Xanathar's has a list of suggested beasts the druid has probably seen, based on the terrain they are from. I find that list very handy for determining the beasts.
What if I have the far traveler background and my backstory is all about me travel to and from many distant lands. Do I get the recommended forms for all of those terrains?
@@booleanillogical4757 Ask your DM. I'd probably give you all the CR 0-1/2 forms from those biomes since they are more commonly encountered, but you'd have to roll for CR 1+ forms since you haven't spent the time to really get to know the land.
I love how 12th level druid wild shaping into an owl can't cast spells at all, including ones granted by an item but a familiar owl holding a dagger can use Ring of Spellstoring to cast Steel Wind Strike.
@@davidioanhedges I fail to see which part of that has anything to do with casting spells through magic items. If you insist on having the example limited to just beasts you can dominate or charm a random owl and tell it to use its action to cast the spell stored in the ring.
@@IsshTM It specifically says when wildshaped you *cannot* cast spells, you just can't - even via magic items - no reason given - specific beats general A familiar is not a beast .. it's not wildshaped - so if it says it can, it can ...
Wild shape is in the uncomfortable "how does this work?" valley connecting the castles of magic where players tacitally agree to handwave everything and the slums of martial classes where someone at the table is an expert on brigantine armor and why studded leather is a myth, so all actions must make sense in the physics of our universe or some other such hullabaloo. Don't believe me? Next game, bring a picture of your Druid with a metal-banded circular shield and watch that one guy's head explode. :)
I could see a druid having a dream trance with the spirit of a beast and gaining the ability to assume its form. But that seems like an opportunity to roleplay instead of handwaving it.
If that worked then I could make up my own beast to change into just cause. (I've had dreams of weird animals before, flies bigger than my body, cats with snake heads, etc,)
Polymorph spell helps with "seen before" part, turn you party member into animal you need during a rest, done. And you get it at level 7, just before flying forms.
@@TimeOfSin Why does one require that any the other doesn't? That's just inconsistent. Doesn't make a whole Lotta sense hoe you can change someone's form into something you've never seen before like a Githyanki
in addition the Druid wild shape CR's usually have a prof. bonus of +2, with the exeption of the moon druids Elemental form, and their animal form past lvl 14!!
I was surprised this came up at all, but I would always use player proficiency bonus, never the beast. They retain all of their mental stats anyways, it should be significantly different than polymorph. Also using information not available to the player to calculate player modifiers does not make sense to me.
The rules you were missing for the Brown Bear proficiency bonus are on page 8 of the Monster Manual. Specifically the table "Proficiency Bonus by Challenge Rating". They list the proficiency bonus for a CR 1 creature as +2.
Fringe case, but I think the "revert to normal form at zero hit points" specification is important for things like zealot barb, who stays up even after hitting zero. So, if you didn't have that somewhat redundant line, you could argue that a zealot bar-bear-ian could maintain wild shape past zero hp because hitting that threshold wouldn't render you (in that form) unconscious, thus not ending the effect. I feel like this would be a bit of a hard sell to make, but that added line makes sure both cases are covered, should one happen without the other…
@@the_algorithm you… should? Probably. Since the relentless endurance feature says "when you are reduced to 0 hit points but not killed outright, you can drop to 1 hit point instead." At no point does that reference a specific biological feature, so it fits under the fleet argument…
concentration on spells is probably the most common case where that one comes up, since going unconscious even briefly would break it if the transformation at zero didn't occur to trigger the "aren't knocked unconscious" clause
Dhampir's Vampiric bite is one of my favorite examples here. Does the "Fanged" bite imply anatomy? Well what if i transform into a giant bat or another creature that has fangs?
Imagine Treantmonk doing character build videos in a system like Pathfinder 2e where you actually have important choices to make past 3rd level! Big hype.
In defense of the Dragonborn's breath weapon, that's at least partly due to their magical heritage, and breath weapons CAN be used by creatures that don't innately have them provided magic is at play, and according to Crawford can even be used by creatures that ordinarily can't attack. So if you want to dust off Xanathar'sGuide and use the Dragon's Breath spell as a reference, then enjoy the power of the lightning-breathing squirrel in your group. ...Note to Self: Make a Dragonborn Druid with the name Thunder-Squirrel...
Fizban's gem dragonborns are the best race for moon druid: 30ft telepathy, great breath weapon damage types and concentration-free wings-free flight with hover at level 5.
A wizard in my group makes daily use of Twinspelling Dragons Breath on two rats they control, creating huge areas of damage every turn that use hardly any of their own action economy. It’s quite something
@@joelsasmad I don't think that's weirder than the fact that sometimes monsters cast spells that can be counter spelled/dispelled and sometimes monsters use abilities that are identical to spells and can't be counter spelled/dispelled.
I think the designers made a mistake referencing actual beast stat blocks. If they'd used a generic template instead, as they've done for many summoned creatures in recent releases, and left the narrative descriptions up to the player, then getting rid of ambiguity would be much easier. You'd get X, y, or z options that grant clearly defined benefits. Some would scale naturally as you level. Others would only improve with class or subclass features. No muss, no fuss.
They could let you just grab some powers (according to level) like darkvision, water breathing, other speeds, natural attacks, and so on. Then have those on top of your normal characteristics maybe with some bonus (or maybe making specific stats some powers, like having a strenght of 16 being one option) and just going with that.
Druid versatility would drop significantly though. I had a whole document on which forms had blindsight, multiattack, different damage types, resistances, climb/fly/swim speeds, proficiencies, AC/HP, etc (my character had access to mage armor, so I also included moster dex bonus)
It's all quite simple: Wild Shape was designed only thinking about the concept that should be achieved, and nobody thought of all the implications the rules have. Over the years, more and more problems became obvious which would have been clear from the start if you thought about it, but now it's already in general use
Plasmoids make a fun wild shape druid. they can use Amorphous RAW without any issues at all. And a huge sized snake being able to go through a tiny crack is hilarious. And it makes sense thematically because your a shapeshifting ooze.
Fleet of Foot I would rule that the racial ability makes the wood elf 5' faster than a regular elf's 30' movement. They are slightly faster than normal - this is the actual trait "Your base walking speed increases to 35 feet" could just as easily have been written you have +5' to an elf's base movement speed. I would apply the same to the wild shape so a snail with a move of 5' would become a faster snail with a move of 10'. I would even allow this to apply to a horse even though they have a 60' move the fleet of foot is a racial feat that makes you slightly faster than normal so the wild shaped horse would have a speed of 65'. Tritons, Merman etc need gills to breathe under water, the wild shape must have gills to breath under water I wouldn't care that the race does not specify that the breathe under water is because of gills it just makes sense.
@@TreantmonksTemple I still think that mental stats bleed over, physical and senses don't ... What mental ability means you can move faster as a snail?
That's how I would write the rule. As soon as treant mentioned keeping the abilities of your race I immediately thought of woodelf because of how its worded
@@davidioanhedges "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so." Moving faster is a feature of the wood elf race so the wild shape creature gains the same benefit as long as they are physically capable. So as long as a creature has a movement speed it can use this racial feature.
These in depth analysis of specific wording is a crazy exercise in willfully taking the wording and making it confusing. It blows my mind to hear some of these interpretations that no one (or hardly anyone) would ever think it ment
Page 8 of the Monster Manual has a chart for Proficiency Bonus by Challenge rating. It's another page to flip to, but it is there (in my copy at least).
Hurray for Tasha's optional rules and subclasses! It has always boggled my mind that Druids, which are all nature themed, didn't have a reliable way to have little pets and friends to do stuff with. Find Familiar just feels right to have as a Druid. Also as someone who has played a Wildfire Druid, I can count on one hand the amount of times I've actually used wildshape to turn into an animal even at level 12. Tracking down stats and looking at the rules for it are nine kinds of confusing - so much more simple to summon your Wildfire Spirit and be done with it.
Yeah ik that's all detailed in the spell but its not a big deal to say "Hey this is an owl that's my friend I found in the forest" instead of "This is some weird celestial creature shaped into an animal". 🙄
@@davidioanhedges wich leads to another bit of contradiction, since you can change the shape of your familiar but the beeing stays the same shouldn´t mental stats be staying the same?
On the proficiency bonuses, one that always confused me was, "how is the DC of the Elephant's trampling change calculated?" If you look at the Mammoth, it looks like 8+STR Mod+Prof, which adds to the DC 18 listed for its trampling charge. But the Elephant, with a +2 Proficiency and +6 STR bonus, only has a DC 12 trampling charge. This isn't the only one where DCs aren't clear on how they're calculated, but the big difference between the Elephant and the Mammoth is especially weird. I can't even say it's just based on the Challenge rating, because those aren't consistent from creature to creature within a given CR.
Some of them are just plain wrong... some have been corrected ... some haven't Mammoth attack is +10 - Str +7 - so Prof is +3 - 8+Prof+Str = 18 - DC 18 Elephant attack is +8 - Str +6 - so Prof is +2 - 8+Prof+Str = 16 - DC 12
@FlameUser64 that math doesn't work out, either. +3 for the Elephant, +5 for the Mammoth, meaning with their proficiency bonus there'd only be a three point difference in DCs, not a six point difference. As a DM, these oddities are fine. But playing a Moon Druid, you start to notice and wonder...
Wildshaped Kenkus can functionally both speak and write using their Mimicry and Expert Forgery features. On a less silly note, one could argue that Tieflings likely get fire resistance for magical reasons rather than for anatomical reasons.
Love this series! Very timely for me! Just started playing a Monk 1/ Moon Druid x in a home brew campaign going to level 13. Playing a Druid is so much fun. So many ways to customize the class.
I like that the feature itself has to specify anatomy. It just makes reflavoring easier if all that I have to consider mechanically is the wording of the feature, as opposed to an extrapolation of the feature. Great video and explanation!
Never liked how wild shape gives you a bunch of hit points and transforms your equipment as well...I know it's for mechanical reasons, but for flavor, it makes the wild shape form a separate entity than the druid rather than being one with the animal form, if that makes sense. I like the idea of a wild shape bear covered with arrows and slash wounds transforming back and still covered with wounds they sustained during the fight
@@МаратГабдуллин-б5ф PF1e druid solves this by having wild shape give a ton of stat buffs. +4 Str, +2 Con, +2 AC, that sort of thing. And then there's Shifter, a class dedicated to being Really Good at wildshape while having no spellcasting. They lose their armour AC while wildshaped, like a druid does, but they have monk unarmoured defence that stacks with the natural armour they get from their wildshaped form. (Also PF1e enemies just do less damage.)
