@@froorocks1000 I mean, yeah. But in all fairness, it's not necessarily hypocrisy. Lol. And it's not necessarily like they don't have a point. Most of what mans touched on in this video was facts, and whatever wasn't he had some good backing for tbh. Heck, they might even be saying what they're saying _because_ they've had a 5 stringy. Like when a drummer that has 7 pieces says you don't need more than a 5 piece. Lol. Granted, you aren't without your validity either. You could very easily go like, "Yo dawg, you got a Yamaha 5 string in your corner, bruh. You thought we weren't gonna cook yo' azz for getting a 5 string for that song you and your band covered by The Warning? 🤣 I'm not saying you a hypocrite, but I AM saying you're your own antithesis on some level." But even still, that don't make what he's saying less valid when you examine it.
need and want are very different but both valid on their own, no? lol 99% of the people that own hypercars don't need them. They outright don't deserve rocking them haha
Why you dont need a five string bass 1. You don't play bass. 2. You exclusively play retro/vintage music written before 5 string basses existed. 3. You play in a gig where you need a specific bass for visuals, like if your in a tribute band and need the same bass as the player your posing as. All you new players, ignore people telling you that you need to spend time and money on a four string if your inspiration for picking up the bass is music played on a 5 string. Its easier, and cheaper to start with a five string bass. This is the Way Furthermore, a good number of the bassists on your list actually did play five string, most notably Leland Sklar, but also Paul McCartney and Chris Squire. The cons of playing a five string are all overcome by paying attention to your technique and musicality, and there's enough music out there that requires extended range that you ought to be prepared for. D tuning your E string is problematic because the drastic change in string tension affects tone, playability, and intonation. Extended range bass is the future. A single well set up five string bass and proper technique is all you will ever need, no fuss, no retuning. Just play.
@@christianfoster3806 Ehhh.....so uhhh.....No tea, no shade, I'm with you for a majority of your reasoning, but up to a certain point. You got very strong supporting data (I myself didn't really support the whole "the greats didn't need a 5 string" argument, because it can go either way, and has as much for it as against it; both sides are heavily valid tho). And your views are very strongly backed; every single view you voiced has great reasoning behind it. The thing I'm conflicted on is that your view leans towards the _other_ extreme, arguably. I agree with you that 5 strings are very useful, but it's hard for me to cosign that you don't need a 5 string if you _don't play bass_ . 🤣🤣🤣🤣 4 stringy ain't _that_ bad. Lol. My personal take on 4 strings and 5 strings is that _both_ bass types are very useful and versatile, and will carry you far, because that's exactly what both basses have done. I think they're both equal (I can elaborate on that later if you want; but I'm already yapping up a storm; forgive me). Both are very great choices to have, just in different ways and for different reasons: A 5 string bass has everything you need. Whereas a 4 string bass has _all_ you need. 😎👍 EDIT: All that said, I still gave ya the upvote because everything you said was either valid, or backed by valid reasoning. I gotta respect that.
@@christianfoster3806 First off, great pun. I love puns. Second, I understand whatcha mean. And that's..... actually a clever way of putting it tbh. The baritone/tuba thing. I gotta look into that. I'm just sayin', tho. That other side do be spittin' too. When mans dropped _Thaddeus Tribbett_ as an example, he was a _strong_ example, lemme tell ya! 😂 Thad's calling card is a 4 string, and to piggyback off your analogy, he was using a baritone in a genre where tubas were _strongly_ recommended. Lol. That said, I do agree with your reasoning here. You could play a baritone like a tuba (figuratively speaking, of course), but you'd rather have the tuba just in case you need it, because you will more often than not. Hell, I myself would take a tuba to be prepared. I don't have the skill to get away with playing in church on a 4 string yet. Lol. I want to, but I ain't got it in me yet. 😅
Exactly this! I play in a cover band with a repertoire of around 250 popular songs. Most people don't realize how often 5 string basses are used on records, thinking it's just metal thing or modern thing, which is very far from truth.
@@arvidlystnur4827 Hmm…what makes you feel that way? There are plenty of times in my professional career that I *don’t* need them, and that playing (or writing for) 5-string would in fact not serve the music. I choose to use them only when I think the music, and the gig, specifically calls for it.
@@FunkyButter , Perhaps I was a little too harsh, or wrong, using the term hypocrite. I realize that you advocate 5 strings in other videos. It's just that I keep hearing 4 string players suggest those who prefer 5 as elites and old schoolers tell me "ya don't need 5 to play jazz" as if I should get rid of my five and get a 4 string jazz or p bass. You mentioned great players that play 4 string basses but what about great players that play 5 string. There are great baroque musicians that play valve less horns and oboes, but they're kind of obsolete in a modern orchestra. Here's my thing. I'm not a great bass player, I've self diagnosed myself as partially dyslexic. I played 4string decades ago and switched to 5. I can't go back to 4. My patterns are all screwed up. I hear wonderful sounding 4 string basses, yet I would customize them to be five if I owned one. Also with my mind, I can't stand 19 fret, got to be 24. To further explain my mindset, I have a Kay Chubby Jackson model five string upright and a five string Mosses, as well as a freted and fretless bass. What could be more confusing than ignoring the B string if one desires to go retro. Yes there are many great 4string players, yet I wonder if they'd be better on 5. Oh well, that's my rant.
@@arvidlystnur4827 Rant away! FWIW, I tend to resist any orthodoxy, so I respect that, and I’m glad you’ve found something that works for you. I think here’s a good use case of what I mean: I’m playing in the house band of a festival this Sunday. About 60% of the music definitely asks for a modern 5-string J, so that’s what I brought to the first rehearsal. But I found today that - despite having the “notes”, despite having even more options as far as pickup configuration, EQ, preamp, etc - the 5-string really isn’t doing it for the 40% of the music that wants a more lofi or vintage energy. So I’ll be bringing my Mustang to rehearsal tomorrow to complement the 5-string.
I was a 4 string player for almost 20 years and I never really thought about playing a 5 string until I played a gig with a singer who changed a bunch of songs to lower keys, bought a five string for the gig and spent a few weeks getting used to it.. I seriously wish I would have been playing 5 strings my entire life, it immediately opened up so many doors for me that I didn’t realize other than the lower extended range, especially with my left hand for creative note choice.. and when I do use that low B.. it turns heads. Also on certain songs playing past the 5th fret of the B string is great for certain keys not to mention the nice round tone i can get in that register with the thicker gauged string, instant tonal variety if i want it. And yes.. I’ve been turned on to the more modern day 5 string companies.. and these basses are truly the best built basses in the world not to mention the tone, once you play these basses… it’s very hard to go back to playing anything else or vintage style basses. All the theater bassists in my town used them my whole life even with regular gigs and I understand why now, I truly regret not getting one years ago. And it really does fine tune your technique naturally
I still think one of the most useful applications for a 5-string is when you need to change key at very short notice. Playing a gig and just as the song starts the singer says "can we move it down a whole tone" and then you're going from F to Eb. It's a life-saver.
Wait until you get a multiscale headless 5 strings or 6 strings, people are always wondering what I'm playing ! 5ers are so practical for cover bands and all
@@xenogear88 yep I have been looking at the multi scale basses, a really good player who used to gig in my town got one many years back, a Spector and that thing sounded amazing and at the time it was a nice clean modern tone. Now there’s many basses like that but I’ve been looking at those. And also.. 6 strings, what do you think about those? I play my five strings for regular gigs with B string for extended low register, but I also play metal in dropped A sharp, tuning up the rest of the strings a half step with with an extended high register G sharp string as the G string. So it’s giving me the higher end range in that tuning like a 6 string would. I’m in a way getting the best of both worlds of a five string and it’s making me wonder about the 6 strings
I love 5 strings. Tried going back to 4, didn't like it. 5 is also awesome when you're playing with a singer who is deciding what key to sing in and keeps changing it up
Inthink its relevant and poignant to point out that a Centrury and a half ago, Basses had three strings, and were tuned ADG. Times change, instruments change. Keep up.
@@christianfoster3806 That really puts things in perspective. Lol. You mean we had to upgrade to the low E???? And since then, history repeated itself and we were like, "It's low B time?" 😮 That's wild. I'm learning new shit every day.
New archeological research shows that as recently as 10,000 years ago, electric basses had only a D string and no fingerboard. In fact, all music was in D.
I have an old bass method book that shows a 3 string, and 4 string bass. I think the point is, the noisier the world becomes, and the better able we are to reproduce low frequencies, the lower we are gonna go...
That subharmonic trick (2:00) is amazing, thanks. Also, thoughtful and compelling arguments aside, I still want a 5-string, and maybe a fretless, and a contrabass.
@@xenophilie Follow your muse! I’ve got a couple 5-strings, including a Sire Fretless 5, and I get great use out of them. I just try to select which axe I bring to the gig based on what the music is calling for.
Most people who play straight-up covers probably don't need a five onstage, except "to look cool." I doubled on bass for many years, then I picked up a "fun" gig at a weekly open jam. First off, with sometimes four (or more!) guitars whanging away, I needed to get some tonal distance from that crowd. Plus, it's annoying how many amateurs do EVERYTHING in E -- well, anyway, half their stuff. Rather than tune down, or buy a detuner and learn how to play DADG, it was simpler for me to buy a half-decent five (Washburn XB-500, $200). After I got some confidence, I wandered back toward a four, but strung BEAD.
