I remember dismantling one of my sister's dolls to find one of those voiceboxes. I was completely amazed by the little turntable inside! My sister, however, was not as amazed.
I had that exact "phonograph" when I was around 14-15. I had to take it apart just to see the drive mechanism.. I was surprised it was an idler drive just like my BSR at the time! Oh the memories... Thank you for this..
Raposa Dislexa, Disney is run by dirty rotten greedy ass holes now. Walt Disney was a Genius, he was kind and caring and positive to point out a few things about him, he would NOT Be happy with what is going on now, it is not how he ran things at all
I really liked the Fisher Price one at the end...I think the playback quality for those was pretty impressive for the time, considering the technology available
this is insane! the amount of innovation that must have gone into stuff like this... they're all the same thing, but different. i love it. thanks for putting it out there, i would have never known this stuff existed.
The Fisher Price Read-to-Me device reminds me of something a professor of mine used to play back bird songs to my class. In 2015. He also had some documentaries on VHS, and I brought in a VCR to play them on because the crappy VCR in the classroom couldn't even be hooked up to the TV.
It's interesting to note that most of these work on the very same principles as the original gramophones - vibrations of the stylus cause a reproducer to generate sound. That Fisher-Price thing is ingenious, adapting phonograph technology for toddlers. I saw a video not long ago (one of Techmoan's, I think) of a similar device from Japan, the Panapic, in which the phonograph disc was stationary and the player spun the stylus. Except the Panapic wasn't for kids.
I had that Talking Football game. I'm trying to find one to buy. You are the first person I've seen that even knew about it. I loved that thing. My neighbor across the street had one too. Brings back great memories.
The mini record player, the first one you showed, reminded me of a commercial for something called a Pocket Rocker whose slogan was "Tiny tapes, tiny player".
WOW this brought back memories from 40+ years AGO!! I had the talk to me books and remember that player well. I also remember having a ride on jumper horse that had a little brown saddle pack that played horse noises!!
I remember back in the early '70s, some cereals started putting these little mini records in the box as a prize, and the commercials suggested they were actual records with hit songs on them and lots of kids got their parents to buy the cereal, only to discover the records were duds, unplayable. They looked just like the records that came with the Mattel game and I wondered if maybe there was some type of player in which they'd actually work?
My mom bought ALOT of cereal for my brother and I . I had records that were small and on the back it showed a phonograph but they didn't say where you could buy the record player because I would have had that ! This was in the 1970's I believe .
Great job! I love the way you get into the mechanical aspects of the devices you feature. I remember dissasembling a toy called the tuneyville choo choo as a kid in the late 70s. It would be a great item for your channel since it actually whistled because it used a miniature fan to blow the notes.
I took apart my sister's talking doll. She went crying to Mother, of course. She never actually played with the doll, not even once. Just couldn't turn down a chance to get me in trouble.
The Fisher Price one is very similar to the Panapic, that Techmoan reviewed awhile back. The records are in a book, the player is placed on the record, and the needle goes round and round.
OMG, I had the Fisher Price player, I remember the mother goose, Mickey mouse, and the Grover books. Thanks for bringing back so many fond memories of my childhood.
The Ozen was also produced by a company in Milan, Italy, it was called "Minifon" and virtually all dolls in the 70's and first part of the 80's were "powered" by it ;-D
I had one of those voice boxes in a toy that I think I may have purchased from Spencer's Gifts at a mall. It was called a "Bag O Laughs" and it was a small draw string bag with the box inside. If you opened the draw string it would start playing the record with scratchy demonic laughing. I think it really only sounded demonic because of the scratchyness though.
the read-to-me book records works the same way as the SportsTalk talking sports cards systems. my dad got me one as a kid in the 80s and it still works today. all i have is baseball cards but cards have a plastic record on the back of them. you place the card into the SportsTalk machine and it would playback interviews with the player on the card. I love that thing.
I went back to my childhood home in SoCal and visited my old shopping mall. The ONLY store still there in the same location for 35 years in the mall was Spencer Gifts.
I remember the Fisher-Price Talk-To-Me Books. I was about in my final year of preschool when it was released. And at that time, I remember learning the long word, exterminate.
I used to have a toy machine gun with one of these Ozen sound box things in it that played shooting dounds when you pulled the trigger. Was pretty cool back then.
This reminds me of a telephone I had as a youngster. It had a small blue plastic record inside. I did get the motor running but at that age I had no idea how to get it working properly. If I find any images (or even listings) for that I'll add an updated comment.
