3:30 The scatter formation isn't bugged, it is meant for sieges. Tell your archers to scatter on the battlements an they'll go find proper cover and angles to fire from.
I thought it was bugged too.. Having a command that's completely useless in most battles confusing players isn't a good design choice! Should only show up in sieges, or be renamed to "battlements" or something.
Three stand out strats from this video that I can't wait to use. 7:50 - Using the advance command for counter cavalry charges means its less likely that my cav ends up scattered half way across the map in the enemy's shield wall -_- 11:30 - Loose formation on my infantry javelins to straight up delete an enemy's archery line or cavalry charge, also possibly building a throwables commander to strip enemy shields with javs. 12:30 - Deploying archers at a maximum of 3 rows deep great guide
Thank you for watching! I'm glad to see the video helped with brainstorming some new ideas :) I tend to get stuck in a pattern of doing the same thing in each battle, so this type of testing is good for me to get outside of my comfort zone as well.
@@Strat-Guides I was goofing around with the custom troop tree mod and gave my infantry 1023 throwing and they were hitting the enemy from the start like they were right in front of them
@@sethmiller2532 I know this is a year late, and probably a really obvious answer. But consoles support keyboard and mouse (I don’t know if bannerlord console does though)
@@samolson9640 The problem with this is that, when using console, the keyboard and mouse option is very clunky and pretty much defeats the purpose of using a controller. I do appreciate the suggestion, though. I just can't (reasonably) follow it because my console is in an entertainment center, rather than at a desk, so there's no real place to have a keyboard or mouse that wouldn't need to be constantly moved elsewhere when not in use.
First episode is out! There were a few surprises here for me, even after 2500+ hours into the game. The rest of the series will be focused on unit vs unit testing, army composition testing, unique tactics (similar to the column formation for cav archers, but even crazier), siege offense and defense tactics and much more. What are you looking forward to see the most next?
I really enjoy your work. You put alot of quality in your video with actually facts from hours of testing. Ey could it be possible when you have time to add your favo top 10 troops ( I know there are some videos from othe youtubers but personaly if it comes from you with all the details like "why", "how", "when" to get them..etc also if possible more crafting weapon videos I dont know about other people but I had alot of fun testing your crafting guides.. if its possible and you know a place where to find more recepies/ designs ... could you lead me to it? anyway thank you for your time of reading this message and have a wonderful day
@@-x-9909 Thank you so much! I appreciate the support :) So I'm not sure about a top 10 video just yet, but I will be testing each of the units out as well as testing army composition based on cultural units and maybe one near the end for "min/max" army comp using any unit in the game. I think between those videos, we should have all those questions covered. The problem with a lot of the unit testing from other UA-camrs is they are very limited in scope. It's still helpful to some degree, but testing "in a vacuum" doesn't really make a lot of sense when you wouldn't fight in battle like that. I think it's good to do the individual testing, but then also include how they fit into an army. For example, maybe the crossbow is really good in a 1v1 against the archer, but how do they fare in a 1000 unit mixed army? Maybe one is better for shooting at moving cavalry than the other? There are so many things to test, but it should be good fun at least. I saw your other comment and replied to it regarding the crafting :) I will probably make another video soon about it since everyone loves to watch those type of videos!
@@-x-9909 I also would be very interested to see some sort of tier list or favorite troops individually, or favorite army compositions. And I'm always down to see more fun crafted weapons to try out on the battlefield.
@@Strat-Guides Thank you so much, to be honest I didnt expect a direct answer. Since you content creators are mostly busy so I understand. But you are completely right. So far past days I only have seen your perk and strategic guides but this weekend I am looking forward to see your gaming episodes. Anyway have a lovely day
I was testing similar things some time ago with legionaries and menavliatons and my conclusions were that that peppering menavliatons throughout your lines makes your lines a bit more harder to handle for the enemy cavalry. Menavliatons also work good in a loose archer formation when defending against cavalry. Just assign combined infantry/archer group with polearm preference with 10-20% infantry and they'll mix in randomly with your archers.
That's a great point! I used to love putting my companions with the archers and a nasty looking polearm, but they did away with that option lol hopefully the next patch makes it a bit easier to put units where we want them.
Yeah Sturgia probably has probably the weakest troop tree right now, but Vlandian is a close second to last. Their bannerknights are squishy (thanks to the very low leg armor + king of low arm armor), the sergeants are the second weakest shield infantry, their crossbowmen have very very limited amunitions, their vanguard aren't really good and are redundant with their noble line (good for AI that just massive recruit without looking especially for noble units, so they can have more cav than usual). In the end their only "dominating" units are the voulgiers who are probably one of the deadliests shock infantry + one of the best at dealing with cavalry. So kind of a pretty weak roster overall, especially compared to Empire or Battania.
Funny enough in the last version sturgian axeman usually have more kills than an imperial legio. So it's mostly archers and spearman being completely useless. And complete lack of horse archers i guess.
@@Strat-Guides I myself have run with lots of QoL mods and I took some inspiration from a mod that gave all T5/T6 troops a focused stat at 160, so they'd all have their own strengths, and Sturgia was still feeble. I spent a lot of time playing with various combinations and I really don't get 'why' some troops perform so much better. It's not entirely up to their skill numbers. Their weapons play a much more significant role, but again, it's really, really hard to narrow down the exact 'why' of it. Bear in mind I was running with very high stats and all the good perks. Vlandian Pikemen just suck. To be honest, I don't get much use out of Voulgiers -- I'd rather take Aserai Palace Guard, Legionaries or Menavlions. And I was using a mod that helps Polearms/Spears not get stuck all the time. Sturgians don't match up to anyone. They have heavier armor and that's about it. Imperial Legionaries will scythe through any army configuration in the game. Especially when backed up by Elite Menavlions, who are also mighty on their own. Consider that's a Sturgian Heroic Linebreaker (pretty sure it's not a Battanian unit) and he is terrible. Meanwhile, the Aserai have the Palace Guard who fulfills a similar role, and he's using the best axe in the game. Maybe if Skirmishing is ever refined to such a point that it becomes a legit, meaningful battle strategy Sturgia would be good? But I've sure as hell never seen Skirmishing be pulled off satisfactorily in any game, even the Total War series.
Nice, gotta love it when that happens :) I had that happen to me this week when I was just thinking I wish I knew more about Cossacks - then bam, 2 new Cossacks videos pop up from my favorite history channels!
In each scenario, can you show us what the unit would normally do if we put them on "delegate command", and see what performs better to see if it's worth micro-managing the unit or not? That would help a lot.
That's interesting, I had not considered that! It would also be good to know if they act differently depending on what other units are in our army and again based on the enemy army etc. I'm not sure if they would do the same thing against cav heavy or archer heavy, etc.
@@Strat-Guides Might be a good video idea. Try to use the best micro-managing tactics you can for each unit type, and then do the same test for each unit with "delegate command" and see what performs better.
Just thought I'd toss in that I agree with this - the difference between microing and delegating is important. In the same way we'd want to assess how competent our junior officers would be in an army it's important to understand the strengths and weaknesses of an AI. Getting a sense of the cost-benefit ratio where our attention is the cost and benefit is improved performance vs delegation would give a good sense of which formations offer the best return on our attention investment.
Great video! It confirmed my practice of always using “Advance” for foot and horse archers, as well as my preference for *never* using Vlandian pikemen! When playing as Battania, I tend not to use their cav at all, but it’s good to learn how to use them better.
i love this type of conntent. i am learning how to win without screaming at my desctop. but it has an even greater effect if tale world game designers watch this stuff, cause they see what is working and what needs fixing. thanks for this effort and keep up your great work *thumbs up*
Thank you! I really enjoy this type of testing as it allows for a lot of creativity :) I think they do watch a lot of these guides, although I'm not sure what impact it has on their design decisions (if I had to guess, very little).
Been watching your vids for a few months. Taleworlds should really have you as a community member to upload tutorial videos and guides since you go into far more detail than you would expect. Every view and subscriber you have is well earned Btw, how do you change the depth of skein and circle formation?
Thank you! They might ask me to redact all the references to TW Maths though, which ain't gonna happen :D It's all in good fun, I don't mean anything malicious by it anyhow. They have a solid game here :) I appreciate the kind words! So you can change the size of any formation (other than square, that one is fixed) by selecting the unit, click and hold left mouse on the floor where you want the formation to start, then drag the mouse out depending on how wide or compact you want it to be. This is significantly easier to do on horseback since you get to see better and you can move faster to drag the line out.
Got it, I'm making notes of that and will be sure to test it in that setting. We will eventually get to siege warfare testing so this will come in handy. Thank you!
Yeah, that's Khalid ibn Al Waleed! I've only recently discovered his story in the last year or so and I'm fascinated by him. Given that he was such a dominant commander and tactician, I figured he should have some of the spotlight :D
@@Strat-Guides I am very proud because some of the history of Islam has reached you and another fact that he was never defeated in his life, even when he clashed with the Prophet Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace in the Battle of Uhud, and 72 Muslims were martyred, and the non-Muslim Arab alliance lost only 23 and This is due to the intelligence and cunning of Khaled Ibn Walid and the disobedience of some Muslim soldiers to Muhammad after he became muslim he swear to spened his entire life in the server of islamic message . he entred many battles ageinst the romans and sassanids the two powerfull faction and deafeat them in too many battles and named "سيف الله مسلول" or in english sword of allah the drawn he want to die in battle but he die with justinian plague and some books say about him There is not a single inch in his body that does not contain a hit, a stab, or arrwo wounds...
Huh. I've never even considered using Skein formation, and I was surprised at how much more effective the Advance command was for the initial Cav charge.
I'm going to be trying out a bunch of different combinations for unit vs unit battles to see which formation is good for which matchup. I did some prelim testing already and I have some interesting results so far! I don't want to give away too much, but one that really surprised me was that square formation in head to head matchup (same unit count and same quantity of units) they traded just about even most of the time. I thought square was good at surviving but not so good at dishing back damage but it seems that's not the case at all! I'll have to test it more to confirm but I thought it was cool. Yeah advance command is soooo good for cavalry and even infantry a lot of the times. It's so easy to units to get ahead by themselves and get crushed.
reading through these comments, i am reminded of the 'floris' mod and the tactics sub-mod in it, where you could instruct troops on what weapons to use. you could specifically say "use blunt weapons" or "use shields", having some way of ordering a change in preference like that could be useful for pikes/spears in switching from anti-cav to melee after the initial impact
That would be incredibly useful. Not just for cavalry, but I suspect other situations too like really dense fighting would benefit from using javelins as melee (to avoid hitting neighbors with swing attacks).
The difference that elevation plays on arrows was new to me, though makes sense. I just did to increase the line of sight for them. Thanks for the straight forward information
Thank you for watching! I think they have realistic physics for projectile flight, otherwise it's hard to imagine how they would program it into the game.
Since we are talking about tactics, i want to share some tactics that i use for my favorite faction in Bannerlord! the Vlandia, and for them i use 40 Sharpshooters, 30 Voulgier and 40 Banner Knights. The tactic is to put the Sharpshootera in the front in line formation, the Banner Knight in the middle in skein formation and the Voulgier behind in shieldwall formation (there is a perk in the polearm poll that increases the polearm skill of the troops in 30 in shieldwall formation). After that, just wait your sharpshooters to deal damage to the enemy lines and use the "move to position" command to make your cavalry pass right through the enemy infantry line (if you make that, the cavalry dont get stuck) after they pass, use charge command with the cavalry and the infantry. I put the Banner Knight in front of the infantry bcz the infantry dont have any shield. If you guys likes it, i have made a tactic for every faction and i would like to share if you guys want to!
This is a very solid strategy! I think a lot of people don't realize how dangerous sharpshooters are. I've ran into trouble before even with fians against sharpshooters since they have the range advantage and bolts hit armor very hard. I plan on doing videos of unit testing by the culture, so this would be perfect as they are released!
@@Strat-Guides The Sharpshooters really are a powerfull unit, and in the right circumstances they are even better then the fian. When i play my battania campaign i put the fian in loose formation and as the enemy unit is advancing towards i use the "move to" command to retread the units and keep doing that till all enemy ranged units are dead. After that i charge with the infantry. This works especially well againt vlandian armies, bcz the sharpshooter need to stop to reload! Keep the amazing work that you bring to this community! Wish you all the best!
F1 + F4 is invaluable for cavalry, especially melee cavalry when you need them to tie-down/engage other cavalry formations. Discovering that on my own was like breaking the German enigma. Spears/pikes are mostly useless, except on horses. The only real benefit to footman w/ spears is that they stop cavalry, allowing other Melee Infantry to actually take them down. So they are best used when mixed in with other melee troops. Though I'm of the opinion two-handed shock troops are better anti-cavalry overall. Spearmen might be better if unit collision is ever addressed. The way infantry blobs and goes into "bee-hive mode" not only looks bad, but basically reduces the game to overwhelming your enemy with numbers. It's why Sun Tzu's F1 + F3 is almost always effective. It never ceases to amaze me how effective charging footman and archers together is. You'd think keep archers out of melee, would be important. Maybe if armor becomes more substantial there will be some actual need for tactics in this game, but I fear it's too late in development to address that. Only real tactics currently is maximizing the use of your ranged troops.
