Thank you all for the kind words! One question I am getting via DM that I think would be helpful for everyone to hear my thoughts: IMS Bearing: "Has the IMS been replaced, what has been done about the IMS, et al....": The 2005.5-2008 M97 era motors used Porsche's final version of the IMS bearing. The good news is that bearing has a lower failure rate than version 1 (96-99) and a MUCH lower failure rate than version 2 (2000-2005) however it is NOT zero. IF you need the 100% assurance that you will not have an IMS failure than one needs to NOT buy any M96/M97 era of motors. To me this versions failure rate falls into my level of acceptable risk however every person has different risk tolerance, so evaluate that for yourself. The BAD news is that this bearing is physically too large to be removed from the case (unlike the earlier versions which can be replaced) and as such in my opinion can't be replaced. (there is a company which has a method to physically enlarge the IMS flange housing bore but IMO that is not an acceptable method, you can form your own opinion). The only thing one can do is remove the grease seal on the IMS bearing to increase splash lubrication. Hope that helps!
I forgot the engine serial number for M97 engines from then on that had a much improved version of the IMS bearing that was installed .......... am I confused about this ? Pretty early in the 2007 model year the improved IMS bearing was being used in the M97 according to these 'later' serial number engines installed in these cars from what I read long ago - and their IMS failure rate is almost non-existent. Also these cars had a Porsche bulletin to change the single coil ignition to 6 individual coils around 2010 I think - many of these cars have not had this done. Has it been done on this car or am I wrong about that too? Thx.
Under the car - [ ] damage to front bumper - [ ] Damage to tub - [ ] Check that covers are present and has correct fasteners - [ ] Check brand of tire - [ ] Check tire wear - [ ] Check tire wear, is it even? - [ ] Check damage to rockers - [ ] Leak from CV joints - [ ] Check for leaks - [ ] valve covers - [ ] oil pan - [ ] Damage to rear bumper - [ ] Exhaust tips - [ ] check rear shielding present Exterior - [ ] Check impact damage front - [ ] check radiators, are they clean? - [ ] Look for door dings, from back of car to front - [ ] paint mismatch - [ ] check that the window drops when you grab door handle - [ ] check that the window goes up when you close the door - [ ] check that it completely closes - [ ] Check how much oil is used - [ ] Check for chips on edge of doors - [ ] Check that all lights illuminate when starting the car - [ ] Check oil level - [ ] Check that it doesn’t smell damp inside Engine - [ ] check that engine lid works - [ ] check that fasteners and stickers are present - [ ] does it look like any of the screws have been removed - [ ] Look for anything that catches your attention - [ ] coolant - [ ] frayed belt - [ ] see oil - [ ] droppings - [ ] Call attention to things to the seller Frunk - [ ] inspect frunk for rock damage - [ ] check hood struts are working - [ ] Pull out bottom cover - [ ] Check that the factory air pump is present - [ ] Factory toolkit is present - [ ] wheel lock key is present - [ ] Pull off battery cover - [ ] Check date to see when it was last replaced - [ ] Check if it has a battery tender - [ ] Check that the vent tube is hooked up - [ ] Check that the battery is properly tied down - [ ] Pull up side covers to check for animal droppings or leaves/debris - [ ] Check that the drains aren’t clogged up, this can result in water spilling into the interior - [ ] Get both keys and test that both keys work - [ ] Can lock and unlock the car, can start the car - [ ] If one of the keys doesn’t work, it could also be a failing alarm module because its been exposed to water Documentation - [ ] put the documentation in chronological order - [ ] Check for service recommendations that customer approved -> good sign - [ ] If you see ‘customer declined’ coming up -> bad sign Thanks for a fantastic video! Using this to find my next 997.1 hope its useful for someone else!
Nothing wrong with A customer declined,p statement, the dealers are constantly trying to make work for themselves on your dime; They tell me i NEED new tyres, discs and pads EVERY damn service even when they replaced the whole lot last service and they’re barely 1/10 worn 😤
20+ year Porsche owner and this car is almost identical to my 997.1 C4S. Purchased it 14 years ago with 6k miles. Today it has 96k miles. Best car I have ever owned. Still excites me to drive and I love how it looks rolling down the road. No issues or problems, just regular oil changes, tires, brakes, and other regular maintenance with the rare occasion, clutch, AOS or water pump changed due to wear and age. Great looking 997.1 C4S
This is a very well produced video on the 997 era cars. I’m a long time Porsche owner-in my 50th year now. One of my cars is a 06 997S cabriolet which I picked up at Zuffenhausen. After driving so many Porsches over so many decades I can tell you that the 997 is a great era 911 to consider purchasing. Porsche learns off every generation of car they have produced and that is readily apparent because the cars are so reliable. Imagine a 182 mph car being reliable. As this guy said, every generation car has some sort of issue. Once upon a time the big achilles’ heel were the chain tensioners. As a late to the game water cooled car maker, I feel their water pumps could last longer, but they don’t. Fortunately, it’s not super hard or expensive to replace them. Oil usage is a problem for some 997s. We have concluded that it could be an issue with “tolerance stack” where a number of components in the assembled engine are at the edge of their spec range-and with enough of those, the tolerance is letting it use more oil. I use exactly 1 quart per thousand miles. It’s nuts of course but it is considered well within the Porsche factory acceptable limits. In a positive sense, I am regularly adding oil to the car, so my oil isn’t just getting old inside the engine! I may be burning it because it’s a tight engine-zero leaks, but certainly no evidence of burning. I now have 132,000 miles on my 06. I drive it. They should be driven. If you don’t, get a trickle charger. (We have eight cars so we have to stay on top of that). Otherwise, you will need to buy batteries at a more frequent rate. Serpentine belts must be monitored, along with the tensioning pulley and the other two come-along wheels. Cheap and easy. In the early 997 cars we have a known issue with the alternators. Particularly the cable between the alternator and the starter. I have replaced my alternator and my starter. I have replaced two water pumps. (Lucky for me Porsche had to pay for one-warrantee item at the time). There are many things that can go wrong on such a capable car but surprisingly the little does. Porsche erred considerably in the interior material choices when they designed these cars, by using too much of tho ‘slush’ finish on surfaces. You can avoid the premature paint wear by choosing a car with a lot of factory leather, like the center console, and door finishers. Otherwise, that slush finish wears off and makes a car look older than it is. The radio knobs always show wear-somewhat rubberized, you can pick them up for little and do them easily. Be proactive with maintenance. There are few things to do with preventative maintenance on the 997s. Regular driving helps to keep them running properly. Again, all the tips from this review are spot on. He’s an excellent source of info on the 911 but be sure to have someone familiar with your era of interest give a look. I consider myself only truly qualified on the G models and the 997s. I am lost on the 991 and 2 cars! Keep in mind that finding such experts is not difficult. I would start with the Porsche Club. And gravitate toward the older guys. I bought my first Porsche at 19. Anyone who waits too long misses out!