@@МаратГабдуллин-б5ф The way your comment it's worded makes it seem the class doesn't deserve attention just because it isn't particularly popular. If that's the case, then it's pretty silly way of looking at it.
When it comes to, “Which animals can a Druid Wild Shape into?” don’t forget that Druids can cast Conjure Animals at 5th level and Polymorph on a friend at 7th level. Both of those spells can let them see a Beast that they haven’t previously seen.
Technically speaking, Conjure Animals summons fey spirits that take the form of beasts. You've technically only seen the spirits. Just like how seeing a picture of a beast wouldn't let you wild shape into it, since you haven't seen the beast itself. I think Polymorph would work though since it says "The target's game statistics are replaced by the statistics of the chosen beast." Personally I think I would rule CA and Poly as having seen the beasts, but I've played with a few DMs who would absolutely reject that.
@@pgd5000 Considering that the DM picks what you summon with Conjure Animals instead of the player, this isn’t much of an issue. The DM can legitimately limit what you see when you use Conjure Animals that way anyway. When I played a Moon Druid my DM had me roll to see what I summoned though which I thought was fair.
The proficiency bonus table is listed in the original Monster's Manual on page 8. It is based on CR and is identical to the one for players levels. For Brown Bear it's CR +2
My favorite example of "physically capable of doing so" is squirrels breathing fire because the original dragonborn druid could, and bears being fire resistant because the original tiefling druid was. I'm pretty generous with those things myself.
Great video! I ran into the unintuitive PB for creatures thing when I created a warlock that used magic stone + investment of the chain master to have a familiar throw stones. Magic stone's attack combines the casters ability score modifier and the creatures PB, but familiars' forms PB's werent listed on their statblocks.
I remember reading somewhere that apparently Dragonborn Breath Weapons work in wildshape because "all you need to be able to do is breathe." Which is just.......nah.
4:02 you can safely assume a druid may have encountered any ordinary beast found in the region of the setting or suitably for the geograpy of the setting.
yeah I get the "hand off"/"use common sense" design in theory, staying out of the DM and letting them decide want works for them, but that also puts the onus of balancing on the DM too. especially in a game that is mainly hard rules too.
I've never thought about any of this before and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it now. It's all seemed fairly straightforward to me about how it works. Like the creature you've seen before. If I'm playing a druid when I come up with my backstory the DM and I will discuss where I grew up and pick a list of animals I can wild shape into because of it. I love the videos but sometimes it feels like there is some pretty impressive reach to make something basic seem complex or not well described from the optimize community.
05:09 Its not all encompassing but Xanathers has a section called learning Beast Shapes under the Druid chapter and it just suggests the druid selects its wild shapes based on the environments they lived/traveled in and it lists tables of animals in those environments. The only changes you need to make if any are if an animal like bears don’t exist in your world or if they choose a biome like Forest which contains an assortment of exotic animals like Baboons next to some ordinary ones like bears. Its because scientifically a Jungle is a forest and they made it all one biome.
And don't forget about the Grung's "Standing Leap" ability. Any animal you wild shape into could automatically leap up to 25 feet forward or 15 feet high... Thanks for pointing this out!
Leaping Brown Bear! However, if you are wildshaped into a brown bear, do you still need to immerse yourself in water to avoid exhaustion? Between two uses of wildshape per short rest, you could easily be in wildshape 24hrs a day before level 12.
@GROOVEGNOME haha, totally understandable. However, I must ask, which is more realistic to us: a brown bear that can leap or a human that can shape-shift into a bear? If we are playing a fantasy game, why not embrace the creative ridiculousness. Balance wise, a leaping brown bear has nothing on half the uncommon magic items or numerous other game features obtained by 5th level.
I think as GM I would allow these unusual interactions or not depending on caster preference at time of casting. So a bear with hills or leaping legs could exist and use them, but wouldn’t pass as a normal bear to an observer.
As usual, I appreciate you pointing out the inconsistencies in the rules. The bigger question is whether the inconsistencies can be fixed without creating a rules-dense and inflexible system. My suspicion is that playability and clarity stop working together at some point, and it's the duty of the players and GM to hash it out at the table starting with Session 0. Did I just punt? Yeah, kind of. But I've played in heavy rules sets before, and they always boil down to the person with more system mastery and stubbornness getting their way. I'd rather deal with these things as they come up. It leaves more room for the Rule of Cool too. It's much easier to say, "I'm not sure, but it sounds awesome so go ahead this time," than to say, "that's against these two rules, but I'll allow it."
10:19 I think you’re misreading the 2nd sentence. If we just take the second sentence alone it states: “If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the BONUS in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature’s bonus instead of yours” And here’s the thing to keep in mind, ability modifies are not considered bonuses. Rules for an ability check: “To make an ability check, roll a d20 and add the relevant ability modifier. As with other d20 rolls, apply bonuses and penalties, and compare the total to the DC.” Rules for saving throws: “To make a saving throw, roll a d20 and add the appropriate ability modifier… As with skill proficiencies, proficiency in a saving throw lets a character add his or her proficiency bonus to saving throws made using a particular ability score.” In both of these examples bonuses are added after your ability modifier, so bonus in wild shape’s case must be referring specifically to proficiency bonus, it’s not referring to the total you add to the roll. And if we read the part after the comma: “use the creature’s bonus INSTEAD of yours” Which would mean that normally you use your own proficiency bonus, but if the creature has a higher proficiency bonus then you use the creature’s proficiency bonus instead. So in your bear example a Druid with proficiency in dex saving throws would just add their proficiency bonus since the bear’s dex modifier is +0.
A point on the last part about physical capability. The autognome's Creature Type feature does not specify any anatomy either, it just says you are a construct. So in this interpretation any autognome druid is always a construct. I would probably let myself be persuaded to let someone play a clockwork druid like that if they wanted.
Moon Druid is my favorite class based on how I rule it but I'm always nervous to play it because of the list of things the DM has to decide about my character. The designers could help us all out a lot with more specifics or some reworks to update wild shape. "What makes sense" just changes too much from DM to DM. Do Elementals have hands to hold a staff? Can they wear cloaks? Magic tattoos? How do these items influence elemental abilities like earth glide? I've struggled to find consensus.
The "that you've seen before" mechanics has been a depending on where you're from or you have traveled you have a list of animals you have seen. If there is an animal you haven't seen but would like to wild shape into, I treat this like role-playing opportunities or rewards for the player as I, the DM, would know what you would like to transform into, but this is given to you similarly to say a magical item for another class.
For dex save: if you have proficiency in dex saves and wildshape into a bear your dex save would be the bear's dex and your proficiency bonus. The rule mentions using the bears physical stats, but also mentions keeping your own proficiency
The specification that your equipment doesn’t change to accommodate your new form actually has a funny interaction. The rules for magic items state that most magic items can or will change size to fit their owner which the Druid specifically stops. This won’t really affect most Druids, I imagine, but if you were feeling especially creative and made an Armorer Druid you’ll run into an issue where two specific rules contradict. Your arcane armor wants to change to fit you but your Wild Shape won’t let it. This is probably something a DM would hand wave since a subclass feature is more specific than a class feature, but it’s still fun to look at weird interactions like this.
crawford did a wildshape episode of dragon+(planescape torment one I think?) where he gave a yes on dragonborn breath weapon working for anything "with a mouth like orifice" then backtracked almost immediately on warforged living construct type beast form plating. Things only got worse from there. 5e druids are still paying for the sins of 3.x CoDzilla in a lot of ways I suspect that if the episode were done a year or two later when wotc realized warforge were super popular as a player race that it would have been a totally different ruling on their plating
Things that races get as part of being a race that you could argue are "features" for the purpose of wild shape: Ability score increases, size, speed, and languages.
If I recall correctly, the DMG states that a creature's proficiency bonus is based on their Challenge Rating (not Hit Dice), with a table that matches the same progression as PC levels but expanded from CR 0 to CR 30. So there is a rule for it, but it's hidden away. Also I believe the PHB bear claw's attack bonus was updated in an errata, so it should be fixed in later printings.
I think I understand wild shape, so I’ll keep editing this comment as the video goes 1º) The point about beast seen, if you wanna transform into something weird you can always ask the DM(before actually being able to do so) so they can introduce a scene/battle/whatever with said beast Conclusion: solid video with solid points, most problems pointed out can be solved with the good old “it’s fine, I guess” but would be nice having guideline that doesn’t overwhelm the DM with making new ruling to every race
10:00 I think it means to use the beast's physical stat modifiers, and then whichever [proficiency] bonus is higher. I think the "bonus" in this case is anything you add other than your modifier. So Jack of All Trades and Expertise both work while wild shaped
In my table I decide to just stop worrying about it and talking with my druid player I just changed the Wild Shape to work like this: You can speak through magical means as if your normal body was there (Still can't cast any spells, just hold concentration). You use the beasts stat sheet for everything but ignore it for mental stat checks. So for a saving throw you roll as if were the beast, with let's say -2 INT modifier. But for a History check you roll with your normal stats and proficiencies. This makes it so much easier to remember, no comparing stats to see which is bigger and no hassle with the player trying to figure out a way to communicate in beast form.
A Dwarven bear getting poison resistance makes me happy. I imagine all Dwarven druid wild shapes also retain the beard, while elven wild shapes retain the pointy ears... and yet, bandits never quite notice the bearded rat running around their HQ.
Cool idea is armorer artificer + moon druid. Since the armor expands to cover your form, a generous reading of the rules might let you continue wearing your magic armor during wildshape.
I’ve always considered the wood elf walking speed to be base 30 +5 for 35. So I would rule that the new creature gets a +5 to their base movement speed.
That makes sense. Since it carries over into wildshaped forms, it would likely be some kind of supernatural effect related to their connection with nature, or something like that.
