Yo not gonna lie. Bringing Fin in was amazing preach. Really love this dude and LOVE this whole bouncing ideas of each other. Easily the most enjoyable addition to this channel
Hard agree. Preach does really well with a buddy and while ghosty was a funny guy he was never all that knowledgeable of high level wow (not that he claimed to be, i just like that in a companion to preach)
Fin is amazing. Top notch. But Ghost is a massive massive hole. One that probably can’t be ever be completely filled. They were lifelong best buds and the webshow was something unique. It was great while it lasted. Maybe they make up in the future, who knows. Either way fin brings something ghost never could. He’s that mythic raid end game guy for mike to bounce off. That was always missing. And, for me, fin does it amazingly well.
yeah because he's full of shit lmao. He keeps saying "YOU WONT BE KICKED FROM CONTENT FOR YOUR SPEC CHOICE ITS FINE" but then literally said that his guild LAUGHED at him for picking feral and said he couldn't raid.
@Not Drunk James not in this video, but in the ones leading up to choosing mains, he does state in the feral video his guild only let him do one pull in raid testing as Feral as they didnt need to take it seriously.
yeah and every other player will see what 95% of the players are using and chose that, I am not looking forward to answering socials in gchat for the 100th time about what covenant he/she should chose
I think for a majority of players it’s going to be a pretty clear choice but one that’s ultimately demoralizing. I’m more casual and I’m going necro Hunter. Don’t really care how it sims I just like the armor and mount too much. But the ability? It might be alright but it’s no fucking Bastion wall hack so that’ll always be a massive letdown that I just can’t use it. I’m sure a majority of people are the same. They’re either simming and the choice is easy but fucking sucks or they’re more about the themes and probably want a different ability.
I’ve been a feral druid main for about 15 years now, through all the ups and downs. Not about to change now. Props to the hardcore guys that put all the time they do into being on top, though.
To be completely fair-- choosing 2 mains for this expansion terrifies me. Between the conduits, the covenants, the legendaries and the plain old cross-expansion class changes. I'm absolutely baffled by the number of variables I have to consider on Day One. And it's not that I am a Mythic raider who needs to mini-max all his shit. I am a very ordinary player, I just want to play what is the most effective tool for the job I am doing. I do not understand why is that such a crazy concept that only should apply to the top 1%. I'll never be driving as well as Ayrton Senna. Does that mean I don't care about how I drive or what I drive at all? Of course I do. Because I share the road with other users who depend on me to perform at a certain level. And this is the secret ingredient - other people. If I want to play Icewind Dale and make a group out of 6 Bards, I can do it. I'll be having some uphill battles ahead of me, for sure, but also some surprising advantages. Is it optimal? No. But it's my time, my crazy idea for an unbalanced group. The moment I play with other people, god forbid, friends - the perception changes dramatically. Suddenly my goofy choices start to matter for OTHER people. And I don't want to play with 6 Bards anymore. I want to have a Warrior, Paladin, Thief, Mage, Cleric and/or a Druid. And I wish someone at Blizzard understood this dependency. At this point, I'm ready to just play it safe - go with Druid for healing/tanking and Rogue for DPSing, with Priest lagging in the 3rd place, designated as "if I have any spare time."
People who call min maxers 1%ers are just arrogant casual players that have no real clue about the playerbase. If you're a mythic raider you care about that stuff, if you do high M+ keys or rated PvP you also care, hell some people even care without doing any of that stuff. I'd say easily 20% of the playerbase cares quite a bit about performing well and picking close to optimal for their spec. It just makes sense, you wanna be the best you can be, why wouldn't you? It's like there's only 2 types of players: casuals and 1% min maxers which is just not true.
@La Nausée I'm sorry not sure what LFR groups you've seen but from my experience about 80% of LFR people just wanna get carried. They don't even watch a boss guide, they're just standing there hoping to dps through it instead of learn the mechanics beforehand. To be fair the only time I did some LFR was end of expansion so maybe that's why but still. LFR was bottom of the barrel, I've seen better players in M0.
@@taserrr The funny thing is, there's quite a large chunk of playerbase that doesnt even do LFR. There are quite a lot of people for whom the endgame content for the last 2 expansions was doing worldquests. I have a friend that has been playing the game like that since Cata when he started. He picked druid and has been playing it ever since because he thinks "druids are neat". His endgame before wq's were made has been literally just flying around, doing story quests and pet battles. I'm allmost convinced that those types of players are the ones crying about the 1%. To them, the game is perfect, every single expansion for them was amazing, and any criticism of the game looks like angry nerds attacking their favorite game for no reason. The only thing I cant understand is why the fuck Blizz keep catering to those people. Players like that would be happy anyway.
@@MrFuckingKololo Yeah I agree, I have no issue with these people but if they don't play endgame why do they have opinions about changes regarding endgame?
@@georgeluxton6830 of COURSE hes going to reroll, they do this everytime people build their mains up and 1-2 months later something gets a 50% buff and top dog gets nerfed into the grave until the end of the expansion
Is it just me, or does anyone else just really enjoy the process that Preach, and now Fin, use to pick their mains? I just really enjoy listening to their reasoning. Also, you've picked the two classes I've played the most in my WoW history, so that's fun for me.
I'm sticking to one class, i put that stamp on my soul after BfA. All those alts where i had to grind essences, or after three times doing the cape dailies and visions i leveled up a healer role. The moment it reached level 120 and Black Empire quest popped up i said to myself, fuck this, i'm not doing this again
I've adapted my playstyle as an alt-o-holic. I just level every alt to max and then max out my professions for gold and then I just buy whatever the fuck I want. Alt addicts are meant to be gold makers I'm convinced
9:50 It's because any time a melee player can't just sit on the boss and do their rotation, they call the fight "melee unfriendly." Since that's every fight, the raid is melee unfriendly. If they have to do any mechanics at all and have any down time whatsoever, it's melee unfriendly.
@@TheSilverwing999 He (also?) said it in a Legion video regarding his Mage. It's in "Rerolling: What would I choose?" at 14:31. I watched it recently so the quote was familar
The old Survival hunter was my favourite hunter spec.. BM really should've been the melee spec if they really needed a melee spec (Which they didn't...)
This is me. Sitting at 9 120’s now all above 440 item level. From mythic dungeons and world quests. Hate raiding, only play to pvp and sadly I have to do pve content to get any kind of edge
@@danama8932 Not unless you buy gear or do regular low mythic+ keys. Without those, aka casually, 440 is actually a fairly large number, which is why none of my characters have surpassed like 453 ilvl, because that's as far as casual rewards go.
Might just be with how they scale them but during testing it was realistic to hit enrage timer in a melee heavy raid for some bosses when it didnt if you were ranged heavy
The way you were talking about Hunters in that first vid, it was super obvious that was really the only option for you. But it's cool you gave us a dramitisation of that choice. Surprised that Fin chose ret though, throughout the last 15 years it's only ever been briefly meta.
Funny thing; last night, my best friend and I were going over the list of classes and specs to choose a main for Shadowlands too and after a while of weeding out things we liked and disliked, we rounded up a few classes that fit our wants. So, I'll be moving into Shadowlands with a Blood DK since I like all 3 specs of it and a Hunter alt, again, because I like all 3 specs...even if survival sucks, it's just damn fun.
For Fin: Unless I've missed some videos (which is likely of course), most of the negative videos on Ret Paladins have been with regards to PvP, not PvE. Ret Pally has a lot of PvP problems right now, even with the rework of Healing Hands.
