The Case for Jesus' Resurrection with Mike Licona
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- Опубліковано 28 чер 2024
- In this video I interview @MikeLiconaOfficial about arguments for the resurrection of Jesus. Mike is one of the world's leading scholars on this topic.
See Mike's UA-cam channel here: / @mikeliconaofficial
Get Mike's book here: www.amazon.com/Resurrection-J...
Truth Unites is a mixture of apologetics and theology, with an irenic focus.
Gavin Ortlund (PhD, Fuller Theological Seminary) serves as senior pastor of First Baptist Church of Ojai.
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00:00 Introduction
01:10 Mike's Interest in Christ's Resurrection
04:48 Surprised By the Evidence
06:44 How Strong is this Argument?
09:58 Comparing Different Arguments for God
13:53 The Resurrection is Very Happy News
15:54 "Bad Philosophy Corrupts Good History"
20:17 Bedrock Historical Facts to Be Explained
25:38 Group Hallucinations?
34:24 "Liars Make Poor Martyrs"
38:43 The Swoon Theory
43:16 Bart Ehrman's View
45:24 Can Historians Investigate Miracles?
48:24 The Explanatory Power of Jesus' Resurrection
53:06 Responding to the Evidence
Lydia Mcgrew would also contribute very much to this discussion. Licona has done some great on this subject though. Love these dialogues 👍
That new open is pretty dope. That being said I hope you'll also talk with Lydia McGrew and explore her maximal data approach to arguing for the resurrection.
I second that!
Two of my favourite YT scholars. God has used them both to bless me enormously
Thank you for this video, Dr. Ortlund. May God bless you bountifully.
Hello from Sweden! really like this channel
thanks for watching! I am Swedish myself. :)
@@TruthUnites That's nice you have a really Swedish last name. Ort means location and Lund is a city so its like Location: Lund
@@folkebitar3258 Having already looked at Gavin's name, it seems that Ort- originally was Ört-, in English "herb", and that -lund, though also the name of the city in the south of Sweden, means "grove". So likely, his name means herb-grove, a probable reference to the location of his family of origin. Place names, as you know, are pretty common in Sweden. I have family there with the name Bergström, in English "mountain-stream".
@@mj6493 Yes its true ört means herb and lund means grove so it probably makes more sense, btw Bergström is a rather common name:)
Please keep doing what you're doing because you do it very well ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
...two guys we can all love...
Thank you, brothers
Kind regards Kim
Just bought this book so imagine my surprise to see this discussion. I suppose I was meant to read it!
This is such an awesome collab!
I’m appreciating your newly-worded goal! It definitely communicates what I appreciate about your content. I also liked the old phrase, but I did used to get hung up on the word “irenic,” firstly because I didn’t know what it meant, and after that, because I thought it might be best to leave the description of one’s manner to others, even if you do have a specific goal in mind in that regard. Blessings.
What a fantastic and clearly put argument forJesus' resurrection! Arguments such as this are the clear and unambiguous refutation of the claim that Christians believe in God through "blind faith". Faith is never blind, and the evidences of what we believe are strong. Faith isn't a thing, it's an action. It's the thing we practice and base our lives around in response to the evidences God gives us for himself.
Thank you
I'm a historian by training, and - Lord Almighty , Jesus Christ - that resurrection is the only event in REAL TIME that explains christianity...
Kind regards Kim
@@kimjensen8207 I had never realized until recently how historians are able to actually examine and asses the events that occurred surrounding Jesus's resurrection before the last year or so, so seeing videos like this and reading books on the matter really opened my eyes to just how much Jesus has given us as evidence to prove who he is. Also, speaking as amateur, history is so much fun!
Blind faith is the unquestioning belief in something, the existence of which cannot be verified. That describes religion accurately.
@@moggpiano8043 I disagree. My faith is based on events and principles that can be tested. While many who practice one religion or another, and probably even some who are Christians practice their faith "blindly", one of the most stark differences between Christianity and any other religion I'm aware of is that it not only can be tested logically, historically and morally but that it does very well if examined closely. Islam can be tested historically but doing so reveals historical discrepancies and moral failings present from its very origins and codified in the Koran and other holy writings of Islam. Similarly, no other religion has even a fraction of the historical and archeological evidences backing it up that Christianity does, or the hope it offers.
Because of this, the faith of the Christian is to believe in what we have not seen or experienced based on what we have seen and know.
@@tategarrett3042 ...Thank you, brother. Kind regards Kim
I Always thought you two sound the same. It's almost Like you have the same voice! And now, all of a sudden, you guys are making a Livestream together, funny! But anyway, God bless you guys!