Very true. I also like to use it when I sneak behind their main lines and pick off archers. They can usually stand and trade with those type of units, assuming it's not fians lol The funny thing is, shields will absorb the charge damage almost 100% of the time and there are some great shield infantry that can take cavalry down so It's hard to justify the pikeman's existence in Bannerlord. Haha Sun Tzu wins again :P It's a great point and is exactly why fighting anything more than 2 people at once is nearly impossible without running away and picking at them. They can have 3 people swinging at you from inside each other practically lol
same i noticed that having medium quality troops in tons beats a small elite army cuz when few tier 3 footmen circle a tier 5 guy yeah he goes down after few hits. I disagree that Spearmen arent usefull. I mean its a infatry unit that has a spear so they can fight in QCC and also stop cav units generaly providing more utility than a simple swordsmen. For me the spearmen unit is that sweet spot cuz they have the shield for range protection , swords/axes for close combat and spears to either brace if that unit can or just poke at cav units and make them stop moving and be ganged up . My use of two handers shock troops is to be a seperate group that i keep behind or on the side of my main line and use them to hit the enemy main line on the flanks cuz that way they have more space to swing those weapons and basicly hit the enemy in the backs and not be blocked by shields. Or use them as bodyguards for archers but idk how a stacked unit of two handers will handle a cav charge cuz most of the troops wont be able to swing unless idk u have them in loose formation.
Pull all the major decisions you made in your speed run vids; I’m usually not one for watching campaigns but you do a great job providing context so a supercut would work well
I was planning on doing a final episode where I go back and put everything together in a single episode, but no fighting and only covering the big stuff! I know what you mean, I don't have time to watch let's plays anymore but I used to learn a lot by watching them so a more condensed version made sense. I'm going to keep experimenting with different formats too, I have some ideas for more stuff in the future. I was thinking about doing a series called "the road to 300" and each episode would be a single play through showing how I went from the start to level 300 for a certain skill, highlighting what strategies I used and also how much in game time it took to get there. Not sure if that's something you would watch?
i fell in love with this game a week ago, i discovered your channel and watched all the guides but i wish i did that before i restarted my campain 10 times lmao, love your content and jokes about 2 percent talesmath and movespeed bonuses , i learned so much and cant wait to try it all in game thanks so much youre the best!
It's such a fun game, I'm glad you joined us! :D Thank you for watching all these videos, I really appreciate the support! I know what you mean, I still redo my campaigns like that once in a while lol I have a bunch of half-finished save games.
@@Strat-Guides after watching this video i feel kind of embarassed for using f1+f3 for everything including archers lol, also i would love to see an auto resolve only run , doesnt have to be a full playthrough i just want to see all the possible battle situations with all the auto resolve perks and how op it can or cannot be
@@Strat-Guides i wonder if its even worth charging/advancing with units other than chasing when they flee/commanding them to do so when the enemy is close , from my experience its just better to stay in place in an advantagous position and let the enemy come to me while my ranged units snipe them and order melee units to charge when they get too close and reposition my ranged units to hit them again
9:56 Javrun calvary is the best unit type in the game, and it's not even close. They do exactly what their name says they do as well: They charge into skirmishing range to loose a single javelin into the dirt and then *run* off of the battlefield. Remember that it's not a lost battle, it's a strategic retreat.
about to watch this video, saved it for later your videos kept changing my playstyles slowly and multiple times while i usually feel most comfort in playing it safe taking only battles in my favour to chill as 1 man army with F1 F3 support for convenience mostly digging huge cavalry only im currently going in with a slow start into a massive sudden slaughter with me as 2h mounted AXEman with a small cavalry followage picking up enemies, slowing and disrupting forces that can easily be pushed out of place while waiting for the main encounter, having ranged save behind the main force then i flank the enemies with all the moral impact skillset to split their frontlines so mine can surround them wich leads to massive enemy routing often times leading to closely 0 losses while outnumbered 2to1 or more (big surgeon helps alot) lets see what i can take from this one
I appreciate that! I think this will be my favorite series out of the few that I've done so far. I really enjoy commanding troops so I'm excited to see what the optimal uses for each unit/formation is!
That`s a lot of work for the video but greatly appreciated at least by me, thank you. Save a lot of trouble and testing for the rest, so more time for playing... and maybe hopefully serves for devs to get their feedback.
Thank you! Yeah it's pretty fun :) I also recommend getting the RTS mod (works on 1.7.1) if you don't already have it since you can control both sides, making it much easier to run tests and different scenarios.
Hi Strat! Just wanted to thank you for your incredible work. I liked, subscribed, and have just joined - the first time I have ever joined any UA-cam content. Bannerlord is certainly, if not THE most incredible game I have ever played, in the top 3 lifetime for me. Funny, first time I played it, my reaction was "meh" - and after just a few hours in game, I put it away, for months. Reasons? I think because I encountered some of the unfinished parts, the parts that need polishing, a few bugs etc., and most importantly encountered what were for me a lot of non-intuitive functions, things like undecipherable perk descriptions, etc. It was like being a person going from looking at a fishing pond, seeing the ocean for the first time, and thinking it was just a bigger pond lol, not perceiving the depth under the surface. Yes, there is still a lot to fix - but - it's an unfinished work of absolute genius imho. A couple months ago, I picked it back up again randomly out of my Steam cellar, and by chance came across your UA-cam. Your guides, particularly the Quick Guides, Perk Guides, etc. have *clarified* and *transformed* the game for me. I consider your guides to be *indispensable* to my understanding and enjoyment of the game. I think Taleworlds could be missing out on sales of the game because there is so much depth there that is not clearly explained by them to users such as myself. I think they should purchase your videos from you to help them showcase the game, and hire you to help them polish and perfect it! Thank you again for your work to bring this to us!!!!
Wow, thank you so much for the support! It's always great to hear the hard work is helping others out :D I know exactly what you mean, when I picked up Bannerlord I was in an EU4 phase, so I played it for a week or so and then went back to staring at maps lol. It always irked me when I picked perks and planned things out, only to find they weren't even working. I agree with you, it's not the first to do a lot of what they do, but it's the first where they combine all of these elements into a single game AND add enough depth where it's still fun starting up a new campaign after a few thousand hours! It's funny you mention it, because I've asked if they wanted to collaborate on a beginner's guide before they hit full release. I didn't ask for anything other than promoting the video when it's done - no sponsorship contract, no free stuff, literally just push the video to new people who buy the game. They said "We don't have anyone able to facilitate that at the moment." which is corporate for "$%@# off" lol! Oh well, I tried :) Anyhow I'll keep up the hard work and pushing guides out until everything is covered!
You can also look for the weapon that was drawn first. This changes depending on the type of opponent. Unfortunately also with each unit at a different time. that's why the Vlandian Sergeant can't compete against Cavalry at the moment - they switch to the spear too late! I noticed that the Khuzait Darkhan is the only unit in the shield wall that raises their spear over their head to thrust.
That's a great point, there is always a lag for the AI to process what to do. I notice they do that with throwing weapons too. They will cycle between their melee weapon and pulling out the throwing axe or javelin and half the time not have time to use either effectively lol. Interesting, I'll make a note of that for when we get to the Khuzait unit testing! Thank you for letting me know!
Thank you, I appreciate that! Haha if it's on reddit, it must be true :P I have a copy of The Art of War in the other room, I might need to handwrite that in there lol
4:06 I never bothered to check, but does the delegate command order change any in-battle captain perks, or is it static after choosing the captains/commanders in the initial battle set up?
That's a great question, because often times they will rearrange their unit groups once the you do that. I'm not sure! My guess is the perks would still work, but I'm not positive.
Wow dude! What an exellent video! I have been playing MnBB for over a year (Singleplayer only though) and I never knew there was so much complexity to the tactics-strategy! Obviously I use it a lot, but I've mainly placed my units before battle in what seemed the best place (uphill) and formation (archers on slope with mounted archers behind - usually infantry either in front of the archers in shield wall defending them, or just hidden away to avoid them being slaugtered, and cavalry placed as best as possible to give a charge). I LOVE your video! But.. I have one small hickup.. The video is edited in a way that enables as much talk as possible in as short a time as possible. I would personally very much like it if you explained the mechanics and gave it 2-3 played scenarios to give us a visual presentation of the facts you're presenting! I had to skip back and forth a LOT in your video to actually contemplate what you're saying while understanding how it worked out on the battlefield. I know it would make your videos longer, but I think they would be even better than they already are! :D This is the first video of yours I've watched, so I looking forward to diving into your other ones! :) Regards.
Basic range tactics that always works: - Range units are the meta, especially horse archers if you like to micro them for maximum damage output. - Always put your archers in loose formation and stretch the line to 3-4 men deep. That will ensure every single unit will have a line of fire and put the hurt on the enemy. If you can, position them on hill and/or at the flank of your infantry formation. - if you want to optimise the range meta, go for horse archers and put them in loose formation. Divide the horse archers into 2 groups and use hold position command to put the 2 groups on both flanks. If the enemy is charging toward one group, order the other to move closer for devastating flank shots. A bit micro intensive but this tactic had allows me to win against enemies with overwhelming number as I started my own kingdom. Basically, try and use the horse cav like foot archers who are mobile and kite the enemies until they ran out of arrow. At that point should be easy to finish them off when you charge them in. Also, did you know Khan’s Guards are the best melee and archer cavalry unit? Their glaives are devastating when cavalry got stuck in after their charge. And any cav foolish enough to charge at them would usually be dispatched or dismounted by their hail of arrows. A core group of 100 KG in your party is recommended to steam roll any fools tried to challenge you.
On the topic of Khan's guard, they are also better than Fian archer in melee + are the best shock infantry if you just tell them to fight on foot and to not use their bows.
These are all great strategies, thank you for sharing! Yeah I think the Khan's guard need a bit of a nerf. They nerfed Fians a while back and it baffles me as to why Khan's guard didn't get the same treatment.
@@Strat-Guides KG actually got somewhat nerfed since the first early access patch as I remember they used to have Noble Bow (yes you heard that right). They were basically decked out with the best gears like Fian Champion with their Noble Long Bows, but TW probably saw how ridiculous that was and nerfed it to Steppe Curve Bow. They also used to only had 1 quiver instead of 2 as they do now in the early patches. Fun fact: mounted archers would straight up win a shoot out against foot archers, face-to-face on flat land, because their horses would help tanking some of the shots. Edit: I managed to find a video reviewing the troops in the first patch ua-cam.com/video/82T2-TNB9wg/v-deo.html. As you can see, they were carrying that unrealistic big bow limbs from the Noble Bow lol.
Oh wow lol I can only imagine them with the noble bow! I have been playing since the first release, but I don't think I was paying attention to patch notes at all back then. I was still in my EU4 phase back then, so that took up most of my free time lol
Awesome videos, loved the bonus section at the end. Cant wait for the ret of the series! would be very interested to see you do a side-video of similar nature using the "realistic battle AI mod" just to see what the differences are!
Thank you for watching! We are going to be testing all kinds of scenarios and doing some wacky things to see if they work. Yeah that's a great idea! I actually have plans for doing a play through with that mod specifically, so maybe i'll do the testing video first so I'll know roughly what to expect. Good idea, thank you!
@@Strat-Guides thanks! Am glad you liked the idea. If you do five it a try, I would recommend only using the AI module as the one which changes armour I think is very unbalanced.
@@Strat-Guides yea, it makes armour waaaay more effective. So low tier weapons just bounce off most of the time. (Havnt used it for a few updates but was not enjoyable last time I did)
Nice breakdown on the commands for different troop types! I always put melee cavs with javelins on Hold Fire since I tend to mix them with other non-javelin melee cavs. Instead of relying on infantry with spears (both 1h and 2h), IMO a dense shield wall formation of 1h infantry works better against charging cavs since it still stops them while the 1h melee weapon works much better than a thrusting polearm with everyone squished together. Mix in some 2h swinging polearm infantry (Menavliaton/Veteran Falxman) to clean up the cavs that got stuck in the formation. (Also make sure that the 2h infantry don't get stuck in the front of the shield wall formation when trying to move to the back line.) Between square and circle, I personally prefer square for infantry since the formation is denser and it's hard to put ranged units inside the circle in a way they still put out volleys of projectiles. One interesting idea I had is to put infantry in a square formation 50-100 steps ahead as bait for enemies to attack and surround while I keep a wide line of ranged units behind to shoot down any enemy units that had their shields turned away.
Same, I much prefer square for infantry too! Even against other infantry it seems to do quite well. I'm going to be doing more testing to see how different formations do against others using the exact same units. It should be interesting :D
Paused at 13:36 to suggest (to anyone that cares, lol) separating archers into 2 groups, in loose formation, stacked on the hill. The 3 lines of each group should fire, doubling the force multiplier.
Oookay this was helpful. Possibly a touch dated but for whatever reason I struggle with commands in Bannerlord. I did quite well in Warbands, but I think it's just been too long. Refresher much appreciated.
I think until they become muscle memory, it's difficult to command effectively because the added stress of trying to command while a huge battle is going on is tough!
I'm was glad to see they added slow motion while issuing orders (and made it optional for those who prefer it off). Speaking for myself as a gamer who is, well, probably getting too old to play games, it really made issuing orders much less stressful for me. Other than basic F1 F3
The absolute best terrain for archers is if you can achieve an Amphitheatre effect, where your archers are positioned on an incline and their targets are approaching them from the leveled-off area not sharing the incline with your archers, or your archers are on the leveled-off area and the enemy are coming down the incline. Or two inclines are facing each other creating a small valley between them. This opens up the most area for your archers to get clear lines of fire on their targets so you can get a whole formation volleying. Not always achievable but always worth exploiting when you come across terrain that plays along with you this well.
