And what prove the precision of modern mass production,that's the point, this precision is supposedly done without lathe and by hand, with copper tools or stones I believe, did you guys even watch the vids?
@@cgnplays942 my point is most people have no idea what it means when something has a tolerance of 3 thou. but if you show the tolerance of say a billiard ball, something most people think is totally smooth/symmetrical, it puts the insane tolerance of the vase into perspective.
@@iconofsin66 I agree. People have no concept of what 3 thou actually is. I own both a metal lathe and mill and i can't make stuff that preceise out of easy to machine materials like aluminum. I can't imagine how they did it using some of the materials they used.
@@LBCAndrew Don't say that. Most people commenting here seem to have good knowledge of for example tolerance levels. As an engineer, I have no difficulty understanding, lol.
Great video Ben. 👍👍 Great analysis of the exterior of the vase (the easy part). Is there a plan to scan the interior of the vase? 1) To establish the symmetry of the interior. 2) To compare the sides to the vertical axis used for the exterior comparison. 3) To map the thickness of the vase and the thickness consistency at different horizontal planes? 🇨🇦
Interesting video. I suspect/hypothesize that those high precision vases are possible the remnants and artifacts of Atlantis. Atlantis was supposed to be a very advanced civilization. Interesting part about vases is their handles. They are designed to be handled mechanically instead by hand or robes. What strikes me is the amount of precision for the object that is supposed to be used to handle simple liquids by simple people. Such precision of the vase can be found in aerospace industry and some automotive industry. Therefore, the civilization was so advanced that considered the precision vase making a piece of cake or that this vase was made for precise specs for a specific purpose/function that requires high tolerances.
I've been thinking a bit about the handles. Clearly they're not ergonomically shaped. Was it the only feasible way to create them? Were the vases meant to be hanged? Aesthetic preference maybe? Or was it just the fact that a more ergonomic handle would require a bigger block of original material?
The only serious objection to your reasoning I can come up with is this, but it is quite damning. All these extremely precise objects are clearly art. There isn't a single UTILITARIAN precise object or, if there is - its utility cannot be demonstrated beyond reasonable doubt. Why would that be the case? Yes, you could use such vases for storing grain or liquids, however, clay is much lighter, and clay vases much cheaper to make, and, should a clay vessel be accidentally dropped, - no big deal. It can be shaped in a mold or rotated into shape in mere minutes. We have extremely precise art too, however, our precision is merely a side effect, if you will of our advancements in complex technology. Without precision rockets will not achieve a stable orbit, gun barrels will explode, solar panels will not open in the vacuum of space. Now, where are all the utilitarian objects made with such precision? Never mind the question of where are the tools which made these vases, sure I can accept the idea that they were far less numerous and could have been destroyed in a cataclysm of some sort or pulled apart to make crude tools after the demise of Younger Dryas civilisation. However, the utilitarian objects made by such machining would be far more numerous and widespread and surely we would have found some by now, would we not?
I find this measurement effort to be incredibly exciting and important. No, I'm not in the least surprised that you can't get access to the museum's artifacts - and that's shameful.
If you think ancient technology is censored and discredited with b.s. wait until you find out about the pharma version. Maybe check Charles Lieber patents to understand the true horror of the situation. Hoping to wake a few more sheeple up
They keep these items away from outsiders so people cannot make discoveries without them. Gatekeepers! It’s not in their best interest for new narratives to be made because they’re so heavily invested in a specific direction.
It still bewilders me how people believe these objects are made by old kingdom Ancient Egyptians. They were a Bronze Age people, using copper tools. I can't see how someone who is being honest can come to those conclusions. CLEARLY some type of technology or high knowledge of techniques to perfectly cut out these objects was used to make them.
Many were made during the Neolithic. Which is the stone age friend. Do you know why it's called the stone age? Lithic meaning stone neo meaning new. It's called the stone age because humans began making tools from stone.
No matter…THEY WERE BLACK AFRICAN…. Before any race on the planet there was only ONE!….Kush is 12-15,000 olmec are 15-20,000 years there was a major world event that destroyed these civilizations
As a Master Stonemason, with an MA in history, I am impressed with your methodology and your understanding of the variable hardness of these materials and the problems that this causes when working (shaping) them. This is true even when using machines. However It's worth remembering that these items may be the perfect ones, there may also have been any number of failures that were discarded. Keep up the good work 👍
Also, conversely, the vases we see today could possibly be the ones that were of average precision quality. There could be granite vases that are even more perfect
Hello Ben, great work on presenting the high tolerances on this vase. I was a precision tool designer, working in the automotive and aerospace industries for decades, and am now retired. I have been to Egypt and have seen many examples of precision machining on various artifacts and at many ancient buildings. I agree that none of that work could have been manufactured without powered precision machine tools. Regarding the machining manufacturing processes used today, CNC 5 Axis machining centers and lathes often require precision custom designed holding tools and fixtures in order to be machined in the first place. Companies like Boeing, Honeywell aerospace, Northrop Grumman, Lockheed Martin, plus the Big Three automakers have tool design departments that design precision work holding fixtures that are needed to accomplish high precision machining processes. The knowledge to design those fixtures takes a lifetime of hard won experience, and it requires a lot of training. Add to all this the fact that the ancients were working with non homogeneous stone materials, and not metals, is even more impressive. All over Egypt and other ancient sites evidence of high precision stone working is plain to see. Archaeologists are not engineers and should stay in their lane by digging up graves and small artifacts, and leave the inquiry as to how huge structures and high precision artifacts were made to the engineers.
I worked in the same fields, manufacturing and machining. There is absolutely no way these stone vases etc were manufactured by hand. Only by highly precise equipment with extreme repeatability. The tolerances speak volumes !
"custom designed holding tools and fixtures " Yup, the problem isn't just finding a cutting tool (diamond?) it's the stiffness of the holding fixtures needed for that precision.
same here, the accuracy in relation to the reference planes proves that this piece was manufactured in one single process, re-tooling will make this accuracy impossible.
I concur... 38 years in Engineering , cutting heat resistant super alloys. Inconel, Hastelloy, Waspelloy Stellite, Titanium ,Zirconium and many others. I now design and manufacture cutting tools for the aerospace in the military sector for some of the companies you mentioned... I started out in heavy engineering on valve's. Again we had to design special work holding tooling. IE molded jaws, or machine component profiles that matched the component surface being held. Valve bodies with 12 inch inlets / outlets were held inside indexing chucks ensuring that multi facets where rotated along the same axis, ensuring centre line compliance... I've used solid carbid, CBN, PCD. But to machine granite without deflection of the work piece or ripping out aspects of the material is quite simply baffling to me now especially considering the wall thicknesses we're discussing... I am truly spellbound...👍
Ben, I think I speak for the vast majority when I say we cannot thank you enough for your continued and rigorous outstanding research into the subject of ancient engineering and precision. This is by far, in my honest opinion, the most crucial aspect of archaeology to date, and of course, much more study needs to be done, especially with this kind of attitude towards it. Stay true, D.
@@brothermaleuspraetor9505 I don't see a link, maybe a copyright problem - on a thousands of years old vase. Well, the copyright is in the work to scan it, not in the old object. But there should be many free ancient vases, amphoras and so on available on platforms like thingiverse. Maybe you find things that you really like. And it should be possible to make a 3D object just by looking at it, that closely resembles it, that looks almost like it.
This is excellent. You are doing a serious job for humanity, a dreams work for many. Zahi and crew would scoff over this and prevent it with threats of banishment so quickly. This is a huge development. HARD DATA, makes these become objective truths, in which I'd love to hear arguments for this being handmade at this point.
Sa I needs to hurry up and take his place in the duat and amongst the other thousand points of light, should he be so lucky to have a place saved for him….
@@bluedog7222 yep. If you understand precision, you understand why this is unequivocal proof of an advanced civilization predating modern humanity. If you don't understand precision, you probably ought not have opinions on these sorts of things until you fix that knowledge deficiency. It's why so many engineers, masons, machinists (or any other trade dealing in tight tolerances), metrologists, etc, just laugh when presented with the theory that these were hand carved: we have the knowledge to immediately see that as beyond farcical. Whats mind blowing is I dont know if we could do this today. I mean, I feel pretty confident we could make similarly precise things for cheap enough to make this many, out of steel, but of course that wouldn't last a thousand years, let alone ten thousand. But I don't know how you'd set up a CNC mill with a rotary table that could vary feeds and speed enough not to fracture the vessel when cutting igneous stone... It would have to involve a machine learning program using some type of scanning device to scan just ahead of the cutter path, fast enough to run the material calculations and increase/decrease speed and feed rates before it hit the change in media density/hardness. And there would be a *lot* of mistakes.
Silly answer .. Ofcourse they're straight, do you think a sand worm (granite worm) ate its way through? Better answer .. The holes are tangent to the vertical axis at centre point of drilled (? Not carved ) holes and horizantal to the top within a few hair thickness. If curved, i think taking data points inside the tube hole would be extremely difficult and the lads would have made a point about it. So, are they curved? Highly unlikely from discussion but cannot give definitive No. Video footage never good enough to say 100%, ever! Great question though.
@@nawhedawhe6905 So what you are saying is that, if the holes are curved, even with current technology, we would have difficulty in *measuring* it, let alone replicating it. But just to confirm whether it is curved or straight, maybe a soft clay-like mold can be inserted to see the shape it produces?
Straight. But they are so out of line that they fail at precision twice. They are visibly not paralell something aking to 5 degrees angle. One is going upwards while one is mostly in the handle direction.
I somehow discovered you and Jimmy at the same time, both under 100k subs, before Grahams first visit to JRE. I knew you will join forces, you are the new science and archeology needed for the free world !
You boys are pioneers in this work!!!! No one, besides the people that made them in the first place, has ever done this meticulous examination of these artifacts!! In my opinion you all deserve a Pulitzer for this groundbreaking work!!!! Cheers
Maybe this has been answered or addressed but has the wall thickness of the vase been measured in enough points to see how well the inside of the vase was milled as well?
Ive been fascinated by Egypt since age 12, nearly 60 years ago, winning a school prize that allowed me to chose a book, and I chose a book of beautiful pictures of Egyptian artifacts and statues. Ben, you've managed to make me feel so positive about the future of research and discovery again. Thank you. Finally modern technology has advanced enough to accurately analyse these treasures.
Either the Smithsonian or the Vatican has these ancient tools in their possession, or both. These ancient tools are in a wooden crate somewhere underneath other wood crates filled with ancient knowledge.
I am retired tool and die maker with a lifetime of experience in precision mashing. Up to the 1980 or there about we all ways remove material by using a harder tool ( cutter) to cut the softer material , using manually operated lathes or milling machines and later CNC controlled machines. But then a new technology came along that didn’t require a cutter to remove material the material was removed not by cutting action but by erosion. And by that I mean Spark erosion, wire erosion , laser machining and so on. This technology give us the freedom to machine very complicated shapes with ease. I feel that this article especially the protrusions will be very difficult if not impossible to do with cutting action. This vase is not part of a machine that has to be so accurate. Is made so accurate because the technology that existed at the time of manufacturing enables the mass production of this vases, the accuracy of the article is a reflection of the program that was used, perhaps to the third decimal point if you want, makes no difference in the speed of manufacturing. I believe that this article and many others with extremely thin wall sections and complicated shapes were made by a technology that we have yet to discover.
@@myview1875 I remember the first big Mazak unit I got to set up, it was quite a sight coming from smaller HAAS gear. Crazy to think the ancients seem to have had access to such precision & power.
Either the Smithsonian or the Vatican has these ancient tools in their possession, or both. These ancient tools are in a wooden crate somewhere underneath other wood crates filled with ancient knowledge.
@@calikid2139 certainly no current way to disprove that at least the knowledge relating to such things may be there. Wonder if people will ever get fed up and forcibly open the archives.
As an aeronautical engineer with an A&P license these tolerances are absolutely astounding. I’ve been waiting for actual tangible evidence via NDT. Good on y’all!
Yeah, well, keep waiting. The tangible evidence of high technology, every last particle of it, was packed up and carried back to the Planet Xescam just after the YD event.
I am a granite installer and fabricator, I have been doing it for 16 years now and I would definitely love to try replicating this vase, problem is the inside, even using our water jet it would not contour along the vertical wall, also I think I can get the outside wall down to 1/16 of an inch but the edges were the handle meets would not be the difficult part, cnc machine can cut to specs and have my pro polisher handle it as we check tolerance. It's possible but would require machines that cost 500k. We work with 1 3/16 thick stone or 3 cm, it would be interesting to see if the vases in museums will have some sort of resin for micro blowouts that happen when working with granite. From the vases I can tell they used dark colored granite which is usually more dense and strong but also creates the problem of harder scribing. Also granite is known to be pourus or micro voids, how did they get the vase to be smooth with no pours. Also in our machines we do not have to be careful with granite that has other forms of stone inside of it, water is our best friend when cutting multiple materials in granite
U just serve coffee, calling urself a barmaid in another language doesnt elevate the actual job. It just makes others laugh at you because ur such a wannabe. 20 years ago people served coffee aswell, no one called themselves this bullshit 'barista'. Ridiculous. I bet ur the type of person who sits at Starbucks with their laptop 😂😂😂
The content is exemplary and your presentation style is like no other. Truly a modern academic in full bloom! Thank You Ben for sharing your knowledge and time. Absolutely aWeSoMe ❣️
To anyone in or around London, go to the Petrie museum and see this for yourself - and the drill core made of granite. It’s surreal to be centimetres away from items at least 12,500 years old crafted using powerful ancient technology (albeit through a glass😅). Thank you, Ben, for the inspiration / information to do so!
