Nietzsche on Women | Was Nietzsche a Misogynist?
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- Опубліковано 19 чер 2024
- The views of Nietzsche on women are a challenge to any reader. But it is not as clear cut as it initially seems. Despite the fact that in Beyond Good and Evil women are portrayed in a shocking light, Nietzsche was surrounded in his final years by women. And not just any women but pioneering feminists, some of the first women in Europe to get PhDs. These were his closest friends and readers in his final years at the same time that Nietzsche was misogynistic to the extreme. What is also surprising is his journey from feminist to misogynist and how his sexism developed in the early 1880s after being a supporter of the women's movement in the 1870s. The story of this transformation of course involves Nietzsche and Lou Salomé. The fallout of Nietzsche and love or rather unrequited love bled into his worldview. But while it seems to be in his philosophy it seems to be lacking in his actions. We will also be exploring how this connects with incel psychology and Nietzsche's commonalities as a prototype of the MGTOW movement. So was Nietzsche a misogynist? Let's dive in and look at the views of Nietzsche on women.
Further reading:
Nietzsche and Women by Julian Young www.oxfordhandbooks.com/view/... [to access plug the DOI ( 10.1093/oxfordhb/9780199534647.013.0003) into sci-hub]
Basic Writings of Friedrich Nietzsche [translated by Walter Kaufmann and including Birth of Tragedy, Beyond Good and Evil, Genealogy of Morals and Ecce Homo] amzn.to/3puBIy4 [affiliate link]
Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:27 The Feminist 1870s Nietzsche
05:22 Nietzsche and Lou Salomé
09:40 The Feminist Circle Around Nietzsche
15:23 Beyond Good and Evil §231
19:09 Misogyny as a Lever
22:19 Mapover with Incel Psychology
26:54 Conclusion
#Nietzsche #thelivingphilosophy #Philosophy
This was a brilliant analysis, to say the very least! Hopefully more people stumble across this video and your channel in general, as your insight and perspective on things is a breath of fresh air. Very well done, man -- keep it coming!
Thanks for making this videos! You have a very beautiful approach to philosophy... and the depth of feeling you have is rare in philosophical analyses, which are often very dry to say the least.
Ah thank you Guzzo that's great to hear thanks for the kind words
Thank you for this video! Very helpful.
I loved this video! Such an an accurate & compassoniate way of interpretting Nietzsche's views on the subject. I noticed Nietzsche speaks from a very feminine perspective, his *truths* about women are things a woman would likely complain about if put in the shoes of a man whereas most men are conditioned & act in such a way that these *truths* never occur to them. Im sure Nietzsche felt very ashamed for how distanced he himself was relative to what he felt was womans "ideal man" and consequently his views on women are the resulting fruits of his internal war. So I think you're spot on in your analysis! Great Video!
Wow this is a beautifully made video, absolutely necessary for the understanding of Nietzsche (something very misunderstood), thank you so much
Ah thanks Danny that's much appreciated!
Fantastic lecture, thanks for this video, it helped a lot, cheers from Brazil
Ah that's great to hear Alison I'm glad you enjoyed it and delighted to hear that my videos are being watched in the other hemisphere!
--A couple short thoughts on this topic: Nietzsche distanced himself from the close love of a woman and I think this was probably the most painful form of self-discipline he endured for the sake of his philosophy. His comments on women can be interpreted as a self imposed barrier around himself that he created to disallow himself from getting close to a woman. Also, I think that his comments also bear witness to the raw thoughts of a man who has given up the idea of cohabitating with a woman --thoughts that many of us might have in our more personal, interior animal thoughts, but which we temper in order to live with women in a more cooperative manner. Finally, it is Nietzsche who said that Truth is a Woman... a very grand statement for a philosopher to make.
well said
Truths are illusions of which we have forgotten that they are illusions - Nietzsche
So, truth is NOT a vvoman.
@@tolloromassi99 exactly, "illusion" more likely.
