I wonder how much it costs to deal with the injuries and fatalities and material-damage and necessary policing and judicial process, associated with self-entitled individuals driving too fast and too unskilfully. Then environmental and health costs associated with the production and usage of vehicles. My sense is that these associated costs would be many, many times £34m.
@@dungareesareforfools This seems to be the driving factor Ian. Namely, individuals so prioritising themselves, than they might refuse to adhere to laws which are for the benefit of everyone. They can still drive faster than 20mph in all sorts of places, but still they want more just for themselves, even if it is to the disadvantage of others.
This was and is the biggest issue in Wales.Wales is sorted now and it has no issues of any kind.If someone disagrees it will breach the hate crime law against the government and so ut will be sent to reeducation camps where they will remain till they see the situation in Wales and Britain in a positive way. In worse case scenario the Government will legalise the usage of hard drugs or adopt the Canadian legislation where a citizen can request a free euthanasia if they are not happy with the government. Crazy it sounds to a regular person listening to this and the whole thing to the government doesn't see they incompetence and lack of care for the future of British children is what is the source of the issues and problems on the country and the a 20 mph speed limit.
I think they should make the speed limit not apply to motorcycles because it's safest if we go faster than cars, same as HGVs and Vans are not allowed above a certain speed. A road that I use frequently has become much more dangerous after they reduced speed limit, you are in car driver's blind spot at a junction for a long time so they pull out on you. whereas I never had it when the speed limit was 40. I always expect it's going to happen btw but christ, it's gone from never happening to everytime someone will pull out on you.
How about just making speed limits make sense for the road they’re applied to? Then you do public service ad campaign to promote safe driving alongside an equitable system of speed monitoring and fines. Treat the public with respect and fairness for a change.
We should try having conceptual speed limits, not numerical ones. Think "low", "medium", and "natural", and then we teach drivers that "low" means you should be driving between 15 and 30 miles an hour on high alert, being extra cautious (replaces 20 and 30), "Medium" means from 30 to 50 on wider roads with less pedestrian traffic (replaces 40 and 50) and "Natural" means "Drive as you feel safe" (replaces 60 and national, no maximum). Allow people to drive as they feel is safe, allow judges to decide when someone's idea of safe is unacceptable, and you will vastly improve people's attitude toward driving.
@@icedreamer9629 ...and their skills. We're currently on a path of dumbing down driving skills as much as possible, rather than being selective on who drives and encouraging aspirations to be better drivers.
'We're fully aware that absolutely no one likes it, needs it or wants it, but we're doing it anyway..' should Never be uttered by any Politician to the Citizenry.
I notice Wilson never replied on the question of pollution reduction. Surely pollution would be higher when you drop a gear to maintain 20mph. If the data has been collected before/after the change (and I doubt is has) then why has it not been published.
I am not in Wales but my town got a 20mph blanket speed limit. Most people only wanted the limits in residential areas and near schools. As a result 90% of drivers ignore the limits, and those which do obey it cause anger, frustration and dangerous overtaking. Accidents as a result have gone up.
when the said about a 20mph speed limit in wales most people thought it was for residential areas or out side of a school and if it was the case their would be no problem but ive been driving along and their isn't a house on either side of the road, just fields and i'm rolling along at 20 mph
I'm on the border (Hereford) and if you stick to 20mph limit when in Wales then most people will overtake you. I think 20mph specifically applied in areas like schools, residential,etc (after consultation) would have been broadly supported by most - this would have been a smarter move.
@@AdamBuckley1964 there isn’t a blanket 20mph limit when you cross the border. It’s a myth. The 20mph limit is restricted to residential areas and villages. Most roads have the national speed limits 70 for dual carriageways and 60 for single carriageways (as default) with lower limits according to the nature of the roads (ie 50, 40, 30). I’m not sure why folks believe that it’s 20 everywhere in Wales. I think it was an impression created by Westminster in order to make the non-existent ‘Woke War on Motorists’ a wedge issue. There’s really no such thing but it’s quite easy to push some people’s buttons and get them into a steaming rage about anything. … as the comments under this vid show rather clearly.
@@PHlophe I used to tell my kids you can do anything you want and be anything you want in this country, i think it is getting so you can be anything the government wants you to be.my father used to say they will be charging for fresh air next, guess what.
Exactly my thoughts. People think children are too thick to learn how to cross a road safely. They are wrong. I (and all of my school) learnt that "skill" at the age of 4 years old. Not teaching children is imho total neglect.
Children do their best, but unfortunately they are impulsive and make mistakes. These mistakes are significantly more likely to result in death if struck by a vehicle at 30mph than at 20mph. The evidence for this is strong.
@@45graham45 Look right look left and look right again and if it's safe to cross go ahead but not with a bloody phone clamped in your hand in front of your eyes.....
£33 million wasted on putting up 20mph roadsigns yet the Welsh Labour Government totally ingnored the fact that Wales has a NHS dental care crisis due to the near total lack of availability of any NHS dentists, this is the reality of a Labour led Government, remember this when you cast your vote at the next General Election.
@@anonymes2884 pay them and they will immigrate from other countries. or even better... nationals will stop risking high loans to setup their private practices.
@@rob5944 I thought the same, seems a waste of time as you can easily do that when you have stopped driving, this is why I prefer to catch up on the latest box sets on Netflix and prime whilst I’m driving
£32m for 20mph signs across the country plus what ever other expenses they spent our tax money on. How many more millions of pounds of tax payers money are they going to waste rectifying this
How did it cost so much and why didn't they just stick a 20 signs over the 30 instead of changing the whole sign. Also there is a cul de sac near where I live it's only a few yards long and would be impossible to go at more than 10 mph but they have spent loads of £££ changing the signs and also putting a red colour tar mac with a big 20 sign painted on top. Must have cost a couple of hundred quid !!!
Change it to 3 mph. Think of the lives it would save !!! Then ban all motorcycles, then all cars, then all trucks then all buses. Ban everything that moves!!
No, no need for that. Just bring back the man with the red flag to walk before the vehicles, just to ensure that our roads are 100% safe and effective. Just like the you know what!
I live in Wales and I knew nothing about the law until the last stages before it became law. The police in Newtown, Powys don't even stick to 20mph so that's what the law thinks of the speed limit lol. I live in a village and there are six speed changes in 200m. The whole thing is a waste of money Wales doesn't have and it now a big embarrassment. Mark Drakeford has left a wake of debt and ruin including the NHS.
I live on a main road in Wales with 20mph AND 2 schools and very few drivers do 20mph and a heck of a lot do more than 30. Why didn’t someone with a brain work all this out before spending was it 34 million and now spending more millions changing it. Well done Labour in Wales
@@davecooper3238Do you think 20mph is needed during the night when the main roads are empty ? 20mph on side roads is perfectly fine but on main roads, no it’s just an annoyance nothing more
You don't. Vehicles are not designed to drive at 20MPH. The gear ratio matches 30MPH, so people have to change down a gear, especially when going up hill, this means that the engine revs are higher, and it produces more pollution.
@@zedcarr6128... You can change the differentials to adjust the ratios and behaviour of the gear increments. Also overcooking your velocity to speeds you can't maintain for long before needing to breaking creates far more pollution than higher revs. Accelerating and breaking hard over and over and over "accelerbreaking" about complex areas with frequent junctions, lights and obstacles is going to create very high pollution.
@@julianshepherd2038 Where do people go when there's a road rage incident and someone gets assaulted because they are stuck behind someone doing 17 mph the NHS costing more money and clogging up the NHS.
Lee Waters was the main instigator in implementing the disastrous 20mph zones here in Wales. No surprise he’s since resigned his position as transport minister and left Ken Skates to pick up the mess he left in his wake.
The problem with the "it reduces injuries and fatalities" argument is that it has no end point. If that's the reason for doing it then the inescapable conclusion is that the speed limit should immediately be lowered to zero mph on every road. The other aspect to the argument is that it's always implied that it's drivers and their speed who are responsible for accidents with pedestrians. If someone is run over on the highway, isn't it part of the equation to ask what they were doing on the highway to be run down? The road is for road users, not pedestrians. Nobody EVER mentions better road safety education for pedestrians as a way of reducing accidents.
Sorry bro. Don't be silly. How on earth did you get 11 upvotes without any criticism? Every "road user" by which i assume you mean "motorist", becomes a pedestrian before they start the journey and after they complete it , so what is this nonsensical distinction between "road users" and pedestrians? Are you certain the child that got knocked down outside a school may not have been dropped at school by a parent? When it was just horse buggies and bicycles said "highways" were perfectly safe for pedestrians. It was motor vehicles that brought danger to the roads. Remember they were limited to 4mph max and had to be preceded by a man with a flag? Separate sidewalks were not even necessary except in busy environments. If a public highway is so narrow that a person absentmindedly stepping into the path of car will be severely injured or killed, the cars shouldn't be there or the maximum speed should be severely curtailed. 12mph tops, which is the condition you normally get around schools. Just as a reminder, the roads outside schools are "public highways"
When I was in school in the '60s we were taught the Green Cross Code. Stop, look right, look left, look right again and then cross when it is safe. This was also reinforced with examples on TV showing how you stayed safe as a pedestrian. This modern idea that pedestrians and cyclists have right of way is patently daft, as it takes away responsibility from the people who are going the slowest and who are therefore able to stop in the shortest possible distance. Ya canna change the laws of physics!