@@Man_fay_the_Bru I went to the museum 3 days ago now, there are countless artefacts made of clay using primitive technology because they are trying to imitate the vases thousands of years older. As I said, they are made of granite, diorite and quartz however the most impressive (at the Cairo museum) made from corundum. The striations/lines/thread marks left behind by the tool to build the vases and extract the drill cores are clearly all done in one motion without interruption. You need at least diamond to cut through these materials as anything else is too weak and the tool has to be fixed in place. I’ve watched 100s of hours of videos on this topic including plenty on ‘rocks’ (not cos I enjoy it) to know this is real - and saw it in person. I would encourage you to do the same if you genuinely care. Love for the reply though ❤️
@@craigparker4108 if the technology existed to build these, it could be no less as it would’ve been destroyed by the younger dryas cataclysm. It’s actually what is being claimed as the ‘missing chapter in human history’: a pre-dynastic (Egyptian) civilisation. I would recommend watching Graham Hancock’s new Netflix documentary ‘Ancient Apocalypse’, it has irrefutable evidence for this claim. I hope this helps, much love for the reply. ❤️
@@AA11AA11AA Yeah have seen all Graham's work, don't know what i was thinking. Probably just younger dryas 11.6 to 11.8 k ago so older than that maybe. Was really tired & confused & will delete that post.
These vases were not milled, for sure. Most probably, a combination of waterjet cutting, sandblasting and laser ablation controlled by a computer and laser sensors was used.
@@JoshJones-xd5mw The cost of manufacturing such a vase using the latest technology would be several thousand US dollars, so I doubt that it would be sold in a gift shop for $50.
Wow!! Since I found your videos over a year ago, and you introduced me to the machining and precision in ancient Egypt, I'm happy to say each new video you release still wows me. This vase and the story it tells really is a massive tribute to our ancestors and their capabilities. I look forward to learning more about them. Thank you, and all involved ☺️
I'm not buying Ben's narrative. These things have been replicated by modern archeologists using wood and copper. Please ask Ben to show one sliver of this pre-Dynastic technology. There isn't a shred.
These could have been made with a template on a lathe if they were soft like clay during manufacturing. The space between the handles could have also been cleanned up with a template after being rough-cut. If they were made while in a hardened state, the cutter could have or would have been moving slowly, especially between the handles. They could have used a casing around it to support the pressure on the walls while cutting out the inside of the wall. Some kind of vibration could have been implemented as well to help move the cutter through the substance. ...imo as a machinist who has also drilled marble.
Can someone please machine a replica of the vase, to the same tolerances, with an easy medium ie Aluminium and document the process, so we can all see how incredibly difficult this would be when multiplied by the hardness of Granite . Love your work Ben.
Surely there must exist at least a handful of archelogists / egyptologists that are open to making these precises measurements of public artifacts. We've got to find them !
No, if they do, the moffia of Egyptian forced thought will have them driven out. They do not want the truth. They think it takes away from Egyptian history. NOT ONE TOOL has been found that could do this! I saw one of these scientest say "We know how it was made" IS A LIE! If stone age people could make it then have these scientes make it!
They have to stay in their lane. Their tenures and funding depend on them "toeing the party line" which seems to be, either ignore, avoid, deny, that there has been a cover up of information. I think "they" know that the past was not backward but far more knowledgeable than they want us to believe.
Very good podcast. I spent a year in Cairo in 1988 on assignment at the US Embassy Cairo which as you probably already know The Cairo Museum is only a few hundred yards up the street from the embassy. And I visited the museum often. I have been in the EE field and have another degree in Computer Science since 1980 and have been involved with the family engineering and construction business since 1962. I had the opportunity at the end of my tour to spend 3-1/2 weeks in Luxor/Karnak/Valley of the Kings and was not near enough time. While in Cairo my status with the embassy I had access to some of the back areas/rooms/staging areas and sometimes after hours of the Cairo Museum. I handled and touched a lot of items and not just the type of jars and plates you illustrated in your video podcast. There is no doubt for decades it has puzzled me for years how this type of design and shaping of stone with such precision. By the time I left Cairo in January 1989, I was convinced these items were molded. I even looked for seams from a mold but absolutely no hint of a seam. Some of the larger items had scaffolding built around them as they were preparing for display on the museum floor. It has kept me in bewilderment since then. But then you take a close examination at statues made of Schist stone, especially one of the Menkaure Triads. You leave with the thought this is impossible with Bronze age instruments and technology. At times I used magnifying glasses to examine the details [especially around the ears, eyes, nose and mouth] it is clean and precise and the edges are crisp and not one tool mark or scratch I could detect.
I do lapidary work regularly and we carve some pretty small objects with extremely sharp corners and details with relief, all polished to finish, removing any evidence of tool marks from shaping. Problem is, a dental tool called a micromotor, a kind of brushless high rpm flex shaft style rotary tool, is how we achieve this. Extremely high precision. Combined with water, and various Diamond coated bits, it’s an hour or two worth of work depending on the item. Afterwards we use special polishing bits of similar shapes and sizes, also with water, to scrub/erase the abrasive marks from shaping. Typically we use nova bits for our projects to achieve high quality polish/finished on hard stones. These are completely synthetic resin and Diamond proprietary bits manufactured by an Australian company. This also takes about an hour or two. For a palm sized object. While these techniques achieve astonishing detail and polish, there’s a reason we only use them on “free-handed” style sculptures. As this kind of manufacturing process is only effect on asymmetrical designs. We have precision cabbing wheels and lapidary wheels as well, even rock saws, nothing even close to the wet lathe like a countertop place would have. and even with pro setups in state of the art facilities, they aren’t machining hard stone vases like this at 1/1000th inch accuracy. Let alone 6,000 years ago. This precision matches today’s pro standards; quiet literally nearly perfect, so close in fact that its closer to “perfect” than you might think. Over 99.9% of the vase is symmetrical; that is, mathematically exact relative to the reference point. That is… beyond remarkable.
I used to run CNC machines (Dual/single turret lathes w/ multiple tools & 5-axis mills) and we would make parts out mainly out of Ti & SS at the levels of precision that this vase is created with. Some of our parts had geometry that is similar to those handles, but we would make them on cylindrical surfaces, not on a curved spheroid surface or whatever you call the shape of that vase. Cutting away that excess material was relatively hard on the milling tools we would use, and that was for a uniform cutout on a cylindrical shape. Doing that same process on a curved surface would increase the difficulty substantially, most likely require additional passes, and would probably not perfectly blend the surfaces between turning and milling (the tooling marks are different and mills generally don't create surfaces as clean as lathes without much effort). That requires additional polishing steps afterwards. Ti is a 6 and SS is an 8 on the Mohs hardness scale. If we were to somehow mix those two materials to create something similar to the different minerals in the granite, it would be even harder on those tools because the optimal feed rates, turning speeds, etc. are different depending on the material, otherwise the tooling wears/breaks from running at sub-optimal conditions. You are 100% right that holding tolerances on shapes with multiple machining steps was increasingly difficult because the part would have to be set perfectly in the clamp/jaws every single time. Those jaws/clamps were custom machined parts holding tight tolerances, too. If one little thing was off, it could ruin the part (or at least break tolerance). The different states of tool wear would have to be manually accounted for after a few parts because as you take away material, it also wears down the tool. We would constantly have to be measuring several dimensions per part to ensure they were within tolerance. Which usually was .005 in. or .010 in. for non critical dimensions... This vase most likely is not something that has to be as precise as it is, so for it to hold tolerances as tight as it does for almost all features is truly incredible. Idk what they used to make this vase but it most certainly wasn't hand tools.
This is what raises so many questions for me. You wouldn't build tools to produce vases to this precision. You would build tools to do other things that require this level of precision, then once it is available, apply it to things like building decorative objects and architecture. Building vases to this precision probably wasn't the goal, it was the byproduct.
I agree with most of what you say except the hardness of SS. There are many different grades of SS, some soft & some tough, so a blanket statement cannot be said about the general hardness of it without specifying the grade of SS.
Thank you so much for making the .STL file public. I'll be printing this on my 3D printer, as it is likely the closest I'll ever get to a pre-dynastic artifact outside of a museum. Love the content, you're doing a great service to filling in gaps in our historical knowledge.
@@bluedog7222 I should be able to print the full version without any trouble. For those who cant though, you could just print the lower half, then the upper half and use CA glue to bind them. If anyone needs the .STL file bifurcated for smaller printers let me know. I'll try to check back here a few times in case anyone who has a smaller printer is interested.
In San Diego, Balboa Park there's an ancient Egypt exhibit in the museum of man. They have some vases from predynastic Egypt. I was so excited when I saw it because I immediately thought about Ben's video! I thought I would have to travel to Egypt to see one but its on display right here in California! And honestly, seeing one up close really is incredibly awe inspiring! I can't wait for more info on this stuff!!!
No more smoking gun excuses and apologies…. This is Fact now. As a CNC machinist working in aerospace for over 40 years… this is conclusive evidence… beyond question. Thank you Ben… great work… I was with you on that great Egypt trip nov/dec 2020. I saw myself in the background footage of your Cairo museum shots. Great memories. Keep up the great work Ben!
Ex aeronautical design engineer back in the day. I completely agree with you. I have no idea what sort of cutting edge they were using but the evidence of some sort of advanced machining centre is hiding in plain sight. If you were making items by hand, why on earth would you spend many hundreds of hours making it so accurate for NO gain in its function. It's just really sad that more testing is not being allowed, and even more perplexing why ?
@@Goldenproductionsemc They clearly knew something we don't. Who's to say that knowledge wasn't how to make this stone easier to work with? You can believe they had 5+ axis CNC but not that? Point being we have ZERO evidence of how they were made and until we do nothing gets rules out
@@okgroomer1966 are you dense? We know the type of machining requirements needed to maintain tolerances on the type of medium the artifact was crafted from. Therefore it's easily acknowledgeable that the tools we are led to believe that crafted the vase is not a plausible explanation. That's it, end of discussion.
Thank you for bringing to my attention the scale and precision of this stonework. I'd brushed off the Ancient Aliens nonsense. Your work is very good and I am astonished with the accuracy shown in this vase. I'd love to see you take a Hexagon scanner to some of the statues and pillars strewn around the desert.
As a woodturner this vase blows my mind. Even turning this out of wood would be extremely challenging. Especially, the handles which would have to be turned as a bull nose ring and carved away by hand or by CNC. For that precision you would have to use a CNC lathe or some other device that would move the cutting blade as the handle loop approached. Also, hollowing out the vessel requires special tools and gauges to get the wall thickness uniform. Regardless of who made them, it's amazing work and precision. At some point I might try and make one from wood to see how close I can get as far as the shape and the handles. I've tried inlaying stone in my work and unless it's a calcite or soap stone it's had to cut with conventional wood turning tools. Even carbides have a hard time. I would think you'd need diamond cutters. Thanks for posting this remarkable vase.
the differences in size of the pots is also amazing, especially the huge chunk of that massive vase in tunnels you found compared to the smaller ones in the museum. I could only imagine how large they could've made them back whenever. keep up the great work!
Tbh, having someone attempt an actual reproduction of one of these cases would make a tremendous push in the right direction. Far too often does mainstream archeology make claims about how things were done, but then never make the effort to make reproductions
As far as I'm concerned, this is *the* most important work being done on ancient artifacts since Petrie noticed we ought to look at these a little more closely. This will rewrite human history. As an aside, I think the appropriate response to all those tweets is "tell me you know absolutely nothing about metrology/manufacturing/precision/lathe work/etc, without telling me you know nothing" Watching people have strong opinions about things they demonstrate they lack any fundamental knowledge to justify any opinion on is hilarious.
You are most definitely the closest I've ever come to in understanding and probing what actual technology may have been used in the ancient past, more than any other so called expert. I have already accepted that in my life time I may never know who or what ancient culture built the pyramids and other amazing architecture or how they machined these ancient artifacts, but I am truly grateful to people like you who are brave enough and determined enough to seek real truth. Always in aww of your findings and excited for new video's. Thank you again, absolutely love your content!!
@Blue Dog I think the global cataclysm is pretty good explanation why it was lost... if that happened today the only possible way to preserve our tech would be to have an underground bunker where books and data storage would be protected. Most likely the only thing that would be accessible afterwards would be books and gaining access to the bunker would mean the people that know about it would have to survive. Think about it. If 90% or more of the population was killed good luck reconstructing a computer and running windows without a keycode if you're just the average joe. Tech would be very limited and likely controlled. Everything operates from computers now and most would more than likely get fried. We store all our knowledge on the fragile internet which in the event of a catastrophe like the one that occurred would be less available than books.
Couldn't agree more with you blokes... The tolerances used here are jewellers level tech...it's no wonder the generations that came later made clay copies of what must have been found... & venerated. It may explain why they were found next to ea other in Kings & the wealthys tombs.
@@jhtsurvival indeed, just to add, I would be concerned with the mind set of people of to day? lots of guns in the hands of survival victims. friend or foe?
Every time I see Ben on a video, I've come to expect sanity, common sense, open-mindedness and dogged determination to find the truth, without succumbing to circumstantial evidence. Your work is so important to us all. Engineers get the job done.
I have very high respect for you and your work Ben. As a fellow Aussie, you’re really deadset making a difference brother! Keep up the great efforts. Cheers 🍻🇦🇺💙💪
Can we please get a skilled craftsman to video themselves attempting to make similar vases? It is important that those who do not understand how difficult it is, to see it in video format. With talk and walking through the process.
Crazy thing is, we’re mind blown from an fing vase. Thats like 10,000 years later people freaking out because of coffee mugs. Like imagine the technology and society they must’ve had at the time.