Glad for the work of scholars like Mike, but also glad that the resurrection of the Messiah is more of a solid premise than a statistical conclusion according to the word of God (Acts 17).
Interesting discussion gents. Are you of Swedish heritage by any chance mr Ortlund?
Bring some presupp’s on! I love the historical case for the resurrection and also classical apologetics and other evidences. I also love presupp and I think it offers the strongest case for the truth of Christianity but it is also very esoteric. Ultimately, we look at history, evidences, and facts about reality through our worldview lens. Presupp is both a defensive and offensive style at the same time. Great Channel! Love you brother
Watch the debate between Sye Ten Bruggencate and Matt Dillahunty.
That’s when presuppositionalism died.
@@ramigilneas9274 I’m not a fan of either. Neither are good interlocutors
man that intro beat was crispy
Hi Gavin.
Do you have an available link as to your understanding of what happened on the day of resurrection? Ie: sequence of events
If you feel led to, could you please address the rising fascination with Sister Wilhelmina Lancaster? It’s quite interesting (and concerning obv)
When the next video of you debunking Suan Sonnas arguments ?
Regarding Gavin’s question to Licona on arguments for God’s existence vis-a-vis arguments for Jesus’ resurrection:
objectively speaking,
(1) arguments for God’s existence such as argument from contingent things, argument from the existence of changes, etc are deductive arguments while arguments for Jesus’ resurrection are abductive arguments (inference to the best explanation),
and
(2) sound deductive arguments are impossible to be false while the strongest abductive arguments would still have a tiny chance of being false.
Therefore every sound deductive argument for God’s existence is objectively stronger than even the strongest argument for Jesus’ bodily resurrection.
Pastor, I am struggling heavily with the scriptural scholarship of Bart Erhman and the people on the subreddit /r/academicbiblical. It's hard to believe most of the gospels anymore. Can you make a video rebutting them or your POV on it?
_"It's hard to believe most of the gospels anymore."_
You know none of the Gospel authors witnessed Jesus, right? That's because Jesus is a fictional character.
Paul created Christianity in 48 AD after the Daniel 9:25 prophesy expired unfulfilled.
@@twitherspoon8954 to the first point I am aware that most of the gospels are oral traditions but I don't think the second follows from it.
@@twitherspoon8954 You lie.
I was a member of Bart Ehrman's online discussion group for about a year. No doubt about his credentials as a scholar, but I would say there's a certain amount of "slam dunk" theatrics and bias that goes along with his presentations. For example, Erhman has long said that Jesus and all his apostles must have been illiterate. When The Chosen came out, it featured Matthew as a quite literate note taker, ie, someone who could have recorded the events of Jesus's ministry. When I brought that up to Prof Ehrman, he replied that it was more or less "impossible" that Matthew, a tax collector, could have been able to read and write. In similar manner, I saw Ehrman simply hand wave away other conclusions about the NT that didn't fit his overall theme that almost nothing in these scriptures is historically accurate, and therefore three cheers for atheism. What I'm saying here is to take Ehrman's views seriously, but never accept them outright as correct until you've compared his conclusions with that of other scholars.
Mike Winger has a whole series on this, the supposed contradictions in the Bible and Bart Erhman specifcally.
ua-cam.com/play/PLZ3iRMLYFlHuhA0RPKZFHVcjIMN_-F596.html
I hope this helps!
Hello, as Protestants how do you respond to the mass observations of the Virgin Mary such as in Cairo and Guadalupe in Mexico without group hallucinations?
Can you prove a group hallucination actually exists?
U should debate Jay Dyer over Ecclesiology
You don't understand TAG
Equating the resurrection to empirical historical knowledge is to confuse the creator with creation - a desperate act of self security that proves one is not ready to accept faith as the dark way (luther).
I would love to see Lydia McGrew on here
She is great at debunking the minimal facts argument.
On an aside, I continually find it interesting the moon landing skeptics are bunched into the loony pile, despite there being good reasons to hold reservations. This does not mean the earth is flat, or Reptilians rule the earth, but the world holds some interesting perspectives too, and some times they need examining (like the perspective of most people that Christ didn’t rise from the dead or that it doesn’t matter).
I think Bart Ehrman doesn't grant the burial and empty tomb so he would probably try to say that the Gospels are legends and we don't know what happened exactly but miracles are impossibly by his philosophy.
He doesn’t say that miracles are impossible.
He says that testimony alone could never be good enough to prove that a miracle happened because alternative explanations would always be much more likely to be true.
25:26 - well unfortunately this is only natural. The moment someone grants the empty tomb Christianity follows almost by necessity. I think what I personally kick against is the idea that those who do not grant the empty tomb are simply "impartial observers".
Nah… the resurrection would still be by far the least likely explanation for an empty tomb.
