Great review! New sub! Spent the day trying a few different settings with the luftkappe installed . No tokens, 6 psi more than standard, found the sweet spot. The fork is a now a different animal, couldn't fault the fork prior to the installment but I advise anyone with a zeb to invest, transformed the fork.
2021 Lyrik here, 83kg ride weight. I normally run 1 token / 77 PSI. I've upped the spring rate to 90 PSI (just over 15%) and removed the token. Fork feels perfect. Holds nice and high in it's travel, doesn't dive, but plush, as all the small bump are eaten up in the first 1/3 of it's travel. Plus still about 1-2cm reserved for big hits. I find if you run the fork with less pressure than 15% more (than standard) with the mod, you're getting a lot of the small bumps down into the first 1/2 of the travel, which makes it feel harsher. The idea is to keep all the small bumps in the top 1/4-1/3 of the fork's travel. Done plenty of experiementation to get to this point. So anyone only bumping it up only a small amount, try more. You won't be sacrificing any plushness, and it'll actually feel more plush on the small stuff, but more supportive for everything else, steeps, jumps, drops etc.
Luftkappe. Well, what different that makes to the Zeb. Straight away on the driveway you tell the difference. Soo much smoother and softer off the top. Thanks for the tip Telly. Legend.
Glad you finally got the zeb sorted but at the end of the day when you buy a high end fork like that you shouldn't have to buy a vorsprung air Shaft to make it feel the way it should anyway. Knowing what you know now if you had to buy another fork would you still go with the zeb or a Fox 38 ? As I have debated which to get as I have a lyric with the B1 spring and love it but didn't like the c1 at all
I agree. I wouldn’t buy either fork to be honest. The Lyrik B1 does everything for someone my weight. If I had to choose between 38 and zeb with no option to upgrade I’d choose 38, its definitely superior once the airspring is serviced properly. TheZeb has creaky steerer issues and the lower legs aren’t manufactured to correct tolerances. The 38 comes full of grease in the neg chamber which needs to be addressed straight away to get the most out of it. Fox are known for creaky steerers as well but I haven’t seen any issues with that in the 38 so far. Lyrik B1 all day
@@mtbtelly5522 Hi and thanks for getting back to me yeah I'm definitely going to stick with the lyric for sure I'm 76kg and I'm extremely happy with it especially after you gave me advice on how to set it up better. The last service I did on the powers I used racing bro's dust seals and I'm due to do it again have you tried the latest SKF wiper seal's i've heard their supposed to be even better than standard? Oh and i've been considering putting a coil shock on my 2019 specialised enduro comp! It's recommended that I should put an ohlins ttx on it so I was wondering if you've had any experience with it on any bikes! I currently have the rockshox monarch plus rc3 which is a great shock but would love to try coil but I'm not sure as I do alot of climbing.and descending What are your thoughts?
Looks good, you were charging through that rock section. Need to give the spring upgrade a go but seriously thinking about the coil conversion (Vorsprung Smashpot).
As a lightweight rider, I just can't get a good small bump sensitivity with the Zeb, it doesn't feel as plush as my Lyrik or my Pike. I was looking at the Secus but damn this thing is expensive, I'll give the Luftkappe a try, had of on a 36 and loved it. Thanks for the review mate
@@martinbourgault816 oui, ça l'a transformé la Zeb. Bcp plus plush en début de course et plus de sensibilité en début de course, pour une Zeb 2021-2022 c'est un must. La 2023 semble être mieux de ce côté et je ressent pas le besoin d'en mettre un
Hey man, Bought a 38 a couple weeks back but only just recently ridden it a couple times. To be completely honest i think i preferred my lyrik ultimate lol well for trail trash anyway. But the 38 corners sooo freaking well its unbelievable. It does feel a little harsh in the initial part of the stroke like landing jumps etc. I was surprised by this as lots of people say the 38 has a "pillow" type feeling on landings but im just not getting that at all. Any ideas?
Bushes in the lowers most likely get a die or a shop to size them for you, plus a luftkappe helps a lot too that really was the icing on the cake for me once that was fitted I loved the 38s, I also think they feel shit unless they are freshly serviced well lubricated, keep the bike upside down and use a fork lube. When you get it tuned right you wont feel a thing when you charge over small rocks and chatter, bigger hitting roots should cause you no hand pain and should retain that decent cornering and mid stroke support. Damper settings can be found all over the internet. 2 HSR and about 5-7 LSR then compression to suit (if any). Took me 2 months to get it right but the bushings were the problem.