17:00 - I would rule that the previous line there "Your ability to take any action that requires hands is limited to the capabilities of your beast form." is the specific ruling, while "prevent you from taking actions that are part of a spell" is the general ruling. Wild Shape, in and of itself, would not prevent you from using the instant summon, but a lack of hands or a lack of ability to speak would prevent you from doing that in snake form. The Circle of the Moon druid's elemental forms could use the instant summon - they have hands and are capable of speaking an elemental language after all. 19:40 - "Transforming doesn't break your concentration on a spell you've already cast, however, or prevent you from taking actions that are part of a spell, such as call lightning, that you've already cast." I read this as applying to your base form abilities, as they have already stated that ongoing spells continue to affect you. The stipulation that you can't use any of your special senses is a rider on the previous statement that you retain the benefits of your racial features if the new form is physically capable of it. ie: you can't say that because your new form has eyes, you can keep your elven darkvision. As Truesight is a spell, it modifies your form. So your new form starts with no truevision, but is then modified by the spell while it's active.
Here's a fun one. Just a few weeks ago, our party druid got afflicted by an aboleth's mucous cloud, and was forced to breathe water instead of air. Thing is, she was a giant constrictor at the time. If she dropped wild shape, would she still suffer the same effect? What if she wild shaped again into a creature that can breathe air? For that matter, how do normal diseases interact with wild shape, anyway? If a wild shaped druid contracts a disease, does that go away when she shifts back?
For most of these, I feel like you're just playing with us. My favorite class is druid, and I feel pretty confident in my understanding of Wild Shape. That said, your "what's reasonable to me" ruling looks to be right most of the time. The "you have seen before" clause is just a DM "buy-in" clause; it's vague so DMs can rp or set a system if they so choose but otherwise does nothing. I mostly use it to limit options for first time players so they don't struggle with analysis paralysis. Shapechange hp pool is separate from your base hp pool and your WS hp pool. So at 8:40, that's a shapechange issue and is independent of WS. If your concentration remains on shapechange despite being brought to 0 hp in WS, you revert to shapechange because it replaces your "normal form" for the duration of the spell. What makes it wonky is if you cast this spell while WS or shapechange again after WS; that's where we really have no rule on how it works. So I think WS proficiency rules are bad as written, but you're mistaken in thinking you're running it wrong if I'm understanding you correctly. RAW and RAI, just look at the bonus (no formulas, no calculating). Looking at the brown bear, it has a +5/+6 "bite" attack which will always be a +5/+6 "bite." The brown bear doesn't have a DEX saving throw proficiency (but the Giant Sea Eel from Ghosts of Saltmarch does), so the bear has a +0 to DEX saves. If your DEX save bonus is higher but you lack proficiency, your bonus is 0. So looking at the Giant Sea Eel who has a +4 to DEX saves (+2 DEX), they always have a +4 bonus that doesn't scale with your character (if I'm understanding Jeremy Crawford*). In this case with DEX resilience, your character has a +7 bonus to DEX saves and uses this +7 bonus even when WS as a Giant Sea Eel. Calculating their proficiency bonus is irrelevant; just look at the bonus as a total. Now, let's look at the most bogus example: let's say you have a +2 WIS, no proficiency in perception, and you WS into an owl at lvl 6. The owl has a +3 perception bonus listed on its sheet, and you have a +2 from your WIS. You don't recalculate based on your higher WIS or your higher proficiency bonus. Your perception, RAW and RAI, is +3. You only look at the bonus total without calculating any formula. It does not become +4 because of your WIS nor +5 with your proficiency. I disagree with everything that makes this RAW and RAI. But you're also mistaken on how to determine the proficiency bonus for NPCs/monsters; treat their CR level the same as a PC level (rounded up if less than 1). *In his tweets clarifying the intention Jeremy Crawford says: "A druid in beast form uses his or her proficiencies, except when the beast has the same proficiency with a higher bonus." and "The intent is that the druid uses the bonus in the beast's stat block for any proficiency the druid lacks." No matter how I read this and the WS rules, your proficiency bonus doesn't seem to apply to the beast's stat block. HOWEVER, everyone I know (and resources I've read) who's ever read this (and from whom I've gotten the tweets) all interpret that you calculate in your proficiency to the beast. You are the first person who has agreed with my reading comprehension and dndbeyond's WS functions (according to someone I play with, I haven't made a druid on there). Carry over damage and hit dice is 100% correct. Spells and actions of spells, your ruling is correct, but the qualifier is actually in the first sentence. (Despite not having hands) if your WS is reasonably capable of performing an action, you are able to perform the action. It just requires DM "buy-in," so the opposite ruling would also be correct if the DM doesn't think you would be reasonably capable. Physically capable of doing so... oh, yep. Yeah, it's super gray. But the fine line it breaks on is if the ability includes a body part in the description that the new form doesn't have. Ah, you found a tweet. I haven't seen this one before, but yeah... I totally get you. Some things are dumb.
Personally how we've always handled wild shape is: It lasts until you're knocked out of it or dismiss it. You use whichever stats are higher between you and the beast. Rather than any beast you've seen it's any beast you've "established a spiritual connection with" so getting new forms is more of an active mini adventure that lets us have "hey look what I earned" moments. All racial bonuses like dark vision carry over as long as it's not requiring something like an obvious anatomy such as a shell, claws, wings, etc. And we pick a shape as a favored form and it levels alongside so forms stay relevant and fun.
I’m playing a Werewolf in our current campaign (Moon Druid/Beast Barbarian/Long Death Monk). Only went to lvl 2 Druid, and will only be using Brown Bear until I unlock Beast Claws, and then while go Dire Wolf for the rest of the build. The key to my build is that the character is a Changeling, and uses Shapechange to adjust the Wildshape to be more humanoid (the Were in Werewolf). Large size means the Claws are 2d6+Str+Rage, and strike twice with a single attack action. As the character goes Monk, that means three attacks then four attacks, and finally six attacks at 2d6+6 each (and the occasional bite for 2d6+6 that also knocks the target probe on a failed Str save).
On the proficiency question: the wording has always led me to believe that if you're proficient in a skill or saving throw, you always add your proficiency bonus but still use the creature's (physical) ability scores.
I think the craziest interaction with wild shape is when you mix it with a changeling. You become an eldritch abomination if you can shapechange while wildshaped. Wolves with spider legs, rabbits with mandibles, deer that walk upright and bite like a hyena. You could also theoretically speak, and have human hands as an animal so logically you should be able to spellcast but wildshape won't let you. You can live all your weirdest furry dreams though. Just all at once in a horrific amalgamation that surely won't produce countless nightmares.
FYI, Monster proficiency bonus scales the same as PCs, but uses CR instead of level. i.e. CR 0-4 has +2 proficiency, CR 5-8 is +3 proficiency, and so on. Reference DMG chapter 9 table "Monster Stats by CR" you find this aligns with PC's proficiency bonus scaling and continues past lvl 20.
Re: seen shapes. Xanathar's has some optional guidance in the druid section. "Consider the environment your druid grew up in, then consult the appropriate table for a list of animals that your druid has probably seen by 2nd level". It DOES kinda imply that most/many druids will be from a small number of environments to get access to Brown Bear and Giant Eagle. (and no environment I can find includes Brown/Polar/Eagle)
Dwarven Fortitude doesn't work in wildshape. The prerequisite is being a dwarf. "If you ever lose a feat’s prerequisite, you can’t use that feat until you regain the prerequisite."
My favorite adaptation of wild shape was in the 3.5 Player’s Handbook 2 book. It offered an alternative to the base druid’s wild shape, and instead had different forms that offered static boosts. For example, you learn the ferocious slayer form at level 8, which it suggests may look like a bear, tiger, or dire wolf. You increase in size once, and it grants you a bite and two claw attacks, a +8 to Strength, a +4 to Fortitude saves, and a +8 to natural armor. No more question about if you’ve seen a creature anymore, and no more worrying about source books that add imbalanced beast stats. It also made it so druids couldn’t dump their physical stats anymore, which was an issue in 3.5. Their hit points never changed, so they couldn’t just continually shift to gain mountains of free hit points. To help with that, this version of wild shape has unlimited uses. I think it’d be easy enough to adapt this to 5e with the introduction of Tasha’s summon spells. Make stats for your predator or aerial or whatever form, and then allow your druid to change into them based on whatever level restrictions you use.
*reads crawford's tweet* *looks at plasmoid* "The amorphous trait doesn't specify anatomy…" *furiously pages through the monster manual to find the largest creature I can wild shape into to fit through a 1 inch hole*
Here's my take! 1. Beasts you've seen should be covered by an agreement between you and your DM. 2. Your normal form sounds vague, but it also doesn't say it cleanses you from other effects. So Shapechange would still be in affect. 3.1. Because you are proficient in dexterity, you get to add your proficiency to your dexterity saving throw as a Brown Bear but use the form's dexterity. Wild Shape doesn't hinder your instincts, but that bear body sure makes dodging arrows tougher than what you remember it to be. 3.2. Monsters don't usually have a proficiency since that was designed for player-mechanic, which is why we take all other info from the monster stat block except the three mind skills and a possible proficiency - because that's rooted in the individual. 4. Carry over damage is affected by resistances if it makes sense so our DM rules it. For example a cone of cold would affect the normal form as well because the spell takes time, but a piercing damage from an arrow deals all of it's damage in a single instant. 5. Snakes can't talk, but they can do other actions that can be parts of a spell. But if your DM is cool with it, that would just make more cool moments. 6. Spells would remain in effect so True Seeing would work. It isn't "your" special sense. What does intrigue me is what would a person with true sight see when looking at a druid that has shaped into a rat. We just consider all physical traits getting replaced or removed by Wild Shape. 7. No Amphibious, Dwarven Resilience & Toughness, Rabbit Hop. But even Jeremy there is manacled to the templated text form of the books. 5e doesn't hide effects: what you see is what you get to a massive extent. I'm pretty sure you know how Wild Shape works. You're an incredibly smart person. Some lines just need to be drawn by the DM. And those are the trials that define them as such.
Regarding the proficiency bonus of monsters, page 8 of the monster manual has a table called "Table: Proficiency Bonus by Challenge Rating" which I believe answers this question... although it's really not in an obvious place to say the least.
