the point about “ punk shows only being cool if you have a stable home life” really fascinates me. Where I live, there’s this incredibly grungy noise music venue called the meatlocker which is exclusively visited by 16-year-olds or middle-aged men, and whether or not being at the meatlocker is seen as cool or as trashy is entirely dependent on similar traits that you’ve pointed out lol
@@samsrants glad to know it’s so universal. I actually cut a line hammering home the point because I was a bit worried it might read as me being condescending rather than speaking from experience
i feel like maybe rachels disappearance might've made chloe alot more emotionally unstable and aggrivated her and davids relationship again. losing rachel so suddenly probably reset her grief for her dad in a way she wasn't prepared for and it got taken out on david, so in my mind the transition from bts chloe to lis chloe makes sense in a way
Before the Storm is my favorite in the series, even if it's not objectively the best or most original. It just hit me right, and therefore is important to me. And made me a fan of Daughter.
12:14 I think it actually makes more sense than you might’ve thought of by the moment of recording this video. Chloe can’t handle rejection well and doesn’t have strong ambitions in life. She has struggles in letting go which is very prominent in her diary and dialog. She keeps mentioning Max in her journal and often talks about her even tho she left years ago. In the Life is Strange dlc we can see Chloe as a child and compared to the BTS Chloe she is A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT person. She used to love science, had ambitions, good grades, was happy, social, more conventionally looking(i ain’t saying that being punk is a bad thing but usually by the age of 13 kids experiment with their clothes). In comparison to that in Life Is Strange: Before The Storm, we see grumpy punk Chloe that smokes w33d, gets expelled and fails every class. In Lis she has already lost Racheal 6 months ago (even if she didn’t know that she has passed at the beginning). It makes sense that this would’ve been the breaking point and change her character almost completely, knowing that she was the only thing that inspired her to actually live life instead of just experiencing it in agony.
@@tlou_lisI don’t think it’s really “about” any one thing. That’s definitely a major part of it but if it was just about that one thing they wouldn’t have added all the other stuff with the school, frank, Joyce, David, etc.
I believe the devs did confirm it, Rachel's spirit uses the ghost doe to communicate with Max, because the doe is also Max's spirit guide. Rachel guides her towards the truth, etc.
Why I feel Chloe accepting the photo won't change things: We see in the game that every time Chloe agrees to go along, David takes advantage and reinstates authority instead. From the beginning: Chloe gets the wrench, he's rude. Parking lot: Chloe agrees to start over, good, now empty your pockets. If Chloe doesn't do that, later he'll search her room behind Joyce's back, and then expects a truce again. And the photo: no, that's not an offer of understanding. What David is saying is "I lost somebody, so I have the authority to tell you how you have to handle your pain". Nevermind a soldier losing a comrade is not comparable to how helpless a child feels when loosing a parent. Asking Chloe to hold on to the photo of his buddy is manipulative. Btw. all the while, as it is pointed out more than once, photos of William are disappearing from the house (I guess it's Joyce's decision, but is still painful for Chloe). David tries to do good but he is overbearing, invasive and incompetent (in his work too), while Chloe is a problematic child. Their relationship is basically Chloe screaming "I'm in fucking pain!", David's responding "Language, young lady!" while Joyce asks "Why cant we all just have breakfast together?" -- Great characters doomed to fail. :)
I really like the way you put that together. That is how I have always seen the Chloe/David/Joyce relationship. You just said it way better than I could.