AWSOME mate. nothing like being alittle deflated and then flipping it on its head and being stoked. no matter what it is in life. and for you my friend it seems like thats a good running bike :)
@@mtbtelly5522 do you noticed any difference with the axle to crown height vs other forks as I heard off a bloke he had to remove 5mm stem spacer to get the front end feeling right again. Going from a 36 to a zeb. Maybe the vorsprung helps it sit in more tho? He was also running one token and much more air then you as well.
@@chadsugden411 before the luftkappe when I tested the fork as standard I left my stem and bars where they were, there was bugger all if any difference between the zeb and my lyrik from memory. Same now with the luftkappe. Just set the pressure to put me at the same height and it feels killer. If I had to run less sag I’d drop the bar a little but no need, it feels right where it is
@@mtbtelly5522 ok good to know. As I’d take your word over his. I wanna upgrade my fox 36 Rhythm’s soon. But not sure if you I should put a grip 2 in it and leave it. (and maybe some kinda updated air spring like a luftkappe piston/spring upgrade) Or buy some factory 38’s or ZEB’s and what will give the best results on my sight.
@@chadsugden411 funny enough that Rhythm is a killer fork. Have you serviced the air spring? When I get hands on this A2 I’ll have a better idea of where to go with the tune, but I wouldn’t get the Zeb because of the binding lowers and the crappy spring design. The 38 is killer, but needs a spring clean straight out of the box to get the real performance out of it. I had a bounce around on the 38 I cleaned out last week, man that is an incredible feeling fork. Very impressive but expensive and heavy
Thanks for your superb videos mate! I am unsure if the top out bumper needs to be removed on the Zeb as well like on the Lyrik‘s? The Vorsprung video is only about the Lyrik and there Steve removes the top out bumper. Thanks and greetings from Switzerland!
@@mtbtelly5522 thanks for your answers. Yes, i installed it already in my Zeb on the Trek Rail (160mm). I have tried the settings you and others mentioned here in the comments, but i strangely need to use almost 90PSI to get to 30% SAG. I aim for 20%, but the fork would be stiff as hell then. Sure, the E-Bike weighs a bit more then your Slash, but still it should not make such a huge difference imo. I am 88kg ride ready. Have a great day!
Why was I so happy to see you crash? haha. Love your enthusiasm bud. That looks blooooody rowdy on the tube, it will no doubt be nuts in real life. Beyond my skill level for sure.
Hi mate,I have a fox 34 rhythm 130mm as I do longer rides but also ride some chunky trails do you think a shorter travel fork would benefit from this upgrade ?thanks
Absolutely. I’ve ridden a 140 34 pre and post luftkappe and it was certainly a noticeable improvement over standard setup. Not necessary but it is an improvement
I have 3 2021+ Lyrik Ultimates and 2 have B1 air shaft. I like the feel of the B1 over the C1. Do you think the LuftKappe will make my 3rd Lyrik even better than the B1’s?
You’d have to get an old A1 shaft to install a luftkappe in a new lyrik. Which would make the fork killer, I’m not sure about better than B1 but I believe its as good for sure. I heard a rumour they’re bringing a new lyrik out in june with a new spring and more
So how douse it affect how how far it sits into the travel Is it Lowe or higher Thinking of doing this upgrade to my 2021 lyirik When I’m sat in my seat and not stood up my fork sits at around 20%sag with 1 token ( bike I have is an ebike) if it sits Lowe my bike will feel like it’s diving Also do you have to cycle to fork to balance the air pressure or will it still work like my fork douse now
You do need to cycle it but not vigorously as the eq point is only just into the travel from full extension. You definitely want the front to stay up in the travel when you’re neutral. And not dive, but also not be harsh on the hands
Hey Telly. Did you ever try your Lyrik with a Luftkappe? Ive tried both the C1 and B1 springs in my Lyrik and wondering if I'll see another step up in performance going B1 to Luftkappe. Cheers.
@@mtbtelly5522 Likewise also in my 2018 Lyrik and likewise it was sublime! Wondering if it'll be much of a difference in the 2021 Lyrik though in comparison to the B1 spring I already have in there...