What the critics and debunkers are failing to grasp is some of these artifacts are not only impossible to carve by hand but are also impossible to carve by machine. Other than the fact they exist proving someone, somewhere, at some time, did the impossible. But for our advanced civilization it still remains impossible to recreate the most notable pieces. And that's the part they cannot comprehend or accept even when the evidence is in plain view.
Thank you Adam. Ben, I am soo happy to have lived to see this day finally come. I hope it means even half as much as your perseverance has meant to me. Bravo!
I would like to know if a geologist could identify the quarry origins of all theses vases - Study the quarries for evidence of manufacturing determine the routes - to get to Egypt- especially if marine archeologists could then look for shipwrecks that might contain examples.
As you show here, the vases (plural!) are Not one-offs, and there are enough objects to make me think that they were crafted on machines in series, rather than craftsmen scratching & polishing the things for months and years by hand.
Are you able to look closely at the surface (electron scanning microscope) to see if there are lines running horizontal or vertical? Not sure how good the polishing is but may a remnant of direction will help with the mfg process used.
Do you really feel he would have the ability to access an electron scanning microscope? Maybe academia need look at the lie they have covered up since the start.
I bought a brand new 10k scanner for automotive scans (motorsport components), and the tolerances of the vase are beyond what we usually use for suspension and exterior/interior components. You bet your Aussie ass I will download and play around with it. How freaking cool!! Thanks for making this available, mate!
As someone who has no idea of any ancient history of any previous civilizations; I am fascinated by the research of such things; and what I see as commercialized shows and ‘media’ pieces; it’s refreshing to listen to your research and efforts Ben; as you seem quite knowledgeable and straightforward about your research, which is very refreshing from the standard media coverage of all the topics you cover, and the time you invest in sharing the things you discover; thank you sir! Sorry for the long post; I am a hemiplegic stroke survivor ( my mental state has been challenged by my stroke).
Bro/sis: You have a gift! Some that are foolish and lack detailed perspective may call it verbose, drawn-out, wordy... Yet still there's a better group of patient, wiser folk that call it colorful and descriptive, impressive and detailed, and appreciated and admirable. I used to call myself verbose; but I was wrong... It's colorful, attentive... I enjoy painting the scene with the necessary words to convey the importance of what I wish to share. Stay colorful my friend!
As an engineer who has worked with both hand tools as a historical hobby and the most advanced metal and stone cutting tools we have access to in the United States, including military manufacturing. This is remarkable, and plainly impossible to achieve with anything other than some very unique if not modern technology. The refusal to revisit the dating of these objects and continue the research is an embarrassment to science. Not to mention all the people who embarrass themselves by refusing to acknowledge the difference between pottery making and stone carving. Even in modern times we do not manufacture stone vessels like this because even with modern tools it would be incredibly difficult and an expensive and pointless waste of resources. The fact that there are academics who believe stone age people were simply "really good" at this is laughable. I'm a master carpenter and I would struggle to make things like this out of wood with every tool in my workshop. Give me a break.
The methods used were very familiar to a civilisation freshely out of the stone-age. They could tell stones apart and were quite apt to select and used different stones for different tasks. They made a lot of those ancient granite wood axes by the peck and grind method. And they clearly used nothing too precise in their manufacture. Downloaded. So first there are clear signs this is made by hand but quite well. A rotated (lathe) part is easily made to quite a high degree of surface precision. My take on the manufacturing process is: Given that breaking the core is the most risky operation, It is easier to drill the hole first in a reasonably sized stone. Break the core. What you get is a reasonably good hole into which to place a log connected to something akin to the drilling setup. This means you can turn it nice and proper. The turning is similar to the drilling in action and all it requires is some well placed grinding hardness stones and mud. General shape with massive lug handle revolute feature acheived after a lot of work. Cutting the handles and cutting the whole portion to be removed into slices to be chipped off. Now back to turning to smooth out the inter lug area. This time you do not turn all the way but do a 80 degree twist and reverse action. Reasonable shape can be easily acheived, but it will show definite signs of a different surface right next to the lug handles, as the grinding stones would engage that suface only partially. Next a bit or turning in fine abrasive mud for polishing. Drilling the lug holes is not a big issue. And some rough work on the inside, but seems not to be that important overall. Then present it to your local prince for depositing his kidneys and get showered in massive amounts of hard metal cash to feed you stoneworking stone-turning familiy for generations.
Have you hand carved stone before without modern metal tools? My experience comes from north American native stone tool working and the types of objects those stone age people and my ancestors worked with. I would say your explanation and others like it work very well in the theoretical "white room". But core drilling with primitively manufactured copper tubes and sand would work, but the time investiture per piece does not match the relative commonplace finding of tens of thousands of these artifacts across the region. Yes, stone age people were very sophisticated at working with natural materials , but the amount of copper and time required from a master craftsperson in what was still a largely subsistence based society is not practical. Even in cultures with more specified tasks and roles such objects have not been made since these until modern times. I would encourage you to work with stone even using modern tools and trying to accomplish one of these to these specifications in your lifetime. You will quickly realize how this vase has more in common with rocket science than it does with pottery.
@@TwoKnowingRavens Your premise is wrong. Egypt was far from subsistence farming 5500 years ago. They held an excellent position where crops would grow compared to their surrounding, which meant they had enough and more and anyone that would attack them would be mostly starving. They got the Nile flooding's from time to time, when agriculture was important and in-between that not much to do other than build trade and do seafaring. They kind of knew of wheels, definitely knew rollers and the pottery wheel with the core drill setup. They could make complex pottery. They could lift and drag heavy objects by the basic rotational winch, and most certainly had leavers and heavy ropes. They had bronze by 3000BC, and copper before that. Does this even come close to subsistence.
Nobody would argue that the Nile, Indus, Yellow river valleys and others were extremely productive even with ancient agriculture techniques and could have created abundance, but that's just a tiny fraction of the puzzle. Even if I grant that this stonework is all completely explicable with flint and copper tools (which I don't) the question remains as to why the techniques don't crop up in other civilizations at similar technology levels. If this was such a common and relatively easily achievable process then history should be full of stonework vases, plates, cups, etc. They do after all last nearly forever unless forcibly smashed. If this technology was attained by such basic tools combined with some specialized training, then they should be as common as pottery shards. No. I maintain that al evidence points to these being a highly specialized technology by a people who predate most Egyptian civilization and they were either gifted to, found by, or pillaged by the Egyptians who then tried and failed for thousands of years to copy them and never succeeded. Today we could make these to these specifications but only with very specialized lathes, and water cutting tables and c&c machines. Even artisans in our time with far better tools, far more free time, and sophisticated measuring devices don't make objects like this. We must all simply be lazy and uninspired.
@@TwoKnowingRavens Most civilizations went to more productive processes like pottery that could produce more, faster and bigger than any stone vessel. These objects were mostly used for afterlife rituals so they were supposed to be special and expensive and time consuming and so on. My wager is that they were made in Egypt or close by in something akin to a family business specialized in these very objects. They would thus benefit from specialized tools and jigs and knowledge passed down the line. Such families were prized because they made aristocratic luxury goods, and would hide their working method to keep competition out. But they also die out with war or disease if care is not taken to pass the knowledge further.
From modern perspective precision which is not required by a function occurs only in mass production or highly automated process. But, these objects may not be vases but some part of “machinery” which requires such a precision. Given vibration properties of granite it points in direction of a resonator. Essentially a resonator is an interplay of elasticity, mass and shape in response to the flow of energy.
I swear I would have paid more attention in school if we would have been talking about things like this. I'm just a simple mechanic/fabricator/ welder. I respect anyone who can make objects like these (the large granite boxes are amazing, but the smallest objects are just mind blowing). A lot of these artifacts look like if you knocked it over, it's gone. How did they make it?
Why is it so hard to admit they were wrong for some people? How can one ignore this evidence ? I will never understand. Grateful for this kind of research and for making it all free and open source. One day we will find out the truth in this matter thanks to people like this.
Imagine if the experts had to finally admit they were wrong about everything in their field since the beginning and how could they show themselves in public?all funding would be spent on finding answers to the younger up n coming people hence a lot of careers would be damaged making it look like these so called experts knew all along purposely preventing any further investigations into the functioning of the pyramids and all others around the world
Measuring one vase one time doesn't prove anything. That's the whole point that Ben is ignoring. To make any conclusions about "lost technology" there needs to be lots more work before any conclusions can be made, but that isn't stopping Ben from making his claims and stating they are positive proof, instead of simply one "possible" example. Making replicas and measuring them doesn't serve any purpose other than to measure the replica, and would be absolutely useless for anything historical.
The main issue seems to be nobody has a answer to explain otherwise. Just saying they had advanced machines isn't evidence. We still have no clue how they did it
@@nobodyspecial4702 Yeah well they only have one vase. Whats wrong with making assumptions with the facts you have? They even talked about needing to scan more vases since one is not enough.
Ben , I’m begging you , please reach out to a UA-camr called miniminuteman - he’s gaining a lot of traction from his new series debunking Graham Hancock. The way he minimises the great pyramid down to , literally , as he says , that’s it’s just the best way to stack rocks and that it’s a tomb ,despite all of the other amazing evidence surrounding it , is mind blowing , but not in a good way - and the amount of people in his comment section commending him and dismissing any other claims against his narrative , is a sad sight to see. I’d love for you or Randall to offer to debate him just to see how he can get round some of the glaring evidence that the great pyramid is more than just a tomb.
You will never change the view of people who have thier careers or reputations threatened by any evidence that goes againt the grain of their chatechism. Kudos to you and your search for the truth. There is evendice for advanced civilazations in the deep past, Michael Cremo's talks about Forbidden Archaeology are an interesting example of this viewpoint.
Thank you and everybody else for sharing the STL! As someone that loves to learn, especially about engineering and history, this is a godsend... what these represent to human history is absolutely incredible.
If they were making vases with this much precision I wonder what their music sounded like. What kinds of tunings and scales did they use? It seems like they would have been able to make some very precise instruments like harps or flutes. I wonder what approach the predynastic Egyptians had towards making music. All their architecture is obviously so resonate. I wonder if they mostly just used drums and voice like all shamanic cultures use?
Probably made EDM on the same systems they ran their CAD/CAM programs on. No, seriously though I have a feeling they had such a thorough understanding of sound that making music was just the tip of the iceberg.
It's so frustrating to see these experts so sure of the past but refuse something as simple as taking modern measurements, why shouldn't we have every data point available to best understand the past? Especially when there is almost no risk to damage to the artifacts and creating these digital copies enables the artifact to live on forever on the internet. Not to mention the fact that it gives access to the world to study them. It should be a standard practice for all museums to scan and make the scans available for the scientific community to explore. Wouldn't that be the scientific thing to do?
it could have been done on a lathe with something similar to a dividing head, setting a start and stop points, but that still doesn't explain the level of precision or the lack of tooling marks. if the handles are not separate pieces with a nearly perfect interference fit, it doesn't make any sense how they were able to do it. egyptologists are nuts if they think this was done by hand with copper tools and quartz powder. i would force most of them to attend a modern machine shop and try to machine stuff for at least a month before allowing them to open their mouths about egyptian artifacts
Great work, as always. I don't know if this angle has been approached, I don't remember hearing about, but it's something that always struck me about these pre-dynastic vases: They look so much alike that I wonder if the techniques used could even produce something different. It's understandable we are thinking on "lathe" terms, cause that's what we have now, but maybe they did something so specific that wouldn't work for anything else. Yeah, I know this doesn't answer anything, but maybe someone we'll pick this up and carry the thought.
I have also wondered at times it their technology was extremely sophisticated but entirely different than our own. Maybe something to do with frequencies or chemistry where they could temporarily soften and shape things like these very hard stones with ease, or used in conjunction with some sort of precision lathes and jigs.
Just like 80% of all the other comments I’m an engineer and it seems impossible to make these with the methods we have today, let alone using stones, sand, and ever the most skilled pair of hands
They clearly wasn't using their hands lol.... You can use rotational forces, gravity, water or any other natural ways to create things in stone given enough time. The reason no one does or tries it today is we have infintelly cheaper and faster methods to do so. You're not much of an engineer if you think something is impossible just because you can't think outside the box. Yes, we don't know exactly how they did it, but it's certainly not impossible.
@@nihlify you can't be more wrong. Those methods you cite only came into existence within the last few decades at best. You need to account for the MILLENIA that no such objects were produced...anywhere on the planet. You apologists are in a losing battle.
@TopazBadger6550 oh no one is taking the millenia into account haha This video actually shows the dial indicator moving .0035 not .001 so if they want to make up nonsense they could atleast be accurate.
HI Ben, great work in all the details you uncovered! I'm curious if you have investigated the volume metric properties of the vase. Is there any evidence that the internal volume may have been a consideration to its original design intent? Perhaps when filled with a liquid, presumably water, maybe it's precision tolerance in dimensional specs achieves an accurate volume or weight of water. Since typically a vase is used to hold something, most likely fluid, you may find something interesting in determining its precise fluid volume/weight. Good Luck!
Thankful for hardworking enthusiast like you Ben, this is very important history. I still find it mind boggling some egyptologist and historians do everything in their power to stop scientific research into their field
Love your stuff, can't get enough of it ! If I can help, you don't have to say 0.028mm, you can say 28 microns. Meter, centimeter, millimeter, micron (micrometer), nanometer, picometer, femtometer, etc. Doesn't change that it's hard to really imagine something that precise no matter the system you use, I actually prefer that you use a comparison like the human hair :) But I guess it's really all about habit. Thanks for your work !
