WARNING: I will be deleting any comments that use this space to spread negativity about Double Exposure. This video is about celebrating Life is Strange, I won’t tolerate those looking to tear the new game down.
@shicyn Well when you make a UA-cam video that gets 8k views and counting about a series that whose fan base is currently highly volatile, you can handle it the way you want
I never wanna jump straight to misogyny when it comes to topics like this but it really just feels like that's what stuff like this boils down to. People complain about Mary Sue characters and wanting them to be more complex but when they're given that they can't handle it. Make up your minds!
Yes she is very flawed and but having a father who suddenly dies , a mother who has to keep them afloat so doesn’t have time to comfort a grieving daughter or when she goes rebellious she also probably doesn’t know how to reach out to each other so she finds comfort in some else which only further devises Chloe and Joyce , and to have a best friend suddenly leaves ( which is not maxes fault) but to not try and keep in contact was not the best , and to have another person suddenly disappear. Chloe is a lonely person she obviously connects deeply but struggles to reach out , her experience probably stunts her emotional growth we see this through the fact that she was clearly very smart and compassionate when younger and in the other time line when she’s in the wheelchair but due to the events she can’t and Yh she is selfish and gets jealous and is overbearing but throughout the story / depends on the choice she does change and realise her faults, the ending where she begs max to choose the town shows how that she is a good person and rises above all what has been thrown at her for the lives of every one else Spoiler for new game In the letter she right max shows her growth that’s she’s able to let go and not keep someone around just for her sake , she finally wants to move forward unlike in the original she’s latching on to the past .
@@millieboonChris from LIS2 went through worse than BtS Chloe. They both lost a parent, but the difference is that Chloe was older and more emotionally mature than Chris. Chloe had a loving mother that cared about her. Chris on the other hand, has an alcoholic father who beats him up and blames him for his mother's death. I know everyone handles trauma differently, but come on. The behavior of those two is vastly different
Chloe is a favorite character of mine. Losing her dad and Max in the same week had a really bad effect on her. People are one-sided in this case. Chloe is a complex character with many flaws, but there are good things about her. She's protective, loyal, a free-spirit, and a kid at heart. Which is one of the many reasons I like her as a character.
10:02 "and before Max moved across the country" Well technically, she only moved one state over. Oregon and Washington are right next to each other. But that kind of makes it even worse considering how she really wasn't actually that far away, but still didn't keep in touch or visit. She was a 4 or 5 hour drive away at most.
"At most" when Max has no car. Her parents left in the middle of William's burial. You think they cared enough about her friendship with Chloe to drive her 4-5 hours for a visit?
who's parents who are not very present would drive their kid 4-5 hours to see a friend. in order to make up for that drive i would've had to stay over like a week LOL.
Kinda crazy how u perceive a 4-5 hours drive as "not far away". For me, a european, that's like going on vacation in another country. Like if you have friends that are 4-5 hours away from you...well u probably see them once in a year at most here in europe haha
Just a person with a lot of love to give while nobody really gave her enough love. That's all she was ,not some kind of master manipulator sociopath. Everything about her indicates a loyal and empathetic personality and she wants the same from others in her life but never gets that.
What I found out recently is that Max had an IEP at Blackwell. That actually makes a lot of sense to her character coupled with Chole having behavioral and situational issues. I can surely say that school failed its students. These were lovable characters written in real ways. Coming back to the series 10 years later. I appreciate LIS even more.
Weird, maybe people just don't understand others well that's why so many hate on Chloe. Everytime she's mean or rash I can see the reason behind it. When she pushes people away she's hurt and she wants someone to care about her. When she's impulsive and reckless she's saying no one is going to miss her anyways so fuck it. Chloe screams in every part of her being that she just wants to be loved and cared about. The universe didn't want Chloe dead, Chloe did. That's why I saved her as Max. The whole point of Maxes powers were to save the most important person in her life. Why else did they awaken? Just to teach us that we can't control fate? Screw that. I'd save Chloe every time.
@@keyl8185 "The universe didn't want Chloe dead, Chloe did." you just blew my mind oh my god now i'm standing with my option of saving her even stronger
I say this every time in situations like these and won't ever stop, people in this day and age have ZERO media literacy. I don't know if this is only a phenomenon in the west due to them not being taught it in school or not or whatever, but when I played the game for the first time when I was newly 14, i IMMEDIATELY understood why Chloe was the way she was. These are grown adults not being able to see through this stuff
Life in strange discourse regarding Chloe is so bad. I dont know if media literacy or just people really REALLY not understanding the long lasting effects of trauma on people
I’m glad there’s a video defending Chloe Price. I hate the fact that people are saying she was a user and that she never loved Max or cared about her. Did they not play the same game?
This is such a thoughtful and considerate take on Chloe’s character. As someone who’s always loved and felt for Chloe, thank you for making this video! Subscribed!! 😊
How is this video not more popular?! You perfectly summed up how I've always felt about Chloe. Even in the first game I could see why she was angry and vengeful. Your dad dies and your best friend moves away. I agree with the video saying that Joyce really did fail Chloe when it comes to bringing David home to serve as Chloe's "new dad". As an individual, of course Joyce deserves to move on and find new love after William's death but I dont think hiding William's photos and bringing in a "new dad" home right when Chloe was still in the process of grieving her father was exactly helping with Chloe's attitude. It felt exactly as Chloe described it in the game, like her mom was shoving memories of her dad away in some cabinet to accomodate her new boyfriend. I loved David in LiS 2 and you can clearly see how much he has grown from his trauma and even made peace with Chloe but for god's sake he was soooo infuriating in BTS. I was completely on Chloe's side when it came to all the backtalk, like this stranger just comes into your house AFTER YOUR DAD DIES and acts like he knows everything about you and thinks he can replace your dad just like that??!! Chloe and David are BOTH going through a rough time. Chloe is still grieving for her father and missing her best friend, while David is clearly still in the process of healing from his own trauma as a war veteran. I dont know why Joyce thought it was a great idea to force these two to live under the same roof. It would have been fine if she kept dating David but lived separately so at least David wasn't constantly butting into Chloe's private space. By letting David into their house, Joyce basically took away Chloe's only safe space outside of school-no wonder Chloe decided to hang out in the junkyard instead I mean where else was she supposed to go? Perhaps liking the character of Chloe does all boils down to how much you can personally relate to Chloe herself. I feel like every character in the LiS franchise is either a hit or miss to most fans-you either hate them or love them. Like Rachel Amber, David, and Daniel from LiS 2. I disliked these characters in my first gameplay. These characters get a lot of hate if you only see them on the surface level but like you said EVERY LiS character is deserving of their own essays because in each game play we learn more nuances to their characters-which is what I LOVE about the LiS franchise. I have been replaying these games since 2017 and each time I find a new reason to appreciate the characters. The scene when David bursted into Chloe's room angry and yelling at her reminded me all too much of the unfair authority figures I've dealt with in my life. For me, it was easy to take the blame for the joint not because I believe Chloe is innocent but because I know what it's like to be slapped in the face under the guise of "discipline" or "its for your own good." But in the long run that kind of treatment never really helped, it just caused more resentment between both parties, even if the adult in the situation had good intentions. For Rachel, it was because she cheated on Chloe with Frank. I think Rachel and Chloe were romantically involved-even if you only befriend her in BTS-in LiS Chloe clearly implies that there was something more to it than that. Why else would Chloe be mad when Max told her Rachel was dating Frank? I felt like Rachel betrayed Chloe but after playing BTS again, I realized Rachel was going through her own hell and was desperate to leave Arcadia Bay. I know that doesnt excuse her behaviour but somehow her actions in LiS made more sense after I found out about her whole family situation-which is a whole discussion on its own. Of course trauma doesnt justify making bad decisions, but it's these bad decisions that makes these characters more relatable to us. We all have different ways of coping which is why some people like Kate Marsh and dislike Chloe because maybe Kate's expression of her own trauma resonates to them-still choosing to be a kind and gentle person in spite of what they went through. Again, it all boils down to how much we can relate to each character and how much we are willing to look past our own experiences and acknowledge other people's experiences. Lastly i absolutely love this video's discussion on Chloe's self image and how feeling rejected by everyone has led to her thinking that maybe deep down she isnt worthy of love thats why she lashes out. I remember a comment in another LiS video essay saying that how Chloe wanted us to sacrifice her in the final scene of LiS perfectly shows how much she hated herself and that the storm was basically the world saying "Yes, everyone is better off without you!" and playing as Max we have the chance to say: "yes that's true and I'm sorry but no one deserves to suffer because of you"-or, we can say: "No, you matter to ME. You deserve to live and be loved as much as everyone else in this town."
Wow, this is really good, dude. This got to be the best video about Chloe I've ever watched. Most vids and posts just say she's toxic and is the worst friend.
Great video! I got into Life is Strange pretty recently and I was surprised when I discovered the discourse surrounding Chloe in the fandom (though maybe I should not have been surprised...) . My opinion/analysis pretty much lines up with yours. Chloe has quickly become one of my favorite characters in fiction and I'm grateful to see such an in-depth analysis!
Your video essay warmed my heart, thank you for treating Chloe's character (one of my favorite game characters) with such an even hand and covering a significant amount the context that in which she exists with such consideration and care. Great work and good luck with future videos!
I’m so happy to hear that!! I work really hard on my videos, and I’m always very careful and intentional to be respectful of where my audience may be coming from. It’s always wonderful to hear that it comes through. I hope you’ll subscribe to enjoy my work in the future!
thank you for making this video essay. I think the conversation in ep4 for alt chloe and the conversation with her in the truck was why i saved her. And if u look close, you can find her anti-depressants in the bathroom. She was really dealing a lot of stuff. The lost of her father, a tough stepfather and a chaotic friend's disappearance (rachel). Chloe constantly thinks that she doesn't deserve to live and being very self-destructive etc..And that's the point for me to save her.