Is it hard to get into raidgroups as ret? I hear despite his good burst, his sustain damage is low compared to other melees wich makes him b tier on most lists
@@__-fi6xg PvE wide, retribution does do most of their damage in their burst windows, and that can be useful in fights that need certain targets dead. Over the full course of a fight, if they line up their cooldowns correctly, a ret does pretty high damage. It's just super dependent on knowing the fight.
Thats why he mentioned that one particular build with execution sentence. Theres a bunch of prep you have to do in order to ensure you get as much damage in as possible within the window and messing it up will completely ruin you. Theres been some recent GCD changes for a few of the burst cds but to my knowledge it can teter on the edge of clunkadin
@@Lunethzero it really is clunky atm. We could really use a few extra seconds of duration on one or two of the abilities. There's just so many buttons now lol
I'm mainly a pvp player but I always like to try to complete the game (complete high keys, complete HC and do some mythic progress) and I'm really liking this kind of videos because I'm in the process of choosing an alt that gives me fun in general. So now I can see what some classes and spec can offer in the PvE area ! Thanks Preach, GGs!
@@KwalleSon There is a good video by Tiqqle that goes into each covenant and how good it is for each spec and each type of content that you can check out, seems like Venthyr IMO
The problem is when melee has do to mechanics it almost always results in DPS downtime. Where as, like they said, range are generally always able to hit the boss. Running out and having your thumb in your butt for 10-15s is not fun. Mythic nzoth has so much downtime for melee it makes it unenjoyable.
I guess you can look at melee/ranged unfriendly or friendly in 2 ways. What is the desired composition for m+/ raid or how easy is it to do your thing. Raidwise, caster have to cancel their cast stop what their doing and move, theirs also more things to go wrong; combustion, RoP or frozen orb. While melee can do their thing and finish up. But raidwise encounters often force you into needing range but not the other way around
Warrior main, same as I've done since TBC, and my OG Hunter and my Druid as my primary alts. Here's to hoping warrior ever gets back to the glory days of Wrath or MoP.
Yeah lets go warrior mains!! I will be maining my warrior too.. only character that never gets questioned . Only thing I need to decide is what other classes to play. I kinda want to cover all aspects of the game.. so I think priest, hunter and dh... every armor type and every role/playstyle covered. But warrior first as always
MoP Fury Warrior in SoO patch, damn that was so good, managing cooldowns/procs and resources around CS window for huge storm bolts. Now, few expansions later, just spam keys asap ;(
Fellow warrior here. I swapped main in WoD to play shaman and ended up going straight back to warrior. Then I swapped to DH in Legion, went straight back to warrior. In BfA I tried rogue, and went straight back to warrior. In Shadowlands? I've learned my lesson, warrior from the start.
Warrior main here too. As much as i adore Arms, it looks like Fury gonna stay as the relevant spec one again.Absence of Lucid Dreams and huge haste numbers really hurts Arms. It has mechanical issues as well.
Do you guys think you can get renown on the launch before the reset? They fixed the m0 IDs, but I wonder what Shadowlands-specific bs they forget that gives you a boost on the first day if you grind through the night. Would getting renown early make you multi-box so you can get it on your alt aswell?
Blood DK here. After 14 years of maining a Holy Paladin, I decided to move to Blood DK in 8.3. Having a million unbuffed hp and getting that Twil. Devastation proc is just... so much fun. Will stay Blood DK for Shadowlands but I haven't decided yet on the covenant (between Venthyr and Necrolords). Any ideas ?
I was thinking on this myself but DK and rogue have just been a blast for me for alts. I love how arcane is shaping up but I'm sortve just wanting something not fire and frost mage which I've Mained mage since tbc or at least an alt. I've actually never really given rogues a fair chance before besides for a short period in legion, found out I liked it, now enjoying rogue tons lately. Still stuck on being a range main though and I'm glad to see MM so I believe I'm just going to go hunter this xpac for now. Was tempted with druid since I like feral and resto but balance has eclipse and guardian feels dull....
I'm torn I really don't want to not main my ret pal, because i love the class so much. Especially now after trying mage I'm really missing ret; but I can't get him in groups. My mage has instant q's so I guess its the new main :/
Thank you for having loud audio on your videos! Far too often podcast style videos have way too low volume so you can barely hear people talking in them. Fun to listen to :)
@@oneplayerpete well the problem is more people care so much about simming now compared to "before". it kind of sucks because this would NEVER happen in say IRL sports, imo. for some reason if you don't do things most optimally IRL you don't get treated as a 2nd rate citizen.
I've played the game since WotLK with only one extended break in BfA. I have never played a class/spec because it simmed well. I've always played a class/spec I enjoy and for me, that happens to be discipline priest. One thing I've learned over the many expansions is if there is anything that you like about your class/spec Blizzard can and probably will change it. Therefore, I never pick what is most powerful. If something is fun Blizzard will find it and nerf it even if only the top 1% players are really "overpowered." But I only raid normal and heroic so my goals and fun in the game are modest compared to those 1%ers. My advice is to create your own fun and stop with the number-crunching unless that is fun for you.
In reality thats what most people do. They play what they want to play. When you say "we", thats a tiny % of the playerbase. Most people simply dont care that much. Stop looking at sims, play what you want and the game gets a lot more enjoyable. For real.
Agreed, I love how sub plays on the beta, I don't mind Sin or outlaw but my favourite is sub by far, I just really hope they nail the tuning and have the balance be pretty close, is hate for another uldir situation
@@__-fi6xg he isn't talking about all specs, just sub. Sub has been really bad through bfa. The rogue class is fine, its sub which was way weaker in a pve situation. Alot of rogue mains are really hoping that sub is the best choice, because it's the most fun in most players eyes.
Sketch-1980 meh its an op class in every single content in the game for every tier. Wish they nerfed it to the ground so people can enjoy other classes for once.
I've always been curious. I'm not a mythic raider so I always wondered, if you pick a class that can do multiple roles, let's say Druid, is the expectation that you should be able to perform all the roles if called upon, and if you can't/won't then you should rule that class out? Like if you wanted to main a Druid, you should be prepared to be asked to tank, heal, melee, or ranged as needed by the content? Obviously, it's different at the mythic level than at heroic.
@@davichan9286 That wasn't true for the previous expansions except for the 1% of the top players and it wasn't about skill more about insane hours on theorycrafting and farming the specific items to make it work.
Being a feral main myself, I still had high hopes of seeing you main one as well. It’ll still be my main going forward as I’m no stranger to maining an underdog class and spec. Was still hyped to see that I was a top four pick for you Preach.
Never in all my years of watching Preach would i have thought he would ever main a hunter. Hes never said anything glowing about that class lol. Such a weird choice
He was quite clear about it. He loves to do mechanics. Need to soak/move something/take 'arrow' away from raid/etc? Hunter is great for that because he can dps while doing so.
DonMajkos he’s still completely trashed it for years, so regardless its weird. He once did an entire video trashing barbed shot in a TDP while using it in the completely wrong way, so for us true Hunter people seeing him pick it leaves a bad taste.
I think he will regret it a lot. Hunter is boring as hell to play. He even thinks it's boring. Doing some mechanics isn't going to bring enough joy to get around boring MM gameplay.
Healer here I have narrowed down to priest, shami, and Druid, part is waiting on numbers and part is waiting for 2 members of the heal team to make there choice first, And unless priest is just bad will be one of the 2 choices I make simply because it brings 2 specs for more flexibility.
I've been leaning toward shadow myself, especially after playing it through BFA. I have no idea if it will be good for M+ though. What I want to play is whatever the strongest M+ dps class is looking like in damage and utility. I only raid two nights a week so I have plenty of time to do M+, I find them more fun sometimes anyway.
