I'm an atheist myself. Alex o Connor has helped me better understand Christianity than many other channels both on the internet and in real life. His presence in this online discussion is a very welcome one!
Alex is a brilliant orator with an exceptional ability to research and prepare. He often understands his opponent’s arguments better than they do, effortlessly dismantling their points with precision and insight. His skill and intellect make him absolutely fascinating to watch.
I've never listened to this Glen Scrivener before. He's unusually good at summing up the progress of an argument between two parties, as a third party.
It's because he's a proper philosopher, we're trained to give our opponents the best version of their argument, in order to be a good thinker you always have to be your own devils advocate
I have watched Alex since he was 16.He is really seeking the truth.I pray that he will have the divine intervention that he is looking for because he worked so hard for it
"When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, ‘You are not far from the kingdom of God.’" (Mk 12:34) I vividly imagine Jesus giving a similar response to Alex O'Connor. If truly the hiddenness of God is the decisive part that keeps him from becoming a Christian then I believe this is for a purpose and God wants him to be in just the place he is for the time being, but eventually will reveal Himself to him in a clear and unmistakable way. Let's thank God for who Alex is and what he does and let's pray that--"God willing"--the missing part will be given and received when the time is ripe. Just imagine Alex O'Connor as kind of a new C.S. Lewis (whom he seems to know and understand very well, by the way)--what a blessing could he be to the world!
@@MoNtYbOy101 I don't mean close in the sense of understanding christianity well. I wouldn't say Bart Ehrman is close for example. I mean close in the sense of not being closed-minded and being open to the supernatural. If God tommorow were to cause a clear supernatural event in his life I think he may convert on the spot. I don't think that's the case for, say, Dawkins.
You will know them by their fruits. Alex produces more, real fruit than a lot of Christian commentators out there. I’ve been saying for a long time now that he exemplifies Christianity better than most Christians.
I was actually thinking about this earlier that Alex is a really good God advocate. When people say they don't believer in God because they can't see him it is a silly reason, and Alex (as an agnostic) likes to point that out to other non christians/non religious
Alex has done so much good to bring both sides to conversation. As an atheist, one of my greatest fears is both parties will vilify the other party to the point that conversation can no longer happen.
I think it's less of Alex channeling an "inner christian", and more the idea that he likes ideas clarified , and is genuinely curious. As an atheist myself, I often cringe when I hear bad arguments against the existence of "God".
Glen, your thoughts on balancing spiritual books that feed your soul (Tozer, Spurgeon, Bunyan, Baxter, Edwards) versus apologetic books (Aristotle, Aquinas, Chesterton, Lewis)?
The chimney comment is good. Still operates within the framework of physicalism, but sometimes you have to use analogies in that framework to help one grasp the underlying concepts
We either feel God's presence and support in our lives, or we don't. It would be arrogance to tell someone who has their prayers answered in an amazing way - that it was all just co-incidence. At the end of the day, Heavenly Father reads hearts. It is up to Him who to help further His purposes - believer or not ❤
I'm genuinely curious, what would you qualify as a prayer answered in an amazing way. I think it's fair to say that if one's prayers are demonstrably answered then it would qualify as good evidence. However I often find a huge flaw in this, when it comes to the type of prayer, and the rate to which these prayers are answered. I do believe that what people call answered prayers are often times coincidences because 90% of times when a specific prayer is made, it fails. But people tend to ignore that and take the 10% of the time when it works to deem it a success overall. So, to you, what counts as an answered prayer?
I'm just gonna say, I really don't think anyone should be listening to Destiny. He's not seeking anything, and he's not striving toward a greater good. On top of that, I have serious doubts whether he's a good faith arguer. From my limited observation, he's most interested in being right, with everything else coming in 2nd.
I think I remember Alex once saying that he wants to be a Christian but just can’t quite get there. He didn’t exactly elaborate why but I imagine when he is around atheists he becomes more Christian because there atheist does not understand Christianity. But if he’s around a Christian that doesn’t understand science/ethics or even Christianity he becomes more like an atheist
Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children;
@livingthedream8539 no, but there does need to be an ultimate authority in order for there to be absolute standards. So what standards do you base your morality on so that you could say that slavery and genocide are objectively bad?