9:36 This system was also used in the "talking toys" by Mattel, (like the Talking Farm) when you pointed the arrow on the dial, and wound up the system by pulling the cord or lowering the handle, a track from a multi track disc was played based on where the arrow was pointed
I just rewatched the video and realized that it is impossible to measure the Ozen record because he didn't show it playing. But by counting frames. Step the video frame by frame and see how many frames it takes for the record to make one revolution. I counted the football record takes 13 frames to make one revolution. 30 FPS / 13 FPR = 2.308 rev/sec 2.308 rev/sec * 60 = ~138.5 RPM Interestingly, this does not agree with the 105 RPM stated. For the poynter phonograph, I counted 17 frames per revolution giving ~106 RPM For a sanity check, I counted the actual phonograph to be 22-23 frames per revolution giving between 78 and 82 RPM.
dandanthetaximan A former Mattel employee who supervised the making of their records stated that their lathe had been modified so that the speeds they used were 90, 105 and 133 rpm. 90 was for records with a thumb-sized hole (hence the Ozen); 105 was for records with no hole, only a nick in the middle (hence the Talking Football); and 133 was for 1-1/2 inch records used in dolls
@@m2esectr Yeh that's me that said that and the Mattel employee in question was my great-uncle. ``Modified'' is a little bit of a misnomer though - because originally A) 90 RPM was half-speed-mastered at 45 B) 105 is what you get for 78 when your 33 is set to 45 (on a Scully) C) 133 used to be quarter-speed mastered at 33 like talking books for the blind. In the case of C) these were 8-1/3 RPM discs cut at 33. The only original modification was when they were still trying to get the real-size custom miniature lacquers to work (they never did) by making a small mount about an inch high to place them on so that the vacuum system would work removing the thread. As every record enthusiast already knows - cutting inside out as these are instead of outside in TECHNICALLY eliminates the need for vacuum thread removal because all the thread falls into the center where the recording has already taken place instead of outside in where recording hasn't taken place yet. But that of course only holds true when there's a label area into which the thread can fall. When the recording starts at the hole and winds out, there's still noplace for the thread to go - therefore the vacuum thread removal is still necessary. Enter in what was already the dominant format for making doll records - take a normal 14-inch lacquer - punch a series of extra holes around a circumference on the disc, cut as you normally would if the disc had been centered and repeat the process moving the disc to the next hole and so on and so on. For the micro records 2-inches and under it is possible to utilize a second larger circumference around the disc to repeat the process after which the plating and pressing process remains the same with the final records being separated out later on. In the case of the flexidisc versions, same thing - only difference is the pressing process. But the real-time 90 and 105 was really never an option after the real-size miniature lacquer project fell on its' face - purely because of the level of lacquer perfection being insufficient to be able to record such a high speed like that and the loss of expensive recording styli caused thereby. It's also why there's never been any such thing as a 16-inch transcription or 17-1/4 inch transcription master disc ever cut at anything other than 33. Anybody who would ever try it would never be able to get a whole side done in one take like what needs to happen - and would blow several $30 apiece master laquers and $300 apiece recording styli in the attempt. Not to mention that if anybody tried half-ish speed mastering (33 for 78) they'd have to have a POUND of vinyl (half a kilo) to make a 16-inch disc stiff enough - and would have to use special 4.5 mil or larger styli and a tracking weight in the OUNCES JUST to be able to TRACK at 78 - and even then it would be doubtful. So don't try this at home guys. Not responsible for what happens to you if you do. Now the OTHER thing you can look up is the Juniorfon which is the German version of the exact same system used in the dolls - and on that itty bitty gramophone reproduction (minus the notch in the center). As everybody has found out by now - most of those - with the exception of the Carnival Toy which is both lateral as well as 78 RPM same as the Mattel-O-Phone - are also vertically modulated like many music transcriptions in addition to being cut inside out in the same fashion. This would account for the puny sound of the Oh Susanna on a conventional turntable. Many of the pull-string acoustic-only toys are also vertical modulation because of fewer parts needed - glorified Solo cup and a glorified pin on the bottom with a little button resting on the bottom of the cup is all that's needed. Welcome to the world of the half blind fat partially autistic dork with way too much time on his hands.
I remember getting a Talking Football game for Christmas in 1972. Lots of fun. Also available were records devoted to sports figures....I remember names like John Brodie and Pete Maravich who were featured on them. These were not multi-groove records. The side with the playing groove had a more conventional cut, so played for about 30 seconds; the other side would have a picture of the person glued to it. And some others were devoted to such things as race cars. At least one I had in that series was not only double sided, the playing surfaces were clear vinyl, with pictures laminated in the core. That's right--these were technically picture discs, and I'd guess they were the smallest of the type ever produced.
When I was kid we had that Ozen device and it was actually hidden in some kind of sack. Then you push the button through the sack and it starts laughing. I think it was called something like "laughing sack" or so :-)
Still got one of those somewhere, it was yellowish IIRC. The novelty of a laughing sack wore thin very quickly and it never even got a fresh set of battery s when the originals died.
this player also was used in many „speaking“ dolls and there were a lot of additional records available .. children songs and sound effects (crying or laughing baby etc.)
The Fisher-Price Talk-to- Me does have slip rings for the cartridge. The cartridge is a mono Astatic 89T cartridge stylus used with Telex/Audiotronics & other brands of mono school record players & some of the Fisher-Price record players.
I was wondering about playing that first one on a proper record player too. Voicebox: I've always thought it would be amusing to swap records in those. A great source of the player is Action Man radio thing. The records are swappable. Also, if you remove the platter, it fits onto a record player. I had the record playing no problems at 78 RPM.
if you remember the IBM punch cards when I was young they had cards like them but with magnetic tape and you had to place one after another through the player
I had one as a kid that was similar in size to the Ozen, but it was intended to be opened up, so you could put the record in. The record had actual picture sleeves. I cannot find any information on it.