Thank you so much for this essay, Chloe has been my fav character for the last 9 years and I love all content which attempts to look at her for who she is: mentally ill girl who got abandoned, mentally and physically, by everyone she cares about, and has behavioural issues bc noone in the town cares to see her as anything other than 'a problem unable to do good things'. I deeply love and relate to her. Thank you for this video
No shit. but people specifically coming at her with misogynistic labels, without considering the point and background of her character, that's pretty unfair. Despite having experienced trauma throughout her life, she was demonstrated to have significantly changed her ways in a matter of days. All we're asking is empathy, which female characters are rarely afforded. There are many broken people in the real world, but that doesn't mean they shouldnt be given the opportunity to get their act together and improve.
He says men dont get it, but the exposure i mostly get from SE is ff15, an many hate Gladio for similar reasons and hes the most masculine. Its not simply misogyny. Often the male characters are just better written, not that we just hate girls People dont like dealing with people with a lot of trauma. Chloe would get more hate as a guy. Guys can't "have feelings"
thanks my guy this gave me a lot of perspective and a deeper appreciation for her character i was already stoked to play this game but you turned it up to 11
You mentioned the incongruencies between BTS and LiS1. One idea I like is that BTS is Chloe telling Max about Rachel and some of what went down. The gaps and errors become the gaps and errors of a person trying to recall a series of events. I enjoyed what you did here. Thanks for it.
She has got what she deserved in my story. She's with Max and they're together. Developers and publishers will take characters and stories to any point to grab more cash. It's up to us where we put a stop.
i always loved chloe for her hilarious lines in the game. now while before the storm isnt a favorite of mine, it helped me see how alone and hurt chloe truly was. and over the years, i realized i related to her more than i thought. during high school, i definitely had a max and chloe side in me. someone who was introverted, insecure, and tended to stay in the background, and also someone who was deeply hurting, angry at the world and pushed people away
You know, this video actually kinda made me cry. (Not in a bad way) I’ve loved this character for years and you basically voiced my entire stance/opinion on Chloe Price, it always made me sad to see people play the game and see people just kinda hate on Chloe, not taking the time to really look at her situation and why she’s the way she is. Seeing her worst traits and not seeing the good side of who she is. I didn’t always like Chloe’s character especially not in the beginning of my first playthrough of LIS1 but that changed by the end of the games story to where I really felt for her and really liked her character. And my love for the character became pureified by her story in BTS & the Farewell episode. I love this video and I thank you for making it.
@@TheAdamSplitter it really was, after watching this and Playing Double exposure I wonder what your thoughts on the Chloe stuff are, wether you’d do a follow up talking about it or just having this analysis video be a one off (btw I don’t have anything negative to say about the topic)
I might do a video on DE at some point once the toxicity dies down a little haha. In the meantime, you might want to check out my livestreams of the game.
Chloe is just an ok character. I get it she’s just a teen but she does become unlikable after awhile. She is incapable of moving on and is stuck in the past and uses it to tear down everyone around her because she always acts like a child. It literally gets her killed. Not saying she’s completely horrible because she does have some like able traits and moments but she doesn’t grow at all as a character. It’s good that she does accept that she’s supposed to be dead because it’s better off this way.
I would die for Chloe Price, she helped me come to terms with being a lesbian❤ but besides that, just overall great a character. Well made woman 100/10
Don't know if it's brought up anywhere else (sorry, haven't watched the linked essays) but I always thought it was ... interesting, during the final decision, that Chloe doesn't stop to say other's lives are worth more than her own until AFTER she sees Max reject, or at least struggle with, Chloe's offered deferred guilt plan. Max questions, and blames herself. Chloe really tries to shift the perspective of the storm, and Max's inherent responsibility for it, into -- life sucks, sh@$'s gone bad, but give yourself moment to breathe; maybe all of this was supposed to happen, and I'm grateful for you. #$^@ who's to blame, you're amazing. Referencing video: ua-cam.com/video/htpG3W7aTyw/v-deo.html The first minute encapsulates my above interpretation. Starting at 0:56 to 1:07 there is a pause while Chloe waits, watching Max work through Chloe's rudimentary attempt to soothe. If the creators *meant* for those specific facial reads on Chloe's face to reflect how Chloe *seems* to take Max's silence and continued, if not rising, agitation, that little crestfallen beat at 1:04 to 1:08 is really heartbreaking. She was *waiting* for Max to say, yeah, this is f-ed up, too big to handle, but you matter to me, Chloe; your life matters. And right there, when it would have been most meaningful, Max is silent. Instead, Chloe gives Max the out Max needs to make the final choice. And Max protests, because what has Max been doing ALL THIS TIME if it comes down to It's nice that Chloe got the words of affirmation she needed, just depressing it was after she decides she's worthless. Making space for Max to feel better is the best Chloe can offer in the moment, but it's just -- it's sad, you know? It wasn't like she didn't have those thoughts (evidenced by the fact she says them); that the greater good might be better served by her dying on the bathroom floor -- just think of everyone else who'd be saved! -- but to me, it seemed like fear and self-loathing (also wanting Max to feel better) were her primary motivators. Still, it was a genuine offer, and draws the finish line for Chloe's emotional/maturity arc. Either decision is justified (even if one, the more tragic, gut wrenching one, got a better conclusion). It just makes me sad, for Chloe -- she did all that growing, from BtS to LiS -- and this is how it ends. With a whimper or a bang. As an aside, yes, I know Chloe's little speech contradicts what she literally said earlier, that the storm likely stemmed from Max's timey-wimey shenanigans (sorta), but I consider that sentiment, and Warren's, "Holy understatements, Bat-Max, look at what you've done!", to be more story streamlining to make the binary choice more palatable than actual, you know, character driven dialogue. Another aside: 'Dirty pool, old man', as Gomez Addams says, evoking such a strong symmetry to Final Destination, and movies where bad things happen because it's fate, and there's no escaping it. SMH at Don't Nod for that particular shortcut. Another another aside: #$^@ the trolly problem and all philosophical quandaries that spawned it. Burn it. Burn it with fire. Love the series though! Cheers!
Well I’m doing livestreams of that too haha. But this essay was written before even the early access of the first two chapters and designed to be released alongside DE, so yeah it isn’t about that. Glad you enjoyed it!
My biggest issue with people who don't even try to understand Chloe is that we're talking about a videogame here. A story based videogame, at that. Meaning, the game actively DEMANDS your attention and empathy. When you're experiencing a story, understanding the characters is the least you can do and you are rewarded for it with a more engaging understanding of the story. So, if some people are unable to show that empathy for a fictional character in exchange for said reward, how are they gonna show any empathy to real people in exchange for nothing?
There's a subset of men who get triggered by outspoken, confident women. They feel threatened by them, and prefer women to be meek and "trad". The fact that Chloe is attractive and gay (and has blue hair!) just makes it even worse. And it is almost always men who have a problem with Chloe. I think if you come across a man who hates Chloe, you should view it as a big red flag.
I love Chloe so much because I understand and have felt her pain. She's not a perfect person, she's deeply flawed and hurt and she wants people to show her the love and patience that they show others but but because they already see Chloe as the angry problem child that's the only way treat her without even attempting to treat her any other way. Chloe despite being angry and hateful is so capable of so much love and empathy for others, looking around her room you find so many keepsakes of her dad, Rachel, and Max even though she felt they all left her and hurt her deeply she still kept all those memories of them because she loves each of them so much after so many years. Everyone is so quick to be mad at her when she's rude but never comments on the times she shows them love. Even the time she got mad about answering Kate's call she later apologized but if you look at it from her point, Max was her childhood best friend who moved away and left her right after her father died then ghosted her for no reason for 5 years, then she finds out Max has been back in town for months without letting her know, then after all that time ignoring her calls and messages she sees Max making it an important point to answer a phone call from a girl that Max has only known for a few months, which for Chloe would be an especially painful stab in the heart after the way Max treated her.
I haven't watched the video yet but what I do know is that after DE there will be more Chloe haters here. Because "she left Max"” Although Dontnod did a good job of showing that she would never do that (She's super loyal), they showed it in both games and the point of Bae ending was always that the girls would stay together forever. D9 disrespected that and killed Chloe as a character.
I’m so tired of DE discourse. This isn’t the space for this kind of comment. I love life is strange and I’m not interested in feeding the toxic beast that all Max and Chloe discourse seems to be.
when i first played lis 1 i didn't like chloe's actions and personality even though i cared about her. after i played before the storm... it totally changed the way i saw her. i love her now
I absolutely agree with your overall message and I agree with almost all of what you have to say here, but I was really confused by the discussion on Joyce and David. If these are common opinions in the community, forgive me for being out the loop, but after you went through the factors to consider closely with Chloe and efforts that should be taken to unbias ourselves, it felt like whiplash to not extend those same considerations to Joyce or David. I think objectively, the original LIS commits fully into the notion that David is well-intentioned and is capable of growth/change, but is working through his own trauma and PTSD that while not justifying his negative actions, does inform it, and by the end he does believably reflect on his actions and strive to do better. As for Joyce, on one hand I want to lean on that we just don't know enough to say whether or not she failed Chloe. We have no idea what she did at the time of William's death and how she choose to support Chloe before David entered the picture, or really anytime prior to Before the Storm. Regardless, I have a hard time thinking that she always sided with David, given how easy it was to persuade her to kick him out of the house in Chapter 4. Joyce had to have been the one most impacted by William's death, as on top of the emotional trauma that would come from that, and the guilt she likely felt being the one to call him to pick her up, she also didn't have the time to spiral because she had to keep things going for Chloe. It always felt more to me like Joyce was stuck between a rock and hard place with Chloe and David, not necessarily like she took one side every time. She calls David out when he make mistakes and can be swayed to fully turn on David. Calling her awful altogether almost felt like you didn't take your own advice about how to respectfully view a women's situation and consider the context to come to nuanced conclusion.
