The walther P38 is probably the most advanced handgun of the war because it's the first double action semiautomatic 9mm pistol but the P08 Luger is so iconic and cool.
The Hi-Power is probably my pick for “overall best” of WWII, but the P38 has a few design implements that are at least as impactful as the Browning. Between the two of them (and the 1911) you pretty much have all the modern ideas for how a handgun should operate
They did. The Beretta 92 is essentially a double stacked p38 with a slide that covers the entire length of the barrel, and the front sight is removed from the barrel and put on the tip of the slide instead
The Beretta M1951 was the first falling locking block pistol they produced which was influenced by the P-38. Similar to the P-38, it had a single stack magazine. So it’s more accurate to call the 92 series developed during the 1970s, a” double stack M 1951”.
As a beretta enjoyer, I really appreciate the engineering that went into the walther in order for the 92 to shine. It's the only pistol with both a sleek design and a slide I can operate with my massive hands (the cz 75 is a beautiful pistol, but dear god is the slide a fucking pain to operate with big hands)
Dont forget that Beretta did 1915 and 1917 pistols that looked pretty similar to the next Beretta guns. They might have “borrowed” some internal ideas from Walter though to some degree.
legend has it that the Fuerer in a fit of nostalgia decided to take the P08 fully apart and as a result could not assemble it back again, sitting over a pile of random pistol parts he uttered: "To many parts, we need a pistol that has half as much" ergo the P38 appeared (the Luger has 80 pcs. the Walther only 40 two of which were useless, german punctuality at its best ) )))
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry it might be in Lugers at Random.But using the letter block system that's 270,000.plus they made some commercial weapons. Mauser stopped production in '42 ,Kreighoff continued into 1945 for the Luftwaffe.
Nice presentation! Luger is such a beautiful iconic pistol. A lot of hand fitting involved in production. P38 just simply an outstanding design that really ushered in the age of double action/ single action semi Auto pistols.
The P-38 was double action and was not as jam prone as the P-08. German officers were allowed to carry any side arm they preferred. Astras were very popular and so was the Browning Hi Power.
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry I have one Nazi proofed example and two in 9mm Largo. They're commonly used by movie studios for conversions to fire blanks (most real .45 framed pistols don't cycle blanks very well). In fact, Jules in Pulp Fiction is carrying a nickeled Star with pear grips. It is a shame Star went out of business, they made some outstanding pistols.
And the P08 Lugar was so tightly fitted it would stop working under many combat conditions that the Walther P38 would continue working through just fine... The P38 was also designed to carry a round in the chamber with the hammer down and fired by double action safely, while the P08 was designed to carry with the chamber empty...
It's a trivial issue. Sidearms are a trivial part of an army's equipment. For those troops who need them, it mattered only that they had SOMETHING that could be used in an emergency. That's all.
When I was a youngster, Dad gave me a squirtgun with "Lugee" cast into the clear yellow-orange plastic. I spray painted it satin black to make it look really cool (bad idea nowadays) I was fascinated by it, and remained fascinated until I bought a real one 20 years ago. It's still a beautiful pistol, fun to shoot, but I just don't like putting the wear on it.
Worth noting that Luger production stopped-although there were plenty of “replicas” marketed by makers like Stoeger. The P38 continued to be manufactured, even in France, and used by German police and Bundeswehr -as P1-for decades. The Beretta 92 uses the same basic form and action.
Each piece on a PO-8 Parabellum is machined and milled for THAT specific gun. They were NOT "interchangable" as in the P-38. For some that's what makes the Lugar so special.
I have had both and you are correct. My Luger will jam just because I shot it on a Tuesday, whereas my P38 just runs and runs. I do wish my P38 had a larger capacity clip. Both provide an instinct-based shooting - just point and shoot.
I have a Luger that belonged to my grandfather. Field cleaning that gun is unbelievably simple. Because of the back angled grip, it feels very natural to shoot. My example is from 1917 and is still deadly accurate.
American soldiers would trade Lugers for everything, food, memorabilia, other weapons, etc. My uncle fought in the 82nd Airborne division from Africa - V/E day. He must have sent home more Lugers, Mauser K-98’s, among other items (spoils of war), that put my cousin through college. Smart man 😉👍🏻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
In war time it definitely makes sense to have a weapon that is easy to produce and crank out fast. In some cases it affected the quality but in other cases the simple designs made for great weapons that could be mass produced in a short time such as the AK47 and it's variants.
Most of the stories by allied WW2 soldiers and officers I’ve read say the Luger was mostly issued to German officers who preferred them to the Walthers for whatever reason and because of this the Luger was far more sought after by allied men as a war prize / “take-home” trophy over a Walther.