Absolutely. And there are tens of thousands of similar examples... of objects that don't seem to have a practical or productive purpose. The implications are just mind boggling.
Thank you for providing the stl file! Very excited to print this, its gonna be really cool holding something with such a mystery. The journey of how it got from its mysterious origins to my printer blows my mind!
Here is something that I would REALLY like to know---If we are talking about a truly advanced Society, Culture, "Body" of extreme technology, knowledge, experience, and know~how... Then, my question is: WHY were they using so much of these, admittedly often very very hard (and although I'm no chemist? probably highly chemically~resistant? and yes, obviously very resistant to TIME Itself, etc.etc...) BUT, also potentially very FRAGILE substances? Why aren't we finding large hoards of more EXOTIC substances? Where are the ancient "super~ceramics", "super~plastics", and so~forth? Are WE then, the first technological society to refine (Ok, perhaps just "Large Amounts Of") Aluminum, for instance, which essentially doesn't rust, corrode, or otherwise "degrade", in a relatively static, "desert"~ey environment, like Egypt (As far as I know---Again, not a chemist.) WHY did these Ancients go around, making these complex objects out of substances as hard, heavy, and difficult, as granite, diurite, quartz... These objects have been mentioned, as having been, "Stacked up like Tupperware!" a couple of times. Well, there's a whole series of really good reasons, that we make Tupperware, out of light, flexible, translucent or transparent, durable, standardized, sealable, easily~stackable, PLASTICS! And.....Let me also bring up, the case of the JUST REALLY COMPLETELY BIZARRE "Disc of Sabu" (the famous tri~lobed "alien steering~wheel" object, which was constructed out of SCHIST, of all things... I'm sure you can Google an image of it? If anyone has trouble doing so, I'll be happy to link!) Now, I do wood carving, and I occasionally carve stone. I've also handled plenty of schist, before. In my opinion, it would have probably been significantly easier, to have carved such a thing out of...I don't know?...random TREE BARK. Or, just regular old glass! Glass certainly would have made a LOT more sense, to me anyway! (But, I'm not an Ancient Proto...Proto...Proto? Egyptian, either!). Glass is pretty, and it's very long lasting. It can be made in many different colours, it can be moulded...Which would cut WAY down, on the time and difficulty, AND you could re~use the mould! Or at least, re~use the schematic for the mould---And, I think that this is another important point!: An item like 'The Disc of Sabu' would be EXCRUCIATING to make, just as a "one~off", even with every reasonably priced modern hand~tool, that I can think of (I mean sure, it might be possible to 3D~Printer it, or something like that, IF you could "Print" SCHIST, at the MOLECULAR~LEVEL, good luck! But I'm talking, Storebought, Lowes, Home~Depot, Hand~Tools. Or mayyybe, with the full resources of a small, IF well~appointed, modern Machine~Shoppe. AT MOST.) Why make it out of a substance, like Schist, when there would be basically ZERO chance to ever make a perfect duplicate? I mean... HOW much TIME, and LABOUR, and FOCUS, and DETERMINATION...along with INSANE, obsessive~compulsive, AMBITION, and...sheer luck?...Could these Ancients have possibly had? Basically, to me? It points to one of three (admittedly WAY OUT THERE!) possibilities: Either, 1: They had some way of either manufacturing, moulding in some way, and/or, PERFECTLY repairing, solid granite and other types of stone.
Hey Ben, Thanks for the update and the additional info here. Once again superbly delivered. Something caught my eye at 11:40 - 11:45 ish... The piece of plate being held up is great but are there any suggestions for what made the parallel track marks on the wall behind? What rock is that? Limestone maybe? The marks all seem to crisscross but a couple seem to be perfectly parallel, like tread marks left by the rovers, in the dust on Mars. Queue, x-files theme tune. :D
honestly i think its from a chisel of some sort the distance between each tooth looks similar and many are at different angles so that is what you would expect from a chisel these tunnels have been explored/raided for many years while metal tools have been in existence, imagine some guys in 1900s trying to get their big wooden pully down there to try lift/move something they would have no choice other than to chisel protruding rocks to try get their equipment in i think its quite often you see modern tooling marks within passageways, cool spot tho!
@@SHERMA. I thought about that but the spacing is too consistent along a single track. Even an electric or pneumatic chisel would have a certain variance in the regularity of impact due to the technique and / or fatigue of the person using it. You're right about modern tools overlaying ancient. I'm sure there is plenty of that. Strange tho, that these seem to be in sets of two, parallel to each other and in dead straight lines. Would be keen to see these up close and also to know if this is the only spot they appear. Cheers
I wonder, has anyone from the "mainstream" responded to these findings? I mean, they've been asking for years for a scan of this nature, what's their excuse now? Edit: nevermind, got my answer ten minutes in, and it was very unfortunately exactly what I expected. Looking at it from the perspective of the other side, which in this case means from the perspective of the "mainstream", that of historians, egyptologysts etc.. with an official title coming from an university or an institution with an equally recognized authority, I still don't understand the pushback. If anything they should appreciate the effort and do their best to confirm the findings. It makes no sense whatsoever, from a logic standpoint at least, trying to "debunk" it, particularly since their counter argument always falls into the economic aspect of things, completely disregarding the reason that generated this level of interest from engeneers and other specialists that deal with precision manufacturing. Why aren't museums offering some of their artifacts for scanning instead of acting like pissed ex wives? If they are so sure of being right, why don't act accordingly? What do they have to lose? Yeah, what?...
Ben, have you seen the Al Naslaa rock formation in Saudi Arabia? The huge rock with the perfect cut straight down the center? I'd love to hear your opinion or thoughts on this if you haven't talked about it yet.
Ben, isn't there even one "expert" willing to venture how much precision could be obtained in any time period, even the 80s? Thanks for your work, real head scratcher.
@@the_chomper you can easily create precision (and methods to measure that precision) with sand?? Lol. Do tell. Remember, in order to create precision you have to be able to measure it and repeat it. Are you suggesting they used sand to measure?? 😂😂
@@the_chomper Well then, go ahead and show us. Take a unworked piece of granite and show us how you make a flat surface (to 1/1000") and produce a cylindrical hole in the piece of granite that is 1/100" perpendicular to the flat surface. I'm gonna check in on your channel in the next couple of months! Shouldn't take you to long since this is "easly doable with SAND"
about the vases: I think an early, unknown civilization had tools we can only dream of - some sort of 3D diamond cutter that could easily produce these shapes in large numbers! and not only that: they were also able to transport, join and shape extremely shear blocks of granite or other hard rock! A technology that we cannot even begin to understand! If anyone in this world has an explanation for this, please bring it on! if this someone can also produce something like this, then please show us that!
Thank you for the STL File! I am an avid 3D scanner myself, but I don't have the financial capabilities to travel around the World, so I am constantly looking for 3D Scans of ancient artifacts and architecture to be able to measure and study them in detail. There are still so many things left that need to be 3D scanned so they can be shared with the world! Edit: I have already found an interesting detail about the vase from the stl file.
@@racoon965 there is an horizontal imperfection in the surface, close to one of the handles, showing definite proof of laithe work. Also, the flat face of the handle closest to the imperfection has a slightly diffirent angle to the outer surface of the vase than the other flat faces of the handles. it's barely noticable, but you can see it if you put a box around the handles and compare the angles to each other. To me this looks like whatever tool they used to clear out the area between the handles wasn't set 100% correctly, and so it created the wrong angle on that side and carved slightly too deep into the material. But they corrected the tool on the other sides of the handles.
@@Parabola001 That is not on a lathe, but the very same drill setup used for coring. Just not fully turned but more on the line of 150 degrees turn and rewind repeat. The grinding stone did not fully touch the sides where the lug handles were as it could not. Done by hand, but still a remarkable amount of care and attention to detail. Unlike the inside surface which is kind of ignored. Why would they ignore it if they had the capabilities? Mostly because they did not.
Hey Ben! Thank you so much for providing this kind of analysis! I'd like to mention that there has been one other analysis of this kind that showed similar results in regards to precision: v=HmJerr3-PTE&t=3236s The BAM team went to India and took measurements with 3D laser scanners of the Barabar caves and the results are just equally impressive!
Why not use an electron microscope to image the groove marks left by the machining process, I’d hazard a guess that fragments of the tool used could be found 🤷🏻♂️.
I would love to hear about the internal volume (capacity) of all the pre-dynastic pottery. Maybe we could find a standard unit that was used, and then gauge the precision of volume held without the need to worry about differences in size or shape. This would be an easy experiment to run, depending on the number of items available to properly measure, and I am surprised I haven't heard anything about it yet.
Go Ben! Thanks again to you and all your colleagues and guests for providing undeniable proof, again, of ancient machine technology! Keep on keeping on!
you guys should take everyday modern items that most of us think are “precise” and scan them to put the precision of the vase into perspective.
yes, like a porcelain bowl or something
And what prove the precision of modern mass production,that's the point, this precision is supposedly done without lathe and by hand, with copper tools or stones I believe, did you guys even watch the vids?
@@cgnplays942 my point is most people have no idea what it means when something has a tolerance of 3 thou. but if you show the tolerance of say a billiard ball, something most people think is totally smooth/symmetrical, it puts the insane tolerance of the vase into perspective.
@@iconofsin66 I agree. People have no concept of what 3 thou actually is. I own both a metal lathe and mill and i can't make stuff that preceise out of easy to machine materials like aluminum. I can't imagine how they did it using some of the materials they used.
@@LBCAndrew
Don't say that. Most people commenting here seem to have good knowledge of for example tolerance levels.
As an engineer, I have no difficulty understanding, lol.
Great video Ben. 👍👍 Great analysis of the exterior of the vase (the easy part). Is there a plan to scan the interior of the vase? 1) To establish the symmetry of the interior. 2) To compare the sides to the vertical axis used for the exterior comparison. 3) To map the thickness of the vase and the thickness consistency at different horizontal planes? 🇨🇦
Love it. Great work to all involved 🎉
Fantastic information and analysis. A slight slip noticed in phrasing at 34:00: who's "they?" Don't worry, I already know the answer! Carry on!
Was there an analysis done of the vase’s interior? Thank you for all your work!
Interesting video. I suspect/hypothesize that those high precision vases are possible the remnants and artifacts of Atlantis. Atlantis was supposed to be a very advanced civilization. Interesting part about vases is their handles. They are designed to be handled mechanically instead by hand or robes. What strikes me is the amount of precision for the object that is supposed to be used to handle simple liquids by simple people. Such precision of the vase can be found in aerospace industry and some automotive industry. Therefore, the civilization was so advanced that considered the precision vase making a piece of cake or that this vase was made for precise specs for a specific purpose/function that requires high tolerances.
I've been thinking a bit about the handles. Clearly they're not ergonomically shaped. Was it the only feasible way to create them? Were the vases meant to be hanged? Aesthetic preference maybe? Or was it just the fact that a more ergonomic handle would require a bigger block of original material?
Ben you gotta change your intro. That kick comes in so much louder than the rest of the mix. Love your channel.
The only serious objection to your reasoning I can come up with is this, but it is quite damning. All these extremely precise objects are clearly art. There isn't a single UTILITARIAN precise object or, if there is - its utility cannot be demonstrated beyond reasonable doubt. Why would that be the case? Yes, you could use such vases for storing grain or liquids, however, clay is much lighter, and clay vases much cheaper to make, and, should a clay vessel be accidentally dropped, - no big deal. It can be shaped in a mold or rotated into shape in mere minutes. We have extremely precise art too, however, our precision is merely a side effect, if you will of our advancements in complex technology. Without precision rockets will not achieve a stable orbit, gun barrels will explode, solar panels will not open in the vacuum of space. Now, where are all the utilitarian objects made with such precision? Never mind the question of where are the tools which made these vases, sure I can accept the idea that they were far less numerous and could have been destroyed in a cataclysm of some sort or pulled apart to make crude tools after the demise of Younger Dryas civilisation. However, the utilitarian objects made by such machining would be far more numerous and widespread and surely we would have found some by now, would we not?
There are dozens of these jars in the Petrie museum in London and they will give access to artifacts for research purposes.
I cannot thank you enough- I did not know about the Petrie museum I shall visit very soon.
Sounds promising
I find this measurement effort to be incredibly exciting and important. No, I'm not in the least surprised that you can't get access to the museum's artifacts - and that's shameful.
This ❤
If you think ancient technology is censored and discredited with b.s. wait until you find out about the pharma version. Maybe check Charles Lieber patents to understand the true horror of the situation. Hoping to wake a few more sheeple up
They have provided enough data to shame the experts who refuse to listen...
They don't want to get their stuff stolen and end up in foreign museums like in the past.
They keep these items away from outsiders so people cannot make discoveries without them. Gatekeepers! It’s not in their best interest for new narratives to be made because they’re so heavily invested in a specific direction.
It still bewilders me how people believe these objects are made by old kingdom Ancient Egyptians. They were a Bronze Age people, using copper tools. I can't see how someone who is being honest can come to those conclusions. CLEARLY some type of technology or high knowledge of techniques to perfectly cut out these objects was used to make them.
Many were made during the Neolithic. Which is the stone age friend. Do you know why it's called the stone age? Lithic meaning stone neo meaning new. It's called the stone age because humans began making tools from stone.
@@samkostos4520 but not with that level of precision
@Scott Prather why not? Because high-school drop out youtubers told you so?