I remember Mad Magazine sent a flimsy blueish transparent record with one delivery. Played on any ordinary turntable, but it's special feature was that it didn't always play the same thing. They somehow worked in an intentional skip or something. Anyway, that's just an old memory.
I think you mean their 'It's a super-spectacular day' flexi, which had the same first part, and eight different endings depending on where the tonearm landed. A master disc for something like this is very difficult to produce as however many separate grooves next to each other have to be cut, one at a time, getting them all in just the right places. The first ones were called 'puzzle records' or in the case of this earliest-known example from 1901, a 'puzzle plate' (as Emile Berliner first called his disc records plates). ua-cam.com/video/XaLog1I_4eg/v-deo.html
Hey those mini records are very cool 😎 and quite interesting and this was a very educational video and a very good and fun video and an awesome video and a really great job done keep up the excellent work
i remember my first experiance with a "turntable" it was one of thoes, music boxes with the music box hidden in the tone arm, and yeah the imperial troop transport, michael of retroblasting did a restoration video of it, you should check it out if you havent
Mattel's See 'n Say uses a system of playing a plastic disc with lead-in grooves to play certain sounds in relation to where the needle is dropped, just like their Talking Football game that was demonstrated in this video. It has that plastic cone for the speaker as well. The difference is that it only uses one plastic disc, which is built into the toy. Also, the See 'n Say has a lever, which is attached to gears, which are attached to a string, which is connected to a stylus and a brass spring. When you pull the lever down on a See 'n Say, it turns the gears which pull the string, which lifts the needle and pulls it back to one of lead-in grooves at the outer edge. At the same, the string winds the brass spring, so when you let go of the string, the energy in the spring makes the disc spin, which causes the needle to follow along the groove. So you don't need batteries to make a See 'n Say work, like you do for the Talking Football game. As with many spring-wound mechanisms, the disc is connected to a governor by a belt which helps control the speed of the disc and keep it from wobbling.
that last one at the end the record idea looks just like one Techmoan showed of a japanese book when is in japanese but the player is basically a round cylendar (sp) with a needle on the bottom, which for new old stock tended to skip at the end. wonder if this plays those :O
didn't think there's be thumbs up on this comment, I did look that video up and it runs from out to in. The one shown above is in to out. Now some hobbyists might be able to figure out how to switch the motor backwards to it can play out to in. Just a thought. Mostly to avoid the skipping problem Techmoan had.. Woulda made for one of Q's Rejects I assume (007) (nah someone would know how to read it. unless it's a laser etched paper or something like that
the ozen voicebox was a copy of the Italian made minifon player and unlike all the later clones of this toy player. it wasn't initially meant for dolls but was to be used as a miniature regular record player the doll records mainly have crying baby sounds but the minifon had children's songs and even orchestral music on them. not all minifon players have the logo of this brand on them but they lack the screw to fasten them in the doll and it has no portruding wires. if a minifon is in a doll it can be easily taken out by just pulling it out later versions came with an optional doll to put your player in. also the Italian minifon is the first company to bring out the laughing bag
Do you know if you can buy the little record players alone that go in the voice box? I have an old Doll that has one of those voice boxes, but I can’t seem to find any of the players out of the voice box. I don’t want to buy a whole new voice box when the one I have works.
The way the diaphragm is positioned on the original player at 5:21 I think the grooves were cut vertically as the Edison records rather than laterally. That could be the reason more distortions at 7:10 because the main vertical modulation cancels out on the lateral mono cartridge. Try capture the audio with a stereo cartridge then render only the L-R part of the audio using Audacity.
Man, I remember that book player. My school had one of those in their K class. It was impressive for the time, no doubt. I think that might've been what got me interested in tech, in all honesty. Oh, and am I the only one who had those nursery rhymes ruined by Andrew "Dice" Clay in the late 80's?
That last Fisher Price one looks fascinating. I can imagine kids were having a blast with that, back in the day. Not so good for the parents though. I'm afraid kids got eager to hear a second story before they went to sleep.
when I was a kid, I remember a little girl that rode the same bus as me with one of those fisher price "talking book" players & a book and I took it from her & took it off the bus with me and her parents showed up on our doorstep to get it back. Before they came, though, I took it all apart to see how it worked and then put it back together & thank God it still worked, LOL! I got grounded for that one, though! LOL! I also had a player similar to the sports one that took winnie the pooh "records" and it was blue plastic. I had that for a few moths after I got it for Christmas until I took it apart to see how IT worked and ruined it. LOL! I'd pay BIG BUX for another player & records like that one (the winnie the pooh player)
Cheap? Be respectful of the Asians... It was a clever and expensive toy... That made a little one very happy!!! And now with everybody throwing things away in America it's probably worth 50 bucks each... With viewers going Dam, I Shouldn't have tossed that,,,,,, away!!!
Dumbo's day at the circus... For five year old that's a work of art... Jaded narrator... This would take two month old babies to like 5 years old make them ecstatic...
