@@Coops321 they did. But not in league. As a Houston fan glad they got him, but obviously if he was on Shock in 2022, it's arguable Shock would have won multiple tournaments that year.
@@Coops321 mer1t and kilo were sharing playtime and mer1t got better and better in the league so kilo going to shock made sense but was just the worse pick in the end
Bro I think people forget how Jinmu played in 2021. Guy was holding his own very well and helped Chengdu to two Finals appearances in Midseason tournaments.
It’s bc people think of him as a meme Pharah player, but he’s always been a good player in the league even in Chengdu down years he still was great on Genji, Pharah, Sombra and than in 2021 when Chengdu improved he finally started to get the recognition he deserved. Also in ow2 he was still very good on a Genji he was destroying Zest all last year, he was one of Chengdu most consistent players despite hero poll situation.
@@baseebirdhe’s also like actually the pharah goat by far it’s kinda wild how ppl don’t even recognize that he was FORCING a DOGSHIT hero and still putting in great performances
@@baseebirdI think Jinmu was the biggest example of a class canon player. When he was poppin off, he was INSANE. But if he went silent, he was quiet as a mouse.
I'd love to see a retrospective video for each team, going over the team's history, roster changes, and an overall season by season recap. Kind of a timecapsule for each OWL team
Personally I think the Titans team should’ve just been the 2019 one. Even if they were mostly known for their Goats comp, they still made it to the grand finals even in role lock. Which is more than pretty much any other of the people you put has achieved. And even tho most of them flopped after leaving Titans I still think they are one of the best teams with the best synergy ever and for that reason I still think Slime would do better with twilight than masaa and Jjanu and Seominsoo (maybe even bumper) would do better too. And every time Sinatraa doesn’t get mentioned in an all-time video I get disappointed. I know he is not the most liked person in the Overwatch community but he still achieved everything there is to achieve, won the OWL, won the World Cup, won MVP in OWL and won MVP in World Cup.
do fissure and rascal count for london? cause i'd be adding them for sure. also i feel like peak vindaim was super good for dynasty, and stalker is obviously goated. also i'm contemplating having rascal in on infernal as well.
Shu, Fearless and Decay being three different teams is pretty insane imo. Really shows no matter the team they were on they were nuts. Other multiple team players as well of course.
Shu and decay deserved a ring they were some of the best talent in the league consistently. I'll never forget watching the dallas game where decay just deadlifts the team against houston where he just wouldn't let houston cross the bridge on second point of rialto, then gets dropped from dallas and picked up by Washington for playoffs where he was one map map win away from hardcarrying his team to a win against the shock in playoffs
I don't see why we can't have Gesture and Hadi at the same time for London, 2020 shock had a main tank rotation as well, we don't have to force limitations, just like you said
My one thing with owl I've always wondered is if mano was the center of attention on a team as good as nyxl at his peak. He was rivaling main tanks like Smurf or super on rein who did get the resources and attention. Edit: also for shock I'm really glad you went with the heavy dps line with 4 of them. I feel like that's always been the shock way with the flexibility they had on that role.
Amazing video, as always, but my only question is you put Kaan in text category for the Eternal but didn't mention him. Was he not supposed to be there?
As a Philly fan from day one I think they should have gotten similar treatment to the Shock. They typically had fairly large DPS lineups too bar the last two years where it was just MN3 and Zest, plus Carpe in 2022. They had some amazing players in their own rights as well. You could have included Rascal, similar reasoning as to why he was included on Shock, Ivy was always extremely consistent, or even Heesu for Sombra metas (I personally think his Sombra was better and more consistent than MN3's ever was). I also would personally take Poko over Fury. I know you said you were taking players at their best in OWL history but I just feel like Poko is too integral to Philly's identity to leave him out. Plus he has proven to still be an elite off-tank player even in the modern day, whereas the same cannot really be said for Fury. Also, Chipsa is right freaking there man. 100% winrate in OWL, I'm just saying. Gotta have him there
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 That's fair, and while I think either is a valid choice, I would like to point out that anybody at the top of their field is harder and more critical of themselves, more than anybody else. I respect that Poko is humble enough to admit when he believes somebody to be better than him, but I do not know that his admission of such makes it fact. That said I also don't know the numbers or stats or anything so it's entirely possible that Fury is objectively better, it's more just personal preference that I choose Poko.