McCartney famously played a 5-string Wal MK2. Lee Sklar has a signature 5, Pino has played a 5-string fretless stingray. Chris Squire played a 5 in his later career also. I love the 4, and wish I could play more of it. But, the 5 has its place, and ultimately, no matter if your preference is a 4, you gotta play 5. That’s why I play a passive 5-string P bass on 85% of my gigs; I’d rather have that than some modern active instrument most of the time.
100% agreed that the 5 has its place. I just see a lot of people using it out of place and missing out on the full possibilities of 4-strings. And I'm not 100% sure that I'd agree that you "gotta play 5". I've had a 5-string for over 10 years, until about 2 years ago when I started finding more uses for it, I only played 5-string on maybe 2% of my gigs, including gospel, merengue, hard rock and styles that typically 'lean towards' 5-string.
if we're going down this rabbit hole, then let's commit: we don't need bass players period. Seriously, just tell your keyboard player to use his left hand, or get a submarine pickup.
I exclusively play 5 strings but totally get what you mean by the physically of having the E string as the lowest I've even gone as far as fitting one of my 5 strings with a high C rather than a low B (EADGC) Completely changes how you feel about 5 strings really. You get the benefit of using a 6 string without the crazy thick necks 😂 It feels much closer to a 4 string for me, just can't seem to warrant getting something that only has 4 strings, but retro sounds aren't really my bag
I fell for this old news and first bought a 4-string. When I bought a 5-string it seemed like a silly waste of money to have limited myself with a 4-string based on these old ideas. I hate that these videos are holding others back as well. #1. There are plenty of options if you look. #2. Why "trick" listeners into maybe thinking they hear a lower note when you can actually play the lower note. You don't "deal" with the 5-string, you get extra options. 3. 5 string has much better access to low notes than having to use drop tuners. 4. Not at all. 5. It's like saying the most influential keyboard players were classical pianists, so you don't need a keyboard you need a piano.
Appreciate your thoughts! And if a 5-string is working for you and the kinds of music you play, by all means, more power to you. I wind up playing a lot of 5-string - *when* the music calls for it. But I went into a detail in this response video about how, in a professional context, 4-string bass is often a better choice for the context (and more likely to get me hired, depending on what the artist/producer wants!) On a festival gig this past weekend, I wound up bringing a 4-string and a 5-string, and making extensive use of subharmonics and my detuner - because that's what was right for some of the music. Similarly, I just sent in some files for a remote recording session recorded on one of my 5-strings, but it turns out that what the producer really wanted was my '66 Precision. So I would be disappointed if these sorts of ideas "hold people back", when, in fact, they have largely driven my success in my career and my employability as a creative musician. ua-cam.com/video/kjWIq-pDpoM/v-deo.html
A) You can alwats restring a 4 string with a .140" B and tune it B E A D. B) To get the sub harmonic attack the string at its mid point; open string play at the 12th fret, the 5th fret harmonic play at the 17th fret.
If like me, you want the extra low notes a B string brings, but don't like having to deal with the wider board and extra string, I recommend stringing your 4-string B E A D. That's what I do and it works a treat. I never liked playing too high anyway and never used the top five notes.
This is not why you don’t need a 5-string: this is why you should not limit yourself to having just 5-strings, and how to best use a 5-string. Also some of your people who “exclusively” use 4-strings use 5-strings, too.
Great video man :) Awesome Edit too :) I honestly do play a tonne of 5 string these days, but yes you certainly don’t want to abuse that low B string!!! Great Video again… Subscribed
Thanks for the kind words! To be honest, I've been playing with a project that requires a lot of 5-string as well - but I try to be careful in choosing my weapon based on the gig at hand 💪
I've played 5-string for years in standard tuning (B-E-A-D-G), just switched to a custom string set to drop the whole thing another 4th - F#, B, E, A, D. I used to use the G-string for pops and harmonics, but then I decided I'd rather be uncontested (and move my hand less) in the lowest possible registers. Very happy with it, btw, shout out to stringjoy!
Oof! 🙈 No shade, there's lots of great reasons for having a 5-string - I just think it's most effective when players make concrete choices with how the use it ;)
If you didn’t need a 5 string bass I don’t think there would be so many hundreds of great bass players 5 or 6 or 7 string basses if you are inspired by extended range bass players and you want to play them you should just play it regardless of what someone may say there’s tons of genres that use extended range basses along with many many many extended range basses that are great to play and find like he was saying you can’t find a semi hallow 5 string you absolutely can Ibanez made them Gibson made them gretch makes them epiphone made them not to mention all the basses he played in the start of the video sound the exact same because they were made for the exact same purpose the only reason they even slightly sounded different was because of the strings and the pick he played with on the hofner at the end of the day wether you play a 4 or a 8 or 9 whatever bass you play it’s still a bass regardless of tuning regardless if you play chords or root notes regardless if you slap or play with a pick figure out what you want to play figure out your voice on the instrument and embrace it no one should be able to tell you what you need or don’t need ever when it comes to music and that’s for every instrument on earth
I don't need lot of different types of basses and if I do I'll get them. Most of the reason 5 string basses have a modern tone is because of the need to make the B string come to life. And if you have a decent 5 it can be versatile. So interesting about the prefect 5ths tricking the brain, but I'm not sure that's as versatile a way of getting the low notes because your fingers will not always be in a position to do that, Agree to an extent about the weaker E string but that's mainly with decending slides in my experience.
@@joannalewis5279 You got some valid takes here. I respect em. And I didn't know about the modern tone being a thing for a reason, and one of those reasons being the B string. Hell, I don't even know the difference between modern and vintage tones. Lol. I don't know much of anything about tone. I just play em and feel my way around with my ear and the research I've done. I can tell tones apart when it's obvious, but I need someone to tell me the differences between vintage and modern and other shit. And thanks for reading my loooong post from before as well.
That's an excellent point about the need to liven up the low B incentivizing active basses and the 'modern' sound. To build on that further, recent makers like Serek have been bringing more of a vintage vibe to 5-strings, including developing some solid fives with 30-32" scale length.
@@FunkyButter very true and I know someone with a 32 inch scale 6 string Fodera and that can sound grey different to a typical extended range. Great videos
This channel is going to be huge! Just wanted to be the first to say it 😅 Great video, and I didn't know drop tuners existed. The subharmonic trick is a nice one as well, always wondered how that happens, until I saw a Veritasium video on it recently.
@@zumba.c That’s true. There’s also a lot of music that doesn’t demand a “modern” sound or approach, including contemporary music. That’s not to say that it’s not creative to mix and subvert those sorts of expectations, but when I show up to a gig, it’s important that I bring the right tools to fulfill the artist’s vision - and, often (though of course not always!) - that’s not a 5-string.
@@FunkyButter That low end. I got 4 string basses,Standard,fretless, had a 5 string, not bad. I play 7 and 8 string guitar too, they go hand and hand. I have a esp 6 string bass and it just sounds stellar, heavy as hell. scales, modes,ect just flow better to me. I Play tighter on six string basses!
@@FunkyButter The neck!Wider necks are more comfortable on bass for me. Also depends on what I am trying to accomplish.6 String are stellar for death metal style bass with more real-estate to travel.I love to stay moving on instruments. I constantly use three fingers on fast parts, less stress on hand for me. I don't slap or play the funk style which I have tried and for me is better suited for 4 string if I want pursue it...I hope I do one day! Options are awesome,having those difference at arms length are priceless!
I understood I didn't need a 5 when I noted I had to choose when using low notes, that made me think that I was already good at doing that on a 4 string, others were the things I had to improve, not using low notes more often.
I've had both. Now just use a 4 string tuned to D standard. D, G, C, F. My Fender Precision Mod Shop sounds much better in this tuning. Punch is still there but notes are more full. When I need lower than a D I use Foxrox Octave pedal which can be set to sound very natural and not at all synth like.
@@FunkyButter I use the Foxrox Octron 3. Gives you 3 notes - the note you're playing, one octave below and one octave above. You can set volumes separately for each. Due to how physics work, the octave above will be slightly distorted and I've used this pedal just for distortion at times. In my example from my first comment - I'm using just the octave below and that creates natural sounding notes below my low D. If you crank up all 3 notes, you get that classic Led Zepplin bass and distorted guitar playing a riff in unison sound.
@@FunkyButter no latency but you have to play your one note very cleanly. Any hint of another string ringing and it won’t work. It made me become a very precise player!
1. Not everyone wants to sound like a cardboard box strung with rubber bands. 2. Subharmonics as described in this video require a compressor and special amp settings, whereas low notes on an extended range bass can simply be played. 3. Detuners only go down to D (or C at best), whereas a 5 string goes down to B with no need to transpose. 4. This "physicality" he mentions is just a matter of technique and proper setup. 5. This was only true until 5-strings became normalized, and his examples are cherry-picked.
Enjoyed the video mate, definitely watching the next one, I love my 4 and 5 strings for different reasons. I would love to add the existence of High C 5 string players and the Low B 4 string players to the mix.
Excellent vid mate. Easiest subscribe button click in a while lol. Didn't know about subharmonics being usable how you describe them. Feel like I've just had my eyes opened!