@ databits Did you know that in early Mattel See & Say talking toys, the sound was generated by a phonograph record? I learned that back in 2013. Up until then, I didn't know how talking toys that didn't require batteries worked. Interestingly enough, Mattel made phonograph based See & Say toys into the 1990's
Fixy Clary That's right, but even though Mattel produced phonograph based See & Say toys in the 1990's, I believe that battery operated electronic talking toys were becoming more popular then.
I'm a Mini phonograph. I think you should try Playing the Turkey in the straw. Record with the audio photograph and the audio from the record player that made it sound good
The speed control in the Fisher Price machine is on the circuit board, so I guess that it contains not only an audio amplifier, but also a regulator for the motor. That makes sense in a product of that quality: without it, the speed and pitch would vary as the batteries get worn.
The old See and say taking toys used a record with multi lead in start groves , Turning the pointer to a picture selection rotated the record to que up the proper lead in groove that plays the correct audio example..the record on a see and say the farmer says has 12 unique lead in locations.
Thanks sharing Mickey's guts and stuff, Databits. :-) That Fisher-Price unit is definitely cool. BTW, you sound kinda like the guy that does the 'collector dot net' YT page... are you related?
I loved the video, these toy turntables I find very interesting, any child would love to play with one of these, including myself hahahahahah ^^ (I'm 22 years old :3)
I had a giant pound puppy toy that has that pinkish ozen box to the right of the tiny gramophone. Also you should do a teardown of the Mickey Mouse Talking Phone. My cousin had one and I was curious as to how it worked. I know today it has some type of record similar to that football one you showed with multiple tracks because the phone played different character sounds. You should play these on a regular turntable like the small record. Maybe even record them to MP3s. Fisher price storybook player: Curious as to how the needle connects to the amp and then is able to turn like that.
That was my first question also how that contact works. Without all the digital and wireless technology back then, the toy makers got really creative and innovative to create something affordable and exciting for the kids.
I had a remote control (corded) toy fire truck with extending and rotating ladder and back then I took stuff apart, I took the ladder part apart and it had a metal ring in the swiveling part with two or more contacts running on it for power to the lights and motors on the ladder. This was back in 89-90. No LEDs, small incandescent bulbs I bet they used something like that but more reliable since it has to transmit a sound signal to the amp. Maybe it uses something like in a video head drum in a VCR. two coils, one on the moving part and one on the stationary part.
The first one: I don't suppose the stylus is replaceable? Did it sound that bad when new? I know on Victrolas, they recommend changing the stylus after each single record play. I know it's a tinny toy.
I remember dismantling one of my sister's dolls to find one of those voiceboxes. I was completely amazed by the little turntable inside!
My sister, however, was not as amazed.
I had that exact "phonograph" when I was around 14-15. I had to take it apart just to see the drive mechanism.. I was surprised it was an idler drive just like my BSR at the time! Oh the memories... Thank you for this..
The book series is amazing!! So clear. So many kids must have loved those. :)
U know how friendly Disney is when you need a friggin DISCLAIMER just because you are showing a Disney toy that they don't even remember exists
Raposa Dislexa, Disney is run by dirty rotten greedy ass holes now. Walt Disney was a Genius, he was kind and caring and positive to point out a few things about him, he would NOT Be happy with what is going on now, it is not how he ran things at all
Better get used to that, because sooner or later, Disney will own the entire entertainment industry, unless the Chinese beat them to it.
@@ricknelsonm Didn't he extend the copyright expiration date to an extreme amount of time? I think he was the same.
@@cooliofoolio
Done in 86 or 88 iirc when Mickey was gonna go into the public domain
He was long gone by then
I really liked the Fisher Price one at the end...I think the playback quality for those was pretty impressive for the time, considering the technology available
Yeah I was very impressed how loud and clear the voices were coming through, but then when he showed the amplifier and speaker, it made sense.
I was honestly kind of shocked an old kids toy using such a rudimentary system was so loud and clear
this is insane! the amount of innovation that must have gone into stuff like this... they're all the same thing, but different. i love it. thanks for putting it out there, i would have never known this stuff existed.
Thanks for watching!
Absolutely fascinating . Your enthusiasm is infectious. I look forward to more dismantling ,saves me having to do it myself!
Charles Achurch my thoughts exactly.
That was big fun! Thanks for the in depth demonstrations!
The Fisher Price Read-to-Me device reminds me of something a professor of mine used to play back bird songs to my class. In 2015. He also had some documentaries on VHS, and I brought in a VCR to play them on because the crappy VCR in the classroom couldn't even be hooked up to the TV.
Great work
It's interesting to note that most of these work on the very same principles as the original gramophones - vibrations of the stylus cause a reproducer to generate sound.
That Fisher-Price thing is ingenious, adapting phonograph technology for toddlers. I saw a video not long ago (one of Techmoan's, I think) of a similar device from Japan, the Panapic, in which the phonograph disc was stationary and the player spun the stylus. Except the Panapic wasn't for kids.