No matter…THEY WERE BLACK AFRICAN…. Before any race on the planet there was only ONE!….Kush is 12-15,000 olmec are 15-20,000 years there was a major world event that destroyed these civilizations
As a Master Stonemason, with an MA in history, I am impressed with your methodology and your understanding of the variable hardness of these materials and the problems that this causes when working (shaping) them. This is true even when using machines. However It's worth remembering that these items may be the perfect ones, there may also have been any number of failures that were discarded. Keep up the good work 👍
Also, conversely, the vases we see today could possibly be the ones that were of average precision quality.
There could be granite vases that are even more perfect
Hello Ben, great work on presenting the high tolerances on this vase.
I was a precision tool designer, working in the automotive and aerospace industries for decades, and am now retired.
I have been to Egypt and have seen many examples of precision machining on various artifacts and at many ancient buildings. I agree that none of that work could have been manufactured without powered precision machine tools.
Regarding the machining manufacturing processes used today, CNC 5 Axis machining centers and lathes often require precision custom designed holding tools and fixtures in order to be machined in the first place.
Companies like Boeing, Honeywell aerospace, Northrop Grumman, Lockheed Martin, plus the Big Three automakers have tool design departments that design precision work holding fixtures that are needed to accomplish high precision machining processes.
The knowledge to design those fixtures takes a lifetime of hard won experience, and it requires a lot of training.
Add to all this the fact that the ancients were working with non homogeneous stone materials, and not metals, is even more impressive.
All over Egypt and other ancient sites evidence of high precision stone working is plain to see. Archaeologists are not engineers and should stay in their lane by digging up graves and small artifacts, and leave the inquiry as to how huge structures and high precision artifacts were made to the engineers.
I worked in the same fields, manufacturing and machining.
There is absolutely no way these stone vases etc were manufactured by hand.
Only by highly precise equipment with extreme repeatability.
The tolerances speak volumes !
"custom designed holding tools and fixtures "
Yup, the problem isn't just finding a cutting tool (diamond?) it's the stiffness of the holding fixtures needed for that precision.
next up on the ancient technology mystery: scanning polygonal walls and figuring out how they were made
same here, the accuracy in relation to the reference planes proves that this piece was manufactured in one single process, re-tooling will make this accuracy impossible.
I concur... 38 years in Engineering , cutting heat resistant super alloys. Inconel, Hastelloy, Waspelloy Stellite, Titanium ,Zirconium and many others. I now design and manufacture cutting tools for the aerospace in the military sector for some of the companies you mentioned...
I started out in heavy engineering on valve's. Again we had to design special work holding tooling. IE molded jaws, or machine component profiles that matched the component surface being held.
Valve bodies with 12 inch inlets / outlets were held inside indexing chucks ensuring that multi facets where rotated along the same axis, ensuring centre line compliance...
I've used solid carbid, CBN, PCD.
But to machine granite without deflection of the work piece or ripping out aspects of the material is quite simply baffling to me now especially considering the wall thicknesses we're discussing...
I am truly spellbound...👍
Ben, I think I speak for the vast majority when I say we cannot thank you enough for your continued and rigorous outstanding research into the subject of ancient engineering and precision.
This is by far, in my honest opinion, the most crucial aspect of archaeology to date, and of course, much more study needs to be done, especially with this kind of attitude towards it.
Stay true,
D.
I 3D printed the scan file. Love having a replica of something so old and mysterious.
That's so cool.
says "server not found" for me :(
@@brothermaleuspraetor9505 I don't see a link, maybe a copyright problem - on a thousands of years old vase.
Well, the copyright is in the work to scan it, not in the old object. But there should be many free ancient vases, amphoras and so on available on platforms like thingiverse. Maybe you find things that you really like.
And it should be possible to make a 3D object just by looking at it, that closely resembles it, that looks almost like it.
Was it printed with the same precision? 😁
What size did you scale it to mate?
This is excellent. You are doing a serious job for humanity, a dreams work for many. Zahi and crew would scoff over this and prevent it with threats of banishment so quickly. This is a huge development. HARD DATA, makes these become objective truths, in which I'd love to hear arguments for this being handmade at this point.
I remember laughing when seeing the faces Hawass made in the Muon discovery documentary. The sooner that guy goes away, the better.
You cannot argue with real science. one word.... Precision
Sa I needs to hurry up and take his place in the duat and amongst the other thousand points of light, should he be so lucky to have a place saved for him….
@@bluedog7222 yep. If you understand precision, you understand why this is unequivocal proof of an advanced civilization predating modern humanity. If you don't understand precision, you probably ought not have opinions on these sorts of things until you fix that knowledge deficiency.
It's why so many engineers, masons, machinists (or any other trade dealing in tight tolerances), metrologists, etc, just laugh when presented with the theory that these were hand carved: we have the knowledge to immediately see that as beyond farcical.
Whats mind blowing is I dont know if we could do this today. I mean, I feel pretty confident we could make similarly precise things for cheap enough to make this many, out of steel, but of course that wouldn't last a thousand years, let alone ten thousand. But I don't know how you'd set up a CNC mill with a rotary table that could vary feeds and speed enough not to fracture the vessel when cutting igneous stone... It would have to involve a machine learning program using some type of scanning device to scan just ahead of the cutter path, fast enough to run the material calculations and increase/decrease speed and feed rates before it hit the change in media density/hardness. And there would be a *lot* of mistakes.
@@thepewplace1370 Indeed, The biggest problem with academia is what all this implies...🤔
Silly question. Are the holes in the handles straight or, do they follow the curve of the vase? Drilling curved holes would be an interesting trick.
Silly answer ..
Ofcourse they're straight, do you think a sand worm (granite worm) ate its way through?
Better answer ..
The holes are tangent to the vertical axis at centre point of drilled (? Not carved ) holes and horizantal to the top within a few hair thickness.
If curved, i think taking data points inside the tube hole would be extremely difficult and the lads would have made a point about it. So, are they curved? Highly unlikely from discussion but cannot give definitive No. Video footage never good enough to say 100%, ever!
Great question though.
@@nawhedawhe6905 So what you are saying is that, if the holes are curved, even with current technology, we would have difficulty in *measuring* it, let alone replicating it.
But just to confirm whether it is curved or straight, maybe a soft clay-like mold can be inserted to see the shape it produces?
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
Straight. But they are so out of line that they fail at precision twice. They are visibly not paralell something aking to 5 degrees angle. One is going upwards while one is mostly in the handle direction.
@@andrewholdaway813 thank you for reply. It is a rather curious anomaly. I wonder if there are vases with handles but, without holes?
I somehow discovered you and Jimmy at the same time, both under 100k subs, before Grahams first visit to JRE. I knew you will join forces, you are the new science and archeology needed for the free world !
You boys are pioneers in this work!!!! No one, besides the people that made them in the first place, has ever done this meticulous examination of these artifacts!! In my opinion you all deserve a Pulitzer for this groundbreaking work!!!!
Cheers
I Agree, pioneers of our times🤔
@@bluedog7222 didn't you get the memo? The word "literally" now means "figuratively", ie. "the exact opposite of literally"
yessirrrrrr
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
Ben & Co. are pivotal in changing the actual understanding of our history. Rock stars in more ways than one.
Mike B. Los Angeles California
Maybe this has been answered or addressed but has the wall thickness of the vase been measured in enough points to see how well the inside of the vase was milled as well?
Ive been fascinated by Egypt since age 12, nearly 60 years ago, winning a school prize that allowed me to chose a book, and I chose a book of beautiful pictures of Egyptian artifacts and statues. Ben, you've managed to make me feel so positive about the future of research and discovery again. Thank you. Finally modern technology has advanced enough to accurately analyse these treasures.
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
Well said LAT
Either the Smithsonian or the Vatican has these ancient tools in their possession, or both. These ancient tools are in a wooden crate somewhere underneath other wood crates filled with ancient knowledge.
@@calikid2139 "TOP......MEN....."
Which is funny in the movie..cuz its obvious that Indiana Jones WAS the 'Top Man"...
@@projektkobra2247 I thought "top men" meant MIB...?
18:37 I'd really like to hear Yousf's opinion on the stones at Stonehenge.
As a mechanical engineer of over 10 years, I can confidently say that anyone who thinks these vases we made by hand is completely ignorant.
I am retired tool and die maker with a lifetime of experience in precision mashing. Up to the 1980 or there about we all ways remove material by using a harder tool ( cutter) to cut the softer material , using manually operated lathes or milling machines and later CNC controlled machines. But then a new technology came along that didn’t require a cutter to remove material the material was removed not by cutting action but by erosion. And by that I mean Spark erosion, wire erosion , laser machining and so on. This technology give us the freedom to machine very complicated shapes with ease.
I feel that this article especially the protrusions will be very difficult if not impossible to do with cutting action. This vase is not part of a machine that has to be so accurate. Is made so accurate because the technology that existed at the time of manufacturing enables the mass production of this vases, the accuracy of the article is a reflection of the program that was used, perhaps to the third decimal point if you want, makes no difference in the speed of manufacturing. I believe that this article and many others with extremely thin wall sections and complicated shapes were made by a technology that we have yet to discover.
you are so on point.
As a CNC machinist who holds these kinds of tolerances...this is truly amazing to see
I used to work on CNC lathes many years ago. 😀. Mazak machines. 🙂.
yeah for us these days, it's easy, but considering they're over 10,000 years old... amazing.
@@myview1875 I remember the first big Mazak unit I got to set up, it was quite a sight coming from smaller HAAS gear. Crazy to think the ancients seem to have had access to such precision & power.
Either the Smithsonian or the Vatican has these ancient tools in their possession, or both. These ancient tools are in a wooden crate somewhere underneath other wood crates filled with ancient knowledge.
@@calikid2139 certainly no current way to disprove that at least the knowledge relating to such things may be there. Wonder if people will ever get fed up and forcibly open the archives.
As an aeronautical engineer with an A&P license these tolerances are absolutely astounding. I’ve been waiting for actual tangible evidence via NDT. Good on y’all!
Just to add, it questions our historical history.
Yeah, well, keep waiting. The tangible evidence of high technology, every last particle of it, was packed up and carried back to the Planet Xescam just after the YD event.
what would be your best guess - machining from the pre flood era?
@@MrCarpediem6 Nope, God just willed them into existence.
Lol 😅
I am a granite installer and fabricator, I have been doing it for 16 years now and I would definitely love to try replicating this vase, problem is the inside, even using our water jet it would not contour along the vertical wall, also I think I can get the outside wall down to 1/16 of an inch but the edges were the handle meets would not be the difficult part, cnc machine can cut to specs and have my pro polisher handle it as we check tolerance. It's possible but would require machines that cost 500k. We work with 1 3/16 thick stone or 3 cm, it would be interesting to see if the vases in museums will have some sort of resin for micro blowouts that happen when working with granite. From the vases I can tell they used dark colored granite which is usually more dense and strong but also creates the problem of harder scribing. Also granite is known to be pourus or micro voids, how did they get the vase to be smooth with no pours. Also in our machines we do not have to be careful with granite that has other forms of stone inside of it, water is our best friend when cutting multiple materials in granite
they probably used some sort of grinding wheels and a jig
You have just shoved the precision/technology problem down the road.
This video should serve as proof enough that we don’t know enough about our ancient past, and further analysis in museums must be done.
"But muh provenance" - meanwhile refusing to provide their "real" vases for scanning.
😂 you clown. No one refused to let their vases be scanned. That vase came from a gift shop. Prove me wrong.
As a barista and professional coffee consumer, I can confirm that this jar is perfect for storing liquids of all sorts.❤
🤣🤣🤣
You can even put your weed in there
@@johndemtopics1377 how do you know? What's your profession? How many years of experience do you have?
@@johndemtopics1377 Individual precision turned pre-rolled
U just serve coffee, calling urself a barmaid in another language doesnt elevate the actual job. It just makes others laugh at you because ur such a wannabe. 20 years ago people served coffee aswell, no one called themselves this bullshit 'barista'. Ridiculous. I bet ur the type of person who sits at Starbucks with their laptop 😂😂😂
The content is exemplary and your presentation style is like no other. Truly a modern academic in full bloom! Thank You Ben for sharing your knowledge and time. Absolutely aWeSoMe ❣️
To anyone in or around London, go to the Petrie museum and see this for yourself - and the drill core made of granite. It’s surreal to be centimetres away from items at least 12,500 years old crafted using powerful ancient technology (albeit through a glass😅).
Thank you, Ben, for the inspiration / information to do so!
“Powerful ancient technology”…bow drills aren’t that amazing😂😂
@@Man_fay_the_Bru I went to the museum 3 days ago now, there are countless artefacts made of clay using primitive technology because they are trying to imitate the vases thousands of years older. As I said, they are made of granite, diorite and quartz however the most impressive (at the Cairo museum) made from corundum.
The striations/lines/thread marks left behind by the tool to build the vases and extract the drill cores are clearly all done in one motion without interruption. You need at least diamond to cut through these materials as anything else is too weak and the tool has to be fixed in place.
I’ve watched 100s of hours of videos on this topic including plenty on ‘rocks’ (not cos I enjoy it) to know this is real - and saw it in person. I would encourage you to do the same if you genuinely care.
Love for the reply though ❤️
@@Man_fay_the_Bru blinkered denial is quite astounding though
@@craigparker4108 if the technology existed to build these, it could be no less as it would’ve been destroyed by the younger dryas cataclysm. It’s actually what is being claimed as the ‘missing chapter in human history’: a pre-dynastic (Egyptian) civilisation. I would recommend watching Graham Hancock’s new Netflix documentary ‘Ancient Apocalypse’, it has irrefutable evidence for this claim. I hope this helps, much love for the reply. ❤️
@@AA11AA11AA Yeah have seen all Graham's work, don't know what i was thinking. Probably just younger dryas 11.6 to 11.8 k ago so older than that maybe. Was really tired & confused & will delete that post.