@@tolloromassi99 Truth IS a Woman. The entirety of a female's natural inclinations and what society teaches a women to be, is an illusion. Everything from her makeup, to her white lies to "spare someone's feelings". To her having "best friends" that she talks bad about behind their back. It's all fake. They are the ones most likely to publicly signal their virtue the loudest, while holding the complete opposite view in private. "Money doesn't matter", while never dating anyone who is not making less than $100k/yr. "Looks don't matter" while never dating anyone that couldn't be on the cover of a Men's Fitness magazine. It's all an ILLUSION and when you refuse to believe the lies, it's the women who band together and ridicule you for it. Punishing you with social stigma and isolation.
I don't think he thinks truth is necessarily good.
i just wanted to say this by far your best video on the channel here,
huge respect and appreciation of that.
A very well thought out commentary, Sir.
Great analysis. So much Nietzsche analysis is dull and uninspired, repeating all the usual clichés so I appreciate the time you have taken here to construct a nuanced commentary.
Wow thanks Peter I really appreciate that!
The second half of this video was spot on, really helps piece things together.
What a great contribution to Nietzsche's oeuvre! This clears up a lot of things, thank you!
Thank you!! That was the hope! It's always something that's puzzled me so it was great to get down into it myself
Keep up your great works, chiefs 🫡
This was great. Thank you!
Wow this was amazing, a very balance and insightful perspective and I totally agree. I almost want to laugh when I read those “misogynistic “ statements by Nietzsche as if I knew there’s some kind of dark humor underneath it all
This video is amazing! The effort u put in is unbelievable. Following rn!
Thanks so much Ale! that's really heartening to hear thank you!
This is so interesting! Thank you!
My pleasure! Glad you enjoyed it!
Another approach is to consider Nietzsche's alleged misogyny as a polemic directed delibreately towards a particular type of women in the society in which he lived, intending to apply his style of living philosophy directly on them as an experiment. The possible psychological motivations behind such an attempt are nicely presented in this video, without necessarily being the sole explanation.
Fantastic explanation. I suspect you are familiar with "Carl Jung's Seminar on Nietzsche's Zarathustra" and if so, was that where you found a lot of the insights you mentioned above?
I actually only heard about it last year would you believe and have thusfar been kept away by the daunting length of it though it does have a tug at my soul so I will be doing a deep dive at some point. Have you read it? What did you think?
@@TheLivingPhilosophy I was able to get it about 10 years ago on an interlibrary loan and could only have it for 3 weeks. I was only able to glance through some of it. From what I read, it was pretty amazing but dense if you are not familiar with Jung's psychological lexicon and profound knowledge of ancient myths. The 2 volumes total 1600 pages. I hope to one day purchase it.
@@Sanguillen39ify Yeah wow!! That be a long book! I'm familiar with Jung and familiar with Nietzsche so in that sense I think I'd love it but yeah it's the setting out on the long journey. Hell maybe I'll just dip my toe in the water and see if I feel compelled to explore I'll be able to get a digital version online I'm sure
YES! Always felt that if Nietzsche had lived later in time he would have had a better connection with more women. Imagine him meeting Amelia Earhart. Must have been tough feeling isolated from love and knowing the true potential of what could be vs the societal standards holding back women at that time. Such frustration could make one very bitter.
Haha yeah Nietzsche and Amelia Earhart now that would be a gem of a story!! Yeah he surely could have fared better outside of the Victorian era
Lmfao what the hell are you talking about? Holding women back? If anything the societal standards back then we’re more conducive to relationships lol if Nietzsche was around today he’d be a MGTOW on steroids with the modern state of the average woman
His connection would be much worse. In modern times people would tell Nietzsche to "be more confident", "suck it up", and "stop crying you pu**y, that's why no one wants you". His feelings would be dismissed, (especially by women) as the signs of a "Weak and bitter man-child who does not deserve to ever be with a girl or even be alive". Which would quickly be followed up by baseless assertions that he believes he is "owed sex" when all he ever wanted was to have a significant other that loves him as much as he loves her.
Thank you for the great analysis of Nietzsche on Woman. and thank you for the great leads also.
But I couldn't get the Biography of Nietzsche by Hellen Zimmern. Could you provide the book name.
Thank you very much.