I've thought about getting a 5 string bass, but i realize that all the basslines that i enjoy listening to utilize the higher audible portion of the fretboard rather than low rumbly portions :) 4 strings also just have mojo. Diff strokes for diff folks Plus, if i want a low B, i can always string up BEAD, type O style ;)
5 strings are better than 4 strings, in my opinion. Especially when playing live shows and when they change the key to a much lower one, the 5 string helps a lot.
i completely the fuck agree. messed around with 5 strings for 3 years and it was just a quarter extra bass practice for not a lot of extra bass. plus, the things are heavy, fretboard like the deck of an aircraft carrier and what for me is the deal-breaker; an extra string to damp. like, damping is this stupid tax you have to pay for permission to sound your note; why pay more? further stuff: a] i got a 4 string 2 octave bass. thats 96 notes. i need 101? b] i dont like the notes below low E. spent 6 months making mistakes on the stupid things cos i couldnt tell them apart cos they were too low and i cant tell them apart the audience sure as shit cant tell them apart. theres a reason low E is low E. c] as for a C string, i wander into that territory so rarely it aint worth having. thinking of getting myself a 20-fret bass for less bass practice c] the only real advantage a 5 string offers you is access to 2 octaves in the one hand position. the hell, youre supposed to be able to move about the fretboard anyway, its a bass skill and you can always look at the damn thing c] 4 string works for my brain. there's something about 4 strings which somehow gels with music theory in my mind. it's supposed to work, god says it works, dont rebel
why i got a 5 string, i like it. It was definitely an adjustment though, muting etc, its nice that for MOST songs i play in the band im in i dont have to downtune. however some lines just make more sense in Eb or Drop D. If there was a 4 string that felt as amazing to play as my favorite 5 though, id probably play 4 strings just as much. I love bass discussion and seeing peoples opinions and im stoked to see why you like 5 strings, maybe ill pick something up from it. 👀
@@Blakeadam52 It was the versatility for me. And the lower notes. And I also play in church too, specifically a gospel setting. A 4 string _can_ be used in gospel, and you're not committing a sin if you use one........but a 5 string at bare minimum is _highly_ recommended. Because if you play with a 4 string in a gospel setting long enough, you're gonna wish you had the fifth. Lol.
@@Six3rdy i dont play gospel, but i dont think ive ever seen a gospel player use a 4 string. Lol and i figured there was a reason 😂😂 my church is more contemporary music, so i can play 4 or 5 depending on what im feeling. Gospel players are just built different though. Unbelievable players usually
@@Blakeadam52 Oh yeah. And I hope to be one of em one day. Lol. (I'm in training at the church. I'm pulling my weight, and people like my playing. Now I gotta refine the gospel sauce, ya know?) Now don't get me wrong. You CAN pull of gospel on a 4 string. The video referenced Thaddeus Tribbett, who's a friggin' monster on a 4 string. He's the key reason why I know gospel on a 4 string is possible. I might be (pardon my nonchurchly French) ballsy enough to try it out! I wanna see how I can manage it. But the 5 string is the safest bet. EDIT: That's awesome that you got that option to bring what you're feeling. I gotta add more basses to my arsenal, and I wanna bring my 4 string in, but I wanna swap out the pickups and pots. I need a brighter sound from it. It can do warm well, but now I need the bright for slap.
Your notes are only as limited as your knowledge and imagination. You could stick to roots and 5ths and maybe even 3rds, but you don't have to. There are no wrong notes. It's how you use them that matters. I'm just trying to sound like me most of the time. I'm not looking to sound like someone else. You have so many ways to change the tone of your bass just by how and where you play it. I don't need 5 string but I definitely prefer it over the 4 string. It makes some things I do on a regular basis easier without constantly switching out basses or tuning/detuning my basses or without moving pretty far on the fretboard quickly. Plus, I like being able to shake every door in the house with just a single note. It is very satisfying in a way that I can't use words to describe. You don't need a specific bass to have the same/similar tone as someone else. A single bass has so many tones and emotions that it can play. You just have to figure out how to make it happen if that is what you want. Sounding like someone else is easy. Sounding like yourself is far more challenging for a lot of people. Finding their sound/voice but what they don't know is, it was always there from the beginning. Some people just lose it during the learning process, so they have to try to find it all over again. It's a lot harder the second time around. There is no cookie cutter way to get there for every bass player. There are some things theory can teach you but there is a lot that theory can never teach you. There are also things that theory can unteach you if you aren't careful that you might want later on. To make a long story short. Sound is just wiggly air in the end so make the air wiggle as you. Not them. You're the one playing. They had their time. It's good to have knowledge from them but generally you shouldn't aim to become them unless you are in a tribute band. Be yourself and feel what you have to say and let the bass speak through your playing. All depends on your goals with bass too.
@@rainbowdarth Strongly agree with just about everything you’ve said! The only thing I’d add is this: when I was first getting started as a professional side musicians, I felt like I needed to “assert” my personality in order to feel like I was being myself. In time, I found that *everything* I play feels like my voice, and that no assertion is needed: there are many facets of my personality and my voice that come out on any instrument I pick up. But carefully choosing the paintbrushes we use can both give us a broader palette, and make us more appealing to those who hire us to fulfill their artistic vision.
I've only ever needed 4 strings, all my favourite bass players only used 4 strings Jaco Stanley Clarke James Jamerson Chris Squire John Paul Jones Ralph Armstrong Leland sklar Steve Harris etc
his frankenstein bass which he recorded spectrum & early sessions was a 4 string but later he used a 5 but my favourite recordings & ones that influenced me were done on the 4 string@@hyperplayability6290
@@skuhdoop1411 I find that some writers - particularly for theater - see the extra range and don’t realize they’re limiting their options in other ways. I think some beginning bassists also aren’t totally hip to the full spectrum of tone. But for sure, if someone’s considering a 5, they’re probably listening to music that merits it
Here’s one: 5 string basses are ugly and visually unbalanced. I used to work as a house engineer at a record company studio and in the 80s, when these things first started to be trendy, we had a sign that had a photocopy of a 5 string magazine ad with a cross through the low B string and the words- If you want to be a synth player, get a synth. Now, it was tongue in cheek and of course we recorded 5 string bassists. But if I’m going to work with a band and the bassist turns up with a 5 string I get concerned. Good players will be fine but the more is always better crowd are a problem. With few exceptions, the essence of great bass is simplicity and adding more bits to a normal bass makes it tempting to widdle widdle or try to come to the front too much. And this is coming from someone who came up when basses were first moving into the spotlight. Cf Joy Division, Killing Joke etc. Rock music tends to put the kick drum as the lowest instrument. Some more modern forms swap this around, metal (those clicking sounds they call a kick drum!) and any RnB that uses bass at all often have the electric bass making the most noise between 30 and 50 Hz but if you’re doing something that calls on the sound of the golden era (66-96) you’re gonna want to be careful about the kick and bass stepping on each other and usually choose to have the bass sitting in a pocket a whisker higher than the kick. And a string that goes a 5th below 41.2Hz down to about 31Hz is gonna make that hard if the bassist isn’t really careful.
These are EXCELLENT observations - thank you for sharing! The marketing thing about 'get a synth' is kind of hilarious. Especially because - regardless of the number of strings - so much synth vocabulary has been incorporated into the electric bass canon. (I was particularly inspired by Meshell's playing on 'Cookie: The Anthrolpological Mixtape) when I was first getting started as a bassist.
You don't "need" to play bass! Pretty nifty video :) A lot of the repertoire that I play does require me to go below a B so I'm just stuck on a 5 Still have a couple 4's though, won't put those down ever The point about historical players doesn't really stand too much though IMO, innovation is what has pushed us forwards (and Lee does play 5 string xD) Whatever suits your needs works :)
Good points. I think there's just a lot more history on the 4-string bass, and the adaptations of 5-string instruments haven't fully encapsulated the tradition and idiom that was developed on 4-string. That said, there's certain room for innovators to bring that energy to a 5!