Great to hear what your choices are and why. My next question is for the Main and Alt Main what covenants are you choosing. Really excited to hear what you will choose for the DK and why.
@@joshuagarner1654 Yea McConnell is PvE though and I haven't heard of him rerolling to another class as there is no reason for the little amount of PvP he plays
One thing I’m jealous about when it comes to streamers is they get to test the content ahead of time and figure out how mythic dungeons work and get a feel of which toon they will main. Love the videos... keep it up! Much respect.
@@ismount I mean. I get it, the only thing either really offer to a group is damage. And neither of them are best at it in any scenario, so you really can't pick it in their scenario.
@@dbosch123 I wish they had more utility, they need the love. Blizzard seems to hate them for that. Priest is ganna be my main alt because God damn it's so beautiful to play.
I'm really glad about hearing that you guys are going 3 characters, at the end of Legion I was maintaining 9 characters doing weekly 15-20s on all of them and raiding HC for tier sets like 3x a week and raiding mythic on main casually. Going into BfA I wanted to at least have like 3 characters from the start but it immediately felt horrible to do that and I quickly stopped that
I'm imagining a surival hunter redesign would be something like a healer that uses his survival skills to smash healing pots into his allies' faces and has a fully featured ultimate gnomish army knife to revive the fallen. And a St. Bernard with the barrel collar for a pet.
28:48 I agree so much. RIP old survival, the most fun spec I ever played in this game. I hope one day blizz comes to their senses and gives it back to us.
@@gorrevisor Yeah, rotation was never complex for BM since Legion really. But always liked the ability to move whenever and no really have a DPS impact. Never really started playing BM till Legion. Played MM or Survival going back to WOTLK. Really enjoyed the MM spec and the armor penetration stacking back when it was in the game in WOTLK.
MIKE, i'm glad you made the comment about old survival hunter. MoP survival was my favorite point of any spec in the game. I've played since BC and MoP survival specifically was PERFECTION. I just want it back so badly.
@@CosmicCleric during MoP i enjoyed almost every spec in the game. The class designs were actually fun regardless of anything else about the expansion!
Hell yea man MoP was amazing. I had fun playing almost every class and lots of different specs. Never felt like I couldn't play x class because x class sucked.
@@Sadows12 yupp every single spec was actually fun and none were completely useless. Alts were also extremely easy to keep geared up. Every time I look back I didn't appreciate MoP as much as I should have at the time lol
I have mained Frost Mage since I started playing WoW at the start of MoP. It has consistently performed adequately/very well in mythic raids. And my main alt was Frost/Blood Dk to begin with and then Unholy/Blood when unholy became broken AF for aoe situations. Im currently still happy with both :)
Preach, I'm hella thankful for the content on Shadowlands, I wanted to wait until near the end to decide if I should even buy it (I trust your opinions and like your reporting on changes, systems ect) but I've decided that playing since classic, to not buy Shadowlands. I have never been not excited for a WoW expac, ever. This is the first one. Plus the way Activision-Blizzard has handled some issues has driven me away from the company its self. I can't wait to watch your content in shadowlands and hope you have fun.
Preach and Finn - I know that raiding is your absolute focus but after what seems to be hundreds of dungeons this beta on pretty much every spec, I would absolutely love to see a segment on Mythic Plus and your take on what you predict will be some successful specs and comps.
not a bad idea, i remember playing a MMO called RIFT it was one of the best mmos i have played, there was a rogue tank, similar like survival hunter and their tankiness revolved around evasion stat, they did not parry or block or mitigate dmg by CDs but by evading every attack, was fun
Blizzard needs to bring back old Survival. Hearing Mike talk about how he missed the old gameplay reminded me of all the fun times I had griefing other hunters camping Arcturis in the Grizzly Hills back in Wrath.
Coven of Shivarra. That'd be a good example of a melee unfriendly fight. As for hunter vs shadow priest, are there no dot cleave fights in the raid? Surely you'd drop your hunter for a shadow priest for something like Queens Court in EP. Nothing like that in the new raid?
I just want to say thank you to Fin for making me feel a bit better about being in love with the ret paladin while the rest of youtube is just shitting on it 💛💛
Craven Strategem changes your FD substantially by lowering the CD by 15 sec and removing any bleed, snare or root effect - which is huge. I can definately see it being a solid choice over the dps ones. I feel like that legendary is kind of looked over right now.
Great Video, always love the new expac content. It was very interesting listening to the priest discussion because it felt like the priest was kinda boiled down to shadow. I know the shadow priest was a hot button topic throughout the alpha and beta on here so its no surprise lol, but it was funny when just a few moments ago preach you were going into how you play a class not a spec then not too long after go into just shadow as a priest consideration. I would have liked to see maybe a little more discussion on the considerations of all specs for each class. Also it'll be interesting seeing preach play a hunter this xpac as hunter doesn't fill any roles outside of DPS. At the start of either it was BFA or legion I remember preach saying one of his considerations was playing a class that can fill multiple roles so I wonder if those positions have changed and would be cool to find out why if they have. Loved the video and cant wait for more of the iconic finn and preach duo. Cheers m8
Here it is! And I'll be logging on beta and look at all the bois who just logged in to test your choices :D As far as mains go... Still dont know for myself. But there is the stealth-op PI for shadow, which you can give to a healer, or perhaps a destro lock duing heavy multi target cleave... Stuff like that.
They keep saying spriest legendaries are rubbish, its like they missed the fact that they just reworked 2 of them and 2 of them are legit amazing now. One is even comically overtuned even. (the mindbender AOE one). Nubkeks has a video covering the new ones.
it's not about wether they do insane dmg or not, they are just bland and boring , same with hunter sadly, the only fun one (lighting your tar trap on fire) was nerfed to the ground :(
Windwalker gives 10% move speed. This is always so underrated, it was the bomb in Antorus on the bridge boss, people really felt it. I am a Windwalker myself, re-rolling to Death Knight because of the AMZ being a thing, it brings so much to the table compared. You almost never really trade a Death Knight, they are good, really good.
So Mike, is Survival Hunter bad? I was thinking on maining one and saw the legendary that lets you use Tar Trap + Flare combo as an AoE DoT. Is it good? Have you tried it out?
This did not really make any sense to me "swapping spec for a single fight" Since your Soulbind tree is locked for a week... this wont even be relevant until progression is done when you can unlock your second follower/soulbind tree to even have another spec ready at a moments notice, unless the goal is "go swap your spec for this fight and do it with 0 conduits". Either way your playing one set of conduits for the week. Now if your talking about having 3 of a class (for example mage-maldraxxus) so that u can have an Arcane mage, Fire Mage, Frost Mage all ready with soulbind and conduit optomized thats a different argument and issue entirely. Either way swapping from Frost to Unholy for a single fight means your playing Unholy the rest of the raid OR your going to finish the raid as Frost with Unholy conduits, since you cant swap back during a single raid.
I think every spect can have a different soulbind. So if you are a DK, you can have soulbind 1 for frost, souldbind 1 for unholy and blood with soulbind 3. But don´t quote on that.
@@12345Granada logging into beta to double check, last i remember this wasnt possible, and u wont unlock the 2nd/3rd covenant tree till well after progression. later on of course this will be possible, but basically not for the first raid tier. Update: swapped from Frost to Unholy , i still have my frost conduits activated and the CD on resetting my conduits now says 4 days (tuesday reset). yeah so for the time being unless you make multiple DKs or w/e class your stuck with the wrong conduits if you want to swap back and forth between fights.
During progession you'll only do one fight, for multiple weeks or even a month if you're at the penultimate or ultimate boss of the raid. That is what they mean when they say respec for a fight.