I did explain that I deeply sympathize with Joyce’s struggles and why a man like David is appealing to her. And I also noted that she’s not an all-around awful person, but rather an awful mother. Her own struggles do not excuse her treatment of Chloe. In terms of kicking David out, I feel that she’s mainly listening to Max rather than Chloe in that moment. It’s pretty consistent that Joyce listens to Max but dismisses Chloe. Also, David hitting Chloe absolutely should have been the breaking point. “He feels awful” is an unacceptable reaction to that. Even separate from that, he constantly refers to her in demeaning and misogynistic-leaning language like “girlie” and “missy”, not to mention he clearly sees total control over her life and invasion of her privacy as rights he is owed. As for why I didn’t spend much time on the nuances of David, it’s because this essay is about Chloe and why she is the way she is, and David’s abuse of Chloe is more important to that topic than his trauma and such. Like I mentioned, (almost) every character in the LiS series is a full person but this essay was focused specifically on Chloe, and I’d have to save analysis of other characters for other videos.
@@TheAdamSplitter Fair's fair on not delving into David, but I think the crux of our disagreement comes down to what should earn you "awful mother status," and does the slap reaction and Joyce's implied over-support of David outweigh what she has done and still continues to do for Chloe. There's no doubt in my mind and Joyce struggles and suffers day after day almost solely to provide for Chloe and give her a comfortable environment, and even after 5 years Joyce is still trying to help Chloe work through her grief. Joyce will chastise Chloe for her negative behaviors, but never get's angry or withdraws her overall love/support. When it comes to the slap, which was completely out of line, it's sort of unfair to judge her conversation with Max I think for a few reasons. For one, we don't get to see Joyce's actual reaction to hearing of the news, since due to an interesting character moment for David, he comes clean about it immediately to Joyce off-screen, so we don't have a good reference point to gauge her in-the-moment response. I think what we know about David overall should point that in the context of Joyce's life, he would deserve the opportunity to fix what he did through change, and that the nebulous "punishment" she also mentions to Max may imply the need for family or anger-management counseling, which I think would really benefit David more than kicking him out. There's also the concern of whether or not Joyce feels comfortable attempting to kick David out of their house in a 1:1 confrontation, and while I don't personally think David would ever hurt Joyce, she would still need to consider this and consider how her and Chloe's lives would get harder without David around. The conversation Joyce has with Max also has to be viewed through the understanding that this is their first interaction in 5 years, and Joyce likely isn't willing to disclose every detail of her marital struggles at the drop of a hat, and while she is working. The point is that even if we chalk her not kicking David out right now as a huge blunder in parenting, does that ultimately cancel out her continued love/support and care? I definitely don't think it would be fair to fault her for not "fixing" Chloe in terms of working her through her trauma, both with William and Rachel Amber, as Joyce isn't a grief counselor and even then grief isn't a linear process and something that can be forced to resolution in the first place. One last thing on David and Chloe specifically though, I think his policing of Chloe comes down less to an entitlement to her privacy, and more to the coupling of him being genuinely concerned for Chloe with the negative expectations/behaviors that were instilled in him through his military service. We know though some of his possessions in LIS and his overt behaviors in Before the Storm that David does view Chloe as his daughter, and as a child overall, on top of genuinely caring for her wellbeing and safety, so it's not surprising that he oversteps boundaries because they have a relationship that Chloe does not agree with. I think his misogynistic-learning language also supports this, as he sees Chloe still as a child in need of discipline.
I understand and respect all this, but I do stand by what I said here and I do feel that a lot of this is best saved for an essay more focused on David.
Discussions like this are necessary but, at the same time I don't think a lot of the chloe haters are necessarily looking too deep into her. She is the blue haired loud woman, she's abrasive and as such she is annoying. Also lots of people claim she triggers their PTSD from narcissistic parents or partners. It's quite unfortunate because I really think I understood the intention behind her character. I also think lots of people who never played the games are some of its biggest haters. I find it ironic that the entire internet was up-in-arms about the way D9 handled the new game when most of the people hadn't even engaged with the series since, like, 2015 when they watched a youtuber play the game or something. Don't get me wrong, the new game is.... interesting to say the least, and probably my least favourite of the series, but it's so strange to me seeing all these people jump onto the subreddit/twitter fandom and they're suddenly diehard Chloe fans, like, where have they all been the last 9 years lol? I dunno. This IP is definitely in a strange place at the moment. I will probably listen to the rest of this video while I'm playing a game later today.
@@TheAdamSplitter Sorry, which part were you referring to? The bit about Chloe being an alleged abuser? Because I can link some tweets if I can find them, I promise it's a real thing that used to pop up in the odd viral post. If you *were* referring to the part about the fan outcry, I feel like the existence of this video is evidence alone that you were aware of the general attitude towards Chloe, at least prior to the new game. That being said, the hate usually came from outside the fandom, maybe these suddenly vocal fans were here the entire time I dunno. I just know that I've snooped into enough reddit users' post history to see they've only become active in the subreddit specifically to hate on the new game with little evidence of previously being fans. I mean the new game is not fantastic, especially the direction they took with Chloe, but, still.
@@TaxFraudTutorials sorry for not being clear. I meant that a lot of people I’ve run into that have problems with the new game are people who have a deep emotional attachment to the original and to Pricefield specifically, to the point that they seemingly can’t (or refuse to) accept the developments for Pricefield that the new game establishes. There’s been a LOT of gatekeeping in the LiS fandom for years now. There’s a very specific image many people have of what LiS is supposed to be, and anything outside of that tends to be treated with mild to significant hostility.
I absolutely loved your review! I have to apologize-I misjudged a bit when I saw it was a man discussing these women’s lives. I’ve been a little cynical lately, and I’m sorry for that initial assumption. But your insights truly surprised me, and I found myself agreeing with every single point. You expressed it all so perfectly; I couldn’t have said it better myself!
I don’t blame you for that trepidation, men don’t have the best track record of talking about women’s struggles. I extra appreciate you giving the video a genuine chance. Im so happy you found it so meaningful!
I have seen many people argue that "Just because she suffered doesn't excuse her being an asshole" I wonder if they would say the exact same thing to characters like Patrick Bane, or Tony Stawks, or in general some of the most well known "dark and edgy" male characters that have been know for their brutality, rough around the edges, yet deeply been traumatized since the get go. When they think about THOSe characters, would they jump out and say " oh yeah, that dude infuriating! I couldn't stand seeing him every second on screen, he was such a bitch!"? And if so, would they pause, think about it, and acknowledge the world they lived was the environmental cause of that behavior and would come to understand that it would be easier to fall into that mindset the character had? In other news have seen no mention on how Mark Jefferson, the main antagonist , has down atrociously worse things than Chloe or Rachel (the manipulators) would never ever subject thier victims to. Yet no one (I'm looking at male audiences on this but not specifically you OP) mentions this because he was "forgettable." I would really like hear your thoughts on Rachel Amber or Victoria Chase. Great Video, I wish this had more views but unfortunately algorithm is a bitch.
A great video on Chloe price. I have always loved and appreciated her story and character in LiS. she is someone who wants love and cares very deeply as well. Chloe experience many losses in her formative years which are the most crucial developmental years of a person. Her experiences shaped her i was able to understand and empathize and have sympathy for her. I choose the save arcadia ending personally but i was also impacted by the save chloe ending because to me this game is about max and chloe's intense and complex and moving relationship. Chloe deserved a chance to heal and live a happy satisfied life. Her whole character arc showed that she is capable of empathy, goodness, growth and change if given the circumstances and support. Yes, she is not perfect and because of her trauma she lashes out and is selfish and sometimes makes bad decisions but that doesn't make her incapable of growth or irredeemable unlike the many "likeable and redeemed" adult male characters in other video game or any other medias that have done far worse and still earn the kindness and sympathy and support of the audience. She is able to recognize her mistakes and willing to make sacrifices. It is unfortunate that discussions of her character is often veers into misogyny and also homophobia. Of course some have valid critiques of her character and many others have changed their opinions later or are open to healthy discussions and engagement all are not going to arrive at the same conclusion. Its just the blatant vitriol and lack of slight empathy that bothers me when analyzing Chloe. Chloe is one of my favorite characters along with Max that have impacted me in the long run. I only say this about characters that have deeply resonated with me or made me think or teach me or inspire me or give me new other perspectives and have stayed in my mind long after I completed experiencing their story. Sidenote: I assume u might be a fan of rwby sorry if u r not. i used to be in my teen years and i got into LiS in my young adult years so my maturity and media literacy was different. Rwby was an utter disappointment for me. It started off good but now its unrecognizable to me personally i gave up long ago. To summerize my critiques 1. the lack of narrative and plot focus 2. lack of emotional and narrative arc for the main female characters compared to the overt focus on male characters 3. lack of good sociopolitical worldbuilding and themes, frankly it has mediocre worldbuilding 4. queerbaiting and lack of full fledged queer characters and women and femme with diverse intersectional backgrounds. 5. the utterly bad and sometimes offensive handling of the racism allegory with the faunus storyline and insensitive handling of sensitive issues within the story 5. the bad and harmful corporate practices of rooster teeth and using rwby ip to churn out for cash grab in greed we can agree to disagree on my rwby points and if you have anything different to add or if u do agree on some of my points. Seeing flashes of rwby in your video brought back some opinions of mine that i had long closed/moved on from regarding rwby as a show its been a few years since i thought about it. Thank you for reading kindly if u have read fully. I apologize for any grammar or any error as english is not my first language and if i said something wrong pls correct me.