It seems that hardly anyone on this threads understands why "accidents" are "accidents". Could it because they are "accidental"? People make mistakes, misjudgements, lapses in concentration, or even sudden illness like strokes etc. The whole idea is that when "accidents" happen the speeds are low enough not to cause serious injury or death. Are there others besides me in this thread who understand this?
20 mph is fine on short side roads, outside schools and hospitals, but it causes anger, road rage and dangerous overtaking situations on long main roads.
Bath imposed 20mph speed limits, a new study has shown that fatalities and collisions increased in all areas where the new limits were imposed ,after driving with the new limits in Wales I can tell you it does not work ,schools hospitals ,fine ,and it was imposed by someone who does not even drive
i live in the south wales valleys and have never known there to be accidents like there are now since this ridiculous 20 mph law has come in people are getting frustrated by being stuck behind drivers doing 20 mph and taking risks to overtake not only that but the build up of traffic on the roads is just causing traffic jams everywhere it only takes one car in front doing 20 and thats it the traffic keeps building up until theres a queue half a mile long that idiot drakeford needs his head seeing to for bringing this ludicrous law in utter stupidity
I live in Wales and a blanket 20mph is insane. I support 20mph in purely residential areas, outside schools, hospitals, care homes etc. But they were putting these on arterial roads which provide critical traffic links, one road I drive regularly goes from 40mph to 20 mph to 30mph to 50mph, the 20 mph element in the middle of that is a 1.5 mile stretch through countryside with no side roads or junctions, it also has a pavement and streetlights.
Exactly, a sensible limit for the road. I'd love a 20 here as there are no pavements, a primary school, a doctors surgery and only room for one car if there are others parked. People zoom along and if someone stepped out they'd have nowhere to go. In fact I'm amazed nobody has bit hit, yet the council doesn't seem bothered. Even at 20 I doubt you'd even get to the brake pedal, let alone stop.
I visited Wales last year and driving 20mph on what was a 40mph was surreal and painful. This would stop me going to Wales, but maybe thats their goal?
@@balajat786 Yeah, but some people don't have that common sense. Their perception of risk is greatly distorted. So in some scenarios (like around schools) it's reasonable to prioritize safety over convenience.
I got zapped 26 in a 20. Going uphill from 2nd into 3rd. Road used to be 30. Some **** with a motorbike with a camera. This is not about safety just pure revenue raising.
@@robert100xx Yes, it was noticeable that by far the most signatures on that petition to scrap it were from folk in the North- Anglesey, Wrexham, Conwy, Flint and so on. I hope those folk have the sense to vote Labour out.
@@kriskalpa We were taught to drive within the speed limit but to "read" the road and adjust speed accordingly, not drive at the speed limit regardless. You may not of had an accident but how many have you caused?
What happened to teaching people how to cross roads safely? Or should pedestrians be permitted to just wander onto roads without looking? There also such things as Zebra Crossings and crossings with traffic lights in case you hadn't noticed.
No it hasn't. The first casualties of this 20mph fiasco was that dictator mark drakeford and his sidekick, Lee waters. Lee waters was a director of the charity sustrans. Sustrans a charity promoting sustainable transport. When Lee water became transport minister for wales, sustrans were awarded a flood of contracts from Welsh assembly and a massive chunk out of 33 million budget for rolling out this nonsense. Lee water appears to be a flat crook.
In Scotland many areas did the same thing, the only reason it hasn't hit the headlines is because no one takes any notice of them. Good money for sign makers though.
I can understand 20mph speed limits adjacent to primary schools and possibly old people’s homes and shopping precincts but anywhere else is overkill and turning this country into a nanny state.
I live just over the border with Wales in England. The benefit to my village of the 20 mph limit is an increase in traffic as more traffic drives through the village to aviod the 20 mph limit in Wales!
I sympathise with the sentiment, but £38 million is a tiny fraction of the annual £9 billion running cost of the NHS in Wales, so it wouldn't make much difference in the scheme of things. However, I agree that the money could have been better spent in other areas - in repairing the roads, for example.
@@ftumschk Extra 1000 full time qualified band 5/6 nurses not trainees. Not forgetting this is just one money wasting exercise, add them all up and its a new hospital fully staffed for years.
@@WhiteDieselShed ...for one year. This was a one-off exercise, don't forget. Where do you next year's £38m from, or the year after that? And this new hospital is all very well, but what about all the others? £38m in national government terms is a drop in the ocean.
6 million pounds a day for illegal immigrants 34 million is nothing for a hole country its only 8 pounds each for every Welsh person 2 pints of Carling 😊
Start by removing most of the traffic lights- it's always noticeable the traffic flows smoother when lights have failed. Moving traffic is less polluting per mile.
Traffic lights work far less well than roundabouts up to certain traffic levels. However, there is not always space for a roundabout. But yes, I could name several busy junctions which work a lot better when the lights have failed.
It is indeed but it doesn’t use as much fuel and therefore less tax for the goverment. They dont want free flowing traffic thats why they are turning roundabouts into junctions under the pretence of safety.
'Appropriate' speed has always been taught by driving instructors. It says it in the highway code. A 'good' driver shouldn't need any speed limit signs. I have thought for a long time now that councils impose unrealistically low speed limits, under the guise of 'safety', just to capture fines.
Your right. It's an excuse for revenue collection only that revenue doesn't go to fixing roads (like smart motorways). Wonder where all the fine and eco tax money goes.......?
I was in Wales the day this came in. It was so poorly implemented with roads going down to 20 that clearly should be 30. The local authorities just didn't use their power to keep 30 where appropriate. And i think the answer is 25mph, and change the law to make that possible.
At last!!! Someone in the Welsh Assembly with some Common Sense...This news deserves a round of applause from the beleaguered motorists of Wales..👏👏👏👏👏
I'd hold off on the applause until we see what they're actually going to change. If this is foisted off on councils how many of them are going to have the will and the funds to clear up the WAG's mess?
Its not easy keeping cars below 20 mph but i agree that 20mph should be used around schools. This makes perfect sense. Those led speed signs are all thats required to remind drivers of the speed change as they are really easy to see.
So you agree that 30 is too fast near children, but you think those children only deserve the protection of a lower speed limit once at the school, not when walking there on other roads. Good to know.
Anybody who was fined or recieved penalty points for exceeding the ridiculous 20mph by a few mph should be compensated and have points taken back and insurance premiums back to normal.
Most pedestrian vehicle accidents/ collisions are down to the pedestrians not watching where they are going , crossing without looking ,head in the phone ect, not down to speed so shall we re educate the peoples on road safety and not always blame the motorist , the only way to stop this is to get rid of all vehicles and how would you feel about going back 150 years just asking as no government body ever thinks things out fully before imposing its will and by the way people were still killed and injured by horse and carts so where do you stop . just saying
You're right. Not so many years ago, every school child in the country was taught the Green Cross Code - what happened to that? We had it drummed into us - look right, look left, look right again and only cross if it's all clear. Even now, I still do it.
Another thing, most of the people on bicycle don't even have a Hi-Vis, making it almost impossible to see them at night, or having headphones on and not being aware of the traffic
@@doru10922nothing like a bit of victim blaming, eh? If you get behind the wheel, it is on YOU to look where you are going. Should pedestrians wear helmets & hi-viz too?
Speed limits used to be based on the speed most motorists thought was safe. I live on a single track road with no lights so the speed limit is 60mph in spite of blind entrances and bends. The local A route road is straight with wide footpaths and housing set well back in large front gardens. Speed limit 20mph! Explain how sensible the difference is to a friend who has been struck several times by mirrors on vehicles on this road here.
I went to Wales recently and observed the 20 mph speed limit. On one particular day, I had patiently waited behind a slow moving bicycle travelling uphill in a 50mph speed limit and found myself completely unable to overtake leaving the statutory 2 metre clearance and sure enough , I had the time to observe that the self righteous cyclist had compromised hisown safety by clipping a go pro onto his helmet. Well, we eventually go to the top of the hill, the road straightened out and I was able to finally overtake legally. A further 1/4 mile up the road, we entered a built up area where there was a 20mph limit and I dutifully slowed since of course we were on the other side of the hill and we were now going downhill and looking at all the speed camera signs. The cyclist sped past us at well above the speed limit and was also overtaking on the inside and hardly leaving any gap at all. We passed through the built up area and the speed limit returned to 50 and we once again were climbing a hill very slowly following that same cyclist and were totally unable to pass. Eventually, the individual tired of his pedalling and became a pedestrian and therefore walked in the gutter with his bicycle....again disregarding the highway code in that he wasnt facing the oncoming traffic. The fact that this herbert had made himself a pedestiran then allowed me to find sufficient space to overtake in a totally legit manner.I concluded that neither the laws for unlicensed vehicles or the 20mph speed limit have been very well thought out. I wondered how many times speed cameras in 20mph regions have snapped cyclists. I also wondered how all this was of any actual benefit to the planet since the tailback from this one cyclist was substantial so much that I would imagine that it would have been extremely difficult for the cyclist to remount his bicycle in a safe manner for quite some time.