@@12345Granada Also 15:12 Is the reason DKs not taking Maldraxxus grip for Night fae dmg increase are probably going to hit a wall, Utility of that Necro lord grip > 4% dmg increase of Night fae for the time being.
Melee unfriendly means that you have a harsh cap on melee. Fetid Devourer for example is an example of a catastrophically melee unfriendly fight because you were hard capped at 4 melee while keeping 100% of their efficacy.
My current problem is that I want to go with covenants based on looks not abilities but I don't want to gimp myself because for instance I want my hunter to join the night fae for example. I wish they'd made it so all the abilities came out to the same dps or at least very close as I really don't want to be excluded from content because I chose a sub par group.
@@KubiaSpeed What's mind boggling to me was always "Oh there is one phsyical damage ranged class in the game and we added 3 classes over the past 15 years and they are all melee, let's make survival melee aswell". What's the thought process on this? I hate it so fucking much and it made me reroll in Legion and BfA from Hunter to whatever.
13:50 Shadow Priest Mass Dispel :O Maybe a good reason? idk if we have Mass Dispel anymore though, haven't played this expansion, just watching for research for next expansion so this may be irrelevant.
Yo not gonna lie. Bringing Fin in was amazing preach. Really love this dude and LOVE this whole bouncing ideas of each other. Easily the most enjoyable
addition to this channel
Hard agree. Preach does really well with a buddy and while ghosty was a funny guy he was never all that knowledgeable of high level wow (not that he claimed to be, i just like that in a companion to preach)
I miss Ghosty alot.
@@cameronpack3965 i miss ghosty too, but Fin fills the role well enough to mitigate most of my yearning for a reunion.
Fin is amazing. Top notch. But Ghost is a massive massive hole. One that probably can’t be ever be completely filled. They were lifelong best buds and the webshow was something unique. It was great while it lasted. Maybe they make up in the future, who knows. Either way fin brings something ghost never could. He’s that mythic raid end game guy for mike to bounce off. That was always missing. And, for me, fin does it amazingly well.
Couldn't agree more. Now that Ghost is a.... ghost... 😭
Preach - Hunter main. DK alt
Finn. - Pally main. Rogue alt
you are a treasure saves my lot of time =)
Finns choices aged like milk
@@shen1801 In the end, Preach were the worst. Hunter bored him to death !
22:10 for lazy
The real MVP
Thanks!
Thanks dude!
thank f**king god for waveyzen... the whole video is fluff AND it's 30 minutes of spoilers
A true hero
"i dropped feral"
and i here i thought i couldn't get more sad than afterlives: ardenweald
if the covenants go to war... that furry bastard who sacrificed ursoc is getting my kill shot.
ahhh cmon, we all knew he wasn't really going for feral anyways. :D
@Not Drunk James I don't think you actually watched the video.
yeah because he's full of shit lmao. He keeps saying "YOU WONT BE KICKED FROM CONTENT FOR YOUR SPEC CHOICE ITS FINE" but then literally said that his guild LAUGHED at him for picking feral and said he couldn't raid.
@Not Drunk James not in this video, but in the ones leading up to choosing mains, he does state in the feral video his guild only let him do one pull in raid testing as Feral as they didnt need to take it seriously.
Love this picking a main series so far preach
"I'm gonna sim and see which is the best" God what a hard and meaningful choice that's gonna be for Fin. LUL
yeah and every other player will see what 95% of the players are using and chose that, I am not looking forward to answering socials in gchat for the 100th time about what covenant he/she should chose
I think for a majority of players it’s going to be a pretty clear choice but one that’s ultimately demoralizing. I’m more casual and I’m going necro Hunter. Don’t really care how it sims I just like the armor and mount too much. But the ability? It might be alright but it’s no fucking Bastion wall hack so that’ll always be a massive letdown that I just can’t use it. I’m sure a majority of people are the same. They’re either simming and the choice is easy but fucking sucks or they’re more about the themes and probably want a different ability.
@@Kongaii Well you don't have to answer,even the first time, unless you choose to.
Friendly reminder whoever reads this, , that you can play what sounds/looks/feels cool to you too.
That's what I do. I've never simmed anything. I'm also not a mythic raider.
bUt ThE mEtA SaYs i HaVe tO PlAy ThIs!!!!
I'm doing frost DK in maldraxxus and nobody can stop me
I’ve been a feral druid main for about 15 years now, through all the ups and downs. Not about to change now. Props to the hardcore guys that put all the time they do into being on top, though.
I'm making a fury Warrior this go around because I've always wanted to play one. Didn't matter how strong they were they just looked hella fun
"Doing Nazjatar twice...* vomit sound*" = real feels
To be completely fair-- choosing 2 mains for this expansion terrifies me. Between the conduits, the covenants, the legendaries and the plain old cross-expansion class changes. I'm absolutely baffled by the number of variables I have to consider on Day One.
And it's not that I am a Mythic raider who needs to mini-max all his shit. I am a very ordinary player, I just want to play what is the most effective tool for the job I am doing. I do not understand why is that such a crazy concept that only should apply to the top 1%. I'll never be driving as well as
Ayrton Senna. Does that mean I don't care about how I drive or what I drive at all?
Of course I do. Because I share the road with other users who depend on me to perform at a certain level. And this is the secret ingredient - other people. If I want to play Icewind Dale and make a group out of 6 Bards, I can do it. I'll be having some uphill battles ahead of me, for sure, but also some surprising advantages. Is it optimal? No. But it's my time, my crazy idea for an unbalanced group.
The moment I play with other people, god forbid, friends - the perception changes dramatically. Suddenly my goofy choices start to matter for OTHER people. And I don't want to play with 6 Bards anymore. I want to have a Warrior, Paladin, Thief, Mage, Cleric and/or a Druid. And I wish someone at Blizzard understood this dependency.
At this point, I'm ready to just play it safe - go with Druid for healing/tanking and Rogue for DPSing, with Priest lagging in the 3rd place, designated as "if I have any spare time."
Amazing post, here have this like.
People who call min maxers 1%ers are just arrogant casual players that have no real clue about the playerbase. If you're a mythic raider you care about that stuff, if you do high M+ keys or rated PvP you also care, hell some people even care without doing any of that stuff. I'd say easily 20% of the playerbase cares quite a bit about performing well and picking close to optimal for their spec.
It just makes sense, you wanna be the best you can be, why wouldn't you? It's like there's only 2 types of players: casuals and 1% min maxers which is just not true.
@La Nausée I'm sorry not sure what LFR groups you've seen but from my experience about 80% of LFR people just wanna get carried. They don't even watch a boss guide, they're just standing there hoping to dps through it instead of learn the mechanics beforehand.
To be fair the only time I did some LFR was end of expansion so maybe that's why but still. LFR was bottom of the barrel, I've seen better players in M0.
@@taserrr The funny thing is, there's quite a large chunk of playerbase that doesnt even do LFR. There are quite a lot of people for whom the endgame content for the last 2 expansions was doing worldquests. I have a friend that has been playing the game like that since Cata when he started. He picked druid and has been playing it ever since because he thinks "druids are neat". His endgame before wq's were made has been literally just flying around, doing story quests and pet battles. I'm allmost convinced that those types of players are the ones crying about the 1%. To them, the game is perfect, every single expansion for them was amazing, and any criticism of the game looks like angry nerds attacking their favorite game for no reason. The only thing I cant understand is why the fuck Blizz keep catering to those people. Players like that would be happy anyway.
@@MrFuckingKololo Yeah I agree, I have no issue with these people but if they don't play endgame why do they have opinions about changes regarding endgame?
Countdown to "Why i'm rerolling 30 days into the expansion". He's 1000% gonna reroll
100%. Definitely by 9.2.
