I have the Ultra. The reason the size doesn't look that different is because the Ultra doesn't use the full build plate, it actually uses a shockingly small portion of it. I was rather upset by my realization of this. I would really like to see a video of you popping a small object on each corner of the build area and showing a comparison of how close to the edge they print. The Cones of Calibration (search UA-cam for it) is great to test this out, as they are tiny and square, so you can really set them perfectly on the edges.
I've been following your vids for awhile and enjoy them a lot. I personally think a lot of people would appreciate it and you could once and for all put the debate and questions by just printing 3 models (a bust, a medium size model and a mini like you did in this vid) on a 8k/4k printer and on the Photon D2, give it a grey primer and some dry brushing and put them side by side split screen. I am very much on the fence with printers like the Photon D2 because but who knows what next year brings that will push me over :)
I understand completely. This technology is always changing, though as I said in this video, nothing has really moved forward for nearly a year since the Phrozen Mini 8K. My personal guess is that DLP is the way the industry will eventually go and I suspect all the printer companies are researching this approach. 😁
@@vogman DLP looks insanely promising and I can't wait to see more. Once DLP reaches the 35 micron pixel size territory, we'll probably reach the extreme diminishing return territory for print quality. I hope companies would start focusing on other areas, such as ease of use and Quality of Life. That's a needed area that needs more improvements.
VOG is the #1 go to reference I use for 3d printing advice. Fair and balanced. And in this video I LOVE how he pointed out the anti Aliasing feature !. My friend wants to upgrade all his printers to 4k, he has extremely good 2k LCD models and I enjoy the slight fuzzieness of the pixels on it. The bleed on the edges of them hide that jagged pixelated effect VOG was focusing on here.
As an owner of the Photon Ultra and Mars 3, I hope people hear the key difference from DLP, detail and DEPTH. The depth is hard to explain and show on camera, but it's really evident when you see or hold it. The clarity in something like scales or the fingers on a fist is how deep the recess is right next to a raised surface. That valley-to-peak is just sharper on DLP. They look more... convincing (I can't say 'realistic' for fantasy creatures or sci-fi...).
I have been running the Photon Ultra for about 6 months now following the fine review from VOG. The quality and accuracy of the DLP printer is amazing. I am printing for dental purposed mostly so need an accurate finish and run with zero AA mostly. Superb results all around. Much better for me than the built in AA of an LCD printer, because you can't turn that off!
We need more reviewers and creators like you. I've been watching you for years, going from DIY stuff to tech reviews. You're one of the few who I trust to give real, honest, reviews even when it could risk further videos (like the Z-Wobble.) If you say something is worth it, I seriously consider getting it. I am shocked at the performance of this machine, especially the low power consumption for something so crisp and still being at a price level that a home hobbyist would consider. The only question I do have is if a print to be molded in silicone would come out smooth and shiny or if the voxels will become more defined in the de-molded result. But that is not something that a normal review video will do, so looks like I need to get my hands on this for myself. The way the skull ring came out I don't think there will be any issue or need to cover in a thin resin before molding.
Wow, thanks very much. That's really appreciated. You'll always get voxel lines, even if you use AA. It really depends on the print, the way it's angled and supported, the layer height, resin temperature and all sorts of things. Yes you can tinker and tinker and tinker until it's eventually as good as you'll get it, but most folks (especially me) don't have the patience. So yes, if placed in a mold, those voxel lines would carry over as silicone is excellent at picking up the detail. BUT... once a print has been washed and UV cured, you can sand it. This is very easy. Just use VERY fine grade paper, like 600 or 800, then finish off with 2000. Be gentle and wear a dust mask. This can easily remove voxel lines and leave the print silky smooth. After that silicone holds no fears.
FYI: VOG means to say voxelation rather than pixelation. Pixels are a 2-dimensional element. In the 3-dimensional world of 3D printers, these elements are called voxels.
ABSOLUTELY EPIC REVIEW. Thank you! I’m so happy you set the layer height down to .02mm to “match” the apparent pitch of 21μm. And then showing side by side with and without anti-aliasing really gave us a great feeling of what this printer can do. But you went above and beyond and actually painted and drybrushed a model. I’m sold. This is amazing. I can’t wait until they make a larger build area. Have you tried printing skin textures or other subtle textures?
Many thanks. My Cyborg Skull Ring has surprisingly lumpy texture. I didn't want smooth bone, but the pitied texture of a dug up skull. I was very pleased that this came out well 😁
Man, without a doubt my favorite 3D printer channel, I literally can't ask you to do anything more or any better, since you clear up all the doubts I might have. Amazing work like always, keep it up!! :D
I just realised I have been watching your printer reviews and PLA loss casting videos since the first Elegoo Mars back in Aug 2019. It’s crazy how good these printers have gotten and thank you for your detailed analysis along the way.
I still cringe at that Mars review. I did such a poor job. But yes, it's incredible how quickly the technology has moved on. And more will come, I'm sure of that 😁
Something I'd be really interested in is if you could look into how different printer specifications (such as technology and pixel size) influence feature dimension limits for mechanical 3D printing. I'm interested in making very small parts with very thin walls, and think that a video that examined what kinds of tolerances and wall thicknesses different printers could accomplish would be very generally interesting.
Thanks VOG, I had a backorder for an Ultra, then the D2 launched, and your videos gave me the kick I needed to pay the difference for a D2 :) It's getting shipped out on Monday! Cannot wait :D
The improvement over the Ultra is amazing. If you saw my previous D2 video I showed an extreme close-up of an Ultra print and a D2 print. Massive difference! Even finer details 😁
Ordered it before the launch livestream even started by checking the store page lol, as an Aussie pleasantly surprised by the free shipping! I've had the money ready to go for a printer like this all year. Now to order some tough & flexible resin for that golden mix for minis.