I am 19 and i am looking at purchasing a 2006 911 4s it has 98k miles on it it’s a private seller i’m going to go see the car on tuesday the 997 is my favorite generation and if it possible i hope i can do it
To me this video was super helpful and informative. To the point that I decided I wanted to buy the car. Set up an appointment with the seller in Cary, NC and about 3 hours before, Nathan texted that the car was sold. Disappointed but 2 days later I received word that the Porsche dealer that serviced this car had just received a 2008 C4S with nearly identical mileage but hadn't listed it yet. Went over immediately, pretended I was Nathan running through my 997 inspection and bought the car. It has a Kenwood unit installed so I asked the dealer to put in the new PCCM Classic and will pick it up this week. Somewhat surprised that the dealer had the PCCM in stock. Thanks to Will for the video as it was enough to get me to go buy a C4S even if it wasn't the same car.
Yup, Nathan is a great source of knowledge for the Porsche community. His work with the PCA community is really comprehensive and valuable for any prospective Porsche owner. Thanks for doing this "non air-cooled" segment Will!
Nathan is an absolute treasure for those of us here in the Pacific Northwest - and beyond. He clearly knows his stuff. Will, you are fortunate to have him on your channel as I’m sure you already know. Both of you do great content… Keep it coming!
Still have my Porsche Cayman 987 2.7 l / 2008 / 245 HP since 15 years no issues with this car whatsoever ca 200.000 km now this is the best design Porsche has ever made the last analog one !
19:15 Would love to have a new Porsche but realistically a used one will be how I enter into the space. Grateful I came across this channel, educating myself before purchasing.
I could listen to Nathan for hours. He is knowledgeable and methodical in his approach when evaluating these cars and it does not seem to matter the year or model. He knows them all. Very impressed that you had him on your channel.
He is very knowledgeable. I bought my 2003 SL55 new. I do all repairs and maintenance myself, consequently I don't have 'documentation'. I do it myself because most shop mechanics don't meet my high expectations. I've never looked at the display indicating the oil level, because a transducer could never be as accurate as a shop dip-stick. Retired Chief Engineer
Great video with useful extensive info on the 997.1 I own a 997.1 C4S and bought it with 70.000 miles on the clock. I am the owner for 8 years now and it now has done 170.000 miles. At 160.000 miles the engine got overhauled. I always warm the engine up and after a spirited drive let it cool down. Also oil changes are done every 6000 miles, instead of every 20.000 miles like Porsche recommends. I don’t cut corners with maintenance, so if you treat it with respect (as you should) it is a fantastic trustworthy car. Of course, this is only my experience with the 997.1.
I know this sounds weird....but with Porsches it's not good to let them idle and warm up. Best to be driven to warm up the way the oil system is designed.
I don't believe that Porsche says every 20,000 miles on an oil change. Changes are once a year. And that is way too far between oil changes for anyone that drives their car as their main driver.
Yeah, so this guy would be good as a judge on the Concours, but for everyone else please drive your cars!!! My grass is not green but yellow. We are in a drought in the North Pacific. But my garage and cars are immaculate, thank you but don’t judge me. Most important, my cars are NOT garage queens are are driven and scuffed.
That comment kind of hit me too. I’m not a super organized compulsive dude like the guy in this video. He sounds like a pain to his wife and kids: “you can’t have any pudding”…. Kind of guy My cars are driven hard and well taken care of. I get upset when my kids are not careful around them and I’m protective, but I’m using them as the builder wanted them to be used. What’s the purpose of having a 911 and be obsessed with the thought that something’s gonna happen to it?
Yeah but he's talking about a DETAILED PPI. Most have to save for YEARS to be able to touch one of these cars. It's not a honda civic that you can repair for a grand if its in real bad shape. This is the kind of particular individual I'd want to buy a porsche from.
When I was 8 years old I loved to wash my parents cars. I would vacuum and wax and found it so rewarding. Even as a young 10 year old to teen I was always the one to recommend a new car to my parents and they always bit. An older gentleman who was a friend of the family and collected cars knew that I was a car kid. He told me something that stuck with me even more than 50 years later.. He told me “Gregory the drivers seat will often tell you the story of a car.” He was so correct. I often go straight to the bolster pictures for any car for sale on line. One other thing that drives me crazy is all the crap and lint on the dash, vents, shifter area, switches.... I’m like get a paint brush and sweep those things away.....
“ The drivers seat often tell the story” I too look at the drivers seat first and if it’s worn or especially replaced, I give serious consideration to the purchase. Thanks for letting me know I am not alone.
I have never heard anyone more knowledgeable on Porsches than Nathan!! He is a walking encyclopedia! And he brings it in a very entertaining way as well. Top video!🤩
Lots of great info, but not really much about the 997 specifically. What I really wanted was 5 mins of the top 997 things to look for, more than 40 mins of how to spot the perfect car
Wow...what a MUST see video. Will, your videos keep getting better and better. I watched your car on Bring A Trailer and your videos about the 'process', but I didn't see one about 'now it's sold and gone'. Did I miss that one? Finally, thanks for taking the time to produce excellent and informative Porsche videos.
Great content Will, thanks for putting this together. I’m sure many of us have Merz season tickets, awesome to see the 997 added to the knowledge base. Must watch.
Thanks NM for helping buyers hear you say a "tracked Porsche is ok", or may not be an abused car. On the contrary, a responsibly tracked car will have fluids and brakes replaced early or prematurely so that it can preform as designed through the whole event. I'd take a tracked car spun into the grass a couple of times any day over a car with curb rash and daily city driving jumping over RR tracks etc. My general experience is that most German cars driven responsibly hard will run better. They like it.
Very professional, straightforward evaluation that is so useful to see in video format. In multiple ways, I think some of Nathan's evaluation process would be useful on other cars. Thanks for providing!