Ok, so imma be honest. This is gonna be a long post. I apologize in advance, but you've touched on some great stuff here, and I wanna address em all. First, I do have to admit that you made very good points, and I agree with the lot of em, but I respectfully disagree with the "limiting" or "crutch" implications (correct me if I'm wrong in how I summed them up). I know you're not ragging on 5 strings; I'm not gonna do you that dirty by misconstruing your point. But I can't completely cosign the limiting and crutch factors. Not fully at least. I get the logic, but I don't think they're big enough to stress over as long as the bassist in question is being true to themselves and doing their jobs. If a player uses the B string as a crutch, I say let em..... within reason. People got the right to do what's most comfortable for them. There are 4 stringers that are scared of 5 strings (like Danny Saepko, i think. The BEHS dude. Very fire.). And vice versa. So it's whatever to me frfr; do what works for you. Next, Thaddeus Tribbett, eh????? WE GOT A FELLOW MAN OF CULTURE IN THA BUILDIN'!!!!!!! LET EM KNOW WHAT TIME IT _IS!!!!_ *Ahem* I mean, I have great respect for the shout-out to Thad. He's the key reason why I know 4 strings in gospel are possible. I wanna do that soon, but I gotta ease myself into it. I play 5 strings at church, because I found out that if you play 4 strings at a gospel setting long enough, you're gonna wish you had the 5th (trust me, those walking church basslines in A flat, and a beefier C sharp and E flat, prove ky point). But if I can get away with 4 strings, I'll try it. I think they're easier to control. To your physicality point, I won't knock your view on it, but I don't think you're losing much if you go the 5 string route. And it's arguable that the benefits outweigh the cost. You don't get that extra pull on your E string, but you get five extra, IMPORTANT notes, with the added versatility to boot (we can do E in universal fingering patterns now, lol). Your tone palette point is an insightful one too, but I'd also argue that we're _probably_ not losing much with that either. Not saying it's not important, but we could work our way through it if need be. I never experimented with drop tuning much. I'm to afraid of it. I have to rewire my brain. And my beloved A flat is pushed out my cash register. 😭😭😭 It's a skill issue on my part, I'll admit, but it's just comfortable for me to work in standard tuning. Now for the most important point I want to _ask_ you about..........teach me more about those subharmonics you were touching on. That caught my eye, and ear. How did you do that?!?????? That was incredible!!!! When I heard a low D from a 4 in standard tuning, I was floored!!!!!! How strong are you in the Force, my man?!?? You a whole sith lord out here in these streetz!!!! But forreal, you got a UA-cam link or guide? Put a homie on game. Lol. But forgive the exaggerations throughout the post. I tend to be an expressive guy. And yet again, many thanks for the video and the inputs. If you made it this far through the post, let me know whatcha think! 😁
Appreciate the expressiveness! 😂 I think nailing the subharmonics is a function of both touch - getting used to playing the two notes at the same time with a pretty consistent, round tone - and partially, a function of the amp (or preamp). When I try it with a clean D.I. signal, it's never quite the same, but played through an amp or a nice tube pre, it always feels enormous. I'll just add one other thing when it comes to drop tunings: my dude Chelton Grey plays 5-string with the entire axe tuned down a whole step (ADGCF 😵💫). And reads in concert pitch! I guess like anything, if you do it enough it becomes a part of you 💪
@@FunkyButter Thanks for the props and the info. And a whole step?!? Everything?!??? My mind would be crushed like I lost a duel with The Pharaoh from Yu-Gi-Oh.
@@CharlesRobitaille514 Jimmy Johnson was the first cat I ever heard “abusing the fifth string”, so to speak - and when I learned he was essentially responsible for the invention of the low B, I was like… “ok… I guess you have a license to do with it what you want 😂”. Dude is an absolute legend and one of the most tasteful (and tasty) players I’ve ever heard.
@@dellebelphine-moralez3510 I think when I last saw him live, he may have played a fretless 5 for one or two songs. But he’s typically known for his 4-string playing
@FunkyButter emulating a guitar when you otherwise cant. i can play along to anyy song without tuning my instrument. my high notes sound better because i dont have to transpose them up to the 24th fret. i can play both bass, and treble parts in tapping at the same time. plus lets face it, being able to go across instead of up is faster to shred with! downsides include learning to mute 6 strings, and really focus on proper playing technique to avoid hurting your wrist cause its a huge board... i really like my 6 string though. big fat sounds! lots of bass heavy bands play 5 and 6 that i listen to as well, so it only makes sense to be able to keep up. i could only afford one instrument, so i got one that does everything.
@@MrRickburns Ehhhh.......well in all fairness, I'd wager he probably can. He foreshadowed it at the end. Lol. And even if he can't, he appears to play a mean 4 string, so he's not completely capping. And he did hit us with some rather insightful takes frfr. I don't necessarily agree with all of em, but I can give him the credit that he's got valid backing behind em. I think both 5 strings and 4 strings are very useful, and neither overshadows the other imo. The key difference is how they're useful: 5 string has everything you need, whereas a 4 string has _all_ you need. But let me tell ya.......when mans hit them _subharmonics_ ............I was like, "WHOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! 😮😮😮😮😮😮" I didn't even know what subharmonics were before this video! 😂 That was a nice touch, no pun intended.
Indeed I don't need a five-string, because I don't need the G-string. So I have BEAD. Instead of downtuning I simply use a capo. Thus I have all the advantages of a fivestring with very few of the disadvantages.
@@bussy6884 You ain't do nothing wrong, playa playa. You bought the thang. Just use it and enjoy it! 😂😂😂😂 Also, don't get too too hung up on the video. He wasn't necessarily knocking 5 strings. He was just challenging whether or not they were necessary. He wasn't saying they were useless; there's a difference. My take on it is this. Many people say that whatever the song requires determines the bass and number of strings you use. I say that's priority number one........but YOUR comfort and enjoyability are priority number ZERO. Your comfort on the instrument, and whether or not it fits with what YOU like and how YOU desire to "speak" musically, takes precedence even over what the music needs. And I say this because if YOU are comfortable, _what you play_ will be comfortable. If you ain't, then it's not likely to be. So honor what the music needs, but honor yourself first. If you want to speak with a 5 string, then do so. If you want to speak with a 4 string, then do so. What you do with this information is two things. First, factor it in to how you make your decision, but don't let it make your decision for you. Make the decision YOU want to make. Second, use it as a reminder to challenge yourself. Nothing wrong with taking the 4 string challenge to see how you manage it. So that's my 20 cents on the matter. Lol. Sorry in advance for the length of the post.
my first bass i bought (rented a 4 string before) is a 5 string and is my main bass right now, very good to have the low B, even if you don't always use it you might find new songs that use this
Response - WHEN you don’t need a 5-string:
ua-cam.com/video/kjWIq-pDpoM/v-deo.htmlsi=2Ckxm2irBC5kwcVH
Every UA-camr who does a video on why you don't need a 5 string always has a 5 string 🤔
@@froorocks1000 I mean, yeah. But in all fairness, it's not necessarily hypocrisy. Lol. And it's not necessarily like they don't have a point. Most of what mans touched on in this video was facts, and whatever wasn't he had some good backing for tbh.
Heck, they might even be saying what they're saying _because_ they've had a 5 stringy. Like when a drummer that has 7 pieces says you don't need more than a 5 piece. Lol.
Granted, you aren't without your validity either. You could very easily go like, "Yo dawg, you got a Yamaha 5 string in your corner, bruh. You thought we weren't gonna cook yo' azz for getting a 5 string for that song you and your band covered by The Warning? 🤣 I'm not saying you a hypocrite, but I AM saying you're your own antithesis on some level." But even still, that don't make what he's saying less valid when you examine it.
need and want are very different but both valid on their own, no? lol 99% of the people that own hypercars don't need them. They outright don't deserve rocking them haha
@@burger1113 I’m interested in the small overlap between people who *need* hypercars and people who *need* a five-string…
UA-camrs with the same tellings, but who did not have 5 strings, are much more suspicious)
Why you dont need a five string bass
1. You don't play bass.
2. You exclusively play retro/vintage music written before 5 string basses existed.
3. You play in a gig where you need a specific bass for visuals, like if your in a tribute band and need the same bass as the player your posing as.
All you new players, ignore people telling you that you need to spend time and money on a four string if your inspiration for picking up the bass is music played on a 5 string. Its easier, and cheaper to start with a five string bass. This is the Way
Furthermore, a good number of the bassists on your list actually did play five string, most notably Leland Sklar, but also Paul McCartney and Chris Squire.
The cons of playing a five string are all overcome by paying attention to your technique and musicality, and there's enough music out there that requires extended range that you ought to be prepared for. D tuning your E string is problematic because the drastic change in string tension affects tone, playability, and intonation.
Extended range bass is the future. A single well set up five string bass and proper technique is all you will ever need, no fuss, no retuning. Just play.
@@christianfoster3806 Ehhh.....so uhhh.....No tea, no shade, I'm with you for a majority of your reasoning, but up to a certain point.
You got very strong supporting data (I myself didn't really support the whole "the greats didn't need a 5 string" argument, because it can go either way, and has as much for it as against it; both sides are heavily valid tho). And your views are very strongly backed; every single view you voiced has great reasoning behind it.
The thing I'm conflicted on is that your view leans towards the _other_ extreme, arguably. I agree with you that 5 strings are very useful, but it's hard for me to cosign that you don't need a 5 string if you _don't play bass_ . 🤣🤣🤣🤣 4 stringy ain't _that_ bad. Lol.
My personal take on 4 strings and 5 strings is that _both_ bass types are very useful and versatile, and will carry you far, because that's exactly what both basses have done. I think they're both equal (I can elaborate on that later if you want; but I'm already yapping up a storm; forgive me).
Both are very great choices to have, just in different ways and for different reasons:
A 5 string bass has everything you need. Whereas a 4 string bass has _all_ you need. 😎👍
EDIT: All that said, I still gave ya the upvote because everything you said was either valid, or backed by valid reasoning. I gotta respect that.
@@Six3rdy Bottom line(no pun intended) a 5 string has 5 more notes than a four string. When you need a tuba, a baritone doesn't cut it.
@@christianfoster3806 First off, great pun. I love puns.
Second, I understand whatcha mean.
And that's..... actually a clever way of putting it tbh. The baritone/tuba thing. I gotta look into that.