@@georgeluxton6830 I mean rerolling 2 patches in is definitely pretty reasonable by that poin.
with a main alt the and a secondary alt 3 classes would have to be un able to fill the needs of the next raid tier for that to happen.
@@georgeluxton6830 of COURSE hes going to reroll, they do this everytime people build their mains up and 1-2 months later something gets a 50% buff and top dog gets nerfed into the grave until the end of the expansion
Preach finally did it. He embraced his inner weeb by going full hunter with an edgy DK alt.
"What do you consider melee unfriendly?"
*Tyrant Velhari Flashbacks*
*shivers* bad memories dude
Velhari was wunderfull
maybe the best Arms warri execute boss ever
@@childoffire8068 For all 5 seconds you could be in melee range I assume.
I've played a tank for 10 years and I'm swapping to spriest. Wish me luck, guys. lmao
Good luck. We're all counting on you.
Same
I've played spriest since lich King and I'm switching to tank lmao, have fun tho!
Good luck idk how people like you do it. I play a new class or spec every tier
Have fun waiting for a group invite 😂😂
Is it just me, or does anyone else just really enjoy the process that Preach, and now Fin, use to pick their mains? I just really enjoy listening to their reasoning. Also, you've picked the two classes I've played the most in my WoW history, so that's fun for me.
Yay, Fin is going Ret! Loving the addition of Fin to the channel, the chemistry is unquestionable.
I feel the same!
Me with literally 22 120's listening to this as I level another alt through questing trying to tell myself I will stick to 1 character this expansion.
why would you! arguably most alt-friendly expansion in a long time.
Im going to try to focus only 2 classes for once
I'm sticking to one class, i put that stamp on my soul after BfA. All those alts where i had to grind essences, or after three times doing the cape dailies and visions i leveled up a healer role. The moment it reached level 120 and Black Empire quest popped up i said to myself, fuck this, i'm not doing this again
I've adapted my playstyle as an alt-o-holic.
I just level every alt to max and then max out my professions for gold and then I just buy whatever the fuck I want.
Alt addicts are meant to be gold makers I'm convinced
Seriously. And seven of my 120s are warlocks.
9:50 It's because any time a melee player can't just sit on the boss and do their rotation, they call the fight "melee unfriendly." Since that's every fight, the raid is melee unfriendly. If they have to do any mechanics at all and have any down time whatsoever, it's melee unfriendly.
Pally and Hunter have been my main two classes in WoW. Im excited to hear you talk about them throughout Shadowlands!
“I miss old survival so much” *tear rolls slowly down cheek*... spoken like a true hunter, friend.
yep
Same
Yeah, shame they just deleted survival and Hunters only have 2 specs now.
Preach after maining a mage:
"I will never main a pure dps-class ever again"
Preach 2020:
"I will main hunter"
They did talk about how Shadowlands is alt-friendly, maybe that played a factor.
Or he's gonna regret it in a few months :p
Actually that was a revelation he had way back when he mained rogue and then ditched it again. In wod I believe.
@@TheSilverwing999 He (also?) said it in a Legion video regarding his Mage. It's in "Rerolling: What would I choose?" at 14:31. I watched it recently so the quote was familar
BM is boring, Survival isnt viable or good, so hes picking a class with one fun/viable spec
@@Buggabones He finds the raid utility that BM provides fun. ie being able do specific mechanices without loosing much dps
The old Survival hunter was my favourite hunter spec.. BM really should've been the melee spec if they really needed a melee spec (Which they didn't...)
Preach is turning into a valley girl
Like totallaay...
Sounds like some Northern twang coming through, perhaps he needs a cuppeh.
whats a main? says the altoholic that doesnt raid but still enjoys these videos
This is me. Sitting at 9 120’s now all above 440 item level. From mythic dungeons and world quests. Hate raiding, only play to pvp and sadly I have to do pve content to get any kind of edge
@@TheNightmareItachi only takes a day or two to reach 440 ilvl lol
@daniel so true, noxic is a failure thinking he has anything good
nvm
@@danama8932 Not unless you buy gear or do regular low mythic+ keys. Without those, aka casually, 440 is actually a fairly large number, which is why none of my characters have surpassed like 453 ilvl, because that's as far as casual rewards go.
Awesome video as always! Can't believe I called your picks for mains out (though I completely forgot SP was a choice :D)
"melee unfriendlay" Preach have you been spending time in Stoke or something?
Might just be with how they scale them but during testing it was realistic to hit enrage timer in a melee heavy raid for some bosses when it didnt if you were ranged heavy
I think you mean Birmingham. We have completely different accents.
The way you were talking about Hunters in that first vid, it was super obvious that was really the only option for you. But it's cool you gave us a dramitisation of that choice. Surprised that Fin chose ret though, throughout the last 15 years it's only ever been briefly meta.
Preach: "Why am I saying unfriendleh?"
Me, an American: "I thought that's just how you said it lol"
Funny thing; last night, my best friend and I were going over the list of classes and specs to choose a main for Shadowlands too and after a while of weeding out things we liked and disliked, we rounded up a few classes that fit our wants. So, I'll be moving into Shadowlands with a Blood DK since I like all 3 specs of it and a Hunter alt, again, because I like all 3 specs...even if survival sucks, it's just damn fun.
For Fin: Unless I've missed some videos (which is likely of course), most of the negative videos on Ret Paladins have been with regards to PvP, not PvE. Ret Pally has a lot of PvP problems right now, even with the rework of Healing Hands.
Is it hard to get into raidgroups as ret? I hear despite his good burst, his sustain damage is low compared to other melees wich makes him b tier on most lists
@@__-fi6xg I think that’ll come down to class tuning, whereas the issues in PvP are more fundamental to how the class is designed.
@@__-fi6xg PvE wide, retribution does do most of their damage in their burst windows, and that can be useful in fights that need certain targets dead. Over the full course of a fight, if they line up their cooldowns correctly, a ret does pretty high damage. It's just super dependent on knowing the fight.
Thats why he mentioned that one particular build with execution sentence. Theres a bunch of prep you have to do in order to ensure you get as much damage in as possible within the window and messing it up will completely ruin you. Theres been some recent GCD changes for a few of the burst cds but to my knowledge it can teter on the edge of clunkadin
@@Lunethzero it really is clunky atm. We could really use a few extra seconds of duration on one or two of the abilities. There's just so many buttons now lol
I'm mainly a pvp player but I always like to try to complete the game (complete high keys, complete HC and do some mythic progress) and I'm really liking this kind of videos because I'm in the process of choosing an alt that gives me fun in general. So now I can see what some classes and spec can offer in the PvE area ! Thanks Preach, GGs!
I decided to play shaman, both enh and ele so cant wait for sl :D shaman prolly my favorite class of them all both for pve and pvp
I'm an Elemental shaman main since Wotlk. 🍃🔥
same! hope enh is decent most the time. Its so fun to play
Resto/enh here.. im going into this with a positive mindset
My only concern is... Which covenant to choose when I really wanna play both specs(enh and ele) and every content raid, m+ and pvp :/
@@KwalleSon There is a good video by Tiqqle that goes into each covenant and how good it is for each spec and each type of content that you can check out, seems like Venthyr IMO
I love the back and forth between you and Fin. This series has been really enjoyable.
Melee: *Have to do mechanics*
Melee: "THATS MELEE UNFRIENDLY"
The problem is when melee has do to mechanics it almost always results in DPS downtime. Where as, like they said, range are generally always able to hit the boss. Running out and having your thumb in your butt for 10-15s is not fun. Mythic nzoth has so much downtime for melee it makes it unenjoyable.