@ “but there does need to be a ultimate authority standards” No…! It don’t. Different cultures have different standards of morality. Is slavery and genocide morally bad to you?. My self preservation tells me I don’t want that to myself. I never need any god concept to act with reason to my standards of morality. If you say that morality is imposed to me by your god I have to ask you about my free will.
Dear Glen, I am looking forward to watching this, but I hope you have stumbled on Alex's conversation with Fr. Gregory Pine release yesterday? ua-cam.com/video/8k9A7d2Wnjk/v-deo.htmlsi=DMf2HfA53lHhsPWq I think it is evidentially clear where Alex is at in his wrestling/musings. But also, how the answersand dialogue from Fr. Pine seem to be so on point for a wrestler/muser like Alex.
If you get rid of the hiddenness of God, then why do we need faith? You could then delete the entire chapter of Hebrews 11 and Jesus words to Thomas. When God chooses to keep himself hidden it is His choice, and it is ultimately for our good.
@ I would define faith as trust in the Lord. I believe God rewards those who trust in Him. Those who pursue him. Those who declare a belief in the Lord will find that their belief gets tested to see if they are sincere. Ask any Christian if this is true for them. If God appeared to you before you started seeking him wouldn’t it tie your hand a bit? It would mean that there was less freedom in your free choice to follow God. Those who choose the way of Christ must believe that He is the son of God, and must believe that he died for you that you might have right standing before God. If you read Hebrews 11 it gives a list of heroes of faith past. Those who died before seeing the fulfilment of all the promise they had been given. They had all lived before Christ had made a way for them. They all understood that according to the Law they were not going to get to live with God based on any rightness that they themselves had, and yet they rested on their faith in the Goodness of God and trusted that he was both capable and wanted to fulfill all He had promised. Sorry if this is a bit too long an answer but.. :)
@ I would say that if someone chooses to put their trust in the Lord then their faith will be tested. And God wants to leave you totally free here and not tie your hands, if he appeared before you and told you that you had a choice to make then how free would you be. “For whoever would come near to God must believe that God exists and that He is the rewarder of those who earnestly and diligently seek Him.”
@@CraigBoyer086 No need to apologize. I do appreciate the long answer, but I still don't see why putting your trust in a God is predicated upon him being hidden from you. All the characters mentioned in Hebrews 11 (Abel, Enoch, Moses, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Sarah, David, Samuel, etc.) had encounters and interacted (some of them even had verbal communication) with the God of the Bible in the OT. God was clearly not *hidden* from them. If God revealed himself to me before I started seeking him, I would still have the free choice _not_ to follow and worship him under libertarian free will, so I don't see how pointing to free will addresses divine hiddenness. Paul became a follower of Christ after God appeared to him in a vision according to scripture. It was the transformative vision that led to his conversion to Christianity, not because Paul chose to seek God first.
Christian here, i can listen to the other atheists like dawins or Harris talk and make their points but Destiny is just so repulsive on everything, drives me crazy
Peterson is almost there. God must draw him to fully understand the relationship, the reconciliation he hasn't experienced. Alex is smart but not wise.
Richard dawkins has debated many religious people the idea that he doesnt know what he doesnt know should probably be appiled in a miror before someone else.
I'm intrigued as to why you go so hard after Peterson in this, you just come across annoyed that he hasn't converted yet... rather than just accepting he is a seeker on his own journey. All this whilst praising Alex, who is another seeker on his own journey. They're both in the same boat in my opinion, but you treat them very differently for some reason.
I come across as going hard after Peterson? I don't mean to. What I was trying to communicate is that Alex goes hard after a straight answer from Peterson on God and resurrection. I'm glad he goes hard and I think Peterson respects him for going hard here.
I'm a big Peterson fan. Peterson is frustrating on this topic. "Is God a conscious rational entity or the basis of a value heirarchy?" "YES!", I impotently shout at the screen
Every time you talk about Alex O’Connor I find myself deeply frustrated with your rush to forgo his input and strip his agency in favor of your self-congratulatory fantasy that he might be leaning towards belief in Christianity. You might sound polite, but this reeks.