I feel like David could have also gotten his ego up again after moving in, and getting a new job - similar to him being in the army, in his mind, where he felt purpose again, and his power trips lead back to how they were fighting before, and it turns into more than verbal abuse, unfortunately (even if Max doesn't see it, he's apparently hit her before and Joyce either doesn't believe it, and/or tries justifying it). I think accepting the photo just shows you especially at least tried. Makes sense how quick she is to forgive him when he tries to step up and make things right. Like with sabotaging Victoria's homework, standing up for Nathan, possibly helping Samantha, drugging Victoria, etc. All showing your Chloe's morals, what she thinks is justified, all leading up to that final decision. Regardless, no matter the choices, Chloe always ends up caring to a point, even if she says otherwise. Sometimes maybe even too much. Even in the prequel, even when he's not trying to be mean, David usually goes too far or at times needing to be on top/have the last word: "You're awfully smug for someone who just got kicked out of school." Or when he's trying to give her a pep-talk but still unintentionally insinuates that she's a loser for getting suspended/expelled. Or: "You've had enough of a vacation from having a father figure." But then if you choose to endure and listen, even Chloe sees he actually tries to give good advice and cares in his own way, but he is so stubborn and unknowing of how to necessarily handle certain aspects of life outside of what he learned from the army, he's a mess. (You thank him, he thinks you're being sarcastic and he gets snippy.) Not to mention, it probably happened again but worse, since James speaks to Ray Wells to get Chloe back into school, but she ends up getting expelled in the future as well anyway. Like seriously, imagine what he must of said when she got kicked out AGAIN. (Then cue him leaving answering messages about him caring about her safety before he takes out his anger, unknowingly or otherwise, on her when he's had a stressful day - in LIS Ep 1.) I'd be confused and pissed too, among other things, if I was Chloe. So much changed for her home life in such a short time. She had no one to turn to, before Max came back. And even when you do a scumbag Max playthrough, Chloe still shows up for you and forgives + even apologizes herself. Love her or hate her, I definitely thought it was big of her; even going so far as to call David her step-father at the end, despite everything. She thinks of everyone else in that moment especially, like in the possible scene for visiting Kate in the hospital (same for visiting Drew/Mikey), where she also apologizes. David, Rachel, and Max can end up telling her borderline the same words, think of someone else, don't be selfish, grow up, etc. Even when she probably should be selfish at times, she throws herself under the bus or goes out of the way to help others a lot, even if they've hurt her. More than most people think/notice. Thank you so much for this video, because I had most the same thoughts!
personally I think that Chloe does line up well to be honest when I first played the game I didn't think that because it seemed disconnected but after taking some psychology classes for my degree I view it as Chloe has intentionally pushed him away again like if you play and bond with David in Before the Storm you can take it as after Rachael went missing and with her Father's death Chloe subconsciously blames herself because from her prospective everyone she loves either dies or leaves so she instead pushes David away instead of continuing to bond with him even though she wants to.
Thank you for helping me appreciate what I considered a lackluster game, You have to admit for some of us, the end of ch 2 seem to promise something the conclusion never delivered. Well, you did a great job of clarifying Rachel's motives,. Rachel is an actress, perpetually putting on an act, just like her father,
rachel's attitude also seems to reflect chloe with max. And I wish the chloe we saw in before the storm was reflected. While I didn't really like chloe, I did feel bad for her (her scene in the different world honestly broke my heart.) There was just so much more potential gone just like that, and maybe that's what chloe and rachel represented, potential.
Hi I just found this video and haven’t dug around your channel yet (must’ve gotten the bad habit of snooping from Max ;) but I was curious of your take on Elliot. I get fixated on him since he gave me such whiplash the first time I played. The other character that fascinates me is Nathan. He was supposedly having more to do with the storm in Max’s vision but they cut that content. Aside from that in BTS he doesn’t even really acknowledge Victoria and is instead with this Samantha character. I thought pre-quels were supposed to answer questions instead of giving us more. Lol
Samantha and Elliot are two characters that I don’t even know what to think about except that Samantha’s character model looks like a grown adult woman to me. Im workshopping something about a character’s pain existing for others character development for the Chloe video and I’ve thought about including something about them in it.
@ I agree. Samantha looks like she has no business being on a student campus. Her model reminds me a little of of Rachel’s mom unless I’m totally misremembering.
About our version of Chloe not aligning with Life Is Strange 1, I really think it's a simple thing: Familial relationships go back to suare one VERY easily. Example, a mother with an addiction promises to not take her irritation out on her kid. She keeps that promise...for a while. Old habits die hard, the mother has a bad day, and before she knows it, she has reverted back to her old self. Chloe and David bond a bit, but I'm assuming six months after Rachel's disappearance, Chloe loses it, maybe she even tried to talk to David about it, but he probably said smt she didn't like. And we all know when someone says something that Chloe doesn't like, she shuts them out/sees them as the enemy.
