nekro_Knight Actually, I would discuss bad things and why it failed if it was not good. This is just part of my feedback to the game.
some stuff in her quest felt very convineint for the plot like not all cops knowing she was a secret agent, the drukards she used to get into the neos building, or the fissures that allowed the lion gang member to survive the fall. they feel like weird plot excuses that took me out of the story. but imo zenless has never set an expectation of perfect realism which allows the story to be a little wacky and lets the audience focus on what matters, in this case being janes intricate planning and the glimpses of her real personality
Seth fucked up her plan much more than he helped. If Jane didn't have to save Seth, she could have just become Razor's bodyguard and slit his throat while he slept.
The drunk people and portals, I agree! Although honestly, there should really be a covert entrance to the police station anyway :p I think the drunk people were just there to show how she can improvise moreso than being pivotal to the plot - it could have easily been cut out and the story would be intact.
Yeah, you can see it as ZZZ being itself. There is a certain comical element to it, especially with Razor pausing to wait for Jane and Seth to speak up.
But to add to the discussion... not all cops knew she was a secret agent is a detriment to her. I did cut this from the video, but the general rule of writing is this: "Conveniences that get your character into trouble are good, but conveniences that get your character out of trouble are bad". Had Seth been informed, he would've stayed in the smoke and let Jane escape as planned.
I do agree with @ddd8828. The drunkards are just to give her a chance, but she still has to work to use it. Meanwhile, the guy surviving the fall is bullcrap, physically speaking. You can write a story where he actually died and have Jane deal with the aftermath. It could be more interesting, actually. How would she deal with collaterals in her mission?
Alright Here I am again my bit**ing,
Now compare this undercover agent in ZZZ with undercover agent present a ahhhhh..... Genshin 2.0 called Yinlin moving in broad daylight and performing undercover operations for the public safety bureau (idk if its called that but its something like that) and holds an elite position in it.
WTF did the writer was thinking when writing a undercover story. Its like written by someone who has never once read or watched any and I mean any Undercover related stuff. seriously whoever was incharge of the that story needs to attend some classes on how to write basic stories and worldbuilding. The ending to that story was absolutely hilarious, mind booglingly stupid. The so called bad guy some magically erased her records from her employer's database and now no one can even recognize her as the member of that bureau. That means the entire time her employer or the head of PSB was blind when he/she hired Yinlin for the role of undercover agent. Not to mention crappy backstory they gave to yinlin. Its just pains me to even write this comment. THIS IS THE SAME DEV THAT WROTE EYE WATERING CHAPTER IN PUNSHING:GRAY RAVEN. (again asking u to review it highly suggested if u to critically analyze Genshin 2.0)
She was being Portrayed as this BATMAN of the JINZHOU city, the scarlet knight in the shadows, yet she is given this treatment like she does not even matter in the world anymore. Are u kidding me? Her character trailer showed more promises than her entire foolishly written story. There were no stakes, there were no severe consequences, there were no repercussions and she is just silently killed off in the distance. IF THEY REALLY HAD TO DELETE HER FROM THE MAIN STORY, then atleast could have done it in a more effective manner, like The bad guy could have leaked that the OVERLORD HAREM MC was kidnapped by YINLIN A MEMBER OF THE OFFICIAL UNDERCOVER AGENCY to the midnight rangers/patrollers thereby giving her a bad reputation, making her a most wanted in all of Jinzhou or maybe the New Federation or whatever the hell that is or just leaking that she is a undercover agent in the general public. CREATE SOME STAKES GODDAMIT.
and then on the other hand we have Jane dough, write of the bat she is not even once seen in the general public first and foremost rule of being an undercover agent. And only interacts with them if need arises. This story was written with actual thought put into it. Jane had to make it up to the top into that gang's members and had to gain the trust while she was only doing it alone, no OVERLORD HAREM ARISING FROM ASHES TO SAVE THE RAT FROM THE LIONS. Seth and the site workers' kidnaping only made it even more difficult for Her to act on her own cuz now she had to look after the site workers and Seth who is a complete novice in NEPS or Buffoon for short. She had to make it snappy and there was hint of tensions everytime and when she called for the duel when one gang member was seemingly executed for helping the kidnapped by jane herself, that freaking created a tension in the atmosphere of the chapter, she had to be ruthless in her actions. And the duel happens where the leader was already planning on killing the rat with his own hands rather than making her his right hand. Even though its a cliché story it works for her story and then in her character trailer we learn that all the members captured one got away and the leader was seemingly missing and also she was the gang's leader in the reports. There fore creating another reason for her to be in hiding once more carry out the next mission. Plus the romance b/w Jane and Seth worked wonders here. Unlike Yinlin also bootlicking THE OVERLORD HAREM MC like the bajjilion other boot lickers in the city ohhh sorry the world of genshin 2.0
and before u start to state that u are neutral cuz story writing takes time. DUDE they had 2 years two whole freaking years. in CBT1 she was connected to whining aix and had much better plot focused story. According to some leaks or rumors the writer are same as PGR where they can write glorious chapters yet in this game they complete toddlers when it comes to write a single cohesive line of a story. its not like they inexperienced or anything, me a long time player of PGR knows what they are capable of yet they are doing the exact opposite.