Cool story. You should perhaps re-read your Highway Code. Speed limits don’t apply to bikes and there’s no requirement for a cyclist to push their bike with the bike in the gutter facing oncoming traffic.
@@nuttycommuter3718 Hmmmm wrong! speed limits apply to all road users while you can't normally be charged for speeding on a bicycle you could, in extreme cases, be charged with careless cycling (maximum fine £1,000) or dangerous cycling (max fine £2,500). Furthermore, local bye-laws can impose limits on cyclists. and the highway code for pedestrians walking along roads with no pavements has stated that they should walk facing the oncoming traffic on the right hand side of the road. Perhaps you should have a look at the highway code, I learnt that one before I was old enough to hold a valid licence.If you're having trouble its under the guideance for pedestrians.Pedestrians pushing bicycles are not regarded as being any different to pedestrians pushing trolleys, zimmer frames or prams they are on thier feet, they are pedestrians.
I wish Quentin would have done a little research. The TfT's own research into towns and cities across the UK with 20mph zones shows no difference in accidents, injuries or fatalities after implementation.
I live in Wales and have decided to add 2 miles each way to my daily commute . This is for no other reason other than to avoid the 20mph zone roads and be stuck behind some buffoon travelling at 17mph. So, ironically, the new 20 zones have caused me to create MORE pollution 🤷♂
And Scotland are about to go down the 20mph route in addition to the present 20mphs already present AND spending 45 million in doing so. Makes you wonder who it's all for...
Speed is naturally moderated by drivers per the road design - NOT by signs posted along the way contrary to road design. Signs are over-simplistic failures by over-simplistic people's over-simplistic imaginations. You MUST think DEEPER, all the way to cause & effect.
West Devon Council apparently can't afford to change speed limits, our road has a school, doctors surgery and only pavments in places. There was an overwhelming response to a questionnaire in favour of a 20 mph limit in parts of the village here, that was several months ago and we've yet to hear anything. Personally I find the roads over the border in Cornwall to be much more in tune with modern thinking and methods, such as traffic calming and speed bumps.
We made all roads in towns, villages and cities comply with a blanket 30 mph speed limit as early as 1934. and its has stuck with us and done us well ever since. Some 95% plus of drivers adhere to it or near to it. The older 20 mph limit set previously was abandoned and removed by the RTA of 1930 as it fell into disrepute but then again many vehicles, prior to them becoming lawfully required in 1937,did not have a working speedometer. So how would a driver know that he was exceeding that 20 mph speed limit?.
For no reason at all other than revenue generation, they made the Welsh side of the M48 50mph meaning you now speed up to 60mph to cross the Severn Bridge! Makes me laugh every time I drive it 😂
He's been a motoring journalist for decades and perhaps while not an authority, he's an opinion people have listened to and more PAID to listen to for a very long time.
There's a road near me which recently changed to 20mph (from 30mph) which was a minor inconvenience. However, they have now added lots of really tall/ sharp speed bumps which throws the car around even at 12 mph. It's ridiculous.
Wales to roll back default 20mph speed limit because it was a terrible idea. Scotlands First Minister is spending £45 million on new road signs to introduce 20mph limits because......?
punishment for speeding in wales has always been taken to ridiculous level, like the guy that was charged and find for doing 33mph in a 30mph zone whilst riding a mountain bike. The 20mph limit was just a scam to be able to send out more fines and generate more income for the government.
@@silversurf6159 Although the speed limit doesn't usual apply to a bicycle, It is a criminal offense to ride a cycle either dangerously or without due care and attention whilst on a road. they deemed the speed he was at was dangerous that's how they got him.
Can you please convince the idiotic excuse we have for a government in Scotland not to waste £45 million on even attempting to make the same mistake. 🇬🇧
I have noticed our local roads are far more dangerous since the 20 mph limits. The 20 limits take away ones attention to their driving and many others are completely ignoring it and speeding past in a dangerous manor. As a pedestrian since the 20 limit I have to be very careful. Basically its a complete failure.
Setting speed limits absurdly low will make lots more money in fines.💶💶💶💶💶 If you can’t catch the real criminals then criminalise the people you can catch 🙈
What’s needed here in Wales is to return to common sense when councils applied for a 20 mph zone outside schools, hospitals, care homes etc.. Something else that’s needed is data from the eight areas of Wales that have now had 20mph imposed upon them for over two years showing how many lives/serious injuries have been saved due to the 20mph limit.
Was this the Consercative party who voted *for* the 20mph originally, and whose Leader Andrew R T Davies called ‘common sense’? This was before the backlash of course and now they’ve jumped on the opportunist bandwagon.
The main problem was when you have questions in the official small consultation that the Welsh Govt did, which was about 1000 people, that confused or even tried to mislead people. The official questionnaire has now been quite hard to find, anywhere (Lee Walters must have taken it with him hen he suddenly left!!) but when the main question was something along the lines of, 'Do you agree with a 20mph zone on restricted roads where there are pedestrians and cyclists' Well, I think most would say yes to that as you would be thinking of a town center, village school etc where there are people walking around. However, the sly part they put in there was, 'Restricted Roads'. How many people actually know that a restricted road is actually a normal 30mph road. Certain councils went to far, but then again they wern't given proper guidance. 20mph on some roads and some areas in extremely dangerous as some are driving at about 18-19moh thinking they will get a speeding tickets above that. Some are now chancing pulling out at junctions or overtaking people when they never did when it was 30mph. It's one of the worst things the Welsh Govt has ever brought in. They need to concentrate on things that actually makes a difference to peoples lives in Wales and not try and think they are getting one up on Westminster by doing things differently,
It’s the stupidest law. It’s making travelling a nightmare for visitors. When I go to Wales I feel nervous the whole time because it’s so random that I don’t know how fast to drive as it’s not clear what the speed should be. I just copy the local traffic.
Drakeford was Too Cheap to accept his deluded Policy was Wrong How about saying 40mph max on the tiny little lanes in the countryside which are Peppered with potholes
So who’s going to pay the £33 million that it cost to change all the signs, plus the more money needed to change back again? Yet again a perfect example of why the devolution experiment does not work 🤨.
All cars should be speed restricted to to walking pace - and have a man walking in front of them waving a red flag !!!! - We all know that this is not about air quality and not about safety ! Responsible drivers know the appropriate speed for their vehicle and the external conditions - before our police force became politicised they would only 'nick' you for speeding if you drove at a speed which was unreasonable and too fast for the conditions - regardless of the speeding signs - for example if you were driving through a 30 limit at 45 mph on a deserted road at 3.00am they would not stop you ! These ridiculous speed limits stick yet another blow to the heart of our free and democratic society.
in a 20Mph zone, I have to drive in second gear. This means that the engine is doing more than twice as many revolutions and therefore twice as many cylinder fulls of 'pollution' _and_ I am present in the area making 'noise' (the other environmental argument) for 33% LONGER than if I were driving at 30Mph. I also waste potential energy in braking for the 20Mph zone and then waste even more fuel accelerating to a more reasonable speed _after_ the zone - which adds to the 'pollution'. Some 'touristy' streets do need a lower speed limit - perhaps even 15mph likened to a pedestrian zone. Some places in Wales have temporary 20Mph zone around school areas - '20Mph when lights are showing' - I am totally on-board with that. For almost everywhere else, 30Mph is perfectly safe when prevailing conditions are considered. Quentin's comment about *DRIVER TRAINING* really is on the money - I have been driving for over 40 years and seen driver skills and cognisance fall to face-palm levels, mostly in the last 10 years. In that time I have never crashed or killed any pedestrians whilst the speed limits were 30Mph through towns and 60 on all other country lanes and A roads - the same experience as the majority of sensible, well-trained drivers - so the observable evidence is at odds with the propaganda. ALL driving examiners should be re-trained and be MORE inclined to fail learners when _any_ inadequacy is detected (lives depend on it!). People who fail more than three times should be banned from driving for life (driving is clearly NOT for everyone) - it is a privilege earned and NOT a right. *And what about electric cars - they do not pollute at the point of driving,* so against this environmental argument, they should be allowed to drive faster (particularly 70 through the 50 zones that are posted as 'speed reduced to protect the environment') - and yes, I know that is impractical since the 'delta-v' (that means difference in speed between cars) would be a cause of collision risk. *But then we are back to punishing the innocent majority for the transgressions of the negligent minority instead of dealing with the REAL problem.* The whole ideology is ridicules.
The only cars that would have to use 2nd gear to handle 20 mph would be cars from the '70s and back, these cars had weak engines and a limited number of gears. I don't think staying in 2nd gear is necessary in a modern car, which I'd define as being a car from the late '90s and newer. Even the ones with single litre engines should be alright to handle 20 mph in 3rd or even 4th gear, on road without inclines. However, that's not to say that an automatic transmission will do it right. Many automatic transmissions from around the turn of the millennium had less gear ratios than their manual counterparts. As such, when sticking to 20 mph, some might not even bother with changing to 3rd gear. Cruise control systems in cars from the '00s, cars which were never designed to drive at 20 mph, often won't even turn on at 20. You'd need to be doing 30 mph for that. But yeah, I'm with you for the most part. Just don't give yourself seasickness from the strong engine braking of 2nd gear, yeah?
duel carriage ways should be at least 40 not 30mph its a joke some people can run the speed of 20mph and ive been overtaken by pushbikes, going faster then 20, When are the people in charge going to realise that its the pedestrians that need educating to cross the roads at the right places and not in between cars on busy roads. Doing 20 in the same area for longer will still churn out the smoke, it must be just as bad as being in an area for less time doing 30, as well as causing damage to the vehicles travelling at that speed in between gears. i honestly think the people in charge are loonys or they dont use the highways themselves, probably they are chauffeur driven in company cars.