Before the storm is easily the worst lis game for me and 2. The way they potrayed Chloe and David relationship in the game was very confusing. David is not this mega jerk and chloe pushing him away makes sense. However david was abusive paranoid jerk in the first game and it wasnt shown. Well the paranoia at least should have been shown. I also didn't like Rachel Amber at all I think I was better off not knowing about her. Then the way it ended to not even show who killed her annoys me. I refuse to believe Jefferson is telling the truth.
@@taylorwiser3114 Why? Because she is a toxic introvert who attacks girly girls and loves to judge everyone around. Ah yes and for one Safi I hate so much, she caused a time disaster. I hate tomboyish characters and I hate how Life is Strange series is hatefull towards girly girls.
@@Icy-be5vl that’s fair and for sure true. And also it’s kinda the point. Like max is supposed to be an asshole to further drive home the point that Rachel was both admired and adored but never genuinely. Max has a lot of shitty internal dialogue that is super fucking mean in the way a teenager like that tends to be. All the characters in these games are very flawed in very significant ways. It’s a good thing that you find those attributes distasteful. She’s a well written shitty teenager in my opinion. So are Chloe and Rachael. They all do pretty fucked up teenager shit. When max sees Victoria and Mr Jefferson talk in different scenes she almost always has a preferential view towards Mr Jefferson even though Mr Jefferson is hostile towards Victoria in a very unprofessional way. She has that shitty mentality many of us do at that age of good and bad being black and white. That all being said, Max has the opportunity to grow and be better. Being nice to Victoria or other girls in the game is an option and if you take them you can see how max is still kind of an asshole but also has the potential to grow. These interactions also do have an impact on the stories and by the end max becomes a far more loving and understanding person
@@GargoylePrincess No she doesn't. In Life is Strange Double Exponsure she is still mean towards everyone who are different than her and by saying different. I mean girls who actually likes to party and loves to wear dresses. High heels. Girly clothes and has girly hobbies. Chloe and Rachel have their own problems and they don't moralize everyone around like Maxine. Maxine is just perfect example of introvert who before being 18 years old has perfect life. Nothing bad happened to her but know when she is disliked by some people. She already thinks that she is some kind of victim and she even dares to say Chloe to grow up. Maxine is the one who never grow up. In Life is Strange Double Exponsure Maxine still thinks that she is some kind of sheriff who can moralize and judge everyone around her. She is doing worse things than Lucas. Vyhn. Loretta. Viktoria and everyone she hates and she is the biggest manipulant in the series. I am sick of people hatred towards Chloe and Rachel. Their behavior is understable. Maxine has no reasons to play a sheriff because that's who she is. She enjoys telling people what they should or not should do. She is nice to you only when you are a nerd introvert. She is even mean to Chloe. Yes she is mean to Chloe. When Chloe is mad at her, she actually has reasons. Maxine is mean to Chloe because Chloe is not good girlie type of girl. Maxine thinks that everyone are supposed to surrender to her will, if someone is different than her, she is hatefull and mean towards this person.
@@GargoylePrincess And what I hate about is the fact that people call Maxine a good person and even some kind of role model. Maxine is not a role model and is not a good person.
the point about “ punk shows only being cool if you have a stable home life” really fascinates me. Where I live, there’s this incredibly grungy noise music venue called the meatlocker which is exclusively visited by 16-year-olds or middle-aged men, and whether or not being at the meatlocker is seen as cool or as trashy is entirely dependent on similar traits that you’ve pointed out lol
@@samsrants glad to know it’s so universal. I actually cut a line hammering home the point because I was a bit worried it might read as me being condescending rather than speaking from experience
i feel like maybe rachels disappearance might've made chloe alot more emotionally unstable and aggrivated her and davids relationship again. losing rachel so suddenly probably reset her grief for her dad in a way she wasn't prepared for and it got taken out on david, so in my mind the transition from bts chloe to lis chloe makes sense in a way
Before the Storm is my favorite in the series, even if it's not objectively the best or most original. It just hit me right, and therefore is important to me. And made me a fan of Daughter.