Interesting story of the P38 on the Man from UNCLE…. In the first episode they used a German 1934 Mauser automatic, but it jammed a lot and when the attachments were added the gun all but disappeared…. The gun used afterwards was a Walther P38 that worked better and didn’t disappear when the carbine attachments were added…. Stranger still, the P08 was also considered, but also was nixed…. The rest is TV history!
For a gun to be absolutely worth it *to me* it would have to do the following. 1. Cheaper to make, buy and easier to maintain. 2. Longer useage lifespan. In other words it gets so old you cant use it anymore. 3. Less frequent jamming. 4. Can take hotter diet loads of ammunition for longer periods of time. 5. Fits comfortably in my hand. 6. Is more accurate. 7. Can hold more ammo in a magazine. If the replacement gun cant do those things its not worth it. It should be able to do at least 2 or 3 of these things to be considered. Also to be considered all the things it didnt do it at least has to be on par with the previous weapon cuz if something was worse then i wouldnt bother. Lets say the new pistol holds more ammo, is more accurate and is cheap to make and easier to maintain but the other things is on par with the last pistol then its worth the upgrade. If any of those other things were worse than the last pistol then its not worth it cuz youre essentially just getting the same gun just a different face.
Lupin chose the P-38 because it wasn't a display piece, he was going to use it as a tool or a weapon, and everywhere he went to steal something he was likely to get his suit dirty, in turn his gun needed to be much more serviceable.
My Grandfather gave me his guns, he brought back a P-38 and a PPK from WW2. He was in the 10th Mountain Division He got them when they liberated Italy. He said Lugers were pretty scarce, he was in from 43 to 45 The P-38 is still like new, the holster has the soldiers name written on the inside. I also have the 1943 Colt 1911a1 he carried through the war, of all my guns it’s my favorite. I consider it an honor to have all 3 pieces of history and will pass them down to my children
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry So I shouldn’t have yelled at him for not getting me a Luger ? I’m just kidding of course But I’d love a chance to fire a real Luger from the era. Thanks for getting back to me. I really enjoy your videos
The P08. Luger would only feed copper nose bullets , lead bullets would cause extensive jamming. The P38. Would not jam on lead bullets because it did not have the toggle action It was a blow back action, for easier feeding. Kevin Phoenix
The P38 wasn't a blowback operated pistol, it was short recoil operated with a locked breech. Blowback operation doesn't have a locked breech, it relies on spring pressure and the mass of the slide/bolt to allow for its operation. A the Walther ppk is blowback, so are the Astra 300,400, and 600 series. The P38 is similar to the Beretta 92 in that they use a hinged locking piece to operate.
The feeding is related to the angle of the grip and magazine, but for army use there is only round FMJ used on all. The Luger angle block the hand in line with the forearm so less mazle flip and also greater accuracy for all shots including the first one, 80m rated for Luger and 50m for P38. P38 is not direct blowback operated but locked breech with sliding barrel as Luger, but instead of togle action P38 use a hinged block for locking the barrel to the slide similar to Berretta 92. On both P08 and P38 the barrel slide a few mm back locked to slide, until the bullet exit the barrel, and then the slide is unlocked.
I have fired a p38 and regardless of its rifled barrel it is usless for hitting a target pass 50 ft due to its 4 inch drift. it is very much for police and officers as you have to be within 25 feet of the target to be successful. using a std 9mm round.
If I remember correctly, the Bundeswehr (the German Armed Forces) used the P38 as their sidearm all the way up until 2004. but they used the P1 version of said pistol.
I’ve owned both, miss them both as they were sold when I deployed over seas again. But I agree that the P38 was all that was mentioned, plus it was a better shooter (accurate on target) for me.
Military Luger production ended in 1942. The Walther P38 was not only cheaper to make, but functionally more reliable in battlefield conditions. Side note - it was so technologically advanced, if you want to see its legacy, look no further than Beretta's 92F (or M9) which copied the design, only changing the aesthetics and converted the single-stack magazine into a staggered double-stack one. Functionally, it's the same firearm.
In addition to the switch to double stack mag, it replaced the P 38's twin recoil springs mounted at the back of the frame with a more conventional single spring mounted under the barrel. Hence the full length slide on the Berettas. The heel magazine release was also changed to a push button style. But the method of operation is indeed identical, and the overall shape of the weapon is clearly heavily influenced by the P38.
Also, S&W, in it's 1st, 2nd, & 3rd generation pistols, used the excellent Walther de-cocker/safety system. i have 3 of these S&Ws, and one or the other is my EDC; I also have a Bersa Thunder, another excellent pistol with the Walther safety.
One downside of the P 38 that the spent 9mm case would eject and hit you in your forehead 50% of the time or go over your head.I know because I bought a used one in the eighties and took it to a gun smith and he said that was one of the common things about the P38 handgun.I always made sure that I had glasses on but do not fire my P 38 made in 1975 in Germany very much because it hurts to get hit in your forehead with that spent case.
