Harbor Freight Dust Collector.. upgrades 2023
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- Опубліковано 30 чер 2023
- 2023 HARBOR FREIGHT DUST COLLECTION UPGRAGES
Donaldson merv 15 filter part number- P181038
amzn.to/3tRHf9R
Dust collection hose
amzn.to/3ups4Fo
Blast gate
amzn.to/497cWLN
Wen Turbo Fan part number 3403-022
As someone that works at the Donaldson factory that makes those filters, I am happy to see that you chose the right product.
Hey that’s cool… very happy with the product. I think Donaldson could put together a kit with an attachment mechanism and seal up that hole in the top and it would sell like crazy. Thanks for watching and commenting
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Crazy question, have heard that these filters are meant to have airflow go the opposite way from how you would mount this on a dust collector, is that true?
@@Obtuse94 That is mostly true. The majority of filters are designed with the flow going from outside to inside. However, most media is bidirectional. In this type of application there wont be enough pressure differential to cause concern. so while they are designed (in most cases) to flow the opposite way, they will function very well without issue using reverse flow.
Nice work on this. Thanks for sharing your findings.
I did this same thing to my new HF dus collection system. Did not realize that tip gasket would come off. Thanks for the info about that.😊
Well i hope it helps … thanks for watching
Mine was glued on. Had to trim the top layer and the edge to release it. Wish it had been as easy as yours. However, my fan blade came right off. That’s a decent trade. Thanks for the video.
Good job. Thank you so much
Fan blades are mfd in one of several configurations; Forward curved, backward inclined, and straight are the basics. The factory blade and the replacement you used are forward curved. But the replacement blade was mfd' for a different fan rotation. I doubt running a forward curved blade in reverse is very efficient. You're getting more air simply because the blade is a larger diameter, but it's using more energy and creating less air flow than if it were the right blade. I would be curious what result you would see if your replacement blade was made for the rotation of your fan housing (CCW - always viewed from the drive side of the fan housing).
I have been scouring the internet trying to find one. If i find one I’m going to revisit this just because all the comments and i am very interested to see what it would do. Thanks for watching and commenting.
A centrifugal fan like that will always pull from the center outward, regardless of direction of rotation. However the blades are curved to work better in one direction than another. Were the HF blades in the correct direction, or the Wen blades? I don't know but it's probably explained somewhere.
I watched another video on this upgrade that said testing on both types of blades revealed that the replacement blade here yielded better results because instead of scooping the air it was almost force feeding or compressing it into the outlet. Just what I heard in the other video.
@@jamphotostudio Correct. The blades in reverse curve force the air to run faster, just like the top surface of an airplane wing. This forces the air away from the center and out the exhaust, requiring more air through the inlet, requiring more CFM and resulting in better suction.
Above my pay grade….now I’m curious(?)
Good! Amen on the Jocko quote! I have the Wen impeller on mine and it hasn't blown a 20amp circuit yet, even though it also powers a deep freeze and our house alarm (multiple pulls on amperage). I am going to add the Donaldson filter soon and change the inlet to 6"... a 5" can't support 2 4" in operation without CFM degradation.
Yeah mine is good to go on a 20 amp circuit. The circuit that i spoke about in the video east the circuit breaker in the 15amp power strip.
Rikon makes one, I believe.
Those are some worthy upgrades
Yeha
Wynn Environmental makes some really nice worm gear clamps made to hold the filter down. Did that on mine, I put them on the inside.
This is the first i have heard i will have to look in to them.
I had the same issue when i removed my impellar. Except my solution was way more difficult and time consuming.
I drilled out the bolts holding each wing. Took 2 bits and hours of using a hand drill because i only had a small bench size drill press that the whole assembly didnt fit on/in. Then i used a grinder to cut the base small enough so that i could use a larger gear puller to use the base to grip and pull out.
Yeah your solution was quite a bit better. I even have a welder, just dont use it enough to consider it when trying to solve issues 😮💨
If i had 220V in my garage i would have bought a plasma cutter😢
I have definitely been in those situations before where something just beats you down, but that makes fixing it feel that much better.