It hit me right too. Everything from the music to the themes just worked for me.
I know, right? I'd never heard of Daughter before the game, and now she's half my playlist 😂
12:14 I think it actually makes more sense than you might’ve thought of by the moment of recording this video. Chloe can’t handle rejection well and doesn’t have strong ambitions in life. She has struggles in letting go which is very prominent in her diary and dialog. She keeps mentioning Max in her journal and often talks about her even tho she left years ago. In the Life is Strange dlc we can see Chloe as a child and compared to the BTS Chloe she is A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT person. She used to love science, had ambitions, good grades, was happy, social, more conventionally looking(i ain’t saying that being punk is a bad thing but usually by the age of 13 kids experiment with their clothes). In comparison to that in Life Is Strange: Before The Storm, we see grumpy punk Chloe that smokes w33d, gets expelled and fails every class. In Lis she has already lost Racheal 6 months ago (even if she didn’t know that she has passed at the beginning). It makes sense that this would’ve been the breaking point and change her character almost completely, knowing that she was the only thing that inspired her to actually live life instead of just experiencing it in agony.
It's funny how bts is story about Rachel told through Chloe and how video about Rachel is mainly about Chloe
@@dzrmgkva now that you point it out…yeah that is pretty funny. I wish I’d done that on purpose lol
isn't bts mainly about Chloe and how she perceived their relationship though?
@@tlou_lisI don’t think it’s really “about” any one thing. That’s definitely a major part of it but if it was just about that one thing they wouldn’t have added all the other stuff with the school, frank, Joyce, David, etc.
Many peope theoried that the deer from the first game symbolizes Rachel's spirit.
I’ve seen this theory and I prefer it to the “spirit animal” thing that exists in game.
I believe the devs did confirm it, Rachel's spirit uses the ghost doe to communicate with Max, because the doe is also Max's spirit guide. Rachel guides her towards the truth, etc.
Why I feel Chloe accepting the photo won't change things:
We see in the game that every time Chloe agrees to go along, David takes advantage and reinstates authority instead. From the beginning: Chloe gets the wrench, he's rude. Parking lot: Chloe agrees to start over, good, now empty your pockets. If Chloe doesn't do that, later he'll search her room behind Joyce's back, and then expects a truce again.
And the photo: no, that's not an offer of understanding. What David is saying is "I lost somebody, so I have the authority to tell you how you have to handle your pain". Nevermind a soldier losing a comrade is not comparable to how helpless a child feels when loosing a parent. Asking Chloe to hold on to the photo of his buddy is manipulative. Btw. all the while, as it is pointed out more than once, photos of William are disappearing from the house (I guess it's Joyce's decision, but is still painful for Chloe).
David tries to do good but he is overbearing, invasive and incompetent (in his work too), while Chloe is a problematic child.
Their relationship is basically Chloe screaming "I'm in fucking pain!", David's responding "Language, young lady!" while Joyce asks "Why cant we all just have breakfast together?" -- Great characters doomed to fail. :)
I really like the way you put that together. That is how I have always seen the Chloe/David/Joyce relationship. You just said it way better than I could.
I feel like David could have also gotten his ego up again after moving in, and getting a new job - similar to him being in the army, in his mind, where he felt purpose again, and his power trips lead back to how they were fighting before, and it turns into more than verbal abuse, unfortunately (even if Max doesn't see it, he's apparently hit her before and Joyce either doesn't believe it, and/or tries justifying it). I think accepting the photo just shows you especially at least tried. Makes sense how quick she is to forgive him when he tries to step up and make things right. Like with sabotaging Victoria's homework, standing up for Nathan, possibly helping Samantha, drugging Victoria, etc. All showing your Chloe's morals, what she thinks is justified, all leading up to that final decision. Regardless, no matter the choices, Chloe always ends up caring to a point, even if she says otherwise. Sometimes maybe even too much.