Haha, I always love your unhinged rant! But yes, I do agree wholeheartedly.
10 minutes into Yinlin's Companion Story and I already see the cracks everywhere. She can't even make a proper excuse to let her off the hook. She has to display her Patroller badge. That failed in so many different ways.
This is exactly why I haven't fully played the entire Companion Story in WuWa. I just don't have the motivation to do it. They don't have writers for this game, do they?
@@FeyHunt and they proudly call it the genshin killer my ass. Man this horrendous writing made me Leave the game. I would have cut them some slack for copying Genshin impact but no this game is not for story enjoyers like u and me. It's lamely, lazily and greedily put together soulless copied sheit show that that only appeal to exhuasted ex genshin players or just casual players who don't give a f about story. Seeing pretty animated graphics is enough eye candy for them and KURO is cashing that very aspect so they don't give a sheit about making a good story. They rewrote the entire CBT1, well written story just for the sake of making it appeal to simps and coomers in the gacha community. But still the defenders claim that it's going to become a huge game yeah let's see what we have in the game a yae miko copy who just wanna bang the MC and is drooling over the Overlord MC, zhi Zhi haha whose story is about being creative, being urself and being honest while the game itself is copying entirely from Genshin impact, ahh yes a character exists in this game who is not even once mentioned.in the story once no he does not even exist in that world to Begin with, what do we have in the future a copied HSR character called swan which had coomers and simps drooling over rn. I don't need freebies, I need a quality game for fk sake. I don't play the game just for the sake of combat alone. I wanna see myself immersed in that stupid little fantasy far away from the real world and this game has zero immersion to begin with. Combat alone won't be able to carry it.
I disagree with the way she is shown to be human she is unlucky but that's out of her control she rarely shows signs of weakness that's why i find her pretty flat
bro did you play the story she literally got in to difficult situation and turn it her way
Huh... Did we play the same story? As I said in the video, she did show regrets and doubts many times in the quest. The most noticeable part is her wishing the guy she threw was alright, and how she interacts with the objects in the free-roaming section.
@FeyHunt you know what you're right I really did like how they wrote her thoughts In the free roam section made her feel grounded and especially the part where she hoped the guy she threw off a building is great and the part where she gets caught by razor her moments of weakness are immediately overshadowed by showcases of her wit
@jude508.3 yeah but that's her being smart
I'm feel a little bit disappointed after Jane story, because i can't really see what's it adding to the main plot. Did i miss something?
because it's not a main story. More of an agent story where the mcs doesn't get involved.
Well, that's understandable. It's just all the previous stories have something to do with the main plot.
There are some lore significance if you really squint on it. But yeah, I think this is what we can expect from special episodes. They act more like Agent stories than main stories
i like to imagine the special episode still has some merit as it attempts to showcase what the character is as a set-up (especially since shes the smart character who are mostly prone to pitfalls)
so when she eventually shows up in the main plot later on its as if we can intuit that she might cook something up in the off-chance theres an even more intelligent antagonist that they might need her specialty for
@@sigma0184 Good point! Maybe we do need her to be introduced before the main story to fully understand her. If that's true, then the next chapter with her might start with a bang and go straight into the action. That's gotta be exciting!
You're glazing but I agree
Well... I would say my praises are well-adjusted for what the story was. They earned my respect for trying to do something better than most gacha games. But feel free to disagree if there are parts you hated. I do have mine as well.
The only way for gacha game story to improve is if we celebrate when they do right, and criticize them when they do wrong. Next video might be criticism time!
@@FeyHunt I just said I agree with what you said bro
@@k_aesar saying someone’s glazing means their logic and reasonings aren’t well adjusted and exaggerated.
@@k_aesar Then why would you say he was glazing? Although you agree, what are you seeing that we aren't seeing?