Pilate feeding the corpse to his dogs would have been a better explanation.😂
@@ramigilneas9274 Of course but then the tomb would not be empty now would it? It would never been filled in the first place?
@@marinusswanepoel1825
Jesus most likely wasn’t buried in a tomb.
But even if he was then it’s still trivially easy to come up explanations that are much more likely to be true than a resurrection.
@@ramigilneas9274 I'm fine with granting that Jesus was not buried in a tomb. That is not what I said.
The claim is that once you grant the empty tomb Christianity follows almost by necessity.
Notice you don't offer any of these trivial explanations of yours off the bat. Almost like you are nervous that they would sound highly improbable.
@@marinusswanepoel1825
All natural explanations no matter how silly they sound or unlikely they are are by default more likely to be true than that Christianity is true.
Jesus was buried in the tomb… but then someone removed the body.
And it’s irrelevant who did it or for what reason.
-Pilate thought that it was funny to feed the corpse to his dogs.
-Some unknown follower of Jesus stole the body.
-Joseph of Arimathea removed the body… because he only temporarily allowed that the body got stored there until they prepared a ditch grave for Jesus.
So many possibilities…
PRAISE GOD FOR HIS MERCY:
There Is only one God, in three persons, God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. ONE God.
Humans are ONE person ( in three parts) The body, soul and spirit. Three parts, ONE person.
The Bible says that we are all sinners.
As it is written: There is none righteous , no not one. Romans 3:10
For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.Romans 3:23
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousness are as filthy rags. Isaiah 64:6
For the wages of sin is death. Romans 6:23 (The word death in this verse means eternal separation from God in hell).
Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow. Isaiah 1:18f
Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures and that He was buried and that He rose again the third day according to the scriptures. 1Corinthians 15:3-8
In whom we have redemption through His blood, even the forgiveness of sins. Colossians 1:14
For by grace ye are saved, through faith; and not of yourselves.
It is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast. Ephesians 2:8-9
I do not frustrate the grace of God, for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. Galatians 2:21
Realize that you are a hopeless sinner and trust in Jesus shed blood on the cross to pay for your sins.
The moment you trust in Jesus and only Jesus, you are saved.
Hello - This is in fact about the Resurrection. All the above is extraneous to the discussion. It merely goes off into other directions. In The Winds of Truth it is stated by Lord Mikaal (Archangel Michael) that it is forever GOD, MOTHER, CHILD. There is no Holy Ghost. Human beings are much more than body, soul and spirit. It goes beyond that, which is encompassed in the metaphysics, some of which is for Initiates only. Jesus did not die for our sins and was never meant to by GOD, who was horrified at the Crucifixion. How could He send His first Son to be MURDERED. He had in fact healed the son of Pilate and was taken down, passing into the hands of His uncle Joseph of Arimathaea, a wonderful herbal doctor, who treated Him for three days, after which He rose and lived to be 120 years of age. We are all saved (a priestly invention) by our expiation of sins through karma and further incarnations we have all signed up for. All talk of blood shed on the Cross must cease, as it is a commemoration of horror, the most awful sin of mankind, and redolent of black magic, which makes use of sacrificial blood to achieve its nefarious aims. All religions lead to redemption, as they teach the same thing, and are as pearls on the golden string of Truth, of which there is none new, and a new religions every 2160 years, bringing in a further aspect of human consciousness. The whole of Christianity is therefore warped by the manipulations of the early priests in order to formulate a faith which would be accepted by the simple-minded populace of 2000 years ago. We have since evolved. This is now the Age of Aquarius, and we are under Saint Germain, Lord Maitreya and Lord Kuthumi. Blessings - RevDrD/Ministry
The Christian can know there is objective morality by pointing the 10 Commandments.
Those rules existed long before Judaism was invented.
@@ramigilneas9274 who before Moses posted the 10 Commandments?
@@Justas399
The code of Hammurabi is much older than anything in the Bible.
That’s probably what inspired the authors of the OT… also Zoroastrianism.
@@ramigilneas9274 no reputable scholar on the Old Testament makes that claim. There is no proof for your claim that someone had the 10 Commandments before Moses.
@@Justas399
There are no reputable historians who think that Moses existed at all or that the Exodus happened.😉
The Money Question: how many actual *historians* agree with Licona's conclusions? Are there any of them, any of them that is who aren't Christians? If Licona is claiming that the scholars who dispute the Resurrection aren't really historians, fine. But he should be able to show that his conclusions have been accepted as sound by top historians. Are they?
Even most Christian historians would never dare to damage their reputation as a serious professional by making the outlandish claim that the resurrection is the best explanation for the historical data.