That's a good point, it would present the largest area to shoot at rather than a cross section of the formation or a front/side face. I had not considered that!
3:22 just saw this "column" while playing on PS4. Since it wasn't me who gave the order (I was playing as just another mercenary on the field), I started to wonder how to achieve this "insane X formation" and how effective it would be on the battle. Turns out it's just Mount and Blade being Mount and Blade
And there goes my idea of using Macedonian tactics I have the feeling though that horses are far too eager to charge into pointy sticks. The main benefit of a pike square is that it can basically stop a cavalry unit from ever connecting because the mounts would shy away from moving themselves onto the defender's weapons
Yeah they need a much longer pike :( That's a good point, although Bannerlord is notorious for horses smashing into trees, rocks, running off cliffs, etc. so I'm not sure they could program them to avoid pikes who's brace state changes through the battle. It would be good though!
Im your host, Strat, and I appreciate your time... meh meh meh mih mah.. no bra. We appreciate your time. Hours of learning, compiled and sorted.. fkn gg. And the amount of guides and guides and guides. Lol sub'd
man I am shocked as clearly I haven't played enough of this game but still shocked that Caverly are just that broken even against a pike wall omg I never laughed so hard such a shame, wish they made 70% of the horses react to a solid tight formation with a shield wall with spears that is usually all you needed to stop a cavalry charge in IRL not just a classic pike wall, this has been very educational
I think 'Scatter' formation only works on maps with 'objects' that archers go to, like manlets and firing positions. Archers on siege maps default to 'scatter' formation and you have to remove them from it to position them anywhere other than along the wall or behind the barriers.
Okay got it, that makes a lot of sense. I know i've used it before, but didn't realize that's what it was for. Thank you! I'll be sure to include this when we get to the siege combat episodes.
I think that for the Vlandian Pikes, you should go by the rule "Less Is More". They seem like a super-specialized unit so you really only want them capitalizing on it 100% of the time. I'd suggest just keeping a small number of them in your army. Just enough to make a single-row line formation wide enough to cover your other troops. If they can land substantial damage on the charge defense, they're a profitable addition to the army and their further use as sub-optimal sword infantry is just icing on the cake. If they die from the charge or shortly after, it's better that they die than your more valuable troops. If they can't do substantial damage on the initial charge defense then they're just sub-optimal sword infantry and you might as well not have them. So it's better to have less of them than you need.
Good point, I think "sprinkling" a few of them into formations can help against cavalry charges. Maybe they would make good guards for archers? I think the issue with the test I ran is that the AI doesn't have 500 cavalry. That many cav seem to push through any formation just due to the sheer number of horses. When I get to the cavalry testing, I may back that number down to a more realistic number like 100 - 200 or so.
They sound like they'd be good archer guards. I imagine they're cheaper than cav so it'd be less of a loss having them sit around on babysitting duties than cav. Yeah that's always the issue with dry tests. Things don't always line up 'live' cases. That's why I prefer studying and experimenting while on campaign, but even still there's plenty of issues with that. Your control over the scenario is very limited, it can take a LOT of time to reach satisfactory conclusions, and sometimes the conditions you're trying to test are just far too rare or expensive in one way or another. I tried experimenting with War Dogs in Rome2 Total War because of how odd a unit they are. In dry tests they were fantastic, but it was just a nightmare trying to get any useful data from live experimentation.
@@FiltyIncognito Yeah that's exactly why I wanted to start like this, in a controlled environment. We will slowly add more and more to the mixed testing and eventually get to the full scale battles :D Lol the war dogs! I remember trying to make them work too :)
You are missing an intresting thing from real battles: different types of units. For ex: line formation mixes and matches front row with shield units, shock troops and shieldless low tier infantry. Square, shield wall, skein and circle automatically forms first 1-2 rows with shields if possible and sends all the unprotected units behind the shield line. Square also focuses shields on front and flanks, leaving back unprotected.
Thanks for the video. Lots of interesting info there, although I did come here to see how to shrink formations (e.g. when enemies do a tight shield wall when out-numbered. You mentioned that you can configure this, but not how. I'll test it later (Maybe the same command twice?) I also have been finding that mounted archers, standing still are very effective too. They seem to be much more accurate than having them just advance and can be quite easy to position behind the enemy, but you do need to keep an eye on them.
Sorry for the late reply, been out of action for a few months due to business issues. I have a whole tactics guide series that covers all of these! And the one I just published yesterday was testing horse archers - They seems to be about 2x to 3x more deadly when shooting without moving. That being said, they do worse in combat when directly engaged - the group circling will always come out ahead.
Looking forward to the rest of this series! I reckon your analytical and experimental approach to your videos works really well here. Also, I always really appreciate the bonuses :)
Thank you for watching! We have a ton of testing to get through, but I think the majority of it will be practical stuff we can all use. Yeah the bonuses are always my favorite! :D
I'd like to see how thrusting polearm units perform with (if the engine allows for it) the ability to be able to stab through allies. I think what's stopping them being good is the collision detection mechanics and AI not vibing. If spear units could attack two lines deep and pikemen three they would be a lot more versatile in melee with the ability to be able to sustain a line better but be susceptible to flanking. Having tested pikemen before there's something interesting there but it feels like a wasted unit compared to a standard heavy infantry, skirmish or shock troop.
I think they could make it work. I suspect they do that with cavalry archers since each row can fire and their trajectory is pretty much flat. I feel like having a small detachment of pikes would be okay. Maybe 20 - 30 to cover the initial cavalry charge. But then again you can achieve the same outcome with shield infantry and just let them run into the shields lol
1:44 Jokes on you, i've been using Louis Stevens' advice on Bannerlord battlefield tactics for the last 22 years. But if you really want to become a pro, "Beans" is the tactical genius of our time.
Only the first and second line of pikes will brace. The third line and each line after that will not brace. Longer spears are best for bracing and to be honest, the Vlandian Pikeman needs a longer spear (there is one in the game), along with a better sword IMO. They could also use an armor upgrade too. Otherwise, Vlandian Voulgiers and especially Battanian Falxman work better. As far as archers, the most effective way to use them is a long thin line (usually single line) in loose formation. Do not face enemy. Mr Chicken did some really extensive testing: ua-cam.com/video/SHpBGfyp6lo/v-deo.html For those who use Realistic Battle AI (great mod by the way), everything changes. To be honest, I think Taleworlds needs to change the square formation - all lines of pikes should brace.
Thank you for watching! I really hope they adjust pikes because they need some help big time. I'm going to be doing more unit vs unit testing but for the most part I agree with his results. Yeah I'm really excited to try that mod out! I have it downloaded, but waiting to do testing on it until after we finish this series :D
I think what the Pikes and formations in general need is mass and hard be able to hard stand ground, like in Medieval 2 or Rome Total War, so when the horses hit, they can’t just push through, the pikes actually hold and it’s hard to push through them through brute force.
Good job! Thank you for your time! Very interesting results, i will remember them and use ingame. In my game i play mostly with cavalry and i don't like how they act after doing charge and left on their own. So i go another way. I command them "follow me" and then go accurately, slicing enemies layer by layer, coming inn and out with some initial kills and almost no casualties, waiting for their archers to split from infantry to become the easy prey for my cav. That means that my cataphrachts loose the advanatage of lance strike and i need to take manual control of battle to myself but i like riding with my warriors and i like that under my control they attack only the troops that they need to attack and take less casualties which are pretty expensive when speaking about 150+ elite cataphrachts. If you are interested, the rest 150+ warriors are the horse bowmen who just execute the enemy infantry defending from my cav on the opposite side and getting bunch of arrows in their backs. Meanwhile the horse bowmen can keep the distance from enemy infantry comfortably and enemy cavalry (second threat for standing horse bowmen) was erased by my cav in the beginning of the battle. So until i am not wounded and can control the battle the casualties are really low and the kills are high. Also such party is incredibly quick on campaign map but is extremely expensive to raise. So advantages and disadvantages as usual xD BTW i play on maximum difficulty just in case
That's a good idea, I usually do that with cav archers but I don't see why it couldn't work with regular cav as well :D I could see this being particularly effective against archers like you said. I feel like cataphracts against archers is fine with the sword or mace (not fians though lol they wreck everyone). Which horse bowmen do you prefer to use? I assume you are referring to the imperial Buccelarii?
@@Strat-Guides Thank you for your interest! I am playing the campaign and and i've chosen the Istiana side, so most of my activity is on Empire territory srarting at Epicroteia. So i prepared Empire villages for good reputation beforehand. So yes, i have 380 army which is ~180 Cataphrachts and 130 Bukkelaries and some more horse troops. But during campaign i've found out that bukkelaries have little amount of arrows and now i am looking for an option to have khuzait horse archers. I did not think that this arrow amount will be that important before. So now i am planning to move East and bring my kingdom closer to Khuzait or maybe even fight them to get prosoners, but there is another problem. I doubt that my tactics will work against them. I think their skirmishes wil outrun my cataphrachts and with anti-horse infantry i will never catch em up on campaign map.
@@xAMSTERCheshir Yeah that's the only downside of those units. I wish they had more ammo :( The Khuzaits get the crazy steppe arrows that have 32+ arrows per quiver, it's crazy!
one thing to add: hold fire on inf helps a lot vers cav charges. and realy 2 handed agenst cav is quite strong, I tryed 500 batania volunteers vers 500 bannerknights and volenteers in square won. thx fore the nice worke!
Informative vid as always Strat! I'm floored about square formation & pikes, I'm glad I never went down that path even though I wanted to try a pike block... btw If you havent tested macro-managing cav while you advance the rest of your troops, it can be very effective. First, have them formed either in line or skein on the flank(s), then command your melee cav to move to a position through the enemy line (like 30-50m on the other side) and will temporarily open infantry to missile fire, assist your footmen pitted in combat, or completely wreck archers. Once they are past, either move through their line again or draw them back towards your flank and move through again from the front. If it were viewed from above, it would result in a figure 8 like movement that occasionally retraces given the situation and terrain
Thank you for watching! Yeah I was pretty disappointed by that test. I thought for sure it would at least keep the Cavalry out if nothing else but it was the worst one lol That's a great point, I have not used it as you described but I have sent my cavalry to mop up the enemy cav since they just sit there on both sides of the enemy army lol easy pickings. I'll be sure to test using this method as well, thank you for the heads up!!
@@Strat-Guides Agreed, cav vs cav is usually 1st priority. And I'd say this method works similar to an improved charge command, in that if cav gets stuck or stopped, they'll go directly to the point instead of drawing swords and attempting a melee, so it can help with losses, with management being the drawback
When delegating command for archers they go into a skirmish line, which is more spread out than "loose", but is inaccessible in the command menu. Therefore I quickly F6 my archers to get the formation and then take over command to place them well. Come to think of it, the formation may be part of the realistic battle mod, hence why there isn't an option in the command menu.
Your vids keep getting better! I'd love to see some breakdowns on small unit composition -- early game build-up and late-game hunter/killer parties. How can we get the best map speed? What's effective against various bandit types? Who should I take into a base assault? How far away do I have to draw an enemy before the 2,000-strong death stack can't reinforce them?
That's a great idea! I think once I get a little further into it, I can maybe do a video specifically for small unit tactics. These are all good questions. I'll do my best to address them in the coming guides :D
The issue with pikes is that cavalry are beasts in this game compared to real horses. Square formations were effective against cavalry because horses have self preservation, and can’t tank several shots to the body. If they see a line of soldiers facing them down with spears they straight up wouldn’t charge into them head on. Not only do bannerlord horses not care, so the pikemen couch one horse, then the ones behind go through. The pikemen really need to allow the guys in back to attack too
Great video. I'd love to know the best tactics to use for each soldier type in more detail and how that compares to the good ole F6. For example: I've got infantry, archers, and cav. What should I do with each unit to max their effectiveness against various enemy units. I put heavy infantry in shield wall, archers in loose on a hill behind, and cav off to the side/back. Lure the enemy in and charge the infantry right at contact, leave the archers or use fallback if needed, and just F6 the cav. I'd love to know if I'm doing it right. Once I smash the first wave, I always pull everyone back and wait for enemy reinforcements then rinse and repeat.
This is exactly what this series is about! I'm glad you brought those questions up :) I'm still formulating the next topic, but I think it might be easier to go culture by culture until everyone is covered and then do biggest testing after like mixed army, large scale battlefield tactics, siege tactics, etc.
@@Strat-Guides EY sorry to bother you again. but to have free camera do you use some kind of special mod? Yesterday I have been googling the whole time and found some mods but they arent working on 1.7 (RTS mods to command and have free camera) which mod or where can I find yours? thanks again have a lovely day^^
@@-x-9909 Yeah for this video I only used one mod - RTS. Check out Nexus Mods: www.nexusmods.com/mountandblade2bannerlord/mods/791?tab=files It's under Realistic Battle Mod (RBM) then go to files page, scroll down and look for RTS for 1.7.0 - 1.7.1 and download that one. You can install RTS by itself so you don't need the other stuff. I hope that helps!
I just found out about F6 and I love it actually. I put footmen and bows in the hands of the AI and I can run around with the cav like a real nobleman. If I need something from the infantry or archers I will move them and then grant back control to the ‘sergeants’.