I’d still go the Lyrik with a B1 spring and 2.1 damper. The Zeb has been poorly manufactured and will show substantial stanchion wear after a couple seasons. Th Lyrik is lighter and still smashes just as hard, its just not quite as stiff which doesn’t bother me being 75kg
@@mtbtelly5522 am 87kg and run a Lyrik atm. No complaints just getting a feel if there is a gain in the extra burliness of a Zeb. Pretty consistent reports in the forums of the weak mid stroke support from the stock air spring. Great vids btw. Legend.
Bit off topic but what are your thoughts on lower chain tensioner/guides? I really like the idea of reducing chain slap but unsure if it puts undue stress on components or affects shifting.
Cascade components new lower guide is excellent, it has no effect on the drivetrain but creates excellent retention. Worth a look for sure. Lower rollers aren’t great but do the job for sure
Yeah the Zeb with the Luftkappe literally feels like my lyrik now, just bigger and stronger. The difference just altering the spring design makes is excellent. Worth every cent for sure. I no longer hate my Zeb haha
@@mtbtelly5522 cool , I’m thinking of getting the alloy mega frame when they are released, the last 2 years they have come with the super deluxe , for the fork maybe the zeb with the spring upgrade might be the go. , you have done the research for me :)
@@camwells9726 I’d still go lyrik over Zeb until they fix the lower misalignment issue with a new zeb lower leg. Both are killer, but the lyrik is my choice to keep the weight down and performance up
ive had my zeb for 4 months now, and i cant at all find a right setup for it, ive had more pressure and no tokens, its harsh on initial, almost to the point of been dangerous because you ping off everything, or i run lower pressure with 3 tokens to where theres not much support until the end, this sounds like it fixes these issues, so going to give it a go!
Yeah the standard spring is garbage compared to the luftkappe setup. You’re exactly right with your interpretation of how the spring performs. Not to mention the Zeb has binding issues between the upper and lower legs.
Fitted and been for a ride this morning, the difference is absolutely massive, this is how this fork should of behaved to begin with!!! no more pinging around, holds lines better, way more support, feels so much calmer, gone up to 74psi for my 92kg weight and it's perfect. Thanks for the recommendation!!
Interesting that vorsprung have made an air spring to mimic the older debonair spring characteristics. If the vorsprung have changed the spring in relation to the transfer port does that mean the initial part of the stroke you lose 5 or 6mm of travel like it being sucked down? If that's the case it seems like that was rockshox main focus was to gain the initial stroke of travel which therefore potentially comprising the whole spring curve. I wonder if any pros endorsed by RS share the same issues you have and use this vorsprung airspring and not tell them.
Most of the RS athletes have likely been on the new zeb spring all season. It might be released soon. I know many people that aren’t big on the Zeb performance. Its a good fork but not great without the revised spring/vorsprung upgrade
Another good review. Do you have problem getting full travel after the mod? I notice you increase the pressure quite a lot but the positive chamber size is smaller than before (the luftkappe is quite bigger than one volume spacer that you removed)
If I drop the pressure 3 psi from my preferred, I’ll bottom it out multiple times, but I set it up to stay away from the bottomouts. As you said the kap takes up a good chunk of positive space. To fine tune the spring you can add a little grease to the negative chamber to slightly decrease the neg volume, which will change the pos neg ratio slightly lowering mid stroke/overall stroke strength. I feel like the luftkappe is an increase of neg that is just a little too much for most people, which is great because you can bring it back down a touch with a little grease or oil, and have literally the best performance you could ask for. So yeah the luftkappe is quite progressive even at no token due to the increase in neg and decrease in pos
@@mtbtelly5522 I actually have the same bike but a select+ zeb. At 67kg, the last 3cm travel is unreachable. Don’t think I want a even more progressive spring rate. My major complaint is the initial suppleness. Went to a bike park last week and those brake bumps really hurt my hands I tried to use the zip tie trick to equalize the lower leg pressure at 10% travel. At full extension, the lower pressure should provide a softer initial stroke. Can’t wait to test it on trails I think the zeb is designed for enduro racing and may not fit an average joe like me. -Stiffer initial stroke for ride height and pop -less mid stroke for charging. For some terrain, you may want the fork to use travel easily to clear obstacle while maintaining speed. It requires very fast rebound and can be hard to hold -Super progressive at the end for bottom out control
@@mtbtelly5522 Got the bike few weeks ago and is still testing setup. Last week at bike park was 47psi with 1 spacer, 8-9 click out from the slowest rebound. One click lsc I just removed one spacer and lowered the lower leg pressure a little bit I can feel the brushing loosen up a bit but It’s still not silky smooth. Will do a lower leg service later
@@cscsw assuming you have the standard spring without luftkappe, I’d run 2 tokens, 4-6 clicks of lsc from open to start, and 55psi starting pressure, rebound probably 10 or 11 out from closed. Sounds like a lot compared to what you’re running, but it will get the front up in the more supple part of the travel and the token config will give a decent spring curve
The smoothest setup I could get pre luftkappe was no token 72psi but it was way too high in the travel (12%sag) to be good everywhere. My best compromise was 3 tokens 64psi to get me down enough in the sag to have compliance on hard rough stuff and a good ride height. But it would still beat your hands up and was not excellent. I’m now at no token 72 psi at 18% sag and its just mauling, exactly how I set up my B1 lyrik pretty much. Its a way way better fork now and very confident everywhere. Just a pleasure to ride now
@@mtbtelly5522 Thanks for the info. I'm about 90 kg and have been running around 79 PSI and no tokens. Mainly to get the support I'm looking for. This has resulted in less than ideal compliance and comfort early in the stroke. I think the luftkappe may be exactly what I need to optimize my fork.