Thank you Adnan that's much appreciated!! Unfortunately I got confused in the video Helen Zimmern did not write a biography of Nietzsche I was thinking of her translation of Beyond Good and Evil into English although in hindsight a biography of hers would have been invaluable
@@TheLivingPhilosophy Yes, therefore I was excited. Thanks again for the cool analysis of Nietzsche on this rarely touched subject.
@@AdnanSoysal My apologies for getting your hopes up however I can offer this which is a collection of things that people who knew Nietzsche said about him www.goodreads.com/book/show/1156196.Conversations_with_Nietzsche
Interesting video. Your idea that his misogyny was a natural part of his nature development between being a ‘nice guy’ and a carless womaniser, makes a lot of sense, like when someone loses a relationship and they at first blame either themselves entirely or the opposite party, before going back and forth until finally accepting that both parties were at fault. Keep at the good work.
Yeah exactly it's like a psychological pendulum that overcompensates before finding a balanced centre
@@TheLivingPhilosophy definitely.
@@TheLivingPhilosophy your educated bro, i see very few people like you well thought commentary from you, your better than hippies and old wjite dudes in the library or mcdonalds 6AM
This in my opinion puts his idea of slave and master morality into question..i means in terms of.its application.
Is it possible that it functions a little like the inferiority/superiority complex?
Someone who somewhere feels inferior tends to overcompensate with lofty self aggrandisement, whereas someone who secretly feels superior will often present as a humble, self effacing person.
In Jungian terms there is that struggle with the inferior function, which in Nietzsche's case was instinctive and sensate to his highly developed intuitive function. (Which was pointed out in the video) Such a morality that aims to integrate the instinctive wouldn't appeal to a primarily sensate personality...
Just a thought...
He wasn't a mysogynist, he had a serious relationship with the women in his life.
How many women have best friends one minute then behave like harpies between each other the next.
He saw everything in terms of his own masculinity.
Sometimes bitterness is necessary for healing.
Veritas!
What's with your sound system? I kept looking around to see what car around me was playing one of those super ANNOYING Deep BASS Sound speakers. Seemed like a Mike was dropped too
Does anyone have insight about what he meant by his quote “ a woman with scholarly inclinations , usually has something wrong with her sexuality ? I’m a woman who has a huge fan of his work; But at the same time I was pretty insulted to hear this, because my “ scholarly inclinations “ are what drove me to his work. ( and let me tell you , my sex life with my boyfriend is not suffering from my intellectual curiosity 😂) What exactly was he saying with this quote ? That intelligent women are not acting feminine ?
Well I just thought of this randomly and I may be wrong. Scholarly Field and Inclination towards it is on Outside Masculine , while on the essence at its Core is Feminine in its origin, much like 'Wu' that ancient Chinese speak of which is soft-spoken compassionate & graceful , so he or May I say I imply it as Those type of Women are attracted by that Masculine of the Outside & at the same time delve on Femininity of Scholar's Essence. It is like they feel Comfortable with that Magnet and there is no resistance in the attraction towards them. He may not necessarily say that they are not Feminine, but that certain part of their psyche, say their Animus & Ego has Juxtaposed , just as it is Implied by this Video's Narration that Ego & Anima of Nietzsche has Half-Juxtaposed on Certain Aspects of the Male Psyche and that leads to a Morphed Interpretation of Truth , the So called my truth.
In a broader sense the more driven and high achieving a women becomes, the lesser chance she has to find a suitable partner as she appears too masculine which acts as a repellant for men. By becoming a high achieving woman hipergamy also limits her pool of suitable men as women prefer to mate across and up in dominance hierarchies. Considering these, it makes sense.
@@S41GON but I think that’s ridiculous to assume that high intelligence is masculine
@@pranzatastatistically, it more often is.
Just finished Human All Too Human, thank you for clearing this up, I need to keep in mind the Dionysian perspective going forward. On to the Gay Science!
P.S you have really good insight into Nietzsche psyche, love your work. More Nietzsche please ! ☺️
Hi Ken don't know how I missed your comment for so long but just after seeing it and I'm very grateful thank for this always delighted to hear when video content resonates. There's no better feeling than the dots coming together!
I'd like to know the name of the speaker and something about his academic activities. Does anybody know?