Interesting, will they run through a shield wall to get after horse archers first or is there a range limit? I guess the question is what happens if they are all equidistant and then again at different ranges. I'll be sure to test this out, maybe formations and commands part 2 lol
@@Strat-Guides I don't know if there is a range limit, but I given advance commands to my cavalry to attack 50+ size formation of enemy melee cav very close to them. Only for them to ignore the melee cav and attack a 5 size formation of horse archers.
Oh this is so good! Stuff here I didn't know. At the beginning, I pressed some wrong buttons with all the stress, and the worst was Dismount... it was so frustrating!
I'm at 500 hours+ and I think F5 should be Fallback, would be less frustrating for beginners. It's so bad misspress that, and hearing your hero shouting "Dismount!" and you go "Noooo! Where's the 'mount' command???"
I am soooo stoked for this series!! And curious how you were so effective with a spear in the end haha.Also those were some nice looking troops!! I haven't made any custom banners... How did you do it? They looked great!
This was a really fun video to test/make! It's going to be interesting to see what's possible :) So that was just randomly generated from the custom battles. I really like the peppermint candy flag lol made me want to snack on some.
I'd be interested to see what "jobs" the infantry are all good at. For example I'm aware that Legionaries are the best shielded infantry against other shielded infantry however, are sergeants better at stopping cavalry due to their braceable spear?
That's exactly why I wanted to do this series :) I was asking myself the exact some questions! Rest assured, we will find all of these answers and more.
from my campaign testing where i used vlandian troops vs Vlandia in a civil war, Sarg's are amazing against cav charges, as are oathsworn or any of those end tier shield infantry with braceable spears. counter charging from my experience after the initial cav impact is the best course of action too, naturally that requires a tad amount of micro but it really isn't bad. on the flipside any top tier unit with a one handed mace does well against other top tiers, legionaires and sarg's have a fairly good spawn rate for maces..... and empire sarge crossbows, whom can beat units like oathsworn and aserai veteren infantry while on hold fire.
Thank you for watching! I've got much more useful info coming in the next few videos as this one was just the intro to get the basics, making it easier to understand the next several videos :)
@@benjaminwaite5970 The bonus section of the next video has a little something for you then :D I couldn't quite defeat Khan's guards with skirmisher infantry (almost though), but literally any other cavalry archer it can be done with infantry only :D
I have a 250 army that has 20 cavalry and 230 horse archers. The best formation that I found was to put horse archers in loose and cavalry to follow me then I go and deal with enemies horsmen. If we aren't outnumbered the enemy will stay back and when horsemen are done horse archers will charge. But if we are outnumbered enemy will charge the infantry. When the infantry is near to horse archers, horse archers will charge (Khans Gaurds are really good at dealing with infantry) and then they go to the other side of the map and do the same thing (loose formation...). This tactic is fantastic for armies with a few horseman (Sturgia, Empire...) but doesn't really work against Khuzaits themselves.
It seems like the Khan's guard will basically counter everything else in the game lol they probably need to be nerfed slightly. I'm sure they were devastating IRL in melee combat as well, but it makes them insanely strong in pretty much every situation.
Awesome vid, but I was hoping you'd show more strategies for actual battles that aren't just comprised of a single type of unit. Maybe you could do a general guide for battle strategies in the future (normal battles in the open, and sieges)? Not sure if that would get views. This is my first strategy type game and I'm a shitter, but maybe the youtube algorithm isn't profitable for people like me for this game anymore.
Hey Dennis! Thanks for watching - I do have plans to run actual army vs army battles but I wanted to be extra thorough in covering each unit type, formation and command just so we know which is the most efficient going into the bigger battles. It can often times be difficult to discern which are best to use since even a bad command or formation can still win if the unit vs unit balance it off (tier 3 vs tier 5, etc). Don't hesitate to reach out if you have question in the future, I'll do my best to help :)
For 90% of the time when using mounted of foot archers, I always opt for the Advance command and if I'm attacking, I'll tell them to do so before the fighting starts when setting up the troops. And it works really well if I'm Battanian and have those amazing _Fain archers_ at my disposal. If I'm defending, then it's shield troops behind the archers on _hold_ until the enemy is in range, then I'll tell the archers to advance. They'll then fall behind the shield troops but still keep peppering them.
I've had some success manually moving cav through enemy formations, not giving any charge/advance commands. Example; Enemy line formation in front of me and my cav, I move command my horses say, 50 yards behind the enemy line. The horses will move towards the enemy, when they get close enough they will prepare an attack, proceed to attack, move past and group up behind. Then i can do it again, but this time moving them back towards me. Through the enemy line again. It has been quite effective. They dont seem to do as much damage as a charge command, but get stuck way less, and so i can get in a lot more charges before having them all die on me.
That's a good point, I forgot to test that! When I get into the unit vs unit testing, I'll be sure to check which gives the best results before making any conclusions. Thank you for letting me know, very helpful!
Ha, I finally see that when you say advance in newer videos that it was because they changed the command to "engage" at some point. My character even still yells "advance!".
I don't know if you have thought of that yet: since archers in one unit pretting much use only the first three lines - what about splitting a unit that can't be deployed in 3 lines into 2 units right behind each other, each in 3 lines. Would that improve performance? Or does the foremost unit still count as an obstacle? and what about leaving a little opening between the two ranged units?
I recall trying that a few months back and they block the shots unless you space them out enough to have clearance. It's a good though, I was hopeful as well :D
15:06 🙈 "to few has come, we can not defeat the armies of Vlandian Pikemen" "no we can not.. but we will meet them in battle none the less" I laughed so much, bittersweet memories 😅😂
This video is an absolute blessing, I knew what a lot of the commands were supposed to do, but really hadn't played with them enough to really know what to do, now I actually have some idea of what commands to give to what troops. In the archer testing I was surprised by the results showing only the front 3 ranks firing mainly, does that change at all based on the range to the target? I'm assuming not since you had them fairly close in some of the tests you showed. Also, do you know what happens when the front ranks run out of arrows? With this new info I'm now curious how to really effectively use archers. As for future vid ideas, I'd be really interested to see different ways to effectively deal with enemy cavalry in a field battle, as I've found that in most of my fights, as long as I'm not getting run over by cavalry I can limit my losses even with very basic micro.
It's funny you mention that because I kind of had an idea for most of these, but actually testing them by themselves really helped understand them fully. I think I will be using advance much more frequently for infantry instead of charge. I like that they keep their cohesion instead of a small group running ahead and getting slaughtered lol. Yeah I'm pretty sure it's based on range. I made sure to be well inside the max range so that everyone could fire if they were able to. When they run out, they just sit there lol it's unfortunate. I think the best course of action is to make sure that all 3 rows can shoot at all times, otherwise they are being underutilized. I think it's also helpful to use the hold fire command frequently. It's annoying to have to micro it, but at max range most units don't hit squat lol Cavalry is certainly going to be the toughest to test again! I have a few ideas though... :D
I'm in an heavily archer-focussed playthrough right now, and I get best results (tell me if u get better) if I use 2 Archer formations, 1 on "2" and the other on "5" or later. If I put the 2. group on "3", melee cavalry will just respawn there instead of archers, which just completely wastes it. As shown in the video, if you have mass archers on "loose formation", they will just form a giant rectangle, not something that looks like a line, which is really bad most of the time. So what I do is, select group 2, put them in loose -> now they will form a line and not a rectangle. Select Group 5 and move them right behind group 2. They will automatically be in a line which is spread out like if they were in loose formation(talewords wonkyness). Means you will have two long rows of archers and rly not a rectangle shape (except for if youre fighting with very limited space such as the edge of a battle map or mountains), and around 90% will be shooting all the time. Also very good to just put 1 archerline to the left and 1 to the right of the infantry. They can not only shoot more and from better angles and without being blocked by our infantry, they're also pretty save. I think using the advance command on archers is way inferior than to manually tell them their position with short charges in between but u could prove me wrong. Face enemy direction is massive though.
Yeah I think splitting the archers is the best for defeating a shield wall since one group can always be on the flank. I think it also helps when being charged by cavalry as one group will be able to fire instead of everyone getting switched to melee mode. I need to do a bit more testing with using multiple groups for archers because like you mentioned, having all of them shooting at the same time is much more effective than only half due to formation limitation. Yeah the only time I use advance for archers is when I don't have time to micro them, but I also don't want them to run into melee range. It's really good for lazy leading (fighting against looters lol). I can confidently issue advance and walk away for a minute :D
Honestly, I think having the pike break after the first charge and then having the pikemen swap to a secondary weapon will be way more effective than what they are now.
I've learned to just go Napeoleonic wars with my Ranged units to be fair, Make 3-line deep Loose formations, perhaps split into groups of 2, and hose the enemy down once they come within 180m, then within the last 20m, Switch to Melee & Line formation. Ussually have atleast a 20-man cavalry group to make Enemy units turn around and put their backs to my ranged, or keep enemy cavalry at bay from my flankable ranged units.
my favorite strategy so far: using my little warband to RP a bit of an elite group (cuz these troops are slightly OP but not by much and i find the battles still struggling when outnumbered or evenly matched but out done.) i have the following troops cavalry similar to sturgian DCs horse archers similar to kuzhaits archers similar to battanian fians 3 sets of infantry berserkers - 2h axe, lots of javs hunters - pikes, javs, 2h axe shield brothers - spear, shield, sword, javs. i like javs. i usually have the infantry advance in either a shield wall or just charge to close in fast. and i have all mounted troops follow me and we circle and smash. hammer and anvil baby! love it.
@@Strat-Guides oh it's so much fun. you can use troops as a template which makes it easy to get started. i found it easiest to start with top tier troop designs and working my way backwards. it's nice to be able to trim your troops skills to just what you need from them too. i was worried about making troops too OP and disrupting the balance but it's honestly not that bad at all.
3:30 The scatter formation isn't bugged, it is meant for sieges. Tell your archers to scatter on the battlements an they'll go find proper cover and angles to fire from.
I thought it was bugged too..
Having a command that's completely useless in most battles confusing players isn't a good design choice! Should only show up in sieges, or be renamed to "battlements" or something.
Bruh... like 150hours in..
150 hours of putting lines of archers on walls warching half of them look into walls...
Three stand out strats from this video that I can't wait to use.
7:50 - Using the advance command for counter cavalry charges means its less likely that my cav ends up scattered half way across the map in the enemy's shield wall -_-
11:30 - Loose formation on my infantry javelins to straight up delete an enemy's archery line or cavalry charge, also possibly building a throwables commander to strip enemy shields with javs.
12:30 - Deploying archers at a maximum of 3 rows deep
great guide
Thank you for watching! I'm glad to see the video helped with brainstorming some new ideas :) I tend to get stuck in a pattern of doing the same thing in each battle, so this type of testing is good for me to get outside of my comfort zone as well.
Yeah the lose javelin formation is downright horrifying
@@senatorsponge Imagine if they all had the impale perks?! lol
@@Strat-Guides I was goofing around with the custom troop tree mod and gave my infantry 1023 throwing and they were hitting the enemy from the start like they were right in front of them
@@senatorsponge I'm not sure why, but this made me laugh out loud. I hope I didn't wake up the baby lol thank you for sharing this :)
The pain of playing this on console and not being able to make use of the full potential of available tactics...
If you play on Xbox series S or X I'm pretty sure you can use M+K
Point to it with your right stick and press right trigger
@@sethmiller2532 I know this is a year late, and probably a really obvious answer. But consoles support keyboard and mouse (I don’t know if bannerlord console does though)
@@samolson9640 The problem with this is that, when using console, the keyboard and mouse option is very clunky and pretty much defeats the purpose of using a controller. I do appreciate the suggestion, though. I just can't (reasonably) follow it because my console is in an entertainment center, rather than at a desk, so there's no real place to have a keyboard or mouse that wouldn't need to be constantly moved elsewhere when not in use.
@@sethmiller2532 use a mouse and keyboard to set up your army
First episode is out! There were a few surprises here for me, even after 2500+ hours into the game. The rest of the series will be focused on unit vs unit testing, army composition testing, unique tactics (similar to the column formation for cav archers, but even crazier), siege offense and defense tactics and much more.
What are you looking forward to see the most next?
I really enjoy your work.
You put alot of quality in your video with actually facts from hours of testing.
Ey could it be possible when you have time to add your favo top 10 troops ( I know there are some videos from othe youtubers but personaly if it comes from you with all the details like "why", "how", "when" to get them..etc
also if possible more crafting weapon videos I dont know about other people but I had alot of fun testing your crafting guides.. if its possible and you know a place where to find more recepies/ designs ... could you lead me to it?
anyway thank you for your time of reading this message and have a wonderful day
@@-x-9909 Thank you so much! I appreciate the support :)
So I'm not sure about a top 10 video just yet, but I will be testing each of the units out as well as testing army composition based on cultural units and maybe one near the end for "min/max" army comp using any unit in the game. I think between those videos, we should have all those questions covered.
The problem with a lot of the unit testing from other UA-camrs is they are very limited in scope. It's still helpful to some degree, but testing "in a vacuum" doesn't really make a lot of sense when you wouldn't fight in battle like that. I think it's good to do the individual testing, but then also include how they fit into an army. For example, maybe the crossbow is really good in a 1v1 against the archer, but how do they fare in a 1000 unit mixed army? Maybe one is better for shooting at moving cavalry than the other? There are so many things to test, but it should be good fun at least.
I saw your other comment and replied to it regarding the crafting :) I will probably make another video soon about it since everyone loves to watch those type of videos!