One video idea I have is making a community post asking for Overwatch League all time hot takes and then you give your opinion on ones you find interesting.
I think it's hard to say honestly.. Because Meko was mainly a Dva 1 trick.. For the most part. Not completely. But mainly. Piggy played every off tank to a high degree. The only reason Piggy stocks dropped is because he had to play main tank a lot his last few years. Maybe I'd rate Meko's Dva better, but Piggy everything else imo.
tbh for SF shock ANS and Proper is all it needs for the DPS role. Maybe add Striker for dives. rascal and stiker r also good players dont get me wrong, but with ANS and Proper, ANS can not only play basically all the hitscans but also all of them at like top level. As for Proper, there's not much to say, think of a random, literally random, hero name, and then think about proper, u can instantly picture him dominating the lobby with that hero (maybe not junkrat lol). these two player r just way tooo competent in their roles, rly insane players.
Gangnamjin would just come off the bench to play main support over LeeJaeGon for some godforsaken reason and the community would collectively mald out of control
Is the “peak” he talks about relative peak or absolute peak for players? Striker is a definite lock if relative peak for No.1 tracer player but no need for him with decay if we’re talking absolute (on Boston)
How about this for an interesting video idea the worst starting lineup of all team for each team I think that would be super fun to watch and like a meme video
I would want to point out that in LA Valiant backline should have Mr SEX BIG DICK, Lastro. He has proven himself as a flexible support able to play both Main and Flex support at a high level I think him being in the backline for LA Valiant would round out the lack of Main Support in the Draft
For LA valiant i think sOon did à very good work, like he can hitscan and tracer very good and in a rush meta hé prooved he can play a very good symmetra
You’ve lost a lot of the restriction when you’re double/triple counting players. It would’ve been nice to keep a player to their peak team if they would’ve featured in multiple teams.
Ryujehong didnt do well in the modern era but is one of the best anas of all time and he popularized the hero. Part of his not keeping up tho was his age, dude was like 30 playing in a league full of 20 year olds, just lookup the player ages. Dude was ahead of his time and peaked before OWL
So on pure hitscsn I think Merit is better on most things (maybe not Widow and Hanzo, think Happy wins there), but the flexibility Happy provides I think is what ATP was looking at. Merit can't claim to beat Happy's Sombra, Tracer, or his other flex picks. That's what I would say.
I would change: Vindaim over Tobi regardless of what you think about Vindaim he had a very good s5 easily the best Seoul ms ever. Glads I would put Ans over Birdring his prime was better Birdring in his prime was very inconsistent. I’d also put Hotba over Coluge on Toronto Hotba was never a issue on any of his teams, if anything he improved over his career in his later years.
nah man, apart from the korean players most coaches agreed that vindaim was a mid tier ms, tobi was one of the best ms in ow1. Coluge was the best sigma in owl and very consistent even if he wasn't the greatest leader in the world, the season 5 sig stats speak for themselves, also birdring season 3 (argueably his prime) was probably one of the most consistent dps in the world
@@baseebird if Ajaxing a good player was all you needed to be good then so many players would be goated, vindaim was a bottom 50% brig who benefited from having a great team around him to cover for his weaknesses as well as a good Lucio player who was very good at converting damage to kills and so often filled up the elim bar, his flexibility is overstated with him not being particularly fantastic at anything off Lucio (decent zen, would not play him on kiri regardless of circumstances, bad Ana) I think he definitely served his purpose and was a good glue for 2022 Seoul but I don’t believe he was anything great like Tobi
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 Tobi was never that good on Seoul as he was pre owl, in 2020 he was easily the weakest player when they made the finals. Vindaim in 2022 you could argue he was the weakest player, but he was the most consistent apac ms and a top 5 ms overall in the league, even his Zen was very solid in msm obviously not great if they had Jjonak that could of went differently. His Brig was his best hero so I disagree there the way he shut down Winston’s in kc was insane.