The Proficiency Bonus for monsters is actually, of all things, buried in the DMG! Page 274 gives the CR to PB chart, and is the only part of Monster creation that is a rule rather than a tradeoff guideline~
When I first started delving into DnD and learned about Wildshape and saw it in videos the first thing I remember thinking whenever some druid who never really saw much of the world transformed into a dinosaur or super rare but cool animal was "Wait a minute, I am 100% sure your character has *never* seen that animal in his whole life! Why is the DM allowing this? Okay because it's cool probably", but that always felt kind of weird/unsatisfying to me.
The way I read it, you don't get to add your ability scores to dex, strength and con saves when in wild shape. It says 'You also retain all of your skill and saving throw proficiencies, in addition to gaining those of the creature. If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature’s bonus instead of yours'. I think that passage 'bonus in its stat block is higher than yours' refers simply to the proficiency bonus, not to the total bonus. So if you had a proficency bonus of +2 and transformed into a creature with +3, and both you and the creature were proficient in con saves, you would add +3 to your con saves. However, if you had 16 con and the beast only had 10 con, I think you would only get +3, not +6.
The Bugbear’s “Sneaky” feature says “Without squeezing, you can move through and stop in a space large enough for a Small creature.” This means a 18th level Moon Druid can become a mammoth and still squeeze into small spaces. Definitely intended.
At the time Wild Shape was written, monsters (including animals) did not _have_ a proficiency bonus. If they had, then Wild Shape would have specified whether you keep your own bonus or use the beast's. But since the rule was not written with the future errata in mind, and you keep all of your stats that aren't overriden by an equivalent one in the beast statblock, you keep your own proficiency bonus.
In regards to your normal form certain abilities aren't intended to stack ie: temp HP or multiple sources of AC so an altered form would follow that same rule and a new altered form would override the previous. Eg. If the druid was already wildshaped and the wizard turn cat polymorph on them the polymorphed form would override the wildshape (if the player didn't resist the change) so the druid would no longer have access to class features and if concentration is lost or they ran out if temp HP then they would drop to their base form not their wildshape.
I agree with all of your rulings and readings except for the skill and STs. What I would do is just let you use the total bonus (including PB) that is higher, so if the beast has a crappy perception and I ask you to roll perception you can use your own character's, but if the beast has a STR ST of +5 you can use that one instead of your own
From the wording in the PHB this is how I think the ability scores and proficiencies work, however I also agree with just doing whatever the DM/table wants or thinks is most fun: Str score = Beast's score Dex score = Beast's score Con score = Beast's score Int score = Character's score Wis score = Character's score Cha score = Character's score If the beast is proficient in a skill or save and your character is not, use the beast's proficiency bonus. If your character is proficient in a skill or save and the beast is not, use your character's proficiency bonus (implied from the following statement "If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature's bonus instead of yours."). If you are both proficient in a skill or save, use your character's proficiency bonus unless the beast's bonus is higher (directly stated in the above statement). I'm not sure where Chris is reading that we get to use our character's Dex bonus on skills/saves we're proficient in but I think that is wrong since the book plainly states that all of your character's game statistics are replaced by the beast's statistics with the exceptions of Int/Wis/Cha scores, skill proficiencies, and saving throw proficiencies. This entire comment is also extremely pedantic so I'll stop it here
@@Caterpie56 "You dont know how to use wildshape"! Proceeds to make a video with incorrect information. Honestly not even watching because I know how Wildshape works like the back of my hand, and the title was click bait, and pretentious.
@@GreyfauxxGaming he does go over some useful/interesting rulings with regards to racial traits but the part on proficiencies irked me because I know just how important wording is. Overall good video though so I would just skip over that section and get to the second half
My one solution to the Brown Bear proficiency bonus riddle was: It has a +1 proficiency bonus, but it has Expertise in Perception, doubling it to 2. It seems like this is redundant with Keen Smell in the mix, but it at least creates some consistency. (Using an errata to change it to +2 is fine as well. :) )
There is an implied base speed of 30ft in the races. Racial features increase or decrease from the 30. Fleet of foot is a +5ft to the base walking speed, so if you are using it in the wildshape form, then it is beast speed +5ft.
A follow up video... How do Magic Items worn by the Druid interact with Wild Shape? "You choose whether your equipment falls to the ground in your space, merges into your new form, or is worn by it. Worn equipment functions as normal, but the DM decides whether it is practical for the new form to wear a piece of equipment, based on the creature's shape and size. Your equipment doesn't change size or shape to match the new form, and any equipment that the new form can't wear must either fall to the ground or merge with it. Equipment that merges with the form has no effect until you leave the form."
Another prickly issue: can you take the form of specific beasts you see? If you are still infiltrating the manor of a baron, can you take on the form of his calico housecat, with her very specific and recognisable markings, her scarred ear, and her bobbed tail? If your fighter friend has accepted a challenge to joust a rival knight, who shows up with a massive brute of a warhorse with all kinds of bonuses and proficiencies to joisting, could you shape shift into that specific horse to gain all those advantages for yourselves?
I don't think anyone has said this but around the saving throw + skill proficiencies. You wouldn't use your dex save modifier of +7 in the video. You would use your proficency of +3 and the bears dex of +0. So a total of +3. "You retain all your skill and saving throw proficiencies" it would be "being proficent" that is what's carried over. I would assume the second half of that would refer to it having a higher proficency bonus in those skills.
My favourite "abuse" of this ambiguity is this: 1. Tabaxi: "your claws are natural weapons, which you can use to make unarmed strikes" 2. Unarmed fighting fighting style: Unarmed attacks become 1d8 if both hands are empty 3. Two levels in monk for Flurry of Blows. 4. Druid wild shaping into a Moorbounder for the claw attack: Claws. Melee Weapon Attack: +6 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 14 (4d4 + 4) slashing damage. Thus turning our unarmed tabaxi claws into natural weapons using d8s and then turning into a beast using those natural/unarmed attacks but dealing 4d8s per attack instead. Then Flurry of blows for total of 12d8 + 3xStr. 😂
In either tashas or xanathar, can't remember which, there is a list of beast and what regions they would be seen in. So you could just say your druid grew up around forests and you would get a whole list of creatures.
pretty certain there was a sage advice on the hit dice - they come from the BEASTs hit dice, not the "players". "Dark vision" is a "natural physical ability" of the creature (and therefore should be replaced with your current forms natural phsyical abilities) where "True sight" is a magic spell and should be retained. FOr the "toughness" abilities we always ruled that the toughness WAS applying....to the players HP and you still saw the benefit when you got knocked out of wildshape (as the druid in question of course I wanted to get extra HP for my bear )
To the proficiency bonus thing: There is a handy chart to the prof. bonus based on the CR in D&D Beyond CR: 0-4 = +2 CR: 5-8= +3 CR: 9-12= +4 CR: 13-16=+5 CR: 17-20= +6 CR: 21-24= +7 CR: 25-28=+8 CR: >28= +9 Hope this proofs helpful
I actually give out cards with the statblocks of creatures the encounter saves the trouble of them being unsure and gives them something to plan with. Makes the game much smoother and easier to plan with . As for race, I just let them all stick and say that the wildshape works in a way that the gills stay or something.
If its a str, dex or con save or check you are profiencient in, use the beasts stat bonus plus your own profiency bonus. So a brown bear would be a +2 to a dex roll if your pb bonus is +2
Xanathar's has a list of suggested beasts the druid has probably seen, based on the terrain they are from. I find that list very handy for determining the beasts.
I was going to say this. Xanathar's fixed a lot of things people complain about.
I use that too!
What if I have the far traveler background and my backstory is all about me travel to and from many distant lands. Do I get the recommended forms for all of those terrains?
@@booleanillogical4757 Ask your DM. I'd probably give you all the CR 0-1/2 forms from those biomes since they are more commonly encountered, but you'd have to roll for CR 1+ forms since you haven't spent the time to really get to know the land.
I love how 12th level druid wild shaping into an owl can't cast spells at all, including ones granted by an item but a familiar owl holding a dagger can use Ring of Spellstoring to cast Steel Wind Strike.
A familiar is not a beast .. it's a Celestial, Fey or Fiend ... We might have to look at Centaurs, Hexbloods, and Satyrs ...
@@davidioanhedges I fail to see which part of that has anything to do with casting spells through magic items.
If you insist on having the example limited to just beasts you can dominate or charm a random owl and tell it to use its action to cast the spell stored in the ring.
@@IsshTM It specifically says when wildshaped you *cannot* cast spells, you just can't - even via magic items - no reason given - specific beats general
A familiar is not a beast .. it's not wildshaped - so if it says it can, it can ...
@@davidioanhedges What point do you think you're arguing here, and who do you think is disagreeing with you?
@David Hedges what are you trying to say?
Wild shape is in the uncomfortable "how does this work?" valley connecting the castles of magic where players tacitally agree to handwave everything and the slums of martial classes where someone at the table is an expert on brigantine armor and why studded leather is a myth, so all actions must make sense in the physics of our universe or some other such hullabaloo.
Don't believe me? Next game, bring a picture of your Druid with a metal-banded circular shield and watch that one guy's head explode. :)
Imagine saying that you can Wildshape into a dinosaur because you _see_ dinosaurs in your dreams...
I could see a druid having a dream trance with the spirit of a beast and gaining the ability to assume its form. But that seems like an opportunity to roleplay instead of handwaving it.
@@momqabt Daydreams.
No. "What you saw before" means that the creature actually exist in your DM world. The dinosaur you dream about might not be existing in DM's world.
If that worked then I could make up my own beast to change into just cause. (I've had dreams of weird animals before, flies bigger than my body, cats with snake heads, etc,)
@@momqabt elves dream of past lives across the multiverse, so they'd actually make more sense
Polymorph spell helps with "seen before" part, turn you party member into animal you need during a rest, done. And you get it at level 7, just before flying forms.
Don't you need to see a creature polymorph someone into it?
@@yunusahmed2940 Polymorph says nothing about having to had seen the targets new form before in order to do the transformation.
@@TimeOfSin
Why does one require that any the other doesn't? That's just inconsistent.
Doesn't make a whole Lotta sense hoe you can change someone's form into something you've never seen before like a Githyanki
@@yunusahmed2940 I agree, I simply meant that Wild Shape explicitly calls out the need to have seen what you transform into, but Polymorph doesnt.