I second this. Plenty of mechanics that are ranged unfriendly, but god forbid melee have to deal with something it’s the end of the world lmao
I guess you can look at melee/ranged unfriendly or friendly in 2 ways.
What is the desired composition for m+/ raid or how easy is it to do your thing.
Raidwise, caster have to cancel their cast stop what their doing and move, theirs also more things to go wrong; combustion, RoP or frozen orb. While melee can do their thing and finish up.
But raidwise encounters often force you into needing range but not the other way around
Warrior main, same as I've done since TBC, and my OG Hunter and my Druid as my primary alts. Here's to hoping warrior ever gets back to the glory days of Wrath or MoP.
Yep, im with you on warrior main, but rogue as alt just because rogue is so close to warrior in terms of fun for me
Yeah lets go warrior mains!! I will be maining my warrior too.. only character that never gets questioned .
Only thing I need to decide is what other classes to play. I kinda want to cover all aspects of the game.. so I think priest, hunter and dh... every armor type and every role/playstyle covered.
But warrior first as always
MoP Fury Warrior in SoO patch, damn that was so good, managing cooldowns/procs and resources around CS window for huge storm bolts. Now, few expansions later, just spam keys asap ;(
Fellow warrior here. I swapped main in WoD to play shaman and ended up going straight back to warrior. Then I swapped to DH in Legion, went straight back to warrior. In BfA I tried rogue, and went straight back to warrior. In Shadowlands? I've learned my lesson, warrior from the start.
Warrior main here too. As much as i adore Arms, it looks like Fury gonna stay as the relevant spec one again.Absence of Lucid Dreams and huge haste numbers really hurts Arms. It has mechanical issues as well.
the rogue UI at 25:30 is gorgeous, but it doesnt look like either fin's or preach's... whose is it? i want it BAD
imagine playing what you like and not what is expected of you
Too many Meta slave in the MMO community now a days for that to happen.
That isn't how they enjoy the game though, you're free to do as you wish
Do you guys think you can get renown on the launch before the reset? They fixed the m0 IDs, but I wonder what Shadowlands-specific bs they forget that gives you a boost on the first day if you grind through the night. Would getting renown early make you multi-box so you can get it on your alt aswell?
preach hunter main, dk main alt. fin pala main, rogue alt :) np
Blood DK here. After 14 years of maining a Holy Paladin, I decided to move to Blood DK in 8.3. Having a million unbuffed hp and getting that Twil. Devastation proc is just... so much fun. Will stay Blood DK for Shadowlands but I haven't decided yet on the covenant (between Venthyr and Necrolords). Any ideas ?
Venthyr teleport is legit. Dungeon pack skips. Perfect positioning every minute. Swarming Mist nets a ton of RP and dodge too. It’s not Night Fae.
Im picking mage as main and going to level a hunter with new leveling system
Mage for me and once they improve bear tanks the druid will follow. I'm excited for the mage!
@@JohnTesch Yeah im specially excited for arcane
Mage mains unite!
I was thinking on this myself but DK and rogue have just been a blast for me for alts. I love how arcane is shaping up but I'm sortve just wanting something not fire and frost mage which I've Mained mage since tbc or at least an alt.
I've actually never really given rogues a fair chance before besides for a short period in legion, found out I liked it, now enjoying rogue tons lately. Still stuck on being a range main though and I'm glad to see MM so I believe I'm just going to go hunter this xpac for now.
Was tempted with druid since I like feral and resto but balance has eclipse and guardian feels dull....
I'm torn I really don't want to not main my ret pal, because i love the class so much. Especially now after trying mage I'm really missing ret; but I can't get him in groups. My mage has instant q's so I guess its the new main :/
Thank you for having loud audio on your videos! Far too often podcast style videos have way too low volume so you can barely hear people talking in them. Fun to listen to :)
I miss the days when we played the class we liked the fantasy of the most instead of simming and parsing for the highest numbers.
No-one has a gun to your head, make the change you want to see.
@@oneplayerpete well the problem is more people care so much about simming now compared to "before". it kind of sucks because this would NEVER happen in say IRL sports, imo. for some reason if you don't do things most optimally IRL you don't get treated as a 2nd rate citizen.
I've played the game since WotLK with only one extended break in BfA. I have never played a class/spec because it simmed well. I've always played a class/spec I enjoy and for me, that happens to be discipline priest. One thing I've learned over the many expansions is if there is anything that you like about your class/spec Blizzard can and probably will change it. Therefore, I never pick what is most powerful. If something is fun Blizzard will find it and nerf it even if only the top 1% players are really "overpowered." But I only raid normal and heroic so my goals and fun in the game are modest compared to those 1%ers. My advice is to create your own fun and stop with the number-crunching unless that is fun for you.
In reality thats what most people do. They play what they want to play. When you say "we", thats a tiny % of the playerbase. Most people simply dont care that much. Stop looking at sims, play what you want and the game gets a lot more enjoyable. For real.
@@placeholdername3206 as a guy who wanted to raid heroic in bfa I didnt really have a choice :(
The Epic Launcher interrupting the dungeon encounter speaks to my soul
Been rogue since vanilla, staying rogue in shadowlands.
So excited to rock Sub again.
Agreed, I love how sub plays on the beta, I don't mind Sin or outlaw but my favourite is sub by far, I just really hope they nail the tuning and have the balance be pretty close, is hate for another uldir situation
There was never a addon where rogue wasnt viable, i mean you got 3 damage trees and one of them will allways dominate.
@@__-fi6xg he isn't talking about all specs, just sub. Sub has been really bad through bfa. The rogue class is fine, its sub which was way weaker in a pve situation. Alot of rogue mains are really hoping that sub is the best choice, because it's the most fun in most players eyes.
@@DragonNinjaGaming spot on.
Sketch-1980 meh its an op class in every single content in the game for every tier. Wish they nerfed it to the ground so people can enjoy other classes for once.
I've always been curious. I'm not a mythic raider so I always wondered, if you pick a class that can do multiple roles, let's say Druid, is the expectation that you should be able to perform all the roles if called upon, and if you can't/won't then you should rule that class out? Like if you wanted to main a Druid, you should be prepared to be asked to tank, heal, melee, or ranged as needed by the content? Obviously, it's different at the mythic level than at heroic.
Picking a main before nerfs are even finished brave.
All classes will do well, if you play well.
And their choices are ALWAYS good.
@@davichan9286 "all classes" except monk ww/mw and feral kekw
@@davichan9286 All classes will do well in a hall of fame environment it's a lie.
@@davichan9286 That wasn't true for the previous expansions except for the 1% of the top players and it wasn't about skill more about insane hours on theorycrafting and farming the specific items to make it work.
He will just do another video for more content. “Blizz did it, new main changed”
Being a feral main myself, I still had high hopes of seeing you main one as well. It’ll still be my main going forward as I’m no stranger to maining an underdog class and spec. Was still hyped to see that I was a top four pick for you Preach.
I becoming a feral main this exp, I hope they got a high buff to become a top tier
@@WZ76FY you must be new to wow ....cuz if you pick feral as a main .....you know nothing Jon Snow.
I miss old surv too. A a dot hunter was great
With the like 8 second explosive shot.
Hunter has not been as fun since MoP SV died. RIP.
Yeah. That was my favorite iteration of Hunter. BM and Surv were cool and MM was there too. Those were the days.
Dot based class that benefited heavily on fights where there was little to no movement. Topping charts on Heroic Ultraxion is a good memory
TLDR: HUNTER
You guys have the Frostpunk soundtrack going in the background? :D
Never in all my years of watching Preach would i have thought he would ever main a hunter. Hes never said anything glowing about that class lol.