I'm just sayin', tho. That other side do be spittin' too. When mans dropped _Thaddeus Tribbett_ as an example, he was a _strong_ example, lemme tell ya! 😂 Thad's calling card is a 4 string, and to piggyback off your analogy, he was using a baritone in a genre where tubas were _strongly_ recommended. Lol.
That said, I do agree with your reasoning here. You could play a baritone like a tuba (figuratively speaking, of course), but you'd rather have the tuba just in case you need it, because you will more often than not.
Hell, I myself would take a tuba to be prepared. I don't have the skill to get away with playing in church on a 4 string yet. Lol. I want to, but I ain't got it in me yet. 😅
Exactly this! I play in a cover band with a repertoire of around 250 popular songs. Most people don't realize how often 5 string basses are used on records, thinking it's just metal thing or modern thing, which is very far from truth.
I’ve seen even Jaco playing a 5 string. Hurry up and google the footage before the purists succeed in burning the few remaining clips
The title should be exactly „WHY I DON’T need a 5string bass”
@@jacobfurman6500 And yet, alas, I have three 🙈😂
@@FunkyButter,
Then you're a hypocrite!
@@arvidlystnur4827 Hmm…what makes you feel that way? There are plenty of times in my professional career that I *don’t* need them, and that playing (or writing for) 5-string would in fact not serve the music. I choose to use them only when I think the music, and the gig, specifically calls for it.
@@FunkyButter ,
Perhaps I was a little too harsh, or wrong, using the term hypocrite.
I realize that you advocate 5 strings in other videos.
It's just that I keep hearing 4 string players suggest those who prefer 5 as elites and old schoolers tell me "ya don't need 5 to play jazz" as if I should get rid of my five and get a 4 string jazz or p bass.
You mentioned great players that play 4 string basses but what about great players that play 5 string.
There are great baroque musicians that play valve less horns and oboes, but they're kind of obsolete in a modern orchestra.
Here's my thing. I'm not a great bass player, I've self diagnosed myself as partially dyslexic.
I played 4string decades ago and switched to 5.
I can't go back to 4. My patterns are all screwed up.
I hear wonderful sounding 4 string basses, yet I would customize them to be five if I owned one.
Also with my mind, I can't stand 19 fret, got to be 24.
To further explain my mindset, I have a Kay Chubby Jackson model five string upright and a five string Mosses, as well as a freted and fretless bass.
What could be more confusing than ignoring the B string if one desires to go retro.
Yes there are many great 4string players, yet I wonder if they'd be better on 5.
Oh well, that's my rant.
@@arvidlystnur4827 Rant away! FWIW, I tend to resist any orthodoxy, so I respect that, and I’m glad you’ve found something that works for you.
I think here’s a good use case of what I mean: I’m playing in the house band of a festival this Sunday. About 60% of the music definitely asks for a modern 5-string J, so that’s what I brought to the first rehearsal. But I found today that - despite having the “notes”, despite having even more options as far as pickup configuration, EQ, preamp, etc - the 5-string really isn’t doing it for the 40% of the music that wants a more lofi or vintage energy. So I’ll be bringing my Mustang to rehearsal tomorrow to complement the 5-string.
I was a 4 string player for almost 20 years and I never really thought about playing a 5 string until I played a gig with a singer who changed a bunch of songs to lower keys, bought a five string for the gig and spent a few weeks getting used to it.. I seriously wish I would have been playing 5 strings my entire life, it immediately opened up so many doors for me that I didn’t realize other than the lower extended range, especially with my left hand for creative note choice.. and when I do use that low B.. it turns heads. Also on certain songs playing past the 5th fret of the B string is great for certain keys not to mention the nice round tone i can get in that register with the thicker gauged string, instant tonal variety if i want it. And yes.. I’ve been turned on to the more modern day 5 string companies.. and these basses are truly the best built basses in the world not to mention the tone, once you play these basses… it’s very hard to go back to playing anything else or vintage style basses. All the theater bassists in my town used them my whole life even with regular gigs and I understand why now, I truly regret not getting one years ago. And it really does fine tune your technique naturally
There's some great uses for 5-string, and to be honest, I've been playing mine a lot lately 👍
I still think one of the most useful applications for a 5-string is when you need to change key at very short notice. Playing a gig and just as the song starts the singer says "can we move it down a whole tone" and then you're going from F to Eb. It's a life-saver.
@@KimSE4 Definitely helpful 👍
Wait until you get a multiscale headless 5 strings or 6 strings, people are always wondering what I'm playing ! 5ers are so practical for cover bands and all
@@xenogear88 yep I have been looking at the multi scale basses, a really good player who used to gig in my town got one many years back, a Spector and that thing sounded amazing and at the time it was a nice clean modern tone. Now there’s many basses like that but I’ve been looking at those. And also.. 6 strings, what do you think about those? I play my five strings for regular gigs with B string for extended low register, but I also play metal in dropped A sharp, tuning up the rest of the strings a half step with with an extended high register G sharp string as the G string. So it’s giving me the higher end range in that tuning like a 6 string would. I’m in a way getting the best of both worlds of a five string and it’s making me wonder about the 6 strings
If you play music in many styles, you'll often need it.
I love 5 strings. Tried going back to 4, didn't like it. 5 is also awesome when you're playing with a singer who is deciding what key to sing in and keeps changing it up
6 Strings bass 🔥
Inthink its relevant and poignant to point out that a Centrury and a half ago, Basses had three strings, and were tuned ADG. Times change, instruments change. Keep up.
@@christianfoster3806 That really puts things in perspective. Lol. You mean we had to upgrade to the low E????
And since then, history repeated itself and we were like, "It's low B time?" 😮
That's wild. I'm learning new shit every day.
New archeological research shows that as recently as 10,000 years ago, electric basses had only a D string and no fingerboard. In fact, all music was in D.
Bb, actually. The drone note on bagpipes!
I have an old bass method book that shows a 3 string, and 4 string bass. I think the point is, the noisier the world becomes, and the better able we are to reproduce low frequencies, the lower we are gonna go...
@@pdxsaintjohn Is that real? When’s it from?
That subharmonic trick (2:00) is amazing, thanks. Also,
thoughtful and compelling arguments aside, I still want a 5-string, and maybe a fretless, and a contrabass.
@@xenophilie Follow your muse! I’ve got a couple 5-strings, including a Sire Fretless 5, and I get great use out of them. I just try to select which axe I bring to the gig based on what the music is calling for.
Most people who play straight-up covers probably don't need a five onstage, except "to look cool." I doubled on bass for many years, then I picked up a "fun" gig at a weekly open jam. First off, with sometimes four (or more!) guitars whanging away, I needed to get some tonal distance from that crowd. Plus, it's annoying how many amateurs do EVERYTHING in E -- well, anyway, half their stuff. Rather than tune down, or buy a detuner and learn how to play DADG, it was simpler for me to buy a half-decent five (Washburn XB-500, $200). After I got some confidence, I wandered back toward a four, but strung BEAD.
McCartney famously played a 5-string Wal MK2. Lee Sklar has a signature 5, Pino has played a 5-string fretless stingray. Chris Squire played a 5 in his later career also.
I love the 4, and wish I could play more of it. But, the 5 has its place, and ultimately, no matter if your preference is a 4, you gotta play 5. That’s why I play a passive 5-string P bass on 85% of my gigs; I’d rather have that than some modern active instrument most of the time.
100% agreed that the 5 has its place. I just see a lot of people using it out of place and missing out on the full possibilities of 4-strings.
And I'm not 100% sure that I'd agree that you "gotta play 5". I've had a 5-string for over 10 years, until about 2 years ago when I started finding more uses for it, I only played 5-string on maybe 2% of my gigs, including gospel, merengue, hard rock and styles that typically 'lean towards' 5-string.
if we're going down this rabbit hole, then let's commit: we don't need bass players period. Seriously, just tell your keyboard player to use his left hand, or get a submarine pickup.
@@riogrande163 Hahah fair point!
Thanks for the tips bro imma buy me a fiver now!
I exclusively play 5 strings but totally get what you mean by the physically of having the E string as the lowest
I've even gone as far as fitting one of my 5 strings with a high C rather than a low B (EADGC)
Completely changes how you feel about 5 strings really. You get the benefit of using a 6 string without the crazy thick necks 😂 It feels much closer to a 4 string for me, just can't seem to warrant getting something that only has 4 strings, but retro sounds aren't really my bag
@@SimpleJarman I dig it! What do you find yourself using the high C for?
@@FunkyButter I have done the same thing myself...to replicate the 6 strings tuning ...
I fell for this old news and first bought a 4-string. When I bought a 5-string it seemed like a silly waste of money to have limited myself with a 4-string based on these old ideas. I hate that these videos are holding others back as well. #1. There are plenty of options if you look. #2. Why "trick" listeners into maybe thinking they hear a lower note when you can actually play the lower note. You don't "deal" with the 5-string, you get extra options. 3. 5 string has much better access to low notes than having to use drop tuners. 4. Not at all. 5. It's like saying the most influential keyboard players were classical pianists, so you don't need a keyboard you need a piano.