IDK about the london pick, I agree gestures the better winston but hadi has shown a decent sig in the past and is probably the better modern orisa, he's also not complete ass on monkey as he managed to get 5th in a literal hard monkey meta, sure gesture was great but saying hadi isn't as proven as him when he's probably one of the best ow2 tanks is kinda weird (top 1 rein, top 5 jq, far above average orisa, average monkey, good ball, average sig) not just that but he was the main shotcaller for season 5/6 london which is insanely important for ow2. I can see gesture being the guy but dismissing hadi is kinda lame.
Okay it wasn’t just Pelican who carried on the 2021 reign Hawk iris and Massa were top 5 at there respective positions that year and Kai and Gator were well above average
Indeed, it was a very underrated squad that stuck to their guns and played their comfort which got them far pelican was their mvp but everyone was pulling their weight for sure.
Kai was a top 5 hs that year, Masaa revived his career, Iris top 3 Bap, Hawk was a top 5 ot, Gator was great on Rein, and Orisa pelican was great obviously, but it wasn’t just him carrying mediocre players for sure.
Having Reiner in and no pine is exactly where I lost it😡. Big boss pine was a one year wonder and way more dynamic than the two stage wonder of Reiner.
God I wish we got to see ans and proper play together in their primes they would have been absolutely unstoppable
Could have seen Merit + Proper realistically. That's pretty close. But Outlaws kind of swept Merit up before O2 was claimed by Shock
@@CrazeeAdam Didn't they play together on O2?
@@Coops321 they did. But not in league. As a Houston fan glad they got him, but obviously if he was on Shock in 2022, it's arguable Shock would have won multiple tournaments that year.
@@Coops321 mer1t and kilo were sharing playtime and mer1t got better and better in the league so kilo going to shock made sense but was just the worse pick in the end
That has nothing to do with it, Shock thought Kilo was better when they picked up the three@@CrazeeAdam
Bro I think people forget how Jinmu played in 2021. Guy was holding his own very well and helped Chengdu to two Finals appearances in Midseason tournaments.
It’s bc people think of him as a meme Pharah player, but he’s always been a good player in the league even in Chengdu down years he still was great on Genji, Pharah, Sombra and than in 2021 when Chengdu improved he finally started to get the recognition he deserved. Also in ow2 he was still very good on a Genji he was destroying Zest all last year, he was one of Chengdu most consistent players despite hero poll situation.
@@baseebirdhe’s also like actually the pharah goat by far it’s kinda wild how ppl don’t even recognize that he was FORCING a DOGSHIT hero and still putting in great performances
@@baseebirdI think Jinmu was the biggest example of a class canon player. When he was poppin off, he was INSANE. But if he went silent, he was quiet as a mouse.
I'd love to see a retrospective video for each team, going over the team's history, roster changes, and an overall season by season recap. Kind of a timecapsule for each OWL team
As someone who kinda fell off keeping up with OWL after season 2, this would be great
Personally I think the Titans team should’ve just been the 2019 one. Even if they were mostly known for their Goats comp, they still made it to the grand finals even in role lock. Which is more than pretty much any other of the people you put has achieved. And even tho most of them flopped after leaving Titans I still think they are one of the best teams with the best synergy ever and for that reason I still think Slime would do better with twilight than masaa and Jjanu and Seominsoo (maybe even bumper) would do better too.
And every time Sinatraa doesn’t get mentioned in an all-time video I get disappointed. I know he is not the most liked person in the Overwatch community but he still achieved everything there is to achieve, won the OWL, won the World Cup, won MVP in OWL and won MVP in World Cup.
You should do a part 2 where u make a bracket for these team
I would pay money to see what prime profit and fleta would look like as a duo. They would be the best most flexible duo in the league
do fissure and rascal count for london? cause i'd be adding them for sure. also i feel like peak vindaim was super good for dynasty, and stalker is obviously goated. also i'm contemplating having rascal in on infernal as well.
passing mer1t in Houston is kinda crazy
Shu, Fearless and Decay being three different teams is pretty insane imo. Really shows no matter the team they were on they were nuts. Other multiple team players as well of course.
twilight with 4: 👁👄👁
Shu and decay deserved a ring they were some of the best talent in the league consistently. I'll never forget watching the dallas game where decay just deadlifts the team against houston where he just wouldn't let houston cross the bridge on second point of rialto, then gets dropped from dallas and picked up by Washington for playoffs where he was one map map win away from hardcarrying his team to a win against the shock in playoffs
WAIT DUDE you should do a theoretical tournament bracket with these teams!!!