Really interested to get your views on the luftkappe after you got setup, I think it will be a long wait to get the new zeb air spring so luftkappe is the way to go! How many clicks rebound are you at at 72psi, I'm going between 8 and 13 from closed. Not sure which I prefer, hard to get setup where I like it.... any thoughts mate?
71 psi 6 clicks lsc 1 click hsc the fork feels killer. The little beit of hsc definitely adds charge factor to the fork and feels strong and controlled. Rebound I’m not sure of the clicks, just fast but not topping out
@@benkerslake4024 My setup is almost the same but I'm running 59psi (170lbs) and 9 from closed. I started with 1 spacer but kept feeling like the fork would blow through the mid stroke, but felt harsher off the top with more PSI. Then once I got up to 3 spacers I got the mid stroke support but couldn't get the fork to use all of the travel without going too low on the pressure and losing the mid support. I'm installing the luftkappe next weekend so we'll see how it changes things. I'm hoping it will feel similar to 3 spacers but allow me to drop the PSI a bit and use the full range of travel
Are you running the same pressure or higher with the Lufkappe as prior? I have a ZEB on the way and my lufkappe is already at the shop waiting for the installation.
More pressure with less tokens. I can’t remembetr what my preferred was without luftkappe. I think it ended up around 3 tokens 62 to have it at 20% sag with decent support now no token 72 for 20%sag and heaps of support and bottomout resistance
Thanks for all that R&D. I started my run HS compression fully open. LS 2 click in. Right away I noticed that it was not enough. LS 4 click in was definitely better but still missing a little support. looks like I will be at 6 clicks in. I think this is quite similar to what you are running? I am at 20% sag. So far. I am really liking that ZEB.
Great review! New sub! Spent the day trying a few different settings with the luftkappe installed . No tokens, 6 psi more than standard, found the sweet spot. The fork is a now a different animal, couldn't fault the fork prior to the installment but I advise anyone with a zeb to invest, transformed the fork.
2021 Lyrik here, 83kg ride weight. I normally run 1 token / 77 PSI. I've upped the spring rate to 90 PSI (just over 15%) and removed the token. Fork feels perfect. Holds nice and high in it's travel, doesn't dive, but plush, as all the small bump are eaten up in the first 1/3 of it's travel. Plus still about 1-2cm reserved for big hits. I find if you run the fork with less pressure than 15% more (than standard) with the mod, you're getting a lot of the small bumps down into the first 1/2 of the travel, which makes it feel harsher. The idea is to keep all the small bumps in the top 1/4-1/3 of the fork's travel. Done plenty of experiementation to get to this point. So anyone only bumping it up only a small amount, try more. You won't be sacrificing any plushness, and it'll actually feel more plush on the small stuff, but more supportive for everything else, steeps, jumps, drops etc.
Luftkappe. Well, what different that makes to the Zeb. Straight away on the driveway you tell the difference. Soo much smoother and softer off the top. Thanks for the tip Telly. Legend.