Appreciate your thoughts! And if a 5-string is working for you and the kinds of music you play, by all means, more power to you. I wind up playing a lot of 5-string - *when* the music calls for it. But I went into a detail in this response video about how, in a professional context, 4-string bass is often a better choice for the context (and more likely to get me hired, depending on what the artist/producer wants!) On a festival gig this past weekend, I wound up bringing a 4-string and a 5-string, and making extensive use of subharmonics and my detuner - because that's what was right for some of the music. Similarly, I just sent in some files for a remote recording session recorded on one of my 5-strings, but it turns out that what the producer really wanted was my '66 Precision. So I would be disappointed if these sorts of ideas "hold people back", when, in fact, they have largely driven my success in my career and my employability as a creative musician.
ua-cam.com/video/kjWIq-pDpoM/v-deo.html
A) You can alwats restring a 4 string with a .140" B and tune it B E A D.
B) To get the sub harmonic attack the string at its mid point; open string play at the 12th fret, the 5th fret harmonic play at the 17th fret.
OMG the Vox! While I have a dingwall combustion that has enough for what I do, I could never pull a tone like that outta the dingwall. Great tips man!
@@omegacanon Thanks! What’s the Dingwall?? I’m unfamiliar
@@FunkyButter Possibly on par with Warwick for best heavy 5 string bass.
If like me, you want the extra low notes a B string brings, but don't like having to deal with the wider board and extra string, I recommend stringing your 4-string B E A D. That's what I do and it works a treat. I never liked playing too high anyway and never used the top five notes.
My brother in law strings his EB3 like that and it sounds unique., and good, Flatwounds.
This is not why you don’t need a 5-string: this is why you should not limit yourself to having just 5-strings, and how to best use a 5-string.
Also some of your people who “exclusively” use 4-strings use 5-strings, too.
Agreed! Perhaps a better title would have been "Why you [don't always] need a 5-string (and how to get the most out of your 4-string"
Great video man :) Awesome Edit too :) I honestly do play a tonne of 5 string these days, but yes you certainly don’t want to abuse that low B string!!! Great Video again… Subscribed
Thanks for the kind words! To be honest, I've been playing with a project that requires a lot of 5-string as well - but I try to be careful in choosing my weapon based on the gig at hand 💪
I've played 5-string for years in standard tuning (B-E-A-D-G), just switched to a custom string set to drop the whole thing another 4th - F#, B, E, A, D. I used to use the G-string for pops and harmonics, but then I decided I'd rather be uncontested (and move my hand less) in the lowest possible registers. Very happy with it, btw, shout out to stringjoy!
Wow! What kind of music are you playing with the low F#? Are you playing with (against 😅) 8-string guitarists?
Many modern metal nowadays use really lower tunings@@FunkyButter
1:45 mind blown brother.
Holy Crap! This is a cool technique! 😳🤯
All this did for me is reinforce why I have a 5 string and a vintage 4. This video should have been called why you need another bass.
a day after i got my first 5-string, this vid shows up in my feed 😂
Oof! 🙈 No shade, there's lots of great reasons for having a 5-string - I just think it's most effective when players make concrete choices with how the use it ;)
If you didn’t need a 5 string bass I don’t think there would be so many hundreds of great bass players 5 or 6 or 7 string basses if you are inspired by extended range bass players and you want to play them you should just play it regardless of what someone may say there’s tons of genres that use extended range basses along with many many many extended range basses that are great to play and find like he was saying you can’t find a semi hallow 5 string you absolutely can Ibanez made them Gibson made them gretch makes them epiphone made them not to mention all the basses he played in the start of the video sound the exact same because they were made for the exact same purpose the only reason they even slightly sounded different was because of the strings and the pick he played with on the hofner at the end of the day wether you play a 4 or a 8 or 9 whatever bass you play it’s still a bass regardless of tuning regardless if you play chords or root notes regardless if you slap or play with a pick figure out what you want to play figure out your voice on the instrument and embrace it no one should be able to tell you what you need or don’t need ever when it comes to music and that’s for every instrument on earth
So true! You don't need 5 strings.... You need 7!!!!! 😌😎🤣
Eegads, I wish my wrists could handle 7!
I don't need lot of different types of basses and if I do I'll get them. Most of the reason 5 string basses have a modern tone is because of the need to make the B string come to life. And if you have a decent 5 it can be versatile.
So interesting about the prefect 5ths tricking the brain, but I'm not sure that's as versatile a way of getting the low notes because your fingers will not always be in a position to do that,
Agree to an extent about the weaker E string but that's mainly with decending slides in my experience.
@@joannalewis5279 You got some valid takes here. I respect em.
And I didn't know about the modern tone being a thing for a reason, and one of those reasons being the B string. Hell, I don't even know the difference between modern and vintage tones. Lol. I don't know much of anything about tone. I just play em and feel my way around with my ear and the research I've done. I can tell tones apart when it's obvious, but I need someone to tell me the differences between vintage and modern and other shit.
And thanks for reading my loooong post from before as well.
That's an excellent point about the need to liven up the low B incentivizing active basses and the 'modern' sound. To build on that further, recent makers like Serek have been bringing more of a vintage vibe to 5-strings, including developing some solid fives with 30-32" scale length.
@@Six3rdy you're so welcome keep playing my friend
@@FunkyButter very true and I know someone with a 32 inch scale 6 string Fodera and that can sound grey different to a typical extended range.
Great videos
This channel is going to be huge! Just wanted to be the first to say it 😅 Great video, and I didn't know drop tuners existed. The subharmonic trick is a nice one as well, always wondered how that happens, until I saw a Veritasium video on it recently.
Thanks! Would love to see the Veritasium video - do you remember what it's called?
Great video. Was astonished at how few subscribers you have, this is an extremely well made video. Subscribed.
Thanks for the kind words, glad you're diggin it! More to come…
Respect to my fellow 4 string bass players! coming from a 5 string bass player that mostly plays gospel and r&b ✌️✌️
@@jaredvargas7490 🙌🙌
5-string is the modern standard. 5-string basses often come in 35" scale or fan-fret variety, and you won't find many 4-strings in those styles
@@zumba.c That’s true. There’s also a lot of music that doesn’t demand a “modern” sound or approach, including contemporary music. That’s not to say that it’s not creative to mix and subvert those sorts of expectations, but when I show up to a gig, it’s important that I bring the right tools to fulfill the artist’s vision - and, often (though of course not always!) - that’s not a 5-string.
I love my 6 string basses!I agree you don't need a 5 string!
What do you find 6-strings most helpful/effective for? I'm open to being persuaded!
@@FunkyButter That low end. I got 4 string basses,Standard,fretless, had a 5 string,
not bad.
I play 7 and 8 string guitar too, they go hand and hand.
I have a esp 6 string bass and it just sounds stellar, heavy as hell.
scales, modes,ect just flow better to me.
I Play tighter on six string basses!
@@MyBichSustained Nice! What do you think helps you play tighter on 6-string basses?
@@FunkyButter The neck!Wider necks are more comfortable on bass for me.
Also depends on what I am trying to accomplish.6 String are stellar for death metal style bass with more real-estate to travel.I love to stay moving on instruments.
I constantly use three fingers on fast parts, less stress on hand for me.
I don't slap or play the funk style which I have tried and for me is better suited for 4 string if I want pursue it...I hope I do one day!
Options are awesome,having those difference at arms length are priceless!
@@MyBichSustained Wow! I find wide necks put much more strain on my left wrist. How often do you find yourself using the C string in death metal?
I understood I didn't need a 5 when I noted I had to choose when using low notes, that made me think that I was already good at doing that on a 4 string, others were the things I had to improve, not using low notes more often.
I've had both. Now just use a 4 string tuned to D standard. D, G, C, F. My Fender Precision Mod Shop sounds much better in this tuning. Punch is still there but notes are more full. When I need lower than a D I use Foxrox Octave pedal which can be set to sound very natural and not at all synth like.
Love this! I associate that tuning with Nashville, maybe…? Unfamiliar with that octave pedal but I'll check it out!
@@FunkyButter I use the Foxrox Octron 3. Gives you 3 notes - the note you're playing, one octave below and one octave above. You can set volumes separately for each. Due to how physics work, the octave above will be slightly distorted and I've used this pedal just for distortion at times. In my example from my first comment - I'm using just the octave below and that creates natural sounding notes below my low D. If you crank up all 3 notes, you get that classic Led Zepplin bass and distorted guitar playing a riff in unison sound.
@@ghosttownreview1531 How is the tracking - any latency?
@@FunkyButter no latency but you have to play your one note very cleanly. Any hint of another string ringing and it won’t work. It made me become a very precise player!
Ok, got it I’ll get a 6 string instead
@@risaadthemerchant5142 😂💯
Don't care. Just wanna play the fat B string
1. Not everyone wants to sound like a cardboard box strung with rubber bands.
2. Subharmonics as described in this video require a compressor and special amp settings, whereas low notes on an extended range bass can simply be played.
3. Detuners only go down to D (or C at best), whereas a 5 string goes down to B with no need to transpose.
4. This "physicality" he mentions is just a matter of technique and proper setup.
5. This was only true until 5-strings became normalized, and his examples are cherry-picked.
@@palsyddad So, do you bring 5-string basses to vintage-y, rootsy or singer-songwriter gigs? To Motown gigs? How do the artists respond?