I believe that the lug nut rusting is due to galvanic corrosion. When two dissimilar metals contact one another for a long period of time, one metal will give up ions to its neighbor and rust. Chances are good that the wheels and the lug nuts are different materials here.
This guy is phenomenal . . .and he's common sense understandable. I am, by no means a Porsche Geek but even i could clearly understand everything he educated me about
I purchased my 996 by using some of Nathan’s inspection procedures and unfortunately first Porsche emotional attraction. Fortunately I made a good purchase and enjoyed the car for several years. However, the next one will be inspected by Nathan or by a PCA shop that follows Nathan’s process.
I really like your philosophy on cleanliness. I agree that if a person takes care of their things it will reflect in all aspects of their life. I believe there are two types of people. Maintainers and Users. I would prefer to purchase a car from a maintainer. Thanks for the video. I am considering buying a 997 and found this very helpful.
I had a 997 series 1 2007, Carrara S 6 speed manual, Cabrio. Black with tan leather. Beautiful car. It is one of the cars I wish I hadn’t sold. They rarely have problems. I spent no money on it in 2 years.
Every generation of every manufacturer has some issues. Every part on every car will fail eventually. And fixing any car at the dealership is expensive. A new Key. fob for my 2017 Macan was $410, and they programmed it free - even though I didn't buy it from that dealership. A new Key fob for a 2017 Dodge Charger was $386 plus two hours labor. I could go on and on, but my experience is that a Porsche properly maintained and daily driven isn't meaningfully worse. If you want to keep your 911 Turbo in like new condition while you track it on weekends, you have gotten yourself a VERY expensive hobby, but try it with a Mustang GT or a Honda Civic or a Toyota Supra. Maintaining a track car to dealer spec will hurt a lot.
Excellent video and very informative! I have learnt a lot! I have owned a 2007 997 C2S Cabriolet and I wish I knew all this when I bought it used with only 14,000 Km’s on the odometer. However I was very lucky and the only problem I ever had was the internal rear lining of the cabriolet roof which somehow was stretched and a little torn but easily repaired. Thanks for a great video and yes they are fantastic cars!
Wow , I’ve learnt more from listening to Nathan in this video than any other video so far, he is so knowledgeable and informative I’ve really learnt so valuable insight and lessons to apply not only useful to the Porsche 997 but to others as well, I’m really glad I clicked on this video. Watching from Australia 🇦🇺
What a great video! Coincidentally your videos and the ones Nathan does for PCA happen to be my top two favorites on UA-cam for Porsche content. So this little collaboration was an unexpected surprise today
Not sure I buy the consistentcy theory. I have a sloppy house, but my car is manicured and meticulously maintained. I am a car guy, but not much of a housekeeper.
You're the exception!!! I would be extremely cautious purchasing a Porsche, or any vehicle for that matter from anyone that keeps a dirty home. My thought is if you neglect the care of your home, why not the care of your vehicle as well.
Would be nice to do this kind of PPI explanation on cars with actual problems to point out. Every time I see something like this its always with a pristine or near pristine example
@Aircooled I would LOVE to do that type of video, the challenge I run into is that most people are unwilling to have their car featured if we are showing real issues as that of course would cause issues if they were ever to sell the car. I inspect LOTS of cars that don't pass my inspection, but I have never had one of those owners willing to let me publicly show the issues.... If anyone is willing, let me know!
@@nathanmerz I hear you. It’s definitely a delicate subject with owners. I would gladly offer up my ‘77 coupe but like many in your videos it’s pristine. You might have to do it guerilla style with eye glass cameras at random dealerships 😂. Appreciate you sharing your wealth of knowledge on these cars. It’s a true asset to the pcar community.
"what to watch out for".... well... before even looking at the car itself, may I suggest watching out for your financial situation first to make sure that you can reasonable afford to cover the repair costs and other stuff? :) (those were the words of my friend who has been my CPA for the last 35 years)
what a fantastic lesson this video is. There really is no better teacher than experience. My Porsche 911 days were air-cooled, needed head studs, and all kinds of gaskets. These were 5-8 thousand 20 years ago. Today the same car in the same condition is 68,000. I wasted money buying a 1987 944. This car sounded like a helicopter from the torque tube when downshifting around corners. What a way to ruin your Porsche experience. Every time I drove that car I reminded myself, this is my poor man's Porsche.
very well done. If you do your own window regulator, which is easy, it is a lot less than $600. One other random comment. Plugged frunk drains can affect the main negative battery ground on the firewall. Porsche in their infinite wisdom has a non-threaded stud which accepts a fine "haired" female fitting on the negative cable. The "hairs" on that fitting fail and you end up with a poor connection. It would have been EASY for Porsche to have the male threaded and then put a traditional battery cable end fitting and a nut. Anyway, on my Cayman S I ended up jamming loose copper wire in the female fitting and squeezing that onto the male stud. Symptom was that the car would start sporadically and sometimes get no juice at all. Once had to pour water down the windshield to force an electrical connection so I could unlock the car.
This inspection also tells a lot about the dealership…you have seasoned technicians (or the means) to repair those leaks but you choose to pass it on to the customer. This isn’t your run of the mill used car dealership…at the very least, fix all the leaks. Reputation is everything, especially when you’re dealing with higher clientele.
Very interesting vdo. It’s also very important to get a full engine history including engine speeds with possible engine over speeds. Agreed Porsche dealers do it by plugging the engine on their electronic case and they know exactly at which overspend and which exact mileage the engine run in any case.
I loved my 06 997.1 Cabriolet and sold it after one year. Really fun, really special, but I was retiring. Three aspects to consider: 1) IMS bearing issue (as others have mentioned). Before 2006, this should be a concern for any potential buyer. 2007 and beyond: no issue. With any 2006, getting the engine number and checking the forums to see if your engine has the corrected IMS or not. All this is key to understand before any purchase. 2) The cheap, plastic, original keys crack even if you are a diligent owner. The key can be reflashed, replaced at Porsche for big $$ ($450-500) or you can get a replacement online and do it yourself ($20). It's not super easy, but it is doable for anyone with a modicum of mechanical knowhow. For instance, I did it and the resulting key was better than the original Porsche key. 3) Water pump, serpentine belt, and belt tensioner. If the car still has the original pump and you are getting above 50k miles, have this work done. Replace the pump and tensioner. It's gonna cost, but better than leaving you on the side of the road outside of Kingman, Arizona, in 100 degree heat (ask how I know . . . ). If the records don't show that this work has been done, you've been warned. Certainly the water pump is a consideration when sizing up a 997. You can do it yourself (one of the great things about 997s - you can DIY!), but having a shop do it will set you back between $2,500 and $4,000 depending on the shop and where you are. I could go on about bore-scoring, but any decent PPI that scopes the cylinders will uncover this known problem.