I remember re-reading 231 at one point and being reminded of Eminem's "Rap God" so it was neat to see this episode. Especially interesting in light of your characterization of his method as possession and what we might imagine he'd say given Amor Fati. On the one hand you can think about incels, but you can also think of the type that mistakes eliminating toxic masculinity (inside) with simply ignoring it and acting the part of a feminist (outside). It's too simple to dismiss this as only hypocrisy. It isn't obvious without some lucky teaching or life experience that although the masks we wear are part of us, they aren't all that's there. When you talk about the two sides of you where one is skeptical -- this is one of those places people like Jung shine bc they have a developed language for talking about the dynamics of that inner world. Whereas science folk went about denying its existence until the cognitivists realized mental maps are a thing - but what have they done with the inner world since then?? Only a certain kind of thinker will be satisfied thinking nothing at all rather than to turn to something more poetic when the subject is lacking in scientific hardness. That has always struck me as a kind of toxicity itself.
That's hilarious!! I can actually see what you're talking about like a man speaking to his haters great stuff!! You know what I might give a bit of thought to amor fati and Nietzsche's psyche and see what I come up with. Interesting one to play around with.
Couldn't agree more about the richness of the inner world and the slowness of psychology to catch up with it post-psychoanalysis. I read a fantastic book by a woman called Rita Carter called the People You Are which was amazing. Completely different angle on this to the Jungian approach so even though the post-psycholoanalysis psychological world has taken some time to catch up I am enjoying the novelty of their independently originated perspective. Very important topic though and one I'll be talking about much more in future I suspect
Schmuck. The main problem is his disavowal or morals based on misunderstanding Aristotle's view that logic in practical wisdom is only possible with ethics.Virtue is not just from God (Nietzsche's main error) but from logic and reason whose foundation is ethics (practical wisdom).
Nice account of some of this history, very interesting. Nonetheless, Nietzsche's comments don't seem to me totally misogynistic to me, whatever that word intended to mean.
Schopenhauer was a lot harsher with this totally pessimistic takes.
Thanks
How are you getting your hair so silky?
😂 I always ask people same questions in comments too.
Nice vid
Thanks Emiliano!
Excellent synopsis of Nietzsche. The part about using philosophy to balance out an imbalance of personal character is spot on.
Many men are doing this today unconsciously, I myself did for awhile as well but I feel I have gotten where Nietzsche couldn’t of balancing myself out not because I am better than our dear pal Nietzsche but because I had the good health and positive mindset to keep trying until I broke through.
People really need to stop using the word "misogyny" when they don't understand what it means lol
At 4:44, so true, and beauty and intellect is so intimidating and just not fair.
It’s interesting what Lou said, feminine genius. Maybe he hated his femininity within himself to an extent after being hurt by a woman. Like his femininity reminded of the woman he loved but couldn’t be with. I need to read more on this but just wanted to comment.
Nono, you don’t understand Nietzche just as the feminists now + probably then don’t, I suppose you are one of them. His ideas came from the study of philology and what he found most inspiration in was the ancient Greeks. They were the ones who had the ‘will’ and spirit of the lion, who destroyed the decaying systems of the era on a international scale, developed art based on the appreciation of the human body (or also interpreted as the ‘vessel’ of will), started the Olympics to appreciate the capacity of human capability, and having the most ‘carelessness’ in the sense that they didn’t make use of any system or technology or cultural habit that didn’t fit the symbol that the individual stood for (like w/spartans + no ‘easy’ currency).
These people had will like no other because they gave life meaning through the appreciation of the opposites in their myth + ritual practice. These people literally civilized a societally degrading world.
This is where Nietzsches background views come from, not in the modern perspective of the Greeks, but in the ancient understanding of them harboring the most traits of Masculinity, Aggression, Tenacity, and Strength.
Id be lying if I said this hasn't coloured my perception of Nietzsche.
Experience made him wise
Dear lord! How can you retain so much information?!?
Sounds like his madness involved a misogynistic shadow or alter, which came out in his writings and is likely to be why the girl ran away; she must have detected it, and his later letters to her proved her right. As for his not being hateful and aggressive, this is exactly what a whip is.
Maybe it was the Countess who gave Nietzsche that bit of advice about women.
Great insights on Nietzsche's psychology James.