The person that first brought in the 30 mph speed limit knew what and why he was doing it. His name that I know but not able to spell properly is associated with zebra crossings and the beacons that flash at the road side.
If you drive at 20mph you’ll just get flashed and cut up by drivers who don’t want to drive that slow. That’s happened to me in London where someone almost took my front wing off!
How is this going to work? So when they roll back selected roads, some roads will be marked 30mph and I’ll be able to go 30mph, whilst other roads I’ll go 30mph and ignore the stickered 20mph signs. Just when I’d got used to ignoring ALL the 20mph signs.
Don't worry the fools in Wales that want 20 mph everywhere can relocate to Scotland where they plan 20 mph for everyone. Cars, Buses, Lorries, Bicycles, Trains, Planes.
@Redducati1199 - this is happening in the South Wales valleys too. In my near 40 years of driving, I've noticed there were always drivers who would drive at around 5mph less than the speed limit, even if the road was perfectly straight and dry an with good visibility. As 20mph is such a slow speed anyway, driving at what amounts to 75% of the actual limit is so much more noticeable. To be fair, though, I think they're afraid of accidentally reaching 21mph and being done for speeding.
@800beemer - the 20mph blanket limit has stopped people staring at phones, satnavs and dashboard screens as they are too busy staring at the speedometer. I now set my speed limiter at 20mph so I can concentrate on actual driving and being aware of what's happening around my car as I'm driving rather than trying to keep my car at or below 20mph.
I'm a Londoner living in Wales. The labour government, in Wales, has completely lost the plot over the last few years. The 20mph madness and their stance on gender and eroding women's rights has lost them my vote. Reform UK or SDP for me.
Reform are just a different bunch of vocal elites though really. Leadership with unifying ethics plus actual economic chops are what is needed in Cymru.
Also scientifically proven that if pedestrians look before they go into a road, then there will be less deaths. Just teach children & adults the Green Cross Code. Problem solved.
Regards the question of public consultation. Little or no such consultation was ever carried out as the use of vehicles developed and increased. That latter failure has allowed massive problems with use of vehicles to develop unchecked and unmonitored (for the most part). All we are hearing against these speed limits, is arguably the shouty voice of the more aggressive vehicle user; and they very much involved in the problems associated with vehicle use. The age of unlimited rights for vehicle users is over. Now other constituencies are having their voices heard. Driving and vehicle use, is a privilege, not a right; so accept and obey required regulation in a densely packed world of diverse stakeholders.
Accept and obey? They've got you well trained I see 🤷♀️ wait till they come after something you value because they will. You will own nothing and be happy.
@@BeaHindebars Life doesn't boil down to a binary between fundamentalist anarchy and supine subservience. Myriad reasoned positions exist between these polar extremes. There isn't then a single monolithic sinister "they". Life comes at you on myriad pathways, and you judge what comes at you on its own merits and demerits. Some things you support and some you oppose. For me these 20mph speed limits need to be supported (on their merits); and those who break these speed limits need to be opposed (on their demerits). "They" do not make an appearance or have an effect.
@@BeaHindebars "They" is a term and concept, embedded in an ideology, which plays part in the self-construction of some people. There are many other alternative options for self-construction, which do not involve this term and concept and ideological dynamic.
Instead of interfering with people in every aspect of our lives, the best way to “take the public with you” is to just leave us alone and let us get on with our lives. Instead we get constant petty rules!!!
![The Wrong Way to Set Speed Limits [ST06]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bglWCuCMSWc/mqdefault.jpg)
You could fill an awful lot of potholes with the £34m it cost to put up unneeded road signs.
I wonder how much it costs to deal with the injuries and fatalities and material-damage and necessary policing and judicial process, associated with self-entitled individuals driving too fast and too unskilfully. Then environmental and health costs associated with the production and usage of vehicles. My sense is that these associated costs would be many, many times £34m.
@@creepycrawlything Bah, survival of the fittest. Natural selection would get rid of all the idiot drivers
@ianbaker8225 Yeah, but then people might _want_ to drive, and be happier.
@@dungareesareforfools This seems to be the driving factor Ian. Namely, individuals so prioritising themselves, than they might refuse to adhere to laws which are for the benefit of everyone. They can still drive faster than 20mph in all sorts of places, but still they want more just for themselves, even if it is to the disadvantage of others.
With modern think they'd probably spend £34m digging new potholes to slow people down!
20 mph was a ridiculous imposition.
Depends on the area.
It's good in housing estate schools and anywhere with higher foot traffic . Blanket 20 was to much
This was and is the biggest issue in Wales.Wales is sorted now and it has no issues of any kind.If someone disagrees it will breach the hate crime law against the government and so ut will be sent to reeducation camps where they will remain till they see the situation in Wales and Britain in a positive way.
In worse case scenario the Government will legalise the usage of hard drugs or adopt the Canadian legislation where a citizen can request a free euthanasia if they are not happy with the government.
Crazy it sounds to a regular person listening to this and the whole thing to the government doesn't see they incompetence and lack of care for the future of British children is what is the source of the issues and problems on the country and the a 20 mph speed limit.
Letting 1 million immigrants in to our country a year was also a ridiculous imposition.
@@87stevan Don't you think that the two are not really comparable?
Having silly speed limits makes everyone lose respect for the rules
Exactly 💯
I think they should make the speed limit not apply to motorcycles because it's safest if we go faster than cars, same as HGVs and Vans are not allowed above a certain speed. A road that I use frequently has become much more dangerous after they reduced speed limit, you are in car driver's blind spot at a junction for a long time so they pull out on you. whereas I never had it when the speed limit was 40. I always expect it's going to happen btw but christ, it's gone from never happening to everytime someone will pull out on you.
How about just making speed limits make sense for the road they’re applied to? Then you do public service ad campaign to promote safe driving alongside an equitable system of speed monitoring and fines. Treat the public with respect and fairness for a change.
We should try having conceptual speed limits, not numerical ones. Think "low", "medium", and "natural", and then we teach drivers that "low" means you should be driving between 15 and 30 miles an hour on high alert, being extra cautious (replaces 20 and 30), "Medium" means from 30 to 50 on wider roads with less pedestrian traffic (replaces 40 and 50) and "Natural" means "Drive as you feel safe" (replaces 60 and national, no maximum).
Allow people to drive as they feel is safe, allow judges to decide when someone's idea of safe is unacceptable, and you will vastly improve people's attitude toward driving.
@@icedreamer9629 ...and their skills. We're currently on a path of dumbing down driving skills as much as possible, rather than being selective on who drives and encouraging aspirations to be better drivers.
They never undertook any meaningful public consultations.
The questionnaire didnt even mention 20mph
'We're fully aware that absolutely no one likes it, needs it or wants it, but we're doing it anyway..' should Never be uttered by any Politician to the Citizenry.
@terencejay8845 Not true. I think it's great.
They shut it down
I notice Wilson never replied on the question of pollution reduction. Surely pollution would be higher when you drop a gear to maintain 20mph. If the data has been collected before/after the change (and I doubt is has) then why has it not been published.
I am not in Wales but my town got a 20mph blanket speed limit. Most people only wanted the limits in residential areas and near schools. As a result 90% of drivers ignore the limits, and those which do obey it cause anger, frustration and dangerous overtaking. Accidents as a result have gone up.
Just like UK government guidance said would happen with a blanket 20mph
when the said about a 20mph speed limit in wales most people thought it was for residential areas or out side of a school and if it was the case their would be no problem
but ive been driving along and their isn't a house on either side of the road, just fields and i'm rolling along at 20 mph
I'm on the border (Hereford) and if you stick to 20mph limit when in Wales then most people will overtake you. I think 20mph specifically applied in areas like schools, residential,etc (after consultation) would have been broadly supported by most - this would have been a smarter move.
Which town is it?
@@AdamBuckley1964 there isn’t a blanket 20mph limit when you cross the border. It’s a myth. The 20mph limit is restricted to residential areas and villages. Most roads have the national speed limits 70 for dual carriageways and 60 for single carriageways (as default) with lower limits according to the nature of the roads (ie 50, 40, 30).
I’m not sure why folks believe that it’s 20 everywhere in Wales. I think it was an impression created by Westminster in order to make the non-existent ‘Woke War on Motorists’ a wedge issue. There’s really no such thing but it’s quite easy to push some people’s buttons and get them into a steaming rage about anything. … as the comments under this vid show rather clearly.
What happened to the green cross code. people need to take responsibility for their own actions not relying on the government to tell them what to do.
Richard, we need state nanny to tell us what to do. 20mph was Bullscheisse in the first place.