To be honest... when I played Life is Strange for the first time in 2017, I hated Chloe. She was this rebellious know-it-all brat who blamed everyone for everything she messed up. That really pissed me off back then. I've since played Life is Strange: Before the storm and my view of Chloe has changed a bit. For me, the prequel is an important part of understanding why Chloe is the way she is and acts the way she does. My decisions in my current 2nd run through of Life is Strange are much milder and in favor of Chloe.
I'm recommending this video to anyone who wants to say that Chloe is a bad friend and toxic for no reason even though its so much more deeper than that.
She may deserve better but I still think she's a terrible friend cause one she acts like Max had a choice to leave when she was a minor at the time and was acting ungrateful towards max when she literally kept saving her life over and over again
8:25 Unrelated but…. *glares daggers at the Hazbin Hotel Fandom* Now, more related, I remember when LIS came out, people HATED Chloe and I didn’t know why. She’s a flawed person like everyone else in the franchise. And for reasons…people hate actually flawed female characters dispite wanting them to exist.
Chloe lost her father at a young age then max moves away shortly after that. Her mother gets with david who was a douche though that changed later. Chloe meets rachel who was her angel. Then rachel just vanishes from her life. She then finds out that rachel was killed. Max ghosts her for years. Chloe gets drugged by nathan. Chloe either loses her mom or her life. Considering everything she's been through she gets too much hate. And chloe in general isn't a bad character or person. Especially considering characters like nathan and jefferson and in comparison to them.
Post like the the “you couldn’t even handle [insert infamously hated female character here]” get me thinking about claims like what they quote. To start with those claiming we need more [blank] female characters will often be the same that agree that there’s a cultural stigma against girls who will “step out of line” socially and how that’s been leveraged against female characters enmass. Though it’s also interesting to think about the other group this claim will come from. Namely those who carry their unconscious biases against “badly written” female characters but act as if they don’t. See, they can handle evil, comical or even morally grey female characters… in their minds. They love the hypothetical strong female character in their heads. Detached from any narrative context. No other characters, male especially, for them to foil off of. Nothing to “ruin” them as it were. Korra, the character, had initially been received well at the idea of a female protagonist leading a new Avatar series. However, when applied to an actual story and cast of characters to bounce off of, you better believe that a lot of people busted out the “unlikable” card like it was Exodia’s Head.
Joyce, your daughter lost her dad at like 13-14 or something- An you’re saying she chooses to be angry, WHEN YOUR NEW MAN SLAP THE HELLA OF HER 💀💀 ((Love all these characters btw)))
chloe is rude selfish bad friend maybe manipulative that being said i like her she does sfow appreciation from like when you convince to not go after nathan and tell her about the other chloe also she genuinely cares for max
How to comment this the right way. So when we as the player take control of Max she is the most mid or grey person you can be. Little introvertet, has some friends but not many, isnt popular, isnt a high scorer on test and grades but the teachers belive in her and that she can be better. Something so many people can easily relate too. Max is meant to be modeled by the players choices and actions rather than her own goals. As some1 wrote on anther video if it wasnt for Chloe what would Max in theory do with her powers? And the anwser is nothing. She is very fine with being in her own lane if you can say so. Max is made to have reason to everything. She cares about everyone even thou she doesnt show it because she doesant know how something her powers let her achieve by talking to people finding out more about them. Then we have Chloe. Some1 who is the total opposite of Max. She isnt intovertet, she isnt shy, she was a high grading student who with her own will choose to let it all slip. Chloe has no "reason"(she does but i cant explain it without that word) she is the voice of madness if you could say it like that. Max is reason and love Chloe is madness and hate if you will. In the end of ep1 Chloe wants arcadia bay to destroyed because it has taken everything she ever cared about. Where as Max is constantly trying her hardest to save everyone around her all through the game. We the player never really have our own goals in the game. Chloe is the one that drags the game forward being just that as so many people have pointed out she is selfish while Max isnt selfish at all. All things Max cares about is how to stop the storm and her school thats it. There is no thinking far into the future. So when we have Chloe in the game if she was like Max nothing ever would have happened by "following" the rules. That what is making Chloe so good. Her actions is never based on reason or anything more than her self. STealing money? Max would never but Chloe would. At the start Max tries to save everyone but Chloe is only thinking about saving herself. At the end Chloe is willing to save everyone else but she dies while Max is "fine ok doesnt care" with letting everyone else die but Chloe lives. They are made to be their polar opposite and from the start to the end they both change the mindset about everything 180 degree. Chloe being okay with dying for the sake of other while Max is okay with other dying so she can save Chloe. Chloe is a broken ass person in every way and form possible but it also makes those times when we see the bullshit attituide drop like when we visit Kate in the hospital how sorry she actually is for her both getting mad at Max for taking a call and not thinking about anyone lse but herself Chloe is in every episode changing so ever slightly and when we get to see those moments being in focus she doesnt seem so broken after all. It redeems her by showing that she understand as you said how she is affecting her own surrounding with her actions. Her being genuinely sorry at the hospital or inbetween timeline shifts where she texts Max to tell her she is sorry for getting angry at her in the car when she had done nothing wrong. When you write a character that is broken it is easy to lose those "sane" moment and make the broken character say that theyre sorry but it is not showing or it doesnt match up with how the character seems. DONTNOD made a very (in)perfect character in Chloe, she was never meant to be a likeable character and that is so beautiful about her. At the end where Chloe is realizing that Max could go back and let her die she doesnt do it because she doesnt value her life or how to say that Max cares more about Chloe then Chloe does. Chloe has always held her self as her own top1 priority never thinking about anyone else but she also knows how people around her are affected by things. All she never needed was to be accepted like when her dad was still alive. All she ever needed was to feel loved and cared about and get out of her own head with her thinking that people hates her and leaves her by choice. It was never a choice they were killed. All it took was for Max to come back over and over for those 5 days for her to understand her ways. You can even hear Chloe break down trying to say that she has to die. She cant say it, she never says it. She never could say that she is fine with dying because she isnt. She has more come to terms with that fact that she has been an asshole beyond belief for no reason. She never gave any1 a chance in life So if it means that Chloe dies so every can get their chance that they never got if she stays a life after the bathrrom she is fine to give them their chance, she believes in their chance to live. Some1 that wants to die pushes for the action that will end her life. Chloe doesnt want to die but she doesnt want to live with her actions either. She gives her believes to Max that she is the only one strong enough to make that choice about who dies. MAx is the only one that will not break after choosing life and death, regretting their choice after. As you said about the car scene Chloe is angry so her pain validatied "its not really an indicator to her feeling in general". Max had done everything she can to keep Chloe alive so when she comes back and Chloe ask her to go back and she says no it is not really an indicator for Max feelings as with Chloe in the car. It is a reaction to something around her it is not until Chloe say how everyone else should live and she gives she true thoughts and feelings about people that Max is even considering it. That "Chloe I cant make this choice" line from Max is powerful because at that moment when she says it she has already thought about both saving Chloe and letting her die. A whole as text about a game, it is insane that after 8 years this game still fking haunts me everywhere I go. Always being the ghost in the back of my head. I can never let this character Chloe Price leave or get out of my head and i find it insane. She is so bad and horrible and she is also perfect and well done at the same time. From my point of you if some1 reads everthing i wrote you can see that I differ from OG where as I see Chloe as a person who just wanted to die for the longest time but when she understand by that her dying will stop everything she just wants nothing more than to live but not if everyone has to die because if it. The very duality of man. She wants to die for so long but when the time comes for her to die she actually wants to live. Having something great but not understanding how great that "something" is until that something is lost. Great video either way. I hope my comment isnt to bad i know i wrote a lot but passion makes people do dumb things ima right?
Thanks for mentioning Korra in the beginning, the victim blaming for something she didn't even do is insane, it's crazy how hated female characters are called Mary sues despite being hated for their flaws, april from tmnt 2012 is also a victim of this
Joyce, your daughter lost her dad at like 13-14 or something- An you’re saying she chooses to be angry, WHEN YOUR NEW MAN SLAP THE HELLA OF HER 💀💀 ((Love all these characters btw)))
![Scenes to Brighten the Soul: A Celebration of Hopepunk [VIDEO ESSAY]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/UZwVe9vVcos/mqdefault.jpg)
WARNING: I will be deleting any comments that use this space to spread negativity about Double Exposure. This video is about celebrating Life is Strange, I won’t tolerate those looking to tear the new game down.
@@TheAdamSplitter negativity is just as valid as positivity. You put something public, you invite both
Well you put "She deserves better" in the thumbnail
Make another video about misconception about mr jefferson. He's actually trying to safe the town theory
No I don’t think I will make a video on how Mr Jefferson might be good actually. He’s not. He’s a horrible, horrible person
@shicyn Well when you make a UA-cam video that gets 8k views and counting about a series that whose fan base is currently highly volatile, you can handle it the way you want
I never wanna jump straight to misogyny when it comes to topics like this but it really just feels like that's what stuff like this boils down to. People complain about Mary Sue characters and wanting them to be more complex but when they're given that they can't handle it. Make up your minds!
I mean like I explained there’s definitely more to it than misogyny, but misogyny is an undeniable factor in this kind of hostility
Yes she is very flawed and but having a father who suddenly dies , a mother who has to keep them afloat so doesn’t have time to comfort a grieving daughter or when she goes rebellious she also probably doesn’t know how to reach out to each other so she finds comfort in some else which only further devises Chloe and Joyce , and to have a best friend suddenly leaves ( which is not maxes fault) but to not try and keep in contact was not the best , and to have another person suddenly disappear. Chloe is a lonely person she obviously connects deeply but struggles to reach out , her experience probably stunts her emotional growth we see this through the fact that she was clearly very smart and compassionate when younger and in the other time line when she’s in the wheelchair but due to the events she can’t and Yh she is selfish and gets jealous and is overbearing but throughout the story / depends on the choice she does change and realise her faults, the ending where she begs max to choose the town shows how that she is a good person and rises above all what has been thrown at her for the lives of every one else
Spoiler for new game
In the letter she right max shows her growth that’s she’s able to let go and not keep someone around just for her sake , she finally wants to move forward unlike in the original she’s latching on to the past .