that would go so hard
Would be fun to do an all time meme starting 5 for each team
That Valiant team is getting its shit ROCKED by the other 19 teams.
ans over sinatraa is wild
ANOTHER ATP VIDEO LETS GO. I’ve been watching a lot of valorant lately but overwatch esports will always be first in my heart
Glad to see you still making OWL content!! Appreciate it lots
these videos are just goated they make me so happy thanks ATP
Awesome video as always! Now rank them. (I also wanna see comments have at this)
how are you gonna not put seeker on the valiant team? especially after you said a brawl meta would be a problem.
Lies Bumper was so good at making space that he took all of the enemy teams damage. Truly the GOAT of tank
both hadi and lhcloudy think that bumper was a top 10 rein all time tbf
I don't see why we can't have Gesture and Hadi at the same time for London, 2020 shock had a main tank rotation as well, we don't have to force limitations, just like you said
My one thing with owl I've always wondered is if mano was the center of attention on a team as good as nyxl at his peak. He was rivaling main tanks like Smurf or super on rein who did get the resources and attention.
Edit: also for shock I'm really glad you went with the heavy dps line with 4 of them. I feel like that's always been the shock way with the flexibility they had on that role.
mano was not rivaling super on rein
however he is one of the goat low resource main tanks alongside fate
Amazing video, as always, but my only question is you put Kaan in text category for the Eternal but didn't mention him. Was he not supposed to be there?
As a Philly fan from day one I think they should have gotten similar treatment to the Shock. They typically had fairly large DPS lineups too bar the last two years where it was just MN3 and Zest, plus Carpe in 2022. They had some amazing players in their own rights as well. You could have included Rascal, similar reasoning as to why he was included on Shock, Ivy was always extremely consistent, or even Heesu for Sombra metas (I personally think his Sombra was better and more consistent than MN3's ever was). I also would personally take Poko over Fury. I know you said you were taking players at their best in OWL history but I just feel like Poko is too integral to Philly's identity to leave him out. Plus he has proven to still be an elite off-tank player even in the modern day, whereas the same cannot really be said for Fury.
Also, Chipsa is right freaking there man. 100% winrate in OWL, I'm just saying. Gotta have him there
i mean poko has gone on record saying that he felt like he could not match up to fury, i think he is a better sig tho
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 That's fair, and while I think either is a valid choice, I would like to point out that anybody at the top of their field is harder and more critical of themselves, more than anybody else. I respect that Poko is humble enough to admit when he believes somebody to be better than him, but I do not know that his admission of such makes it fact. That said I also don't know the numbers or stats or anything so it's entirely possible that Fury is objectively better, it's more just personal preference that I choose Poko.
Eternal has Nosmite for Orisa/Winston duty in 2020, so I feel like they could've had a 3 tank rotation.
You said in their primes, right? Well prime ANS > prime Birdring for Glads.
I think while Gator might be only a bit above mid tier, Hawk is overshadowed greatly, while not the best, he is definitely A tier
One video idea I have is making a community post asking for Overwatch League all time hot takes and then you give your opinion on ones you find interesting.
no sinatras on the shocks?
libero was quietly becoming one of the best dps players sadly over shadowed by sbb insane trace
How close is it between Mek0 and Piggy for Outlaws? Looking at primes, Mek0 was pretty damn good for NYXL is season 1
I think it's hard to say honestly.. Because Meko was mainly a Dva 1 trick.. For the most part. Not completely. But mainly. Piggy played every off tank to a high degree. The only reason Piggy stocks dropped is because he had to play main tank a lot his last few years. Maybe I'd rate Meko's Dva better, but Piggy everything else imo.
Honestly with the florida team you should have put checkmate in dps and tank. Chadmate forever
Super > Space 21:31
My only question is why is pine not on the list of dps for nyxl
Not having surefour on glads is a crime
Not having Doha on Dallas is wild, I get it, but like Maasa, he too, is a staple on this team.