@@PHlophe I used to tell my kids you can do anything you want and be anything you want in this country, i think it is getting so you can be anything the government wants you to be.my father used to say they will be charging for fresh air next, guess what.
Exactly my thoughts. People think children are too thick to learn how to cross a road safely. They are wrong. I (and all of my school) learnt that "skill" at the age of 4 years old. Not teaching children is imho total neglect.
Children do their best, but unfortunately they are impulsive and make mistakes. These mistakes are significantly more likely to result in death if struck by a vehicle at 30mph than at 20mph. The evidence for this is strong.
@@45graham45
Look right look left and look right again and if it's safe to cross go ahead but not with a bloody phone clamped in your hand in front of your eyes.....
£33 million wasted on putting up 20mph roadsigns yet the Welsh Labour Government totally ingnored the fact that Wales has a NHS dental care crisis due to the near total lack of availability of any NHS dentists, this is the reality of a Labour led Government, remember this when you cast your vote at the next General Election.
Yeah, NHS dentists are falling from the sky here in Tory lead England.
@@anonymes2884 pay them and they will immigrate from other countries. or even better... nationals will stop risking high loans to setup their private practices.
The clue is 33 million, laundered y the city of London, the 33 freemason borough
HEAR HEAR.
I don't see what's got to do with Scotland cars going so quick you can just flurry dreadful really
I like the 20 limit. It gives me time to catch up on texts and emails while I’m driving.
I love it 😂
😂
That's in pretty poor taste.
@@rob5944 I thought the same, seems a waste of time as you can easily do that when you have stopped driving, this is why I prefer to catch up on the latest box sets on Netflix and prime whilst I’m driving
@@rob5944 Get a grip
£32m for 20mph signs across the country plus what ever other expenses they spent our tax money on. How many more millions of pounds of tax payers money are they going to waste rectifying this
How did it cost so much and why didn't they just stick a 20 signs over the 30 instead of changing the whole sign. Also there is a cul de sac near where I live it's only a few yards long and would be impossible to go at more than 10 mph but they have spent loads of £££ changing the signs and also putting a red colour tar mac with a big 20 sign painted on top. Must have cost a couple of hundred quid !!!
Change it to 3 mph. Think of the lives it would save !!! Then ban all motorcycles, then all cars, then all trucks then all buses. Ban everything that moves!!
Hear hear! Sloths probably generate almost no CO2. Better yet, let's all become sea sponges.
It's better to be safe than sorry. People should also wear helmets in public.
No, no need for that. Just bring back the man with the red flag to walk before the vehicles, just to ensure that our roads are 100% safe and effective. Just like the you know what!
remember pedestrians breath out co2
That is the plan, never heard of 15 minute cities? They don't want us having the ability to move freely, thank the WEF for that idea.
I live in Wales and I knew nothing about the law until the last stages before it became law. The police in Newtown, Powys don't even stick to 20mph so that's what the law thinks of the speed limit lol. I live in a village and there are six speed changes in 200m. The whole thing is a waste of money Wales doesn't have and it now a big embarrassment. Mark Drakeford has left a wake of debt and ruin including the NHS.
Then you must live under a bridge. It was in the manifesto and then it was in the news for months before it happened
I was taught how to cross a road safely. I've never been hit by a car, yet...
nor me, and all through my life the speed limit was 50% higher than now.
Tufty the Squirrel, The Green Cross Man aka David Prowse (Darth Vader actor) and Alvin Stardust taught me to cross the road in the 1970s 😊
I was obviously taught poorly I have been hit by one once and it hurt so I decided not to do that again....
@iceninja46 you got the point, unfortunately people are only getting dumber 😊
@@zedcarr6128 yes and there was 1/3 of the number of cars on the roads compared to today
I live on a main road in Wales with 20mph AND 2 schools and very few drivers do 20mph and a heck of a lot do more than 30. Why didn’t someone with a brain work all this out before spending was it 34 million and now spending more millions changing it. Well done Labour in Wales
Looks like you have provided evidence that Wales needs to spend more on policing.
@@davecooper3238Do you think 20mph is needed during the night when the main roads are empty ? 20mph on side roads is perfectly fine but on main roads, no it’s just an annoyance nothing more
@@Youafool500 It was an pain when the original 70mph National Speed Limit came in. We could no longer ride as fast as we liked.
Labour is the epitome of the Nanny State. They can’t help themselves
@@davecooper3238 The national speed limit is 60 MPH. 70 MPH is the speed permitted on motorways. Before posting utter drivel....do some research.
What Wales needs to do now is recoup all the wasted money in this ridiculous 20MPH scheme, and it's reversal, from Mark Drakeford personally.
I wonder how much they have made from fines from people driving at 23 mph
Drakefords personal finances need to be investigated now ( like Sturgeons ) .
It was actually the brainchild of a guy called Lee Waters, the Senedd member for Llanelli. Drakeford merely championed the idea.
There is not a shred of plausible evidence that shows you get cleaner air from driving at 20mph v 30 mph. Complete cobblers.
in a ev?
Well said..👏👏👏
You don't. Vehicles are not designed to drive at 20MPH. The gear ratio matches 30MPH, so people have to change down a gear, especially when going up hill, this means that the engine revs are higher, and it produces more pollution.
@@zedcarr6128... You can change the differentials to adjust the ratios and behaviour of the gear increments.
Also overcooking your velocity to speeds you can't maintain for long before needing to breaking creates far more pollution than higher revs.
Accelerating and breaking hard over and over and over "accelerbreaking" about complex areas with frequent junctions, lights and obstacles is going to create very high pollution.
you do not get cleaner air if you drive at 20mph, you get the opposite.
Biggest waste of money
Ken Skates pushed this thru when NHS was desperate for funds! Other people’s money! Labour career MPs
Where do people go when they get knocked down?
The NHS.
This will save the country money and lives.
50,000 Women who have been subjected to fgm, have been moved into The UK, how are the NHS going to Deal With That?@@julianshepherd2038
@@julianshepherd2038 Where do people go when there's a road rage incident and someone gets assaulted because they are stuck behind someone doing 17 mph the NHS costing more money and clogging up the NHS.
Lee Waters was the main instigator in implementing the disastrous 20mph zones here in Wales. No surprise he’s since resigned his position as transport minister and left Ken Skates to pick up the mess he left in his wake.
The problem with the "it reduces injuries and fatalities" argument is that it has no end point. If that's the reason for doing it then the inescapable conclusion is that the speed limit should immediately be lowered to zero mph on every road. The other aspect to the argument is that it's always implied that it's drivers and their speed who are responsible for accidents with pedestrians. If someone is run over on the highway, isn't it part of the equation to ask what they were doing on the highway to be run down? The road is for road users, not pedestrians. Nobody EVER mentions better road safety education for pedestrians as a way of reducing accidents.
Sorry bro. Don't be silly. How on earth did you get 11 upvotes without any criticism?
Every "road user" by which i assume you mean "motorist", becomes a pedestrian before they start the journey and after they complete it , so what is this nonsensical distinction between "road users" and pedestrians?
Are you certain the child that got knocked down outside a school may not have been dropped at school by a parent?
When it was just horse buggies and bicycles said "highways" were perfectly safe for pedestrians. It was motor vehicles that brought danger to the roads. Remember they were limited to 4mph max and had to be preceded by a man with a flag? Separate sidewalks were not even necessary except in busy environments. If a public highway is so narrow that a person absentmindedly stepping into the path of car will be severely injured or killed, the cars shouldn't be there or the maximum speed should be severely curtailed. 12mph tops, which is the condition you normally get around schools. Just as a reminder, the roads outside schools are "public highways"
@@vonhabsi4158I think you need to reconsider your ridiculous comment. The OP's comment is a sound analysis.
Yep, OP said it exactly as it is, but there will always be people who are hurt by the truth.
When I was in school in the '60s we were taught the Green Cross Code. Stop, look right, look left, look right again and then cross when it is safe. This was also reinforced with examples on TV showing how you stayed safe as a pedestrian. This modern idea that pedestrians and cyclists have right of way is patently daft, as it takes away responsibility from the people who are going the slowest and who are therefore able to stop in the shortest possible distance. Ya canna change the laws of physics!
It seems that hardly anyone on this threads understands why "accidents" are "accidents". Could it because they are "accidental"?
People make mistakes, misjudgements, lapses in concentration, or even sudden illness like strokes etc.
The whole idea is that when "accidents" happen the speeds are low enough not to cause serious injury or death. Are there others besides me in this thread who understand this?
20 mph is fine on short side roads, outside schools and hospitals, but it causes anger, road rage and dangerous overtaking situations on long main roads.
Bath imposed 20mph speed limits, a new study has shown that fatalities and collisions increased in all areas where the new limits were imposed ,after driving with the new limits in Wales I can tell you it does not work ,schools hospitals ,fine ,and it was imposed by someone who does not even drive
i live in the south wales valleys and have never known there to be accidents like there are now since this ridiculous 20 mph law has come in people are getting frustrated by being stuck behind drivers doing 20 mph and taking risks to overtake not only that but the build up of traffic on the roads is just causing traffic jams everywhere it only takes one car in front doing 20 and thats it the traffic keeps building up until theres a queue half a mile long that idiot drakeford needs his head seeing to for bringing this ludicrous law in utter stupidity
I live in Wales and a blanket 20mph is insane. I support 20mph in purely residential areas, outside schools, hospitals, care homes etc. But they were putting these on arterial roads which provide critical traffic links, one road I drive regularly goes from 40mph to 20 mph to 30mph to 50mph, the 20 mph element in the middle of that is a 1.5 mile stretch through countryside with no side roads or junctions, it also has a pavement and streetlights.