@@-x-9909 I also would be very interested to see some sort of tier list or favorite troops individually, or favorite army compositions. And I'm always down to see more fun crafted weapons to try out on the battlefield.
@@Strat-Guides Thank you so much, to be honest I didnt expect a direct answer. Since you content creators are mostly busy so I understand. But you are completely right. So far past days I only have seen your perk and strategic guides but this weekend I am looking forward to see your gaming episodes. Anyway have a lovely day
Looking forward to siege tactics so I can learn how to not lose half my army to a couple ballista.
Q: How to make Pikeman better?
A: "Use Voulgier"
Lol pretty much!
I was testing similar things some time ago with legionaries and menavliatons and my conclusions were that that peppering menavliatons throughout your lines makes your lines a bit more harder to handle for the enemy cavalry. Menavliatons also work good in a loose archer formation when defending against cavalry. Just assign combined infantry/archer group with polearm preference with 10-20% infantry and they'll mix in randomly with your archers.
That's a great point! I used to love putting my companions with the archers and a nasty looking polearm, but they did away with that option lol hopefully the next patch makes it a bit easier to put units where we want them.
Just when you think Sturgia is in a bad spot, look at the Vlandian polemen.
Lol just you wait, I'll get to Sturgia soon enough :P
Yeah Sturgia probably has probably the weakest troop tree right now, but Vlandian is a close second to last. Their bannerknights are squishy (thanks to the very low leg armor + king of low arm armor), the sergeants are the second weakest shield infantry, their crossbowmen have very very limited amunitions, their vanguard aren't really good and are redundant with their noble line (good for AI that just massive recruit without looking especially for noble units, so they can have more cav than usual).
In the end their only "dominating" units are the voulgiers who are probably one of the deadliests shock infantry + one of the best at dealing with cavalry.
So kind of a pretty weak roster overall, especially compared to Empire or Battania.
A damn shame too. Vaegirs were my favourite faction.
Funny enough in the last version sturgian axeman usually have more kills than an imperial legio. So it's mostly archers and spearman being completely useless. And complete lack of horse archers i guess.
@@Strat-Guides I myself have run with lots of QoL mods and I took some inspiration from a mod that gave all T5/T6 troops a focused stat at 160, so they'd all have their own strengths, and Sturgia was still feeble.
I spent a lot of time playing with various combinations and I really don't get 'why' some troops perform so much better. It's not entirely up to their skill numbers.
Their weapons play a much more significant role, but again, it's really, really hard to narrow down the exact 'why' of it. Bear in mind I was running with very high stats and all the good perks. Vlandian Pikemen just suck. To be honest, I don't get much use out of Voulgiers -- I'd rather take Aserai Palace Guard, Legionaries or Menavlions. And I was using a mod that helps Polearms/Spears not get stuck all the time.
Sturgians don't match up to anyone. They have heavier armor and that's about it.
Imperial Legionaries will scythe through any army configuration in the game. Especially when backed up by Elite Menavlions, who are also mighty on their own.
Consider that's a Sturgian Heroic Linebreaker (pretty sure it's not a Battanian unit) and he is terrible. Meanwhile, the Aserai have the Palace Guard who fulfills a similar role, and he's using the best axe in the game.
Maybe if Skirmishing is ever refined to such a point that it becomes a legit, meaningful battle strategy Sturgia would be good? But I've sure as hell never seen Skirmishing be pulled off satisfactorily in any game, even the Total War series.
I was just thinking about this topic! I've been watching and rewatching your WC run to try to glean tactics. You've helped out a lot so far 👍
Nice, gotta love it when that happens :) I had that happen to me this week when I was just thinking I wish I knew more about Cossacks - then bam, 2 new Cossacks videos pop up from my favorite history channels!
In each scenario, can you show us what the unit would normally do if we put them on "delegate command", and see what performs better to see if it's worth micro-managing the unit or not? That would help a lot.
That's interesting, I had not considered that! It would also be good to know if they act differently depending on what other units are in our army and again based on the enemy army etc. I'm not sure if they would do the same thing against cav heavy or archer heavy, etc.
@@Strat-Guides Might be a good video idea. Try to use the best micro-managing tactics you can for each unit type, and then do the same test for each unit with "delegate command" and see what performs better.
@@Strat-Guides I sometimes put a small number of horse archers on delegate command while I command the rest of my army normally.
Just thought I'd toss in that I agree with this - the difference between microing and delegating is important. In the same way we'd want to assess how competent our junior officers would be in an army it's important to understand the strengths and weaknesses of an AI.
Getting a sense of the cost-benefit ratio where our attention is the cost and benefit is improved performance vs delegation would give a good sense of which formations offer the best return on our attention investment.
Great video! It confirmed my practice of always using “Advance” for foot and horse archers, as well as my preference for *never* using Vlandian pikemen! When playing as Battania, I tend not to use their cav at all, but it’s good to learn how to use them better.
These huge troop formations are strangely pleasing to look at. Great job. Thank you.
Haha I was thinking the same thing! It reminds me of a sub reddit "Oddly Satisfying".
i love this type of conntent. i am learning how to win without screaming at my desctop. but it has an even greater effect if tale world game designers watch this stuff, cause they see what is working and what needs fixing. thanks for this effort and keep up your great work *thumbs up*
Thank you! I really enjoy this type of testing as it allows for a lot of creativity :) I think they do watch a lot of these guides, although I'm not sure what impact it has on their design decisions (if I had to guess, very little).
Been watching your vids for a few months. Taleworlds should really have you as a community member to upload tutorial videos and guides since you go into far more detail than you would expect. Every view and subscriber you have is well earned
Btw, how do you change the depth of skein and circle formation?
Thank you! They might ask me to redact all the references to TW Maths though, which ain't gonna happen :D It's all in good fun, I don't mean anything malicious by it anyhow. They have a solid game here :) I appreciate the kind words!
So you can change the size of any formation (other than square, that one is fixed) by selecting the unit, click and hold left mouse on the floor where you want the formation to start, then drag the mouse out depending on how wide or compact you want it to be. This is significantly easier to do on horseback since you get to see better and you can move faster to drag the line out.
I really love the thumbnail of the video
I appreciate Khalid ibn Al-Walid reference ❤
Thank you! He needs to get more recognition for the brilliant general and tactician that he was :)
@@Strat-Guides yes ofc ❤️❤️
Dude these videos are soooooo helpful, watched the entire series and it answered so many questions. Many thanks.
Nice, I'm happy to hear that! I'm going to do the full army testing soon as well which should be a bit more practical :)
Scatter formation is used in sieges when they take cover from the walls of arrows
Got it, I'm making notes of that and will be sure to test it in that setting. We will eventually get to siege warfare testing so this will come in handy. Thank you!
ahhhhhhhhh that makes sense
I know I'm late, but in the background image of this video caught my attention the name in the of soldier's shield
Yeah, that's Khalid ibn Al Waleed! I've only recently discovered his story in the last year or so and I'm fascinated by him. Given that he was such a dominant commander and tactician, I figured he should have some of the spotlight :D
@@Strat-Guides I am very proud because some of the history of Islam has reached you and another fact that he was never defeated in his life, even when he clashed with the Prophet Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace in the Battle of Uhud, and 72 Muslims were martyred, and the non-Muslim Arab alliance lost only 23 and This is due to the intelligence and cunning of Khaled Ibn Walid and the disobedience of some Muslim soldiers to Muhammad
after he became muslim he swear to spened his entire life in the server of islamic message . he entred many battles ageinst the romans and sassanids the two powerfull faction and deafeat them in too many battles and named "سيف الله مسلول" or in english sword of allah the drawn
he want to die in battle but he die with justinian plague and some books say about him There is not a single inch in his body that does not contain a hit, a stab, or arrwo wounds...
@@Strat-Guides
I subscribed in your channel solely for this thumbnail and your very well deserved admiration of Khalid ibn Al-Walid 😃😃
Huh. I've never even considered using Skein formation, and I was surprised at how much more effective the Advance command was for the initial Cav charge.
I'm going to be trying out a bunch of different combinations for unit vs unit battles to see which formation is good for which matchup. I did some prelim testing already and I have some interesting results so far! I don't want to give away too much, but one that really surprised me was that square formation in head to head matchup (same unit count and same quantity of units) they traded just about even most of the time. I thought square was good at surviving but not so good at dishing back damage but it seems that's not the case at all! I'll have to test it more to confirm but I thought it was cool.
Yeah advance command is soooo good for cavalry and even infantry a lot of the times. It's so easy to units to get ahead by themselves and get crushed.
reading through these comments, i am reminded of the 'floris' mod and the tactics sub-mod in it, where you could instruct troops on what weapons to use. you could specifically say "use blunt weapons" or "use shields", having some way of ordering a change in preference like that could be useful for pikes/spears in switching from anti-cav to melee after the initial impact
That would be incredibly useful. Not just for cavalry, but I suspect other situations too like really dense fighting would benefit from using javelins as melee (to avoid hitting neighbors with swing attacks).
The difference that elevation plays on arrows was new to me, though makes sense. I just did to increase the line of sight for them. Thanks for the straight forward information
Thank you for watching! I think they have realistic physics for projectile flight, otherwise it's hard to imagine how they would program it into the game.
@@Strat-Guides The velocity of the arrows is modeled in game amazingly! shooting downhill increases it while uphill decreases it.
@@berenhamilton3321 As a student of physics in the past, I approve :D
Since we are talking about tactics, i want to share some tactics that i use for my favorite faction in Bannerlord! the Vlandia, and for them i use 40 Sharpshooters, 30 Voulgier and 40 Banner Knights. The tactic is to put the Sharpshootera in the front in line formation, the Banner Knight in the middle in skein formation and the Voulgier behind in shieldwall formation (there is a perk in the polearm poll that increases the polearm skill of the troops in 30 in shieldwall formation). After that, just wait your sharpshooters to deal damage to the enemy lines and use the "move to position" command to make your cavalry pass right through the enemy infantry line (if you make that, the cavalry dont get stuck) after they pass, use charge command with the cavalry and the infantry. I put the Banner Knight in front of the infantry bcz the infantry dont have any shield. If you guys likes it, i have made a tactic for every faction and i would like to share if you guys want to!
This is a very solid strategy! I think a lot of people don't realize how dangerous sharpshooters are. I've ran into trouble before even with fians against sharpshooters since they have the range advantage and bolts hit armor very hard.
I plan on doing videos of unit testing by the culture, so this would be perfect as they are released!
@@Strat-Guides The Sharpshooters really are a powerfull unit, and in the right circumstances they are even better then the fian. When i play my battania campaign i put the fian in loose formation and as the enemy unit is advancing towards i use the "move to" command to retread the units and keep doing that till all enemy ranged units are dead. After that i charge with the infantry. This works especially well againt vlandian armies, bcz the sharpshooter need to stop to reload! Keep the amazing work that you bring to this community! Wish you all the best!
F1 + F4 is invaluable for cavalry, especially melee cavalry when you need them to tie-down/engage other cavalry formations. Discovering that on my own was like breaking the German enigma.
Spears/pikes are mostly useless, except on horses. The only real benefit to footman w/ spears is that they stop cavalry, allowing other Melee Infantry to actually take them down. So they are best used when mixed in with other melee troops. Though I'm of the opinion two-handed shock troops are better anti-cavalry overall.
Spearmen might be better if unit collision is ever addressed. The way infantry blobs and goes into "bee-hive mode" not only looks bad, but basically reduces the game to overwhelming your enemy with numbers. It's why Sun Tzu's F1 + F3 is almost always effective. It never ceases to amaze me how effective charging footman and archers together is. You'd think keep archers out of melee, would be important. Maybe if armor becomes more substantial there will be some actual need for tactics in this game, but I fear it's too late in development to address that. Only real tactics currently is maximizing the use of your ranged troops.
Very true. I also like to use it when I sneak behind their main lines and pick off archers. They can usually stand and trade with those type of units, assuming it's not fians lol
The funny thing is, shields will absorb the charge damage almost 100% of the time and there are some great shield infantry that can take cavalry down so It's hard to justify the pikeman's existence in Bannerlord.
Haha Sun Tzu wins again :P It's a great point and is exactly why fighting anything more than 2 people at once is nearly impossible without running away and picking at them. They can have 3 people swinging at you from inside each other practically lol
same i noticed that having medium quality troops in tons beats a small elite army cuz when few tier 3 footmen circle a tier 5 guy yeah he goes down after few hits. I disagree that Spearmen arent usefull. I mean its a infatry unit that has a spear so they can fight in QCC and also stop cav units generaly providing more utility than a simple swordsmen. For me the spearmen unit is that sweet spot cuz they have the shield for range protection , swords/axes for close combat and spears to either brace if that unit can or just poke at cav units and make them stop moving and be ganged up . My use of two handers shock troops is to be a seperate group that i keep behind or on the side of my main line and use them to hit the enemy main line on the flanks cuz that way they have more space to swing those weapons and basicly hit the enemy in the backs and not be blocked by shields. Or use them as bodyguards for archers but idk how a stacked unit of two handers will handle a cav charge cuz most of the troops wont be able to swing unless idk u have them in loose formation.
I wish the game had a better in-game guide about how the tactics work. Never knew advance was so complex and I love it.
Excellent work, concise and tested. Thank you, now you have another subscriber!