I keep immaculate cars. But I moved from a 6 car garage to a three car garage. So that doesn’t necessarily mean anything. My garage is a disaster. But my gt3 is perfect
been watching a lot of 911 videos including yours, bought a 997 a month ago (could've used this video, but purchase went great anyway), and... only now subscribed because you finally did a non air cooled video, hint hint hint.
Major miss while under the car: A simple rotation of the tire, looking for impacts to the alloy rims. The outside can look perfect but on a lift you'll often find a bent rim from pot holes. While turning the tire also look for bulging damaged sidewalls. Again it might look perfect from the outside but surprise you looking at the inner tire and rim.
This guy was pretty thorough. His best information was about te soot an bore scope.. you can walk up to one and if it has the tell tail signs Walk away. He said if this car had those signs more than likely he would walk. This car was a pretty nice example of a car most would purchase especially if we didn’t get that information about the soot. Nw I know this car did not have the sooting. Now we just need to find out what the owner is asking???
Poorly fixed crash damage, as I experienced, even though the seller bought the car second hand through an official Porsche Center… Porsche actually reimbursed me a significant chunk (10%) of the buying price on the 2010 C2 manual i bought a couple of yrs ago, even though they sold it to another guy 3 yrs prior to me buying it from him. It had had a substantial hit to the left wing, but aside from some panel gap discrepancies, one needed to tear down the front to reveal the damage repairs. After settling with Porsche I managed to sell it cheap at a no-loss to another buyer with all its history disclosed. The dealer was originally screwed buy the guy selling it to them. Buyers be aware!
Hi these cars or slightly different have a bearing at the back of the engine which must be changed. Engine out job. They also have a problem with over heating at the back of the engine because the cooling water can’t reach , I think , cylinder 6. Porsche do know about it . Certainly in Ireland it has caused engine failure I note reference to piston slap and oiled exhaust pipes , maybe these are early warning signs Great video none the less
Fantastic review and recommendations. The only comment I have- guys, you are buying a car, not an art piece! If you are looking for a car in this condition- how are you going to drive it??? It's just a car! It's not supposed to look like this one unless you are buying it to resell and make money in 10 years.
Thanks! The entire car is PPF’d, which is the best of both worlds. Gorgeous condition and protected from rock chips for backroads driving with friends.
Sadly Porsche phased out the under hood sticker at the end of the 996 generation. Every so often you will find one as old school dealer techs who were trained the old way sometimes put them under the hood, but it was not the standard. On this car you will find the option code sticker as it should be in the maintenance book.
Love this guy and how particular he is. But man for such an expensive car, its a shame how many potential issues there are with it. I'm trying to save for one and I'm having second thoughts. For such an expensive car, I'd expect more reliability.
I recall the 9x6 cars had the alarm module under the driver seat. The 9x7 cars should have the rear module under the driver seat and I believe the Bose amplifier under the passenger seat (if equipped). Water can get in thru the heater core cover too. The 9x7 cars can also get power distribution box pin corrosion.
Thank you all for the kind words! One question I am getting via DM that I think would be helpful for everyone to hear my thoughts:
IMS Bearing: "Has the IMS been replaced, what has been done about the IMS, et al....": The 2005.5-2008 M97 era motors used Porsche's final version of the IMS bearing. The good news is that bearing has a lower failure rate than version 1 (96-99) and a MUCH lower failure rate than version 2 (2000-2005) however it is NOT zero. IF you need the 100% assurance that you will not have an IMS failure than one needs to NOT buy any M96/M97 era of motors. To me this versions failure rate falls into my level of acceptable risk however every person has different risk tolerance, so evaluate that for yourself. The BAD news is that this bearing is physically too large to be removed from the case (unlike the earlier versions which can be replaced) and as such in my opinion can't be replaced. (there is a company which has a method to physically enlarge the IMS flange housing bore but IMO that is not an acceptable method, you can form your own opinion). The only thing one can do is remove the grease seal on the IMS bearing to increase splash lubrication. Hope that helps!
In other words if you want a reliable good looking sports car buya Jaguar, Corvette or Chrysler V10?
I forgot the engine serial number for M97 engines from then on that had a much improved version of the IMS bearing that was installed .......... am I confused about this ? Pretty early in the 2007 model year the improved IMS bearing was being used in the M97 according to these 'later' serial number engines installed in these cars from what I read long ago - and their IMS failure rate is almost non-existent. Also these cars had a Porsche bulletin to change the single coil ignition to 6 individual coils around 2010 I think - many of these cars have not had this done. Has it been done on this car or am I wrong about that too? Thx.
Lvvlvl
@@andrewallen9993 checking market prices tells a different story ...
Under the car
- [ ] damage to front bumper
- [ ] Damage to tub
- [ ] Check that covers are present and has correct fasteners
- [ ] Check brand of tire
- [ ] Check tire wear
- [ ] Check tire wear, is it even?
- [ ] Check damage to rockers
- [ ] Leak from CV joints
- [ ] Check for leaks
- [ ] valve covers
- [ ] oil pan
- [ ] Damage to rear bumper
- [ ] Exhaust tips
- [ ] check rear shielding present
Exterior
- [ ] Check impact damage front
- [ ] check radiators, are they clean?