Glen said twice that Alex makes some good points. Whether or not he is really leaning toward Christianity, time will tell. But he's thinking. He's no Dawkins.
I'm an atheist myself. Alex o Connor has helped me better understand Christianity than many other channels both on the internet and in real life. His presence in this online discussion is a very welcome one!
Alex is a brilliant orator with an exceptional ability to research and prepare. He often understands his opponent’s arguments better than they do, effortlessly dismantling their points with precision and insight. His skill and intellect make him absolutely fascinating to watch.
I've never listened to this Glen Scrivener before. He's unusually good at summing up the progress of an argument between two parties, as a third party.
Came from Gavin Ortlund! You were a great recommendation
Love Gavin
It's because he's a proper philosopher, we're trained to give our opponents the best version of their argument, in order to be a good thinker you always have to be your own devils advocate
I have watched Alex since he was 16.He is really seeking the truth.I pray that he will have the divine intervention that he is looking for because he worked so hard for it
"When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, ‘You are not far from the kingdom of God.’" (Mk 12:34) I vividly imagine Jesus giving a similar response to Alex O'Connor. If truly the hiddenness of God is the decisive part that keeps him from becoming a Christian then I believe this is for a purpose and God wants him to be in just the place he is for the time being, but eventually will reveal Himself to him in a clear and unmistakable way. Let's thank God for who Alex is and what he does and let's pray that--"God willing"--the missing part will be given and received when the time is ripe. Just imagine Alex O'Connor as kind of a new C.S. Lewis (whom he seems to know and understand very well, by the way)--what a blessing could he be to the world!
I think this should be a call to pray for Alex O'Connor. He is close.
He definitely isn't close, but God is a God of miracles 🙏
@Stephen-gn2br
He doesn't seem to be in as much of a state of mind to ignore miracles now though. I think that makes him close.
Usually natural disaster will awake your supernatural interest-in help and answers.
He’s not remotely close, he just understands Christianity better than a lot of “apologists”
@@MoNtYbOy101
I don't mean close in the sense of understanding christianity well.
I wouldn't say Bart Ehrman is close for example. I mean close in the sense of not being closed-minded and being open to the supernatural.
If God tommorow were to cause a clear supernatural event in his life I think he may convert on the spot. I don't think that's the case for, say, Dawkins.
You will know them by their fruits. Alex produces more, real fruit than a lot of Christian commentators out there. I’ve been saying for a long time now that he exemplifies Christianity better than most Christians.
Loved the content, my friend. Liked and subbed. God bless.
I was actually thinking about this earlier that Alex is a really good God advocate. When people say they don't believer in God because they can't see him it is a silly reason, and Alex (as an agnostic) likes to point that out to other non christians/non religious
Alex fan here. Awesome video, made it to the end.
Bold! I like it! :)
Alex has done so much good to bring both sides to conversation. As an atheist, one of my greatest fears is both parties will vilify the other party to the point that conversation can no longer happen.
I think it's less of Alex channeling an "inner christian", and more the idea that he likes ideas clarified , and is genuinely curious.
As an atheist myself, I often cringe when I hear bad arguments against the existence of "God".
God willing, his curiosity takes him where he would like to be!
You did not choose to be an atheist. You were hardwired by the same ideology which is trying to replace you.
You were hardwired to be an atheist by the same ideology which wants to supersede you.
You were hardwired to be an atheist by the same teaching that is trying to supplant you.
You were hardwired to be an atheist by the same ideology which is trying to supplant you.
Glen, your thoughts on balancing spiritual books that feed your soul (Tozer, Spurgeon, Bunyan, Baxter, Edwards) versus apologetic books (Aristotle, Aquinas, Chesterton, Lewis)?
The chimney comment is good. Still operates within the framework of physicalism, but sometimes you have to use analogies in that framework to help one grasp the underlying concepts
We either feel God's presence and support in our lives, or we don't. It would be arrogance to tell someone who has their prayers answered in an amazing way - that it was all just co-incidence. At the end of the day, Heavenly Father reads hearts. It is up to Him who to help further His purposes - believer or not ❤
😂
I'm genuinely curious, what would you qualify as a prayer answered in an amazing way.