This has nothing to do with misogyny. Karen from LIS2 is a loved flawed-character. Maybe because she's actually well-written, unlike Chloe.
@@millieboonChris from LIS2 went through worse than BtS Chloe. They both lost a parent, but the difference is that Chloe was older and more emotionally mature than Chris. Chloe had a loving mother that cared about her. Chris on the other hand, has an alcoholic father who beats him up and blames him for his mother's death.
I know everyone handles trauma differently, but come on. The behavior of those two is vastly different
@@ddmc05 I've never once seen a favorable opinion of Karen anywhere
Chloe is a favorite character of mine. Losing her dad and Max in the same week had a really bad effect on her. People are one-sided in this case. Chloe is a complex character with many flaws, but there are good things about her. She's protective, loyal, a free-spirit, and a kid at heart. Which is one of the many reasons I like her as a character.
Exactly
10:02 "and before Max moved across the country"
Well technically, she only moved one state over. Oregon and Washington are right next to each other. But that kind of makes it even worse considering how she really wasn't actually that far away, but still didn't keep in touch or visit. She was a 4 or 5 hour drive away at most.
Oof. That is worse.
"At most" when Max has no car. Her parents left in the middle of William's burial. You think they cared enough about her friendship with Chloe to drive her 4-5 hours for a visit?
And here you can see the proof Americans think a 5 hours drive is a short distance lmao
who's parents who are not very present would drive their kid 4-5 hours to see a friend. in order to make up for that drive i would've had to stay over like a week LOL.
Kinda crazy how u perceive a 4-5 hours drive as "not far away". For me, a european, that's like going on vacation in another country. Like if you have friends that are 4-5 hours away from you...well u probably see them once in a year at most here in europe haha
Just a person with a lot of love to give while nobody really gave her enough love. That's all she was ,not some kind of master manipulator sociopath.
Everything about her indicates a loyal and empathetic personality and she wants the same from others in her life but never gets that.
💯
I loved this. Max and Chloe are both incredibly special to me, warts and all, and you really did them both justice. Thank you.
I’m so glad to hear that!
What I found out recently is that Max had an IEP at Blackwell. That actually makes a lot of sense to her character coupled with Chole having behavioral and situational issues. I can surely say that school failed its students. These were lovable characters written in real ways. Coming back to the series 10 years later. I appreciate LIS even more.
Weird, maybe people just don't understand others well that's why so many hate on Chloe.
Everytime she's mean or rash I can see the reason behind it. When she pushes people away she's hurt and she wants someone to care about her. When she's impulsive and reckless she's saying no one is going to miss her anyways so fuck it. Chloe screams in every part of her being that she just wants to be loved and cared about. The universe didn't want Chloe dead, Chloe did. That's why I saved her as Max. The whole point of Maxes powers were to save the most important person in her life. Why else did they awaken? Just to teach us that we can't control fate? Screw that. I'd save Chloe every time.
@@keyl8185 "The universe didn't want Chloe dead, Chloe did." you just blew my mind oh my god now i'm standing with my option of saving her even stronger
I say this every time in situations like these and won't ever stop, people in this day and age have ZERO media literacy. I don't know if this is only a phenomenon in the west due to them not being taught it in school or not or whatever, but when I played the game for the first time when I was newly 14, i IMMEDIATELY understood why Chloe was the way she was. These are grown adults not being able to see through this stuff
Life in strange discourse regarding Chloe is so bad. I dont know if media literacy or just people really REALLY not understanding the long lasting effects of trauma on people
I’m glad there’s a video defending Chloe Price. I hate the fact that people are saying she was a user and that she never loved Max or cared about her. Did they not play the same game?
"She kept talking about rachel" SHE WAS MISSING???
She did though. She still cared about max, too. Thats why she was mad
This is such a thoughtful and considerate take on Chloe’s character. As someone who’s always loved and felt for Chloe, thank you for making this video! Subscribed!! 😊
I’m so glad you enjoyed it! I work really hard to be fair, thoughtful and kind in my work. It’s always nice to know it comes through!
Chloe gets me on such a deep level I swear
How is this video not more popular?!
You perfectly summed up how I've always felt about Chloe. Even in the first game I could see why she was angry and vengeful. Your dad dies and your best friend moves away.
I agree with the video saying that Joyce really did fail Chloe when it comes to bringing David home to serve as Chloe's "new dad". As an individual, of course Joyce deserves to move on and find new love after William's death but I dont think hiding William's photos and bringing in a "new dad" home right when Chloe was still in the process of grieving her father was exactly helping with Chloe's attitude. It felt exactly as Chloe described it in the game, like her mom was shoving memories of her dad away in some cabinet to accomodate her new boyfriend. I loved David in LiS 2 and you can clearly see how much he has grown from his trauma and even made peace with Chloe but for god's sake he was soooo infuriating in BTS. I was completely on Chloe's side when it came to all the backtalk, like this stranger just comes into your house AFTER YOUR DAD DIES and acts like he knows everything about you and thinks he can replace your dad just like that??!!
Chloe and David are BOTH going through a rough time. Chloe is still grieving for her father and missing her best friend, while David is clearly still in the process of healing from his own trauma as a war veteran. I dont know why Joyce thought it was a great idea to force these two to live under the same roof. It would have been fine if she kept dating David but lived separately so at least David wasn't constantly butting into Chloe's private space. By letting David into their house, Joyce basically took away Chloe's only safe space outside of school-no wonder Chloe decided to hang out in the junkyard instead I mean where else was she supposed to go?
Perhaps liking the character of Chloe does all boils down to how much you can personally relate to Chloe herself. I feel like every character in the LiS franchise is either a hit or miss to most fans-you either hate them or love them. Like Rachel Amber, David, and Daniel from LiS 2. I disliked these characters in my first gameplay.
These characters get a lot of hate if you only see them on the surface level but like you said EVERY LiS character is deserving of their own essays because in each game play we learn more nuances to their characters-which is what I LOVE about the LiS franchise. I have been replaying these games since 2017 and each time I find a new reason to appreciate the characters.
The scene when David bursted into Chloe's room angry and yelling at her reminded me all too much of the unfair authority figures I've dealt with in my life. For me, it was easy to take the blame for the joint not because I believe Chloe is innocent but because I know what it's like to be slapped in the face under the guise of "discipline" or "its for your own good." But in the long run that kind of treatment never really helped, it just caused more resentment between both parties, even if the adult in the situation had good intentions.
For Rachel, it was because she cheated on Chloe with Frank. I think Rachel and Chloe were romantically involved-even if you only befriend her in BTS-in LiS Chloe clearly implies that there was something more to it than that. Why else would Chloe be mad when Max told her Rachel was dating Frank? I felt like Rachel betrayed Chloe but after playing BTS again, I realized Rachel was going through her own hell and was desperate to leave Arcadia Bay. I know that doesnt excuse her behaviour but somehow her actions in LiS made more sense after I found out about her whole family situation-which is a whole discussion on its own.
Of course trauma doesnt justify making bad decisions, but it's these bad decisions that makes these characters more relatable to us. We all have different ways of coping which is why some people like Kate Marsh and dislike Chloe because maybe Kate's expression of her own trauma resonates to them-still choosing to be a kind and gentle person in spite of what they went through. Again, it all boils down to how much we can relate to each character and how much we are willing to look past our own experiences and acknowledge other people's experiences.
Lastly i absolutely love this video's discussion on Chloe's self image and how feeling rejected by everyone has led to her thinking that maybe deep down she isnt worthy of love thats why she lashes out.
I remember a comment in another LiS video essay saying that how Chloe wanted us to sacrifice her in the final scene of LiS perfectly shows how much she hated herself and that the storm was basically the world saying "Yes, everyone is better off without you!" and playing as Max we have the chance to say: "yes that's true and I'm sorry but no one deserves to suffer because of you"-or, we can say: "No, you matter to ME. You deserve to live and be loved as much as everyone else in this town."
I’m so happy you enjoyed this essay so much! What a wonderful comment. I’m glad my work was able to speak to you this way.
Wow, this is really good, dude. This got to be the best video about Chloe I've ever watched. Most vids and posts just say she's toxic and is the worst friend.
Thank you so much!
Great video! I got into Life is Strange pretty recently and I was surprised when I discovered the discourse surrounding Chloe in the fandom (though maybe I should not have been surprised...) . My opinion/analysis pretty much lines up with yours. Chloe has quickly become one of my favorite characters in fiction and I'm grateful to see such an in-depth analysis!
Your video essay warmed my heart, thank you for treating Chloe's character (one of my favorite game characters) with such an even hand and covering a significant amount the context that in which she exists with such consideration and care. Great work and good luck with future videos!
I’m so happy to hear that!! I work really hard on my videos, and I’m always very careful and intentional to be respectful of where my audience may be coming from. It’s always wonderful to hear that it comes through. I hope you’ll subscribe to enjoy my work in the future!
thank you for making this video essay. I think the conversation in ep4 for alt chloe and the conversation with her in the truck was why i saved her. And if u look close, you can find her anti-depressants in the bathroom. She was really dealing a lot of stuff. The lost of her father, a tough stepfather and a chaotic friend's disappearance (rachel). Chloe constantly thinks that she doesn't deserve to live and being very self-destructive etc..And that's the point for me to save her.
Ive been waiting for this kind of video for so long. Thank you!
I’m so happy to hear that!