Even in the prequel, even when he's not trying to be mean, David usually goes too far or at times needing to be on top/have the last word: "You're awfully smug for someone who just got kicked out of school." Or when he's trying to give her a pep-talk but still unintentionally insinuates that she's a loser for getting suspended/expelled. Or: "You've had enough of a vacation from having a father figure." But then if you choose to endure and listen, even Chloe sees he actually tries to give good advice and cares in his own way, but he is so stubborn and unknowing of how to necessarily handle certain aspects of life outside of what he learned from the army, he's a mess. (You thank him, he thinks you're being sarcastic and he gets snippy.)
Not to mention, it probably happened again but worse, since James speaks to Ray Wells to get Chloe back into school, but she ends up getting expelled in the future as well anyway. Like seriously, imagine what he must of said when she got kicked out AGAIN.
(Then cue him leaving answering messages about him caring about her safety before he takes out his anger, unknowingly or otherwise, on her when he's had a stressful day - in LIS Ep 1.) I'd be confused and pissed too, among other things, if I was Chloe. So much changed for her home life in such a short time. She had no one to turn to, before Max came back. And even when you do a scumbag Max playthrough, Chloe still shows up for you and forgives + even apologizes herself.
Love her or hate her, I definitely thought it was big of her; even going so far as to call David her step-father at the end, despite everything. She thinks of everyone else in that moment especially, like in the possible scene for visiting Kate in the hospital (same for visiting Drew/Mikey), where she also apologizes. David, Rachel, and Max can end up telling her borderline the same words, think of someone else, don't be selfish, grow up, etc.
Even when she probably should be selfish at times, she throws herself under the bus or goes out of the way to help others a lot, even if they've hurt her.
More than most people think/notice.
Thank you so much for this video, because I had most the same thoughts!
personally I think that Chloe does line up well to be honest when I first played the game I didn't think that because it seemed disconnected but after taking some psychology classes for my degree I view it as Chloe has intentionally pushed him away again like if you play and bond with David in Before the Storm you can take it as after Rachael went missing and with her Father's death Chloe subconsciously blames herself because from her prospective everyone she loves either dies or leaves so she instead pushes David away instead of continuing to bond with him even though she wants to.
I definitely see that interpretation but it still just doesn’t seem connected for me and the version of Chloe I ended up with
Thank you for helping me appreciate what I considered a lackluster game, You have to admit for some of us, the end of ch 2 seem to promise something the conclusion never delivered. Well, you did a great job of clarifying Rachel's motives,. Rachel is an actress, perpetually putting on an act, just like her father,
life is strange has always been one of my favorite series! thanks for ur video
rachel's attitude also seems to reflect chloe with max. And I wish the chloe we saw in before the storm was reflected. While I didn't really like chloe, I did feel bad for her (her scene in the different world honestly broke my heart.) There was just so much more potential gone just like that, and maybe that's what chloe and rachel represented, potential.
I loved this game
I do feel like they should have let us change Rachel's fate
Nice Rachel we're having
Hi I just found this video and haven’t dug around your channel yet (must’ve gotten the bad habit of snooping from Max ;) but I was curious of your take on Elliot. I get fixated on him since he gave me such whiplash the first time I played.
The other character that fascinates me is Nathan. He was supposedly having more to do with the storm in Max’s vision but they cut that content. Aside from that in BTS he doesn’t even really acknowledge Victoria and is instead with this Samantha character. I thought pre-quels were supposed to answer questions instead of giving us more. Lol
Samantha and Elliot are two characters that I don’t even know what to think about except that Samantha’s character model looks like a grown adult woman to me. Im workshopping something about a character’s pain existing for others character development for the Chloe video and I’ve thought about including something about them in it.
@ I agree. Samantha looks like she has no business being on a student campus. Her model reminds me a little of of Rachel’s mom unless I’m totally misremembering.
About our version of Chloe not aligning with Life Is Strange 1, I really think it's a simple thing: Familial relationships go back to suare one VERY easily.
Example, a mother with an addiction promises to not take her irritation out on her kid. She keeps that promise...for a while. Old habits die hard, the mother has a bad day, and before she knows it, she has reverted back to her old self.
