Why Do We Love The Grizzly?
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- Опубліковано 26 жов 2023
- Today we need to talk about the Grizzly, a Clan Ghost Bear heavy mech that is a jack of all trades.
Grizzly MF: www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/57iy9d...
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I still love the Ghost Bears despite their flaws, even as the Rasalhague Dominion
The Grizzly looks kinda like the Ghost Bears' Cataphract & I like it in spite of its quirks
It does have a bit of the Cataphract look to it.
Clan second lines are always such an interesting concept. Watching a Clanner struggle to design a generalist mech is like watching an alchoholic attend a wine tasting event with a 3 drink maximum. Thanks for the video.
The Grizzly is one of my favorite secondline clan mechs. No frills, just simple unabashed firepower and a slab of armor, that can actuality move.The fact that it is a bear design is just icing on the top, it just too bad its a clan design.
But thats just my inner Sphreriod yelling, because earplugs are apparently lostech and he cant hear to well anymore on account of all the autocannon fire he puts out😊
"It just works."
Interesting designing a totem mech as a second line
Not the first time it happened, Fire Scorpion was designed specifically as cheap second line mech way before Grizzly
Same with the Kodiak. It is second line to the Executioner.
Yeah I'm a little wary of calling it a totem mech because it really only dips its toes in the water with the name and hulking mech appearance. But you can see where the Clans were going to go in the future with the totems.
A LOT of Totems are non-omni mechs.
"Daddy, I wanna pilot a Summoner when I grow up!" "Hahaha, sorry my child but you are freeborn. But don't worry, we have a Summoner at home..."
Turns out the Summoner at home is pretty decent.
@@MechanicalFrog Cost-efficiency wins your wars. But we don't dream to be ordinary. We don't imagine ourself in the dirt, next to the blown up torso of our former comrade. In our dreams we are the glorious trueborn warrior. We are fighting for the glory of a bloodname, As a ristar marching on the direct order of our kahn. Or even as a mercenary, working around the boundaries of our contract just to stamp on that little capellan orphanage just to maybe get away with it. And we don't do it in a grizzly. We use our Warhawk for that. Or maybe a Hellbringer. Or a captured Mad-Cat if it has to be. As long as we can go warcrimy on those little cpellans that are not supposed to make it out alive... uhm... what am I rambling about again?
Fun design I always liked, think because it reminded me of the Thunderbolt of the Inner Sphere. I can see why you aren't too impressed with the Grizzly 3, but I think it works in the setting especially if it is used against combined arms forces, so it still keeps its generalist role.
The Grizzly does have that Thunderbolt vibe. Versatile, strong, etc. It just works.
Never underestimate the staying power of a mech with a standard engine. It’s so tempting to go fast but not overheating until they get through all that Center Torso armor is really nice.
"I can outlive you..."
Speed is armor though, I find my CXL mechs outliving my standard mechs off movement bonuses and sheer dakka
It sort of seems odd that as a budget second liner they gave it a gauss when if it was in urban environments 'more commonly' you could stick a big fat old Clan UAC in there for blowing people up on the cheap at much less ranges of course. Then again, clanners are weird but they drop good loot
Glad we have at least one good quality.
The thing you need to remember is that the Clans tend to avoid fighting in their cities and infrastructure. They view it as rather incompetent to risk damaging the thing their fighting over and getting civilians caught in the cross-fire when you can fight a Trial in an out of the way place. So having a mix of weapons including some long-range heavy hitters makes sense for a Clan generalist garrison Mech. Also, you'll note that the later post-Clan Invasion versions of the Grizzly tend to start emphasizing closer-range combat with the experience they gain fighting the Inner Sphere.
Like all of these designs. Thanks for covering the mech as I found a new one for my ghost bear collection.
Between the HAG and the Gauss I’m torn as the pin point dmg, and head clipper is weighed down by the bomb like nature of Gauss rifles, and the HAG gives it some crit seeming to go thru holes punched with the pulse lasers.