Glad you finally got the zeb sorted but at the end of the day when you buy a high end fork like that you shouldn't have to buy a vorsprung air Shaft to make it feel the way it should anyway. Knowing what you know now if you had to buy another fork would you still go with the zeb or a Fox 38 ? As I have debated which to get as I have a lyric with the B1 spring and love it but didn't like the c1 at all
I agree. I wouldn’t buy either fork to be honest. The Lyrik B1 does everything for someone my weight. If I had to choose between 38 and zeb with no option to upgrade I’d choose 38, its definitely superior once the airspring is serviced properly. TheZeb has creaky steerer issues and the lower legs aren’t manufactured to correct tolerances. The 38 comes full of grease in the neg chamber which needs to be addressed straight away to get the most out of it. Fox are known for creaky steerers as well but I haven’t seen any issues with that in the 38 so far.
Lyrik B1 all day
@@mtbtelly5522 Hi and thanks for getting back to me yeah I'm definitely going to stick with the lyric for sure I'm 76kg and I'm extremely happy with it especially after you gave me advice on how to set it up better. The last service I did on the powers I used racing bro's dust seals and I'm due to do it again have you tried the latest SKF wiper seal's i've heard their supposed to be even better than standard? Oh and i've been considering putting a coil shock on my 2019 specialised enduro comp! It's recommended that I should put an ohlins ttx on it so I was wondering if you've had any experience with it on any bikes! I currently have the rockshox monarch plus rc3 which is a great shock but would love to try coil but I'm not sure as I do alot of climbing.and descending What are your thoughts?
I have the Secus and it feels incredible, kind of want to try the Luftkappe
Looks good, you were charging through that rock section.
Need to give the spring upgrade a go but seriously thinking about the coil conversion (Vorsprung Smashpot).
Can’t go wrong with a coil setup
Once SRAM bring out the new lowers will you raise another warranty claim and get the new lowers hoping it resolves the bushing issue?
As a lightweight rider, I just can't get a good small bump sensitivity with the Zeb, it doesn't feel as plush as my Lyrik or my Pike. I was looking at the Secus but damn this thing is expensive, I'll give the Luftkappe a try, had of on a 36 and loved it. Thanks for the review mate
Yeah luftkappe def brings the fork to life. Set one up for a lad at 52kg and he loves it
Et puis, as tu installer le luftkappe ? Je regarde moi aussi mes options ?
@@martinbourgault816 oui, ça l'a transformé la Zeb. Bcp plus plush en début de course et plus de sensibilité en début de course, pour une Zeb 2021-2022 c'est un must. La 2023 semble être mieux de ce côté et je ressent pas le besoin d'en mettre un
Hahaha Telly partying too hard on the trails 🤘
Hey man, Bought a 38 a couple weeks back but only just recently ridden it a couple times. To be completely honest i think i preferred my lyrik ultimate lol well for trail trash anyway. But the 38 corners sooo freaking well its unbelievable. It does feel a little harsh in the initial part of the stroke like landing jumps etc. I was surprised by this as lots of people say the 38 has a "pillow" type feeling on landings but im just not getting that at all.
Any ideas?
Bushes in the lowers most likely get a die or a shop to size them for you, plus a luftkappe helps a lot too that really was the icing on the cake for me once that was fitted I loved the 38s, I also think they feel shit unless they are freshly serviced well lubricated, keep the bike upside down and use a fork lube. When you get it tuned right you wont feel a thing when you charge over small rocks and chatter, bigger hitting roots should cause you no hand pain and should retain that decent cornering and mid stroke support. Damper settings can be found all over the internet. 2 HSR and about 5-7 LSR then compression to suit (if any). Took me 2 months to get it right but the bushings were the problem.
AWSOME mate. nothing like being alittle deflated and then flipping it on its head and being stoked. no matter what it is in life. and for you my friend it seems like thats a good running bike :)
She was punching for sure. Gone from ready to sell the Zeb to holy shit this is what I been looking for
@@mtbtelly5522 do you noticed any difference with the axle to crown height vs other forks as I heard off a bloke he had to remove 5mm stem spacer to get the front end feeling right again. Going from a 36 to a zeb.
Maybe the vorsprung helps it sit in more tho?
He was also running one token and much more air then you as well.
@@chadsugden411 before the luftkappe when I tested the fork as standard I left my stem and bars where they were, there was bugger all if any difference between the zeb and my lyrik from memory. Same now with the luftkappe. Just set the pressure to put me at the same height and it feels killer. If I had to run less sag I’d drop the bar a little but no need, it feels right where it is
@@mtbtelly5522 ok good to know.
As I’d take your word over his.
I wanna upgrade my fox 36
Rhythm’s soon.