I'm fascinated :) thank you for posting
I had that Talking Football game. I'm trying to find one to buy. You are the first person I've seen that even knew about it. I loved that thing. My neighbor across the street had one too. Brings back great memories.
Well done!
Absolutely Cool!!
Fantastic channel. Super interesting content.
I love it. Brilliant video
The mini record player, the first one you showed, reminded me of a commercial for something called a Pocket Rocker whose slogan was "Tiny tapes, tiny player".
WOW this brought back memories from 40+ years AGO!! I had the talk to me books and remember that player well. I also remember having a ride on jumper horse that had a little brown saddle pack that played horse noises!!
The Fisher Price one was by far the one with the best fidelity!
Great video
i love that lil record player and oen disc left thats awesomes i like how it sounds trully staticool
I remember back in the early '70s, some cereals started putting these little mini records in the box as a prize, and the commercials suggested they were actual records with hit songs on them and lots of kids got their parents to buy the cereal, only to discover the records were duds, unplayable. They looked just like the records that came with the Mattel game and I wondered if maybe there was some type of player in which they'd actually work?
My mom bought ALOT of cereal for my brother and I . I had records that were small and on the back it showed a phonograph but they didn't say where you could buy the record player because I would have had that ! This was in the 1970's I believe .
Great job! I love the way you get into the mechanical aspects of the devices you feature. I remember dissasembling a toy called the tuneyville choo choo as a kid in the late 70s. It would be a great item for your channel since it actually whistled because it used a miniature fan to blow the notes.
I took apart my sister's talking doll.
She went crying to Mother, of course. She never actually played with the doll, not even once. Just couldn't turn down a chance to get me in trouble.
Entertaining video, thanks!
Amazing
The Fisher Price one is very similar to the Panapic, that Techmoan reviewed awhile back. The records are in a book, the player is placed on the record, and the needle goes round and round.
I recall these also being used in Tomy's Cosmic Clash Mini Arcade for the sound effects. Very ingenious use of this system for the time!
OMG, I had the Fisher Price player, I remember the mother goose, Mickey mouse, and the Grover books. Thanks for bringing back so many fond memories of my childhood.
Ahhhhh Vintage Vinyl, good record shop! ;-) I remember NHS!
The Ozen was also produced by a company in Milan, Italy, it was called "Minifon" and virtually all dolls in the 70's and first part of the 80's were "powered" by it ;-D
Always facinating to see what weird ways people make sound
I had one of those voice boxes in a toy that I think I may have purchased from Spencer's Gifts at a mall. It was called a "Bag O Laughs" and it was a small draw string bag with the box inside. If you opened the draw string it would start playing the record with scratchy demonic laughing. I think it really only sounded demonic because of the scratchyness though.
the read-to-me book records works the same way as the SportsTalk talking sports cards systems. my dad got me one as a kid in the 80s and it still works today. all i have is baseball cards but cards have a plastic record on the back of them. you place the card into the SportsTalk machine and it would playback interviews with the player on the card. I love that thing.
Very Interesting
ah, back when spencer gifts sold toys, not "toys"
I went back to my childhood home in SoCal and visited my old shopping mall. The ONLY store still there in the same location for 35 years in the mall was Spencer Gifts.
Yeah the records for that were probably not pornographic or dirty in nature.
I remember the Fisher-Price Talk-To-Me Books. I was about in my final year of preschool when it was released. And at that time, I remember learning the long word, exterminate.
I used to have a toy machine gun with one of these Ozen sound box things in it that played shooting dounds when you pulled the trigger. Was pretty cool back then.
DJ Numark uses those little records and recordplayer to scratch with. He has a really cool toy routine.
The football game and talking book records sound remarkably good for something so crude!
This reminds me of a telephone I had as a youngster. It had a small blue plastic record inside. I did get the motor running but at that age I had no idea how to get it working properly.
If I find any images (or even listings) for that I'll add an updated comment.
9:36 This system was also used in the "talking toys" by Mattel, (like the Talking Farm) when you pointed the arrow on the dial, and wound up the system by pulling the cord or lowering the handle, a track from a multi track disc was played based on where the arrow was pointed
You and Techmoan are the best !
oh wow! when I was really little I had those fisher price books but not the player I always wondered what the discs were for.
it is hard to believe that when I was young those stories were a part of my childhood
The Ozen record plays at 90 rpm, and the Mattel Talking Football records play at 105 rpm
Maybe by measuring it?
I just rewatched the video and realized that it is impossible to measure the Ozen record because he didn't show it playing.
But by counting frames. Step the video frame by frame and see how many frames it takes for the record to make one revolution.
I counted the football record takes 13 frames to make one revolution.
30 FPS / 13 FPR = 2.308 rev/sec
2.308 rev/sec * 60 = ~138.5 RPM
Interestingly, this does not agree with the 105 RPM stated.
For the poynter phonograph, I counted 17 frames per revolution giving ~106 RPM
For a sanity check, I counted the actual phonograph to be 22-23 frames per revolution giving between 78 and 82 RPM.
dandanthetaximan A former Mattel employee who supervised the making of their records stated that their lathe had been modified so that the speeds they used were 90, 105 and 133 rpm. 90 was for records with a thumb-sized hole (hence the Ozen); 105 was for records with no hole, only a nick in the middle (hence the Talking Football); and 133 was for 1-1/2 inch records used in dolls
@@m2esectr Yeh that's me that said that and the Mattel employee in question was my great-uncle.