Best biography of Nieztsche?
Curtis Cate's is the classic and very detailed but I've been reading I am Dynamite recently and I'd highly recommend. Can't go wrong with either I'd say
Women by schopenhauer is good to
Same thing happened to Tupac
What doesn't kill you makes you stronger. But, too, is fuel for payback, which, too, is a bitch.
Hey dude, I don't mean this in the negative, but wondering , is there a reason to why your fashion style seems to cross so many periods of history from your long wavy romantic hair of a french revolutionary or a hippie from the 1960's, to your 1990's goatee, to your early 80''s lack of hair part , to your post modern mid 80's cotton athletic style sport top with roomy drop shouldered sleeves, to your rather early 20th century upper class formal speaking quality..Do you think your style is a reflection of your struggle and need to find truth and desire to live a metamodern existence?
Hahaha I love this so much. And what a set of good questions. I have thought about this myself (though I've never been able to articulate the particulars as you so masterfully have (otherwise I probably would have made adaptations)) and my take is similar to yours; what I've thought is that I don't really know who I am. Or rather I don't know what I'm trying to communicate with my outward appearance. Few quotes resonate as deeply with me as Walt Whitman's "do I contradict myself? Very well I contradict myself. I am vast I contain multitudes". I guess there's a metamodern confusion in all that - so many layers at play at once and I am drowning in the complexity of it not knowing what I am and thus what to portray. It's a sign of my having no clear hill upon which I stand. I am hoping the ground will grow more solid with time - perhaps with the haircut (as you can see in the most recent video - the 100k Q&A) this process may already be beginning.
Thank you for one of the simultanously hilarious and profoundly insightful comments. It has warmed my heart and filled it with a question.
Are you saying misogyny is a bad thing 😂
He’s definitely “exorcising” his misogyny
Lots of coping in the commentary section. "Oh Nietzsche felt rejected, his feelings were hurt, that's why he became a misogynist!" How could it be otherwise, right? Perhaps it was precisely *_this_* kind of petty thinking that he despised more than anything else.
This... darling is so fluffing inspiring. Dang. I mean, I only made fun of Nietzsche for his name before, I will keep doing that, but I cam respect this.
Try reading a book.
@@mouwersor I read books. So mean. Try saying that to a dyslaxian, smh.
Woman is not yet capable of friendship: women are still cats and birds. Or, at best, cows.
An interesting perspective to explain his misogyny. This is possible, but not necessarily true. Who knows what was going through his head 🤷
I love this channel, but this is honestly a terrible reading of Nietzsche's view on women. This modernist assumption, that equates any criticism, or almost any differentiation between men and women, as misogyny, is an effect of being brought up in a very ideological, identity sensitive world. Here's a few points to give a counterargument:
-To begin with, Nietzsche's entire philosophy, and also a common theme throughout his philosophy, is the need for one to refine their tastes, to be able to say No as much, if not more, as one needs to. Nietzsche insults and puts down, sometimes joking and mockingly, sometimes in a more serious tone, but the fact that he gave criticism is not definitive proof that he is a misogynist.
-In a quote in Beyond Good and Evil, Nietzsche essentially praises women, despite the shortcomings they may have, they are more in tuned with their nature, and are more instinctual than men. I can find this exact quote if someone wanted it, but this quote exemplifies his actual admiration for women, and their lack of rationalizing the world.
-In one quote from Nietzsche in Beyond Good and Evil, which i see as a summation of his views on women, he claims that women are not as strong as men due to their "inability to be a spectator of someone's suffering." Regardless of what was said here, what he is saying is in a sense empirically true. Women are psychologically more agreeable, less aggressive, more compassionate and more empathetic. Women, generally speaking, are more effected by cruelty and suffering, which is part of their feminine nature. Now, one can dislike Nietzsche's values and choose to orient their values towards the alleviating the suffering of others rather than imposing one's Will to Power on others and not caring if that then causes them suffering in the process, but in turn one would be engaging in what he calls Slave morality. If one knows even about a modicum of his philosophy, then they would know that Nietzsche values traditional masculine values over others, but then one would have to admit that his simply stating that women are essentially empathetic is not sexist or misogynistic because it's actually true, but rather that his philosophy as a whole is sexist.