The P38 was the standard side arm in the Norwegian army as Germany kindly donated thousands of them to us in 1945. It was only replaced by the Glock 17 as the P80 in the Norwegian army in 1985. It is just very , very easy and simple to maintain. And you can field strip an assemble it in seconds with some practice. The Luger is a pain in comparison.
I think we all agree the Luger is the most beautiful pistol ever, but definitely not the most reliable or best! To me that Walter a thing of beauty as well.
Personally, I prefer the P38 primarily because it fits my hand well and the balance is good. I have also handled a luger and the feel is good but what I don't really like is the external slide mechanisms is problematic, there is opportunity for external jamming issues.
Love the P38. My very first pistol in 1987. Super accurate. Not a fancy as the P08, but it was a better gun in just about every aspect aside from aesthetics.
I used to have a Stainless Stoeger 6" Navy Luger I bought for $900. I regretfully sold it in '08. Beautiful fit and finish, unbelievably accurate, absolutely reliable. If you find one, grab it and hang on to it.
The best pistol that the Germans had was easily the browning hi power (issued to paratroopers), that pistol is still being used to this day and doesn't suffer from the heavy trigger pull of the Walter or the unreliability of the luger. Plus, the high power had a bigger magazine.
Considering that when West Germany created their own military in 1955, they chose to adopt the Walther P38 for their standard sidearm, yeah, I'd say it was worth it.
Nice video! Only for info: Walther is actually pronounced just Walter. The h is not pronounced, espacilly not like th (sfer). And the Name of the P.38 is correctly written with a point between P and 38.
Don't know why, but even with the goofy grip angle, the over complicated toggle action, the hand fitting of all the parts, I'd take the Luger every time!
Hank is using Walther P38 to shoot spotted Sussy Baka near base Luger and the Mauser Broomstick are also iconic in their era Such Classic guns are never die old
the reason for the change was coust and speed, the luger war more expensive and took longer and more material, than the p38, but outside of luger copies, the gun was very well made and parts could fit from one gun to another, the tolerances were tight, but could be done, they were not hand fited, nour war it over complicated, the p38 simply had a much simpler system.
The P38 was more apt to mass-manufacturing than the Luger, but it was still WAY too complicate for a total war. Too many pistols were needed, and at the same time workers had more important things to do than pistols. As a result, the Wermacht fielded much more .32 ACP blowbacks (Walther, Sauer and Mauser) than P38.
While I still favor the 1911 overall, the P38 shows evidence of SO many modern day firearms in terms of design and aesthetic just by a mere glance. Besides the Berreta, I can also see the slightly smaller ancestor of the P226.
Definitely one of the most influential designs of all time. And if I’m not mistaken a significant amount of Sig’s designs can in fact be traced to the P38 in one design aspect or another 👍🏻
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry Exactly. It'd be an interesting time of just holding up a picture or blueprint of the P38 beside a picture of other sidearms designed by Sig and other companies to just look at them side by side and think, 'Ah, there it is.' For the longest time I thought of the P38 as a peashooter but as time went by I've appreciated it more. Germans certainly knew how to make toys back in the day.
It is reliable as long as it’s the one fitted to that frame, they can be super unreliable if mismatched (everything was hand fitted so parts interchangeability was near nonexistent)
a big problem was that if dirt got under the toggle it would not close and would not lock the breech block, rendering the gun inoperative. and of course, there is not a much dirtier place than a battlefield.
Oba su bila veoma dobra za vreme kada su nastali P08 je veoma elegantan za svoje vreme nastanka od Bordharts koji je neuglednog izgleda nastao je veoma lep pištolj hvala Georgi Lugeru
I always wondered why the P38 had only 8 rounds. They could have had a double stacked magazine like the P35 (aka Hi-Power) that held more rounds. Cheers!
I believe the FN/Browning had a patent on that particular mag design at the time, the Germans would’ve had to design an entirely different system to get around it
Oddly J think my experience has been the opposite, I’ve never personally shot a P38 that felt particularly tight and it took me quite a bit of work to be able to shoot the P38 even somewhat decently, but the Luger just felt right to me. Can’t explain it, just one of those things I suppose
I've always wanted a Luger, but there are so many pieces of junk out there.. I did own two P38's that were converted or used by the west german police after the war .. Great firearms..
Estupendas las dos armas, pero había que hacerlas más rápido por eso aparece la P38,y aprovecharon a hacerlas con ajustes más olgados para poder usarce en ambientes más sucios.
Parabellum - as we Europeans call it - looks cooler and I'd say is also more fun to shoot with (though I've only shot with the original 7,65 mm version, never the 9mm) but P38/P1 for all effects and purposes was the more economical weapon. Am honestly surprised that the production didn't switch completely to accomodate the Walther.