Since you can achieve basically pixel-level sharpness, have you tried printing a porous block, to see if it works? it may be possible to print porous sponge-like objects which can suck liquids and retain them via surface tension. Of course, good luck with washing the resin away before curing, but it should be doable with ultrasonic cleaners after some cycles
so first, I really enjoy your videos. the review you posted on the elegoo saturn 2 8K is the reason I purchased that printer (after getting rid of the anycubic printer). my thoughts on anycubic....the printers from that company aren't the issue. I recently returned an M3 Premium. why? well, not because the printer had issues. it's entirely due to the crap aftermarket service from anycubic. there were pieces missing in the box when it showed up. anycubic's solution? buy them. damaged NFEP on delivery (from the factory). anycubic's resolution? buy new ones. they didn't even offer to replace the damaged NFEP or send me the missing pieces. just spend more money. I owned that printer for 3.5 weeks and never got to use it. just make attempt after attempt to get anycubic to honour the issues that were responsible for. they actually didn't offer anything until I said fine, I'm returning it. then they suddenyl wanted to try to fix things. too late. so, anycubic's printers aren't too bad. it's the dumpster fire aftermarket service.
It's great that we now have the choice of DLP printing in the "hobbyist" market. Now if Anycubic can make one with a bigger build volume, say around Saturn 2 size, I'll have to throw them a pile of money. I already have 3 printers from them and I've been very satisfied with the results. Excellent job on your reviews, please keep us all informed.
Fantastic review! Thank you. I love that this uses projection technology, rather than just illumination through an LCD screen. To me, this means that it should be possible to make a printer with 4x the surface area and volume, but without a 4x increase in cost, if we're OK with accepting a small decrease in speed and perhaps resolution.
As always, I love your honest disclaimer. Still haven't gotten around to propperly learning how to print resin with my own printer (due to a lack of time) but the plan afterwards seems to be changing atm because this looks really interesting
I say "Honest" because I mean it. I just tell the truth. No one pays me to say anything - I'm not sponsored - and if companies won't allow me to say exactly what I want, I don't review their goods 😁
An excellent review, THANKS(!) I especially appreciated the close-up shots and you showing the results with AA enabled. - Yours is the first vid I’ve seen on the D2 that covers that. I’d been concerned about the pixilation, as I’ve been thinking about using resin printing for making small gears, and the rough pixilated surface seems like it would increase friction and the parts would wear quickly. AA seems to solve that problem though. I really like the long life of the DLP; I want machines that I can just use as needed, without worrying about replacing critical components. Now I just need to decide if the small size will work ok for me…
Hi VOG, I had already guessed that you were impressed by this D2 but for me today is an epic day thanks to Anycubic: not only for the D2, but because I was able to see the NEX (1600 mm / h 🤩) and discover the microled technology for details of 0.02 mm 🤯. I would say that we do not risk getting bored. Best
Do the DLP prints just look better in person because the voxels are sharper and this allows you to see more detail? The real question is whether they actually take paint better - the rougher surface may affect paint washes etc.
So I just left a comment but I'm not sure where it went, damn mobile phone. So if f I've doubled up, forgive me. DLP technology is just amazing! Void star labs just did a video on it like 2 days ago maybe less and it's just amazing tech! This is how resin printers will head I think. Great video as always mate. I really love these honest reviews.
I believe DLP was here first. The problem has been costs. That's why industry has DLPs. LCD technology has made resin printing cheaper, but not quite as good. But now, thanks to Anycubic, DLPs are becoming affordable 😁
The Photon 2D has a build volume of130.5mm x 73.4mm x 165mm. My Prusa SL1S has a build volume of 127mm x 80mm x 150mm. I purchased your Resin Printer Heater body STL files from Etsy and found that the pre-supported parts would not fit on my build plate and used the unsupported files rotated to 30° to fit to the build plate .. my first case of build plate envy.
I'm not going to buy a resin printer, because my wife thinks my FDM printer "smells," even when I'm doing a 1 hour print with PLA. I still look at the detail on prints like this, and drool. Clearly this gives great results. If I were in the market to buy, my main question would be "can I get a resin printer with a larger print volume, that looks just as sharp due to high resolution, that's less expensive?" I think we can agree you're not going to see anything sharper than the D2. Question is, how much can raw LCD resolution substitute for the sharp edges of reflected light in a DLP printer? Are the higher-volume printers going to be "soft" by comparison because the PPI on the screen isn't enough to compensate? An Anycubic Photon Mono X 6K is $450 right now, and has a much larger (197mm x 122mm WxD) printing area than the D2 (131 x 73mm).
While I heartily give Anycubic the thumb's up for getting a consumer grade DLP to market, a mid-size variant would be a must buy for me. I do recall that DLP's need a specific resin, which is kind of a bummer for those of us who bulk purchase, but that's a different problem for a later date.
Print looks great painted and drybrushing would definitely pick up any imperfections but can't see any there! Your not wearing a jewellers eyeglass constantly you'll never see them lines! I have a printed matilda mk1 tank from one of these and it's absolutely out of this world in a 1.35 scale tank!
Be interesting if in the future they could utilise pixel shifting or even optical zooms to enhance and focus details to different parts of the image plane, as projectors obviously allow for optics in ways LCDs don't.
I'm just so flabbergasted @ the surface finish. & print quality!! as always, a very helpful tutorial !! good luck Vog! I'm really hoping these companies, R turning their smarty screws! for some, the future couldn't be any better!! 4 others, it's not even scratched the surface!! speed is probably the next big hurdle!! did I see a speed comparison? with a slice of cake N coffee!! ha..ha..
Would you say the D2 justifies the price difference to the original ultra? I am having trouble finding comparisons. You are the expert here. What differences do you know where the d2 improved over the ultra besides buildable area? Thanks as always for your content
One point I don't see emphasized enough is the DLP won't require a screen change for a very long time. I know friends that have Elegoo, Voxelab and other machines that have had to replace their screens a few times. While priced higher, not having to worry about that may make it worth the higher price?
I think I'll skip this one. I've had no issues with my Ultra apart from the hobbit sized build plate and this just doesn't seem like a worthwile upgrade (especially since shipping to the EU comes with a healthy $70 price increase). Guess I'll go with Saturn 2 for that juicy build volume. Sure, it may not be as crisp as the D2 but it looks good enough for my needs.
There is a clear improvement from the Ultra to the D2, but it's an expensive step for anyone, so I understand you completely. I think it will be a long time before we see large DLPs as costs are prohibitive, but for a mid range printer, the S2 is an excellent choice. 😁👍👍👍
The fact that you had to do math to make sure the D2 is bigger than the Ultra makes it clear that this is more of an incremental release. I love my Ultra as my first proper resin printer, but now I have a want for larger-scale prints.