@@TimeOfSin
I don't understand the design philosophy of this game sometimes
Treantmonk, The proficiency bonus per CR is a chart in the MM P. 8
in addition the Druid wild shape CR's usually have a prof. bonus of +2, with the exeption of the moon druids Elemental form, and their animal form past lvl 14!!
And seeing that you're using Beast forms of a specific CR, it should be easy to remember your Prof bonus from that chart of monster CRs.
It should be in the stat block
I was surprised this came up at all, but I would always use player proficiency bonus, never the beast. They retain all of their mental stats anyways, it should be significantly different than polymorph. Also using information not available to the player to calculate player modifiers does not make sense to me.
The rules you were missing for the Brown Bear proficiency bonus are on page 8 of the Monster Manual. Specifically the table "Proficiency Bonus by Challenge Rating". They list the proficiency bonus for a CR 1 creature as +2.
That's not it's statblock though
@@adamkaris yes it is. Challenge rating is in the stat block.
Fringe case, but I think the "revert to normal form at zero hit points" specification is important for things like zealot barb, who stays up even after hitting zero. So, if you didn't have that somewhat redundant line, you could argue that a zealot bar-bear-ian could maintain wild shape past zero hp because hitting that threshold wouldn't render you (in that form) unconscious, thus not ending the effect. I feel like this would be a bit of a hard sell to make, but that added line makes sure both cases are covered, should one happen without the other…
Half Orc Druid Wildshaped... do you get the racial benefit? Is that part of the anatomy?
@@the_algorithm you… should? Probably. Since the relentless endurance feature says "when you are reduced to 0 hit points but not killed outright, you can drop to 1 hit point instead." At no point does that reference a specific biological feature, so it fits under the fleet argument…
Would be easier to argue that you just can't rage in wild shape.
concentration on spells is probably the most common case where that one comes up, since going unconscious even briefly would break it if the transformation at zero didn't occur to trigger the "aren't knocked unconscious" clause
Dhampir's Vampiric bite is one of my favorite examples here. Does the "Fanged" bite imply anatomy? Well what if i transform into a giant bat or another creature that has fangs?
what are fangs?
pretty sure all mamals have "fangs" called canine teeth
@@harrysarsooh god
vampire whales
@@deProfundisAdAstra not sure balleens count as theeth, but the others sure do orca/sperm whale
@@harrysarso Vampiric Killer whale is go!!!
@@deProfundisAdAstra You mad genius! It's beautiful!!!
"D&D and other RPG talk." Gotta say I'm excited for the future content.
Imagine Treantmonk doing character build videos in a system like Pathfinder 2e where you actually have important choices to make past 3rd level! Big hype.
In defense of the Dragonborn's breath weapon, that's at least partly due to their magical heritage, and breath weapons CAN be used by creatures that don't innately have them provided magic is at play, and according to Crawford can even be used by creatures that ordinarily can't attack. So if you want to dust off Xanathar'sGuide and use the Dragon's Breath spell as a reference, then enjoy the power of the lightning-breathing squirrel in your group.
...Note to Self: Make a Dragonborn Druid with the name Thunder-Squirrel...
Fizban's gem dragonborns are the best race for moon druid: 30ft telepathy, great breath weapon damage types and concentration-free wings-free flight with hover at level 5.
A wizard in my group makes daily use of Twinspelling Dragons Breath on two rats they control, creating huge areas of damage every turn that use hardly any of their own action economy. It’s quite something
@@jaredcarter1165 _"Ahem. _*_BREAKUS ECONOMITUS!"_*
@@jaredcarter1165 iirc, you're not supposed to be able to twin that spell. But the idea of two rat flamethrowers is very entertaining
@@kikikillian1208 well the spell targets just one creature (the rat), so it’s technically a buff just like haste
How does Wild Shape work?
Magic... it's mostly magic.
The idea that there’s any non-magic part of Wild Shape is kind of scary.
It is not a spell though and can't be dispelled
@@joelsasmad I don't think that's weirder than the fact that sometimes monsters cast spells that can be counter spelled/dispelled and sometimes monsters use abilities that are identical to spells and can't be counter spelled/dispelled.
I think the designers made a mistake referencing actual beast stat blocks. If they'd used a generic template instead, as they've done for many summoned creatures in recent releases, and left the narrative descriptions up to the player, then getting rid of ambiguity would be much easier. You'd get X, y, or z options that grant clearly defined benefits. Some would scale naturally as you level. Others would only improve with class or subclass features.
No muss, no fuss.
Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see this addressed in the playtest
PF2 does something like this, actually.
They could let you just grab some powers (according to level) like darkvision, water breathing, other speeds, natural attacks, and so on. Then have those on top of your normal characteristics maybe with some bonus (or maybe making specific stats some powers, like having a strenght of 16 being one option) and just going with that.
13thAge does the same stunt: Fixed stats plus flavour. It works perfectly smooth. 😌👍
Druid versatility would drop significantly though. I had a whole document on which forms had blindsight, multiattack, different damage types, resistances, climb/fly/swim speeds, proficiencies, AC/HP, etc (my character had access to mage armor, so I also included moster dex bonus)
It's all quite simple: Wild Shape was designed only thinking about the concept that should be achieved, and nobody thought of all the implications the rules have. Over the years, more and more problems became obvious which would have been clear from the start if you thought about it, but now it's already in general use
That kind of applies to a lot of things in 5e :D.
Plasmoids make a fun wild shape druid. they can use Amorphous RAW without any issues at all. And a huge sized snake being able to go through a tiny crack is hilarious. And it makes sense thematically because your a shapeshifting ooze.
Fleet of Foot I would rule that the racial ability makes the wood elf 5' faster than a regular elf's 30' movement. They are slightly faster than normal - this is the actual trait "Your base walking speed increases to 35 feet" could just as easily have been written you have +5' to an elf's base movement speed. I would apply the same to the wild shape so a snail with a move of 5' would become a faster snail with a move of 10'. I would even allow this to apply to a horse even though they have a 60' move the fleet of foot is a racial feat that makes you slightly faster than normal so the wild shaped horse would have a speed of 65'. Tritons, Merman etc need gills to breathe under water, the wild shape must have gills to breath under water I wouldn't care that the race does not specify that the breathe under water is because of gills it just makes sense.
I would too, that makes more sense
@@TreantmonksTemple I still think that mental stats bleed over, physical and senses don't ... What mental ability means you can move faster as a snail?
That's how I would write the rule. As soon as treant mentioned keeping the abilities of your race I immediately thought of woodelf because of how its worded
Isn't the movement speed in itself a racial trait? Halfling druids would then always have a 25 feet movement speed.
@@davidioanhedges "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so." Moving faster is a feature of the wood elf race so the wild shape creature gains the same benefit as long as they are physically capable. So as long as a creature has a movement speed it can use this racial feature.
Your "Don't ask your DM this. . ." section was very funny, Chris!
These in depth analysis of specific wording is a crazy exercise in willfully taking the wording and making it confusing. It blows my mind to hear some of these interpretations that no one (or hardly anyone) would ever think it ment
Page 8 of the Monster Manual has a chart for Proficiency Bonus by Challenge rating. It's another page to flip to, but it is there (in my copy at least).
I commented the same thing and then scrolled through the comments to see if I’m not the only weirdo that knows of this table haha
Hurray for Tasha's optional rules and subclasses! It has always boggled my mind that Druids, which are all nature themed, didn't have a reliable way to have little pets and friends to do stuff with. Find Familiar just feels right to have as a Druid. Also as someone who has played a Wildfire Druid, I can count on one hand the amount of times I've actually used wildshape to turn into an animal even at level 12. Tracking down stats and looking at the rules for it are nine kinds of confusing - so much more simple to summon your Wildfire Spirit and be done with it.
A Familiar is not an Animal -- it's specifically a Celestial, Fey or Fiend "wildshaped" into animal form - so kinship...
Yeah ik that's all detailed in the spell but its not a big deal to say "Hey this is an owl that's my friend I found in the forest" instead of "This is some weird celestial creature shaped into an animal". 🙄
@@davidioanhedges wich leads to another bit of contradiction, since you can change the shape of your familiar but the beeing stays the same shouldn´t mental stats be staying the same?
On the proficiency bonuses, one that always confused me was, "how is the DC of the Elephant's trampling change calculated?" If you look at the Mammoth, it looks like 8+STR Mod+Prof, which adds to the DC 18 listed for its trampling charge. But the Elephant, with a +2 Proficiency and +6 STR bonus, only has a DC 12 trampling charge.
This isn't the only one where DCs aren't clear on how they're calculated, but the big difference between the Elephant and the Mammoth is especially weird. I can't even say it's just based on the Challenge rating, because those aren't consistent from creature to creature within a given CR.
Some of them are just plain wrong... some have been corrected ... some haven't
Mammoth attack is +10 - Str +7 - so Prof is +3 - 8+Prof+Str = 18 - DC 18
Elephant attack is +8 - Str +6 - so Prof is +2 - 8+Prof+Str = 16 - DC 12
Is there another ability score that could have been used for trampling charge, like Con?
@FlameUser64 that math doesn't work out, either. +3 for the Elephant, +5 for the Mammoth, meaning with their proficiency bonus there'd only be a three point difference in DCs, not a six point difference.
As a DM, these oddities are fine. But playing a Moon Druid, you start to notice and wonder...
@@deltavictor8369 Oh I meant that the Mammoth's was calculated with Str while the Elephant's was calculated with Con.
@@FlameUser64 considering that the elephant's con is +3, probably not.
Wildshaped Kenkus can functionally both speak and write using their Mimicry and Expert Forgery features.
On a less silly note, one could argue that Tieflings likely get fire resistance for magical reasons rather than for anatomical reasons.
Love this series! Very timely for me! Just started playing a Monk 1/ Moon Druid x in a home brew campaign going to level 13. Playing a Druid is so much fun. So many ways to customize the class.
I like that the feature itself has to specify anatomy. It just makes reflavoring easier if all that I have to consider mechanically is the wording of the feature, as opposed to an extrapolation of the feature.
Great video and explanation!