``Modified'' is a little bit of a misnomer though - because originally
A) 90 RPM was half-speed-mastered at 45
B) 105 is what you get for 78 when your 33 is set to 45 (on a Scully)
C) 133 used to be quarter-speed mastered at 33 like talking books for the blind. In the case of C) these were 8-1/3 RPM discs cut at 33.
The only original modification was when they were still trying to get the real-size custom miniature lacquers to work (they never did) by making a small mount about an inch high to place them on so that the vacuum system would work removing the thread.
As every record enthusiast already knows - cutting inside out as these are instead of outside in TECHNICALLY eliminates the need for vacuum thread removal because all the thread falls into the center where the recording has already taken place instead of outside in where recording hasn't taken place yet.
But that of course only holds true when there's a label area into which the thread can fall. When the recording starts at the hole and winds out, there's still noplace for the thread to go - therefore the vacuum thread removal is still necessary.
Enter in what was already the dominant format for making doll records - take a normal 14-inch lacquer - punch a series of extra holes around a circumference on the disc, cut as you normally would if the disc had been centered and repeat the process moving the disc to the next hole and so on and so on.
For the micro records 2-inches and under it is possible to utilize a second larger circumference around the disc to repeat the process after which the plating and pressing process remains the same with the final records being separated out later on.
In the case of the flexidisc versions, same thing - only difference is the pressing process.
But the real-time 90 and 105 was really never an option after the real-size miniature lacquer project fell on its' face - purely because of the level of lacquer perfection being insufficient to be able to record such a high speed like that and the loss of expensive recording styli caused thereby.
It's also why there's never been any such thing as a 16-inch transcription or 17-1/4 inch transcription master disc ever cut at anything other than 33.
Anybody who would ever try it would never be able to get a whole side done in one take like what needs to happen - and would blow several $30 apiece master laquers and $300 apiece recording styli in the attempt.
Not to mention that if anybody tried half-ish speed mastering (33 for 78) they'd have to have a POUND of vinyl (half a kilo) to make a 16-inch disc stiff enough - and would have to use special 4.5 mil or larger styli and a tracking weight in the OUNCES JUST to be able to TRACK at 78 - and even then it would be doubtful.
So don't try this at home guys. Not responsible for what happens to you if you do.
Now the OTHER thing you can look up is the Juniorfon which is the German version of the exact same system used in the dolls - and on that itty bitty gramophone reproduction (minus the notch in the center).
As everybody has found out by now - most of those - with the exception of the Carnival Toy which is both lateral as well as 78 RPM same as the Mattel-O-Phone - are also vertically modulated like many music transcriptions in addition to being cut inside out in the same fashion. This would account for the puny sound of the Oh Susanna on a conventional turntable.
Many of the pull-string acoustic-only toys are also vertical modulation because of fewer parts needed - glorified Solo cup and a glorified pin on the bottom with a little button resting on the bottom of the cup is all that's needed.
Welcome to the world of the half blind fat partially autistic dork with way too much time on his hands.
Cool!
I remember getting a Talking Football game for Christmas in 1972. Lots of fun. Also available were records devoted to sports figures....I remember names like John Brodie and Pete Maravich who were featured on them. These were not multi-groove records. The side with the playing groove had a more conventional cut, so played for about 30 seconds; the other side would have a picture of the person glued to it.
And some others were devoted to such things as race cars. At least one I had in that series was not only double sided, the playing surfaces were clear vinyl, with pictures laminated in the core. That's right--these were technically picture discs, and I'd guess they were the smallest of the type ever produced.
When I was kid we had that Ozen device and it was actually hidden in some kind of sack. Then you push the button through the sack and it starts laughing. I think it was called something like "laughing sack" or so :-)
Still got one of those somewhere, it was yellowish IIRC. The novelty of a laughing sack wore thin very quickly and it never even got a fresh set of battery s when the originals died.
this player also was used in many „speaking“ dolls and there were a lot of additional records available .. children songs and sound effects (crying or laughing baby etc.)
Late 70s had the bag too
You look like you're about to kill somebody with those records in the thumbnail. LOL!! I just had to
Actually I was constipated. :D
Constipated record throwing ninja man!
LMAO!!!
@@databits Never mind, you've changed it.
I had the Fisher Price when I was a kid. The memories.
Holy crap I remember those Fisher Price books with the records on the pages! I've been trying to find the name of them for years, and now I know :-)
The Fisher-Price Talk-to- Me does have slip rings for the cartridge. The cartridge is a mono Astatic 89T cartridge stylus used with Telex/Audiotronics & other brands of mono school record players & some of the Fisher-Price record players.
I had a tiny plastic jukebox (1970s). Only song I remember was 'turkey trot'(?)
14:24 I had this thing when I was a tot, & all of the same books too.
They remind me both of Japanese singles mini Cds & the 19th century glass & wax records of the Volta Laboratory collection.