Pull all the major decisions you made in your speed run vids; I’m usually not one for watching campaigns but you do a great job providing context so a supercut would work well
I was planning on doing a final episode where I go back and put everything together in a single episode, but no fighting and only covering the big stuff! I know what you mean, I don't have time to watch let's plays anymore but I used to learn a lot by watching them so a more condensed version made sense. I'm going to keep experimenting with different formats too, I have some ideas for more stuff in the future. I was thinking about doing a series called "the road to 300" and each episode would be a single play through showing how I went from the start to level 300 for a certain skill, highlighting what strategies I used and also how much in game time it took to get there. Not sure if that's something you would watch?
i fell in love with this game a week ago, i discovered your channel and watched all the guides but i wish i did that before i restarted my campain 10 times lmao, love your content and jokes about 2 percent talesmath and movespeed bonuses , i learned so much and cant wait to try it all in game thanks so much youre the best!
It's such a fun game, I'm glad you joined us! :D Thank you for watching all these videos, I really appreciate the support! I know what you mean, I still redo my campaigns like that once in a while lol I have a bunch of half-finished save games.
@@Strat-Guides after watching this video i feel kind of embarassed for using f1+f3 for everything including archers lol, also i would love to see an auto resolve only run , doesnt have to be a full playthrough i just want to see all the possible battle situations with all the auto resolve perks and how op it can or cannot be
@@adamkuki3667 Lol no don't! It's not explained anywhere so totally understandable. Now, if you keep using only f1 + f3 then maybe... :D
@@Strat-Guides i wonder if its even worth charging/advancing with units other than chasing when they flee/commanding them to do so when the enemy is close , from my experience its just better to stay in place in an advantagous position and let the enemy come to me while my ranged units snipe them and order melee units to charge when they get too close and reposition my ranged units to hit them again
@@adamkuki3667 I just released part 2 that should answer that question :D ua-cam.com/video/QTxrRzv0ncw/v-deo.html
Wonderful video, I'm very grateful you're willing to spend time to educate us F1+F3 plebs
Haha you're just following Sun Tzu so you can't be faulted too much :)
Thanks!
Your videos are the best for this game, saying they were done perfectly would be an understatement. Thank you for existing my man.
I'm really happy to hear that! And I appreciate the support and kind words, thank you :D
9:56 Javrun calvary is the best unit type in the game, and it's not even close. They do exactly what their name says they do as well: They charge into skirmishing range to loose a single javelin into the dirt and then *run* off of the battlefield. Remember that it's not a lost battle, it's a strategic retreat.
The ultimate intimidation! lol At least they do more than pikemen...
about to watch this video,
saved it for later
your videos kept changing my playstyles slowly and multiple times
while i usually feel most comfort in playing it safe taking only battles in my favour to chill as 1 man army with F1 F3 support
for convenience mostly
digging huge cavalry only
im currently going in with a slow start into a massive sudden slaughter
with me as 2h mounted AXEman with a small cavalry followage
picking up enemies, slowing and disrupting forces that can easily be pushed out of place
while waiting for the main encounter, having ranged save behind the main force
then i flank the enemies with all the moral impact skillset to split their frontlines so mine can surround them
wich leads to massive enemy routing
often times leading to closely 0 losses while outnumbered 2to1 or more (big surgeon helps alot)
lets see what i can take from this one
Very promising start, excited for the rest of the series! As always, keep up the good work.
I appreciate that! I think this will be my favorite series out of the few that I've done so far. I really enjoy commanding troops so I'm excited to see what the optimal uses for each unit/formation is!
Having just got into this game, this video has been very helpful! A comprehensive analysis of pretty much all factors of unit management. Thanks!
Can't wait for the next video in this series! You are very methodical and thorough and I love it!
Thank you! I have done about 400 tests so far and have a good bit of info the the next episode :)
That`s a lot of work for the video but greatly appreciated at least by me, thank you. Save a lot of trouble and testing for the rest, so more time for playing... and maybe hopefully serves for devs to get their feedback.
Great vid as always Strat! I've been sleeping on playing around in the custom battles mode, might tool around with it tonight.
Thank you! Yeah it's pretty fun :) I also recommend getting the RTS mod (works on 1.7.1) if you don't already have it since you can control both sides, making it much easier to run tests and different scenarios.
The man delivers over and over :D, thanks for the great guide!
Thank you! I appreciate you always helping with the algorithm :)
@@Strat-Guides ;)
Hi Strat! Just wanted to thank you for your incredible work. I liked, subscribed, and have just joined - the first time I have ever joined any UA-cam content. Bannerlord is certainly, if not THE most incredible game I have ever played, in the top 3 lifetime for me. Funny, first time I played it, my reaction was "meh" - and after just a few hours in game, I put it away, for months. Reasons? I think because I encountered some of the unfinished parts, the parts that need polishing, a few bugs etc., and most importantly encountered what were for me a lot of non-intuitive functions, things like undecipherable perk descriptions, etc. It was like being a person going from looking at a fishing pond, seeing the ocean for the first time, and thinking it was just a bigger pond lol, not perceiving the depth under the surface. Yes, there is still a lot to fix - but - it's an unfinished work of absolute genius imho. A couple months ago, I picked it back up again randomly out of my Steam cellar, and by chance came across your UA-cam. Your guides, particularly the Quick Guides, Perk Guides, etc. have *clarified* and *transformed* the game for me. I consider your guides to be *indispensable* to my understanding and enjoyment of the game. I think Taleworlds could be missing out on sales of the game because there is so much depth there that is not clearly explained by them to users such as myself. I think they should purchase your videos from you to help them showcase the game, and hire you to help them polish and perfect it! Thank you again for your work to bring this to us!!!!
Wow, thank you so much for the support! It's always great to hear the hard work is helping others out :D
I know exactly what you mean, when I picked up Bannerlord I was in an EU4 phase, so I played it for a week or so and then went back to staring at maps lol.
It always irked me when I picked perks and planned things out, only to find they weren't even working. I agree with you, it's not the first to do a lot of what they do, but it's the first where they combine all of these elements into a single game AND add enough depth where it's still fun starting up a new campaign after a few thousand hours!
It's funny you mention it, because I've asked if they wanted to collaborate on a beginner's guide before they hit full release. I didn't ask for anything other than promoting the video when it's done - no sponsorship contract, no free stuff, literally just push the video to new people who buy the game. They said "We don't have anyone able to facilitate that at the moment." which is corporate for "$%@# off" lol! Oh well, I tried :)
Anyhow I'll keep up the hard work and pushing guides out until everything is covered!
You can also look for the weapon that was drawn first.
This changes depending on the type of opponent.
Unfortunately also with each unit at a different time. that's why the Vlandian Sergeant can't compete against Cavalry at the moment - they switch to the spear too late!
I noticed that the Khuzait Darkhan is the only unit in the shield wall that raises their spear over their head to thrust.
That's a great point, there is always a lag for the AI to process what to do. I notice they do that with throwing weapons too. They will cycle between their melee weapon and pulling out the throwing axe or javelin and half the time not have time to use either effectively lol.
Interesting, I'll make a note of that for when we get to the Khuzait unit testing! Thank you for letting me know!
Your content is just simply the best bannerlord content ! Also your humor gets me... but I am 100% sure Sun Tzu said F1 F3 I read it on the internet.
Thank you, I appreciate that! Haha if it's on reddit, it must be true :P I have a copy of The Art of War in the other room, I might need to handwrite that in there lol
4:06 I never bothered to check, but does the delegate command order change any in-battle captain perks, or is it static after choosing the captains/commanders in the initial battle set up?
That's a great question, because often times they will rearrange their unit groups once the you do that. I'm not sure! My guess is the perks would still work, but I'm not positive.
Wow dude! What an exellent video! I have been playing MnBB for over a year (Singleplayer only though) and I never knew there was so much complexity to the tactics-strategy! Obviously I use it a lot, but I've mainly placed my units before battle in what seemed the best place (uphill) and formation (archers on slope with mounted archers behind - usually infantry either in front of the archers in shield wall defending them, or just hidden away to avoid them being slaugtered, and cavalry placed as best as possible to give a charge).
I LOVE your video! But.. I have one small hickup.. The video is edited in a way that enables as much talk as possible in as short a time as possible. I would personally very much like it if you explained the mechanics and gave it 2-3 played scenarios to give us a visual presentation of the facts you're presenting! I had to skip back and forth a LOT in your video to actually contemplate what you're saying while understanding how it worked out on the battlefield.
I know it would make your videos longer, but I think they would be even better than they already are! :D
This is the first video of yours I've watched, so I looking forward to diving into your other ones! :)
Regards.
Basic range tactics that always works:
- Range units are the meta, especially horse archers if you like to micro them for maximum damage output.
- Always put your archers in loose formation and stretch the line to 3-4 men deep. That will ensure every single unit will have a line of fire and put the hurt on the enemy. If you can, position them on hill and/or at the flank of your infantry formation.
- if you want to optimise the range meta, go for horse archers and put them in loose formation. Divide the horse archers into 2 groups and use hold position command to put the 2 groups on both flanks. If the enemy is charging toward one group, order the other to move closer for devastating flank shots. A bit micro intensive but this tactic had allows me to win against enemies with overwhelming number as I started my own kingdom. Basically, try and use the horse cav like foot archers who are mobile and kite the enemies until they ran out of arrow. At that point should be easy to finish them off when you charge them in.
Also, did you know Khan’s Guards are the best melee and archer cavalry unit? Their glaives are devastating when cavalry got stuck in after their charge. And any cav foolish enough to charge at them would usually be dispatched or dismounted by their hail of arrows. A core group of 100 KG in your party is recommended to steam roll any fools tried to challenge you.
I siege castles after breaching walls with Khan's Guard. They chop defenders shield like chopping tofu.
On the topic of Khan's guard, they are also better than Fian archer in melee + are the best shock infantry if you just tell them to fight on foot and to not use their bows.
These are all great strategies, thank you for sharing!
Yeah I think the Khan's guard need a bit of a nerf. They nerfed Fians a while back and it baffles me as to why Khan's guard didn't get the same treatment.
@@Strat-Guides KG actually got somewhat nerfed since the first early access patch as I remember they used to have Noble Bow (yes you heard that right). They were basically decked out with the best gears like Fian Champion with their Noble Long Bows, but TW probably saw how ridiculous that was and nerfed it to Steppe Curve Bow. They also used to only had 1 quiver instead of 2 as they do now in the early patches.
Fun fact: mounted archers would straight up win a shoot out against foot archers, face-to-face on flat land, because their horses would help tanking some of the shots.
Edit: I managed to find a video reviewing the troops in the first patch ua-cam.com/video/82T2-TNB9wg/v-deo.html. As you can see, they were carrying that unrealistic big bow limbs from the Noble Bow lol.
Oh wow lol I can only imagine them with the noble bow! I have been playing since the first release, but I don't think I was paying attention to patch notes at all back then. I was still in my EU4 phase back then, so that took up most of my free time lol
Awesome videos, loved the bonus section at the end. Cant wait for the ret of the series!
would be very interested to see you do a side-video of similar nature using the "realistic battle AI mod" just to see what the differences are!
Thank you for watching! We are going to be testing all kinds of scenarios and doing some wacky things to see if they work.
Yeah that's a great idea! I actually have plans for doing a play through with that mod specifically, so maybe i'll do the testing video first so I'll know roughly what to expect. Good idea, thank you!
@@Strat-Guides thanks! Am glad you liked the idea.
If you do five it a try, I would recommend only using the AI module as the one which changes armour I think is very unbalanced.
@@Axis_._ Oh okay, interesting. Does it make higher tier units god-like?
@@Strat-Guides yea, it makes armour waaaay more effective. So low tier weapons just bounce off most of the time. (Havnt used it for a few updates but was not enjoyable last time I did)
Is there a way to scale it back some or it's either on or off?
Another great video, really looking forward to the next episodes!
Thank you for watching!! Things are going to get a little wild next haha I think there are some hidden gems waiting to be discovered :D
Sweet Vid. I look forward to the rest of the series
Thank you! I'm not 100% sure yet, but I think we will start the unit testing and go culture by culture for the next few videos.
Nice breakdown on the commands for different troop types! I always put melee cavs with javelins on Hold Fire since I tend to mix them with other non-javelin melee cavs. Instead of relying on infantry with spears (both 1h and 2h), IMO a dense shield wall formation of 1h infantry works better against charging cavs since it still stops them while the 1h melee weapon works much better than a thrusting polearm with everyone squished together. Mix in some 2h swinging polearm infantry (Menavliaton/Veteran Falxman) to clean up the cavs that got stuck in the formation. (Also make sure that the 2h infantry don't get stuck in the front of the shield wall formation when trying to move to the back line.)
Between square and circle, I personally prefer square for infantry since the formation is denser and it's hard to put ranged units inside the circle in a way they still put out volleys of projectiles. One interesting idea I had is to put infantry in a square formation 50-100 steps ahead as bait for enemies to attack and surround while I keep a wide line of ranged units behind to shoot down any enemy units that had their shields turned away.
Same, I much prefer square for infantry too! Even against other infantry it seems to do quite well. I'm going to be doing more testing to see how different formations do against others using the exact same units. It should be interesting :D
Paused at 13:36 to suggest (to anyone that cares, lol) separating archers into 2 groups, in loose formation, stacked on the hill. The 3 lines of each group should fire, doubling the force multiplier.
Oookay this was helpful. Possibly a touch dated but for whatever reason I struggle with commands in Bannerlord. I did quite well in Warbands, but I think it's just been too long. Refresher much appreciated.