LET’S GO BABY LONG ATP VIDEO WOOOOOOO
You are the goat for including fissure he’s my favorite oat.
glads could’ve won the whole thing if fissure didn’t babyrage such a shame we never got to see
SMH bumper slander maybe he was able to end world hunger. But he's still my goat
tbh for SF shock ANS and Proper is all it needs for the DPS role. Maybe add Striker for dives. rascal and stiker r also good players dont get me wrong, but with ANS and Proper, ANS can not only play basically all the hitscans but also all of them at like top level. As for Proper, there's not much to say, think of a random, literally random, hero name, and then think about proper, u can instantly picture him dominating the lobby with that hero (maybe not junkrat lol). these two player r just way tooo competent in their roles, rly insane players.
Gangnamjin would just come off the bench to play main support over LeeJaeGon for some godforsaken reason and the community would collectively mald out of control
i was wondering if you were gonna do Fearless or Diem or one of the other Old Shanghai players from older days
Is the “peak” he talks about relative peak or absolute peak for players? Striker is a definite lock if relative peak for No.1 tracer player but no need for him with decay if we’re talking absolute (on Boston)
No soon for valiant? He was one of the best tracers in season 1
oh how i wish we got the see that LA Glads team in action
It would be interesting to do a power ranking with these teams!
You could do a power ranking with these teams it would be really fun
i'd personally put piggy on the charge but love the video and the concept!!
Wait, did you think dreamkazpar was a hitscan player?
I might be biased because I love soon but I feel like he gets into the eternal roster
14:20 piggy was great on Guangzhou at the beginning of the year?
Prime Lateyoung on Zarya is so underrated 🙌🏼
You did the titans so wrong JJANU not being there is so wrong
ong had the best zarya performance all time
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 also him choi and fury are best dvas of all time
@@GagReelGaming yeah maybe throw void hawk and Hanbin in there but I agree that he is definitely top 3 (I think Choi is mildly overrated)
have you watched the new comander x podcast with gator, it might be interesting for you
How about this for an interesting video idea the worst starting lineup of all team for each team I think that would be super fun to watch and like a meme video
you can make a tier list based of these rosters
how come no mer1t on outlaws? or yaki or nyxl
Why would u not field hadi and guesture
I would want to point out that in LA Valiant backline should have Mr SEX BIG DICK, Lastro. He has proven himself as a flexible support able to play both Main and Flex support at a high level I think him being in the backline for LA Valiant would round out the lack of Main Support in the Draft
Ooooooh atp video a way to procasniate on painful drawing facial features! Thanks! :)
"One random Austrailian with Koreans" oh you mean like how it was in 2021 with Punk and Boston? Lol. That actually happened
For LA valiant i think sOon did à very good work, like he can hitscan and tracer very good and in a rush meta hé prooved he can play a very good symmetra
Why isnt seeker on valiant
majed on atleast defiant, hes a word cup champ? best illari in the league?
You’ve lost a lot of the restriction when you’re double/triple counting players. It would’ve been nice to keep a player to their peak team if they would’ve featured in multiple teams.
How will this affect supers legacy?
Ryujehong didnt do well in the modern era but is one of the best anas of all time and he popularized the hero. Part of his not keeping up tho was his age, dude was like 30 playing in a league full of 20 year olds, just lookup the player ages. Dude was ahead of his time and peaked before OWL
BECKY WAS MENTIONED OH MY GOD
That’s crazy you picked Shaz over Soon
No soon in Valiant ? i think he deserve one of the spot in the best All-Time lineup for Valiant
The Joobi disrespect in this video!
If you wouldve allowed jjonak for dynasty you couldve prob signed the spirit of reiner to defiant
Confused why you wouldn’t include Mer1t for Outlaws. He’s clearly Happys equal or better for almost everything.
So on pure hitscsn I think Merit is better on most things (maybe not Widow and Hanzo, think Happy wins there), but the flexibility Happy provides I think is what ATP was looking at. Merit can't claim to beat Happy's Sombra, Tracer, or his other flex picks. That's what I would say.