I was wondering about playing that first one on a proper record player too.
Voicebox: I've always thought it would be amusing to swap records in those. A great source of the player is Action Man radio thing. The records are swappable. Also, if you remove the platter, it fits onto a record player. I had the record playing no problems at 78 RPM.
cool
Awesome vid just found a Sonora phonograph for sale buying it tomorrow
if you remember the IBM punch cards when I was young they had cards like them but with magnetic tape and you had to place one after another through the player
I had one as a kid that was similar in size to the Ozen, but it was intended to be opened up, so you could put the record in. The record had actual picture sleeves. I cannot find any information on it.
I remember Mad Magazine sent a flimsy blueish transparent record with one delivery. Played on any ordinary turntable, but it's special feature was that it didn't always play the same thing. They somehow worked in an intentional skip or something. Anyway, that's just an old memory.
I think you mean their 'It's a super-spectacular day' flexi, which had the same first part, and eight different endings depending on where the tonearm landed.
A master disc for something like this is very difficult to produce as however many separate grooves next to each other have to be cut, one at a time, getting them all in just the right places.
The first ones were called 'puzzle records' or in the case of this earliest-known example from 1901, a 'puzzle plate' (as Emile Berliner first called his disc records plates).
ua-cam.com/video/XaLog1I_4eg/v-deo.html
Hey those mini records are very cool 😎 and quite interesting and this was a very educational video and a very good and fun video and an awesome video and a really great job done keep up the excellent work
Richard!!! Thanks so much for your comment and for being a subscriber!
@@databits you're welcome
i remember my first experiance with a "turntable" it was one of thoes, music boxes with the music box hidden in the tone arm, and yeah the imperial troop transport, michael of retroblasting did a restoration video of it, you should check it out if you havent
I sooo love your accent i cant seem to figure it out what part ur from 😄 for real and i love the videos
Love how your use of a back scratcher (I had forgotten they even exist) to point at each element to be shown along the video. Random? Means anything?
I remember seeing the player from the talking mickey toothbrush used in pound puppies toys before
Mattel's See 'n Say uses a system of playing a plastic disc with lead-in grooves to play certain sounds in relation to where the needle is dropped, just like their Talking Football game that was demonstrated in this video. It has that plastic cone for the speaker as well. The difference is that it only uses one plastic disc, which is built into the toy.
Also, the See 'n Say has a lever, which is attached to gears, which are attached to a string, which is connected to a stylus and a brass spring. When you pull the lever down on a See 'n Say, it turns the gears which pull the string, which lifts the needle and pulls it back to one of lead-in grooves at the outer edge.
At the same, the string winds the brass spring, so when you let go of the string, the energy in the spring makes the disc spin, which causes the needle to follow along the groove. So you don't need batteries to make a See 'n Say work, like you do for the Talking Football game. As with many spring-wound mechanisms, the disc is connected to a governor by a belt which helps control the speed of the disc and keep it from wobbling.
The See 'b'day Say toys also had records in them.
that last one at the end the record idea looks just like one Techmoan showed of a japanese book when is in japanese but the player is basically a round cylendar (sp) with a needle on the bottom, which for new old stock tended to skip at the end. wonder if this plays those :O
didn't think there's be thumbs up on this comment, I did look that video up and it runs from out to in. The one shown above is in to out. Now some hobbyists might be able to figure out how to switch the motor backwards to it can play out to in. Just a thought. Mostly to avoid the skipping problem Techmoan had.. Woulda made for one of Q's Rejects I assume (007) (nah someone would know how to read it. unless it's a laser etched paper or something like that
I still recall all the cereal box records we collected. And my sister had the Kenner Close and Play. Those ruined many a 45 rpm record!
the ozen voicebox was a copy of the Italian made minifon player and unlike all the later clones of this toy player.
it wasn't initially meant for dolls but was to be used as a miniature regular record player the doll records mainly have crying baby sounds but the minifon had children's songs and even orchestral music on them.
not all minifon players have the logo of this brand on them but they lack the screw to fasten them in the doll and it has no portruding wires.
if a minifon is in a doll it can be easily taken out by just pulling it out later versions came with an optional doll to put your player in. also the Italian minifon is the first company to bring out the laughing bag
Do you know if you can buy the little record players alone that go in the voice box? I have an old Doll that has one of those voice boxes, but I can’t seem to find any of the players out of the voice box. I don’t want to buy a whole new voice box when the one I have works.
The way the diaphragm is positioned on the original player at 5:21 I think the grooves were cut vertically as the Edison records rather than laterally. That could be the reason more distortions at 7:10 because the main vertical modulation cancels out on the lateral mono cartridge. Try capture the audio with a stereo cartridge then render only the L-R part of the audio using Audacity.
Fisher Price Talking Books discs are quite good quality. Probably the best out of the lot.
Man, I remember that book player. My school had one of those in their K class. It was impressive for the time, no doubt. I think that might've been what got me interested in tech, in all honesty.
Oh, and am I the only one who had those nursery rhymes ruined by Andrew "Dice" Clay in the late 80's?