But not sure if you I should put a grip 2 in it and leave it. (and maybe some kinda updated air spring like a luftkappe piston/spring upgrade)
Or buy some factory 38’s or ZEB’s and what will give the best results on my sight.
@@chadsugden411 funny enough that Rhythm is a killer fork. Have you serviced the air spring? When I get hands on this A2 I’ll have a better idea of where to go with the tune, but I wouldn’t get the Zeb because of the binding lowers and the crappy spring design. The 38 is killer, but needs a spring clean straight out of the box to get the real performance out of it. I had a bounce around on the 38 I cleaned out last week, man that is an incredible feeling fork. Very impressive but expensive and heavy
Thanks for your superb videos mate! I am unsure if the top out bumper needs to be removed on the Zeb as well like on the Lyrik‘s?
The Vorsprung video is only about the Lyrik and there Steve removes the top out bumper.
Thanks and greetings from Switzerland!
Nope, leave the topout bumper in on the Zeb ✌🏼✌🏼
Are you gonna put one in your Zeb?
@@mtbtelly5522 thanks for your answers. Yes, i installed it already in my Zeb on the Trek Rail (160mm). I have tried the settings you and others mentioned here in the comments, but i strangely need to use almost 90PSI to get to 30% SAG. I aim for 20%, but the fork would be stiff as hell then.
Sure, the E-Bike weighs a bit more then your Slash, but still it should not make such a huge difference imo. I am 88kg ride ready.
Have a great day!
Why was I so happy to see you crash? haha. Love your enthusiasm bud. That looks blooooody rowdy on the tube, it will no doubt be nuts in real life. Beyond my skill level for sure.
Its pretty heavy top to bottom, gotta have your big boy pants on for this one
Hi mate,I have a fox 34 rhythm 130mm as I do longer rides but also ride some chunky trails do you think a shorter travel fork would benefit from this upgrade ?thanks
Absolutely. I’ve ridden a 140 34 pre and post luftkappe and it was certainly a noticeable improvement over standard setup. Not necessary but it is an improvement
I have 3 2021+ Lyrik Ultimates and 2 have B1 air shaft. I like the feel of the B1 over the C1. Do you think the LuftKappe will make my 3rd Lyrik even better than the B1’s?
You’d have to get an old A1 shaft to install a luftkappe in a new lyrik. Which would make the fork killer, I’m not sure about better than B1 but I believe its as good for sure.
I heard a rumour they’re bringing a new lyrik out in june with a new spring and more
So how douse it affect how how far it sits into the travel
Is it Lowe or higher
Thinking of doing this upgrade to my 2021 lyirik
When I’m sat in my seat and not stood up my fork sits at around 20%sag with 1 token ( bike I have is an ebike) if it sits Lowe my bike will feel like it’s diving
Also do you have to cycle to fork to balance the air pressure or will it still work like my fork douse now
You do need to cycle it but not vigorously as the eq point is only just into the travel from full extension.
You definitely want the front to stay up in the travel when you’re neutral. And not dive, but also not be harsh on the hands
Hey Telly. Did you ever try your Lyrik with a Luftkappe? Ive tried both the C1 and B1 springs in my Lyrik and wondering if I'll see another step up in performance going B1 to Luftkappe. Cheers.
I had the original luftkappe in my 2018 A1 lyrik, and it was sublime 👌🏽👌🏽
@@mtbtelly5522 Likewise also in my 2018 Lyrik and likewise it was sublime! Wondering if it'll be much of a difference in the 2021 Lyrik though in comparison to the B1 spring I already have in there...
Would you take a Zeb over the Lyrik now after piston upgrade.
I’d still go the Lyrik with a B1 spring and 2.1 damper. The Zeb has been poorly manufactured and will show substantial stanchion wear after a couple seasons. Th Lyrik is lighter and still smashes just as hard, its just not quite as stiff which doesn’t bother me being 75kg
@@mtbtelly5522 am 87kg and run a Lyrik atm. No complaints just getting a feel if there is a gain in the extra burliness of a Zeb. Pretty consistent reports in the forums of the weak mid stroke support from the stock air spring. Great vids btw. Legend.
serious gnarr on that trail. nice review
Yeah its a good trail for testing things
Bit off topic but what are your thoughts on lower chain tensioner/guides?
I really like the idea of reducing chain slap but unsure if it puts undue stress on components or affects shifting.