CNC machinist and programmer here, this stuff is mind boggling! Thanks for your work Ben and team. More of this please!
These vases were not milled, for sure. Most probably, a combination of waterjet cutting, sandblasting and laser ablation controlled by a computer and laser sensors was used.
@@tedantares2751😂 Probably it is a fake from a gift shop
@@JoshJones-xd5mw The cost of manufacturing such a vase using the latest technology would be several thousand US dollars, so I doubt that it would be sold in a gift shop for $50.
@@tedantares2751 who said anything about $50? We’re not talking about your sister’s poon. Your strawman game is weak, bruh
Wow!! Since I found your videos over a year ago, and you introduced me to the machining and precision in ancient Egypt, I'm happy to say each new video you release still wows me. This vase and the story it tells really is a massive tribute to our ancestors and their capabilities. I look forward to learning more about them. Thank you, and all involved ☺️
This comment should be pinned as I believe the majority of this channels viewer feel the same
ancestors and their capabilities, it shows that we've had to restart.
@@bluedog7222 yes a few times I think
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
I'm not buying Ben's narrative. These things have been replicated by modern archeologists using wood and copper. Please ask Ben to show one sliver of this pre-Dynastic technology. There isn't a shred.
Thanks as always for your work Ben.
mechanical engineer here. this blows my fucking mind, thank you so much for doing this
They have zero proof the vase is ancient. Nobody knows where it came from...
@@insolitmag5824 That's not even the point. Focus on the craftsmanship and polish. We could NOT do that today. Ask the engineer above
@@RogueReplicant How do you know he is an engineer? LOL
@@insolitmag5824 Test him by asking him this question. If he answers like you, we will know he is not an engineer.
These could have been made with a template on a lathe if they were soft like clay during manufacturing. The space between the handles could have also been cleanned up with a template after being rough-cut.
If they were made while in a hardened state, the cutter could have or would have been moving slowly, especially between the handles. They could have used a casing around it to support the pressure on the walls while cutting out the inside of the wall. Some kind of vibration could have been implemented as well to help move the cutter through the substance. ...imo as a machinist who has also drilled marble.
Can someone please machine a replica of the vase, to the same tolerances, with an easy medium ie Aluminium and document the process, so we can all see how incredibly difficult this would be when multiplied by the hardness of Granite . Love your work Ben.
Are you paying?
@@jamesmcguire6706 u aren’t witty
@InspectorWet Coming from wanna pimp buffoon wearing a clown suit 🤣
@Gamer 247 keep playing you video games.
@InspectorWet In a snow covered straw field with water jugs wearing a Halloween costume. Weird ass dude
Surely there must exist at least a handful of archelogists / egyptologists that are open to making these precises measurements of public artifacts. We've got to find them !
No, if they do, the moffia of Egyptian forced thought will have them driven out. They do not want the truth. They think it takes away from Egyptian history. NOT ONE TOOL has been found that could do this! I saw one of these scientest say "We know how it was made" IS A LIE! If stone age people could make it then have these scientes make it!
@@glenblanton250 It's more of a cartel, in the economical sense, than a mafia I believe.
@trumpisthemessiah7017 Nah the resolution is absolutely fine and the tools they are using are space industry grade scanners..
They have to stay in their lane. Their tenures and funding depend on them "toeing the party line" which seems to be, either ignore, avoid, deny, that there has been a cover up of information. I think "they" know that the past was not backward but far more knowledgeable than they want us to believe.
Very good podcast. I spent a year in Cairo in 1988 on assignment at the US Embassy Cairo which as you probably already know The Cairo Museum is only a few hundred yards up the street from the embassy. And I visited the museum often. I have been in the EE field and have another degree in Computer Science since 1980 and have been involved with the family engineering and construction business since 1962. I had the opportunity at the end of my tour to spend 3-1/2 weeks in Luxor/Karnak/Valley of the Kings and was not near enough time. While in Cairo my status with the embassy I had access to some of the back areas/rooms/staging areas and sometimes after hours of the Cairo Museum. I handled and touched a lot of items and not just the type of jars and plates you illustrated in your video podcast. There is no doubt for decades it has puzzled me for years how this type of design and shaping of stone with such precision. By the time I left Cairo in January 1989, I was convinced these items were molded. I even looked for seams from a mold but absolutely no hint of a seam. Some of the larger items had scaffolding built around them as they were preparing for display on the museum floor. It has kept me in bewilderment since then. But then you take a close examination at statues made of Schist stone, especially one of the Menkaure Triads. You leave with the thought this is impossible with Bronze age instruments and technology. At times I used magnifying glasses to examine the details [especially around the ears, eyes, nose and mouth] it is clean and precise and the edges are crisp and not one tool mark or scratch I could detect.
I do lapidary work regularly and we carve some pretty small objects with extremely sharp corners and details with relief, all polished to finish, removing any evidence of tool marks from shaping.
Problem is, a dental tool called a micromotor, a kind of brushless high rpm flex shaft style rotary tool, is how we achieve this. Extremely high precision. Combined with water, and various Diamond coated bits, it’s an hour or two worth of work depending on the item.
Afterwards we use special polishing bits of similar shapes and sizes, also with water, to scrub/erase the abrasive marks from shaping. Typically we use nova bits for our projects to achieve high quality polish/finished on hard stones. These are completely synthetic resin and Diamond proprietary bits manufactured by an Australian company. This also takes about an hour or two. For a palm sized object.
While these techniques achieve astonishing detail and polish, there’s a reason we only use them on “free-handed” style sculptures. As this kind of manufacturing process is only effect on asymmetrical designs.
We have precision cabbing wheels and lapidary wheels as well, even rock saws, nothing even close to the wet lathe like a countertop place would have. and even with pro setups in state of the art facilities, they aren’t machining hard stone vases like this at 1/1000th inch accuracy. Let alone 6,000 years ago.
This precision matches today’s pro standards; quiet literally nearly perfect, so close in fact that its closer to “perfect” than you might think. Over 99.9% of the vase is symmetrical; that is, mathematically exact relative to the reference point.
That is… beyond remarkable.
I used to run CNC machines (Dual/single turret lathes w/ multiple tools & 5-axis mills) and we would make parts out mainly out of Ti & SS at the levels of precision that this vase is created with. Some of our parts had geometry that is similar to those handles, but we would make them on cylindrical surfaces, not on a curved spheroid surface or whatever you call the shape of that vase. Cutting away that excess material was relatively hard on the milling tools we would use, and that was for a uniform cutout on a cylindrical shape. Doing that same process on a curved surface would increase the difficulty substantially, most likely require additional passes, and would probably not perfectly blend the surfaces between turning and milling (the tooling marks are different and mills generally don't create surfaces as clean as lathes without much effort). That requires additional polishing steps afterwards.
Ti is a 6 and SS is an 8 on the Mohs hardness scale. If we were to somehow mix those two materials to create something similar to the different minerals in the granite, it would be even harder on those tools because the optimal feed rates, turning speeds, etc. are different depending on the material, otherwise the tooling wears/breaks from running at sub-optimal conditions.
You are 100% right that holding tolerances on shapes with multiple machining steps was increasingly difficult because the part would have to be set perfectly in the clamp/jaws every single time. Those jaws/clamps were custom machined parts holding tight tolerances, too. If one little thing was off, it could ruin the part (or at least break tolerance). The different states of tool wear would have to be manually accounted for after a few parts because as you take away material, it also wears down the tool. We would constantly have to be measuring several dimensions per part to ensure they were within tolerance. Which usually was .005 in. or .010 in. for non critical dimensions... This vase most likely is not something that has to be as precise as it is, so for it to hold tolerances as tight as it does for almost all features is truly incredible.
Idk what they used to make this vase but it most certainly wasn't hand tools.
This is what raises so many questions for me.
You wouldn't build tools to produce vases to this precision. You would build tools to do other things that require this level of precision, then once it is available, apply it to things like building decorative objects and architecture.
Building vases to this precision probably wasn't the goal, it was the byproduct.
I am a newly retired manual and CNC proto type machinist from DOD / Aerospace and agree with everything you wrote out so well. This boggles my mind.
I agree with most of what you say except the hardness of SS. There are many different grades of SS, some soft & some tough, so a blanket statement cannot be said about the general hardness of it without specifying the grade of SS.
Keep it up, man! You are waking people up and I can't be more proud of your efforts in this field.
Thank you so much for making the .STL file public. I'll be printing this on my 3D printer, as it is likely the closest I'll ever get to a pre-dynastic artifact outside of a museum. Love the content, you're doing a great service to filling in gaps in our historical knowledge.
Nice idea a scaled down version.
@@bluedog7222 I should be able to print the full version without any trouble. For those who cant though, you could just print the lower half, then the upper half and use CA glue to bind them. If anyone needs the .STL file bifurcated for smaller printers let me know. I'll try to check back here a few times in case anyone who has a smaller printer is interested.
@@RoarkLaughed 👍
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
That's how ancients made it. With ancient 3 d printer
That STL file looks like a "perfect" model I would have made IN BLENDER.
Astonishing levels of machining.
In San Diego, Balboa Park there's an ancient Egypt exhibit in the museum of man. They have some vases from predynastic Egypt. I was so excited when I saw it because I immediately thought about Ben's video! I thought I would have to travel to Egypt to see one but its on display right here in California! And honestly, seeing one up close really is incredibly awe inspiring! I can't wait for more info on this stuff!!!
No more smoking gun excuses and apologies…. This is Fact now. As a CNC machinist working in aerospace for over 40 years… this is conclusive evidence… beyond question.
Thank you Ben… great work… I was with you on that great Egypt trip nov/dec 2020. I saw myself in the background footage of your Cairo museum shots. Great memories. Keep up the great work Ben!
Evidence of what? We know they're accurate but that's it. We are no closer to the how though and I'm not sure we ever will be.
Ex aeronautical design engineer back in the day. I completely agree with you. I have no idea what sort of cutting edge they were using but the evidence of some sort of advanced machining centre is hiding in plain sight. If you were making items by hand, why on earth would you spend many hundreds of hours making it so accurate for NO gain in its function.
It's just really sad that more testing is not being allowed, and even more perplexing why ?
@@okgroomer1966 the evidence that they were NOT made with copper chisels and pounding stones
@@Goldenproductionsemc They clearly knew something we don't. Who's to say that knowledge wasn't how to make this stone easier to work with? You can believe they had 5+ axis CNC but not that? Point being we have ZERO evidence of how they were made and until we do nothing gets rules out
@@okgroomer1966 are you dense? We know the type of machining requirements needed to maintain tolerances on the type of medium the artifact was crafted from. Therefore it's easily acknowledgeable that the tools we are led to believe that crafted the vase is not a plausible explanation. That's it, end of discussion.
Thank you for bringing to my attention the scale and precision of this stonework. I'd brushed off the Ancient Aliens nonsense. Your work is very good and I am astonished with the accuracy shown in this vase. I'd love to see you take a Hexagon scanner to some of the statues and pillars strewn around the desert.
As a woodturner this vase blows my mind. Even turning this out of wood would be extremely challenging. Especially, the handles which would have to be turned as a bull nose ring and carved away by hand or by CNC. For that precision you would have to use a CNC lathe or some other device that would move the cutting blade as the handle loop approached. Also, hollowing out the vessel requires special tools and gauges to get the wall thickness uniform. Regardless of who made them, it's amazing work and precision. At some point I might try and make one from wood to see how close I can get as far as the shape and the handles. I've tried inlaying stone in my work and unless it's a calcite or soap stone it's had to cut with conventional wood turning tools. Even carbides have a hard time. I would think you'd need diamond cutters. Thanks for posting this remarkable vase.
I'm also a woodworker with turning experience, and agree that a regular lathe would only go so far in producing this piece, even out of wood.
the differences in size of the pots is also amazing, especially the huge chunk of that massive vase in tunnels you found compared to the smaller ones in the museum. I could only imagine how large they could've made them back whenever. keep up the great work!
Tbh, having someone attempt an actual reproduction of one of these cases would make a tremendous push in the right direction. Far too often does mainstream archeology make claims about how things were done, but then never make the effort to make reproductions
Or half assed efforts that are far from conclussive and arr hailed as conclussive and definitive proof.
Or half assed efforts that are far from conclussive and arr hailed as conclussive and definitive proof.
Or half assed efforts that are far from conclussive and arr hailed as conclussive and definitive proof.
Or half assed efforts that are far from conclussive and arr hailed as conclussive and definitive proof.
Or half assed efforts that are far from conclussive and arr hailed as conclussive and definitive proof.
Thanks for all your hard work! I really appreciate this information.
Thank you so much! That's very generous - will definitely credit you in the next video! Cheers!
@@UnchartedX You're welcome, man. I absolutely love what you're doing and hope I can join you on a tour someday.
Thanks, I’m just a viewer of the channel but your donation put a smile on my face.
@@mandan8945 I back up my thoughts with action.
$100 for bogus fake information, can’t get more gullible than that really
As far as I'm concerned, this is *the* most important work being done on ancient artifacts since Petrie noticed we ought to look at these a little more closely. This will rewrite human history.
As an aside, I think the appropriate response to all those tweets is "tell me you know absolutely nothing about metrology/manufacturing/precision/lathe work/etc, without telling me you know nothing"
Watching people have strong opinions about things they demonstrate they lack any fundamental knowledge to justify any opinion on is hilarious.
You are most definitely the closest I've ever come to in understanding and probing what actual technology may have been used in the ancient past, more than any other so called expert. I have already accepted that in my life time I may never know who or what ancient culture built the pyramids and other amazing architecture or how they machined these ancient artifacts, but I am truly grateful to people like you who are brave enough and determined enough to seek real truth. Always in aww of your findings and excited for new video's.