I’ll have to throw in environmental conditions on the next map or two I make for the mega mek campaign game. Maybe a lava planet like you mentioned but also a low gravity ice ball for a press all the buttons style of game.
I need to do more lava planet fighting as well...
As others have mentioned, it's effectively a Clan take on the Cataphract. And seeing as how the Cataphract is one of this dirty Capellan's favourite mechs, I can't help but appreciate the Grizzly. Simplicity works.
It's worth noting that the Timberwolf B's loadout is quite similar to the original Grizzly. I'm not sure whether this was intentional or coincidence. While the variants are "sidegrades", don't sleep on that reinforced structure. I recently ran a Mastodon in a game where the Ghost Bears were at a disadvantage. That mech tanked so much damage from a Regent B and was only finally destroyed when the structure was eleminated simultaneously in both side torsos. The Mastadon almost lived long enough to balance the game back out. Lastly the Grizzly has a peculiar weakness: the right torso does not contain components so any critical hits to that location transfer to the CT.
I have to admit I haven't yet played with the reinforced structure. It intrigues me.
Oh the Grizzly, this thing is a absolute beast.
"It shoots stuff good..."
still have 1 of my fasa grizzlys . loved to bring this to bear at the ICC game fair. had the tendency to use it with a kodiack, 2 novacat, and a goshawk
Now that's a fun star.
I loved this thing ever sense MW 2 Ghost Bears Legacy. It was one of my favorite mechs in that game.
Excellent mech in that game. SO much fun.
The grizzly was probably the first mech I ever read about along with the pillager. For a guy who knew nothing about mechs or BT at the time. It blew my mind.
I kind of like the gauss shotgun. Not really the 20, but the 30 and 40 can be real fun to use. As for the mech itself, I remember using it in MW2 GBL, and it played better then a Kodiak( Much better range on the Griz). I also remember it being in some Ghost Bear novels, and it did pretty well.
It's a good one that will rarely let you down.
As someone who had a Ghost Bear rival for quite some time, the Grizly is a mech that I respect alot. Its durable, and simple nough that it slots into nearly any star, and for a clan mech its pretty effective for its point value. Solid all arounder.
It's a solid performer.
So. Back in the early 2000's i was running a mercenary campaign for my group. As they were under contract with comstar to help the FRR against the ghost bears one of my players managed to head shot one with a ppc and crit'd the cockpit. He had a blast playing the Grizzly in the rest of the campaign. As I recall it was a tough mech
What an excellent find.
I have no Grizzly stories, but a few grisly stories, including one-shot cockpit decapitations, a few cored mechs with so much internal damage that it couldn't possibly have lasted so many turns (but did), and a couple of hilarious shutdowns that resulted in falls behind level one elevation saving that mech - but not its wingman - from an otherwise grisly mauling.
How did you bear it?
@@MechanicalFrog [groan]
[Edit] Not being the wingman.
A really good, utilitarian mech with a variety of skills. I like it.
Absolutely.
It seems like ghost bear makes the most well rounded logical clan mechs
Calm and cool.
The combination of an unclan "Wait and See" attitude for the Ghosties, and then later after the IS merge the intense independence and need for self reliance from the Rasalhagians leaves the Ghost Bear Toumans in my opinion probably the best all around military fighting force in the later eras. Taking and upgrading what already works (i.e: Mad Dog III, Firemoths, Stormcrow/Ryoken II, Executioners) and then combining that with alot of purpose built, solid and dependable mechs as complements to eachother and the existing forces (i.e: Karhu, Ursus, Grizzly) *chefs kiss*
The Grizzly can kind of be thought of as a Merlin IIC, not in that the Grizzly was in anyway based on the Merlin, but they both fill the same design niche of solid, reliable generalist heavy to meet the needs of Mechwarriors tasked with defending against a variety of threats on a budget. The later Bruin is basically an 80 ton Grizzly, so even if the Ghost Bears paused building Grizzlies, they still saw the need for a Mech with similar capabilities. Another thing to note is the similarity between the Grizzly's loadout and that of several Clan Wolf OmniMechs. The Woodsman B, Timber Wolf B, and Gargoyle B all have similar loadouts that copy the Grizzly to a greater or lesser extent. Though it could be argued that the Grizzly and the above mentioned Clan Wolf Mechs were all inspired by the SLDF Excalibur.