Cascade components new lower guide is excellent, it has no effect on the drivetrain but creates excellent retention. Worth a look for sure. Lower rollers aren’t great but do the job for sure
I understand the lyric with the b1 is your favourite, so did the zeb with the new spring equal it , or do you still prefer the lyric ?
Yeah the Zeb with the Luftkappe literally feels like my lyrik now, just bigger and stronger. The difference just altering the spring design makes is excellent. Worth every cent for sure. I no longer hate my Zeb haha
@@mtbtelly5522 cool , I’m thinking of getting the alloy mega frame when they are released, the last 2 years they have come with the super deluxe , for the fork maybe the zeb with the spring upgrade might be the go. , you have done the research for me :)
@@camwells9726 I’d still go lyrik over Zeb until they fix the lower misalignment issue with a new zeb lower leg. Both are killer, but the lyrik is my choice to keep the weight down and performance up
Nice little lay down in the bushes there mate. Did you get a bit tyred and needed a rest?? LOL
Thought I saw 2 bucks on the ground!
ive had my zeb for 4 months now, and i cant at all find a right setup for it, ive had more pressure and no tokens, its harsh on initial, almost to the point of been dangerous because you ping off everything, or i run lower pressure with 3 tokens to where theres not much support until the end, this sounds like it fixes these issues, so going to give it a go!
Yeah the standard spring is garbage compared to the luftkappe setup. You’re exactly right with your interpretation of how the spring performs. Not to mention the Zeb has binding issues between the upper and lower legs.
@@mtbtelly5522 ive ordered one, should be here tomorrow, will get it installed this week and hopefully have a much better fork!
Fitted and been for a ride this morning, the difference is absolutely massive, this is how this fork should of behaved to begin with!!! no more pinging around, holds lines better, way more support, feels so much calmer, gone up to 74psi for my 92kg weight and it's perfect. Thanks for the recommendation!!
@@martinhayes5087 its a massive improvement hey. Glad you got it sorted!
Interesting that vorsprung have made an air spring to mimic the older debonair spring characteristics. If the vorsprung have changed the spring in relation to the transfer port does that mean the initial part of the stroke you lose 5 or 6mm of travel like it being sucked down? If that's the case it seems like that was rockshox main focus was to gain the initial stroke of travel which therefore potentially comprising the whole spring curve.
I wonder if any pros endorsed by RS share the same issues you have and use this vorsprung airspring and not tell them.
Most of the RS athletes have likely been on the new zeb spring all season. It might be released soon. I know many people that aren’t big on the Zeb performance. Its a good fork but not great without the revised spring/vorsprung upgrade
Did you crash into poison oak at the bottom?
Nah just blackberry bush. Mid level nasty
Killer review!! I just recently bought a DSD Runt for my ZEB and really like the feel of it. Would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it!!
I haven’t tried the Runt before. Definitely an interesting approach to air spring performance
Another good review. Do you have problem getting full travel after the mod? I notice you increase the pressure quite a lot but the positive chamber size is smaller than before (the luftkappe is quite bigger than one volume spacer that you removed)
If I drop the pressure 3 psi from my preferred, I’ll bottom it out multiple times, but I set it up to stay away from the bottomouts. As you said the kap takes up a good chunk of positive space. To fine tune the spring you can add a little grease to the negative chamber to slightly decrease the neg volume, which will change the pos neg ratio slightly lowering mid stroke/overall stroke strength. I feel like the luftkappe is an increase of neg that is just a little too much for most people, which is great because you can bring it back down a touch with a little grease or oil, and have literally the best performance you could ask for.
So yeah the luftkappe is quite progressive even at no token due to the increase in neg and decrease in pos
@@mtbtelly5522 I actually have the same bike but a select+ zeb. At 67kg, the last 3cm travel is unreachable. Don’t think I want a even more progressive spring rate. My major complaint is the initial suppleness. Went to a bike park last week and those brake bumps really hurt my hands
I tried to use the zip tie trick to equalize the lower leg pressure at 10% travel. At full extension, the lower pressure should provide a softer initial stroke. Can’t wait to test it on trails
I think the zeb is designed for enduro racing and may not fit an average joe like me.