I did maths because my plates didn't match the size and shape of those shown in advertising blurb. That's quite possible as UA-camrs often receive Beta models, so I clarified the claims using the more precise data available from the slicers. The Ultra is excellent. Yes the D2 is better, but the choice of whether to upgrade is yours and please never feel pressured by me or any other information source. YOU must be comfortable with your choices. And I admit, I do get a little excited by new technology 😁 As for bigger, I don't think we'll be seeing bigger DLPs for a while yet. The costs are too prohibitive.
@@vogman Understood, for sure. I just had higher expectations that are a now a bit tempered. Like I said, I'm happy with what I have and I'm sure I'd be just as happy with the D2, it's just not what I'm looking for right now is all. I waited on resin printers until DLP was actually affordable, I don't mind still watching the market, there's definitely a handful of Masked-LED/LCD that I'm interested in
I wasn't completely sold until I saw the AA comparison... If I hadn't just forked out a tone for a Saturn 2, it might be on my shopping list. Might reassess that when a bit more work comes my way (hope there will be some more work, scary times, right?) Great video as always dude!
Hi great review I had an idea could you take a macro photo of FDM printer layers together with resin print "pixels" for comparison I feel like it will give perspective how small resin print voxels are.
May i? I1m wondering if Texas Inst. uses LED as light source in these new products... For if we look the provided image of the DLP assy for this printer, it seems to still have a large heat-sink... I use T.I. DLP im my home projector. The light source of mine is still a incandescent lamp, that uses a quite noisy but needed fan. In the manual of this, there's a note to use a no-break if possible. The fan stand active for a minute after you power off the projector to cool down the lamp. I think that it may be usefull in this one as well...
Looks good with AA enabled on this 51um resolution printer ;P Beats every other 51um (or near) printer I've ever seen! xD Definitely a king of the 2K specced printers, can't wait till TI advances enough that they can make a tru 8k DLP unit for us xD
Great review. I'm curious about the vat. Given that the Ultra uses only a small percentage of the physical build plate is the D2 vat the same one as the Ultra uses? and are the build plates swappable?
The DLP tech should easily be able to dither the projection to smooth any steps thru selective exposure times at boundaries. Perhaps we'll see a 'smoothing' feature added in firmware in future. DLP softening is possible - LCD sharpening is not.
Does your D2 display the time remaining in the print correctly ? Mine shows the hours and minutes at the start, but after a few layers it always displays 0 hours and some quantity of minutes only even when the print has many hours left to print.
this is pretty close to the ideal printer for me, 2560x1440 is plenty of resolution for the price and a huge improvement over the 720p on the ultra, only the build plate is still too narrow in size for me, i will wait for a saturn sized printer with this DLP assembly
Remember the nature of DLP is a projector. It works best for small size printing. Doubling the printing size means doubling the size / density of the micromirror chip which is tremendously expensive. Have you seen the price of 4K or 8K projectors ? That's cinema projector territory. For the foreseeable future, LCD and microled technologies are the most cost effective ways to large print plates for the consumer market, building up on already available large scale manufacturing.
@@the_arcanum err.. i actually view it the opposite way, 2560x1440 is 4x the density of the original photon ultra 720p so a 10" build plate would still have finer resolution than the ultra they could literally take the same assembly from the D2 and simply increase the throw ratio to get a bigger projection area, unlike an LCD where you need to manufacture a separate screen module for each size, DLP scales up way better to bigger sizes of course you trade off xy resolution for print area but 4k or even 8k on a 6" area is overkill anyway, 2.5k is plenty for a midsized printer, 4k DMD would make more sense on a 13"+ build plate
tbh i'm kinda surprised Anycubic skipped 1080p and went straght to WQHD for the D2 a 1080p micromirror chip would've been enough of an upgrade already on the same sized printer
I had my fun when you had to explain that what you see on a 10-20x zoom picture will differe a lot from what you see when you hold a 3cm mini in your hand.
I have a D2, got it last Black Friday…I haven’t used it yet because I’ve never used a resin printer yet…do you think the factory profile is good for a resin beginner such as myself?
There will be lots of profiles available for the D2 which should work well as it's been around for a while now. A good source is the Lychee community 😁
How are you my friend? I am a dental technician and I want to own a 3D printer for dental lab work. Do you recommend this printer and I would be grateful to you for the video and showing all the details
I'll be honest, I was a bit skeptical when I saw it was 50 micron (And I know the previous was 80 micron), but wow that is pretty impressive. I still personally think a pixel size
The Asiga printer I show briefly in this video is 35 micron... and $10,000. I think we can for the D2 being 50 microns. Honestly this printer performs at least of well as the Mini 8K for me, and that's 22 microns. That's why comparing with the same units doesn't work 😁
Remember I used no AA in my painting example, so with good AA use these would be even softer. Personally I think these layer lines are so fine they'd cover over immediately with a brush of paint. Then washes wouldn't be an issue.
Great video, dang fine arguments. However, as an extremely nearsighted person, I have always examined, since toddler-hood, my own toys and other manufactured artifacts from almost microscopic distances. It's fun! (before contact lenses existed, my glasses weighed so much they bruised my nose). Your anti-aliased examples from this printer seem much more appealing to me than the raw output. Still, very impressive.
I've not got great eyesight either and I'm also near sighted. I find it interesting that you, like me, love close-up detail. Maybe that's because it's the best we can see 😁
@@vogman Yeah! It's become more dramatic for me since I had one cataract implant a few years ago. Closing one eye gives me the choice of a 20/20 vision view or a -10 diopter view of the world (without the contact lens)
if you are really concerned with layer lines that you can only see when zoomed way in past what you normaly would then make what you want with clay and get some silicon to make a mold
If you still have the original Photon Ultra can you please make a quality comparison between these two? Especially focusing on the print lines and if D2 deals with AA any different than Ultra. You're probably the only source of that information for all us Photon Ultra owners :)
As I understand it, when printing a single mini the DLP printers focus in the projection, allowing the pixels to be concentrated into a smaller area and providing better detail - an LCD print has the same pixel density in every circumstance. Doesn't this also mean that filling the build plate on the Photon D2 would significantly affect the resulting prints? Whereas printing on a Saturn 2 would provide the same result whether printing one model or a full plate? Another fantastic review though! You're of the youtubers I trust to give a true warts and all run down of any printer you review, and it's much appreciated.