I would change: Vindaim over Tobi regardless of what you think about Vindaim he had a very good s5 easily the best Seoul ms ever. Glads I would put Ans over Birdring his prime was better Birdring in his prime was very inconsistent. I’d also put Hotba over Coluge on Toronto Hotba was never a issue on any of his teams, if anything he improved over his career in his later years.
nah man, apart from the korean players most coaches agreed that vindaim was a mid tier ms, tobi was one of the best ms in ow1. Coluge was the best sigma in owl and very consistent even if he wasn't the greatest leader in the world, the season 5 sig stats speak for themselves, also birdring season 3 (argueably his prime) was probably one of the most consistent dps in the world
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 Vindiam was doing crazy shit on Seoul last year ajaxing Leejaegon, an s tier brig in the dive metas.
@@baseebird if Ajaxing a good player was all you needed to be good then so many players would be goated, vindaim was a bottom 50% brig who benefited from having a great team around him to cover for his weaknesses as well as a good Lucio player who was very good at converting damage to kills and so often filled up the elim bar, his flexibility is overstated with him not being particularly fantastic at anything off Lucio (decent zen, would not play him on kiri regardless of circumstances, bad Ana) I think he definitely served his purpose and was a good glue for 2022 Seoul but I don’t believe he was anything great like Tobi
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 Tobi was never that good on Seoul as he was pre owl, in 2020 he was easily the weakest player when they made the finals. Vindaim in 2022 you could argue he was the weakest player, but he was the most consistent apac ms and a top 5 ms overall in the league, even his Zen was very solid in msm obviously not great if they had Jjonak that could of went differently. His Brig was his best hero so I disagree there the way he shut down Winston’s in kc was insane.
I think it would’ve been cool to rank them
Yeah you cant have a shock all time twam without super, he may not be playing much but super just has to be there
Where is Seeker on Valiant?
Happy over Merit on outlaws is a choice
Seeker maybe instead of Kai for valiant? Just a thought
i mean in all time prime nah, kai was probably best soj in the world for the first half of 2022 and a top tier sniper, he's not washed now either
@@zachariahmarkusson7479 Kai was a s tier hs 2020- to first half 2022 he gets disrespected now bc he was mis used on glads
IDK about the london pick, I agree gestures the better winston but hadi has shown a decent sig in the past and is probably the better modern orisa, he's also not complete ass on monkey as he managed to get 5th in a literal hard monkey meta, sure gesture was great but saying hadi isn't as proven as him when he's probably one of the best ow2 tanks is kinda weird (top 1 rein, top 5 jq, far above average orisa, average monkey, good ball, average sig) not just that but he was the main shotcaller for season 5/6 london which is insanely important for ow2. I can see gesture being the guy but dismissing hadi is kinda lame.
Farway is included just incase Xerneas has some bad behavior
Okay it wasn’t just Pelican who carried on the 2021 reign Hawk iris and Massa were top 5 at there respective positions that year and Kai and Gator were well above average
Indeed, it was a very underrated squad that stuck to their guns and played their comfort which got them far pelican was their mvp but everyone was pulling their weight for sure.
Kai was a top 5 hs that year, Masaa revived his career, Iris top 3 Bap, Hawk was a top 5 ot, Gator was great on Rein, and Orisa pelican was great obviously, but it wasn’t just him carrying mediocre players for sure.
rip no Piggy on Charge
Sleepy on Washington where is my king😭
Do this video but with countries
how could you not just put Hadi on Spitfire as a 3rd tank 😂 I’m like not super mad but that’s disrespect😂💀
I would pick Hadi over Gesture tbh. Hadi is more consistent and more iconic
Wait why can't we name SeoMinSoo?
Having Reiner in and no pine is exactly where I lost it😡. Big boss pine was a one year wonder and way more dynamic than the two stage wonder of Reiner.
Pine was not consistently in the lineup and Reiner did it in a more impressive era
You couldve said Piggy for Guangzhou
I would take Fate over Gargoyle for the Mayhem.
no yaki on nyxl :(
no (peak season 1) ark on justice :(
Justice for majed. Literally said Florida might want another flex, then ignored my boy. Toronto I kinda get peak Twilight over him, but uv? Really?
RaiN over Custa?
Replace Elsa with Lateyoung for sure and add farway
Where is IVY on fily
Ding?
Not adding the goat XQC on Dallas Fuel smh 😞
Where is twisted minds
I think a hot take for Seoul Infernal would be Ivy, man was cracked at his peak.
Tbh i feel like hotba was arguably better than mek0 at their peaks
For outlaws i will take Lastro over violet and merit over happy.