Utter, utter madness 🙄
It would have been simple to say the proposal does not apply to classified roads.
Luckily for you, it’s not a blanket 20mph, as you demonstrated with your example
Exactly, a sensible limit for the road. I'd love a 20 here as there are no pavements, a primary school, a doctors surgery and only room for one car if there are others parked. People zoom along and if someone stepped out they'd have nowhere to go. In fact I'm amazed nobody has bit hit, yet the council doesn't seem bothered. Even at 20 I doubt you'd even get to the brake pedal, let alone stop.
I visited Wales last year and driving 20mph on what was a 40mph was surreal and painful.
This would stop me going to Wales, but maybe thats their goal?
20 MPH is bulshit
Makes sense in some places. Around schools, small residential roads, places used primarily by pedestrians. But as a default it's just ridiculous.
@andybrice2711 Yes, but you can use your common sense around the school ,Hospital etc we did all the life before
20 MPH was imposed
It's probably about equal to your IQ.
@@balajat786 Yeah, but some people don't have that common sense. Their perception of risk is greatly distorted.
So in some scenarios (like around schools) it's reasonable to prioritize safety over convenience.
I respect your brevity.
I got zapped 26 in a 20. Going uphill from 2nd into 3rd. Road used to be 30. Some **** with a motorbike with a camera. This is not about safety just pure revenue raising.
Why didn't they ask the public in the first place 😕
Apparently there was a poll. Loaded questions designed to get the required response. 1000 people in South Wales were approached.
@@robert100xx CANT do that we are just the unwashed and unknowing dumb plebs so why ask us
It was in their manifesto. People really should find out what the parties stand for but they just vote blindly on tribal lines.
1200 people were asked and just 600 approved the idea. So Drakeford went with the 600 out of a population of over 3 million.
@@robert100xx Yes, it was noticeable that by far the most signatures on that petition to scrap it were from folk in the North- Anglesey, Wrexham, Conwy, Flint and so on. I hope those folk have the sense to vote Labour out.
When I learned to drive we were taught to take road conditions into account for how fast we drove
So we shouldn't?
and that is what I do. I don't pay attention to speed limits so the 20mph is meaningless to me. I have never been in an accident and drive safely.
@@kriskalpa We were taught to drive within the speed limit but to "read" the road and adjust speed accordingly, not drive at the speed limit regardless.
You may not of had an accident but how many have you caused?
@@mariemccann5895 "So we shouldn't " What?
This is NOT a forum for sensible comments .
It's been scientifically proven that driving at 1mph drastically reduces injuries to pedestrians.
😂
what a load of 💩
What happened to teaching people how to cross roads safely? Or should pedestrians be permitted to just wander onto roads without looking? There also such things as Zebra Crossings and crossings with traffic lights in case you hadn't noticed.
No it hasn't. The first casualties of this 20mph fiasco was that dictator mark drakeford and his sidekick, Lee waters. Lee waters was a director of the charity sustrans. Sustrans a charity promoting sustainable transport. When Lee water became transport minister for wales, sustrans were awarded a flood of contracts from Welsh assembly and a massive chunk out of 33 million budget for rolling out this nonsense. Lee water appears to be a flat crook.
But it hasn't.
In Scotland many areas did the same thing, the only reason it hasn't hit the headlines is because no one takes any notice of them. Good money for sign makers though.
agreed. they can put up signs for 5mph and I will continue to drive at 30 and according to road conditions.
The ministers involved in implementing this should be reimbursing the Welsh public purse from their own pockets
I can understand 20mph speed limits adjacent to primary schools and possibly old people’s homes and shopping precincts but anywhere else is overkill and turning this country into a nanny state.
I live just over the border with Wales in England. The benefit to my village of the 20 mph limit is an increase in traffic as more traffic drives through the village to aviod the 20 mph limit in Wales!
SNP/Greens are still going ahead with their 20mph Scotland wide. They're spending 56 million on signs.
Cost of signs is 5 million.
Estimated saving to NHS is £56 million.
Well, that will help defund the police from dealing with real crime instead of politically motived ‘hate’ laws!
@@julianshepherd2038That is utter ridiculous nonsense & you must be seriously naive if you believe that,
Idiots.
that assembly won't be in power long enough to enforce it.
How much wasted ? £38m or more ? While the A&E wait times are 5 hours +
I sympathise with the sentiment, but £38 million is a tiny fraction of the annual £9 billion running cost of the NHS in Wales, so it wouldn't make much difference in the scheme of things. However, I agree that the money could have been better spent in other areas - in repairing the roads, for example.
@@ftumschk Extra 1000 full time qualified band 5/6 nurses not trainees. Not forgetting this is just one money wasting exercise, add them all up and its a new hospital fully staffed for years.
@@WhiteDieselShed ...for one year. This was a one-off exercise, don't forget. Where do you next year's £38m from, or the year after that? And this new hospital is all very well, but what about all the others?
£38m in national government terms is a drop in the ocean.
6 million pounds a day for illegal immigrants 34 million is nothing for a hole country its only 8 pounds each for every Welsh person 2 pints of Carling 😊
Start by removing most of the traffic lights- it's always noticeable the traffic flows smoother when lights have failed. Moving traffic is less polluting per mile.
Traffic lights work far less well than roundabouts up to certain traffic levels. However, there is not always space for a roundabout. But yes, I could name several busy junctions which work a lot better when the lights have failed.
It is indeed but it doesn’t use as much fuel and therefore less tax for the goverment. They dont want free flowing traffic thats why they are turning roundabouts into junctions under the pretence of safety.
'Appropriate' speed has always been taught by driving instructors. It says it in the highway code. A 'good' driver shouldn't need any speed limit signs. I have thought for a long time now that councils impose unrealistically low speed limits, under the guise of 'safety', just to capture fines.
Your right. It's an excuse for revenue collection only that revenue doesn't go to fixing roads (like smart motorways). Wonder where all the fine and eco tax money goes.......?
There’s a way to never pay one of those fines. I had to pay one once, but since I’ve learnt this trick I’ve not had to pay a single one
The £30,000,000 cost of this idiocy must be taken from politicians' pension pots.
I was in Wales the day this came in. It was so poorly implemented with roads going down to 20 that clearly should be 30. The local authorities just didn't use their power to keep 30 where appropriate.
And i think the answer is 25mph, and change the law to make that possible.
At last!!! Someone in the Welsh Assembly with some Common Sense...This news deserves a round of applause from the beleaguered motorists of Wales..👏👏👏👏👏
I'd hold off on the applause until we see what they're actually going to change. If this is foisted off on councils how many of them are going to have the will and the funds to clear up the WAG's mess?
Welsh senedd not assembly it's a fully fledged government assembly was 15 years ago 😊
Politicians making up silly speed limits means everyone loses respect for politicians.
Where I live the mostinconvenience is caused by drivers adhering to the 20mph limit on roads which for years were 30mph roads.
Why are the folk who make these ridiculous decision with public money NEVER HELD ACCOUNTABLE…!!!!😡😡😡
Its not easy keeping cars below 20 mph but i agree that 20mph should be used around schools. This makes perfect sense. Those led speed signs are all thats required to remind drivers of the speed change as they are really easy to see.
So you agree that 30 is too fast near children, but you think those children only deserve the protection of a lower speed limit once at the school, not when walking there on other roads. Good to know.
Yes, but not at 01:00 hrs in the morning when there is no-one in the schools!
Anybody who was fined or recieved penalty points for exceeding the ridiculous 20mph by a few mph should be compensated and have points taken back and insurance premiums back to normal.
Most pedestrian vehicle accidents/ collisions are down to the pedestrians not watching where they are going , crossing without looking ,head in the phone ect, not down to speed so shall we re educate the peoples on road safety and not always blame the motorist , the only way to stop this is to get rid of all vehicles and how would you feel about going back 150 years just asking as no government body ever thinks things out fully before imposing its will and by the way people were still killed and injured by horse and carts so where do you stop . just saying
You're right. Not so many years ago, every school child in the country was taught the Green Cross Code - what happened to that? We had it drummed into us - look right, look left, look right again and only cross if it's all clear. Even now, I still do it.
Another thing, most of the people on bicycle don't even have a Hi-Vis, making it almost impossible to see them at night, or having headphones on and not being aware of the traffic
@@doru10922nothing like a bit of victim blaming, eh? If you get behind the wheel, it is on YOU to look where you are going. Should pedestrians wear helmets & hi-viz too?
@@ultimobici. Try and think a bit, is not about blaming, is about safety, I don't think pedestrians share the road I think it is called footpath?
Totally agree with Quentin. Schools and parks I agree, but the blanket 20mph is absurd 5:00 and stressful
We are talking about "Drakeford" here, one cannot expect any comon sense to make an appearance.
Hint: Roads are for CARS; they are not playgrounds.
Why not tell pedestrians to look both ways before crossing a road?