In all my print tests, I never printed "one" object. It was also 2 or 3 as time is an issue for me. I also pretty much filled the plate without issues too. Whilst it's still early days, so far I've seen nothing to make me think a DLP will print less well than an LCD. Honestly, I tend to lean the other way 😁
I'd love to see a comparison of this printer and the original elegoo mars. they have extremely similar pixel density so you could do a head to head battle between msla and dlp
I'm pretty sure that these will very quickly come down in price as other companies try to catch up. I've been lucky enough to see a industrial dlp in action. I don't know the specs apart from it was around £15.000. I've never seen a resin printer print a completely clear shot glass. That's all this machine did, day and night. Personalised shot glasses.
@@vogman I don't even drink lol. Great video. I would prefer a metal resin tray. I wonder if a screen protector would confuse the projector? Maybe a protector would reflect the light back! I suppose plastic is better in this case and the plastic resin trays are far more durable than just a few years ago.
I’m new to this technology and I’m looking for a 3D resin printer with quite a high level of resolution. I want to make a container with a waterproof push on cap, think cocktail shaker for example. I know that due to the low resolution, a watertight seal between two ‘extrusion printed’ parts would be impossible so it was great to see the close up imagery and level of detail in your vid. Do you think such a watertight cap would be possible with the Photon D2 at 22 microns, or even at the 35 microns from the lower priced machines you mentioned? I’m also told that extrusion printing is generally stronger than resin but my own experience is that extruded prints are fragile and break easily along their ‘layer’ lines. Do resin printed parts suffer the same weaknesses? Thanx for a very informative video.
You might have to add a seal space to the print file so you can add a gasket, but if you dial it in, you might get a watertight result without it. It's worth tinkering with. As far as durability, the more solid and uniform the resin prints are, typically the more durable, depending on the resin used. Your definition of durability matters as well. Something with a bit of flex is likely to forgive a fall better, Siraya Tech Tenacious is one of the most flexible resins, and can be mixed with others to get different properties. A more flexible resin might lend itself better to a watertight seal. Just my thoughts.
Hopefully I'll be able to buy this one; I've been checking in on the original Photon Ultra for a year and it normally seems out of stock or unavailable (was it simply a year long beta test for the D2?).
In terms of speed, do you think this is equal to the Phrozen or slower? I saw the skull ring took 8Hr @ .02 Layer Height. How is that compared with a mono screen like the Phrozen Mini 8K? Thanks for taking the time for making these reviews!
I think in terms of speed there's no difference that I can discern. Obviously it's all down to the resin and the settings, but I was pleased with the D2's performance. 😁
I have the Ultra.
The reason the size doesn't look that different is because the Ultra doesn't use the full build plate, it actually uses a shockingly small portion of it. I was rather upset by my realization of this.
I would really like to see a video of you popping a small object on each corner of the build area and showing a comparison of how close to the edge they print.
The Cones of Calibration (search UA-cam for it) is great to test this out, as they are tiny and square, so you can really set them perfectly on the edges.
I've been following your vids for awhile and enjoy them a lot. I personally think a lot of people would appreciate it and you could once and for all put the debate and questions by just printing 3 models (a bust, a medium size model and a mini like you did in this vid) on a 8k/4k printer and on the Photon D2, give it a grey primer and some dry brushing and put them side by side split screen. I am very much on the fence with printers like the Photon D2 because but who knows what next year brings that will push me over :)
I understand completely. This technology is always changing, though as I said in this video, nothing has really moved forward for nearly a year since the Phrozen Mini 8K. My personal guess is that DLP is the way the industry will eventually go and I suspect all the printer companies are researching this approach. 😁
@@vogman DLP looks insanely promising and I can't wait to see more. Once DLP reaches the 35 micron pixel size territory, we'll probably reach the extreme diminishing return territory for print quality. I hope companies would start focusing on other areas, such as ease of use and Quality of Life. That's a needed area that needs more improvements.
@@vogman the microLED looks like it might be a leap forward (for tiny prints)
VOG is the #1 go to reference I use for 3d printing advice. Fair and balanced. And in this video I LOVE how he pointed out the anti Aliasing feature !. My friend wants to upgrade all his printers to 4k, he has extremely good 2k LCD models and I enjoy the slight fuzzieness of the pixels on it. The bleed on the edges of them hide that jagged pixelated effect VOG was focusing on here.
As an owner of the Photon Ultra and Mars 3, I hope people hear the key difference from DLP, detail and DEPTH. The depth is hard to explain and show on camera, but it's really evident when you see or hold it. The clarity in something like scales or the fingers on a fist is how deep the recess is right next to a raised surface. That valley-to-peak is just sharper on DLP. They look more... convincing (I can't say 'realistic' for fantasy creatures or sci-fi...).
That makes sense when you think about the pixel blurring. It's hard to get small concave details when there is a blur factor.
I have been running the Photon Ultra for about 6 months now following the fine review from VOG. The quality and accuracy of the DLP printer is amazing. I am printing for dental purposed mostly so need an accurate finish and run with zero AA mostly. Superb results all around. Much better for me than the built in AA of an LCD printer, because you can't turn that off!
I want to buy anycubic m5s 12k for dental purpose i found it with good price or should i go for DLP printer instead ?
We need more reviewers and creators like you. I've been watching you for years, going from DIY stuff to tech reviews. You're one of the few who I trust to give real, honest, reviews even when it could risk further videos (like the Z-Wobble.) If you say something is worth it, I seriously consider getting it. I am shocked at the performance of this machine, especially the low power consumption for something so crisp and still being at a price level that a home hobbyist would consider.
The only question I do have is if a print to be molded in silicone would come out smooth and shiny or if the voxels will become more defined in the de-molded result. But that is not something that a normal review video will do, so looks like I need to get my hands on this for myself. The way the skull ring came out I don't think there will be any issue or need to cover in a thin resin before molding.
Wow, thanks very much. That's really appreciated.
You'll always get voxel lines, even if you use AA. It really depends on the print, the way it's angled and supported, the layer height, resin temperature and all sorts of things. Yes you can tinker and tinker and tinker until it's eventually as good as you'll get it, but most folks (especially me) don't have the patience.
So yes, if placed in a mold, those voxel lines would carry over as silicone is excellent at picking up the detail.
BUT... once a print has been washed and UV cured, you can sand it. This is very easy. Just use VERY fine grade paper, like 600 or 800, then finish off with 2000. Be gentle and wear a dust mask. This can easily remove voxel lines and leave the print silky smooth. After that silicone holds no fears.