I think until they become muscle memory, it's difficult to command effectively because the added stress of trying to command while a huge battle is going on is tough!
I'm was glad to see they added slow motion while issuing orders (and made it optional for those who prefer it off). Speaking for myself as a gamer who is, well, probably getting too old to play games, it really made issuing orders much less stressful for me. Other than basic F1 F3
Yeah I was pretty surprised they added that to be honest, it didn't seem like something they would do!
As someone who doesn't own this game, i find this video extremely helpful
Nice, I appreciate you watching! Hopefully they can patch the game up a little more and make it enticing enough to purchase :D
That was pretty awesome information! Thanks for taking the time to test this out!
This was awesome. Keep up the good work!
Thank you!!
The absolute best terrain for archers is if you can achieve an Amphitheatre effect, where your archers are positioned on an incline and their targets are approaching them from the leveled-off area not sharing the incline with your archers, or your archers are on the leveled-off area and the enemy are coming down the incline. Or two inclines are facing each other creating a small valley between them. This opens up the most area for your archers to get clear lines of fire on their targets so you can get a whole formation volleying. Not always achievable but always worth exploiting when you come across terrain that plays along with you this well.
That's a good point, it would present the largest area to shoot at rather than a cross section of the formation or a front/side face. I had not considered that!
Thank you again for all of these videos.
No problem, I'm happy to see everyone getting use out of them! I appreciate your support :)
Very informative, thanks mate. Also 3:06, classic 👍
3:22 just saw this "column" while playing on PS4. Since it wasn't me who gave the order (I was playing as just another mercenary on the field), I started to wonder how to achieve this "insane X formation" and how effective it would be on the battle. Turns out it's just Mount and Blade being Mount and Blade
Lol yeah column is a goofy one. I think it was meant for RP purposes or making cinematic scenes.
And there goes my idea of using Macedonian tactics
I have the feeling though that horses are far too eager to charge into pointy sticks. The main benefit of a pike square is that it can basically stop a cavalry unit from ever connecting because the mounts would shy away from moving themselves onto the defender's weapons
Yeah they need a much longer pike :( That's a good point, although Bannerlord is notorious for horses smashing into trees, rocks, running off cliffs, etc. so I'm not sure they could program them to avoid pikes who's brace state changes through the battle. It would be good though!
This was amazing, Singsing needs to watch this
Thank you for watching! The only singsings I know about are the DOTA2 pro and the prison lol
Im your host, Strat, and I appreciate your time... meh meh meh mih mah.. no bra. We appreciate your time. Hours of learning, compiled and sorted.. fkn gg. And the amount of guides and guides and guides. Lol sub'd
Haha I was wondering where you were going with that :D I appreciate the support my dude!
man I am shocked as clearly I haven't played enough of this game but still shocked that Caverly are just that broken even against a pike wall omg I never laughed so hard such a shame, wish they made 70% of the horses react to a solid tight formation with a shield wall with spears that is usually all you needed to stop a cavalry charge in IRL not just a classic pike wall, this has been very educational
I think 'Scatter' formation only works on maps with 'objects' that archers go to, like manlets and firing positions. Archers on siege maps default to 'scatter' formation and you have to remove them from it to position them anywhere other than along the wall or behind the barriers.
Okay got it, that makes a lot of sense. I know i've used it before, but didn't realize that's what it was for. Thank you! I'll be sure to include this when we get to the siege combat episodes.
I think that for the Vlandian Pikes, you should go by the rule "Less Is More". They seem like a super-specialized unit so you really only want them capitalizing on it 100% of the time.
I'd suggest just keeping a small number of them in your army. Just enough to make a single-row line formation wide enough to cover your other troops.
If they can land substantial damage on the charge defense, they're a profitable addition to the army and their further use as sub-optimal sword infantry is just icing on the cake. If they die from the charge or shortly after, it's better that they die than your more valuable troops. If they can't do substantial damage on the initial charge defense then they're just sub-optimal sword infantry and you might as well not have them.
So it's better to have less of them than you need.
Good point, I think "sprinkling" a few of them into formations can help against cavalry charges. Maybe they would make good guards for archers?
I think the issue with the test I ran is that the AI doesn't have 500 cavalry. That many cav seem to push through any formation just due to the sheer number of horses. When I get to the cavalry testing, I may back that number down to a more realistic number like 100 - 200 or so.
They sound like they'd be good archer guards. I imagine they're cheaper than cav so it'd be less of a loss having them sit around on babysitting duties than cav.
Yeah that's always the issue with dry tests. Things don't always line up 'live' cases.
That's why I prefer studying and experimenting while on campaign, but even still there's plenty of issues with that. Your control over the scenario is very limited, it can take a LOT of time to reach satisfactory conclusions, and sometimes the conditions you're trying to test are just far too rare or expensive in one way or another.
I tried experimenting with War Dogs in Rome2 Total War because of how odd a unit they are. In dry tests they were fantastic, but it was just a nightmare trying to get any useful data from live experimentation.
@@FiltyIncognito Yeah that's exactly why I wanted to start like this, in a controlled environment. We will slowly add more and more to the mixed testing and eventually get to the full scale battles :D
Lol the war dogs! I remember trying to make them work too :)
You are missing an intresting thing from real battles: different types of units.
For ex: line formation mixes and matches front row with shield units, shock troops and shieldless low tier infantry.
Square, shield wall, skein and circle automatically forms first 1-2 rows with shields if possible and sends all the unprotected units behind the shield line.
Square also focuses shields on front and flanks, leaving back unprotected.
Thanks for the video. Lots of interesting info there, although I did come here to see how to shrink formations (e.g. when enemies do a tight shield wall when out-numbered. You mentioned that you can configure this, but not how. I'll test it later (Maybe the same command twice?)
I also have been finding that mounted archers, standing still are very effective too. They seem to be much more accurate than having them just advance and can be quite easy to position behind the enemy, but you do need to keep an eye on them.
Sorry for the late reply, been out of action for a few months due to business issues. I have a whole tactics guide series that covers all of these! And the one I just published yesterday was testing horse archers - They seems to be about 2x to 3x more deadly when shooting without moving. That being said, they do worse in combat when directly engaged - the group circling will always come out ahead.
Looking forward to the rest of this series! I reckon your analytical and experimental approach to your videos works really well here. Also, I always really appreciate the bonuses :)
Thank you for watching! We have a ton of testing to get through, but I think the majority of it will be practical stuff we can all use.
Yeah the bonuses are always my favorite! :D
I'd like to see how thrusting polearm units perform with (if the engine allows for it) the ability to be able to stab through allies. I think what's stopping them being good is the collision detection mechanics and AI not vibing. If spear units could attack two lines deep and pikemen three they would be a lot more versatile in melee with the ability to be able to sustain a line better but be susceptible to flanking.
Having tested pikemen before there's something interesting there but it feels like a wasted unit compared to a standard heavy infantry, skirmish or shock troop.
I think they could make it work. I suspect they do that with cavalry archers since each row can fire and their trajectory is pretty much flat.
I feel like having a small detachment of pikes would be okay. Maybe 20 - 30 to cover the initial cavalry charge. But then again you can achieve the same outcome with shield infantry and just let them run into the shields lol
1:44 Jokes on you, i've been using Louis Stevens' advice on Bannerlord battlefield tactics for the last 22 years. But if you really want to become a pro, "Beans" is the tactical genius of our time.
Lol Beans the rapper?!
@@Strat-Guides Beans, the Even Stevens legend
Only the first and second line of pikes will brace. The third line and each line after that will not brace. Longer spears are best for bracing and to be honest, the Vlandian Pikeman needs a longer spear (there is one in the game), along with a better sword IMO. They could also use an armor upgrade too. Otherwise, Vlandian Voulgiers and especially Battanian Falxman work better.
As far as archers, the most effective way to use them is a long thin line (usually single line) in loose formation. Do not face enemy. Mr Chicken did some really extensive testing: ua-cam.com/video/SHpBGfyp6lo/v-deo.html
For those who use Realistic Battle AI (great mod by the way), everything changes. To be honest, I think Taleworlds needs to change the square formation - all lines of pikes should brace.
Thank you for watching! I really hope they adjust pikes because they need some help big time.
I'm going to be doing more unit vs unit testing but for the most part I agree with his results.
Yeah I'm really excited to try that mod out! I have it downloaded, but waiting to do testing on it until after we finish this series :D
I think what the Pikes and formations in general need is mass and hard be able to hard stand ground, like in Medieval 2 or Rome Total War, so when the horses hit, they can’t just push through, the pikes actually hold and it’s hard to push through them through brute force.
Agreed, they just sort of push their way through infantry without slowing down much or knocking anyone down.
Good job! Thank you for your time! Very interesting results, i will remember them and use ingame. In my game i play mostly with cavalry and i don't like how they act after doing charge and left on their own. So i go another way. I command them "follow me" and then go accurately, slicing enemies layer by layer, coming inn and out with some initial kills and almost no casualties, waiting for their archers to split from infantry to become the easy prey for my cav. That means that my cataphrachts loose the advanatage of lance strike and i need to take manual control of battle to myself but i like riding with my warriors and i like that under my control they attack only the troops that they need to attack and take less casualties which are pretty expensive when speaking about 150+ elite cataphrachts. If you are interested, the rest 150+ warriors are the horse bowmen who just execute the enemy infantry defending from my cav on the opposite side and getting bunch of arrows in their backs. Meanwhile the horse bowmen can keep the distance from enemy infantry comfortably and enemy cavalry (second threat for standing horse bowmen) was erased by my cav in the beginning of the battle. So until i am not wounded and can control the battle the casualties are really low and the kills are high. Also such party is incredibly quick on campaign map but is extremely expensive to raise. So advantages and disadvantages as usual xD BTW i play on maximum difficulty just in case
That's a good idea, I usually do that with cav archers but I don't see why it couldn't work with regular cav as well :D I could see this being particularly effective against archers like you said.
I feel like cataphracts against archers is fine with the sword or mace (not fians though lol they wreck everyone).
Which horse bowmen do you prefer to use? I assume you are referring to the imperial Buccelarii?
@@Strat-Guides Thank you for your interest! I am playing the campaign and and i've chosen the Istiana side, so most of my activity is on Empire territory srarting at Epicroteia. So i prepared Empire villages for good reputation beforehand. So yes, i have 380 army which is ~180 Cataphrachts and 130 Bukkelaries and some more horse troops. But during campaign i've found out that bukkelaries have little amount of arrows and now i am looking for an option to have khuzait horse archers. I did not think that this arrow amount will be that important before. So now i am planning to move East and bring my kingdom closer to Khuzait or maybe even fight them to get prosoners, but there is another problem. I doubt that my tactics will work against them. I think their skirmishes wil outrun my cataphrachts and with anti-horse infantry i will never catch em up on campaign map.
@@xAMSTERCheshir Yeah that's the only downside of those units. I wish they had more ammo :( The Khuzaits get the crazy steppe arrows that have 32+ arrows per quiver, it's crazy!
Nice been looking forward to this
Thank you for watching!!
one thing to add: hold fire on inf helps a lot vers cav charges.
and realy 2 handed agenst cav is quite strong, I tryed 500 batania volunteers vers 500 bannerknights and volenteers in square won.
thx fore the nice worke!
That's a great point since they take forever to switch to the correct weapon.
Interesting, I'm going to have to try that one out!
Informative vid as always Strat! I'm floored about square formation & pikes, I'm glad I never went down that path even though I wanted to try a pike block...
btw If you havent tested macro-managing cav while you advance the rest of your troops, it can be very effective. First, have them formed either in line or skein on the flank(s), then command your melee cav to move to a position through the enemy line (like 30-50m on the other side) and will temporarily open infantry to missile fire, assist your footmen pitted in combat, or completely wreck archers. Once they are past, either move through their line again or draw them back towards your flank and move through again from the front. If it were viewed from above, it would result in a figure 8 like movement that occasionally retraces given the situation and terrain
Thank you for watching! Yeah I was pretty disappointed by that test. I thought for sure it would at least keep the Cavalry out if nothing else but it was the worst one lol
That's a great point, I have not used it as you described but I have sent my cavalry to mop up the enemy cav since they just sit there on both sides of the enemy army lol easy pickings. I'll be sure to test using this method as well, thank you for the heads up!!
@@Strat-Guides Agreed, cav vs cav is usually 1st priority. And I'd say this method works similar to an improved charge command, in that if cav gets stuck or stopped, they'll go directly to the point instead of drawing swords and attempting a melee, so it can help with losses, with management being the drawback
@@taianonni Oh okay, interesting. More useful info :D I appreciate you letting me know, this will help a lot.
When delegating command for archers they go into a skirmish line, which is more spread out than "loose", but is inaccessible in the command menu. Therefore I quickly F6 my archers to get the formation and then take over command to place them well. Come to think of it, the formation may be part of the realistic battle mod, hence why there isn't an option in the command menu.
Interesting, I had never noticed that before! I'm going to try it out now.
For archers, divide them into several platoons and separate them. Seems to work well
Awesome idea for a series!
Thank you! It's going to be a good one I think and a lot more enjoyable to run the testing than staring at perks for 10 hours :D
Your vids keep getting better! I'd love to see some breakdowns on small unit composition -- early game build-up and late-game hunter/killer parties.
How can we get the best map speed?
What's effective against various bandit types?
Who should I take into a base assault?
How far away do I have to draw an enemy before the 2,000-strong death stack can't reinforce them?