- [ ] Look for door dings, from back of car to front
- [ ] paint mismatch
- [ ] check that the window drops when you grab door handle
- [ ] check that the window goes up when you close the door
- [ ] check that it completely closes
- [ ] Check how much oil is used
- [ ] Check for chips on edge of doors
- [ ] Check that all lights illuminate when starting the car
- [ ] Check oil level
- [ ] Check that it doesn’t smell damp inside
Engine
- [ ] check that engine lid works
- [ ] check that fasteners and stickers are present
- [ ] does it look like any of the screws have been removed
- [ ] Look for anything that catches your attention
- [ ] coolant
- [ ] frayed belt
- [ ] see oil
- [ ] droppings
- [ ] Call attention to things to the seller
Frunk
- [ ] inspect frunk for rock damage
- [ ] check hood struts are working
- [ ] Pull out bottom cover
- [ ] Check that the factory air pump is present
- [ ] Factory toolkit is present
- [ ] wheel lock key is present
- [ ] Pull off battery cover
- [ ] Check date to see when it was last replaced
- [ ] Check if it has a battery tender
- [ ] Check that the vent tube is hooked up
- [ ] Check that the battery is properly tied down
- [ ] Pull up side covers to check for animal droppings or leaves/debris
- [ ] Check that the drains aren’t clogged up, this can result in water spilling into the interior
- [ ] Get both keys and test that both keys work
- [ ] Can lock and unlock the car, can start the car
- [ ] If one of the keys doesn’t work, it could also be a failing alarm module because its been exposed to water
Documentation
- [ ] put the documentation in chronological order
- [ ] Check for service recommendations that customer approved -> good sign
- [ ] If you see ‘customer declined’ coming up -> bad sign
Thanks for a fantastic video! Using this to find my next 997.1 hope its useful for someone else!
Nothing wrong with A customer declined,p statement, the dealers are constantly trying to make work for themselves on your dime; They tell me i NEED new tyres, discs and pads EVERY damn service even when they replaced the whole lot last service and they’re barely 1/10 worn 😤
youre the best!
Thank you🥃
20+ year Porsche owner and this car is almost identical to my 997.1 C4S. Purchased it 14 years ago with 6k miles. Today it has 96k miles. Best car I have ever owned. Still excites me to drive and I love how it looks rolling down the road. No issues or problems, just regular oil changes, tires, brakes, and other regular maintenance with the rare occasion, clutch, AOS or water pump changed due to wear and age. Great looking 997.1 C4S
30 years of knowledge into one video. This man is a national treasure
...but only 20 seconds on the part of the car that really matters
Which part is that? Just curious.
@@xeetonLol. That's what wanna be expert would say
This is a very well produced video on the 997 era cars. I’m a long time Porsche owner-in my 50th year now. One of my cars is a 06 997S cabriolet which I picked up at Zuffenhausen. After driving so many Porsches over so many decades I can tell you that the 997 is a great era 911 to consider purchasing. Porsche learns off every generation of car they have produced and that is readily apparent because the cars are so reliable. Imagine a 182 mph car being reliable. As this guy said, every generation car has some sort of issue. Once upon a time the big achilles’ heel were the chain tensioners. As a late to the game water cooled car maker, I feel their water pumps could last longer, but they don’t. Fortunately, it’s not super hard or expensive to replace them. Oil usage is a problem for some 997s. We have concluded that it could be an issue with “tolerance stack” where a number of components in the assembled engine are at the edge of their spec range-and with enough of those, the tolerance is letting it use more oil. I use exactly 1 quart per thousand miles. It’s nuts of course but it is considered well within the Porsche factory acceptable limits. In a positive sense, I am regularly adding oil to the car, so my oil isn’t just getting old inside the engine! I may be burning it because it’s a tight engine-zero leaks, but certainly no evidence of burning. I now have 132,000 miles on my 06. I drive it. They should be driven. If you don’t, get a trickle charger. (We have eight cars so we have to stay on top of that). Otherwise, you will need to buy batteries at a more frequent rate. Serpentine belts must be monitored, along with the tensioning pulley and the other two come-along wheels. Cheap and easy. In the early 997 cars we have a known issue with the alternators. Particularly the cable between the alternator and the starter. I have replaced my alternator and my starter. I have replaced two water pumps. (Lucky for me Porsche had to pay for one-warrantee item at the time). There are many things that can go wrong on such a capable car but surprisingly the little does. Porsche erred considerably in the interior material choices when they designed these cars, by using too much of tho ‘slush’ finish on surfaces. You can avoid the premature paint wear by choosing a car with a lot of factory leather, like the center console, and door finishers. Otherwise, that slush finish wears off and makes a car look older than it is. The radio knobs always show wear-somewhat rubberized, you can pick them up for little and do them easily. Be proactive with maintenance. There are few things to do with preventative maintenance on the 997s. Regular driving helps to keep them running properly. Again, all the tips from this review are spot on. He’s an excellent source of info on the 911 but be sure to have someone familiar with your era of interest give a look. I consider myself only truly qualified on the G models and the 997s. I am lost on the 991 and 2 cars! Keep in mind that finding such experts is not difficult. I would start with the Porsche Club. And gravitate toward the older guys. I bought my first Porsche at 19. Anyone who waits too long misses out!
I am 19 and i am looking at purchasing a 2006 911 4s it has 98k miles on it it’s a private seller i’m going to go see the car on tuesday the 997 is my favorite generation and if it possible i hope i can do it
is their anything i should look out for while looking at the car?
Doubles the value of your channel with this type of true expert input - thank you…….
Glad to hear you say that. I am going to begin finding more people to get on the channel. 👍🏼
To me this video was super helpful and informative. To the point that I decided I wanted to buy the car. Set up an appointment with the seller in Cary, NC and about 3 hours before, Nathan texted that the car was sold. Disappointed but 2 days later I received word that the Porsche dealer that serviced this car had just received a 2008 C4S with nearly identical mileage but hadn't listed it yet. Went over immediately, pretended I was Nathan running through my 997 inspection and bought the car. It has a Kenwood unit installed so I asked the dealer to put in the new PCCM Classic and will pick it up this week. Somewhat surprised that the dealer had the PCCM in stock. Thanks to Will for the video as it was enough to get me to go buy a C4S even if it wasn't the same car.
MERZ is the Jedi.
Yup, Nathan is a great source of knowledge for the Porsche community. His work with the PCA community is really comprehensive and valuable for any prospective Porsche owner. Thanks for doing this "non air-cooled" segment Will!
Nathan is an absolute treasure for those of us here in the Pacific Northwest - and beyond. He clearly knows his stuff. Will, you are fortunate to have him on your channel as I’m sure you already know. Both of you do great content… Keep it coming!
Still have my Porsche Cayman 987 2.7 l / 2008 / 245 HP since 15 years no issues with this car whatsoever ca 200.000 km now this is the best design Porsche has ever made the last analog one !
19:15 Would love to have a new Porsche but realistically a used one will be how I enter into the space. Grateful I came across this channel, educating myself before purchasing.
Always amazed with the depth of Nathan’s knowledge. Also, just a great guy to talk to.