Never considered that before... Going to have to ponder the Merlin comparison.
I think opportunity cost is what makes BT interesting; there is no ultimate weapon system. To gain something you have to give up something else so there will always be a weakness to exploit and its not as bland as a paper-scissors-rock kinda thing.
Also, glad to see you talking about my favorite clan, thanks!
It makes fools of us all... Go Ghost Bear.
My favorite Clan BattleMech of its era, it looks good, it´s highly versatile, it got jump jets, no XL weakness.
A solid build that can do whatever you need it to.
The new mini looks great as well, i love how it turned out.
Overall this mech gets way too little love IMO. Thanks for giving it some instead of the Ghost Bears and BT authors, MFrog. Nice MF variant!
"It just works."
The Grizzly is probably my favorite non-omni clan mech that also isn't a IIC. It's an amazing mech for being a (I think anyway) clan Thunderbolt. Because it's an amazing Swiss army mech and also a great addition to forces.
It does share a lot of the positives of the Thunderbolt. Resiliency ++
Armor, speed, and weapons all ... present, but it jumps.
However it has an ursine name so it is an auto include in all Clan Ghost Bear and Dominion force building.
My miniature for it is an old chunky brick and I like the idea of an update.
I'm reminded of the old Magic Card for the Grizzly Bear... "Don't try to outrun one of Dominia's Grizzlies; it'll catch you, knock you down, and eat you. Of course, you could run up a tree. In that case you'll get a nice view before it knocks the tree down and eats you."
I like this Design a lot. A friend of me made one out of Green stuff and bitz for me before he passed away. Since then it is my special treasure, guarded by my two kodiaks.
Wow. Hang onto that.
@@MechanicalFrog oh i will, trust me. Whoever touches the little bugger loses his hand and forearm.
The standard Grizzly would be a great trooper-if its quirks weren't Difficult to Maintain and Exposed Actuators
It's not badly designed, but the chassis does seem to have been poorly engineered. The Mastodon and Rime Otter having inherited that quirk (though with much more rugged construction) shows it's a somewhat fundamental problem, too.
It's sure heck for the mech techs, but, that's the job. People still buy Volkswagens even though they're designed like jigsaw puzzles.
Considering how sustainable its design and loadout are, the Grizzly deserves more credit for being a solid second-line 'Mech that can shore up a battle line and hold it at a reasonable value/cost, or hold and garrison urban sectors. And snuggle.
It just works... and who doesn't love a good Small Pulse Laser snuggle?
Every-bodies favorite Ghost Bear Legacy mech.
Fact Check: True
I actually have 2 variants of the Grizzly. The first, the Grizzly ISM, has a standard Clan Fusion engine and retains the speed and mobility of the standard Grizzly. Endo Steel, DHS, and standard armor as well. Its armament consists of an LB-10X in the left arm with 2 tons of ammo in the LT, an ATM-6/w 4 tons of ammo in the LT as well, with 3 Medium Pulse Lasers and 2 Micro Pulse Lasers in the right arm.
My second variant, the Grizzly ISM 2, uses the Grizzly 3 as a base. It uses an XL engine but doesn't increase the speed, and retaining the 4 standard Jump Jets. It keeps the Reinforced internals, uses Clan DHS and FF armor. I didn't make it a generalist brawler like your Grizzly MF; it retains the Plasma Rifle/w 2 tons of ammo, the LRM-10/w Artemis, swaps the IS CASE II for the Clan version, retains the Targeting Computer, and has 1 ER Large Laser, 2 ER Medium Lasers, and 2 ER Micro Lasers in the left arm while 2 ER Micro Lasers were added to the right arm, and an ER Micro Laser was added to each side torso location. So I guess my Grizzly ISM 2 is able to engage at range but is mainly focused on anti-armor/-infantry.