That's a great idea! I think once I get a little further into it, I can maybe do a video specifically for small unit tactics.
These are all good questions. I'll do my best to address them in the coming guides :D
The issue with pikes is that cavalry are beasts in this game compared to real horses. Square formations were effective against cavalry because horses have self preservation, and can’t tank several shots to the body. If they see a line of soldiers facing them down with spears they straight up wouldn’t charge into them head on.
Not only do bannerlord horses not care, so the pikemen couch one horse, then the ones behind go through. The pikemen really need to allow the guys in back to attack too
Great video. I'd love to know the best tactics to use for each soldier type in more detail and how that compares to the good ole F6. For example: I've got infantry, archers, and cav. What should I do with each unit to max their effectiveness against various enemy units. I put heavy infantry in shield wall, archers in loose on a hill behind, and cav off to the side/back. Lure the enemy in and charge the infantry right at contact, leave the archers or use fallback if needed, and just F6 the cav. I'd love to know if I'm doing it right. Once I smash the first wave, I always pull everyone back and wait for enemy reinforcements then rinse and repeat.
This is exactly what this series is about! I'm glad you brought those questions up :) I'm still formulating the next topic, but I think it might be easier to go culture by culture until everyone is covered and then do biggest testing after like mixed army, large scale battlefield tactics, siege tactics, etc.
@@Strat-Guides EY sorry to bother you again. but to have free camera do you use some kind of special mod? Yesterday I have been googling the whole time and found some mods but they arent working on 1.7 (RTS mods to command and have free camera) which mod or where can I find yours? thanks again have a lovely day^^
@@-x-9909 Yeah for this video I only used one mod - RTS.
Check out Nexus Mods: www.nexusmods.com/mountandblade2bannerlord/mods/791?tab=files
It's under Realistic Battle Mod (RBM) then go to files page, scroll down and look for RTS for 1.7.0 - 1.7.1 and download that one. You can install RTS by itself so you don't need the other stuff. I hope that helps!
@@Strat-Guides You're a damn legend buddy.
@@petes5152 Thank you for all the support :D
"Now let's try out circle formation since you can't outflank a circle." Has to be my favorite quote.
Lol Thank you for watching :D
Great job man! Keep it up.
Thank you!! I appreciate it :)
I just found out about F6 and I love it actually. I put footmen and bows in the hands of the AI and I can run around with the cav like a real nobleman.
If I need something from the infantry or archers I will move them and then grant back control to the ‘sergeants’.
I notice that giving an advance command to calvary makes them target enemy horse archer, then calvary, then foot archers in that order
Interesting, will they run through a shield wall to get after horse archers first or is there a range limit? I guess the question is what happens if they are all equidistant and then again at different ranges. I'll be sure to test this out, maybe formations and commands part 2 lol
@@Strat-Guides I don't know if there is a range limit, but I given advance commands to my cavalry to attack 50+ size formation of enemy melee cav very close to them. Only for them to ignore the melee cav and attack a 5 size formation of horse archers.
I'm in the process of death calvary all the best of each race so far feels great with it it's worth trying
Oh this is so good! Stuff here I didn't know. At the beginning, I pressed some wrong buttons with all the stress, and the worst was Dismount... it was so frustrating!
I'm at 500 hours+ and I think F5 should be Fallback, would be less frustrating for beginners. It's so bad misspress that, and hearing your hero shouting "Dismount!" and you go "Noooo! Where's the 'mount' command???"
Thank you, I'm glad it was helpful! LOL I hate when I do that :P Sometimes I accidentally have my troops facing the wrong direction... woops
I am soooo stoked for this series!! And curious how you were so effective with a spear in the end haha.Also those were some nice looking troops!! I haven't made any custom banners... How did you do it? They looked great!
This was a really fun video to test/make! It's going to be interesting to see what's possible :)
So that was just randomly generated from the custom battles. I really like the peppermint candy flag lol made me want to snack on some.
I'd be interested to see what "jobs" the infantry are all good at. For example I'm aware that Legionaries are the best shielded infantry against other shielded infantry however, are sergeants better at stopping cavalry due to their braceable spear?
That's exactly why I wanted to do this series :) I was asking myself the exact some questions! Rest assured, we will find all of these answers and more.
from my campaign testing where i used vlandian troops vs Vlandia in a civil war, Sarg's are amazing against cav charges, as are oathsworn or any of those end tier shield infantry with braceable spears. counter charging from my experience after the initial cav impact is the best course of action too, naturally that requires a tad amount of micro but it really isn't bad. on the flipside any top tier unit with a one handed mace does well against other top tiers, legionaires and sarg's have a fairly good spawn rate for maces..... and empire sarge crossbows, whom can beat units like oathsworn and aserai veteren infantry while on hold fire.
Thanks for the video, I've been doing some off the things you found to work but not all.
Thank you for watching! I've got much more useful info coming in the next few videos as this one was just the intro to get the basics, making it easier to understand the next several videos :)
@@Strat-Guides I'd love to see one one deadling with horse archers, Khuzait are always a problem for me.
@@benjaminwaite5970 The bonus section of the next video has a little something for you then :D I couldn't quite defeat Khan's guards with skirmisher infantry (almost though), but literally any other cavalry archer it can be done with infantry only :D
I have a 250 army that has 20 cavalry and 230 horse archers. The best formation that I found was to put horse archers in loose and cavalry to follow me then I go and deal with enemies horsmen. If we aren't outnumbered the enemy will stay back and when horsemen are done horse archers will charge. But if we are outnumbered enemy will charge the infantry. When the infantry is near to horse archers, horse archers will charge (Khans Gaurds are really good at dealing with infantry) and then they go to the other side of the map and do the same thing (loose formation...).
This tactic is fantastic for armies with a few horseman (Sturgia, Empire...) but doesn't really work against Khuzaits themselves.
It seems like the Khan's guard will basically counter everything else in the game lol they probably need to be nerfed slightly. I'm sure they were devastating IRL in melee combat as well, but it makes them insanely strong in pretty much every situation.
THANK YOU FOR THIS
Thank you for watching!
Awesome vid, but I was hoping you'd show more strategies for actual battles that aren't just comprised of a single type of unit. Maybe you could do a general guide for battle strategies in the future (normal battles in the open, and sieges)? Not sure if that would get views. This is my first strategy type game and I'm a shitter, but maybe the youtube algorithm isn't profitable for people like me for this game anymore.
Hey Dennis! Thanks for watching - I do have plans to run actual army vs army battles but I wanted to be extra thorough in covering each unit type, formation and command just so we know which is the most efficient going into the bigger battles. It can often times be difficult to discern which are best to use since even a bad command or formation can still win if the unit vs unit balance it off (tier 3 vs tier 5, etc). Don't hesitate to reach out if you have question in the future, I'll do my best to help :)
For 90% of the time when using mounted of foot archers, I always opt for the Advance command and if I'm attacking, I'll tell them to do so before the fighting starts when setting up the troops.
And it works really well if I'm Battanian and have those amazing _Fain archers_ at my disposal.
If I'm defending, then it's shield troops behind the archers on _hold_ until the enemy is in range, then I'll tell the archers to advance. They'll then fall behind the shield troops but still keep peppering them.
Awesome man thanks for the great explanation I'm definitely going to use them
Glad it was helpful!
i was searching for this one tyyy
Perfect timing! :D
I've had some success manually moving cav through enemy formations, not giving any charge/advance commands.
Example; Enemy line formation in front of me and my cav, I move command my horses say, 50 yards behind the enemy line.
The horses will move towards the enemy, when they get close enough they will prepare an attack, proceed to attack, move past and group up behind.
Then i can do it again, but this time moving them back towards me. Through the enemy line again.
It has been quite effective. They dont seem to do as much damage as a charge command, but get stuck way less, and so i can get in a lot more charges before having them all die on me.
That's a good point, I forgot to test that! When I get into the unit vs unit testing, I'll be sure to check which gives the best results before making any conclusions. Thank you for letting me know, very helpful!
Ha, I finally see that when you say advance in newer videos that it was because they changed the command to "engage" at some point. My character even still yells "advance!".
Yeah I dunno why they changed it! Seems like such an unnecessary thing to change.
I don't know if you have thought of that yet: since archers in one unit pretting much use only the first three lines - what about splitting a unit that can't be deployed in 3 lines into 2 units right behind each other, each in 3 lines. Would that improve performance? Or does the foremost unit still count as an obstacle? and what about leaving a little opening between the two ranged units?
I recall trying that a few months back and they block the shots unless you space them out enough to have clearance. It's a good though, I was hopeful as well :D
15:06 🙈
"to few has come, we can not defeat the armies of Vlandian Pikemen"
"no we can not.. but we will meet them in battle none the less"
I laughed so much, bittersweet memories 😅😂
This video is an absolute blessing, I knew what a lot of the commands were supposed to do, but really hadn't played with them enough to really know what to do, now I actually have some idea of what commands to give to what troops.
In the archer testing I was surprised by the results showing only the front 3 ranks firing mainly, does that change at all based on the range to the target? I'm assuming not since you had them fairly close in some of the tests you showed. Also, do you know what happens when the front ranks run out of arrows? With this new info I'm now curious how to really effectively use archers.
As for future vid ideas, I'd be really interested to see different ways to effectively deal with enemy cavalry in a field battle, as I've found that in most of my fights, as long as I'm not getting run over by cavalry I can limit my losses even with very basic micro.
It's funny you mention that because I kind of had an idea for most of these, but actually testing them by themselves really helped understand them fully. I think I will be using advance much more frequently for infantry instead of charge. I like that they keep their cohesion instead of a small group running ahead and getting slaughtered lol.
Yeah I'm pretty sure it's based on range. I made sure to be well inside the max range so that everyone could fire if they were able to. When they run out, they just sit there lol it's unfortunate. I think the best course of action is to make sure that all 3 rows can shoot at all times, otherwise they are being underutilized. I think it's also helpful to use the hold fire command frequently. It's annoying to have to micro it, but at max range most units don't hit squat lol
Cavalry is certainly going to be the toughest to test again! I have a few ideas though... :D
I'm in an heavily archer-focussed playthrough right now, and I get best results (tell me if u get better) if I use 2 Archer formations, 1 on "2" and the other on "5" or later. If I put the 2. group on "3", melee cavalry will just respawn there instead of archers, which just completely wastes it.
As shown in the video, if you have mass archers on "loose formation", they will just form a giant rectangle, not something that looks like a line, which is really bad most of the time. So what I do is, select group 2, put them in loose -> now they will form a line and not a rectangle. Select Group 5 and move them right behind group 2. They will automatically be in a line which is spread out like if they were in loose formation(talewords wonkyness). Means you will have two long rows of archers and rly not a rectangle shape (except for if youre fighting with very limited space such as the edge of a battle map or mountains), and around 90% will be shooting all the time.
Also very good to just put 1 archerline to the left and 1 to the right of the infantry. They can not only shoot more and from better angles and without being blocked by our infantry, they're also pretty save.
I think using the advance command on archers is way inferior than to manually tell them their position with short charges in between but u could prove me wrong. Face enemy direction is massive though.
Yeah I think splitting the archers is the best for defeating a shield wall since one group can always be on the flank. I think it also helps when being charged by cavalry as one group will be able to fire instead of everyone getting switched to melee mode.
I need to do a bit more testing with using multiple groups for archers because like you mentioned, having all of them shooting at the same time is much more effective than only half due to formation limitation.
Yeah the only time I use advance for archers is when I don't have time to micro them, but I also don't want them to run into melee range. It's really good for lazy leading (fighting against looters lol). I can confidently issue advance and walk away for a minute :D
Honestly, I think having the pike break after the first charge and then having the pikemen swap to a secondary weapon will be way more effective than what they are now.
They should definitely give them a Voulge as their secondary lol :)
I've learned to just go Napeoleonic wars with my Ranged units to be fair, Make 3-line deep Loose formations, perhaps split into groups of 2, and hose the enemy down once they come within 180m, then within the last 20m, Switch to Melee & Line formation.
Ussually have atleast a 20-man cavalry group to make Enemy units turn around and put their backs to my ranged, or keep enemy cavalry at bay from my flankable ranged units.
Lol nice, rank and file volley! I like that. The cav for distraction is a great idea as well, who needs to flank when the AI will turn for you :)
my favorite strategy so far:
using my little warband to RP a bit of an elite group (cuz these troops are slightly OP but not by much and i find the battles still struggling when outnumbered or evenly matched but out done.)
i have the following troops
cavalry similar to sturgian DCs
horse archers similar to kuzhaits
archers similar to battanian fians
3 sets of infantry
berserkers - 2h axe, lots of javs
hunters - pikes, javs, 2h axe
shield brothers - spear, shield, sword, javs.
i like javs.
i usually have the infantry advance in either a shield wall or just charge to close in fast. and i have all mounted troops follow me and we circle and smash.
hammer and anvil baby! love it.
Sounds like you're using the Varangian guard! That's really cool, I need to try out that mod. I've heard a lot of good things about it.
@@Strat-Guides oh it's so much fun. you can use troops as a template which makes it easy to get started. i found it easiest to start with top tier troop designs and working my way backwards. it's nice to be able to trim your troops skills to just what you need from them too.
i was worried about making troops too OP and disrupting the balance but it's honestly not that bad at all.
@@KoreyMacGill Yeah that would have been my first concern - game balance. Good to know, I'm adding it to my list :)