Somewhere in the monster manual there is a table of prof bonus by challenge rating
Never liked how wild shape gives you a bunch of hit points and transforms your equipment as well...I know it's for mechanical reasons, but for flavor, it makes the wild shape form a separate entity than the druid rather than being one with the animal form, if that makes sense. I like the idea of a wild shape bear covered with arrows and slash wounds transforming back and still covered with wounds they sustained during the fight
You can flavor it this way. But mechanicly if you share hp with wild shape- caster with d8 hit dice and poor AC wont sustain any wounds in any form.
Decent fix for that is to simply give the beast hp as temp hp
@@none-of-your-busi-ness you don't need to "fix" the least played class in the game
@@МаратГабдуллин-б5ф PF1e druid solves this by having wild shape give a ton of stat buffs. +4 Str, +2 Con, +2 AC, that sort of thing. And then there's Shifter, a class dedicated to being Really Good at wildshape while having no spellcasting. They lose their armour AC while wildshaped, like a druid does, but they have monk unarmoured defence that stacks with the natural armour they get from their wildshaped form.
(Also PF1e enemies just do less damage.)
@@МаратГабдуллин-б5ф The way your comment it's worded makes it seem the class doesn't deserve attention just because it isn't particularly popular. If that's the case, then it's pretty silly way of looking at it.
When it comes to, “Which animals can a Druid Wild Shape into?” don’t forget that Druids can cast Conjure Animals at 5th level and Polymorph on a friend at 7th level. Both of those spells can let them see a Beast that they haven’t previously seen.
Technically speaking, Conjure Animals summons fey spirits that take the form of beasts. You've technically only seen the spirits. Just like how seeing a picture of a beast wouldn't let you wild shape into it, since you haven't seen the beast itself. I think Polymorph would work though since it says "The target's game statistics are replaced by the statistics of the chosen beast." Personally I think I would rule CA and Poly as having seen the beasts, but I've played with a few DMs who would absolutely reject that.
@@pgd5000 Considering that the DM picks what you summon with Conjure Animals instead of the player, this isn’t much of an issue. The DM can legitimately limit what you see when you use Conjure Animals that way anyway. When I played a Moon Druid my DM had me roll to see what I summoned though which I thought was fair.
The proficiency bonus table is listed in the original Monster's Manual on page 8. It is based on CR and is identical to the one for players levels. For Brown Bear it's CR +2
My favorite example of "physically capable of doing so" is squirrels breathing fire because the original dragonborn druid could, and bears being fire resistant because the original tiefling druid was. I'm pretty generous with those things myself.
Great video! I ran into the unintuitive PB for creatures thing when I created a warlock that used magic stone + investment of the chain master to have a familiar throw stones. Magic stone's attack combines the casters ability score modifier and the creatures PB, but familiars' forms PB's werent listed on their statblocks.
I had in fact always dreamed of running a warforged druid who was Dinobot
I remember reading somewhere that apparently Dragonborn Breath Weapons work in wildshape because "all you need to be able to do is breathe." Which is just.......nah.
4:02 you can safely assume a druid may have encountered any ordinary beast found in the region of the setting or suitably for the geograpy of the setting.
yeah I get the "hand off"/"use common sense" design in theory, staying out of the DM and letting them decide want works for them, but that also puts the onus of balancing on the DM too.
especially in a game that is mainly hard rules too.
It works how every other other lazily written rule in this system works: "lol, idk, it's your table, you do you. more money plz"
I've never thought about any of this before and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it now. It's all seemed fairly straightforward to me about how it works. Like the creature you've seen before. If I'm playing a druid when I come up with my backstory the DM and I will discuss where I grew up and pick a list of animals I can wild shape into because of it. I love the videos but sometimes it feels like there is some pretty impressive reach to make something basic seem complex or not well described from the optimize community.
05:09 Its not all encompassing but Xanathers has a section called learning Beast Shapes under the Druid chapter and it just suggests the druid selects its wild shapes based on the environments they lived/traveled in and it lists tables of animals in those environments.
The only changes you need to make if any are if an animal like bears don’t exist in your world or if they choose a biome like Forest which contains an assortment of exotic animals like Baboons next to some ordinary ones like bears. Its because scientifically a Jungle is a forest and they made it all one biome.
And don't forget about the Grung's "Standing Leap" ability. Any animal you wild shape into could automatically leap up to 25 feet forward or 15 feet high... Thanks for pointing this out!
Leaping Brown Bear! However, if you are wildshaped into a brown bear, do you still need to immerse yourself in water to avoid exhaustion? Between two uses of wildshape per short rest, you could easily be in wildshape 24hrs a day before level 12.
As a DM, I wish players would never learn about rules, and just let me tell you what works and doesn’t lmao. I would NEVER allow this to work.
@GROOVEGNOME haha, totally understandable. However, I must ask, which is more realistic to us: a brown bear that can leap or a human that can shape-shift into a bear? If we are playing a fantasy game, why not embrace the creative ridiculousness.
Balance wise, a leaping brown bear has nothing on half the uncommon magic items or numerous other game features obtained by 5th level.
@@Argosodyssey even better, turn into an ant and leap 25 feet.
I think as GM I would allow these unusual interactions or not depending on caster preference at time of casting. So a bear with hills or leaping legs could exist and use them, but wouldn’t pass as a normal bear to an observer.
As usual, I appreciate you pointing out the inconsistencies in the rules. The bigger question is whether the inconsistencies can be fixed without creating a rules-dense and inflexible system. My suspicion is that playability and clarity stop working together at some point, and it's the duty of the players and GM to hash it out at the table starting with Session 0.
Did I just punt? Yeah, kind of. But I've played in heavy rules sets before, and they always boil down to the person with more system mastery and stubbornness getting their way. I'd rather deal with these things as they come up. It leaves more room for the Rule of Cool too. It's much easier to say, "I'm not sure, but it sounds awesome so go ahead this time," than to say, "that's against these two rules, but I'll allow it."
10:19 I think you’re misreading the 2nd sentence. If we just take the second sentence alone it states:
“If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the BONUS in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature’s bonus instead of yours”
And here’s the thing to keep in mind, ability modifies are not considered bonuses.
Rules for an ability check:
“To make an ability check, roll a d20 and add the relevant ability modifier. As with other d20 rolls, apply bonuses and penalties, and compare the total to the DC.”
Rules for saving throws:
“To make a saving throw, roll a d20 and add the appropriate ability modifier… As with skill proficiencies, proficiency in a saving throw lets a character add his or her proficiency bonus to saving throws made using a particular ability score.”
In both of these examples bonuses are added after your ability modifier, so bonus in wild shape’s case must be referring specifically to proficiency bonus, it’s not referring to the total you add to the roll.
And if we read the part after the comma:
“use the creature’s bonus INSTEAD of yours”
Which would mean that normally you use your own proficiency bonus, but if the creature has a higher proficiency bonus then you use the creature’s proficiency bonus instead. So in your bear example a Druid with proficiency in dex saving throws would just add their proficiency bonus since the bear’s dex modifier is +0.
A point on the last part about physical capability. The autognome's Creature Type feature does not specify any anatomy either, it just says you are a construct. So in this interpretation any autognome druid is always a construct. I would probably let myself be persuaded to let someone play a clockwork druid like that if they wanted.
I appreciate the Nurse pic coming in for "difficulty rising!"
Moon Druid is my favorite class based on how I rule it but I'm always nervous to play it because of the list of things the DM has to decide about my character. The designers could help us all out a lot with more specifics or some reworks to update wild shape. "What makes sense" just changes too much from DM to DM. Do Elementals have hands to hold a staff? Can they wear cloaks? Magic tattoos? How do these items influence elemental abilities like earth glide? I've struggled to find consensus.
The "that you've seen before" mechanics has been a depending on where you're from or you have traveled you have a list of animals you have seen. If there is an animal you haven't seen but would like to wild shape into, I treat this like role-playing opportunities or rewards for the player as I, the DM, would know what you would like to transform into, but this is given to you similarly to say a magical item for another class.
I suddenly want to play a fire breathing snail
The first couple pages of the Monster Manual has a graph that relates challenge rating to the proficiency bonus of the monster.
For dex save: if you have proficiency in dex saves and wildshape into a bear your dex save would be the bear's dex and your proficiency bonus.
The rule mentions using the bears physical stats, but also mentions keeping your own proficiency
The specification that your equipment doesn’t change to accommodate your new form actually has a funny interaction. The rules for magic items state that most magic items can or will change size to fit their owner which the Druid specifically stops. This won’t really affect most Druids, I imagine, but if you were feeling especially creative and made an Armorer Druid you’ll run into an issue where two specific rules contradict. Your arcane armor wants to change to fit you but your Wild Shape won’t let it. This is probably something a DM would hand wave since a subclass feature is more specific than a class feature, but it’s still fun to look at weird interactions like this.
crawford did a wildshape episode of dragon+(planescape torment one I think?) where he gave a yes on dragonborn breath weapon working for anything "with a mouth like orifice" then backtracked almost immediately on warforged living construct type beast form plating. Things only got worse from there. 5e druids are still paying for the sins of 3.x CoDzilla in a lot of ways I suspect that if the episode were done a year or two later when wotc realized warforge were super popular as a player race that it would have been a totally different ruling on their plating
Things that races get as part of being a race that you could argue are "features" for the purpose of wild shape: Ability score increases, size, speed, and languages.
If I recall correctly, the DMG states that a creature's proficiency bonus is based on their Challenge Rating (not Hit Dice), with a table that matches the same progression as PC levels but expanded from CR 0 to CR 30.
So there is a rule for it, but it's hidden away.
Also I believe the PHB bear claw's attack bonus was updated in an errata, so it should be fixed in later printings.
I think I understand wild shape, so I’ll keep editing this comment as the video goes
1º) The point about beast seen, if you wanna transform into something weird you can always ask the DM(before actually being able to do so) so they can introduce a scene/battle/whatever with said beast
Conclusion: solid video with solid points, most problems pointed out can be solved with the good old “it’s fine, I guess” but would be nice having guideline that doesn’t overwhelm the DM with making new ruling to every race
That dirty trick segment got me laughing 🤣, I know you said not to do it but I'm so tempted...