-Just to use as a symmetrical example, if someone wrote that men are more aggressive, and therefore it is harder for men to restrain their anger and their violent impulses, they're not expressing misandry because what they're saying is true. Noticing a biological or natural difference between men and women is not based on hate, but it is simply just an observation. And let's assume now that the person who wrote this has an infatuation with babysitters and has a philosophy based on babysitting, but comes to the conclusion that men, by and large, due to their nature, will not become the best of the best of the best of babysitters. That is actually a reasonable and rational conclusion to make, _however_ if one is to point out any "misandry" it wouldn't be sound to claim that the comment about men being aggressive was sexist, because it wasn't sexist, but rather it was true. What you would want to claim as sexist, if anything, would be the "babysitting" philosophy as a whole, which puts feminine, empathetic virtues over masculine virtues, and even that is a stretch.
All in all, this video is the result, in my view, of a modern ideological perspective that immediately casts any view that differentiates men and women as "sexist", and is entirely unproductive to understanding Nietzsche's philosophy.
I agree with a lot of what you’re saying, but your conclusion is wrong. He clearly states that Nietzsche says many nice things about women and in said quotes he clearly differentiates them from men. The OP doesn’t have a problem with differentiation of women from men clearly, otherwise these quotes too would be considered “sexist”.
It’s the clearly disgustingly misogynistic things he says about women or Lou that ARE misogynistic… I mean are you really telling me nothing he wrote about women was anything other than a realistic assessment of feminine strengths and weaknesses?
Please.
I truly believe Nietzsche's misogyny is one of his lies. Whether he is getting in a dig on his sister or finding a point somewhere at the other end of a Rorschach test. Everyone knows Lou Andreas Salome was his love interest and that she was nothing like what he described a woman should be. Kind of. His descriptions are polar, as is human nature.
I find we should not hold historic people to modern standards. Nietche was misgonistic by todays standards but in his era he was quite progressive.
He was very anti-egualitarian,anti_socialist and many things.
You might be going a little overboard in the end when portraying Nietzsche as "the first incel". The whole analysis points rather more to the conclusion that he wasn't INvoluntarily celibate, but voluntarily - that he was simply hurt by Salomé's rejection and didn't quite get to heal from that so he purposively distanced himself from women not to get too close to another one and get hurt again. As many men do.
I don’t think it’s so much what he has and has not said but more of his Will to power philosophy. In a world where might over right is excepted women loose. Women by our nature are not as strong as men physically. To advocate for ourselves in a society like this would be advocating a “slave morality” those who are negatively affected by those in power are looked down on for even questioning their oppression. It’s blatant hostility to equity and inclusion.
This way of thinking is antithetical to who women are and takes no consideration for the that and the physical and mental suffering of women. That is what makes his philosophy ultimately misogynistic imo.
I think Nietzsche summed it up well myself.
MGTOW is a special case, at least honest MGTOWers want nothing to do with women, long term relationships is out of the question, and for some (MGTOW monks) even short term relationships as well. They seem to be waiting for the collapse and the subsequent reset of gender relations to patriarchal terms as they are convinced that under the current circumstances relationship between the sexes are untenable and too dangerous for men _('The juice ain't worth the squeeze')_, which one could argue is somewhat of a cowardly position as taking risks is an important masculinity. It also seems like an accelerationist mindset, an extremely pessimistic view. Let's note that most of the gurus who spread the message are burned out and bitter, divorced men generalize their terrible experiences with women and give this advice to young men with zero experience, turning them into incels essentially; that's not healthy advice, sometimes they even go full retard, see the recent downfall of Rollo Tomassi.
Redpill at least is useful in a practical sense and doesn't deny it's followers in principle to engage and gain experience with women.
Fascinating overview thanks for that
White pill = revaluation of all values
They have introduced two contradictory words " egoism & altruism " they imposed the knowledge on you. You started identifying with either this or that. All your thoughts, feelings, emotions are born out of knowledge. Now you believe one is true other is false. This is how logic functions. But Nietzsche dive far deep & found the common denominator " will to power", I truly appreciate Nietzsche, his teachings resonates well with me. Only devasted people can know it. Now they introduced " feminist & misogynist " classified Nietzsche as misogynist. Again its up to your belief because it is a jungle, it remains a jungle, lion plays lion game, fox plays fox game. Once lion was in top of the value system, now fox's. The value system keeps changing. The show keeps going. All the social functions are superimposed on physicality of organism. It plays its own function accordingly.