I believe the only reason Mauser continued Luger production is because they were contracted prior to the introduction of the P38 and the contract ran through 1942, but don’t quote me on that I could be mistaken
@@joelee2371 Yea I wondered whether it was due to the difficulty of converting the existing methods to support the new weapon but frankly I have no idea how industrial logistics, let alone arms manufacturing, functioned in practise.
The Luger is just a natural … like an extension of your finger … there are other European guns that copied the Luger to the pin … except the toggle . You just never miss . So just don’t use a toggle. Keep the design. Like throwing the baby out with the …. 😊
The walther P38 is probably the most advanced handgun of the war because it's the first double action semiautomatic 9mm pistol but the P08 Luger is so iconic and cool.
Agreed on all accounts 👍🏻
What about the Browning Hi Power??
The Hi-Power is probably my pick for “overall best” of WWII, but the P38 has a few design implements that are at least as impactful as the Browning. Between the two of them (and the 1911) you pretty much have all the modern ideas for how a handgun should operate
Great point, double action is a big deal!
One of each would be nice and throw in a Hsc for goodmeasure
Personally if I was a GI in those days either one would've been a better souvenir than nothing.
Helluva lot better than a wooden leg.
@@dex2591 Yup
Imagine finding an fn browning instead
@@GrosvnerMcaffrey That'd be sick lol CO and S1 would know me always asking them to sign all those capture papers haha
Ye right after you'd execute gay concentration camp workers
I feel like Beretta borrowed Walthers homework and changed it enough to be different for the 92
Basically yeah
They did. The Beretta 92 is essentially a double stacked p38 with a slide that covers the entire length of the barrel, and the front sight is removed from the barrel and put on the tip of the slide instead
The Beretta M1951 was the first falling locking block pistol they produced which was influenced by the P-38. Similar to the P-38, it had a single stack magazine. So it’s more accurate to call the 92 series developed during the 1970s, a” double stack M 1951”.
As a beretta enjoyer, I really appreciate the engineering that went into the walther in order for the 92 to shine. It's the only pistol with both a sleek design and a slide I can operate with my massive hands (the cz 75 is a beautiful pistol, but dear god is the slide a fucking pain to operate with big hands)
Dont forget that Beretta did 1915 and 1917 pistols that looked pretty similar to the next Beretta guns. They might have “borrowed” some internal ideas from Walter though to some degree.
I own an ww2 P08…the accuracy is amazing…more accurate than a 2020 Colt 1911 government competition
We have a p38 that was made right after the war. The coolest gun I ever held
@@Gabe_the_gamersame. I think mine was early 50’s Berlin police issue.
I was surprised to see a Luger P08 on the hip of the German customs officer on my train in 1980.
legend has it that the Fuerer in a fit of nostalgia decided to take the P08 fully apart and as a result could not assemble it back again, sitting over a pile of random pistol parts he uttered: "To many parts, we need a pistol that has half as much" ergo the P38 appeared (the Luger has 80 pcs. the Walther only 40 two of which were useless, german punctuality at its best ) )))
The P08 is a historical work of art and a fine collection piece.
P38 is innovative but p08 is still iconic as ever
Cost and speed of production. I believe there were 300 machining operations on P-08 grips alone.
I read there are over 1100 seperate machining operations.
I believe I stumbled across a similar number, failed to record it in my notes though
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry it might be in Lugers at Random.But using the letter block system that's 270,000.plus they made some commercial weapons. Mauser stopped production in '42 ,Kreighoff continued into 1945 for the Luftwaffe.
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry as far as machining operations, Mike Krause .45 1907 test Luger maker mentioned it in a video
Did you buy yourself a Lugerman .45 1907 test Luger yet???
For those who don't know, the P38 was also the gun Megatron originally transformed into, in the original G1 toyline and TV show.
Heck yes I remember
Still my favorite form for megatron if you go for the original lookin bot mode. I dont care if the gun has to look fake
Nice presentation! Luger is such a beautiful iconic pistol. A lot of hand fitting involved in production. P38 just simply an outstanding design that really ushered in the age of double action/ single action semi Auto pistols.
Thank you kindly! Both were among the best of their respective times for sure
The Walther PP series were what ushered in double action/semi handguns
I just dont like the barrel of the P-38. It looks better on the Luger
I like the Walther because it's responsible for taking out one of history's most notorious supervillains.
The P-38 was double action and was not as jam prone as the P-08. German officers were allowed to carry any side arm they preferred. Astras were very popular and so was the Browning Hi Power.
The Star Model B in 9mm is a fine pistol too.
I’ve actually had the pleasure of shooting one of those in the past, surprisingly good gun. Hopefully I can get one in my collection someday 👍🏻
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry I have one Nazi proofed example and two in 9mm Largo. They're commonly used by movie studios for conversions to fire blanks (most real .45 framed pistols don't cycle blanks very well). In fact, Jules in Pulp Fiction is carrying a nickeled Star with pear grips.