Mine slid off by hand
I just wondered if the cost savings is there after buying the filter and the upgraded blade. Were there any dust removal systems around $500 that would have done the same thing without the modifications? Not ribbing, just wondering if there is a compatible model that would not require the work. Thanks
I think the dust right would be the closest with a canister type filter it is. $750ish but it only flows around 750 CFM. So with the amount of flow and filter you get i feel like what i did has the bang for the buck edge.
For holding down the new filter, would a bungee cord or two work? Seems less hassle than using a bunch of hardware and turnbuckles. It's not a jet engine. Edit: may be as much work, need a way to hold the bungees in place on a cylinder.
Well i do work on jet engines maybe I’m just use to overcomplicating things.
Ha!! At 20:36 I laughed out loud!! “So…..”. Very funny!!
Nice vid. Looking through your stuff, views are low. I been there. Keep it up. Nice quality. I got to get me one of these filters. - new subber.
Thanks. I have only been at it for a short time now (4.5 months now) and the views are starting to slowly increase. I really appreciate you watching and subscribing.
Good video!
Add a starting capacitor to the motor it will help reduce your start current draw.
Yesss !!!this is the info i need. i just have to figure how to do it…. Do you have any resources?
That mod is getting into an area where gut thinking will not do. A cap would need to be disconnected when running speed is achieved. That is typically done by a built-in centrifugal switch, which you don’t have. And it would operate a separate start winding, which you also don’t have. You can’t soup up the motor without making it be able to handle the additional heat. In the end, you must make sure that the windings don’t turn into a temperature blivet, if you know what I mean.
There is, of course, a youtube video that shows "Single phase motor forward and reverse wiring". That may be more complicated than most people can handle, but it's an idea. Run opposite rotation & compare air speeds.
Done a similar setup with mine. I went back and forth on the impeller and decided to hold off for now. Heard too many potential problems similar to what you encountered. Be curious if you feel the same after living with it for a while. Seemed like people were real split on if the gains were worth it.
Well jury is still out. Eventually i will revisit this topic so far the air it pulls is great. The amperage surge i measured today was 22 amps on start up and that poses a problem for most common 20 amp circuits once it’s at speed it only pull 11 amps. Thanks for watching.
I would suggest getting some sort of separator and then removing those cross hair guards on the inlet. I would think they are restricting some of the air flow and with a separator you get the added benefit of not having to change out those bags plus less likely you suck up a nut or bolt into that impeller.
ua-cam.com/video/ckc4x-8hqV4/v-deo.html check this video out i mounted this dust system to the ceiling , added a separator, and modified that inlet.
@@builtforlife I would be curious on what your new CFM calculation is with the new inlet. There is only so much air that can be pulled through that size inlet and with it now being bigger I’m wondering if the CFM is greater.
That’s a good question. The next time i dump my barrel i will measure it.
I’m looking into a customized install (as may people here are).
Has repurposing the seal from the other side of the filter stayed consistent? If so, I’m absolutely going to do that instead of cutting a circle for it.
Yeah … it is holding up great. I have been running it a lot with my cnc with no issues. The cyclone separator is the key to a good system though.
Great video! I was watching along, following your content, when suddenly I noticed that you drink Voodoo Ranger IPA - you must be OK! I began consuming this product when it was just "Ranger IPA", because I was one a long time ago...maybe still am. Keep up the good work!
Thanks for watching … 10 out of 10 on voodoo Ranger.
IPAs rules but ranger is awful
More than one data point is necessary to characterize the effectiveness of these modifications. I could be that when 20 foot of duct is installed that the flow falls on its face. The flow should have been measured by installing a vacuum gauge and a blast gate and then measuring the air velocity at different vaccum.
Also knowing that most import motors usually have no reserve it would be nice to know what the motor amperage was pre modification. I understand the motor is slower to start and thus will be drawing max current for a longer time at start up but I am more concerned about the running current. A start capaciitor does not reduce the starting current, (it actually increases it) but reduces the time for the motor to get up to full speed which helps reduce overheating on startup.