Thank you again, absolutely love your content!!
The science seems to point to our ancestors and having hi-tech capabilities. The question is how far do we go back? and why was it lost?
@Blue Dog I think the global cataclysm is pretty good explanation why it was lost... if that happened today the only possible way to preserve our tech would be to have an underground bunker where books and data storage would be protected. Most likely the only thing that would be accessible afterwards would be books and gaining access to the bunker would mean the people that know about it would have to survive. Think about it. If 90% or more of the population was killed good luck reconstructing a computer and running windows without a keycode if you're just the average joe. Tech would be very limited and likely controlled. Everything operates from computers now and most would more than likely get fried. We store all our knowledge on the fragile internet which in the event of a catastrophe like the one that occurred would be less available than books.
Couldn't agree more with you blokes...
The tolerances used here are jewellers level tech...it's no wonder the generations that came later made clay copies of what must have been found... & venerated.
It may explain why they were found next to ea other in Kings & the wealthys tombs.
closest to what? this easily proves there was better technology than thought, but we have zero answers to what it was.
@@jhtsurvival indeed, just to add, I would be concerned with the mind set of people of to day? lots of guns in the hands of survival victims. friend or foe?
Every time I see Ben on a video, I've come to expect sanity, common sense, open-mindedness and dogged determination to find the truth, without succumbing to circumstantial evidence. Your work is so important to us all. Engineers get the job done.
You mean sanity as in the moon is a construction? Ben is here to sucker you for views on 'exciting' topics.
I have very high respect for you and your work Ben. As a fellow Aussie, you’re really deadset making a difference brother! Keep up the great efforts.
Cheers 🍻🇦🇺💙💪
Can we please get a skilled craftsman to video themselves attempting to make similar vases? It is important that those who do not understand how difficult it is, to see it in video format. With talk and walking through the process.
Great suggestion.
Crazy thing is, we’re mind blown from an fing vase. Thats like 10,000 years later people freaking out because of coffee mugs. Like imagine the technology and society they must’ve had at the time.
What the critics and debunkers are failing to grasp is some of these artifacts are not only impossible to carve by hand but are also impossible to carve by machine. Other than the fact they exist proving someone, somewhere, at some time, did the impossible. But for our advanced civilization it still remains impossible to recreate the most notable pieces. And that's the part they cannot comprehend or accept even when the evidence is in plain view.
Thank you Adam. Ben, I am soo happy to have lived to see this day finally come. I hope it means even half as much as your perseverance has meant to me. Bravo!
Once science proves beyond doubt that hi-tech was used, 🥴a big can of worms will be opened.
I would like to know if a geologist could identify the quarry origins of all theses vases -
Study the quarries for evidence of manufacturing
determine the routes - to get to Egypt-
especially if marine archeologists could then look for shipwrecks that might contain examples.
As you show here, the vases (plural!) are Not one-offs, and there are enough objects to make me think that they were crafted on machines in series, rather than craftsmen scratching & polishing the things for months and years by hand.
Claiming that tests of one vase prove the rest are the same is ignoring that it is actually, a one-off result.
Are you able to look closely at the surface (electron scanning microscope) to see if there are lines running horizontal or vertical? Not sure how good the polishing is but may a remnant of direction will help with the mfg process used.
Second this!
Do you really feel he would have the ability to access an electron scanning microscope? Maybe academia need look at the lie they have covered up since the start.
I bought a brand new 10k scanner for automotive scans (motorsport components), and the tolerances of the vase are beyond what we usually use for suspension and exterior/interior components. You bet your Aussie ass I will download and play around with it. How freaking cool!! Thanks for making this available, mate!
You guys need to step up your quality lol
Sugon Deez
@@cgnplays942 lmao imagine making a car with the precision of Egyptian Engineering. It’ll last thousands of years
As someone who has no idea of any ancient history of any previous civilizations; I am fascinated by the research of such things; and what I see as commercialized shows and ‘media’ pieces; it’s refreshing to listen to your research and efforts Ben; as you seem quite knowledgeable and straightforward about your research, which is very refreshing from the standard media coverage of all the topics you cover, and the time you invest in sharing the things you discover; thank you sir! Sorry for the long post; I am a hemiplegic stroke survivor ( my mental state has been challenged by my stroke).
You are doing just fine. No need to apologize 🙂 Blessings my friend ❤️
@@MeRia035 Thank you!
Bro/sis: You have a gift! Some that are foolish and lack detailed perspective may call it verbose, drawn-out, wordy... Yet still there's a better group of patient, wiser folk that call it colorful and descriptive, impressive and detailed, and appreciated and admirable. I used to call myself verbose; but I was wrong... It's colorful, attentive... I enjoy painting the scene with the necessary words to convey the importance of what I wish to share.
Stay colorful my friend!
@@beatgrinder Thank you so much! Your words are very kind and appreciated!👍🏻
@@MeRia035 Nice and Kind Response !!! God Bless !!!
As an engineer who has worked with both hand tools as a historical hobby and the most advanced metal and stone cutting tools we have access to in the United States, including military manufacturing. This is remarkable, and plainly impossible to achieve with anything other than some very unique if not modern technology. The refusal to revisit the dating of these objects and continue the research is an embarrassment to science. Not to mention all the people who embarrass themselves by refusing to acknowledge the difference between pottery making and stone carving. Even in modern times we do not manufacture stone vessels like this because even with modern tools it would be incredibly difficult and an expensive and pointless waste of resources. The fact that there are academics who believe stone age people were simply "really good" at this is laughable. I'm a master carpenter and I would struggle to make things like this out of wood with every tool in my workshop. Give me a break.
The methods used were very familiar to a civilisation freshely out of the stone-age. They could tell stones apart and were quite apt to select and used different stones for different tasks. They made a lot of those ancient granite wood axes by the peck and grind method. And they clearly used nothing too precise in their manufacture.
Downloaded. So first there are clear signs this is made by hand but quite well.
A rotated (lathe) part is easily made to quite a high degree of surface precision.
My take on the manufacturing process is:
Given that breaking the core is the most risky operation, It is easier to drill the hole first in a reasonably sized stone. Break the core. What you get is a reasonably good hole into which to place a log connected to something akin to the drilling setup. This means you can turn it nice and proper.
The turning is similar to the drilling in action and all it requires is some well placed grinding hardness stones and mud.
General shape with massive lug handle revolute feature acheived after a lot of work.
Cutting the handles and cutting the whole portion to be removed into slices to be chipped off.
Now back to turning to smooth out the inter lug area. This time you do not turn all the way but do a 80 degree twist and reverse action.
Reasonable shape can be easily acheived, but it will show definite signs of a different surface right next to the lug handles, as the grinding stones would engage that suface only partially.
Next a bit or turning in fine abrasive mud for polishing. Drilling the lug holes is not a big issue. And some rough work on the inside, but seems not to be that important overall.
Then present it to your local prince for depositing his kidneys and get showered in massive amounts of hard metal cash to feed you stoneworking stone-turning familiy for generations.
Have you hand carved stone before without modern metal tools? My experience comes from north American native stone tool working and the types of objects those stone age people and my ancestors worked with.
I would say your explanation and others like it work very well in the theoretical "white room". But core drilling with primitively manufactured copper tubes and sand would work, but the time investiture per piece does not match the relative commonplace finding of tens of thousands of these artifacts across the region.
Yes, stone age people were very sophisticated at working with natural materials , but the amount of copper and time required from a master craftsperson in what was still a largely subsistence based society is not practical.
Even in cultures with more specified tasks and roles such objects have not been made since these until modern times.
I would encourage you to work with stone even using modern tools and trying to accomplish one of these to these specifications in your lifetime. You will quickly realize how this vase has more in common with rocket science than it does with pottery.
@@TwoKnowingRavens Your premise is wrong.
Egypt was far from subsistence farming 5500 years ago. They held an excellent position where crops would grow compared to their surrounding, which meant they had enough and more and anyone that would attack them would be mostly starving.
They got the Nile flooding's from time to time, when agriculture was important and in-between that not much to do other than build trade and do seafaring.
They kind of knew of wheels, definitely knew rollers and the pottery wheel with the core drill setup.
They could make complex pottery.
They could lift and drag heavy objects by the basic rotational winch, and most certainly had leavers and heavy ropes.
They had bronze by 3000BC, and copper before that.
Does this even come close to subsistence.
Nobody would argue that the Nile, Indus, Yellow river valleys and others were extremely productive even with ancient agriculture techniques and could have created abundance, but that's just a tiny fraction of the puzzle.
Even if I grant that this stonework is all completely explicable with flint and copper tools (which I don't) the question remains as to why the techniques don't crop up in other civilizations at similar technology levels.
If this was such a common and relatively easily achievable process then history should be full of stonework vases, plates, cups, etc. They do after all last nearly forever unless forcibly smashed. If this technology was attained by such basic tools combined with some specialized training, then they should be as common as pottery shards.
No. I maintain that al evidence points to these being a highly specialized technology by a people who predate most Egyptian civilization and they were either gifted to, found by, or pillaged by the Egyptians who then tried and failed for thousands of years to copy them and never succeeded.
Today we could make these to these specifications but only with very specialized lathes, and water cutting tables and c&c machines.
Even artisans in our time with far better tools, far more free time, and sophisticated measuring devices don't make objects like this. We must all simply be lazy and uninspired.
@@TwoKnowingRavens Most civilizations went to more productive processes like pottery that could produce more, faster and bigger than any stone vessel.
These objects were mostly used for afterlife rituals so they were supposed to be special and expensive and time consuming and so on.
My wager is that they were made in Egypt or close by in something akin to a family business specialized in these very objects. They would thus benefit from specialized tools and jigs and knowledge passed down the line.
Such families were prized because they made aristocratic luxury goods, and would hide their working method to keep competition out.
But they also die out with war or disease if care is not taken to pass the knowledge further.
From modern perspective precision which is not required by a function occurs only in mass production or highly automated process. But, these objects may not be vases but some part of “machinery” which requires such a precision. Given vibration properties of granite it points in direction of a resonator. Essentially a resonator is an interplay of elasticity, mass and shape in response to the flow of energy.
I swear I would have paid more attention in school if we would have been talking about things like this. I'm just a simple mechanic/fabricator/ welder. I respect anyone who can make objects like these (the large granite boxes are amazing, but the smallest objects are just mind blowing). A lot of these artifacts look like if you knocked it over, it's gone. How did they make it?
Simple ? And still watching ? Don’t put yourself down. Fabulous that you are here, understanding and spreading the new science. Respect.
Why is it so hard to admit they were wrong for some people? How can one ignore this evidence ? I will never understand. Grateful for this kind of research and for making it all free and open source. One day we will find out the truth in this matter thanks to people like this.
Their ego is more important than the measurement of reality. I don't understand these kinds of people.
Imagine if the experts had to finally admit they were wrong about everything in their field since the beginning and how could they show themselves in public?all funding would be spent on finding answers to the younger up n coming people hence a lot of careers would be damaged making it look like these so called experts knew all along purposely preventing any further investigations into the functioning of the pyramids and all others around the world
Measuring one vase one time doesn't prove anything. That's the whole point that Ben is ignoring. To make any conclusions about "lost technology" there needs to be lots more work before any conclusions can be made, but that isn't stopping Ben from making his claims and stating they are positive proof, instead of simply one "possible" example. Making replicas and measuring them doesn't serve any purpose other than to measure the replica, and would be absolutely useless for anything historical.
The main issue seems to be nobody has a answer to explain otherwise. Just saying they had advanced machines isn't evidence. We still have no clue how they did it
@@nobodyspecial4702 Yeah well they only have one vase. Whats wrong with making assumptions with the facts you have? They even talked about needing to scan more vases since one is not enough.
Ben , I’m begging you , please reach out to a UA-camr called miniminuteman - he’s gaining a lot of traction from his new series debunking Graham Hancock. The way he minimises the great pyramid down to , literally , as he says , that’s it’s just the best way to stack rocks and that it’s a tomb ,despite all of the other amazing evidence surrounding it , is mind blowing , but not in a good way - and the amount of people in his comment section commending him and dismissing any other claims against his narrative , is a sad sight to see. I’d love for you or Randall to offer to debate him just to see how he can get round some of the glaring evidence that the great pyramid is more than just a tomb.
Dismiss it and don't give him any clout for the simple fact that he's earning money with it.
That's what he wants.
You will never change the view of people who have thier careers or reputations threatened by any evidence that goes againt the grain of their chatechism. Kudos to you and your search for the truth. There is evendice for advanced civilazations in the deep past, Michael Cremo's talks about Forbidden Archaeology are an interesting example of this viewpoint.
These vases are extremely ancient, they are pre younger dryas, golden age. Priceless!!
Those who question the vases provenance should provide ‘Facts and Evidence’ supporting their questions. They ask no less of their own critics 😮😮😮😮
For your tenacity and scholarship, not to mention the fine videos, Thank you, Ben! !
Thank you and everybody else for sharing the STL! As someone that loves to learn, especially about engineering and history, this is a godsend... what these represent to human history is absolutely incredible.
I simply cannot understand the thought process behind NOT exploring as much as humanly possible the information hidden in these artefacts.
If they were making vases with this much precision I wonder what their music sounded like. What kinds of tunings and scales did they use? It seems like they would have been able to make some very precise instruments like harps or flutes. I wonder what approach the predynastic Egyptians had towards making music. All their architecture is obviously so resonate. I wonder if they mostly just used drums and voice like all shamanic cultures use?