Let's be real most women are average cause they dont need to work on themselves. They might be pretty but have an empty skull.
There are a few absolutely extraordinary women such as Lynette Zang or Dr. Ana Mihalcea who deserve mad props, they however are the exception, not the rule.
OMG you have the same Pocket Nietzsche I do! I've read through the whole thing. Hint : do not do that. By the time I finished it I hated Nietzsche's long dead guts. :P
Who else came here from Existential Comics?
I've never agreed with the popular interpretation of Nietzsche being a misogynist. Aside from the nuance and subtlety that you speak of in his writings about women (and about everything honestly), he also said many flattering things about women that are misconstrued as the opposite. People who aren't familiar with Nietzsche don't realize how frequently he inverted the meaning of words and how playful he was with them. He would use words like "evil" in a positive manner and words like "the good and the just" in a negative manner. He would speak positively about illusion and deception, conflict and war, suffering and pain. Like Heraclitus before him, he had a deep sense of the necessity of opposites, their tension, and their harmony. To see men and women as "equal" is to destroy the sublime relatedness between them that can only come about through profound differences. After all, difference and multiplicity are the necessary conditions for harmony and unity. Evil, war, and destruction are the necessary conditions for goodness, peace, and creation. The eternal feminine and the eternal masculine bring about eternal creation.
Did you consider that what he wrote about women was right? Or you have never done that?
Arguably, the 'Epigrams on Woman' are just an example of Nietzsche's _superb observation and judgment of character_ , so obvious to Nietzsche due to his own feminine sensibility.
Every female knows that these _are_ the typical behaviours of her gender - just as we males know in private of our 'fatal' bond with the _exageration_ of our strength, picturing ourselves how we 'save the damsel' while we actually 'blindly fall from cliff to cliff'.
There's also a 'mystery' as to _which_ women are drawn to _which_ men, erotically and vice versa - and how it _rarely_ adds up to a truly complementary, healthy companionship.
The drama between Louise Andreas-Salome, Friedrich Nietzsche, Paul Rée and Elisabeth Förster-Nietzsche exemplifies the underlying instinctive currents of lofty *idealism* , predicting the *social fragmentation* of 20th century post-war *industrial societies* with it's *failing marriages* and *dysfunctional parenthood* . Nietzsche mentioning of *'injured vanity'* (arguably, a symptomatic reference to what we call a *'personality disorder'* ) and *substance abuse* are shadows of a *cultural decline* to come.
('Born Dropped Out: 12 Questions For Hippie Kids. A Documentary on the Children Of 1960s/1970s Hippies')
ua-cam.com/video/eIQv1TZhWLA/v-deo.html
To be clear, we won't see an accurate depiction of the demons that may have plagued Lou as well (documented by her affairs, despite being married) as we are to believe that this is still the age of *'Radical Enlightenment'* and of 'martyrs' of the 'patriarchy' that are to be saved by liberal *bureaucracy* (a line of work that doesn't imply _personal armed struggle_ , despite it's potential lethality) .
('Lou Andreas- Salomé, The Audacity To Be Free' 2016)
ua-cam.com/video/e722D0mnxnw/v-deo.html
Liberal feminism isn't informed about women, nor advocating their best interests - as *the 'enlightened' image of man simply ignores human nature* , entirely in favour of a mere 'normative' _idealization_ of what man should be, explaining the *perpetual fragmentation of civil right groups into ever more radical positions* , demonizing each other for 'betrayal' of doctrine and feeding thereby ever more into *_alienation_* .
In effect, both - men and women - can and will get trapped in a vicious circle of mutual *moralizations* , based on these observations - but it's also an opportunity to engage in *common exploration* of these 'mysteries' and to think about the *_differences in interest_** that comes with gender* , regardless of one's exact position on it's spectrum - which can lead to *_renewed_** institutions of e.g. traditional marriage and family* as well as more *flexible forms of modern work life* .