It is a shame Star went out of business, they made some outstanding pistols.
Officer only most Junior Platoon etc carry 9x19
Senior 7,65,22, 9 short/ .25,.32.380ACP’s smaller the gun bigger the boss
@@454FatJack all true, the big guy himself carried a Walther .25.
And the P08 Lugar was so tightly fitted it would stop working under many combat conditions that the Walther P38 would continue working through just fine...
The P38 was also designed to carry a round in the chamber with the hammer down and fired by double action safely, while the P08 was designed to carry with the chamber empty...
They’re both absolutely beautiful
I worked for John Martz Luger Carbine maker in the 1970s and 1980s and no not everything was hand fitted in the Luger P08.❤❤❤❤❤
It's a trivial issue. Sidearms are a trivial part of an army's equipment. For those troops who need them, it mattered only that they had SOMETHING that could be used in an emergency. That's all.
I own a WW2 P38. Love it. It's easy to break down and operate. Luger is more precise but I prefer the P38. Just an opinion from an old man.
When I was a youngster, Dad gave me a squirtgun with "Lugee" cast into the clear yellow-orange plastic. I spray painted it satin black to make it look really cool (bad idea nowadays) I was fascinated by it, and remained fascinated until I bought a real one 20 years ago. It's still a beautiful pistol, fun to shoot, but I just don't like putting the wear on it.
The P08 will never be replaced.
P38 saw service all the way into the nineties with the German army. Their honor guards still use them to this day.
Never did I think I would have either until just a couple of years ago. Now I have multiples of both and really enjoy them each for different reasons.
Hopefully someday I’ll have one of each variant (within reason, or not lol) so much history in every example
Worth noting that Luger production stopped-although there were plenty of “replicas” marketed by makers like Stoeger. The P38 continued to be manufactured, even in France, and used by German police and Bundeswehr -as P1-for decades. The Beretta 92 uses the same basic form and action.
- Cheaper
- More reliable
- Safer
Each piece on a PO-8 Parabellum is machined and milled for THAT specific gun. They were NOT "interchangable" as in the P-38. For some that's what makes the Lugar so special.
A well functioning and at least mostly matched Luger is a very fine machine, a mismatched/poorly maintained example is near unusable
I have had both and you are correct. My Luger will jam just because I shot it on a Tuesday, whereas my P38 just runs and runs. I do wish my P38 had a larger capacity clip. Both provide an instinct-based shooting - just point and shoot.
I enjoyed shooting the P-38 while I was stationed in Germany in the early 1980s.
I have a Luger that belonged to my grandfather. Field cleaning that gun is unbelievably simple. Because of the back angled grip, it feels very natural to shoot. My example is from 1917 and is still deadly accurate.
American soldiers would trade Lugers for everything, food, memorabilia, other weapons, etc.
My uncle fought in the 82nd Airborne division from Africa - V/E day. He must have sent home more Lugers, Mauser K-98’s, among other items (spoils of war), that put my cousin through college. Smart man 😉👍🏻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
In war time it definitely makes sense to have a weapon that is easy to produce and crank out fast. In some cases it affected the quality but in other cases the simple designs made for great weapons that could be mass produced in a short time such as the AK47 and it's variants.
Most of the stories by allied WW2 soldiers and officers I’ve read say the Luger was mostly issued to German officers who preferred them to the Walthers for whatever reason and because of this the Luger was far more sought after by allied men as a war prize / “take-home” trophy over a Walther.
Interesting story of the P38 on the Man from UNCLE….
In the first episode they used a German 1934 Mauser automatic, but it jammed a lot and when the attachments were added the gun all but disappeared….
The gun used afterwards was a Walther P38 that worked better and didn’t disappear when the carbine attachments were added….
Stranger still, the P08 was also considered, but also was nixed….
The rest is TV history!
They are both works of art
For a gun to be absolutely worth it *to me* it would have to do the following.
1. Cheaper to make, buy and easier to maintain.
2. Longer useage lifespan. In other words it gets so old you cant use it anymore.
3. Less frequent jamming.
4. Can take hotter diet loads of ammunition for longer periods of time.
5. Fits comfortably in my hand.
6. Is more accurate.
7. Can hold more ammo in a magazine.
If the replacement gun cant do those things its not worth it. It should be able to do at least 2 or 3 of these things to be considered. Also to be considered all the things it didnt do it at least has to be on par with the previous weapon cuz if something was worse then i wouldnt bother.
Lets say the new pistol holds more ammo, is more accurate and is cheap to make and easier to maintain but the other things is on par with the last pistol then its worth the upgrade. If any of those other things were worse than the last pistol then its not worth it cuz youre essentially just getting the same gun just a different face.