Probably made EDM on the same systems they ran their CAD/CAM programs on. No, seriously though I have a feeling they had such a thorough understanding of sound that making music was just the tip of the iceberg.
It's so frustrating to see these experts so sure of the past but refuse something as simple as taking modern measurements, why shouldn't we have every data point available to best understand the past? Especially when there is almost no risk to damage to the artifacts and creating these digital copies enables the artifact to live on forever on the internet. Not to mention the fact that it gives access to the world to study them. It should be a standard practice for all museums to scan and make the scans available for the scientific community to explore. Wouldn't that be the scientific thing to do?
it could have been done on a lathe with something similar to a dividing head, setting a start and stop points, but that still doesn't explain the level of precision or the lack of tooling marks. if the handles are not separate pieces with a nearly perfect interference fit, it doesn't make any sense how they were able to do it.
egyptologists are nuts if they think this was done by hand with copper tools and quartz powder. i would force most of them to attend a modern machine shop and try to machine stuff for at least a month before allowing them to open their mouths about egyptian artifacts
I wonder if isotopic and chemical analysis would determine where the raw materials came from?
Mid Atlantic ridge or Richat area?
Good thinking.
Great work, as always.
I don't know if this angle has been approached, I don't remember hearing about, but it's something that always struck me about these pre-dynastic vases: They look so much alike that I wonder if the techniques used could even produce something different. It's understandable we are thinking on "lathe" terms, cause that's what we have now, but maybe they did something so specific that wouldn't work for anything else. Yeah, I know this doesn't answer anything, but maybe someone we'll pick this up and carry the thought.
I have also wondered at times it their technology was extremely sophisticated but entirely different than our own. Maybe something to do with frequencies or chemistry where they could temporarily soften and shape things like these very hard stones with ease, or used in conjunction with some sort of precision lathes and jigs.
Just like 80% of all the other comments I’m an engineer and it seems impossible to make these with the methods we have today, let alone using stones, sand, and ever the most skilled pair of hands
@Gamer 247 it’s okay I feel fine because quite a few Egyptologists act like looney rooms so I’m not offended
They clearly wasn't using their hands lol.... You can use rotational forces, gravity, water or any other natural ways to create things in stone given enough time. The reason no one does or tries it today is we have infintelly cheaper and faster methods to do so. You're not much of an engineer if you think something is impossible just because you can't think outside the box. Yes, we don't know exactly how they did it, but it's certainly not impossible.
@@nihlifyYou clearly do not understand the levels of machining precision that are being discussed in this video. .001' is absolutely insane
@@nihlify you can't be more wrong. Those methods you cite only came into existence within the last few decades at best. You need to account for the MILLENIA that no such objects were produced...anywhere on the planet. You apologists are in a losing battle.
@TopazBadger6550 oh no one is taking the millenia into account haha
This video actually shows the dial indicator moving .0035 not .001 so if they want to make up nonsense they could atleast be accurate.
EXCELLENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NO ONE HAS EVER PERFORMED THIS LEVEL OF INVESTIGATION!!!!!! THIS IS OUTSTANDING!!!!!!
I have been following you for years and as a 25 year Carpenter I’m glad that you’re getting more professionals involved to clearly settle the issue.
HI Ben, great work in all the details you uncovered! I'm curious if you have investigated the volume metric properties of the vase. Is there any evidence that the internal volume may have been a consideration to its original design intent? Perhaps when filled with a liquid, presumably water, maybe it's precision tolerance in dimensional specs achieves an accurate volume or weight of water. Since typically a vase is used to hold something, most likely fluid, you may find something interesting in determining its precise fluid volume/weight. Good Luck!
Thankful for hardworking enthusiast like you Ben,
this is very important history. I still find it mind boggling some egyptologist and historians do everything in their power to stop scientific research into their field
A 5 axis mill will make this but that is some pretty sophisticated machinery even for today
Love your stuff, can't get enough of it !
If I can help, you don't have to say 0.028mm, you can say 28 microns.
Meter, centimeter, millimeter, micron (micrometer), nanometer, picometer, femtometer, etc.
Doesn't change that it's hard to really imagine something that precise no matter the system you use, I actually prefer that you use a comparison like the human hair :)
But I guess it's really all about habit.
Thanks for your work !
The craziest thing to me is that it's just a vase. This means that it is high probability they could only make them that precise with that technique
Absolutely. And there are tens of thousands of similar examples... of objects that don't seem to have a practical or productive purpose. The implications are just mind boggling.
Thank you for providing the stl file! Very excited to print this, its gonna be really cool holding something with such a mystery. The journey of how it got from its mysterious origins to my printer blows my mind!
Indeed 👍
Here is something that I would REALLY like to know---If we are talking about a truly advanced Society, Culture, "Body" of extreme technology, knowledge, experience, and know~how...
Then, my question is: WHY were they using so much of these, admittedly often very very hard (and although I'm no chemist? probably highly chemically~resistant? and yes, obviously very resistant to TIME Itself, etc.etc...) BUT, also potentially very FRAGILE substances?
Why aren't we finding large hoards of more EXOTIC substances? Where are the ancient "super~ceramics", "super~plastics", and so~forth?
Are WE then, the first technological society to refine (Ok, perhaps just "Large Amounts Of") Aluminum, for instance, which essentially doesn't rust, corrode, or otherwise "degrade", in a relatively static, "desert"~ey environment, like Egypt (As far as I know---Again, not a chemist.)
WHY did these Ancients go around, making these complex objects out of substances as hard, heavy, and difficult, as granite, diurite, quartz... These objects have been mentioned, as having been, "Stacked up like Tupperware!" a couple of times.
Well, there's a whole series of really good reasons, that we make Tupperware, out of light, flexible, translucent or transparent, durable, standardized, sealable, easily~stackable, PLASTICS!
And.....Let me also bring up, the case of the JUST REALLY COMPLETELY BIZARRE "Disc of Sabu" (the famous tri~lobed "alien steering~wheel" object, which was constructed out of SCHIST, of all things... I'm sure you can Google an image of it? If anyone has trouble doing so, I'll be happy to link!)
Now, I do wood carving, and I occasionally carve stone. I've also handled plenty of schist, before. In my opinion, it would have probably been significantly easier, to have carved such a thing out of...I don't know?...random TREE BARK. Or, just regular old glass!
Glass certainly would have made a LOT more sense, to me anyway! (But, I'm not an Ancient Proto...Proto...Proto? Egyptian, either!). Glass is pretty, and it's very long lasting. It can be made in many different colours, it can be moulded...Which would cut WAY down, on the time and difficulty, AND you could re~use the mould! Or at least, re~use the schematic for the mould---And, I think that this is another important point!: An item like 'The Disc of Sabu' would be EXCRUCIATING to make, just as a "one~off", even with every reasonably priced modern hand~tool, that I can think of (I mean sure, it might be possible to 3D~Printer it, or something like that, IF you could "Print" SCHIST, at the MOLECULAR~LEVEL, good luck!
But I'm talking, Storebought, Lowes, Home~Depot, Hand~Tools. Or mayyybe, with the full resources of a small, IF well~appointed, modern Machine~Shoppe. AT MOST.)
Why make it out of a substance, like Schist, when there would be basically ZERO chance to ever make a perfect duplicate?
I mean... HOW much TIME, and LABOUR, and FOCUS, and DETERMINATION...along with INSANE, obsessive~compulsive, AMBITION, and...sheer luck?...Could these Ancients have possibly had?
Basically, to me? It points to one of three (admittedly WAY OUT THERE!) possibilities:
Either, 1: They had some way of either manufacturing, moulding in some way, and/or, PERFECTLY repairing, solid granite and other types of stone.
Hey Ben, Thanks for the update and the additional info here. Once again superbly delivered.
Something caught my eye at 11:40 - 11:45 ish... The piece of plate being held up is great but are there any suggestions for what made the parallel track marks on the wall behind? What rock is that? Limestone maybe? The marks all seem to crisscross but a couple seem to be perfectly parallel, like tread marks left by the rovers, in the dust on Mars. Queue, x-files theme tune. :D
honestly i think its from a chisel of some sort
the distance between each tooth looks similar and many are at different angles so that is what you would expect from a chisel
these tunnels have been explored/raided for many years while metal tools have been in existence, imagine some guys in 1900s trying to get their big wooden pully down there to try lift/move something they would have no choice other than to chisel protruding rocks to try get their equipment in
i think its quite often you see modern tooling marks within passageways, cool spot tho!
@@SHERMA. I thought about that but the spacing is too consistent along a single track. Even an electric or pneumatic chisel would have a certain variance in the regularity of impact due to the technique and / or fatigue of the person using it.
You're right about modern tools overlaying ancient. I'm sure there is plenty of that. Strange tho, that these seem to be in sets of two, parallel to each other and in dead straight lines. Would be keen to see these up close and also to know if this is the only spot they appear. Cheers
I wonder, has anyone from the "mainstream" responded to these findings? I mean, they've been asking for years for a scan of this nature, what's their excuse now?
Edit: nevermind, got my answer ten minutes in, and it was very unfortunately exactly what I expected. Looking at it from the perspective of the other side, which in this case means from the perspective of the "mainstream", that of historians, egyptologysts etc.. with an official title coming from an university or an institution with an equally recognized authority, I still don't understand the pushback. If anything they should appreciate the effort and do their best to confirm the findings. It makes no sense whatsoever, from a logic standpoint at least, trying to "debunk" it, particularly since their counter argument always falls into the economic aspect of things, completely disregarding the reason that generated this level of interest from engeneers and other specialists that deal with precision manufacturing. Why aren't museums offering some of their artifacts for scanning instead of acting like pissed ex wives? If they are so sure of being right, why don't act accordingly? What do they have to lose? Yeah, what?...
Ben, have you seen the Al Naslaa rock formation in Saudi Arabia? The huge rock with the perfect cut straight down the center? I'd love to hear your opinion or thoughts on this if you haven't talked about it yet.
Ben, isn't there even one "expert" willing to venture how much precision could be obtained in any time period, even the 80s?
Thanks for your work, real head scratcher.
As a sculptor I can say granite can't be shape with such a precision without advance machines.
🎯I love when these pop up when I take a break from cutting rocks. What brand of copper chisels do you sculpt with?😂
well thankfully sculptors are experts because your wrong. you can easly do this with SAND.
@@the_chomper you can easily create precision (and methods to measure that precision) with sand?? Lol. Do tell. Remember, in order to create precision you have to be able to measure it and repeat it. Are you suggesting they used sand to measure?? 😂😂
@@the_chomper Well then, go ahead and show us. Take a unworked piece of granite and show us how you make a flat surface (to 1/1000") and produce a cylindrical hole in the piece of granite that is 1/100" perpendicular to the flat surface. I'm gonna check in on your channel in the next couple of months! Shouldn't take you to long since this is "easly doable with SAND"
@@the_chomper Please educate mate, can you link us to this? Honestly if you can show it please do
about the vases: I think an early, unknown civilization had tools we can only dream of - some sort of 3D diamond cutter that could easily produce these shapes in large numbers! and not only that: they were also able to transport, join and shape extremely shear blocks of granite or other hard rock! A technology that we cannot even begin to understand! If anyone in this world has an explanation for this, please bring it on! if this someone can also produce something like this, then please show us that!
Thank you for the STL File! I am an avid 3D scanner myself, but I don't have the financial capabilities to travel around the World, so I am constantly looking for 3D Scans of ancient artifacts and architecture to be able to measure and study them in detail. There are still so many things left that need to be 3D scanned so they can be shared with the world! Edit: I have already found an interesting detail about the vase from the stl file.
What is the interesting detail? I’m intrigued.
@@racoon965 there is an horizontal imperfection in the surface, close to one of the handles, showing definite proof of laithe work. Also, the flat face of the handle closest to the imperfection has a slightly diffirent angle to the outer surface of the vase than the other flat faces of the handles. it's barely noticable, but you can see it if you put a box around the handles and compare the angles to each other. To me this looks like whatever tool they used to clear out the area between the handles wasn't set 100% correctly, and so it created the wrong angle on that side and carved slightly too deep into the material. But they corrected the tool on the other sides of the handles.
@@Parabola001 Holy crap. So what are your conclusions on how it was made?
Search for a channel called 'Infrafon' and a video on the channel that says 'how to "melt" stone'. Blew my mind going through his videos.
@@Parabola001 That is not on a lathe, but the very same drill setup used for coring. Just not fully turned but more on the line of 150 degrees turn and rewind repeat. The grinding stone did not fully touch the sides where the lug handles were as it could not.
Done by hand, but still a remarkable amount of care and attention to detail. Unlike the inside surface which is kind of ignored. Why would they ignore it if they had the capabilities? Mostly because they did not.
Hey Ben! Thank you so much for providing this kind of analysis!
I'd like to mention that there has been one other analysis of this kind that showed similar results in regards to precision: v=HmJerr3-PTE&t=3236s
The BAM team went to India and took measurements with 3D laser scanners of the Barabar caves and the results are just equally impressive!
yep I have a video about exactly that as well as an interview with Patrice from BAM
Why not use an electron microscope to image the groove marks left by the machining process, I’d hazard a guess that fragments of the tool used could be found 🤷🏻♂️.
I would love to hear about the internal volume (capacity) of all the pre-dynastic pottery. Maybe we could find a standard unit that was used, and then gauge the precision of volume held without the need to worry about differences in size or shape. This would be an easy experiment to run, depending on the number of items available to properly measure, and I am surprised I haven't heard anything about it yet.
Excellent idea, worth looking into.
genius!
Go Ben! Thanks again to you and all your colleagues and guests for providing undeniable proof, again, of ancient machine technology! Keep on keeping on!