Interesting take on the Grizzly 3. I might have to try that out.
I never faced it, but I love generalist mechs because they can surprise anyone if played and used correctly... I think I am definitely going to take this one for a spin to see how well it performs.
Awesome. Good luck!
A really under-appreciated Clan 70-tonner. I'd take a Grizzly over a Summoner almost every time.
Either will ruin someone's day. :D
Always loved the Clan non-XL "trooper" mechs. When you need to garrison & defend a number of locations and the decision is 3x Grizzly or ~1x Hellbringer, it makes for a pretty easy decision IMO.
My problem with the Grizzly is that with standard engine and JJ's, IMO you don't have the luxury of going with the less "efficient" clan weapon systems. It's why I always struggle with the Summoner going with a big ballistic gun and being oversinked. I love me some GR's, but on a mech that doesn't have a high heat burden it kind of defeats the purpose of the GR IMO - especially one that is limited on weapons tonnage (compared to other clan mechs). I'd rather go with a ERPPC and a couple of heatsinks, and this frees a significant amount of tonnage for some additional short range "oomph" (3xMPL or 2x Streak6). My variant would look like FF Armor, 14DHS, ERPPC, LPL, 4x MPL, 1xStreak6. At long & medium ranges - it's ERPPC/LPL, and short range it's the pulse lasers and streaks.
On the MF variant - would love to hear your impressions of the HAG's. I always struggle to use them, because I'd rather go with clan LRM's & Artemis. The HAG's benefit from a little less heat, a little more range, and not having AMS/ECM impact effectiveness, but about double the tonnage. I'd just rather keep the standard GR for the hole punching and count on something else for crit seeking, but would love to know other's thoughts.
I would even take a Grizzly over a Hellbringer in a frontline battle. Even though it's a very common Falcon mech, the risk-reward on the Hellbringer's thin armor makes me a sad frog.
Keep the LPL, Change out the Gauss Rifle for a HAG 20, and the lrm 10 for an ATM 9. Drop jumpjets to fit the weapons.
Slightly less mobile but packing a punch!
Just saw your short with this mech so cool. Kinda reminds me of a beefy catarphact
Yeah it does have that vibe to it.
Original Grizzly is one of my favorite mechs. I'm a sucker for LPL's (clan only) and Gauss Rifles. Slow, durable, and hard hitting at all ranges. Also doesn't cost 4000 bv
It's a solid choice. Will rarely let you down.
Been a fan since MW2 Ghost Bear's Legacy. I just love the aesthetics of it. And the title of the video is an appropriate one becaude I can't really put my finger on why I like it so much. I usually prefer reverse-joint and angular non-humanoid designs like the Marauder and Ebon Jaguar. But there's something about the Grizzly that still does it for me. Maybe its the chunky gun arms and big shoulders.
Its a shame the thing gets very little exposure in any game since GBL. I'd really love for it to make a long-overdue return in MW5 Clans, though between the focus on the Smoke Jags and the reuse of MWO assets I'm not sure I have much faith it'll happen.
It has a unique look to it that is hard to pin down. Not exactly a totem mech but definitely hulking like a grizzly would be... I just like it.
I really love brawlers and shotgun style weapons. Dig that MF design
Awesome! Glad you like it.
The Grizzly is a very very good 'Mech, the firepower's good, survivability is great due to the standard engine, yeah she's a bit slow, but it makes up for it. And only 'bad' because of its fluff saying it had gammy legs.
Yeh I generally don't put any stock into the quirks that just randomly make a mech bad. see: Stone Rhino
This is the 1st I have seen of this and I LIKE IT! Beginning to be surprised on my increasing like of a number of Ghost Bear designs you have aired here... excellent presentation course love the MF version. 2 Thumbs up for me
Glad you enjoyed it!