Speed limits used to be based on the speed most motorists thought was safe. I live on a single track road with no lights so the speed limit is 60mph in spite of blind entrances and bends. The local A route road is straight with wide footpaths and housing set well back in large front gardens. Speed limit 20mph! Explain how sensible the difference is to a friend who has been struck several times by mirrors on vehicles on this road here.
Lower-speed roads require less maintenance. Coincidence?
What a waste of “public” money, those responsible for the waste should be made to pay it back out of their own pockets🤷🏻♂️
I went to Wales recently and observed the 20 mph speed limit. On one particular day, I had patiently waited behind a slow moving bicycle travelling uphill in a 50mph speed limit and found myself completely unable to overtake leaving the statutory 2 metre clearance and sure enough , I had the time to observe that the self righteous cyclist had compromised hisown safety by clipping a go pro onto his helmet. Well, we eventually go to the top of the hill, the road straightened out and I was able to finally overtake legally. A further 1/4 mile up the road, we entered a built up area where there was a 20mph limit and I dutifully slowed since of course we were on the other side of the hill and we were now going downhill and looking at all the speed camera signs. The cyclist sped past us at well above the speed limit and was also overtaking on the inside and hardly leaving any gap at all. We passed through the built up area and the speed limit returned to 50 and we once again were climbing a hill very slowly following that same cyclist and were totally unable to pass. Eventually, the individual tired of his pedalling and became a pedestrian and therefore walked in the gutter with his bicycle....again disregarding the highway code in that he wasnt facing the oncoming traffic. The fact that this herbert had made himself a pedestiran then allowed me to find sufficient space to overtake in a totally legit manner.I concluded that neither the laws for unlicensed vehicles or the 20mph speed limit have been very well thought out. I wondered how many times speed cameras in 20mph regions have snapped cyclists. I also wondered how all this was of any actual benefit to the planet since the tailback from this one cyclist was substantial so much that I would imagine that it would have been extremely difficult for the cyclist to remount his bicycle in a safe manner for quite some time.
....zzzzzzzzzz...🙂↔️🙂↔️🙂↔️
Cool story. You should perhaps re-read your Highway Code. Speed limits don’t apply to bikes and there’s no requirement for a cyclist to push their bike with the bike in the gutter facing oncoming traffic.
@@JamesLWilliams-k9x and still you read it all!!!
@@nuttycommuter3718 Hmmmm wrong! speed limits apply to all road users while you can't normally be charged for speeding on a bicycle you could, in extreme cases, be charged with careless cycling (maximum fine £1,000) or dangerous cycling (max fine £2,500). Furthermore, local bye-laws can impose limits on cyclists. and the highway code for pedestrians walking along roads with no pavements has stated that they should walk facing the oncoming traffic on the right hand side of the road. Perhaps you should have a look at the highway code, I learnt that one before I was old enough to hold a valid licence.If you're having trouble its under the guideance for pedestrians.Pedestrians pushing bicycles are not regarded as being any different to pedestrians pushing trolleys, zimmer frames or prams they are on thier feet, they are pedestrians.
@@geofwassell speed limits only apply to motorised vehicles. Read the law
We have lost all faith in the government
I wish Quentin would have done a little research. The TfT's own research into towns and cities across the UK with 20mph zones shows no difference in accidents, injuries or fatalities after implementation.
I meant DfT not TfT
Most accidents occur in towns below 20 mph,in the rush hour that has been fact for decades..
@@paulbrookes5365 Are most of these accidents people crossing? Probably no data but crossing in front of or behind a bus?
I live in Wales and have decided to add 2 miles each way to my daily commute . This is for no other reason other than to avoid the 20mph zone roads and be stuck behind some buffoon travelling at 17mph.
So, ironically, the new 20 zones have caused me to create MORE pollution 🤷♂
And Scotland are about to go down the 20mph route in addition to the present 20mphs already present AND spending 45 million in doing so. Makes you wonder who it's all for...
20mph causes more pollution. That alone should swing it.
Speed is naturally moderated by drivers per the road design - NOT by signs posted along the way contrary to road design. Signs are over-simplistic failures by over-simplistic people's over-simplistic imaginations. You MUST think DEEPER, all the way to cause & effect.
West Devon Council apparently can't afford to change speed limits, our road has a school, doctors surgery and only pavments in places. There was an overwhelming response to a questionnaire in favour of a 20 mph limit in parts of the village here, that was several months ago and we've yet to hear anything. Personally I find the roads over the border in Cornwall to be much more in tune with modern thinking and methods, such as traffic calming and speed bumps.
We made all roads in towns, villages and cities comply with a blanket 30 mph speed limit as early as 1934. and its has stuck with us and done us well ever since. Some 95% plus of drivers adhere to it or near to it. The older 20 mph limit set previously was abandoned and removed by the RTA of 1930 as it fell into disrepute but then again many vehicles, prior to them becoming lawfully required in 1937,did not have a working speedometer. So how would a driver know that he was exceeding that 20 mph speed limit?.
Don’t lie. Multiple sources confirm that 80% of drivers happily admit regularly breaking the speed limit
Imagine believing it cost 33,000,000 to put up some road signs 🤡🙄🥱
For no reason at all other than revenue generation, they made the Welsh side of the M48 50mph meaning you now speed up to 60mph to cross the Severn Bridge! Makes me laugh every time I drive it 😂
mathematically the slower you go the harder the engine works. 20mph is not a environmental issue. What makes mr wilson an authority?
He's been a motoring journalist for decades and perhaps while not an authority, he's an opinion people have listened to and more PAID to listen to for a very long time.
"mathematically"
...
Your mathematics is complete garbage, I'm afraid.
@@gazza595 - he's also a big proponent of EVs so he must be right about environmental issues. LOL.
Wrong
20mph on large main roads just makes people angry snd frustrated
There's a road near me which recently changed to 20mph (from 30mph) which was a minor inconvenience. However, they have now added lots of really tall/ sharp speed bumps which throws the car around even at 12 mph. It's ridiculous.
Wales to roll back default 20mph speed limit because it was a terrible idea.
Scotlands First Minister is spending £45 million on new road signs to introduce 20mph limits because......?
punishment for speeding in wales has always been taken to ridiculous level, like the guy that was charged and find for doing 33mph in a 30mph zone whilst riding a mountain bike. The 20mph limit was just a scam to be able to send out more fines and generate more income for the government.
@bazzingabomb1705..........How did that come about ?
Cyclists do not have to comply with speed limits !!
@@silversurf6159 Although the speed limit doesn't usual apply to a bicycle, It is a criminal offense to ride a cycle either dangerously or without due care and attention whilst on a road. they deemed the speed he was at was dangerous that's how they got him.
Can you please convince the idiotic excuse we have for a government in Scotland not to waste £45 million on even attempting to make the same mistake. 🇬🇧
So how much tax payers money has all those 20mph now 30mph road signs cost and who signed it off? Whoever it was wants sacking!
I have noticed our local roads are far more dangerous since the 20 mph limits. The 20 limits take away ones attention to their driving and many others are completely ignoring it and speeding past in a dangerous manor. As a pedestrian since the 20 limit I have to be very careful. Basically its a complete failure.
Oh, dripford, the dictator and his incompetent cronies, got it all wrong. Tell us something we didn't already know.
Setting speed limits absurdly low will make lots more money in fines.💶💶💶💶💶
If you can’t catch the real criminals then criminalise the people you can catch 🙈
People power!
Vote Labour !
🤣🤣🤣🤣
What’s needed here in Wales is to return to common sense when councils applied for a 20 mph zone outside schools, hospitals, care homes etc.. Something else that’s needed is data from the eight areas of Wales that have now had 20mph imposed upon them for over two years showing how many lives/serious injuries have been saved due to the 20mph limit.
Labour in Wales must get voted out ASAP. We need change and I'll be voting Reform or Conservative but no other party
Was this the Consercative party who voted *for* the 20mph originally, and whose Leader Andrew R T Davies called ‘common sense’?
This was before the backlash of course and now they’ve jumped on the opportunist bandwagon.
The main problem was when you have questions in the official small consultation that the Welsh Govt did, which was about 1000 people, that confused or even tried to mislead people. The official questionnaire has now been quite hard to find, anywhere (Lee Walters must have taken it with him hen he suddenly left!!) but when the main question was something along the lines of,
'Do you agree with a 20mph zone on restricted roads where there are pedestrians and cyclists'
Well, I think most would say yes to that as you would be thinking of a town center, village school etc where there are people walking around. However, the sly part they put in there was, 'Restricted Roads'. How many people actually know that a restricted road is actually a normal 30mph road.
Certain councils went to far, but then again they wern't given proper guidance. 20mph on some roads and some areas in extremely dangerous as some are driving at about 18-19moh thinking they will get a speeding tickets above that. Some are now chancing pulling out at junctions or overtaking people when they never did when it was 30mph.
It's one of the worst things the Welsh Govt has ever brought in. They need to concentrate on things that actually makes a difference to peoples lives in Wales and not try and think they are getting one up on Westminster by doing things differently,
The common stupidity of of some MPs is beyond belief.
The terminally lacking in talent usually become politicians or flip burgers in a fast food joint.