Thank you so much for this essay, Chloe has been my fav character for the last 9 years and I love all content which attempts to look at her for who she is: mentally ill girl who got abandoned, mentally and physically, by everyone she cares about, and has behavioural issues bc noone in the town cares to see her as anything other than 'a problem unable to do good things'. I deeply love and relate to her. Thank you for this video
Great video! Chloe is one of the best videogame character out there, and all of what you said is the reason of it.
Great video! the sound inbetween chapters (chapters? like, parts of the video) kept jumpscaring the shit out of me but it was worth it lol
people gets so worked up over this girl for years bro, and its so mid, sexism is sad, love chloe, respect for tackling misogyny!
I mean yeah some people are sexist about it but u can't get mad at people if they wouldn't want anything to do with her if she existed irl
No shit. but people specifically coming at her with misogynistic labels, without considering the point and background of her character, that's pretty unfair. Despite having experienced trauma throughout her life, she was demonstrated to have significantly changed her ways in a matter of days. All we're asking is empathy, which female characters are rarely afforded. There are many broken people in the real world, but that doesn't mean they shouldnt be given the opportunity to get their act together and improve.
He says men dont get it, but the exposure i mostly get from SE is ff15, an many hate Gladio for similar reasons and hes the most masculine.
Its not simply misogyny. Often the male characters are just better written, not that we just hate girls
People dont like dealing with people with a lot of trauma. Chloe would get more hate as a guy. Guys can't "have feelings"
Fucking THANK YOU. It’s about time someone said it.
Great video! Very insightful and its making me thing more about chloe, and differently
I’m so glad! My goal is always to help people think about topics from new angles, great to hear I succeeded!
thanks my guy this gave me a lot of perspective and a deeper appreciation for her character i was already stoked to play this game but you turned it up to 11
You mentioned the incongruencies between BTS and LiS1. One idea I like is that BTS is Chloe telling Max about Rachel and some of what went down. The gaps and errors become the gaps and errors of a person trying to recall a series of events.
I enjoyed what you did here. Thanks for it.
She has got what she deserved in my story. She's with Max and they're together. Developers and publishers will take characters and stories to any point to grab more cash. It's up to us where we put a stop.
i always loved chloe for her hilarious lines in the game. now while before the storm isnt a favorite of mine, it helped me see how alone and hurt chloe truly was. and over the years, i realized i related to her more than i thought. during high school, i definitely had a max and chloe side in me. someone who was introverted, insecure, and tended to stay in the background, and also someone who was deeply hurting, angry at the world and pushed people away
yesss, finally another tasteful LiS essay!! Loved it!! Subscribed :)
You know, this video actually kinda made me cry. (Not in a bad way)
I’ve loved this character for years and you basically voiced my entire stance/opinion on Chloe Price, it always made me sad to see people play the game and see people just kinda hate on Chloe, not taking the time to really look at her situation and why she’s the way she is. Seeing her worst traits and not seeing the good side of who she is. I didn’t always like Chloe’s character especially not in the beginning of my first playthrough of LIS1 but that changed by the end of the games story to where I really felt for her and really liked her character. And my love for the character became pureified by her story in BTS & the Farewell episode.
I love this video and I thank you for making it.
Awww I’m so happy to hear that. I’m glad it was so meaningful for you!
@@TheAdamSplitter it really was, after watching this and Playing Double exposure I wonder what your thoughts on the Chloe stuff are, wether you’d do a follow up talking about it or just having this analysis video be a one off (btw I don’t have anything negative to say about the topic)
I might do a video on DE at some point once the toxicity dies down a little haha. In the meantime, you might want to check out my livestreams of the game.
@@TheAdamSplitter completely fair tbh hahah
Chloe is just an ok character. I get it she’s just a teen but she does become unlikable after awhile. She is incapable of moving on and is stuck in the past and uses it to tear down everyone around her because she always acts like a child. It literally gets her killed. Not saying she’s completely horrible because she does have some like able traits and moments but she doesn’t grow at all as a character. It’s good that she does accept that she’s supposed to be dead because it’s better off this way.
We needed that video
I would die for Chloe Price, she helped me come to terms with being a lesbian❤ but besides that, just overall great a character. Well made woman 100/10
Don't know if it's brought up anywhere else (sorry, haven't watched the linked essays) but I always thought it was ... interesting, during the final decision, that Chloe doesn't stop to say other's lives are worth more than her own until AFTER she sees Max reject, or at least struggle with, Chloe's offered deferred guilt plan. Max questions, and blames herself. Chloe really tries to shift the perspective of the storm, and Max's inherent responsibility for it, into -- life sucks, sh@$'s gone bad, but give yourself moment to breathe; maybe all of this was supposed to happen, and I'm grateful for you. #$^@ who's to blame, you're amazing.
Referencing video: ua-cam.com/video/htpG3W7aTyw/v-deo.html
The first minute encapsulates my above interpretation. Starting at 0:56 to 1:07 there is a pause while Chloe waits, watching Max work through Chloe's rudimentary attempt to soothe. If the creators *meant* for those specific facial reads on Chloe's face to reflect how Chloe *seems* to take Max's silence and continued, if not rising, agitation, that little crestfallen beat at 1:04 to 1:08 is really heartbreaking. She was *waiting* for Max to say, yeah, this is f-ed up, too big to handle, but you matter to me, Chloe; your life matters. And right there, when it would have been most meaningful, Max is silent. Instead, Chloe gives Max the out Max needs to make the final choice. And Max protests, because what has Max been doing ALL THIS TIME if it comes down to
It's nice that Chloe got the words of affirmation she needed, just depressing it was after she decides she's worthless. Making space for Max to feel better is the best Chloe can offer in the moment, but it's just -- it's sad, you know? It wasn't like she didn't have those thoughts (evidenced by the fact she says them); that the greater good might be better served by her dying on the bathroom floor -- just think of everyone else who'd be saved! -- but to me, it seemed like fear and self-loathing (also wanting Max to feel better) were her primary motivators. Still, it was a genuine offer, and draws the finish line for Chloe's emotional/maturity arc.
Either decision is justified (even if one, the more tragic, gut wrenching one, got a better conclusion). It just makes me sad, for Chloe -- she did all that growing, from BtS to LiS -- and this is how it ends. With a whimper or a bang.
As an aside, yes, I know Chloe's little speech contradicts what she literally said earlier, that the storm likely stemmed from Max's timey-wimey shenanigans (sorta), but I consider that sentiment, and Warren's, "Holy understatements, Bat-Max, look at what you've done!", to be more story streamlining to make the binary choice more palatable than actual, you know, character driven dialogue.
Another aside: 'Dirty pool, old man', as Gomez Addams says, evoking such a strong symmetry to Final Destination, and movies where bad things happen because it's fate, and there's no escaping it. SMH at Don't Nod for that particular shortcut.
Another another aside: #$^@ the trolly problem and all philosophical quandaries that spawned it. Burn it. Burn it with fire. Love the series though!
Cheers!
LiS content in 2024 that isn’t about double exposure, finally ❤❤
Well I’m doing livestreams of that too haha. But this essay was written before even the early access of the first two chapters and designed to be released alongside DE, so yeah it isn’t about that. Glad you enjoyed it!
My biggest issue with people who don't even try to understand Chloe is that we're talking about a videogame here. A story based videogame, at that. Meaning, the game actively DEMANDS your attention and empathy. When you're experiencing a story, understanding the characters is the least you can do and you are rewarded for it with a more engaging understanding of the story. So, if some people are unable to show that empathy for a fictional character in exchange for said reward, how are they gonna show any empathy to real people in exchange for nothing?
Thanks for putting my thoughts into words. Always great when someone does that for me
There's a subset of men who get triggered by outspoken, confident women. They feel threatened by them, and prefer women to be meek and "trad". The fact that Chloe is attractive and gay (and has blue hair!) just makes it even worse.
And it is almost always men who have a problem with Chloe. I think if you come across a man who hates Chloe, you should view it as a big red flag.
Does she deserve better though? Chloe has got to be one of the most toxic people and a truly horrible friend.
Did you watch the video?
@adammyers7383 i did, and she is still an incredibly toxic character and a horrible friend.
@@raffydog619you’re just being flat-out ignorant
@@raffydog619 Hey you were mentioned in the video! A person who only looks at the surface of a character!
I love Chloe so much because I understand and have felt her pain. She's not a perfect person, she's deeply flawed and hurt and she wants people to show her the love and patience that they show others but but because they already see Chloe as the angry problem child that's the only way treat her without even attempting to treat her any other way. Chloe despite being angry and hateful is so capable of so much love and empathy for others, looking around her room you find so many keepsakes of her dad, Rachel, and Max even though she felt they all left her and hurt her deeply she still kept all those memories of them because she loves each of them so much after so many years. Everyone is so quick to be mad at her when she's rude but never comments on the times she shows them love. Even the time she got mad about answering Kate's call she later apologized but if you look at it from her point, Max was her childhood best friend who moved away and left her right after her father died then ghosted her for no reason for 5 years, then she finds out Max has been back in town for months without letting her know, then after all that time ignoring her calls and messages she sees Max making it an important point to answer a phone call from a girl that Max has only known for a few months, which for Chloe would be an especially painful stab in the heart after the way Max treated her.
Thank you for defending chloe price, it feels like ever since lis1 people have hated her but ive always felt like i understood her and her feelings.
I lost a parent at an early age, so I understand what makes Chloe what she is. Been there.
I haven't watched the video yet but what I do know is that after DE there will be more Chloe haters here. Because "she left Max"” Although Dontnod did a good job of showing that she would never do that (She's super loyal), they showed it in both games and the point of Bae ending was always that the girls would stay together forever. D9 disrespected that and killed Chloe as a character.
I’m so tired of DE discourse. This isn’t the space for this kind of comment.