-Stiffer initial stroke for ride height and pop
-less mid stroke for charging. For some terrain, you may want the fork to use travel easily to clear obstacle while maintaining speed. It requires very fast rebound and can be hard to hold
-Super progressive at the end for bottom out control
@@cscsw whats your current setup on the fork? Tokens pressure reb and comp
@@mtbtelly5522 Got the bike few weeks ago and is still testing setup. Last week at bike park was 47psi with 1 spacer, 8-9 click out from the slowest rebound. One click lsc
I just removed one spacer and lowered the lower leg pressure a little bit
I can feel the brushing loosen up a bit but It’s still not silky smooth. Will do a lower leg service later
@@cscsw assuming you have the standard spring without luftkappe, I’d run 2 tokens, 4-6 clicks of lsc from open to start, and 55psi starting pressure, rebound probably 10 or 11 out from closed. Sounds like a lot compared to what you’re running, but it will get the front up in the more supple part of the travel and the token config will give a decent spring curve
@MTB Telly What downtube protection do you have on your bike?
I just use 3M automotive protective film and cut it to shape myself. Waay cheaper than a brand name frame skin
I'm seriously considering one of these. Were you running the same air pressure prior to the cap? It sounds like you were running no tokens as well.
The smoothest setup I could get pre luftkappe was no token 72psi but it was way too high in the travel (12%sag) to be good everywhere. My best compromise was 3 tokens 64psi to get me down enough in the sag to have compliance on hard rough stuff and a good ride height. But it would still beat your hands up and was not excellent. I’m now at no token 72 psi at 18% sag and its just mauling, exactly how I set up my B1 lyrik pretty much. Its a way way better fork now and very confident everywhere. Just a pleasure to ride now
@@mtbtelly5522 Thanks for the info. I'm about 90 kg and have been running around 79 PSI and no tokens. Mainly to get the support I'm looking for. This has resulted in less than ideal compliance and comfort early in the stroke. I think the luftkappe may be exactly what I need to optimize my fork.
Sounds awesome!! Where are these trails may I ask?
Cheers,
Lucas
This is Horsnells Gully near Mt Lofty
@@mtbtelly5522 thanks mate! I’m moving to Adelaide this year and keen to check out the trails👌
@@LJV13B we got hundreds to choose from!
Really interested to get your views on the luftkappe after you got setup, I think it will be a long wait to get the new zeb air spring so luftkappe is the way to go! How many clicks rebound are you at at 72psi, I'm going between 8 and 13 from closed. Not sure which I prefer, hard to get setup where I like it.... any thoughts mate?
71 psi 6 clicks lsc 1 click hsc the fork feels killer. The little beit of hsc definitely adds charge factor to the fork and feels strong and controlled. Rebound I’m not sure of the clicks, just fast but not topping out
Cheers
Im now at 65psi, 10 lsc, 2 hsc 14 from closed, 3 spacers and its best so far. No luftkappe though, looks like its worth it though?
@@benkerslake4024 My setup is almost the same but I'm running 59psi (170lbs) and 9 from closed. I started with 1 spacer but kept feeling like the fork would blow through the mid stroke, but felt harsher off the top with more PSI. Then once I got up to 3 spacers I got the mid stroke support but couldn't get the fork to use all of the travel without going too low on the pressure and losing the mid support. I'm installing the luftkappe next weekend so we'll see how it changes things. I'm hoping it will feel similar to 3 spacers but allow me to drop the PSI a bit and use the full range of travel
Just ordered one based on this review!
Won’t be disappointed my friend
Who's go stock of these? None on the online store have anything
I ordered it direct from Vorsprung in Whistler
Are you running the same pressure or higher with the Lufkappe as prior? I have a ZEB on the way and my lufkappe is already at the shop waiting for the installation.
More pressure with less tokens. I can’t remembetr what my preferred was without luftkappe. I think it ended up around 3 tokens 62 to have it at 20% sag with decent support now no token 72 for 20%sag and heaps of support and bottomout resistance
@@mtbtelly5522 thanks for the assistance ✌️
Thanks for all that R&D.
I started my run HS compression fully open. LS 2 click in. Right away I noticed that it was not enough. LS 4 click in was definitely better but still missing a little support. looks like I will be at 6 clicks in. I think this is quite similar to what you are running?
I am at 20% sag. So far. I am really liking that ZEB.
Perfect
I got a KItsuma on my sight. You will like it.
Air or coil?
I can’t wait to try it
Coil.
@@jeanboilard1624 do you find it clunks a bit when it hits full extension?
No so far. My season is over.
up the MTB Telly ☝☝
yeeow! blackberry boy
Burnish the bushings then mate
this is the reason fox factory exist! rocksho.. WHO?