FYI: VOG means to say voxelation rather than pixelation. Pixels are a 2-dimensional element. In the 3-dimensional world of 3D printers, these elements are called voxels.
ABSOLUTELY EPIC REVIEW. Thank you!
I’m so happy you set the layer height down to .02mm to “match” the apparent pitch of 21μm. And then showing side by side with and without anti-aliasing really gave us a great feeling of what this printer can do.
But you went above and beyond and actually painted and drybrushed a model. I’m sold.
This is amazing. I can’t wait until they make a larger build area.
Have you tried printing skin textures or other subtle textures?
Many thanks. My Cyborg Skull Ring has surprisingly lumpy texture. I didn't want smooth bone, but the pitied texture of a dug up skull. I was very pleased that this came out well 😁
Man, without a doubt my favorite 3D printer channel, I literally can't ask you to do anything more or any better, since you clear up all the doubts I might have. Amazing work like always, keep it up!! :D
Wow, thanks! That is a very thoughtful and much appreciate comment. Cheers Cless 😁
I just realised I have been watching your printer reviews and PLA loss casting videos since the first Elegoo Mars back in Aug 2019.
It’s crazy how good these printers have gotten and thank you for your detailed analysis along the way.
I still cringe at that Mars review. I did such a poor job. But yes, it's incredible how quickly the technology has moved on. And more will come, I'm sure of that 😁
Great video, this is very exciting news! The results on the 8-hour prints were crazy. As always, thanks for sharing!
Thanks for watching!
I recently got a Photon Mono 4k and found your channel..great work! Love the comments, thoughts, and commentary, and all clear and concise to boot.
Thanks very much 😁😁😁
Something I'd be really interested in is if you could look into how different printer specifications (such as technology and pixel size) influence feature dimension limits for mechanical 3D printing. I'm interested in making very small parts with very thin walls, and think that a video that examined what kinds of tolerances and wall thicknesses different printers could accomplish would be very generally interesting.
Thanks for hinting at this a few months ago when I asked if you still liked your ultra. I already placed my order and am very excited!
Nice one. You'll love it. It's an excellent printer.
Just ordered the D2, order confirmation pending. So excited!
You'll love it. Amazing detail! 😁
Thanks VOG, I had a backorder for an Ultra, then the D2 launched, and your videos gave me the kick I needed to pay the difference for a D2 :) It's getting shipped out on Monday! Cannot wait :D
You made the right choice. The Ultra was good but the D2 is better 😁
I have the ultra and most definitly will get the d2. 😁
The improvement over the Ultra is amazing. If you saw my previous D2 video I showed an extreme close-up of an Ultra print and a D2 print. Massive difference! Even finer details 😁
Ordered it before the launch livestream even started by checking the store page lol, as an Aussie pleasantly surprised by the free shipping! I've had the money ready to go for a printer like this all year. Now to order some tough & flexible resin for that golden mix for minis.
Way to go!!! You'll love it, honestly. If fine detail is your thing, you'll be smiling like a Cheshire cat 😁
Adds roughly %50 odd to the price for shipping to NZ :(
Thank you for the precisions about the pixellation. Very usefull informations.
Since you can achieve basically pixel-level sharpness, have you tried printing a porous block, to see if it works? it may be possible to print porous sponge-like objects which can suck liquids and retain them via surface tension.
Of course, good luck with washing the resin away before curing, but it should be doable with ultrasonic cleaners after some cycles
I'd be curious to see you re review old printers, just to get a scale of how much better they've gotten.
Hmmm. Might be fun. 😁
Yeah. I'm going to need that deep analysis between the 8k and D2. The top of the top going head-to-head.
I'll see what I can do 😁
so first, I really enjoy your videos. the review you posted on the elegoo saturn 2 8K is the reason I purchased that printer (after getting rid of the anycubic printer).
my thoughts on anycubic....the printers from that company aren't the issue. I recently returned an M3 Premium. why? well, not because the printer had issues. it's entirely due to the crap aftermarket service from anycubic. there were pieces missing in the box when it showed up. anycubic's solution? buy them. damaged NFEP on delivery (from the factory). anycubic's resolution? buy new ones. they didn't even offer to replace the damaged NFEP or send me the missing pieces. just spend more money. I owned that printer for 3.5 weeks and never got to use it. just make attempt after attempt to get anycubic to honour the issues that were responsible for. they actually didn't offer anything until I said fine, I'm returning it. then they suddenyl wanted to try to fix things. too late.
so, anycubic's printers aren't too bad. it's the dumpster fire aftermarket service.
Wow great review and walkthrough of a DLP printer.
Thanks Jacob 😁
Pound 4 Pound Geoff is guaranteed to give the best and most honest information you can get nice one Geoff all the best mate
Ian, that's VERY kind of you. Take care buddy 😁😁😁
It's great that we now have the choice of DLP printing in the "hobbyist" market.
Now if Anycubic can make one with a bigger build volume, say around Saturn 2 size, I'll have to throw them a pile of money.
I already have 3 printers from them and I've been very satisfied with the results.
Excellent job on your reviews, please keep us all informed.
I think you'll wait a long time for a mid-range DLP 😁
Fantastic review! Thank you. I love that this uses projection technology, rather than just illumination through an LCD screen. To me, this means that it should be possible to make a printer with 4x the surface area and volume, but without a 4x increase in cost, if we're OK with accepting a small decrease in speed and perhaps resolution.
I would have loved to see a mini printed at 0.02 with antialiasing and drybrushed. Really push the limits since dry brushing reveals everything.
As always, I love your honest disclaimer. Still haven't gotten around to propperly learning how to print resin with my own printer (due to a lack of time) but the plan afterwards seems to be changing atm because this looks really interesting
I say "Honest" because I mean it. I just tell the truth. No one pays me to say anything - I'm not sponsored - and if companies won't allow me to say exactly what I want, I don't review their goods 😁
An excellent review, THANKS(!)
I especially appreciated the close-up shots and you showing the results with AA enabled. - Yours is the first vid I’ve seen on the D2 that covers that. I’d been concerned about the pixilation, as I’ve been thinking about using resin printing for making small gears, and the rough pixilated surface seems like it would increase friction and the parts would wear quickly. AA seems to solve that problem though.