When it comes to Nietzsche in particular - and likely in regard to 21st century misogyny in the Anglo-Sphere (MGTOW) - one can notice *a shift from **_extreme idealism_** ('Apollonian' concepts) towards a **_reactionary_** position* (acknowledging the 'Dionysian' passions), sugesting that the latter is *an 'overcorrection' of an extreme stance* .
This motion was to be _expected_ and can be taken as evidence that the historical process proceeds according to it's constitutive, partially 'dialectic' factors.
(Passolini and Euripides on *the **_traditionalist_** female* : 'Medea')
ua-cam.com/video/u2ab-I-RXSU/v-deo.html
( *Maximos Confessor on gender* )
www.academia.edu/38828043/Maximos_the_Confessor_and_Gender_A_Commentary_on_Chapters_on_Love_II_30
I really enjoy the sensible investigation of Nietzsche's philosophy as unseparable from his personality and _process of individuation_ in the latter third of the video - avoiding convenient, premature conclusions, flattering one current ideological doctrine over another.
A good example of intellectual integrity as a result of curious scrutiny - which is exactly why it will unlikely get many views on a social media platform unless recommendation algorithms are deliberately written to that end.
Nietzsche says nice things by not saying nice things. The Highest form of manners by calling out all of the ABSURDITY despite your feelings
In other words, he became more misogynistic with experience.
Hahaha that's one way of looking at it!
Nietzsche was based.
Imagine making a 30 min video of cope cuz you like Nietzsche but your modern morals cant stand his misogyny.
You equate misogyny to simple critiques of feminine behavior. Are women truly beyond critique? Nietzsche certainly critiques men, as you yourself pointed out in the video. Yet you do not wonder whether or not he was a misandrist.
This was N instinct..
Why is it nietzsche, the only man of these woman circles, that became so popular.
Was he simply the best mind? Or was he allowed for being a man?
it was because he was left handed
Misogyny is a bit good though woman aren't queens or King's unless ur actually one
What about misandrist witches?
It could be argued thus. I wouldn't wanna date him if I was a lass. Bad posture and a dark countenance. I'd guess that he' was afraid of women, the pretty ones. Ubermensch indeed!!
Nietzsche failed in love and so sought power as a substituite, and by ironically quite decadent and vicarious intellectual means due to his ailing body.
If his proposal had been accepted and his relationship stable over the long term, he would have been a radically different person for the rest of his life. The world would be a radically different place.
It could be said with no small degree of validity that Nietzsche's philosophy is misogynistic. But Nietzsche no more hated women than he hated God. He could see no other way but to proclaim one dead and the other unworthy.
He endeavored to say yes to life because it were as though life herself had said no to him.
He was right you know
Aww who hurt you?
Misoginy? YouI have not understood. He was a MGTOW . Just like shopenhauer, tesla, da vinci, diogenes, epictetus… and so on
So creepy. She said no. 6 months is mad
another last man disappointed
No, just had a brain
What are we not deserving of an education?
He was just rejected by a wonderful woman and became bitter
Never stop being Based
Based on
Nietzsche sounds intelligent, but he was deeply reactionary. He hated dialectics and thus his works were essentially regressive.
You're surprised that a philosopher is a misogynist? Please, show me the philosopher who speaks of women as equals and with respect. Those who do so are called "feminists" by society, they're never called philosophers, as if there were a difference between the two things; as if being a feminist made you someone who is biased in women's favour and therefore not worthy of respect... as opposed to "philosophers" who are invariable misogynists and therefore real thinkers who are entitled to their opinion.
We quickly shout misogyny, but who holds women accountable.
The misogyny accusation says far more about your cultural biases than Nietzsche’s observations. The fact that you find double think in his views is a direct result of your own cultural feminization…..
Maybe it’s because smart men would be against them people are just so brainwashed into letting them get away with anything
Any smart man should be an”misogynist”
Just learn some basic grammar smart man 😂
So basically, being around a bunch of feminist made nietzcher hate women.
Also, this may seem unrelated, but what is your opinion on MLP vore?
Nnnnooooo not at all and as far as MLP vore goes I say to each their own