I love life is strange and I’m not interested in feeding the toxic beast that all Max and Chloe discourse seems to be.
when i first played lis 1 i didn't like chloe's actions and personality even though i cared about her. after i played before the storm... it totally changed the way i saw her. i love her now
I absolutely agree with your overall message and I agree with almost all of what you have to say here, but I was really confused by the discussion on Joyce and David. If these are common opinions in the community, forgive me for being out the loop, but after you went through the factors to consider closely with Chloe and efforts that should be taken to unbias ourselves, it felt like whiplash to not extend those same considerations to Joyce or David. I think objectively, the original LIS commits fully into the notion that David is well-intentioned and is capable of growth/change, but is working through his own trauma and PTSD that while not justifying his negative actions, does inform it, and by the end he does believably reflect on his actions and strive to do better. As for Joyce, on one hand I want to lean on that we just don't know enough to say whether or not she failed Chloe. We have no idea what she did at the time of William's death and how she choose to support Chloe before David entered the picture, or really anytime prior to Before the Storm. Regardless, I have a hard time thinking that she always sided with David, given how easy it was to persuade her to kick him out of the house in Chapter 4. Joyce had to have been the one most impacted by William's death, as on top of the emotional trauma that would come from that, and the guilt she likely felt being the one to call him to pick her up, she also didn't have the time to spiral because she had to keep things going for Chloe. It always felt more to me like Joyce was stuck between a rock and hard place with Chloe and David, not necessarily like she took one side every time. She calls David out when he make mistakes and can be swayed to fully turn on David. Calling her awful altogether almost felt like you didn't take your own advice about how to respectfully view a women's situation and consider the context to come to nuanced conclusion.
I did explain that I deeply sympathize with Joyce’s struggles and why a man like David is appealing to her. And I also noted that she’s not an all-around awful person, but rather an awful mother. Her own struggles do not excuse her treatment of Chloe.
In terms of kicking David out, I feel that she’s mainly listening to Max rather than Chloe in that moment. It’s pretty consistent that Joyce listens to Max but dismisses Chloe. Also, David hitting Chloe absolutely should have been the breaking point. “He feels awful” is an unacceptable reaction to that. Even separate from that, he constantly refers to her in demeaning and misogynistic-leaning language like “girlie” and “missy”, not to mention he clearly sees total control over her life and invasion of her privacy as rights he is owed.
As for why I didn’t spend much time on the nuances of David, it’s because this essay is about Chloe and why she is the way she is, and David’s abuse of Chloe is more important to that topic than his trauma and such. Like I mentioned, (almost) every character in the LiS series is a full person but this essay was focused specifically on Chloe, and I’d have to save analysis of other characters for other videos.
@@TheAdamSplitter Fair's fair on not delving into David, but I think the crux of our disagreement comes down to what should earn you "awful mother status," and does the slap reaction and Joyce's implied over-support of David outweigh what she has done and still continues to do for Chloe. There's no doubt in my mind and Joyce struggles and suffers day after day almost solely to provide for Chloe and give her a comfortable environment, and even after 5 years Joyce is still trying to help Chloe work through her grief. Joyce will chastise Chloe for her negative behaviors, but never get's angry or withdraws her overall love/support. When it comes to the slap, which was completely out of line, it's sort of unfair to judge her conversation with Max I think for a few reasons. For one, we don't get to see Joyce's actual reaction to hearing of the news, since due to an interesting character moment for David, he comes clean about it immediately to Joyce off-screen, so we don't have a good reference point to gauge her in-the-moment response. I think what we know about David overall should point that in the context of Joyce's life, he would deserve the opportunity to fix what he did through change, and that the nebulous "punishment" she also mentions to Max may imply the need for family or anger-management counseling, which I think would really benefit David more than kicking him out. There's also the concern of whether or not Joyce feels comfortable attempting to kick David out of their house in a 1:1 confrontation, and while I don't personally think David would ever hurt Joyce, she would still need to consider this and consider how her and Chloe's lives would get harder without David around. The conversation Joyce has with Max also has to be viewed through the understanding that this is their first interaction in 5 years, and Joyce likely isn't willing to disclose every detail of her marital struggles at the drop of a hat, and while she is working. The point is that even if we chalk her not kicking David out right now as a huge blunder in parenting, does that ultimately cancel out her continued love/support and care? I definitely don't think it would be fair to fault her for not "fixing" Chloe in terms of working her through her trauma, both with William and Rachel Amber, as Joyce isn't a grief counselor and even then grief isn't a linear process and something that can be forced to resolution in the first place.
One last thing on David and Chloe specifically though, I think his policing of Chloe comes down less to an entitlement to her privacy, and more to the coupling of him being genuinely concerned for Chloe with the negative expectations/behaviors that were instilled in him through his military service. We know though some of his possessions in LIS and his overt behaviors in Before the Storm that David does view Chloe as his daughter, and as a child overall, on top of genuinely caring for her wellbeing and safety, so it's not surprising that he oversteps boundaries because they have a relationship that Chloe does not agree with. I think his misogynistic-learning language also supports this, as he sees Chloe still as a child in need of discipline.
I understand and respect all this, but I do stand by what I said here and I do feel that a lot of this is best saved for an essay more focused on David.
Thank you for this
Discussions like this are necessary but, at the same time I don't think a lot of the chloe haters are necessarily looking too deep into her. She is the blue haired loud woman, she's abrasive and as such she is annoying. Also lots of people claim she triggers their PTSD from narcissistic parents or partners. It's quite unfortunate because I really think I understood the intention behind her character. I also think lots of people who never played the games are some of its biggest haters.
I find it ironic that the entire internet was up-in-arms about the way D9 handled the new game when most of the people hadn't even engaged with the series since, like, 2015 when they watched a youtuber play the game or something. Don't get me wrong, the new game is.... interesting to say the least, and probably my least favourite of the series, but it's so strange to me seeing all these people jump onto the subreddit/twitter fandom and they're suddenly diehard Chloe fans, like, where have they all been the last 9 years lol?
I dunno. This IP is definitely in a strange place at the moment. I will probably listen to the rest of this video while I'm playing a game later today.
I think that’s a bit of a strawman honestly, though I see where you’re coming from.
@@TheAdamSplitter Sorry, which part were you referring to? The bit about Chloe being an alleged abuser? Because I can link some tweets if I can find them, I promise it's a real thing that used to pop up in the odd viral post.
If you *were* referring to the part about the fan outcry, I feel like the existence of this video is evidence alone that you were aware of the general attitude towards Chloe, at least prior to the new game. That being said, the hate usually came from outside the fandom, maybe these suddenly vocal fans were here the entire time I dunno. I just know that I've snooped into enough reddit users' post history to see they've only become active in the subreddit specifically to hate on the new game with little evidence of previously being fans.
I mean the new game is not fantastic, especially the direction they took with Chloe, but, still.
@@TaxFraudTutorials sorry for not being clear. I meant that a lot of people I’ve run into that have problems with the new game are people who have a deep emotional attachment to the original and to Pricefield specifically, to the point that they seemingly can’t (or refuse to) accept the developments for Pricefield that the new game establishes.
There’s been a LOT of gatekeeping in the LiS fandom for years now. There’s a very specific image many people have of what LiS is supposed to be, and anything outside of that tends to be treated with mild to significant hostility.
I absolutely loved your review!
I have to apologize-I misjudged a bit when I saw it was a man discussing these women’s lives. I’ve been a little cynical lately, and I’m sorry for that initial assumption. But your insights truly surprised me, and I found myself agreeing with every single point. You expressed it all so perfectly; I couldn’t have said it better myself!
I don’t blame you for that trepidation, men don’t have the best track record of talking about women’s struggles. I extra appreciate you giving the video a genuine chance. Im so happy you found it so meaningful!
This video is so good, I agree with every word
This video is genuinely excellent idk
I have seen many people argue that "Just because she suffered doesn't excuse her being an asshole" I wonder if they would say the exact same thing to characters like Patrick Bane, or Tony Stawks, or in general some of the most well known "dark and edgy" male characters that have been know for their brutality, rough around the edges, yet deeply been traumatized since the get go. When they think about THOSe characters, would they jump out and say " oh yeah, that dude infuriating! I couldn't stand seeing him every second on screen, he was such a bitch!"? And if so, would they pause, think about it, and acknowledge the world they lived was the environmental cause of that behavior and would come to understand that it would be easier to fall into that mindset the character had?
In other news have seen no mention on how Mark Jefferson, the main antagonist , has down atrociously worse things than Chloe or Rachel (the manipulators) would never ever subject thier victims to. Yet no one (I'm looking at male audiences on this but not specifically you OP) mentions this because he was "forgettable."
I would really like hear your thoughts on Rachel Amber or Victoria Chase. Great Video, I wish this had more views but unfortunately algorithm is a bitch.
A great video on Chloe price. I have always loved and appreciated her story and character in LiS. she is someone who wants love and cares very deeply as well.
Chloe experience many losses in her formative years which are the most crucial developmental years of a person.
Her experiences shaped her i was able to understand and empathize and have sympathy for her. I choose the save arcadia ending personally but i was also impacted by the save chloe ending because to me this game is about max and chloe's intense and complex and moving relationship. Chloe deserved a chance to heal and live a happy satisfied life.
Her whole character arc showed that she is capable of empathy, goodness, growth and change if given the circumstances and support.
Yes, she is not perfect and because of her trauma she lashes out and is selfish and sometimes makes bad decisions but that doesn't make her incapable of growth or irredeemable unlike the many "likeable and redeemed" adult male characters in other video game or any other medias that have done far worse and still earn the kindness and sympathy and support of the audience. She is able to recognize her mistakes and willing to make sacrifices.
It is unfortunate that discussions of her character is often veers into misogyny and also homophobia.
Of course some have valid critiques of her character and many others have changed their opinions later or are open to healthy discussions and engagement all are not going to arrive at the same conclusion. Its just the blatant vitriol and lack of slight empathy that bothers me when analyzing Chloe.