I've set up a woodworking shop and now have a clean slate, but I'm uncertain about what diameter pipe to opt for in my dust collection system. Currently, I'm equipped with a Harbor Freight 2HP setup, enhanced with upgraded fan blades and a P181038 filter, alongside the addition of the Oneida Cyclone, which I've wall-mounted.
I've noticed many UA-cam creators employing 4" pipes, while a few opt for 6". Could you shed some light on why you chose the size you did?"
I would love to act like I’m the pinnacle of information, but i am not. All i can tell you is what I have experienced and learned. 4 inch for a small shop seems the most logical to me especially on a smaller system. The more pipe you spread out the more you reduce flow. For the money metal HVAC has worked fine ( not perfect, but works). There is a lot of science and opinion out there that you can analyze to death and never make a decision. I think the best thing to do is build what you want and figure out what works and doesn’t for your situation.
I'm curious about how the pressure with the new fan is different now. You mention that the airflow has increased, but what about pressure? I think the different blade orientation would have.a pretty large effect on the pressure.
I haven’t ignored your comment i have been looking into it and i don’t have a good way of measuring. I think the only way i could compare would be to neck it down to 2.5 and compare it too a shop vac but at the end of the day that doesn’t really tell me anything because this type of system is made for 4” I’m running it on 4” all the way to the tool and it works great. Thanks for watching!
What is the amp draw on the motor. Did you check before and after. Are you overloading the motor
Amp draw on start is about 16 then runs about 9 amps. Didn’t check it before because i didn’t foresee the issue before installing.
Was my question..!! Overloading the motor with a bigger fan..??
Most of the stuff I bought at harbor freight collects dust now . . .
I am very selective of what i buy there. Usually consumables like gloves and rags i get pretty good deals on i also have a floor jack that i have had sense 2004 that is still running strong.
The new blade is for a housing that turns the other direction
Is that housing available?
I could not find anywhere on Donaldson website where it stated this filter was a merv 15 filter, but rather a filter for an engine which doesn't even need to be a merv 10. An engine doesn't need to have that clean of air to operate very efficiently. I would be concerned to use this in my shop.
So yes you are right i reached out to Donaldson for the rating. This particular filter is not rated on the merv scale it’s rated on another scale and it’s rating is actual slightly higher than Merv 15. It in another comment it’s been so long i forgot the actual name and numbers.
Here is what I found
This Donaldson Torit Replacement Filter has media upgrades. Upgrades include 100% Nanofiber FR - Max Temp: 175F (MERV 15) and 100% Spun Bond Polyester: - Max Temp: 200F (upgradeable to 250F). The original part number is P18-1038 and it has a bolt hole. It has an outside diameter of 17.63", an insider diameter of 11.11", and a length of 23". The top is open. The bottom is closed. The shape is round. The filter has 373 square feet of media. Standard features include 80/20 Cellulose/Polyester Blend - Max Temp: 175F (MERV 11).
A HEPA is the creme de la creme of air filters with an equivalent rating of a MERV 17 or higher. A HEPA filter at a MERV 17 rating will trap 99.97% of air particles that are 0.3 microns in size, but capture an even higher percentage of particles smaller or larger than that size.
Where did you get your anemometer? It seems all I can find only go up to 65 MPH.
The one I’m using in this video is a kestrel brand used in shooting sports.
It's a kestrel for long range shooting
I saw the hand cord for the anemometer dangling there while the fan was running. Be careful to not let that cord get sucked into the impeller. That would be a bad thing!
A surge protector responds to voltage surges, which should not result from increased motor current draw. Are you sure that you don’t mean circuit breaker instead? Another reason it would not be a failed surge protector is that the latter (usually a MOV) typically fails by shorting out with smoke and scorching, which is hard to miss. If the increased current caused by the new blade occurs only at start up, it may cause no harm, but if the continuous running current increases, it could cause motor overheating, so the temperature of the motor should be monitored, say, by smelling it after a long run, if there is overheating, perhaps instead of changing impellers, you could feed the blower with a second fan or blower to increase the CFM. How would adding a second blower compare with the trouble and cost of changing the impeller?
It will be interesting to see how the addition of a centrifugal dust separator will affect the performance.