I really like the long life of the DLP; I want machines that I can just use as needed, without worrying about replacing critical components. Now I just need to decide if the small size will work ok for me…
Don't be afraid to sand resin prints. Just use very fine paper (600 or 800) and you can even polish off with 2000. This can remove any layer lines 😁
@@vogman Thanks for the advice! The D2 is looking like the resin printer I’ll likely go with. Your review of it was very helpful!
Honestly all they had to say was “larger print volume” and I’m sold, but wow are those some nice prints
Thanks Ian 😁
Hi VOG, I had already guessed that you were impressed by this D2 but for me today is an epic day thanks to Anycubic: not only for the D2, but because I was able to see the NEX (1600 mm / h 🤩) and discover the microled technology for details of 0.02 mm 🤯.
I would say that we do not risk getting bored.
Best
Good to hear your positive vibes 😁😁😁😁😁
Do the DLP prints just look better in person because the voxels are sharper and this allows you to see more detail?
The real question is whether they actually take paint better - the rougher surface may affect paint washes etc.
So I just left a comment but I'm not sure where it went, damn mobile phone. So if f I've doubled up, forgive me.
DLP technology is just amazing! Void star labs just did a video on it like 2 days ago maybe less and it's just amazing tech! This is how resin printers will head I think. Great video as always mate. I really love these honest reviews.
I believe DLP was here first. The problem has been costs. That's why industry has DLPs. LCD technology has made resin printing cheaper, but not quite as good. But now, thanks to Anycubic, DLPs are becoming affordable 😁
If you had to choose between the Elegoo Saturn 2 8k or the Anycubic Photon D2 which one would you choose?
The Photon 2D has a build volume of130.5mm x 73.4mm x 165mm. My Prusa SL1S has a build volume of 127mm x 80mm x 150mm. I purchased your Resin Printer Heater body STL files from Etsy and found that the pre-supported parts would not fit on my build plate and used the unsupported files rotated to 30° to fit to the build plate .. my first case of build plate envy.
This will be my printer choice ❤ great review
I'm not going to buy a resin printer, because my wife thinks my FDM printer "smells," even when I'm doing a 1 hour print with PLA.
I still look at the detail on prints like this, and drool.
Clearly this gives great results. If I were in the market to buy, my main question would be "can I get a resin printer with a larger print volume, that looks just as sharp due to high resolution, that's less expensive?"
I think we can agree you're not going to see anything sharper than the D2. Question is, how much can raw LCD resolution substitute for the sharp edges of reflected light in a DLP printer? Are the higher-volume printers going to be "soft" by comparison because the PPI on the screen isn't enough to compensate? An Anycubic Photon Mono X 6K is $450 right now, and has a much larger (197mm x 122mm WxD) printing area than the D2 (131 x 73mm).
While I heartily give Anycubic the thumb's up for getting a consumer grade DLP to market, a mid-size variant would be a must buy for me. I do recall that DLP's need a specific resin, which is kind of a bummer for those of us who bulk purchase, but that's a different problem for a later date.
I don't think we'll see a midsize DLP for a few years. But who know. 😁
Thank you for the magnificent unbiased presentation sir 👍
Glad you liked it! 😁
Print looks great painted and drybrushing would definitely pick up any imperfections but can't see any there! Your not wearing a jewellers eyeglass constantly you'll never see them lines! I have a printed matilda mk1 tank from one of these and it's absolutely out of this world in a 1.35 scale tank!
Exactly! I demonstrate MAGNIFIED images which, in the had, look smooth 😁
Be interesting if in the future they could utilise pixel shifting or even optical zooms to enhance and focus details to different parts of the image plane, as projectors obviously allow for optics in ways LCDs don't.
I think it would be best to give some close up side by side photos with typical LCD prints to be able to see the real difference DLP makes.
You can always go back through my videos buddy 😁
@@vogman oh I have haha. I just meant it for people who may just happen to stumble on the video looking for the new printer. Great stuff btw.
I guess I have found my next printer. Thanks for making the review.
It's a beauty 😁
So, with the release now of the Mars 4 DLP, any competition or choice between the 2?
I'm just so flabbergasted @ the surface finish. & print quality!! as always, a very helpful tutorial !!
good luck Vog! I'm really hoping these companies, R turning their smarty screws! for some,
the future couldn't be any better!! 4 others, it's not even scratched the surface!!
speed is probably the next big hurdle!! did I see a speed comparison?
with a slice of cake N coffee!! ha..ha..
I didn't really compare speeds, but I can say it was fairly quick. I mentioned in the captions a ring print, 2 hour @ 0.05 and 8 hours @ 0.02 😁
Would you say the D2 justifies the price difference to the original ultra? I am having trouble finding comparisons.
You are the expert here. What differences do you know where the d2 improved over the ultra besides buildable area?
Thanks as always for your content
One point I don't see emphasized enough is the DLP won't require a screen change for a very long time. I know friends that have Elegoo, Voxelab and other machines that have had to replace their screens a few times. While priced higher, not having to worry about that may make it worth the higher price?
Yes, 20,000 hours lifespan is impressive 😁
I think I'll skip this one. I've had no issues with my Ultra apart from the hobbit sized build plate and this just doesn't seem like a worthwile upgrade (especially since shipping to the EU comes with a healthy $70 price increase). Guess I'll go with Saturn 2 for that juicy build volume. Sure, it may not be as crisp as the D2 but it looks good enough for my needs.
There is a clear improvement from the Ultra to the D2, but it's an expensive step for anyone, so I understand you completely. I think it will be a long time before we see large DLPs as costs are prohibitive, but for a mid range printer, the S2 is an excellent choice. 😁👍👍👍
Its all about the build Volume once your printing 4k+, the quality is negligible
@@lordnovas i feel this is why elegoo went with the 3 pro but upgraded the saturn to 8k
The fact that you had to do math to make sure the D2 is bigger than the Ultra makes it clear that this is more of an incremental release. I love my Ultra as my first proper resin printer, but now I have a want for larger-scale prints.
I did maths because my plates didn't match the size and shape of those shown in advertising blurb. That's quite possible as UA-camrs often receive Beta models, so I clarified the claims using the more precise data available from the slicers.
The Ultra is excellent. Yes the D2 is better, but the choice of whether to upgrade is yours and please never feel pressured by me or any other information source. YOU must be comfortable with your choices. And I admit, I do get a little excited by new technology 😁
As for bigger, I don't think we'll be seeing bigger DLPs for a while yet. The costs are too prohibitive.