Lupin chose the P-38 because it wasn't a display piece, he was going to use it as a tool or a weapon, and everywhere he went to steal something he was likely to get his suit dirty, in turn his gun needed to be much more serviceable.
Based Lupin enjoyer
Both of them are beauty's
My Grandfather gave me his guns, he brought back a P-38 and a PPK from WW2. He was in the 10th Mountain Division
He got them when they liberated Italy. He said Lugers were pretty scarce, he was in from 43 to 45
The P-38 is still like new, the holster has the soldiers name written on the inside. I also have the 1943 Colt 1911a1 he carried through the war, of all my guns
it’s my favorite. I consider it an honor to have all 3 pieces of history and will pass them down to my children
That’s awesome man, not gonna lie I’m a bit jealous!
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry
So I shouldn’t have yelled at him for not getting me a Luger ?
I’m just kidding of course
But I’d love a chance to fire a real Luger from the era. Thanks for getting back to me. I really enjoy your videos
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry
I’d like to send you a few pictures to get your thoughts on them, is there any way I could send them to you?
@3rdRangerBatt if you have Instagram you could direct message them to me there 👍🏻
The P08. Luger would only feed copper nose bullets , lead bullets would cause
extensive jamming.
The P38. Would not jam on lead bullets
because it did not have the toggle action
It was a blow back action, for easier
feeding. Kevin Phoenix
The P38 wasn't a blowback operated pistol, it was short recoil operated with a locked breech. Blowback operation doesn't have a locked breech, it relies on spring pressure and the mass of the slide/bolt to allow for its operation. A the Walther ppk is blowback, so are the Astra 300,400, and 600 series. The P38 is similar to the Beretta 92 in that they use a hinged locking piece to operate.
The feeding is related to the angle of the grip and magazine, but for army use there is only round FMJ used on all. The Luger angle block the hand in line with the forearm so less mazle flip and also greater accuracy for all shots including the first one, 80m rated for Luger and 50m for P38. P38 is not direct blowback operated but locked breech with sliding barrel as Luger, but instead of togle action P38 use a hinged block for locking the barrel to the slide similar to Berretta 92. On both P08 and P38 the barrel slide a few mm back locked to slide, until the bullet exit the barrel, and then the slide is unlocked.
I have fired a p38 and regardless of its rifled barrel it is usless for hitting a target pass 50 ft due to its 4 inch drift. it is very much for police and officers as you have to be within 25 feet of the target to be successful. using a std 9mm round.
If I remember correctly, the Bundeswehr (the German Armed Forces) used the P38 as their sidearm all the way up until 2004. but they used the P1 version of said pistol.
I’ve owned both, miss them both as they were sold when I deployed over seas again. But I agree that the P38 was all that was mentioned, plus it was a better shooter (accurate on target) for me.
A lucky returning GI of WWII had a Luger and a P38 in gear!
I have both but prefer the Luger. It feels better and is more reliable. I accept that the P38 has double action, and that's a benefit.
P08 was not as reliable by a long shot.
I still love to shoot P38.. Super gun!
They are excellent, especially for their time
Military Luger production ended in 1942. The Walther P38 was not only cheaper to make, but functionally more reliable in battlefield conditions. Side note - it was so technologically advanced, if you want to see its legacy, look no further than Beretta's 92F (or M9) which copied the design, only changing the aesthetics and converted the single-stack magazine into a staggered double-stack one. Functionally, it's the same firearm.
In addition to the switch to double stack mag, it replaced the P 38's twin recoil springs mounted at the back of the frame with a more conventional single spring mounted under the barrel. Hence the full length slide on the Berettas. The heel magazine release was also changed to a push button style. But the method of operation is indeed identical, and the overall shape of the weapon is clearly heavily influenced by the P38.
Also, S&W, in it's 1st, 2nd, & 3rd generation pistols, used the excellent Walther de-cocker/safety system. i have 3 of these S&Ws, and one or the other is my EDC; I also have a Bersa Thunder, another excellent pistol with the Walther safety.
One downside of the P 38 that the spent 9mm case would eject and hit you in your forehead 50% of the time or go over your head.I know because I bought a used one in the eighties and took it to a gun smith and he said that was one of the common things about the P38 handgun.I always made sure that I had glasses on but do not fire my P 38 made in 1975 in Germany very much because it hurts to get hit in your forehead with that spent case.
The P38 was the standard side arm in the Norwegian army as Germany kindly donated thousands of them to us in 1945. It was only replaced by the Glock 17 as the P80 in the Norwegian army in 1985.
It is just very , very easy and simple to maintain. And you can field strip an assemble it in seconds with some practice.
The Luger is a pain in comparison.
I just plain love em both! 🤷♂️
Both are excellent!
I think we all agree the Luger is the most beautiful pistol ever, but definitely not the most reliable or best! To me that Walter a thing of beauty as well.