I could listen to Nathan for hours. He is knowledgeable and methodical in his approach when evaluating these cars and it does not seem to matter the year or model. He knows them all. Very impressed that you had him on your channel.
Strongly agree, he's an asset to the community
Most of the PPI stuff I already know but he always has those extra little tips
He is very knowledgeable. I bought my 2003 SL55 new. I do all repairs and maintenance myself, consequently I don't have 'documentation'. I do it myself because most shop mechanics don't meet my high expectations. I've never looked at the display indicating the oil level, because a transducer could never be as accurate as a shop dip-stick. Retired Chief Engineer
This car does not have a dip-stick, only digital read-out
Bought mine with 44K miles. On about 87K now...with about 2K track miles. Great car. Great review....thanks!
My exact car. I have a manual 997.1 C4S, meteor grey just like this one. It’s my 3rd 911 and I’m planning to keep it for the remainder of my life.
Great video with useful extensive info on the 997.1
I own a 997.1 C4S and bought it with 70.000 miles on the clock. I am the owner for 8 years now and it now has done 170.000 miles. At 160.000 miles the engine got overhauled. I always warm the engine up and after a spirited drive let it cool down. Also oil changes are done every 6000 miles, instead of every 20.000 miles like Porsche recommends. I don’t cut corners with maintenance, so if you treat it with respect (as you should) it is a fantastic trustworthy car. Of course, this is only my experience with the 997.1.
I know this sounds weird....but with Porsches it's not good to let them idle and warm up. Best to be driven to warm up the way the oil system is designed.
I don't believe that Porsche says every 20,000 miles on an oil change. Changes are once a year. And that is way too far between oil changes for anyone that drives their car as their main driver.
How bad was it using oil when you rebuilt it ?
@@robertevans9354 hello. The rebuild of the engine was more as a precaution. Oil consumption was about 1liter at 5000 km.
Yeah, so this guy would be good as a judge on the Concours, but for everyone else please drive your cars!!! My grass is not green but yellow. We are in a drought in the North Pacific. But my garage and cars are immaculate, thank you but don’t judge me. Most important, my cars are NOT garage queens are are driven and scuffed.
That comment kind of hit me too. I’m not a super organized compulsive dude like the guy in this video. He sounds like a pain to his wife and kids: “you can’t have any pudding”…. Kind of guy
My cars are driven hard and well taken care of. I get upset when my kids are not careful around them and I’m protective, but I’m using them as the builder wanted them to be used. What’s the purpose of having a 911 and be obsessed with the thought that something’s gonna happen to it?
Yeah but he's talking about a DETAILED PPI. Most have to save for YEARS to be able to touch one of these cars. It's not a honda civic that you can repair for a grand if its in real bad shape. This is the kind of particular individual I'd want to buy a porsche from.
When I was 8 years old I loved to wash my parents cars. I would vacuum and wax and found it so rewarding. Even as a young 10 year old to teen I was always the one to recommend a new car to my parents and they always bit. An older gentleman who was a friend of the family and collected cars knew that I was a car kid. He told me something that stuck with me even more than 50 years later.. He told me “Gregory the drivers seat will often tell you the story of a car.” He was so correct. I often go straight to the bolster pictures for any car for sale on line. One other thing that drives me crazy is all the crap and lint on the dash, vents, shifter area, switches.... I’m like get a paint brush and sweep those things away.....
“ The drivers seat often tell the story” I too look at the drivers seat first and if it’s worn or especially replaced, I give serious consideration to the purchase. Thanks for letting me know I am not alone.
I have never heard anyone more knowledgeable on Porsches than Nathan!! He is a walking encyclopedia! And he brings it in a very entertaining way as well. Top video!🤩
Excellent information. This guy really knows his stuff.
Nathan is great, bought my ‘04 GT3 from him and it was as advertised. Absolutely love the car and he made the process easy 👍
Lots of great info, but not really much about the 997 specifically. What I really wanted was 5 mins of the top 997 things to look for, more than 40 mins of how to spot the perfect car
Wow...what a MUST see video. Will, your videos keep getting better and better. I watched your car on Bring A Trailer and your videos about the 'process', but I didn't see one about 'now it's sold and gone'. Did I miss that one? Finally, thanks for taking the time to produce excellent and informative Porsche videos.
Great content Will, thanks for putting this together. I’m sure many of us have Merz season tickets, awesome to see the 997 added to the knowledge base. Must watch.
Thanks NM for helping buyers hear you say a "tracked Porsche is ok", or may not be an abused car. On the contrary, a responsibly tracked car will have fluids and brakes replaced early or prematurely so that it can preform as designed through the whole event. I'd take a tracked car spun into the grass a couple of times any day over a car with curb rash and daily city driving jumping over RR tracks etc. My general experience is that most German cars driven responsibly hard will run better. They like it.
I have mad respect for Nathan's knowledge.
🙌🏾 This video was so informative and educational. I felt like I was in class, watching a Porsche Jedi. Thanks for posting.
Very professional, straightforward evaluation that is so useful to see in video format. In multiple ways, I think some of Nathan's evaluation process would be useful on other cars. Thanks for providing!
I have often wondered if there was anyone else as picky about their car as I am, the answer is YES! Great information!!!
I believe that the lug nut rusting is due to galvanic corrosion. When two dissimilar metals contact one another for a long period of time, one metal will give up ions to its neighbor and rust. Chances are good that the wheels and the lug nuts are different materials here.
Nathan is one if the best Porsche specialists, known well in the Porsche circles👍👍
Carolina Exotic in Raleigh is where I bought my current 997.2 TS.
This guy is phenomenal . . .and he's common sense understandable. I am, by no means a Porsche Geek but even i could clearly understand everything he educated me about
I purchased my 996 by using some of Nathan’s inspection procedures and unfortunately first Porsche emotional attraction. Fortunately I made a good purchase and enjoyed the car for several years. However, the next one will be inspected by Nathan or by a PCA shop that follows Nathan’s process.
Really enjoy Nathan's youtube videos. A Porsche nerd's nerd without being a nerd. Would love to let him eval my 2011 911 Carrera S.
I saw Nathan at a hour long at a PCA meeting. Most knowledgeable guy I’ve ever heard speak on Porsche and on all models. At Boise a couple years ago
I really like your philosophy on cleanliness. I agree that if a person takes care of their things it will reflect in all aspects of their life. I believe there are two types of people. Maintainers and Users. I would prefer to purchase a car from a maintainer. Thanks for the video. I am considering buying a 997 and found this very helpful.