Is that a bouzouki in the background? Sensational
Good eye! I’m a nerd for rembetika, and sometimes tour with Evangelia
@@FunkyButter that's awesome, much respect
Enjoyed the video mate, definitely watching the next one, I love my 4 and 5 strings for different reasons. I would love to add the existence of High C 5 string players and the Low B 4 string players to the mix.
@@trebm Thank, and agreed! I met a dude who tuned his 4-string Stingray CGDA in fifths, an octave below cello 👀
I have a Ibanez Mikro 5 string bass, it's honestly fun as fuck and weird it's still a short scale.
Nice, what's the scale-length?
I just started using my 5 string... until my 4 string action is fixed and i like it
What kind of 5-string do you play? Certain music really calls for it!
Excellent vid mate. Easiest subscribe button click in a while lol. Didn't know about subharmonics being usable how you describe them. Feel like I've just had my eyes opened!
@@abcbcd1834 Glad you find it helpful! Thanks for diggin it!
If you’re writing original songs you won’t need a five string bass if you playing songs that were written in the 70s or earlier.
As long as I have a decent compressor I prefer the 5 since these metal players think lower is heavier...and invade my frequency range
I've thought about getting a 5 string bass, but i realize that all the basslines that i enjoy listening to utilize the higher audible portion of the fretboard rather than low rumbly portions :) 4 strings also just have mojo. Diff strokes for diff folks
Plus, if i want a low B, i can always string up BEAD, type O style ;)
Reggie Parker, legendary gospel player (Hezekiah Walker, James Hall, etc!), is a gospel four-stringer. Also, Shae Wooten, Elevation Worship.
@@thescatman5029 I wasn’t hip, I’ll be checking them both out - thanks for the tip!
5 strings are better than 4 strings, in my opinion. Especially when playing live shows and when they change the key to a much lower one, the 5 string helps a lot.
Definitely helpful!
i completely the fuck agree. messed around with 5 strings for 3 years and it was just a quarter extra bass practice for not a lot of extra bass. plus, the things are heavy, fretboard like the deck of an aircraft carrier and what for me is the deal-breaker; an extra string to damp. like, damping is this stupid tax you have to pay for permission to sound your note; why pay more?
further stuff:
a] i got a 4 string 2 octave bass. thats 96 notes. i need 101?
b] i dont like the notes below low E. spent 6 months making mistakes on the stupid things cos i couldnt tell them apart cos they were too low and i cant tell them apart the audience sure as shit cant tell them apart. theres a reason low E is low E.
c] as for a C string, i wander into that territory so rarely it aint worth having. thinking of getting myself a 20-fret bass for less bass practice
c] the only real advantage a 5 string offers you is access to 2 octaves in the one hand position. the hell, youre supposed to be able to move about the fretboard anyway, its a bass skill and you can always look at the damn thing
c] 4 string works for my brain. there's something about 4 strings which somehow gels with music theory in my mind. it's supposed to work, god says it works, dont rebel
"The damping tax", I love it 😂😂😂😂
why i got a 5 string, i like it. It was definitely an adjustment though, muting etc, its nice that for MOST songs i play in the band im in i dont have to downtune. however some lines just make more sense in Eb or Drop D. If there was a 4 string that felt as amazing to play as my favorite 5 though, id probably play 4 strings just as much. I love bass discussion and seeing peoples opinions and im stoked to see why you like 5 strings, maybe ill pick something up from it. 👀
@@Blakeadam52 It was the versatility for me. And the lower notes. And I also play in church too, specifically a gospel setting. A 4 string _can_ be used in gospel, and you're not committing a sin if you use one........but a 5 string at bare minimum is _highly_ recommended. Because if you play with a 4 string in a gospel setting long enough, you're gonna wish you had the fifth. Lol.
@@Six3rdy i dont play gospel, but i dont think ive ever seen a gospel player use a 4 string. Lol and i figured there was a reason 😂😂 my church is more contemporary music, so i can play 4 or 5 depending on what im feeling. Gospel players are just built different though. Unbelievable players usually
@@Blakeadam52 Oh yeah. And I hope to be one of em one day. Lol. (I'm in training at the church. I'm pulling my weight, and people like my playing. Now I gotta refine the gospel sauce, ya know?)
Now don't get me wrong. You CAN pull of gospel on a 4 string. The video referenced Thaddeus Tribbett, who's a friggin' monster on a 4 string. He's the key reason why I know gospel on a 4 string is possible.
I might be (pardon my nonchurchly French) ballsy enough to try it out! I wanna see how I can manage it. But the 5 string is the safest bet.
EDIT: That's awesome that you got that option to bring what you're feeling. I gotta add more basses to my arsenal, and I wanna bring my 4 string in, but I wanna swap out the pickups and pots. I need a brighter sound from it. It can do warm well, but now I need the bright for slap.
Love this discussion. I'll be the first to admit there's nothing like a low Db on a 5-string for gospel music!
Your notes are only as limited as your knowledge and imagination. You could stick to roots and 5ths and maybe even 3rds, but you don't have to. There are no wrong notes. It's how you use them that matters. I'm just trying to sound like me most of the time. I'm not looking to sound like someone else. You have so many ways to change the tone of your bass just by how and where you play it. I don't need 5 string but I definitely prefer it over the 4 string. It makes some things I do on a regular basis easier without constantly switching out basses or tuning/detuning my basses or without moving pretty far on the fretboard quickly. Plus, I like being able to shake every door in the house with just a single note. It is very satisfying in a way that I can't use words to describe.
You don't need a specific bass to have the same/similar tone as someone else. A single bass has so many tones and emotions that it can play. You just have to figure out how to make it happen if that is what you want. Sounding like someone else is easy. Sounding like yourself is far more challenging for a lot of people. Finding their sound/voice but what they don't know is, it was always there from the beginning. Some people just lose it during the learning process, so they have to try to find it all over again. It's a lot harder the second time around. There is no cookie cutter way to get there for every bass player. There are some things theory can teach you but there is a lot that theory can never teach you. There are also things that theory can unteach you if you aren't careful that you might want later on.
To make a long story short. Sound is just wiggly air in the end so make the air wiggle as you. Not them. You're the one playing. They had their time. It's good to have knowledge from them but generally you shouldn't aim to become them unless you are in a tribute band. Be yourself and feel what you have to say and let the bass speak through your playing. All depends on your goals with bass too.
@@rainbowdarth Strongly agree with just about everything you’ve said! The only thing I’d add is this: when I was first getting started as a professional side musicians, I felt like I needed to “assert” my personality in order to feel like I was being myself. In time, I found that *everything* I play feels like my voice, and that no assertion is needed: there are many facets of my personality and my voice that come out on any instrument I pick up. But carefully choosing the paintbrushes we use can both give us a broader palette, and make us more appealing to those who hire us to fulfill their artistic vision.
Ask to Paul Turner what he thinks about 5 sting bass.
Well said and consice
@@elchucabagra thanks!
I've only ever needed 4 strings, all my favourite bass players only used 4 strings
Jaco
Stanley Clarke
James Jamerson
Chris Squire
John Paul Jones
Ralph Armstrong
Leland sklar
Steve Harris etc
Sklar uses a 5 🤣
@@hyperplayability6290 fair, but a lot of his classic work was on 4! ;)
@@FunkyButter yeah xD
his frankenstein bass which he recorded spectrum & early sessions was a 4 string but later he used a 5 but my favourite recordings & ones that influenced me were done on the 4 string@@hyperplayability6290
this video is literally reasons to get a 5 string 😂 if you’re considering it you’re prob not worried about missing out on the hofner tone 😂
@@skuhdoop1411 I find that some writers - particularly for theater - see the extra range and don’t realize they’re limiting their options in other ways. I think some beginning bassists also aren’t totally hip to the full spectrum of tone. But for sure, if someone’s considering a 5, they’re probably listening to music that merits it
Here’s one:
5 string basses are ugly and visually unbalanced.
I used to work as a house engineer at a record company studio and in the 80s, when these things first started to be trendy, we had a sign that had a photocopy of a 5 string magazine ad with a cross through the low B string and the words-
If you want to be a synth player, get a synth.
Now, it was tongue in cheek and of course we recorded 5 string bassists. But if I’m going to work with a band and the bassist turns up with a 5 string I get concerned. Good players will be fine but the more is always better crowd are a problem. With few exceptions, the essence of great bass is simplicity and adding more bits to a normal bass makes it tempting to widdle widdle or try to come to the front too much. And this is coming from someone who came up when basses were first moving into the spotlight. Cf Joy Division, Killing Joke etc.
Rock music tends to put the kick drum as the lowest instrument. Some more modern forms swap this around, metal (those clicking sounds they call a kick drum!) and any RnB that uses bass at all often have the electric bass making the most noise between 30 and 50 Hz but if you’re doing something that calls on the sound of the golden era (66-96) you’re gonna want to be careful about the kick and bass stepping on each other and usually choose to have the bass sitting in a pocket a whisker higher than the kick.
And a string that goes a 5th below 41.2Hz down to about 31Hz is gonna make that hard if the bassist isn’t really careful.
These are EXCELLENT observations - thank you for sharing!