Great timing, literally started a campaign last week in which I plan to play a wild shape druid
10:00 I think it means to use the beast's physical stat modifiers, and then whichever [proficiency] bonus is higher. I think the "bonus" in this case is anything you add other than your modifier. So Jack of All Trades and Expertise both work while wild shaped
In my table I decide to just stop worrying about it and talking with my druid player I just changed the Wild Shape to work like this:
You can speak through magical means as if your normal body was there (Still can't cast any spells, just hold concentration).
You use the beasts stat sheet for everything but ignore it for mental stat checks. So for a saving throw you roll as if were the beast, with let's say -2 INT modifier. But for a History check you roll with your normal stats and proficiencies.
This makes it so much easier to remember, no comparing stats to see which is bigger and no hassle with the player trying to figure out a way to communicate in beast form.
A Dwarven bear getting poison resistance makes me happy.
I imagine all Dwarven druid wild shapes also retain the beard, while elven wild shapes retain the pointy ears... and yet, bandits never quite notice the bearded rat running around their HQ.
Fleet of Foot mentions anatomy in the name of the feature, so. No elf foot, no elf move.
Cool idea is armorer artificer + moon druid. Since the armor expands to cover your form, a generous reading of the rules might let you continue wearing your magic armor during wildshape.
druids refuse to use armor so by raw it doesnt work and the armor is still worn by you so it would merge with the form like anything else
@@finalfantasy50 they refuse to use metal armour. Your articifer armour could be made from leather or wood or something.
Awesome idea! And you could still use the lightning attack for example.
I’ve always considered the wood elf walking speed to be base 30 +5 for 35. So I would rule that the new creature gets a +5 to their base movement speed.
That makes sense. Since it carries over into wildshaped forms, it would likely be some kind of supernatural effect related to their connection with nature, or something like that.
17:00 - I would rule that the previous line there "Your ability to take any action that requires hands is limited to the capabilities of your beast form." is the specific ruling, while "prevent you from taking actions that are part of a spell" is the general ruling. Wild Shape, in and of itself, would not prevent you from using the instant summon, but a lack of hands or a lack of ability to speak would prevent you from doing that in snake form. The Circle of the Moon druid's elemental forms could use the instant summon - they have hands and are capable of speaking an elemental language after all.
19:40 - "Transforming doesn't break your concentration on a spell you've already cast, however, or prevent you from taking actions that are part of a spell, such as call lightning, that you've already cast." I read this as applying to your base form abilities, as they have already stated that ongoing spells continue to affect you. The stipulation that you can't use any of your special senses is a rider on the previous statement that you retain the benefits of your racial features if the new form is physically capable of it. ie: you can't say that because your new form has eyes, you can keep your elven darkvision. As Truesight is a spell, it modifies your form. So your new form starts with no truevision, but is then modified by the spell while it's active.
Here's a fun one. Just a few weeks ago, our party druid got afflicted by an aboleth's mucous cloud, and was forced to breathe water instead of air. Thing is, she was a giant constrictor at the time.
If she dropped wild shape, would she still suffer the same effect? What if she wild shaped again into a creature that can breathe air?
For that matter, how do normal diseases interact with wild shape, anyway? If a wild shaped druid contracts a disease, does that go away when she shifts back?
For most of these, I feel like you're just playing with us. My favorite class is druid, and I feel pretty confident in my understanding of Wild Shape. That said, your "what's reasonable to me" ruling looks to be right most of the time.
The "you have seen before" clause is just a DM "buy-in" clause; it's vague so DMs can rp or set a system if they so choose but otherwise does nothing. I mostly use it to limit options for first time players so they don't struggle with analysis paralysis.
Shapechange hp pool is separate from your base hp pool and your WS hp pool. So at 8:40, that's a shapechange issue and is independent of WS. If your concentration remains on shapechange despite being brought to 0 hp in WS, you revert to shapechange because it replaces your "normal form" for the duration of the spell. What makes it wonky is if you cast this spell while WS or shapechange again after WS; that's where we really have no rule on how it works.
So I think WS proficiency rules are bad as written, but you're mistaken in thinking you're running it wrong if I'm understanding you correctly. RAW and RAI, just look at the bonus (no formulas, no calculating). Looking at the brown bear, it has a +5/+6 "bite" attack which will always be a +5/+6 "bite." The brown bear doesn't have a DEX saving throw proficiency (but the Giant Sea Eel from Ghosts of Saltmarch does), so the bear has a +0 to DEX saves. If your DEX save bonus is higher but you lack proficiency, your bonus is 0. So looking at the Giant Sea Eel who has a +4 to DEX saves (+2 DEX), they always have a +4 bonus that doesn't scale with your character (if I'm understanding Jeremy Crawford*). In this case with DEX resilience, your character has a +7 bonus to DEX saves and uses this +7 bonus even when WS as a Giant Sea Eel. Calculating their proficiency bonus is irrelevant; just look at the bonus as a total.
Now, let's look at the most bogus example: let's say you have a +2 WIS, no proficiency in perception, and you WS into an owl at lvl 6. The owl has a +3 perception bonus listed on its sheet, and you have a +2 from your WIS. You don't recalculate based on your higher WIS or your higher proficiency bonus. Your perception, RAW and RAI, is +3. You only look at the bonus total without calculating any formula. It does not become +4 because of your WIS nor +5 with your proficiency. I disagree with everything that makes this RAW and RAI.
But you're also mistaken on how to determine the proficiency bonus for NPCs/monsters; treat their CR level the same as a PC level (rounded up if less than 1).
*In his tweets clarifying the intention Jeremy Crawford says: "A druid in beast form uses his or her proficiencies, except when the beast has the same proficiency with a higher bonus." and "The intent is that the druid uses the bonus in the beast's stat block for any proficiency the druid lacks." No matter how I read this and the WS rules, your proficiency bonus doesn't seem to apply to the beast's stat block. HOWEVER, everyone I know (and resources I've read) who's ever read this (and from whom I've gotten the tweets) all interpret that you calculate in your proficiency to the beast. You are the first person who has agreed with my reading comprehension and dndbeyond's WS functions (according to someone I play with, I haven't made a druid on there).
Carry over damage and hit dice is 100% correct.
Spells and actions of spells, your ruling is correct, but the qualifier is actually in the first sentence. (Despite not having hands) if your WS is reasonably capable of performing an action, you are able to perform the action. It just requires DM "buy-in," so the opposite ruling would also be correct if the DM doesn't think you would be reasonably capable.
Physically capable of doing so... oh, yep. Yeah, it's super gray. But the fine line it breaks on is if the ability includes a body part in the description that the new form doesn't have. Ah, you found a tweet. I haven't seen this one before, but yeah... I totally get you. Some things are dumb.
Personally how we've always handled wild shape is:
It lasts until you're knocked out of it or dismiss it. You use whichever stats are higher between you and the beast. Rather than any beast you've seen it's any beast you've "established a spiritual connection with" so getting new forms is more of an active mini adventure that lets us have "hey look what I earned" moments. All racial bonuses like dark vision carry over as long as it's not requiring something like an obvious anatomy such as a shell, claws, wings, etc. And we pick a shape as a favored form and it levels alongside so forms stay relevant and fun.
I’m playing a Werewolf in our current campaign (Moon Druid/Beast Barbarian/Long Death Monk). Only went to lvl 2 Druid, and will only be using Brown Bear until I unlock Beast Claws, and then while go Dire Wolf for the rest of the build. The key to my build is that the character is a Changeling, and uses Shapechange to adjust the Wildshape to be more humanoid (the Were in Werewolf). Large size means the Claws are 2d6+Str+Rage, and strike twice with a single attack action. As the character goes Monk, that means three attacks then four attacks, and finally six attacks at 2d6+6 each (and the occasional bite for 2d6+6 that also knocks the target probe on a failed Str save).
On the proficiency question: the wording has always led me to believe that if you're proficient in a skill or saving throw, you always add your proficiency bonus but still use the creature's (physical) ability scores.
I think the craziest interaction with wild shape is when you mix it with a changeling. You become an eldritch abomination if you can shapechange while wildshaped. Wolves with spider legs, rabbits with mandibles, deer that walk upright and bite like a hyena. You could also theoretically speak, and have human hands as an animal so logically you should be able to spellcast but wildshape won't let you. You can live all your weirdest furry dreams though. Just all at once in a horrific amalgamation that surely won't produce countless nightmares.
FYI, Monster proficiency bonus scales the same as PCs, but uses CR instead of level. i.e. CR 0-4 has +2 proficiency, CR 5-8 is +3 proficiency, and so on. Reference DMG chapter 9 table "Monster Stats by CR" you find this aligns with PC's proficiency bonus scaling and continues past lvl 20.
Re: seen shapes. Xanathar's has some optional guidance in the druid section. "Consider the environment your druid grew up in, then consult the appropriate table for a list of animals that your druid has probably seen by 2nd level". It DOES kinda imply that most/many druids will be from a small number of environments to get access to Brown Bear and Giant Eagle. (and no environment I can find includes Brown/Polar/Eagle)
Dwarven Fortitude doesn't work in wildshape. The prerequisite is being a dwarf.
"If you ever lose a feat’s prerequisite, you can’t use that feat until you regain the prerequisite."
The dwarven fortitude feat makes me curious about being a dwarven sorcerer with a Bloodwell Vial.
The spell Wither and Bloom from the Strixhaven book also works for this.
@@Ithruwen yes, it's the only thing that can make wither and bloom good
My favorite adaptation of wild shape was in the 3.5 Player’s Handbook 2 book. It offered an alternative to the base druid’s wild shape, and instead had different forms that offered static boosts. For example, you learn the ferocious slayer form at level 8, which it suggests may look like a bear, tiger, or dire wolf. You increase in size once, and it grants you a bite and two claw attacks, a +8 to Strength, a +4 to Fortitude saves, and a +8 to natural armor. No more question about if you’ve seen a creature anymore, and no more worrying about source books that add imbalanced beast stats. It also made it so druids couldn’t dump their physical stats anymore, which was an issue in 3.5. Their hit points never changed, so they couldn’t just continually shift to gain mountains of free hit points. To help with that, this version of wild shape has unlimited uses.
I think it’d be easy enough to adapt this to 5e with the introduction of Tasha’s summon spells. Make stats for your predator or aerial or whatever form, and then allow your druid to change into them based on whatever level restrictions you use.