Great video🥃
Every Nathan video is a porsche video worth watching. Incredible amount of knowledge.
Great video, Will! Really like these as they help educate prospective buyers.
Wondering if the weeping rear main seal is an engine out or expensive job sooner or later. Have to say the car was spotless.
I had a 997 series 1 2007, Carrara S 6 speed manual, Cabrio. Black with tan leather. Beautiful car. It is one of the cars I wish I hadn’t sold. They rarely have problems. I spent no money on it in 2 years.
Haha the exception to the Porsche rule that every generation has some sort of serious, widespread issue.
I didn’t spend anything for 3 years!
But then I had to spend more than I paid for the car in the first place.
F6I rebuild.
That’s a good question.
What about the ims bearings??
Every generation of every manufacturer has some issues. Every part on every car will fail eventually. And fixing any car at the dealership is expensive. A new Key. fob for my 2017 Macan was $410, and they programmed it free - even though I didn't buy it from that dealership. A new Key fob for a 2017 Dodge Charger was $386 plus two hours labor. I could go on and on, but my experience is that a Porsche properly maintained and daily driven isn't meaningfully worse. If you want to keep your 911 Turbo in like new condition while you track it on weekends, you have gotten yourself a VERY expensive hobby, but try it with a Mustang GT or a Honda Civic or a Toyota Supra. Maintaining a track car to dealer spec will hurt a lot.
Nathan's expertise is second to none, great video Will! Maintenance book & PPI is key!
Outstanding. I'm an hour away from Seattle. I'll be checking out his store, Columbia Valley Luxury Cars.
He is FROM Seattle, he lives now in N. Carolina.
@@ronwilson8759 ooohhh!
Excellent video and very informative! I have learnt a lot! I have owned a 2007 997 C2S Cabriolet and I wish I knew all this when I bought it used with only 14,000 Km’s on the odometer. However I was very lucky and the only problem I ever had was the internal rear lining of the cabriolet roof which somehow was stretched and a little torn but easily repaired. Thanks for a great video and yes they are fantastic cars!
Wow , I’ve learnt more from listening to Nathan in this video than any other video so far, he is so knowledgeable and informative I’ve really learnt so valuable insight and lessons to apply not only useful to the Porsche 997 but to others as well, I’m really glad I clicked on this video. Watching from Australia 🇦🇺
Great tips! I'm looking at a 997.2 or 991 C4S manual, this is helpful.
What a great video! Coincidentally your videos and the ones Nathan does for PCA happen to be my top two favorites on UA-cam for Porsche content. So this little collaboration was an unexpected surprise today
Haha thanks. Glad you enjoyed.
Good luck getting the paint film off when it gets old! It’s a nightmare for any car I’ve done.
Mr Merz is a Pro!! Thanks for the video
Scan tool is important- you can check LT and ST Fuel trims to see if there are issues with vacuum or fuel delivery.
Going to look at a 997 turbo tomorrow and this is immensely helpful. Thank you!!
Not sure I buy the consistentcy theory. I have a sloppy house, but my car is manicured and meticulously maintained. I am a car guy, but not much of a housekeeper.
So maybe it’s a guideline, not a male or break?
You're the exception!!! I would be extremely cautious purchasing a Porsche, or any vehicle for that matter from anyone that keeps a dirty home. My thought is if you neglect the care of your home, why not the care of your vehicle as well.
Wow. That was next level professionalism
I could listen to Nathan all day the guy is a total legend . Please can we see more of him on the channel Will, a 964 review would be awesome 😎👍
Extremely helpful pre-inspection PPI-analyses! Hidden damages, missing boy parts, Bore-scoring etc.
Would be nice to do this kind of PPI explanation on cars with actual problems to point out. Every time I see something like this its always with a pristine or near pristine example
I guess it is what it is in this one. But good suggestion.
@Aircooled I would LOVE to do that type of video, the challenge I run into is that most people are unwilling to have their car featured if we are showing real issues as that of course would cause issues if they were ever to sell the car. I inspect LOTS of cars that don't pass my inspection, but I have never had one of those owners willing to let me publicly show the issues.... If anyone is willing, let me know!
@@nathanmerz I hear you. It’s definitely a delicate subject with owners. I would gladly offer up my ‘77 coupe but like many in your videos it’s pristine. You might have to do it guerilla style with eye glass cameras at random dealerships 😂. Appreciate you sharing your wealth of knowledge on these cars. It’s a true asset to the pcar community.
This car got a lot of love. Respect.
This was an awesome sneak peek. Great PPI and fantastic literal analysis.
"what to watch out for".... well... before even looking at the car itself, may I suggest watching out for your financial situation first to make sure that you can reasonable afford to cover the repair costs and other stuff? :) (those were the words of my friend who has been my CPA for the last 35 years)
Very well done! I'm looking for a 997, and this video will help me a lot!
what a fantastic lesson this video is. There really is no better teacher than experience. My Porsche 911 days were air-cooled, needed head studs, and all kinds of gaskets. These were 5-8 thousand 20 years ago. Today the same car in the same condition is 68,000. I wasted money buying a 1987 944. This car sounded like a helicopter from the torque tube when downshifting around corners. What a way to ruin your Porsche experience. Every time I drove that car I reminded myself, this is my poor man's Porsche.
Thanks!
very well done. If you do your own window regulator, which is easy, it is a lot less than $600. One other random comment. Plugged frunk drains can affect the main negative battery ground on the firewall. Porsche in their infinite wisdom has a non-threaded stud which accepts a fine "haired" female fitting on the negative cable. The "hairs" on that fitting fail and you end up with a poor connection. It would have been EASY for Porsche to have the male threaded and then put a traditional battery cable end fitting and a nut. Anyway, on my Cayman S I ended up jamming loose copper wire in the female fitting and squeezing that onto the male stud. Symptom was that the car would start sporadically and sometimes get no juice at all. Once had to pour water down the windshield to force an electrical connection so I could unlock the car.
Great video. I'm a VAG family as well and I love VW bc I can afford it. Audi is my next step and one day a Porsche. You got my follow!
This car underneath is very clean compared to what I’ve seen for sale and on UA-cam
This was so helpful being in the market. Taking notes as I visit Godspeed in Charlotte next week. Thank you!