I actually bought a meter that goes in the receptacle and i can read amperage and all the rest. It was the circuit breaker on the surge protector that actuated. The start up of the motor jumps up to 22 amps and then settles out to about 9 while running. I did feel on the motor for after a long carve and it is no hotter than you would reasonably expect for a 2 hour run. Somebody mentioned adding a start capacitor to it but i haven’t had the chance to research it.
What is the micron ‘filterage’ for this filter? The information on Amazon is very minimal.
I have reached out to Donaldson and I’m hoping for an answer soon. I’ll let you know what they say.
Donaldson got back to me it is an ISO rating of 99.9% which is equivalent to a merve 15.
@@builtforlife Thank you.
what size is the wen turbo fan motor shaft ? thx NEIL Z.
I don’t know.. i would say about 3/4 inch but that is anguess
Came for the dust collector, stayed for the Vodoo, and the titan fitness boxes!, my type of channel :), what you dot on those boxes?
You’ll have to keep your eyes out in the rest of my videos. I haven’t done anything intentionally showing all that but it’s a pretty awesome setup.
That new impeller is reverse rotation to the motor.
In other words, it won’t work as well.
Forward incline vs. backward incline
Your measurements should be more to the outer edge of the intake for more accurate speed.
Wouldn't it have made better sense to have installed the fan on backwards so the fins would be the same as the factory fan? You could always weld a nut on the hub before installing in case you need to pull it off again.
It’s possible and if i take it apart again I’ll give it a try. I have never looked into the design and flow of the impeller based on the way the blades are oriented, but it did increase the airflow a considerable amount.
With how little clearance the new impeller has, you won't get very many wood chips through it since the solid back will be on the intake side of the fan. As far as I can tell, you are missing out on a lot of CFM with this, but if it works, I would leave it be and after filling the first bag with saw dust, take it apart again to make sure you don't have any large debris in the housing.
As pointed out by others, the fins are backwards. Someone suggested below to mount the impeller on backwards. Not sure how that could work, as it would block the intake hole. What I am wondering (with a caveat) is if the motor could be wired to spin in the opposite direction, thereby spinning the blades in the correct direction which should increase air speed. The caveat to this is that I noted by way of your video that the threads on the bolt that hold the impeller to the shaft appears to be reverse threaded? (counter clockwise tightens). If that's the case, perhaps that is because the motor spins in the opposite direction and this is to prevent the bolt from spinning loose? If so, perhaps installing a grub screw could assist on that end? Just some curious thoughts I wanted to share.
Yes a few people have pointed out the blade direction. I had my concerns too when installing it but there is definitely a significant increase with the new impeller. It would be interesting to know what it would do if i was able to reverse the direction. Thanks for watching.
@@builtforlifeI just randomly came across this but if I remember correctly, they are not backwards but something called a neutral vane (or the HF is a neutral vane).
Either way, there’s videos that explain why this works and isn’t backwards
Don't do that! If you reverse the polarity on the fan, it will spin the opposite way. However, the exhaust shoot will not function properly and your wood chips will collect in the fan housing almost immediately. This will cause the motor to have to work against the debris and burn out quite quickly, or if you are lucky, the breaker will prevent this due to the over amperage draw.
@@seabeegamer4498the fix may be to mount the motor from the current inlet side and the inlet to the current motor side then reverse motor direction.
A standard AC induction motor like that used on this dust collector can only rotate in one direction, due to the way the windings are done in the motor's 'field' assembly. There's a video about "Single phase motor forward and reverse wiring" but it's a bit complicated to reverse the windings, and may not be possible on this motor. Fan screw is left-handed to match motor rotation. You'd probably need to use thread-lock on that (removable kind should work, just get nice & tight).
It would be nice if the Donaldson website listed micron filtration size and merv ratings. I just got the 2hp 35 gal harbor freight 299$ -10% discount for ML King weekend. . It is a different model number 59726
and its 97869than the 70 gal one that they still have fir 279$. Not sure of the motor is the same and the bag ring same diameter. The mew one is 19 3/8" od. And 18 7/8" id where that slope is. So this filter should fit . Wonder why you didn't get 1550 cfm stock as advertised
I actually emailed the good folks over at Donaldson and they told me the rating and i did some research and it is right at Merv 15.