@@vogman Understood, for sure. I just had higher expectations that are a now a bit tempered. Like I said, I'm happy with what I have and I'm sure I'd be just as happy with the D2, it's just not what I'm looking for right now is all. I waited on resin printers until DLP was actually affordable, I don't mind still watching the market, there's definitely a handful of Masked-LED/LCD that I'm interested in
I wasn't completely sold until I saw the AA comparison... If I hadn't just forked out a tone for a Saturn 2, it might be on my shopping list. Might reassess that when a bit more work comes my way (hope there will be some more work, scary times, right?) Great video as always dude!
Yes, lots of folks asked for AA on the last video, so I thought I'd better pull my finger out 😁
@@vogman Now I think about it, how does a laser even have an antialiasing function??
Is it solve the deformation problem if printing a large flat surface just like phone case?
Hi great review I had an idea could you take a macro photo of FDM printer layers together with resin print "pixels" for comparison I feel like it will give perspective how small resin print voxels are.
May i? I1m wondering if Texas Inst. uses LED as light source in these new products... For if we look the provided image of the DLP assy for this printer, it seems to still have a large heat-sink... I use T.I. DLP im my home projector. The light source of mine is still a incandescent lamp, that uses a quite noisy but needed fan. In the manual of this, there's a note to use a no-break if possible. The fan stand active for a minute after you power off the projector to cool down the lamp.
I think that it may be usefull in this one as well...
please make a video on how to repair dlp projector if it breaks. they last long but they may get damaged by accident.
Thanks looking at 3d printing very big help.
Glad to help
Looks good with AA enabled on this 51um resolution printer ;P Beats every other 51um (or near) printer I've ever seen! xD Definitely a king of the 2K specced printers, can't wait till TI advances enough that they can make a tru 8k DLP unit for us xD
Don't start on me, otherwise I'll do an entire video dedicated to unit difference 😉😁🤣😂
Great review. I'm curious about the vat. Given that the Ultra uses only a small percentage of the physical build plate is the D2 vat the same one as the Ultra uses? and are the build plates swappable?
The DLP tech should easily be able to dither the projection to smooth any steps thru selective exposure times at boundaries. Perhaps we'll see a 'smoothing' feature added in firmware in future. DLP softening is possible - LCD sharpening is not.
Does your D2 display the time remaining in the print correctly ? Mine shows the hours and minutes at the start, but after a few layers it always displays 0 hours and some quantity of minutes only even when the print has many hours left to print.
Hi I tried burning out the dlp craftsman resin but failed it was still solid inside the cast. Am I doing something wrong.
how does the speed compare to the phrozen 8k? i am running a b9 core 550 and it will do the same job as my phrozen 8k in 1/3 the time
this is pretty close to the ideal printer for me, 2560x1440 is plenty of resolution for the price and a huge improvement over the 720p on the ultra, only the build plate is still too narrow in size for me, i will wait for a saturn sized printer with this DLP assembly
Waiting for a mid-range DLP of this print quality... I think it will be a few years 🙂
Remember the nature of DLP is a projector. It works best for small size printing. Doubling the printing size means doubling the size / density of the micromirror chip which is tremendously expensive. Have you seen the price of 4K or 8K projectors ? That's cinema projector territory. For the foreseeable future, LCD and microled technologies are the most cost effective ways to large print plates for the consumer market, building up on already available large scale manufacturing.
@@the_arcanum err.. i actually view it the opposite way, 2560x1440 is 4x the density of the original photon ultra 720p so a 10" build plate would still have finer resolution than the ultra they could literally take the same assembly from the D2 and simply increase the throw ratio to get a bigger projection area, unlike an LCD where you need to manufacture a separate screen module for each size, DLP scales up way better to bigger sizes of course you trade off xy resolution for print area but 4k or even 8k on a 6" area is overkill anyway, 2.5k is plenty for a midsized printer, 4k DMD would make more sense on a 13"+ build plate
tbh i'm kinda surprised Anycubic skipped 1080p and went straght to WQHD for the D2 a 1080p micromirror chip would've been enough of an upgrade already on the same sized printer
This really needs a comparison to the mini 8k and similar equivalent
I did do some Ultra and Mini 8K comparisons here ua-cam.com/video/AEZCExSCkCM/v-deo.html
WOW!!!!! That was AMAZE-BALLS!!!!! Thanks!!!!
Thanks Charles 😁
This will be my next printer. It looks to be a substantial upgrade over the Mars 2 Pro.
I had my fun when you had to explain that what you see on a 10-20x zoom picture will differe a lot from what you see when you hold a 3cm mini in your hand.
Do you recommend this as the 1st resin printer?
I have a D2, got it last Black Friday…I haven’t used it yet because I’ve never used a resin printer yet…do you think the factory profile is good for a resin beginner such as myself?
There will be lots of profiles available for the D2 which should work well as it's been around for a while now. A good source is the Lychee community 😁
Please make a video on smoothing the print layer with Sonic Mini 8k, sir , thanks you so so much
How are you my friend? I am a dental technician and I want to own a 3D printer for dental lab work. Do you recommend this printer and I would be grateful to you for the video and showing all the details
Siraya Tech-3D Resina despite of being LCD also works on it?
The quality is amazing! But I’m going to wait till it has a bigger print volume
Unfortunately I think you'll be waiting a long time. Even industrial DLPs tend to be small. 😁
Ouch that price. I’d like to see a compare on this and the elegoo mars 3 pro or the elegoo Saturn.
Hello 👋
if i order this printer and print on regular resins, is that ok? Or do I need to fill in the right one? Like dlp Craftsman?
I'll be honest, I was a bit skeptical when I saw it was 50 micron (And I know the previous was 80 micron), but wow that is pretty impressive.
I still personally think a pixel size
The Asiga printer I show briefly in this video is 35 micron... and $10,000. I think we can for the D2 being 50 microns.
Honestly this printer performs at least of well as the Mini 8K for me, and that's 22 microns. That's why comparing with the same units doesn't work 😁
What primer did you use there? I really liked the shade of it!
It's Citadel Mechicus Grey 😁
@@vogman thanks!
I hope in the next releases with 4K DLP chips or even better 8K.
So what is the difference between the Ultra and the D2 in printing quality, because I could get the Ultra for around 400€?