Such a weird choice
its because hunter is a super safe pick. You can dps while moving and lots of utility.
@@Heroickittens I think its also because he never mained one up until now.
He was quite clear about it. He loves to do mechanics. Need to soak/move something/take 'arrow' away from raid/etc? Hunter is great for that because he can dps while doing so.
DonMajkos he’s still completely trashed it for years, so regardless its weird. He once did an entire video trashing barbed shot in a TDP while using it in the completely wrong way, so for us true Hunter people seeing him pick it leaves a bad taste.
I think he will regret it a lot. Hunter is boring as hell to play. He even thinks it's boring. Doing some mechanics isn't going to bring enough joy to get around boring MM gameplay.
Healer here I have narrowed down to priest, shami, and Druid, part is waiting on numbers and part is waiting for 2 members of the heal team to make there choice first, And unless priest is just bad will be one of the 2 choices I make simply because it brings 2 specs for more flexibility.
I've been leaning toward shadow myself, especially after playing it through BFA. I have no idea if it will be good for M+ though. What I want to play is whatever the strongest M+ dps class is looking like in damage and utility. I only raid two nights a week so I have plenty of time to do M+, I find them more fun sometimes anyway.
Tuning not done yet, but there are some classes that pretty much always end up strong in M+ ... Rogue, Mage, Demon Hunter
Great to hear what your choices are and why. My next question is for the Main and Alt Main what covenants are you choosing. Really excited to hear what you will choose for the DK and why.
Savix and McConnell are rolling right now when Fin said he's gonna main Ret XD
Savix is PVP though right
@@joshuagarner1654 Yea McConnell is PvE though and I haven't heard of him rerolling to another class as there is no reason for the little amount of PvP he plays
Well they're PvP focused
I thought mcconnel had a 2400 rating
Really, u know what savix gonna play?
One thing I’m jealous about when it comes to streamers is they get to test the content ahead of time and figure out how mythic dungeons work and get a feel of which toon they will main. Love the videos... keep it up! Much respect.
As someone who's played feral and spriest from the back half of legion on up, was really hoping to see Preach pick up one or the other.
I'm a feral main and I feel similar, but, deep down, we both knew that Priest wasn't going to pick some historically jank-ass spec like feral/spriest.
@@ismount I mean. I get it, the only thing either really offer to a group is damage. And neither of them are best at it in any scenario, so you really can't pick it in their scenario.
@@dbosch123 I wish they had more utility, they need the love. Blizzard seems to hate them for that. Priest is ganna be my main alt because God damn it's so beautiful to play.
I played feral from cata onward. It's so bad right now unfortunately
Shadow would be more interesting than hunter to watch in 9.0 videos, I'll say that.
I'm really glad about hearing that you guys are going 3 characters, at the end of Legion I was maintaining 9 characters doing weekly 15-20s on all of them and raiding HC for tier sets like 3x a week and raiding mythic on main casually. Going into BfA I wanted to at least have like 3 characters from the start but it immediately felt horrible to do that and I quickly stopped that
DK main (blood/unholy) and resto druid alt! Hope we all have fun in WoW's next chapter!
DK main (blood/unholy) and shaman alt (first time trying shaman but they seem to have gotten some love )
Same thing but fury warrior as my alt. I enjoy both of em a lot
DK main (blood/unholy) and warlock alt (just so I can keep all the edgieness to myself)
I like my choice of Warrior + Priest I rolled with since TBC, Main as Melee DPS but being able to jump in as tank, healer or even range DPS
I’m saddened that warrior didn’t make it into this discussion at all 😢
as a old fury warrior main w8 for prepatch im quite sweating here lol
I'm imagining a surival hunter redesign would be something like a healer that uses his survival skills to smash healing pots into his allies' faces and has a fully featured ultimate gnomish army knife to revive the fallen. And a St. Bernard with the barrel collar for a pet.
28:48 I agree so much. RIP old survival, the most fun spec I ever played in this game. I hope one day blizz comes to their senses and gives it back to us.
Survival was great they went and fucked it up as always
Why couldn't they have just added the melee spec as a 4th spec, did they really have to remove the best spec in the game for this garbage man feelsbad
that would be admitting they fucked up, and they'd never do that
it was my fav spec. when it was removed i quit my hunter.
@@HugeBigMan this would be ideal. I love current sv it's fun as heck, but I still love old sv more. Feels bad man
Digging the Frost punk main menu song playing in the back ground :)
Have played BM hunter for years just because of the mobility in raids/mythics
I liked all 3 specs but swapping now its RETARDED
Because playing it is easy mode? I mean, there must be an easy mode for every game.
@@gorrevisor Yeah, rotation was never complex for BM since Legion really. But always liked the ability to move whenever and no really have a DPS impact. Never really started playing BM till Legion. Played MM or Survival going back to WOTLK. Really enjoyed the MM spec and the armor penetration stacking back when it was in the game in WOTLK.
Nothing related to the classes or wow itself but did I just hear Frostpunk soundtrack in the background :) great video tho !
Can you do a vid on the weekly covenant special events like the Venthyr dinner party? What do the other 3 covenants get?
He already showed the necrolord and the kyrian events on other videos. The abomination for necrolords and the boss rush for kyrians
@@Vartence and the night fae?
@@clementeacevedo6665 Garden
I know on stream he has finished testing and they have so much content to edit and put up so the other covenant videos should be up at some point
@@Vartence Where?
Is that Frostpunk's game music in the background? I am 100% sure it is
MIKE, i'm glad you made the comment about old survival hunter. MoP survival was my favorite point of any spec in the game. I've played since BC and MoP survival specifically was PERFECTION. I just want it back so badly.
Feel the same way about MoP disc priest.
@@CosmicCleric during MoP i enjoyed almost every spec in the game. The class designs were actually fun regardless of anything else about the expansion!
@@Chadakkins Yep, MoP was the pinnacle of class design.
Hell yea man MoP was amazing. I had fun playing almost every class and lots of different specs. Never felt like I couldn't play x class because x class sucked.
@@Sadows12 yupp every single spec was actually fun and none were completely useless. Alts were also extremely easy to keep geared up. Every time I look back I didn't appreciate MoP as much as I should have at the time lol
Huge thumbs up for the frostpunk music in the background ! 😀
Imagine playing a class you don't like.
The games not about fun
@@SFTaYZa Why would you spend free time playing a game you don't have fun playing?
@@sumSOTY I don't know lol.
Yeah, seems insane to me but it's their free time so to each their own i guess.
I have mained Frost Mage since I started playing WoW at the start of MoP. It has consistently performed adequately/very well in mythic raids. And my main alt was Frost/Blood Dk to begin with and then Unholy/Blood when unholy became broken AF for aoe situations. Im currently still happy with both :)
Preach, I'm hella thankful for the content on Shadowlands, I wanted to wait until near the end to decide if I should even buy it (I trust your opinions and like your reporting on changes, systems ect) but I've decided that playing since classic, to not buy Shadowlands. I have never been not excited for a WoW expac, ever. This is the first one. Plus the way Activision-Blizzard has handled some issues has driven me away from the company its self. I can't wait to watch your content in shadowlands and hope you have fun.
Preach and Finn - I know that raiding is your absolute focus but after what seems to be hundreds of dungeons this beta on pretty much every spec, I would absolutely love to see a segment on Mythic Plus and your take on what you predict will be some successful specs and comps.