I can say that I'm not the biggest fan of the Gauss shotgun. I'm not entirely sold on the LBX autocannon but at least they can fire solid shells. I only take hags when I have a decent armor destroyer to go with the crit seeker. Fortunately, you at least kept the LPL, which does a good enough job of being sufficiently punchy that I can't complain about it.
Yeah I tend to want to pair the HAG with something with concentrated power. Otherwise you're just sandblasting.
Ive got a 3d print on the way looking foreard to giving it a play in my Ourse Keshik
Nice!
I have always loved the Grizzly, just a simple soldier kind of Mech. It is nothing fancy but at the same time so heat efficient I don't need to wrack my brain maximizing firepower compared to overheat.
I will admit to cringing at your custom only because of one element: That XL.
Every time I hear a chassis is Clan designed, my first joke is "Okay what sized XL engine is it?" Because it always feels like that.
It's just hard to resist that Clan XL's siren song.
Hyper-assault Gauss rifles are closer to machine guns rather than shotguns, though I can understand the confusion.
Eh... feels a little bit like the debate about autocannons shooting a stream of bullets or a single shot...
In MWO, they've made the heavy assault gauss almost as solid as the single shot gauss. They've reduced the spread twice now since it's introduction and they have, very slightly, increased the time between each slug. The only time you're going to notice spread is on long range shots or against fast moving mechs.
Hrm... not sure I like that.
@@MechanicalFrog Quad HAG20 Kodiak, or dual HAG20 ECM Sunspider are pretty fun. First thing I did when I started playing again was take my Quad CGauss Kodiak and swapped for HAG20s. Used the extra 8 tons saved to put more into the engine.
For a clan second liner I consider it to be middling. Its not bad at all, but its not stellar ether. At least it doesn't feel like if you get assigned to one of these some one doesn't hate you.
It just works.
This rules. Have you considered keeping a live-update folder with all your MF designs that people can download from? The MF series is looking pretty crispy
I should do that.
@@MechanicalFrog I'll second that motion.
As far as smaller-than-a-kodiak bear-named Clanmechs I really like the the Ursus more.
Also a fun one.
Good stuff, as always, ‘Frog! 👍
Thanks a ton!
I have always been a fan of the Grizzly. It's not a flashy or overly powerful Battlemech, but it does everything well.
I like the MF variant. The only change that I would make would be to replace the 2 small pulses with a single medium pulse.
It just works...
RA 3 light Ppcs
LA 3 mdm er pulse lasers
In each torso 1 mml5 with 1 ton lrm ammo each and 4 tons srm ammo. Usually half standard and half utility/specialty ammo .
Case II to protect ammo in torsos.
TC for all energy weapons.
Almost 1/3 of wpn weight is in ammo.
Mml5s x3 give mech options at all ranges, but suffer from jamming. Especially during ammo type swaps.
Heat sinks are increased to give mech more chances to jump or sprint while firing alpha strikes.
The triple light pcc allows both barrage mode and single fire in succession to better control targeting and heat.
Chosen for redundancy, it's puzzling why all three are in same arm other than for pure intimidation factor. Same as medium er pulses.
A single mml10 could do the job well enough and supplement long and short range punch.
But again is a single point failure.
What this loadout does is offer the mech more flexibility in combat.
The reinforced frame pays for itself when facing AP or Tandem capable munitions and if case II blows out.
This mech would benefit greatly from ecm and active probes too.
So a star of grizzlies should have at least one mech to act the part as well as carrying a light tag to help focus missile fire on a target.
A headhunter version might benefit from paired light gausses , one each arm and a heavy lg laser with proper sensor and targeting gear.
The thought of a grizzly carryin a sniper cannon w/ 2tons shaped charges for headshots and a ton of HE for the riff raff might be possible too.
What would be support wesponry then?
A good candidate for an is light engine
Oh, that would be interesting.
the grizzly is one of the top mechs on my list that i would love to get my hands on as an IS merc. Yeah, the techs are going to hate me whenever i get hit, but as a platform it is just, so good. Able to keep up with my lancemates without blowing past them, and still able to bodyguard LRM boats while being a long range support mech. Will it replace my black knight? no, probably not but boy would it be great to get my hands on.