You have a great network, Will! Nice to learn more about PPI and the 997 generation from Nathan; they look nice, especially rear silhouette imo.
This inspection also tells a lot about the dealership…you have seasoned technicians (or the means) to repair those leaks but you choose to pass it on to the customer. This isn’t your run of the mill used car dealership…at the very least, fix all the leaks. Reputation is everything, especially when you’re dealing with higher clientele.
Very interesting vdo. It’s also very important to get a full engine history including engine speeds with possible engine over speeds. Agreed Porsche dealers do it by plugging the engine on their electronic case and they know exactly at which overspend and which exact mileage the engine run in any case.
Excellent video. Nathan is awesomeness in action.
I loved my 06 997.1 Cabriolet and sold it after one year. Really fun, really special, but I was retiring.
Three aspects to consider: 1) IMS bearing issue (as others have mentioned). Before 2006, this should be a concern for any potential buyer. 2007 and beyond: no issue. With any 2006, getting the engine number and checking the forums to see if your engine has the corrected IMS or not. All this is key to understand before any purchase.
2) The cheap, plastic, original keys crack even if you are a diligent owner. The key can be reflashed, replaced at Porsche for big $$ ($450-500) or you can get a replacement online and do it yourself ($20). It's not super easy, but it is doable for anyone with a modicum of mechanical knowhow. For instance, I did it and the resulting key was better than the original Porsche key.
3) Water pump, serpentine belt, and belt tensioner. If the car still has the original pump and you are getting above 50k miles, have this work done. Replace the pump and tensioner. It's gonna cost, but better than leaving you on the side of the road outside of Kingman, Arizona, in 100 degree heat (ask how I know . . . ). If the records don't show that this work has been done, you've been warned.
Certainly the water pump is a consideration when sizing up a 997. You can do it yourself (one of the great things about 997s - you can DIY!), but having a shop do it will set you back between $2,500 and $4,000 depending on the shop and where you are.
I could go on about bore-scoring, but any decent PPI that scopes the cylinders will uncover this known problem.
Have an 06 997 and yes the water pump went. My mate has a garage so it cost about £500 to replace...
Valuable info, do the work before buying or get someone like Nathan to help.
I keep immaculate cars. But I moved from a 6 car garage to a three car garage. So that doesn’t necessarily mean anything. My garage is a disaster. But my gt3 is perfect
been watching a lot of 911 videos including yours, bought a 997 a month ago (could've used this video, but purchase went great anyway), and... only now subscribed because you finally did a non air cooled video, hint hint hint.
Major miss while under the car:
A simple rotation of the tire, looking for impacts to the alloy rims. The outside can look perfect but on a lift you'll often find a bent rim from pot holes. While turning the tire also look for bulging damaged sidewalls. Again it might look perfect from the outside but surprise you looking at the inner tire and rim.
This guy was pretty thorough. His best information was about te soot an bore scope.. you can walk up to one and if it has the tell tail signs Walk away. He said if this car had those signs more than likely he would walk. This car was a pretty nice example of a car most would purchase especially if we didn’t get that information about the soot. Nw I know this car did not have the sooting.
Now we just need to find out what the owner is asking???
Poorly fixed crash damage, as I experienced, even though the seller bought the car second hand through an official Porsche Center… Porsche actually reimbursed me a significant chunk (10%) of the buying price on the 2010 C2 manual i bought a couple of yrs ago, even though they sold it to another guy 3 yrs prior to me buying it from him. It had had a substantial hit to the left wing, but aside from some panel gap discrepancies, one needed to tear down the front to reveal the damage repairs.
After settling with Porsche I managed to sell it cheap at a no-loss to another buyer with all its history disclosed.
The dealer was originally screwed buy the guy selling it to them.
Buyers be aware!
Amazing you got some help with this situation. I think this is something to look out for any 911. Thanks for sharing.
Hi these cars or slightly different have a bearing at the back of the engine which must be changed. Engine out job.
They also have a problem with over heating at the back of the engine because the cooling water can’t reach , I think , cylinder 6.
Porsche do know about it . Certainly in Ireland it has caused engine failure
I note reference to piston slap and oiled exhaust pipes , maybe these are early warning signs
Great video none the less
Fantastic review and recommendations. The only comment I have- guys, you are buying a car, not an art piece! If you are looking for a car in this condition- how are you going to drive it??? It's just a car! It's not supposed to look like this one unless you are buying it to resell and make money in 10 years.
Thanks!
The entire car is PPF’d, which is the best of both worlds. Gorgeous condition and protected from rock chips for backroads driving with friends.
I see the Alfa Romeo banner….Being an Alfisti I always was a fond of the 911 and I did end up owning one few years ago!
Non sport steering wheel = negative point. the seat cracks look way more than the mileage if you ask me.
One owner with full maintenance scheduled records, most likely safe. If not.... Good luck.
Great video
I noticed no sticker giving options
on underside of hood 🤔
Sadly Porsche phased out the under hood sticker at the end of the 996 generation. Every so often you will find one as old school dealer techs who were trained the old way sometimes put them under the hood, but it was not the standard. On this car you will find the option code sticker as it should be in the maintenance book.
997.1 first things after cosmetics/visual inspection and test drive is bore scope, especially the 3.8L models.
Yep…and I’ve been told to avoid the .1’s altogether.
UA-cam’s algorithm is so good it’s scary.
I think I can cancel my Netflix subscription now, I'm gonna be here a while!🤣 Great channel 👍
Haha thanks…very kind of you to say
Love this guy and how particular he is. But man for such an expensive car, its a shame how many potential issues there are with it. I'm trying to save for one and I'm having second thoughts. For such an expensive car, I'd expect more reliability.
Nathan is the man, knowledge above most, thank u from nyc
Nathan is the king 🙌
lots of great information. Very impressed with the quality of info. Good stuff
sticking a golf tee in your porsche's vacuum line is remarkably on brand
Thank you for excellent video, very educative.
Which regards to documentation. What if the owner is mechanically skilled and changes their Porsche’s oil and other regular maintenance themselves?
I recall the 9x6 cars had the alarm module under the driver seat. The 9x7 cars should have the rear module under the driver seat and I believe the Bose amplifier under the passenger seat (if equipped). Water can get in thru the heater core cover too. The 9x7 cars can also get power distribution box pin corrosion.
Bought a 991 from Nathan he is the best!
Great to see you on here Bill! Glad you are enjoying the car!