As far as the CFM goes i think it’s the way i was measuring it. That tool is not meant for it. I think it worked to show the increases in airflow but a different tool would be needed for an actual honest to goodness CFM roaring. Out of all the upgrades i have down the filter is definitely the best.
@@builtforlife ordered one... going with a new version 4/5 Oneida cyclone. but is making the inlet from 5-6" needed... I may get the larger impeller.. .and as far as the impeller blade sweep it makes sense to improve the flow with back swept blades. there is actually a perfect curve for air at a certain temp and pressure and flow rate but thats a fancy shape.
The main reason i made the inlet larger was because the inlet on the dust deputy was either 4” or 6” and i could not fine a tight fitting adapter to make it work with 5”. The whole 5” thing is just annoying ha ha
@@builtforlife I have not looked for a good fitting 5-6" adapter yet. do you have any suggestions on where to look... maybe a better choice today than when you looked before.
What is the non youtube use for the anemometer? 😮
Ha ha it’s a kestrel I use for pew pew. UA-cam isn’t really friendly to that community.
I have no idea what all that means. But to answer the question, an anemometer is a wind speed (not pressure) indicator. It can be used to measure the flow in air ducts or other air paths. The older version had the four spinning cups often accompanying a weather vane when you think of a weather station. However that version was too big to be inserted in ducts and other small air paths. I am guessing that it works by measuring the temperature drop from a calibrated heat source, that is flow is proportional to temperature drop. No moving parts, either.
Haha!! I was wondering about that!! What kind of distances are you pew pewwing?! LOL
Also, the Donaldson air filter part number doesn't match what you have on the bench
Here is a link to the actual one I purchased off Amazon I’ll go back and make sure i put the right # in the video
www.amazon.com/Donaldson-kfP181038-P181038-Filter/dp/B00KNINQH8?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=AAA42JQR9MNNG
Its still not right in your heading description
The intake port, cut out that cross support and the cfm will increase even more.
That happens in the second video where i mount it on the wall and attach a cyclone separator.
The Wen impeller is reversed… how is that an upgrade if you're running it backwards?
Yes the fins are reverse from the factory impeller. It is still running the same direction as the factory fan one, and flows way more air. I’m not a airologis but it works.
The fan is not backwards. Google “forward incline impeller” you will find that impeller blades can be curved either way or even be straight (radial). Each has its benefits with regard to sound, speed, pressure, etc. If you were to research other dust collectors, you would find most collectors in the size range of the HF unit to use the same type impeller as the Wen.
@@georgemuff5482 this is good info, thank you georgemuff5482
I like your apron
Thank you
filter cost more than what i paid for the dust collector
Filter is the most important part. Definitely worth the expense not only in airflow, but to me the big benefit is the health aspect. The only way i wouldn't run it is if i could somehow mange to run the system outside .
If your intent on making upgrades then just purchase the more expensive units and save money.
What i did here is still less expensive than anything comparable and pulls more CFM. I did not go into this blind i researched, compared all the numbers including upgrades, and made a decision. Thanks for watching.
I like the video but the music is obnoxious. Please change/eliminate the music. Not sure why youtubers feel the need to put "music" in their videos. They usually play the same 2 or 3 chords over and over. Anyway, please continue making videos and good luck. Thanks
The music issue has been touched on .. I’m knew to all this…. But i will take your reference to UA-camr as a compliment 👍. This was one of my first videos i have changed up the formula now. Thanks for watching.
you are so focused on dust collection that your over looking eye safety. lol squinting your eyes while drilling 2' away doesn't work. metal chips in your eye sucks, getting your eyeball scraped in the E.R sucks even more. I'm not trying to be mean. I just want people to put on safety glasses when they should.
I usually do pretty good but you got me… I’ll do better
34 minutes of video for 10 minutes of content. Cut the extraneous crap. Don’t need to watch you drinking coffee and putting every bolt into the impeller housing.