The marketing thing about 'get a synth' is kind of hilarious. Especially because - regardless of the number of strings - so much synth vocabulary has been incorporated into the electric bass canon. (I was particularly inspired by Meshell's playing on 'Cookie: The Anthrolpological Mixtape) when I was first getting started as a bassist.
You don't "need" to play bass!
Pretty nifty video :)
A lot of the repertoire that I play does require me to go below a B so I'm just stuck on a 5
Still have a couple 4's though, won't put those down ever
The point about historical players doesn't really stand too much though IMO, innovation is what has pushed us forwards (and Lee does play 5 string xD)
Whatever suits your needs works :)
Good points. I think there's just a lot more history on the 4-string bass, and the adaptations of 5-string instruments haven't fully encapsulated the tradition and idiom that was developed on 4-string. That said, there's certain room for innovators to bring that energy to a 5!
The low B is like a gun it is better to have it and not need it rather than need it and not have it🥴
Ok, so imma be honest. This is gonna be a long post. I apologize in advance, but you've touched on some great stuff here, and I wanna address em all.
First, I do have to admit that you made very good points, and I agree with the lot of em, but I respectfully disagree with the "limiting" or "crutch" implications (correct me if I'm wrong in how I summed them up). I know you're not ragging on 5 strings; I'm not gonna do you that dirty by misconstruing your point. But I can't completely cosign the limiting and crutch factors. Not fully at least. I get the logic, but I don't think they're big enough to stress over as long as the bassist in question is being true to themselves and doing their jobs. If a player uses the B string as a crutch, I say let em..... within reason. People got the right to do what's most comfortable for them. There are 4 stringers that are scared of 5 strings (like Danny Saepko, i think. The BEHS dude. Very fire.). And vice versa. So it's whatever to me frfr; do what works for you.
Next, Thaddeus Tribbett, eh????? WE GOT A FELLOW MAN OF CULTURE IN THA BUILDIN'!!!!!!! LET EM KNOW WHAT TIME IT _IS!!!!_
*Ahem* I mean, I have great respect for the shout-out to Thad. He's the key reason why I know 4 strings in gospel are possible. I wanna do that soon, but I gotta ease myself into it. I play 5 strings at church, because I found out that if you play 4 strings at a gospel setting long enough, you're gonna wish you had the 5th (trust me, those walking church basslines in A flat, and a beefier C sharp and E flat, prove ky point). But if I can get away with 4 strings, I'll try it. I think they're easier to control.
To your physicality point, I won't knock your view on it, but I don't think you're losing much if you go the 5 string route. And it's arguable that the benefits outweigh the cost. You don't get that extra pull on your E string, but you get five extra, IMPORTANT notes, with the added versatility to boot (we can do E in universal fingering patterns now, lol).
Your tone palette point is an insightful one too, but I'd also argue that we're _probably_ not losing much with that either. Not saying it's not important, but we could work our way through it if need be.
I never experimented with drop tuning much. I'm to afraid of it. I have to rewire my brain. And my beloved A flat is pushed out my cash register. 😭😭😭 It's a skill issue on my part, I'll admit, but it's just comfortable for me to work in standard tuning.
Now for the most important point I want to _ask_ you about..........teach me more about those subharmonics you were touching on. That caught my eye, and ear. How did you do that?!?????? That was incredible!!!! When I heard a low D from a 4 in standard tuning, I was floored!!!!!! How strong are you in the Force, my man?!?? You a whole sith lord out here in these streetz!!!!
But forreal, you got a UA-cam link or guide? Put a homie on game. Lol.
But forgive the exaggerations throughout the post. I tend to be an expressive guy. And yet again, many thanks for the video and the inputs.
If you made it this far through the post, let me know whatcha think! 😁
@@Six3rdy I read it all just so you know
@@joannalewis5279 Much obliged. 🙏🏾
Appreciate the expressiveness! 😂
I think nailing the subharmonics is a function of both touch - getting used to playing the two notes at the same time with a pretty consistent, round tone - and partially, a function of the amp (or preamp). When I try it with a clean D.I. signal, it's never quite the same, but played through an amp or a nice tube pre, it always feels enormous.
I'll just add one other thing when it comes to drop tunings: my dude Chelton Grey plays 5-string with the entire axe tuned down a whole step (ADGCF 😵💫). And reads in concert pitch! I guess like anything, if you do it enough it becomes a part of you 💪
@@FunkyButter Thanks for the props and the info.
And a whole step?!? Everything?!??? My mind would be crushed like I lost a duel with The Pharaoh from Yu-Gi-Oh.
Jimmy Johnson, Anthony Jackson, Gary Willis, Hadrien Feraud, Jimmy Haslip,(etc..).....5 reasons for 5 strings....
@@CharlesRobitaille514 Jimmy Johnson was the first cat I ever heard “abusing the fifth string”, so to speak - and when I learned he was essentially responsible for the invention of the low B, I was like… “ok… I guess you have a license to do with it what you want 😂”. Dude is an absolute legend and one of the most tasteful (and tasty) players I’ve ever heard.
James Jamerson didn't need one and that's good enough for me.
@@kenbash2951 James Jameson barely needed a second finger on his right hand! 🤯
@@FunkyButter Amen
i do
I've only one reason to not play a 5 string, I've got a 6 string and a 4 string, so 5 seems redundant.
@@jeffgutierrez8796 What do you find the six-string most useful for?
It's looking me less strying to mute than the 6 string with the same low end.
1:55!
Clickbait AF
Doesn’t Marcus Miller have/used a 5-string?
@@dellebelphine-moralez3510 I think when I last saw him live, he may have played a fretless 5 for one or two songs. But he’s typically known for his 4-string playing
too late
@@cheesehandles 😅
I have 6 string im safe
If you want to work harder play 4 exclusively. If you want to work smarter, have a 5
For what it's worth, I've found that working harder during earlier phases of my development helped me to work smarter, better, now 🤷♂️
you need a 6 string bass.
@@Asthmos convince me, I’ll all ears! What is the high C useful for?
@FunkyButter emulating a guitar when you otherwise cant. i can play along to anyy song without tuning my instrument. my high notes sound better because i dont have to transpose them up to the 24th fret. i can play both bass, and treble parts in tapping at the same time. plus lets face it, being able to go across instead of up is faster to shred with! downsides include learning to mute 6 strings, and really focus on proper playing technique to avoid hurting your wrist cause its a huge board... i really like my 6 string though. big fat sounds! lots of bass heavy bands play 5 and 6 that i listen to as well, so it only makes sense to be able to keep up. i could only afford one instrument, so i got one that does everything.
.... sigh
Huh??? You don’t need a 5-string, but you need a D-tuner??? This dude can’t play a 5. Ha!
@@MrRickburns Ehhhh.......well in all fairness, I'd wager he probably can. He foreshadowed it at the end. Lol. And even if he can't, he appears to play a mean 4 string, so he's not completely capping.
And he did hit us with some rather insightful takes frfr. I don't necessarily agree with all of em, but I can give him the credit that he's got valid backing behind em.
I think both 5 strings and 4 strings are very useful, and neither overshadows the other imo. The key difference is how they're useful: 5 string has everything you need, whereas a 4 string has _all_ you need.
But let me tell ya.......when mans hit them _subharmonics_ ............I was like, "WHOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! 😮😮😮😮😮😮" I didn't even know what subharmonics were before this video! 😂
That was a nice touch, no pun intended.
Indeed I don't need a five-string, because I don't need the G-string. So I have BEAD. Instead of downtuning I simply use a capo. Thus I have all the advantages of a fivestring with very few of the disadvantages.
Bunch of nonsense.
I guess I fucking suck because I can't play a fucking 4 string bass ...!!!
@@joseortega584 🙈
????????????????????????????
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i literally just bought a 5 string bass today... what do I do with this 🧍♀
@@bussy6884 You ain't do nothing wrong, playa playa. You bought the thang. Just use it and enjoy it! 😂😂😂😂
Also, don't get too too hung up on the video. He wasn't necessarily knocking 5 strings. He was just challenging whether or not they were necessary. He wasn't saying they were useless; there's a difference.
My take on it is this. Many people say that whatever the song requires determines the bass and number of strings you use. I say that's priority number one........but YOUR comfort and enjoyability are priority number ZERO. Your comfort on the instrument, and whether or not it fits with what YOU like and how YOU desire to "speak" musically, takes precedence even over what the music needs. And I say this because if YOU are comfortable, _what you play_ will be comfortable. If you ain't, then it's not likely to be.
So honor what the music needs, but honor yourself first. If you want to speak with a 5 string, then do so. If you want to speak with a 4 string, then do so.
What you do with this information is two things. First, factor it in to how you make your decision, but don't let it make your decision for you. Make the decision YOU want to make. Second, use it as a reminder to challenge yourself. Nothing wrong with taking the 4 string challenge to see how you manage it.
So that's my 20 cents on the matter. Lol. Sorry in advance for the length of the post.
my first bass i bought (rented a 4 string before) is a 5 string and is my main bass right now, very good to have the low B, even if you don't always use it you might find new songs that use this
@@jeffayoe7468 how about using high c instead
@LEOSoulMonarch preach!
And @bussy6884 -congrats on your new axe!
@@FunkyButter Much obliged. 🙏🏾
If you’re writing original songs you won’t need a five string bass if you playing songs that were written in the 70s or earlier.