That last Fisher Price one looks fascinating. I can imagine kids were having a blast with that, back in the day.
Not so good for the parents though. I'm afraid kids got eager to hear a second story before they went to sleep.
I like your toothbrush!
when I was a kid, I remember a little girl that rode the same bus as me with one of those fisher price "talking book" players & a book and I took it from her & took it off the bus with me and her parents showed up on our doorstep to get it back. Before they came, though, I took it all apart to see how it worked and then put it back together & thank God it still worked, LOL! I got grounded for that one, though! LOL! I also had a player similar to the sports one that took winnie the pooh "records" and it was blue plastic. I had that for a few moths after I got it for Christmas until I took it apart to see how IT worked and ruined it. LOL! I'd pay BIG BUX for another player & records like that one (the winnie the pooh player)
Hey,
For 6 years old that's perfect!
Stop those negative waves.lol
Cheap?
Be respectful of the Asians...
It was a clever and expensive toy...
That made a little one very happy!!!
And now with everybody throwing things away in America it's probably worth 50 bucks each...
With viewers going Dam, I
Shouldn't have tossed that,,,,,, away!!!
Dumbo's day at the circus...
For five year old that's a work of art...
Jaded narrator...
This would take two month old babies to like 5 years old make them ecstatic...
Engineering Marvel look at the battery cover you can't lose it...
Luv
That engineer.
There's a place in a mall near me called spencer's, and it's one of the funniest stores i've been too
I've wonder if you can get mini records with custom sounds
@ databits Did you know that in early Mattel See & Say talking toys, the sound was generated by a phonograph record? I learned that back in 2013. Up until then, I didn't know how talking toys that didn't require batteries worked. Interestingly enough, Mattel made phonograph based See & Say toys into the 1990's
Mitch Matthiesen And which lead-in groove you chose was determined by which person/thing the arrow was pointed to.
Fixy Clary That's right, but even though Mattel produced phonograph based See & Say toys in the 1990's, I believe that battery operated electronic talking toys were becoming more popular then.
That's the night terror Mickey.
I'm a Mini phonograph. I think you should try Playing the Turkey in the straw. Record with the audio photograph and the audio from the record player that made it sound good
The speed control in the Fisher Price machine is on the circuit board,
so I guess that it contains not only an audio amplifier, but also a
regulator for the motor. That makes sense in a product of that quality:
without it, the speed and pitch would vary as the batteries get worn.
OMG I had one from the same movie! You lousy poop! :) Also, that talking football one looks like the Six Million Dollar Man, Van playset's unit.
The old See and say taking toys used a record with multi lead in start groves , Turning the pointer to a picture selection rotated the record to que up the proper lead in groove that plays the correct audio example..the record on a see and say the farmer says has 12 unique lead in locations.
Can you reproduce the Owen disc in another record player ?
On the Fisher Price how is the signal passed to the amplifier? With a turning cartridge. Slip rings maybe?
I was thinking the same thing but if you look closely you can see two rings at the top of the turning part. So yeah, guess they are slip rings.
Thanks sharing Mickey's guts and stuff, Databits. :-)
That Fisher-Price unit is definitely cool.
BTW, you sound kinda like the guy that does the 'collector dot net' YT page... are you related?
I loved the video, these toy turntables I find very interesting, any child would love to play with one of these, including myself hahahahahah ^^ (I'm 22 years old :3)
I’ve been trying to make a movie accurate woody voice box and I don’t know how to make a custom record for the 1960’s Mattel pull string voice box
I would like to build a Library of Audio Books on these tiny Records so kindly suggest a collection scheme of two colours
This vid is groovy man..
the speed of toy mini records is a 100 rpm and that was a pretty standard speed for most toy producing companies all over the globe
5:22 Like 12 seconds running time... That's like a just slightly extended smartphone notification sound!
I assume these are Edison style encoding? (Vertical modulated groove?)
I had a giant pound puppy toy that has that pinkish ozen box to the right of the tiny gramophone.
Also you should do a teardown of the Mickey Mouse Talking Phone. My cousin had one and I was curious as to how it worked. I know today it has some type of record similar to that football one you showed with multiple tracks because the phone played different character sounds.
You should play these on a regular turntable like the small record. Maybe even record them to MP3s.
Fisher price storybook player: Curious as to how the needle connects to the amp and then is able to turn like that.
That was my first question also how that contact works.
Without all the digital and wireless technology back then, the toy makers got really creative and innovative to create something affordable and exciting for the kids.
I had a remote control (corded) toy fire truck with extending and rotating ladder and back then I took stuff apart, I took the ladder part apart and it had a metal ring in the swiveling part with two or more contacts running on it for power to the lights and motors on the ladder. This was back in 89-90. No LEDs, small incandescent bulbs
I bet they used something like that but more reliable since it has to transmit a sound signal to the amp. Maybe it uses something like in a video head drum in a VCR. two coils, one on the moving part and one on the stationary part.
The first one: I don't suppose the stylus is replaceable? Did it sound that bad when new? I know on Victrolas, they recommend changing the stylus after each single record play. I know it's a tinny toy.
Hehe! The 80s rule!