I do have a problem with what Licona says at 11:30 as he is just factually wrong (at least with the best data we have). Looking at the 2020 philpapers survey, which is the largest survey of what philosophers think we can see that 729 non-theists accept moral realism whereas only 456 non-theists reject moral realism. That's over 60% of non-theists accepting objective moral values.
I suppose it comes down to whether you think objective moral values and moral realism are the same thing. I still think Mike is right although he could have articulated it better.
Hello - Jesus had healed the son of Pilate and was taken down. Joseph of Arimathaea treated Him. Three days later He rose. He lived to be 120. Blessings - RevDrD/Ministry
LOL 😆
@@davidjanbaz7728 Hello - Please see my reply to JP Golda below. Thank you for the contribution. Blessings - RevDrD/Ministry
dem crazy trash can lids be flying all over the place!
The survival thing is double ridiculous. Even if he did (he couldn't have) try walking around 3 days after having a nine inch nail driven through your ankles. Try visiting all your friends with a smile on your face as if you aren't in serious need of medical attention. If you saw your friend 3 days after crucifixion dragging his mutilated half dead corps around would you, A scream "holy shit he survived! get him a doctor immediately" or would you B start crying and professing your friend has risen and is God incarnet? The fact that there are Zero acounts in columb A, which would be all of them. And every acount in columb B, which would be none of them, pretty much puts that theory to bed. I'm surprised no skeptic has came up with a very convincing body double as a theory. As conspiritorial and ridiculous as that sounds it's the best i can come up with.
Just because you can create an alternative theory doesn't make it better than a theory with better grounded facts.
@@Lumine777produccines
Nah, a mundane explanation that happens all the time will always win against an explanation that has never happened even once and violates the laws of physics.
I like Gavin Ortlund! He is very entertaining! Gavin says the Catholic Church is in error for teaching the bread, when Blessed "is My Body ". Gavin has though absolutely no idea what Jesus Christ meant by "this IS MY BODY ", as Scripture ALONE is infallible. Thus making all Gavin's interpretations, FALLIBLE! Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink
Gavin isn't claiming that anyone has the ability to infallibly interpret Scripture. When has Gavin said definitively that transubstantiation is an error and his own view is definitely the correct interpretation? Gavin takes a very humble approach to interpreting Scripture and has never claimed his own interpretation of anything is infallible.
@Charlllot Gavin specifically said in his video on the Lord's Supper, that the Catholc Church is in error on it's teaching on the Lord's Supper! Have you not seen it? Yet, Gavin Ortlund, filled with contradictions in his teachings, has no clue what Jesus Christ meant by "this IS MY BODY ", as Scripture ALONE is infallible! As his theory goes! Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and Kind God and Savior, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink
@@matthewbroderick6287 You're right about one thing. Scripture alone is infallible. All other human authorities are fallible, including the pope and the magisterium.
He just put a video about believing in real presence, but not transubstantiation. Eastern Orthodox also believe in real presence and don't believe in transubstantiation, same with Coptic Church. Forcing Aristotle's philosophy into Scripture as if that's what Jesus intended is what's FALLIBLE just like the pope and the Catholic church. Peace always in Jesus Christ our Great and King God and Saviour, He whose Flesh is true food and Blood true drink.
@@matthewbroderick6287 He said they */are/* in error or he */believes/* they are in error?
Jesus is a fictional character.
Jesus Christ is Almighty God, and you have nothing to refute Him.
Here are some Non Biblical Sources for The Existence of The Lord Jesus Christ in History :
• LUCIAN OF SAMOSATA (120 - ~180 A.D.)
• THALLUS (~ 52 A.D.)
• PLINY THE YOUNGER (63 - 113 A.D)
• MARA BAR-SERAPION (Post 70 A.D)
• FLAVIUS JOSEPHUS (37 - 100 A.D.)
• CORNELIUS TACITUS (55 - 120 A.D.)
• GAIUS SUETONIUS TRANQUILLUS (69 - 130 A.D.)
• THE BABYLONIAN TALMUD
• CLEMENT OF ROME (? - 98? A.D.)
• IGNATIUS OF ANTIOCH (? - ~100 A.D)
• QUADRATUS OF ATHENS (126 A.D.)
• JUSTIN MARTYR (~100 - 165 A.D.)
• HEGESIPPUS (110 A.D. - 180 A.D.)
Socrates is a fictional character.
@James Trotter It is not possible to prove that something does not exist. So your statement is irrelevant.
The existence of an individual known subsequently as Jesus Christ is generally accepted as factual, however the idea that he was in any way a supernatural being is supported only by blind belief.
@@moggpiano8043the vide is talking about the resurrection and the historicity of it. That’s not blind faith.