Luger was a classy weapon-that is why Abwehr used it. Plus, much more precise and fits the hand better.
I was surprised to see a P38 be a prominent firearm in the recent "Justified : City Primeval" series .
Haven’t actually watched that yet, it’s on my list though 👍🏻
Personally, I prefer the P38 primarily because it fits my hand well and the balance is good. I have also handled a luger and the feel is good but what I don't really like is the external slide mechanisms is problematic, there is opportunity for external jamming issues.
We would all love to own a WW I/WW II luger, but I really like the P38 and would live to have one
They’re both fascinating guns, and some of the best of their respective time periods
Love the P38. My very first pistol in 1987. Super accurate. Not a fancy as the P08, but it was a better gun in just about every aspect aside from aesthetics.
The Walther never really replaced the Luger, the Luger was still used by the Germans until 1945. Because the Luger was made in huge numbers
Still in use yes, but production was discontinued in 1943
The 08 is such a beautiful gun
Agreed
I used to have a Stainless Stoeger 6" Navy Luger I bought for $900. I regretfully sold it in '08. Beautiful fit and finish, unbelievably accurate, absolutely reliable. If you find one, grab it and hang on to it.
I have one, 4". Biggest piece of junk ever. Rarely gets through a mag without issues.
@@BozgorSlayerwas yours a .22 cal. The 9 was fine.
@@johnjacobjingleheimerschmi3857 Nope- mine's 9mm. Even the mags won't load more than 6rnds.
The best pistol that the Germans had was easily the browning hi power (issued to paratroopers), that pistol is still being used to this day and doesn't suffer from the heavy trigger pull of the Walter or the unreliability of the luger. Plus, the high power had a bigger magazine.
Considering that when West Germany created their own military in 1955, they chose to adopt the Walther P38 for their standard sidearm, yeah, I'd say it was worth it.
Always liked them both!! 😉
The broom handle is one my favorite pistols lugers get more credit then they deserve because of the movie Sergeant york i believe it was
I’d say WWI & WWII movies in general, it seems everyone has a Luger. I’m hoping to get a Broomhandle at some point
Habe mit 12 Jahren mit Beiden schießen gelernt... 👍
cause it looks dope af, that’s why
Essentially yes lol
"Was it worth it?"
I mean... now we have 3 amazing German pistols to add to our collections so..
yes!
I would love to get my hands on a P38
They’re pretty cool!
Nice video!
Only for info: Walther is actually pronounced just Walter. The h is not pronounced, espacilly not like th (sfer).
And the Name of the P.38 is correctly written with a point between P and 38.
La Luguer para mí vitrina.
La P38 para portar.
👍👍🇦🇷🇦🇷
Don't know why, but even with the goofy grip angle, the over complicated toggle action, the hand fitting of all the parts, I'd take the Luger every time!
The Germans also carried Kongberg Colt 45’s… (they were manufactured in Norway)…
Indeed they did! Along with many other contract/occupation pistols. Don’t have a Kongsberg yet but hopefully someday
indeed they did, a very little known fact.nmodtbprople know about the High Powers, but few knew about the Colt-licensed plant.
Hank is using Walther P38 to shoot spotted Sussy Baka near base
Luger and the Mauser Broomstick
are also iconic in their era
Such Classic guns are never die old
I actually used the p38 as inspiration for my fictional retromodern handgun!
It’s a good one to draw inspiration from!
the reason for the change was coust and speed, the luger war more expensive and took longer and more material, than the p38, but outside of luger copies, the gun was very well made and parts could fit from one gun to another, the tolerances were tight, but could be done, they were not hand fited, nour war it over complicated, the p38 simply had a much simpler system.
The P38 was more apt to mass-manufacturing than the Luger, but it was still WAY too complicate for a total war. Too many pistols were needed, and at the same time workers had more important things to do than pistols. As a result, the Wermacht fielded much more .32 ACP blowbacks (Walther, Sauer and Mauser) than P38.
While I still favor the 1911 overall, the P38 shows evidence of SO many modern day firearms in terms of design and aesthetic just by a mere glance. Besides the Berreta, I can also see the slightly smaller ancestor of the P226.
Definitely one of the most influential designs of all time. And if I’m not mistaken a significant amount of Sig’s designs can in fact be traced to the P38 in one design aspect or another 👍🏻
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry Exactly. It'd be an interesting time of just holding up a picture or blueprint of the P38 beside a picture of other sidearms designed by Sig and other companies to just look at them side by side and think, 'Ah, there it is.' For the longest time I thought of the P38 as a peashooter but as time went by I've appreciated it more. Germans certainly knew how to make toys back in the day.
I always wondered what the P38 would look like if it was in Wolfenstein: The New Order.
Yeah that not being a thing was a missed opportunity
I have an early Sig 9mm. It is very close to a P38. But I would of preferred a 1911 any day.