Chloe and David bond a bit, but I'm assuming six months after Rachel's disappearance, Chloe loses it, maybe she even tried to talk to David about it, but he probably said smt she didn't like. And we all know when someone says something that Chloe doesn't like, she shuts them out/sees them as the enemy.
😢thank you for feeding lis fans lol- this essay is so well made i straight up subbed after watching. Cant wait to watch your other vids!
Locked Tomb mentioned!
@@vaportrail85 I have a pink shirt that says “Alecto” in the Barbie font and I live for the day somebody recognizes it
LiS remains my favorite game.
Dev here, I love your video game character essays. Would you be interested in receiving a Steam Key for Extra Coin?
w caroline polachek
UA-cam is a harsh sea😅
Before the storm is easily the worst lis game for me and 2. The way they potrayed Chloe and David relationship in the game was very confusing. David is not this mega jerk and chloe pushing him away makes sense. However david was abusive paranoid jerk in the first game and it wasnt shown. Well the paranoia at least should have been shown. I also didn't like Rachel Amber at all I think I was better off not knowing about her. Then the way it ended to not even show who killed her annoys me. I refuse to believe Jefferson is telling the truth.
Chloe and Rachel are the only good female characters from Life is Strange. Whatever you like it or not! I hate Maxine Caulfield.
Why do you hate Max? I love hearing people's opinions
@@taylorwiser3114 Why? Because she is a toxic introvert who attacks girly girls and loves to judge everyone around. Ah yes and for one Safi I hate so much, she caused a time disaster. I hate tomboyish characters and I hate how Life is Strange series is hatefull towards girly girls.
@@Icy-be5vl that’s fair and for sure true. And also it’s kinda the point. Like max is supposed to be an asshole to further drive home the point that Rachel was both admired and adored but never genuinely. Max has a lot of shitty internal dialogue that is super fucking mean in the way a teenager like that tends to be. All the characters in these games are very flawed in very significant ways. It’s a good thing that you find those attributes distasteful.
She’s a well written shitty teenager in my opinion. So are Chloe and Rachael. They all do pretty fucked up teenager shit. When max sees Victoria and Mr Jefferson talk in different scenes she almost always has a preferential view towards Mr Jefferson even though Mr Jefferson is hostile towards Victoria in a very unprofessional way. She has that shitty mentality many of us do at that age of good and bad being black and white.
That all being said, Max has the opportunity to grow and be better. Being nice to Victoria or other girls in the game is an option and if you take them you can see how max is still kind of an asshole but also has the potential to grow. These interactions also do have an impact on the stories and by the end max becomes a far more loving and understanding person
@@GargoylePrincess No she doesn't. In Life is Strange Double Exponsure she is still mean towards everyone who are different than her and by saying different. I mean girls who actually likes to party and loves to wear dresses. High heels. Girly clothes and has girly hobbies. Chloe and Rachel have their own problems and they don't moralize everyone around like Maxine. Maxine is just perfect example of introvert who before being 18 years old has perfect life. Nothing bad happened to her but know when she is disliked by some people. She already thinks that she is some kind of victim and she even dares to say Chloe to grow up. Maxine is the one who never grow up. In Life is Strange Double Exponsure Maxine still thinks that she is some kind of sheriff who can moralize and judge everyone around her. She is doing worse things than Lucas. Vyhn. Loretta. Viktoria and everyone she hates and she is the biggest manipulant in the series. I am sick of people hatred towards Chloe and Rachel. Their behavior is understable. Maxine has no reasons to play a sheriff because that's who she is. She enjoys telling people what they should or not should do. She is nice to you only when you are a nerd introvert. She is even mean to Chloe. Yes she is mean to Chloe. When Chloe is mad at her, she actually has reasons. Maxine is mean to Chloe because Chloe is not good girlie type of girl. Maxine thinks that everyone are supposed to surrender to her will, if someone is different than her, she is hatefull and mean towards this person.
@@GargoylePrincess And what I hate about is the fact that people call Maxine a good person and even some kind of role model. Maxine is not a role model and is not a good person.