This video compares some Ultra and D2 prints ua-cam.com/video/AEZCExSCkCM/v-deo.html
Finally used anti aliasing, now i know this printer is good!
Always use anti aliasing
I know, I know. I never use AA. But I listened to you guys 😁😁😁
I am thinking of making my first purchase. What should I buy?
This video may help... ua-cam.com/video/sQ-mLzoaEFE/v-deo.html
Nice review and I like this printer more than the LCD type, btw the Anycubic talk about extra of the area is not about the volume of build
Thanks Ahmed 😁
I feel like you covered this but can you use 'normal' resin with this or does it have to be DLP specific stuff?
Absolutely. Any 405 wavelength should work fine. I've had all sorts in the Ultra 😁
@vogman Is an extra $300 for a D2 worth it over the Ultra?
Do we have elefant foot issue with print in place pieces with this technology ?
Is there a test model file from the USB flash drive of this printer? I can not find(((
I'm curious how these prints would paint up. Will those layers get brought out using washes? Anyone have any experience with this? Thanks.
Remember I used no AA in my painting example, so with good AA use these would be even softer. Personally I think these layer lines are so fine they'd cover over immediately with a brush of paint. Then washes wouldn't be an issue.
Hey VOG, will you be casting the “Skull-Borg” ring? It would be a great thing to see. ❤
Great video, dang fine arguments.
However, as an extremely nearsighted person, I have always examined, since toddler-hood, my own toys and other manufactured artifacts from almost microscopic distances. It's fun! (before contact lenses existed, my glasses weighed so much they bruised my nose). Your anti-aliased examples from this printer seem much more appealing to me than the raw output. Still, very impressive.
I've not got great eyesight either and I'm also near sighted. I find it interesting that you, like me, love close-up detail. Maybe that's because it's the best we can see 😁
@@vogman Yeah! It's become more dramatic for me since I had one cataract implant a few years ago. Closing one eye gives me the choice of a 20/20 vision view or a -10 diopter view of the world (without the contact lens)
Yes! Without watching your video yet😜
Thanks buddy 😁😁😁
if you are really concerned with layer lines that you can only see when zoomed way in past what you normaly would then make what you want with clay and get some silicon to make a mold
If you still have the original Photon Ultra can you please make a quality comparison between these two? Especially focusing on the print lines and if D2 deals with AA any different than Ultra. You're probably the only source of that information for all us Photon Ultra owners :)
I've already shown an Ultra / D2 comparison here ua-cam.com/video/AEZCExSCkCM/v-deo.html
@@vogman OMG, I can't believe I missed it :o Thanks for that :)
great review! have you noticed that the basic resis from anycubic has a much stronger smell than some from six months ago?
Personally I haven't noticed.
As I understand it, when printing a single mini the DLP printers focus in the projection, allowing the pixels to be concentrated into a smaller area and providing better detail - an LCD print has the same pixel density in every circumstance. Doesn't this also mean that filling the build plate on the Photon D2 would significantly affect the resulting prints? Whereas printing on a Saturn 2 would provide the same result whether printing one model or a full plate?
Another fantastic review though! You're of the youtubers I trust to give a true warts and all run down of any printer you review, and it's much appreciated.
In all my print tests, I never printed "one" object. It was also 2 or 3 as time is an issue for me. I also pretty much filled the plate without issues too. Whilst it's still early days, so far I've seen nothing to make me think a DLP will print less well than an LCD. Honestly, I tend to lean the other way 😁
@@vogman Hmmmm. Just when I think I've settled on a printer to buy...
Off topic but is there an advantage to vacuum degassing resin for resin printers before putting it into the printing tray to avoid small bubbles?
I'd love to see a comparison of this printer and the original elegoo mars. they have extremely similar pixel density so you could do a head to head battle between msla and dlp
I am also planning to buy . For making jewellery design Which one is best ultra or D2
Definitely the D2. Have a look at this video ua-cam.com/video/NH1z2OxdZiQ/v-deo.html
I'm pretty sure that these will very quickly come down in price as other companies try to catch up.
I've been lucky enough to see a industrial dlp in action.
I don't know the specs apart from it was around £15.000.
I've never seen a resin printer print a completely clear shot glass.
That's all this machine did, day and night. Personalised shot glasses.
Next time you're filling those shot glasses Tony, let know know 😉😁😂🤣
@@vogman I don't even drink lol. Great video. I would prefer a metal resin tray. I wonder if a screen protector would confuse the projector? Maybe a protector would reflect the light back!
I suppose plastic is better in this case and the plastic resin trays are far more durable than just a few years ago.
I’m new to this technology and I’m looking for a 3D resin printer with quite a high level of resolution.
I want to make a container with a waterproof push on cap, think cocktail shaker for example.
I know that due to the low resolution, a watertight seal between two ‘extrusion printed’ parts would be impossible so it was great to see the close up imagery and level of detail in your vid. Do you think such a watertight cap would be possible with the Photon D2 at 22 microns, or even at the 35 microns from the lower priced machines you mentioned?
I’m also told that extrusion printing is generally stronger than resin but my own experience is that extruded prints are fragile and break easily along their ‘layer’ lines. Do resin printed parts suffer the same weaknesses?
Thanx for a very informative video.
You might have to add a seal space to the print file so you can add a gasket, but if you dial it in, you might get a watertight result without it. It's worth tinkering with. As far as durability, the more solid and uniform the resin prints are, typically the more durable, depending on the resin used. Your definition of durability matters as well. Something with a bit of flex is likely to forgive a fall better, Siraya Tech Tenacious is one of the most flexible resins, and can be mixed with others to get different properties. A more flexible resin might lend itself better to a watertight seal. Just my thoughts.
Hopefully I'll be able to buy this one; I've been checking in on the original Photon Ultra for a year and it normally seems out of stock or unavailable (was it simply a year long beta test for the D2?).
From what folks are posting here, yes it's already on sale. Here's a link you can look over bit.ly/3TA6bLb
In terms of speed, do you think this is equal to the Phrozen or slower?
I saw the skull ring took 8Hr @ .02 Layer Height.
How is that compared with a mono screen like the Phrozen Mini 8K?
Thanks for taking the time for making these reviews!
I think in terms of speed there's no difference that I can discern. Obviously it's all down to the resin and the settings, but I was pleased with the D2's performance. 😁
@@vogman Awesome! thanks for the reply!