It’s the stupidest law. It’s making travelling a nightmare for visitors. When I go to Wales I feel nervous the whole time because it’s so random that I don’t know how fast to drive as it’s not clear what the speed should be. I just copy the local traffic.
Drakeford was Too Cheap to accept his deluded Policy was Wrong
How about saying 40mph max on the tiny little lanes in the countryside which are Peppered with
potholes
So who’s going to pay the £33 million that it cost to change all the signs, plus the more money needed to change back again?
Yet again a perfect example of why the devolution experiment does not work 🤨.
All cars should be speed restricted to to walking pace - and have a man walking in front of them waving a red flag !!!! - We all know that this is not about air quality and not about safety ! Responsible drivers know the appropriate speed for their vehicle and the external conditions - before our police force became politicised they would only 'nick' you for speeding if you drove at a speed which was unreasonable and too fast for the conditions - regardless of the speeding signs - for example if you were driving through a 30 limit at 45 mph on a deserted road at 3.00am they would not stop you ! These ridiculous speed limits stick yet another blow to the heart of our free and democratic society.
in a 20Mph zone, I have to drive in second gear. This means that the engine is doing more than twice as many revolutions and therefore twice as many cylinder fulls of 'pollution' _and_ I am present in the area making 'noise' (the other environmental argument) for 33% LONGER than if I were driving at 30Mph.
I also waste potential energy in braking for the 20Mph zone and then waste even more fuel accelerating to a more reasonable speed _after_ the zone - which adds to the 'pollution'.
Some 'touristy' streets do need a lower speed limit - perhaps even 15mph likened to a pedestrian zone.
Some places in Wales have temporary 20Mph zone around school areas - '20Mph when lights are showing' - I am totally on-board with that.
For almost everywhere else, 30Mph is perfectly safe when prevailing conditions are considered.
Quentin's comment about *DRIVER TRAINING* really is on the money - I have been driving for over 40 years and seen driver skills and cognisance fall to face-palm levels, mostly in the last 10 years. In that time I have never crashed or killed any pedestrians whilst the speed limits were 30Mph through towns and 60 on all other country lanes and A roads - the same experience as the majority of sensible, well-trained drivers - so the observable evidence is at odds with the propaganda.
ALL driving examiners should be re-trained and be MORE inclined to fail learners when _any_ inadequacy is detected (lives depend on it!).
People who fail more than three times should be banned from driving for life (driving is clearly NOT for everyone) - it is a privilege earned and NOT a right.
*And what about electric cars - they do not pollute at the point of driving,* so against this environmental argument, they should be allowed to drive faster (particularly 70 through the 50 zones that are posted as 'speed reduced to protect the environment') - and yes, I know that is impractical since the 'delta-v' (that means difference in speed between cars) would be a cause of collision risk.
*But then we are back to punishing the innocent majority for the transgressions of the negligent minority instead of dealing with the REAL problem.*
The whole ideology is ridicules.
The only cars that would have to use 2nd gear to handle 20 mph would be cars from the '70s and back, these cars had weak engines and a limited number of gears.
I don't think staying in 2nd gear is necessary in a modern car, which I'd define as being a car from the late '90s and newer. Even the ones with single litre engines should be alright to handle 20 mph in 3rd or even 4th gear, on road without inclines.
However, that's not to say that an automatic transmission will do it right. Many automatic transmissions from around the turn of the millennium had less gear ratios than their manual counterparts. As such, when sticking to 20 mph, some might not even bother with changing to 3rd gear.
Cruise control systems in cars from the '00s, cars which were never designed to drive at 20 mph, often won't even turn on at 20. You'd need to be doing 30 mph for that.
But yeah, I'm with you for the most part. Just don't give yourself seasickness from the strong engine braking of 2nd gear, yeah?
duel carriage ways should be at least 40 not 30mph its a joke some people can run the speed of 20mph and ive been overtaken by pushbikes, going faster then 20, When are the people in charge going to realise that its the pedestrians that need educating to cross the roads at the right places and not in between cars on busy roads. Doing 20 in the same area for longer will still churn out the smoke, it must be just as bad as being in an area for less time doing 30, as well as causing damage to the vehicles travelling at that speed in between gears. i honestly think the people in charge are loonys or they dont use the highways themselves, probably they are chauffeur driven in company cars.
20mph in 2nd gear good grief the mentality of Mark Drakeford
My cruise control sets in at 25 miles an hour. That would be a compromise between speed, safety and the environment
Try using the speed limiter instead.
@Turnipstalk Nope, I have a 2019 vauxhall combo cruise control will not work at 20 mph...speed is to low
Drakeford brought it in, then he told Councils to enforce it,and pay for road markings and signs. What an utter "i did it because i can" Brick.
The person that first brought in the 30 mph speed limit knew what and why he was doing it. His name that I know but not able to spell properly is associated with zebra crossings and the beacons that flash at the road side.
Belisha
Mr Hall Belisha.
A simple spelling should have been able to do it myself. Thanks everyone.
If you drive at 20mph you’ll just get flashed and cut up by drivers who don’t want to drive that slow. That’s happened to me in London where someone almost took my front wing off!
How is this going to work? So when they roll back selected roads, some roads will be marked 30mph and I’ll be able to go 30mph, whilst other roads I’ll go 30mph and ignore the stickered 20mph signs.
Just when I’d got used to ignoring ALL the 20mph signs.
No. They’re not changing the default 20mph so if there’s no signs, the speed limit is 20
@@nuttycommuter3718 didn’t sense the sarcasm in my post, huh?
@@revelationmd apparently not 😉
Also need to sort out 50mph speed restriction limit on dual carriage ways
Don't worry the fools in Wales that want 20 mph everywhere can relocate to Scotland where they plan 20 mph for everyone. Cars, Buses, Lorries, Bicycles, Trains, Planes.
Perhaps come to Scotland & find out you have been having your leg pulled.
It is not about improving safety, its about making money for the government.
Was in North Wales today, 20mph in a busy built up area is not bad, however the complete melts that drive at 15 mph are the problem
i've overtaken cars doing 15mph without exceeding 20mph. It's so much fun and they blast their horn at you like lunatics. It's a new form of sport.
@Redducati1199 - this is happening in the South Wales valleys too. In my near 40 years of driving, I've noticed there were always drivers who would drive at around 5mph less than the speed limit, even if the road was perfectly straight and dry an with good visibility. As 20mph is such a slow speed anyway, driving at what amounts to 75% of the actual limit is so much more noticeable. To be fair, though, I think they're afraid of accidentally reaching 21mph and being done for speeding.
When you have no real problems you begin to create them.
When most people are staring at phones, satnavs and dash board screens etc. 20mph can be too fast. Lets just get back to driving.
@800beemer - the 20mph blanket limit has stopped people staring at phones, satnavs and dashboard screens as they are too busy staring at the speedometer. I now set my speed limiter at 20mph so I can concentrate on actual driving and being aware of what's happening around my car as I'm driving rather than trying to keep my car at or below 20mph.
The standard of driving since the 20mph limit came in is far worse.
I'm a Londoner living in Wales. The labour government, in Wales, has completely lost the plot over the last few years. The 20mph madness and their stance on gender and eroding women's rights has lost them my vote. Reform UK or SDP for me.
Reform are just a different bunch of vocal elites though really. Leadership with unifying ethics plus actual economic chops are what is needed in Cymru.
I don't want a slower pace of life. I don't want to slow down just because you do.
Not about safety it's a bunch of motor vehicles hate-mongering do gooders
Also scientifically proven that if pedestrians look before they go into a road, then there will be less deaths. Just teach children & adults the Green Cross Code. Problem solved.
Regards the question of public consultation. Little or no such consultation was ever carried out as the use of vehicles developed and increased. That latter failure has allowed massive problems with use of vehicles to develop unchecked and unmonitored (for the most part). All we are hearing against these speed limits, is arguably the shouty voice of the more aggressive vehicle user; and they very much involved in the problems associated with vehicle use. The age of unlimited rights for vehicle users is over. Now other constituencies are having their voices heard. Driving and vehicle use, is a privilege, not a right; so accept and obey required regulation in a densely packed world of diverse stakeholders.
Accept and obey? They've got you well trained I see 🤷♀️ wait till they come after something you value because they will. You will own nothing and be happy.
@@BeaHindebars Life doesn't boil down to a binary between fundamentalist anarchy and supine subservience. Myriad reasoned positions exist between these polar extremes.
There isn't then a single monolithic sinister "they". Life comes at you on myriad pathways, and you judge what comes at you on its own merits and demerits. Some things you support and some you oppose. For me these 20mph speed limits need to be supported (on their merits); and those who break these speed limits need to be opposed (on their demerits). "They" do not make an appearance or have an effect.
@@creepycrawlything well let's resume this discussion in a few years, you may then have figured out who "they" are, or maybe not. 🤷♀️
@@BeaHindebars "They" is a term and concept, embedded in an ideology, which plays part in the self-construction of some people. There are many other alternative options for self-construction, which do not involve this term and concept and ideological dynamic.
@@creepycrawlything ok 🤷♀️
Instead of interfering with people in every aspect of our lives, the best way to “take the public with you” is to just leave us alone and let us get on with our lives. Instead we get constant petty rules!!!