Chloe is one of my favorite characters along with Max that have impacted me in the long run. I only say this about characters that have deeply resonated with me or made me think or teach me or inspire me or give me new other perspectives and have stayed in my mind long after I completed experiencing their story.
Sidenote: I assume u might be a fan of rwby sorry if u r not.
i used to be in my teen years and i got into LiS in my young adult years so my maturity and media literacy was different. Rwby was an utter disappointment for me. It started off good but now its unrecognizable to me personally i gave up long ago. To summerize my critiques
1. the lack of narrative and plot focus
2. lack of emotional and narrative arc for the main female characters compared to the overt focus on male characters
3. lack of good sociopolitical worldbuilding and themes, frankly it has mediocre worldbuilding
4. queerbaiting and lack of full fledged queer characters and women and femme with diverse intersectional backgrounds.
5. the utterly bad and sometimes offensive handling of the racism allegory with the faunus storyline and insensitive handling of sensitive issues within the story
5. the bad and harmful corporate practices of rooster teeth and using rwby ip to churn out for cash grab in greed
we can agree to disagree on my rwby points and if you have anything different to add or if u do agree on some of my points. Seeing flashes of rwby in your video brought back some opinions of mine that i had long closed/moved on from regarding rwby as a show its been a few years since i thought about it.
Thank you for reading kindly if u have read fully. I apologize for any grammar or any error as english is not my first language and if i said something wrong pls correct me.
To be honest... when I played Life is Strange for the first time in 2017, I hated Chloe. She was this rebellious know-it-all brat who blamed everyone for everything she messed up. That really pissed me off back then. I've since played Life is Strange: Before the storm and my view of Chloe has changed a bit. For me, the prequel is an important part of understanding why Chloe is the way she is and acts the way she does. My decisions in my current 2nd run through of Life is Strange are much milder and in favor of Chloe.
I'm recommending this video to anyone who wants to say that Chloe is a bad friend and toxic for no reason even though its so much more deeper than that.
She may deserve better but I still think she's a terrible friend cause one she acts like Max had a choice to leave when she was a minor at the time and was acting ungrateful towards max when she literally kept saving her life over and over again
8:25
Unrelated but…. *glares daggers at the Hazbin Hotel Fandom*
Now, more related, I remember when LIS came out, people HATED Chloe and I didn’t know why. She’s a flawed person like everyone else in the franchise. And for reasons…people hate actually flawed female characters dispite wanting them to exist.
Chloe lost her father at a young age then max moves away shortly after that. Her mother gets with david who was a douche though that changed later. Chloe meets rachel who was her angel. Then rachel just vanishes from her life. She then finds out that rachel was killed. Max ghosts her for years. Chloe gets drugged by nathan. Chloe either loses her mom or her life. Considering everything she's been through she gets too much hate. And chloe in general isn't a bad character or person. Especially considering characters like nathan and jefferson and in comparison to them.
Post like the the “you couldn’t even handle [insert infamously hated female character here]” get me thinking about claims like what they quote.
To start with those claiming we need more [blank] female characters will often be the same that agree that there’s a cultural stigma against girls who will “step out of line” socially and how that’s been leveraged against female characters enmass.
Though it’s also interesting to think about the other group this claim will come from. Namely those who carry their unconscious biases against “badly written” female characters but act as if they don’t.
See, they can handle evil, comical or even morally grey female characters… in their minds. They love the hypothetical strong female character in their heads. Detached from any narrative context. No other characters, male especially, for them to foil off of. Nothing to “ruin” them as it were.
Korra, the character, had initially been received well at the idea of a female protagonist leading a new Avatar series. However, when applied to an actual story and cast of characters to bounce off of, you better believe that a lot of people busted out the “unlikable” card like it was Exodia’s Head.
Joyce, your daughter lost her dad at like 13-14 or something- An you’re saying she chooses to be angry, WHEN YOUR NEW MAN SLAP THE HELLA OF HER 💀💀 ((Love all these characters btw)))
chloe is rude selfish bad friend maybe manipulative that being said i like her she does sfow appreciation from like when you convince to not go after nathan and tell her about the other chloe also she genuinely cares for max
ive noticed nathan gets a lot of love but chloe gets a lot of hate even tho they are both characters with lots of truama but also act like a brat
How to comment this the right way. So when we as the player take control of Max she is the most mid or grey person you can be. Little introvertet, has some friends but not many, isnt popular, isnt a high scorer on test and grades but the teachers belive in her and that she can be better. Something so many people can easily relate too. Max is meant to be modeled by the players choices and actions rather than her own goals. As some1 wrote on anther video if it wasnt for Chloe what would Max in theory do with her powers? And the anwser is nothing. She is very fine with being in her own lane if you can say so.
Max is made to have reason to everything. She cares about everyone even thou she doesnt show it because she doesant know how something her powers let her achieve by talking to people finding out more about them.
Then we have Chloe. Some1 who is the total opposite of Max. She isnt intovertet, she isnt shy, she was a high grading student who with her own will choose to let it all slip. Chloe has no "reason"(she does but i cant explain it without that word) she is the voice of madness if you could say it like that. Max is reason and love Chloe is madness and hate if you will. In the end of ep1 Chloe wants arcadia bay to destroyed because it has taken everything she ever cared about. Where as Max is constantly trying her hardest to save everyone around her all through the game.
We the player never really have our own goals in the game. Chloe is the one that drags the game forward being just that as so many people have pointed out she is selfish while Max isnt selfish at all. All things Max cares about is how to stop the storm and her school thats it. There is no thinking far into the future.
So when we have Chloe in the game if she was like Max nothing ever would have happened by "following" the rules. That what is making Chloe so good. Her actions is never based on reason or anything more than her self. STealing money? Max would never but Chloe would.
At the start Max tries to save everyone but Chloe is only thinking about saving herself. At the end Chloe is willing to save everyone else but she dies while Max is "fine ok doesnt care" with letting everyone else die but Chloe lives. They are made to be their polar opposite and from the start to the end they both change the mindset about everything 180 degree. Chloe being okay with dying for the sake of other while Max is okay with other dying so she can save Chloe.
Chloe is a broken ass person in every way and form possible but it also makes those times when we see the bullshit attituide drop like when we visit Kate in the hospital how sorry she actually is for her both getting mad at Max for taking a call and not thinking about anyone lse but herself
Chloe is in every episode changing so ever slightly and when we get to see those moments being in focus she doesnt seem so broken after all. It redeems her by showing that she understand as you said how she is affecting her own surrounding with her actions. Her being genuinely sorry at the hospital or inbetween timeline shifts where she texts Max to tell her she is sorry for getting angry at her in the car when she had done nothing wrong.
When you write a character that is broken it is easy to lose those "sane" moment and make the broken character say that theyre sorry but it is not showing or it doesnt match up with how the character seems. DONTNOD made a very (in)perfect character in Chloe, she was never meant to be a likeable character and that is so beautiful about her.
At the end where Chloe is realizing that Max could go back and let her die she doesnt do it because she doesnt value her life or how to say that Max cares more about Chloe then Chloe does. Chloe has always held her self as her own top1 priority never thinking about anyone else but she also knows how people around her are affected by things.
All she never needed was to be accepted like when her dad was still alive. All she ever needed was to feel loved and cared about and get out of her own head with her thinking that people hates her and leaves her by choice. It was never a choice they were killed. All it took was for Max to come back over and over for those 5 days for her to understand her ways.
You can even hear Chloe break down trying to say that she has to die. She cant say it, she never says it. She never could say that she is fine with dying because she isnt. She has more come to terms with that fact that she has been an asshole beyond belief for no reason. She never gave any1 a chance in life
So if it means that Chloe dies so every can get their chance that they never got if she stays a life after the bathrrom she is fine to give them their chance, she believes in their chance to live.
Some1 that wants to die pushes for the action that will end her life. Chloe doesnt want to die but she doesnt want to live with her actions either. She gives her believes to Max that she is the only one strong enough to make that choice about who dies. MAx is the only one that will not break after choosing life and death, regretting their choice after.
As you said about the car scene Chloe is angry so her pain validatied "its not really an indicator to her feeling in general". Max had done everything she can to keep Chloe alive so when she comes back and Chloe ask her to go back and she says no it is not really an indicator for Max feelings as with Chloe in the car. It is a reaction to something around her it is not until Chloe say how everyone else should live and she gives she true thoughts and feelings about people that Max is even considering it. That "Chloe I cant make this choice" line from Max is powerful because at that moment when she says it she has already thought about both saving Chloe and letting her die.
A whole as text about a game, it is insane that after 8 years this game still fking haunts me everywhere I go. Always being the ghost in the back of my head. I can never let this character Chloe Price leave or get out of my head and i find it insane. She is so bad and horrible and she is also perfect and well done at the same time.
From my point of you if some1 reads everthing i wrote you can see that I differ from OG where as I see Chloe as a person who just wanted to die for the longest time but when she understand by that her dying will stop everything she just wants nothing more than to live but not if everyone has to die because if it. The very duality of man. She wants to die for so long but when the time comes for her to die she actually wants to live. Having something great but not understanding how great that "something" is until that something is lost.
Great video either way. I hope my comment isnt to bad i know i wrote a lot but passion makes people do dumb things ima right?
Hey new here but I’m a fan of the game series and love a good story and I’m open to others opinions. I liked your essay
YES YES FINALLY I SUPPORT
Thanks for mentioning Korra in the beginning, the victim blaming for something she didn't even do is insane, it's crazy how hated female characters are called Mary sues despite being hated for their flaws, april from tmnt 2012 is also a victim of this
Joyce, your daughter lost her dad at like 13-14 or something- An you’re saying she chooses to be angry, WHEN YOUR NEW MAN SLAP THE HELLA OF HER 💀💀 ((Love all these characters btw)))