Thoughts on Survival: make it a tank spec. It's in the name!! (And would give us a second class that could both tank and ranged DPS)
not a bad idea, i remember playing a MMO called RIFT it was one of the best mmos i have played, there was a rogue tank, similar like survival hunter and their tankiness revolved around evasion stat, they did not parry or block or mitigate dmg by CDs but by evading every attack, was fun
Yeah to increase armore you could sacrifice your pet and use its skin/hide
I've had this discussion with people before, make it like rexxar. You and your pet alternate aggro/shared health pool or something
"Melee unfriendly" translates to "I can't stand still and tunnel the boss for 5 minutes until it dies."
Blizzard needs to bring back old Survival. Hearing Mike talk about how he missed the old gameplay reminded me of all the fun times I had griefing other hunters camping Arcturis in the Grizzly Hills back in Wrath.
Completely disagree, I frickin love new Survival.
Coven of Shivarra. That'd be a good example of a melee unfriendly fight.
As for hunter vs shadow priest, are there no dot cleave fights in the raid? Surely you'd drop your hunter for a shadow priest for something like Queens Court in EP. Nothing like that in the new raid?
I just want to say thank you to Fin for making me feel a bit better about being in love with the ret paladin while the rest of youtube is just shitting on it 💛💛
What aura/Addon are the buff bars? I use elvui and they are squares by default and I’d like them to be bars with descriptions like you have
I've been a UH Dk since when Unholy had bone armor as a talent. Yeah that old. SL is perfect theme wise to play a DK IMO
been a aff lock since tbc and i don't give a crap about anything else , if you enjoy your class why not give it a try atleast
@@Marincigla Warlock for life as well. Even through some of the frustration I still enjoy the class way beyond others.
The only bad part about Unholy is Night Fae is looking so strong for Unholy, yet it just doesn't make sense thematically for a dk.
Magus of the dead so strong it makes in to the shadowlands
I’ve played DK since Wrath, and I still haven’t found a class that clicks with me like that does. Warrior is close.
Craven Strategem changes your FD substantially by lowering the CD by 15 sec and removing any bleed, snare or root effect - which is huge. I can definately see it being a solid choice over the dps ones. I feel like that legendary is kind of looked over right now.
MoP survival was the best hunter spec they ever made. Quit my hunter the day they removed it for a useless melee.
Great Video, always love the new expac content. It was very interesting listening to the priest discussion because it felt like the priest was kinda boiled down to shadow. I know the shadow priest was a hot button topic throughout the alpha and beta on here so its no surprise lol, but it was funny when just a few moments ago preach you were going into how you play a class not a spec then not too long after go into just shadow as a priest consideration. I would have liked to see maybe a little more discussion on the considerations of all specs for each class. Also it'll be interesting seeing preach play a hunter this xpac as hunter doesn't fill any roles outside of DPS. At the start of either it was BFA or legion I remember preach saying one of his considerations was playing a class that can fill multiple roles so I wonder if those positions have changed and would be cool to find out why if they have. Loved the video and cant wait for more of the iconic finn and preach duo. Cheers m8
in b4 u change ur minds after tuning 1 week before SLands
Here it is! And I'll be logging on beta and look at all the bois who just logged in to test your choices :D
As far as mains go... Still dont know for myself. But there is the stealth-op PI for shadow, which you can give to a healer, or perhaps a destro lock duing heavy multi target cleave... Stuff like that.
They keep saying spriest legendaries are rubbish, its like they missed the fact that they just reworked 2 of them and 2 of them are legit amazing now. One is even comically overtuned even. (the mindbender AOE one).
Nubkeks has a video covering the new ones.
Please no, I don't want fearie furries to be the optimal one for shadow ;-;
Being overtuned or having high damage =/= fun necessarily
it's not about wether they do insane dmg or not, they are just bland and boring , same with hunter sadly, the only fun one (lighting your tar trap on fire) was nerfed to the ground :(
Windwalker gives 10% move speed. This is always so underrated, it was the bomb in Antorus on the bridge boss, people really felt it. I am a Windwalker myself, re-rolling to Death Knight because of the AMZ being a thing, it brings so much to the table compared. You almost never really trade a Death Knight, they are good, really good.
I would love them to turn survival back into a ranged spec!
I don't know if Finn reads the comments but mate you've been a great addition to Preachs team. Hope to see more from you!
got my main aswell, holy pally :)
So Mike, is Survival Hunter bad? I was thinking on maining one and saw the legendary that lets you use Tar Trap + Flare combo as an AoE DoT. Is it good? Have you tried it out?
This did not really make any sense to me
"swapping spec for a single fight"
Since your Soulbind tree is locked for a week... this wont even be relevant until progression is done when you can unlock your second follower/soulbind tree to even have another spec ready at a moments notice, unless the goal is "go swap your spec for this fight and do it with 0 conduits". Either way your playing one set of conduits for the week.
Now if your talking about having 3 of a class (for example mage-maldraxxus) so that u can have an Arcane mage, Fire Mage, Frost Mage all ready with soulbind and conduit optomized thats a different argument and issue entirely.
Either way swapping from Frost to Unholy for a single fight means your playing Unholy the rest of the raid OR your going to finish the raid as Frost with Unholy conduits, since you cant swap back during a single raid.
I think every spect can have a different soulbind. So if you are a DK, you can have soulbind 1 for frost, souldbind 1 for unholy and blood with soulbind 3. But don´t quote on that.
@@12345Granada logging into beta to double check, last i remember this wasnt possible, and u wont unlock the 2nd/3rd covenant tree till well after progression. later on of course this will be possible, but basically not for the first raid tier.
Update: swapped from Frost to Unholy , i still have my frost conduits activated and the CD on resetting my conduits now says 4 days (tuesday reset). yeah so for the time being unless you make multiple DKs or w/e class your stuck with the wrong conduits if you want to swap back and forth between fights.
@@jasonu3741 Well, then SL is even worse than i trough lol. thx for correcting me.
During progession you'll only do one fight, for multiple weeks or even a month if you're at the penultimate or ultimate boss of the raid. That is what they mean when they say respec for a fight.
@@12345Granada Also 15:12 Is the reason DKs not taking Maldraxxus grip for Night fae dmg increase are probably going to hit a wall, Utility of that Necro lord grip > 4% dmg increase of Night fae for the time being.
Melee unfriendly means that you have a harsh cap on melee. Fetid Devourer for example is an example of a catastrophically melee unfriendly fight because you were hard capped at 4 melee while keeping 100% of their efficacy.
I wish Ghosty would do a cameo at some point :(
what happened to Ghost?
@@MineVex m.twitch.tv/videos/480787852 Explains Preaches side.
My current problem is that I want to go with covenants based on looks not abilities but I don't want to gimp myself because for instance I want my hunter to join the night fae for example. I wish they'd made it so all the abilities came out to the same dps or at least very close as I really don't want to be excluded from content because I chose a sub par group.
Preach, we can hear your voice echoing from fins headset
that should be Fin's mistake. P2t
Yea this annoyed me a bit... Or annoyed might be the wrong word, but it was hard to unhear when you first picked it up.
Fin is such a good counter to Preach in these videos, awesome stuff :)
God Ion please bring back MoP survival I cry myself to sleep every night knowing I won't get to explosive shot shit to death when I wake up
@@KubiaSpeed What's mind boggling to me was always "Oh there is one phsyical damage ranged class in the game and we added 3 classes over the past 15 years and they are all melee, let's make survival melee aswell". What's the thought process on this? I hate it so fucking much and it made me reroll in Legion and BfA from Hunter to whatever.
I straight up quit in legion cause they fucked hunters, I will never be okay again
13:50 Shadow Priest Mass Dispel :O Maybe a good reason? idk if we have Mass Dispel anymore though, haven't played this expansion, just watching for research for next expansion so this may be irrelevant.