I think it's fair to say that if one's prayers are demonstrably answered then it would qualify as good evidence.
However I often find a huge flaw in this, when it comes to the type of prayer, and the rate to which these prayers are answered.
I do believe that what people call answered prayers are often times coincidences because 90% of times when a specific prayer is made, it fails. But people tend to ignore that and take the 10% of the time when it works to deem it a success overall.
So, to you, what counts as an answered prayer?
@ArcherMVMaster 😂😂😂🤣 Bro you were not supposed to say this part 😂
@@g1lbert68lol aight I'll turn myself in to the police then 😄
I'm just gonna say, I really don't think anyone should be listening to Destiny. He's not seeking anything, and he's not striving toward a greater good. On top of that, I have serious doubts whether he's a good faith arguer. From my limited observation, he's most interested in being right, with everything else coming in 2nd.
This is great!
I think I remember Alex once saying that he wants to be a Christian but just can’t quite get there. He didn’t exactly elaborate why but I imagine when he is around atheists he becomes more Christian because there atheist does not understand Christianity. But if he’s around a Christian that doesn’t understand science/ethics or even Christianity he becomes more like an atheist
in destinys defence he wasnt mad, he just enjoys edgy gamer humor
I feel like anyone speaking to Destiny just needs to repeat this phrase over and over: “your belligerent dismissiveness is not an intellectual virtue”
Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children;
I agree, people who want to makes sense of reality are ridiculous. Let's compare fantasies instead.
Cosmic Saint, God willing
JBP: God isn't real like a table is real.
Bible: Jesus was God and got nailed to a cross.
Alex is only open to the idea of a God if that God agrees with his own standard of morality. 🙏 he comes to truth
That’s why Alex is my god. Alex don’t endorse slavery and genocide .
@livingthedream8539 by what standard do you call either of those things bad?
@@tonyabrown7796 Please, don’t tell me I need god to have morality as clearly my morality is not to god standards
@livingthedream8539 no, but there does need to be an ultimate authority in order for there to be absolute standards. So what standards do you base your morality on so that you could say that slavery and genocide are objectively bad?
@ “but there does need to be a ultimate authority standards” No…! It don’t. Different cultures have different standards of morality. Is slavery and genocide morally bad to you?. My self preservation tells me I don’t want that to myself. I never need any god concept to act with reason to my standards of morality. If you say that morality is imposed to me by your god I have to ask you about my free will.
Dear Glen, I am looking forward to watching this, but I hope you have stumbled on Alex's conversation with Fr. Gregory Pine release yesterday?
ua-cam.com/video/8k9A7d2Wnjk/v-deo.htmlsi=DMf2HfA53lHhsPWq
I think it is evidentially clear where Alex is at in his wrestling/musings.
But also, how the answersand dialogue from Fr. Pine seem to be so on point for a wrestler/muser like Alex.
Glen sounds like he’s constantly chewing peanut butter lol
Sounds fine to me
Sounds like someone is beginning to need a set of hearing aids.
@@authenticallysuperficial9874 nah, it sounds the crunchy nutty kind to me
If you get rid of the hiddenness of God, then why do we need faith?
You could then delete the entire chapter of Hebrews 11 and Jesus words to Thomas.
When God chooses to keep himself hidden it is His choice, and it is ultimately for our good.
Atheist here, but how are you defining faith in this context? If God chose to reveal himself to you, would your faith in him go away?
@ I would define faith as trust in the Lord. I believe God rewards those who trust in Him. Those who pursue him. Those who declare a belief in the Lord will find that their belief gets tested to see if they are sincere. Ask any Christian if this is true for them.
If God appeared to you before you started seeking him wouldn’t it tie your hand a bit? It would mean that there was less freedom in your free choice to follow God.
Those who choose the way of Christ must believe that He is the son of God, and must believe that he died for you that you might have right standing before God.
If you read Hebrews 11 it gives a list of heroes of faith past. Those who died before seeing the fulfilment of all the promise they had been given. They had all lived before Christ had made a way for them. They all understood that according to the Law they were not going to get to live with God based on any rightness that they themselves had, and yet they rested on their faith in the Goodness of God and trusted that he was both capable and wanted to fulfill all He had promised.