Monster Proficiency bonus is tied to CR, there's a table in the DMG you can look it up on page 274.
Traits like Healing Machine do mention it being part of anatomy, right there in the name.
Ooo, I hadn’t thought of a moon druid with a breath weapon. I’m super down for that and checking with my DM now.
We're cleared for breath weapons! Let's do this!
Now this one is fair game, since you can gain this by pure magic, it's not a physical trait but a magical one ...
That could be fun if you first shapechange into a dragon, then wildshape into a cat.
There’s a chart in the introduction portion of the MM that lists proficiency bonus by CR.
*reads crawford's tweet*
*looks at plasmoid*
"The amorphous trait doesn't specify anatomy…"
*furiously pages through the monster manual to find the largest creature I can wild shape into to fit through a 1 inch hole*
thank you for keeping the stellar DnD content coming!
Here's my take!
1. Beasts you've seen should be covered by an agreement between you and your DM.
2. Your normal form sounds vague, but it also doesn't say it cleanses you from other effects. So Shapechange would still be in affect.
3.1. Because you are proficient in dexterity, you get to add your proficiency to your dexterity saving throw as a Brown Bear but use the form's dexterity. Wild Shape doesn't hinder your instincts, but that bear body sure makes dodging arrows tougher than what you remember it to be.
3.2. Monsters don't usually have a proficiency since that was designed for player-mechanic, which is why we take all other info from the monster stat block except the three mind skills and a possible proficiency - because that's rooted in the individual.
4. Carry over damage is affected by resistances if it makes sense so our DM rules it. For example a cone of cold would affect the normal form as well because the spell takes time, but a piercing damage from an arrow deals all of it's damage in a single instant.
5. Snakes can't talk, but they can do other actions that can be parts of a spell. But if your DM is cool with it, that would just make more cool moments.
6. Spells would remain in effect so True Seeing would work. It isn't "your" special sense. What does intrigue me is what would a person with true sight see when looking at a druid that has shaped into a rat. We just consider all physical traits getting replaced or removed by Wild Shape.
7. No Amphibious, Dwarven Resilience & Toughness, Rabbit Hop. But even Jeremy there is manacled to the templated text form of the books. 5e doesn't hide effects: what you see is what you get to a massive extent.
I'm pretty sure you know how Wild Shape works. You're an incredibly smart person. Some lines just need to be drawn by the DM. And those are the trials that define them as such.
I'd argue you'd revert to your "normal form", which is still under the effect of the
Shapechange spell.
Regarding the proficiency bonus of monsters, page 8 of the monster manual has a table called "Table: Proficiency Bonus by Challenge Rating" which I believe answers this question... although it's really not in an obvious place to say the least.
The Proficiency Bonus for monsters is actually, of all things, buried in the DMG! Page 274 gives the CR to PB chart, and is the only part of Monster creation that is a rule rather than a tradeoff guideline~
When I first started delving into DnD and learned about Wildshape and saw it in videos the first thing I remember thinking whenever some druid who never really saw much of the world transformed into a dinosaur or super rare but cool animal was "Wait a minute, I am 100% sure your character has *never* seen that animal in his whole life! Why is the DM allowing this? Okay because it's cool probably", but that always felt kind of weird/unsatisfying to me.
The way I read it, you don't get to add your ability scores to dex, strength and con saves when in wild shape. It says 'You also retain all of your skill and saving throw proficiencies, in addition to gaining those of the creature. If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature’s bonus instead of yours'. I think that passage 'bonus in its stat block is higher than yours' refers simply to the proficiency bonus, not to the total bonus. So if you had a proficency bonus of +2 and transformed into a creature with +3, and both you and the creature were proficient in con saves, you would add +3 to your con saves. However, if you had 16 con and the beast only had 10 con, I think you would only get +3, not +6.
The Bugbear’s “Sneaky” feature says “Without squeezing, you can move through and stop in a space large enough for a Small creature.” This means a 18th level Moon Druid can become a mammoth and still squeeze into small spaces. Definitely intended.
At the time Wild Shape was written, monsters (including animals) did not _have_ a proficiency bonus. If they had, then Wild Shape would have specified whether you keep your own bonus or use the beast's. But since the rule was not written with the future errata in mind, and you keep all of your stats that aren't overriden by an equivalent one in the beast statblock, you keep your own proficiency bonus.
In regards to your normal form certain abilities aren't intended to stack ie: temp HP or multiple sources of AC so an altered form would follow that same rule and a new altered form would override the previous. Eg. If the druid was already wildshaped and the wizard turn cat polymorph on them the polymorphed form would override the wildshape (if the player didn't resist the change) so the druid would no longer have access to class features and if concentration is lost or they ran out if temp HP then they would drop to their base form not their wildshape.
I agree with all of your rulings and readings except for the skill and STs. What I would do is just let you use the total bonus (including PB) that is higher, so if the beast has a crappy perception and I ask you to roll perception you can use your own character's, but if the beast has a STR ST of +5 you can use that one instead of your own
From the wording in the PHB this is how I think the ability scores and proficiencies work, however I also agree with just doing whatever the DM/table wants or thinks is most fun:
Str score = Beast's score
Dex score = Beast's score
Con score = Beast's score
Int score = Character's score
Wis score = Character's score
Cha score = Character's score
If the beast is proficient in a skill or save and your character is not, use the beast's proficiency bonus.
If your character is proficient in a skill or save and the beast is not, use your character's proficiency bonus (implied from the following statement "If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus in its stat block is higher than yours, use the creature's bonus instead of yours.").
If you are both proficient in a skill or save, use your character's proficiency bonus unless the beast's bonus is higher (directly stated in the above statement).
I'm not sure where Chris is reading that we get to use our character's Dex bonus on skills/saves we're proficient in but I think that is wrong since the book plainly states that all of your character's game statistics are replaced by the beast's statistics with the exceptions of Int/Wis/Cha scores, skill proficiencies, and saving throw proficiencies. This entire comment is also extremely pedantic so I'll stop it here
@@Caterpie56 "You dont know how to use wildshape"!
Proceeds to make a video with incorrect information. Honestly not even watching because I know how Wildshape works like the back of my hand, and the title was click bait, and pretentious.
@@GreyfauxxGaming he does go over some useful/interesting rulings with regards to racial traits but the part on proficiencies irked me because I know just how important wording is. Overall good video though so I would just skip over that section and get to the second half
My one solution to the Brown Bear proficiency bonus riddle was: It has a +1 proficiency bonus, but it has Expertise in Perception, doubling it to 2. It seems like this is redundant with Keen Smell in the mix, but it at least creates some consistency. (Using an errata to change it to +2 is fine as well. :) )
There is an implied base speed of 30ft in the races. Racial features increase or decrease from the 30. Fleet of foot is a +5ft to the base walking speed, so if you are using it in the wildshape form, then it is beast speed +5ft.
A follow up video... How do Magic Items worn by the Druid interact with Wild Shape?
"You choose whether your equipment falls to the ground in your space, merges into your new form, or is worn by it. Worn equipment functions as normal, but the DM decides whether it is practical for the new form to wear a piece of equipment, based on the creature's shape and size. Your equipment doesn't change size or shape to match the new form, and any equipment that the new form can't wear must either fall to the ground or merge with it. Equipment that merges with the form has no effect until you leave the form."
Another prickly issue: can you take the form of specific beasts you see? If you are still infiltrating the manor of a baron, can you take on the form of his calico housecat, with her very specific and recognisable markings, her scarred ear, and her bobbed tail? If your fighter friend has accepted a challenge to joust a rival knight, who shows up with a massive brute of a warhorse with all kinds of bonuses and proficiencies to joisting, could you shape shift into that specific horse to gain all those advantages for yourselves?
we played a campain with your idea of chaning wildshape from 1-18 it was a good character in that adventure/campain
I don't think anyone has said this but around the saving throw + skill proficiencies.
You wouldn't use your dex save modifier of +7 in the video. You would use your proficency of +3 and the bears dex of +0. So a total of +3.
"You retain all your skill and saving throw proficiencies" it would be "being proficent" that is what's carried over. I would assume the second half of that would refer to it having a higher proficency bonus in those skills.
My favourite "abuse" of this ambiguity is this:
1. Tabaxi: "your claws are natural weapons, which you can use to make unarmed strikes"
2. Unarmed fighting fighting style: Unarmed attacks become 1d8 if both hands are empty
3. Two levels in monk for Flurry of Blows.
4. Druid wild shaping into a Moorbounder for the claw attack:
Claws. Melee Weapon Attack: +6 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 14 (4d4 + 4) slashing damage.
Thus turning our unarmed tabaxi claws into natural weapons using d8s and then turning into a beast using those natural/unarmed attacks but dealing 4d8s per attack instead. Then Flurry of blows for total of 12d8 + 3xStr. 😂
In either tashas or xanathar, can't remember which, there is a list of beast and what regions they would be seen in. So you could just say your druid grew up around forests and you would get a whole list of creatures.
pretty certain there was a sage advice on the hit dice - they come from the BEASTs hit dice, not the "players". "Dark vision" is a "natural physical ability" of the creature (and therefore should be replaced with your current forms natural phsyical abilities) where "True sight" is a magic spell and should be retained. FOr the "toughness" abilities we always ruled that the toughness WAS applying....to the players HP and you still saw the benefit when you got knocked out of wildshape (as the druid in question of course I wanted to get extra HP for my bear )
To the proficiency bonus thing: There is a handy chart to the prof. bonus based on the CR in D&D Beyond
CR: 0-4 = +2
CR: 5-8= +3
CR: 9-12= +4
CR: 13-16=+5
CR: 17-20= +6
CR: 21-24= +7
CR: 25-28=+8
CR: >28= +9
Hope this proofs helpful
I actually give out cards with the statblocks of creatures the encounter saves the trouble of them being unsure and gives them something to plan with. Makes the game much smoother and easier to plan with . As for race, I just let them all stick and say that the wildshape works in a way that the gills stay or something.
If its a str, dex or con save or check you are profiencient in, use the beasts stat bonus plus your own profiency bonus. So a brown bear would be a +2 to a dex roll if your pb bonus is +2