How reliable is the toggle-lock action? I'm guessing that that's a big reason for the advance of the P-38 over the Luger.
It is reliable as long as it’s the one fitted to that frame, they can be super unreliable if mismatched (everything was hand fitted so parts interchangeability was near nonexistent)
a big problem was that if dirt got under the toggle it would not close and would not lock the breech block, rendering the gun inoperative. and of course, there is not a much dirtier place than a battlefield.
Beautiful guns
Thanks Thomas!
This Saturday- range day . Get to put some first time rounds through my Kar 98 k purchase and first time shooting a mates Swiss K31 👍
Very cool! And ironically I just shot a K11 vs K31 video over the weekend, probably posting it late tonight/early tomorrow morning
The Walther could be better but for me the Luger is still the best. Its loading technology and style are literally priceless!
Agreed, and I’ve always personally been more accurate with the Luger. Dunno why, I just am
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry ...cause it is🤭😌
the Luger is a lovely thing, but beauty and practicality don't mix well on the battlefield. although, the P38 is not in any way an ugly weapon.
Oba su bila veoma dobra za vreme kada su nastali P08 je veoma elegantan za svoje vreme nastanka od Bordharts koji je neuglednog izgleda nastao je veoma lep pištolj hvala Georgi Lugeru
I always wondered why the P38 had only 8 rounds. They could have had a double stacked magazine like the P35 (aka Hi-Power) that held more rounds.
Cheers!
I believe the FN/Browning had a patent on that particular mag design at the time, the Germans would’ve had to design an entirely different system to get around it
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry True, but that never stopped the inventive Germans from innovation.
Cheers!
in my opinion p38 was always really cool looking pistole.
It’s definitely a neat one!
Fun fact the original Megatron transformed into a Walter p38
Did Fn produce/ distribute the Hi- power?
Yes, before, during and after the occupation
If you’ve ever shot both, you’d know why the P38 replaced the P08.
See I actually shot a Vs video with both of them (posting April 2nd) and my results were pretty inconclusive 🤷♂️
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry In my experience, the P38 felt much tighter while shooting. I didn’t like the feel of the Luger.
Oddly J think my experience has been the opposite, I’ve never personally shot a P38 that felt particularly tight and it took me quite a bit of work to be able to shoot the P38 even somewhat decently, but the Luger just felt right to me. Can’t explain it, just one of those things I suppose
@@GreatNorthwestWeaponry It could’ve been the individual guns that we shot. I only have a sample size of one for each weapon.
The big reason the P38 replaced the Lugar is because it was more reliable and didn't jam!
That’s definitely one of the reasons 👍🏻 production cost/time were also big concerns
Yeah , the P38 was a cheaper gun to make , but it was still a damn fine firearm !!
Oh for sure! I actually shot a faceoff video between the two last week, it’ll be posted sometime later next weeek 👍🏻
I've always wanted a Luger, but there are so many pieces of junk out there.. I did own two P38's that were converted or used by the west german police after the war .. Great firearms..
The P38 served another 50 years under a different name. The Bundeswehr called it P1, but it was the same pistol really.
I Love Walter this is German Hero❤💛🖤❤💛🖤
It’s definitely a neat one
Estupendas las dos armas, pero había que hacerlas más rápido por eso aparece la P38,y aprovecharon a hacerlas con ajustes más olgados para poder usarce en ambientes más sucios.
But the Lugar radiates power and aggression like a radioactive metal.Hold it in your hand and you will feel like a boss.
Luger, the archnemesis of GD&T. 😂😂😂😂
Are you the guy I met at the war front in Milwaukie?! If so, hell yeah keep the vids coming!!!
Yup, that’s me! 👍🏻
The guy with that minty pre war Kar 98k?
p38 is superior, but that p08 i just love for its german ubiquitous uniqueness
Nice comparison.
Parabellum - as we Europeans call it - looks cooler and I'd say is also more fun to shoot with (though I've only shot with the original 7,65 mm version, never the 9mm) but P38/P1 for all effects and purposes was the more economical weapon. Am honestly surprised that the production didn't switch completely to accomodate the Walther.
I believe the only reason Mauser continued Luger production is because they were contracted prior to the introduction of the P38 and the contract ran through 1942, but don’t quote me on that I could be mistaken
the lines were already set up to make them, so there was no point in shutting them down, as they were needed.
@@joelee2371 Yea I wondered whether it was due to the difficulty of converting the existing methods to support the new weapon but frankly I have no idea how industrial logistics, let alone arms manufacturing, functioned in practise.
The Beretta 92 is literally just an iteration on the p38. The Luger was really a dead end in the pistol world
The Luger is just a natural … like an extension of your finger … there are other European guns that copied the Luger to the pin … except the toggle . You just never miss . So just don’t use a toggle. Keep the design. Like throwing the baby out with the …. 😊