Sorry if this is a bit too long an answer but.. :)
@ I would say that if someone chooses to put their trust in the Lord then their faith will be tested. And God wants to leave you totally free here and not tie your hands, if he appeared before you and told you that you had a choice to make then how free would you be. “For whoever would come near to God must believe that God exists and that He is the rewarder of those who earnestly and diligently seek Him.”
@@CraigBoyer086 No need to apologize. I do appreciate the long answer, but I still don't see why putting your trust in a God is predicated upon him being hidden from you.
All the characters mentioned in Hebrews 11 (Abel, Enoch, Moses, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Sarah, David, Samuel, etc.) had encounters and interacted (some of them even had verbal communication) with the God of the Bible in the OT. God was clearly not *hidden* from them.
If God revealed himself to me before I started seeking him, I would still have the free choice _not_ to follow and worship him under libertarian free will, so I don't see how pointing to free will addresses divine hiddenness. Paul became a follower of Christ after God appeared to him in a vision according to scripture. It was the transformative vision that led to his conversion to Christianity, not because Paul chose to seek God first.
@@CraigBoyer086 Looks like you deleted your previous reply and posted a new one.
God is using them to plant seeds even though they themselves are not believers.
I don’t particularly need any seeds but my missing limb. All god’s miracles that one we still can’t count on .
Christian here, i can listen to the other atheists like dawins or Harris talk and make their points but Destiny is just so repulsive on everything, drives me crazy
Peterson is almost there. God must draw him to fully understand the relationship, the reconciliation he hasn't experienced. Alex is smart but not wise.
Christians DONT have to affirm the literal historicity of the Canaanite story….
Richard dawkins has debated many religious people the idea that he doesnt know what he doesnt know should probably be appiled in a miror before someone else.
I just think that Alex is just a good person, and by correlation it seems like a Christian by Christian point of view.
Lol Dawkins is ridiculous.
define "christian"
Its much better to be a materialist nihilist than a Christian. I hope Alex helps deconvert many.
The adolescents laugh and mock blithely… until the hell pops up. Then the maturity comes.
Quick. Somebody turn the lights back on. It's dark in here. And depressing.
Lol at your big value judgement there, Mr Nihilist! Third word in!
@@someonesomeone25 Eh, for some of us, it's not a choice 😋
@@jonah9861 I'm not an adolescent.
I'm intrigued as to why you go so hard after Peterson in this, you just come across annoyed that he hasn't converted yet... rather than just accepting he is a seeker on his own journey. All this whilst praising Alex, who is another seeker on his own journey. They're both in the same boat in my opinion, but you treat them very differently for some reason.
One is crudely honest on his seeking, the other is just a teenager masquerading intellectual vanity.
Which is which?
I come across as going hard after Peterson? I don't mean to. What I was trying to communicate is that Alex goes hard after a straight answer from Peterson on God and resurrection. I'm glad he goes hard and I think Peterson respects him for going hard here.
I didn’t see him going after Jordan.Jordan can be frustrating at times with his psychological explanations of things
I'm a big Peterson fan. Peterson is frustrating on this topic. "Is God a conscious rational entity or the basis of a value heirarchy?"
"YES!", I impotently shout at the screen
First!
You win… a video! 🎉🎉🎉
Atheism is for teenagers.
If that makes you feel better 😂
Dogs & yoga.. a perfect post-womanist.
@@dogsandyoga1743 Dogs and yoga.. a perfect feminist.
So are fairytales that make you feel warm and fuzzy at night..
Your demigod Dawkins is peeing his pants seeing the hell coming up to replace him.
Every time you talk about Alex O’Connor I find myself deeply frustrated with your rush to forgo his input and strip his agency in favor of your self-congratulatory fantasy that he might be leaning towards belief in Christianity. You might sound polite, but this reeks.
Glen said twice that Alex makes some good points. Whether or not he is really leaning toward Christianity, time will tell. But he's thinking. He's no Dawkins.
@@HiHoSilveyAlex is far way from leaning toward Christianity. He is honesty Devil's advocate.