Never underestimate the value of a generalist battlemech. Not the OG Shadow Hawk though. That is just bad.
you can fix it, but you can also just get a mech that's good from the get go. @@MechanicalFrog
Grizzly would be welcomed with every arm by Innersphere . The Gauss Rifle placement give so much flexibility , you can swap it with AC20s, AC10s, Rotarys , ER PPC with extra Double Heatsinks etc. Sure it is not fast but with that much weapon pod space along with its armor it would be fine.
It's a solid one.
Great job! I like this ‘mech
Thank you! Cheers!
Hmm, the hag is an odd choice. But I feel like you can't get any better clan standards than the grizzly, tundrawolf. So your doing the falconer next right???
Next video is an Inner Sphere Assault mech.
I fear, unfortunately, that most folks looking at the Grizzly today won't be able to appreciate the context of when it appeared. Kinda like people in our day and age look at movies and pop culture through presentism and criticize things without understanding why or how they came to be the way they are, the Grizzly was a product of a different era. Not only was technology different in the game era that produced the Grizzly, but so were the rules. Quite a bit of what is accepted in CBT today was considered "level 3" both in rules and tech and was not widely accepted.
This is a fair point. The Pulse Lasers were incredible, and in many ways still are, even if overshadowed by newer stuff.
@@MechanicalFrogThe gauss rifle was also more of a powerhouse then too - it was like a game of rock, paper, scissors between AC20, PPC, and gauss rifle in the early 90's.
The mech james vega would use if it was in the Mass Effect universe.😂
Hmm... ok. :D
The MF I would say is the best build, but how often do you battle against infantry, excluding Elementals? I avoid anti infantry weapons as a light mech at top speed runnin' atop of infantry lines usually solves that problem. Napalms easy to make toosame fuel that runs a jet turbine (highly refined kerosene) or gasoline and ivory bar soap (it has the highest amount of glycerin in it hence why it floats). You pick the delivery system.
If we're talking in-universe, more often in the DA/IlClan era.
@@MechanicalFrog The military 'Rule' is always going to be 'You need boots on the ground to hold territory taken.' So I guess in practicality thats the role of Infantry. Now if I could only find me a few Hammers Slammers Tanks, combat cars or even just the hover jeeps and a few Power Guns....
The Grizzly, with the High Ground quirk active, is guaranteed to clip both legs an an arm when it's overheating at elevation. Don't try it.
Now I have to try it...
The only serious issue I really see with the Grizzly is that Gauss Rifle. It doesnt run hot enough that a 13+ ton Gauss Rifle would be a better option than an ER PPC, and it weights drastically more than a clan-grade Long Range Missile Launcher. A secondary issue is how its secondary weapons of 1 each Medium and Small Pulse Laser are insufficient at hunting lighter mechs and infantry.
You can make a custom Grizzly with a LRM-10, Large Pulse Laser, ER PPC, 2 Medium Pulse Lasers, 2 Small Pulse Lasers, and 14 double heat sinks. Using ferro-fribous armor the LRM-10 could be an LRM-20.
Being a generalist, it's always going to struggle at each individual thing. Not the greatest at hunting lights, but still capable of doing so. Not the best long-range mech, but still able to contribute.
I think I would make side grade. Using cheaper weapons.i would keep the mission profile. Who doesent love good jack of old trades mech.
Glory hounds...
I enjoy the Gauss shotgun
Good times had by all.
.... why does it look like a catafraft but un pug'd to me?
They share some characteristics.
Because it's a bear.
rawr
I keep saying this mecha frog! we dont its clan heresy!!!
The next mech is an Inner Sphere assault mech.
Not really a HAG fan. I'll take a streak LRM for better long range damage.
That could be fun.
Needs added to MWO!
I'm a little shocked it isn't already.
I liked the use of painted models in the video
Thanks. When I have them available, I use them.