It is more than a numbers game. It is about being the best with technology of the time and drivers of your own eara. IROC (International Race of Champions) is the best as you have drivers from all levels of motorsport compete in identical vesicles.
@@wingracer1614Lauda was an amazing driver, however Prost was still growing in 1984. In 1985 Prost beat Lauda convincingly, although Lauda suffered some reliability issues that year as far as I can recall.
Schumacher was way past his prime on his second stint (with that neck injury too) that hurts him in this list. Verstappen had a Renault-engine ruined season too which damages his ranking here... But very nice video-idea :D
Love this. I've always judged drivers on head to heads with their team mate over a given season and the consistency throughout their career. You always get a better picture that way
True but I think it isn’t always accurate though. The team isn’t always giving equal treatment and in the past, things like reliability and funding can hamper a head to head outside of how good the drivers really are.
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
@@alexalexan-d6j I agree that Senna was better than Prost later (certainly 1993 showed that - my favourite out of all of his seasons). And he is, still for me, the greatest of all time along with Clark. I think head to heads like any other method of measurement is not totally reliable because there are always so many variables that come into play. An example of that is the whole Hamilton/Alonso in 2007; both had equal points, Lewis lead on 2nd places, Alonso signed for the team as No.1, conflicts between Ron and Alonso, the politics of Alonso trying to blackmail Ron into giving him No.1 status.....the list goes on and on. Head to heads show Alonso beat Hamilton that season while you'd expect that from a double world champion. Not easy when Ron reportedly said "We're not racing Ferrari, we're racing Fernando!" I suppose that was more to do with the fact that the constructors didn't matter any more and Lewis was his man. Regardless, much as I rated Senna extremely high, I still rated Prost as another legend as he was incredibly measured and smooth and calculating. Then again that's why I love things like this, it's not perfect it gives you a different perspective and insight
I'm Brazilian, I love Senna, but for me it's clear that Prost is the GOAT. There's one thing that wasn't mentioned in the video, besides having 4 championships and having won several champions, he was also 2nd in the championship at least 4 times.
It's not just 'who beat who', when some drivers had #1 status in their contract and could never finish 1 place behind their team-mate'. Schumacher is the obvious example.
Schumacher ALSO is the prime example of why the "equal machinery" mentioned in this video is nonsense. In that era there was NO equal machinery for any team all first drivers had better equipment. Also Schumacher for instance had some time with software traction control that his team mates did not have. As that was illegal it was uploaded to the car from the pit wall during formation laps and deleted from the car during the race. It is the reason why communication car to pit wall currently is one directional, car to pit wall only.
This is true but let's be real, Irvine, Rubens, Massa, etc. were not on Michael's level. He had that number 1 status for a reason. If Ferrari could have found someone better, they would have kicked him to the curb in a heartbeat which is basically exactly what they did when Kimi became available.
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Nonsense... He was way better then his teammates therefore they added that clause, not the other way around! Same as giving a teammate a worse car. Why would ANY team do that!?
@@hound83 It's not about giving a driver "a worse car", it's about giving one driver a better one. Schumacher was given updates first. At some races his car would have literally been more advanced, but also he was therefore given addition time to come to grips with these things. Earlier in this current season Perez has beaten Max on track. Red Bull know he's not going to be a true rival to Max over the course of the season (much like with Ferrari and Irvine etc), but they didn't request him to move over in the way that the 2nd Ferrari drivers were requested to (and the same goes for Hakkinen/Coulthard, Hamilton/Bottas etc). Schumacher is obviously a titan in F1, but he still received special treatment that many other legendary drivers haven't been afforded.
Which is ridiculous. When the point system changes you'd have to take different decissions in equal circumstances. When you potentially gain 2 points from 8 to 10 for a P2 to P1 move at the risk of a DNF the calculation is a lot different than when it is from 18 to 25. Just plain and simple mathematical game theory. Some outcomes of finishing orders in races form the past would have been different had the point system been todays point system.
@@endthisnonsense7202 i agree with you, tactically it should have changed the championship. But I do believe also that Prost who was an extremely consistent driver would have definitely benefited a lot from the new point system. All in all I am not surprised that Prost is in the discussion for the goat.
No. Nelson Piquet is the most underrated champion. Prost often receives the credit that he is due. Piquet never receives. People have the guts to put him behind Mansell, whom he beat for the championship as teammates and who only won one title, while Piquet won three. That's actually probably the reason. The British press never forgave him for defeating Mansell in 1987. It also doesn't help that fact that he is a dick.
@@alexalexan-d6j its all based on opinion me thinkz. When you say he's a dick, its already opinion. You have to look at the stats, Nelson was better than Mansell, but not on Prost/Senna level.
@@KevinHwoarang I'm not discussing who was better. I'm discussing who is the most underrated. And it is Piquet. As I said, he never gets the credit he is due. Prost often does. And I think Piquet was more or less on Prost's level. The stats until 87 indicate that. And Prost blocked Piquet in 1988 at McLaren and lobbied for Senna because he shat his pants in fear of having to share the team with Piquet after he saw what he did to Mansell at Williams. Context: Honda wanted to appoint the other driver and wanted either Piquet, Senna or Nakajima. Ron Dennis vetoed Nakajima, so the choice was among the two Brazilians and Prost thought that it would be easier to beat thhe younger, unexperienced Senna.
As a Brazilian and Senna fan (ofcourse my Top 1), is great to see ACTUAL DATA and AGREE not with the choice of the GOAT, but, the actual GOAT A.K.A Alain Prost. I really like him and he is a great guy. You'll not hear that coming from other Brazilian, the only one who I heard talking great things about him was acutally Ayrton Senna, in the tragic Imola 1994, before the race he saluted Alain who was in the French broadcast TV as an analyst. "A special hello to our dear friend Alain, we all miss you Alain." And now I'm almost crying writing this hahaha Thank you for the great vídeo!
This was good fun 😁 Going into it, I felt like one of the biggest issues was going to be the bell curve that is an F1 driver's career. Beating 2012 Schumacher is not comparable to beating 2000 Schumacher.
This video is basically the STFU card to all the new fans who uses points stats to determine a driver’s greatness instead of using their abilities and other variables
There were some scientists that used this logic for their study to calculate who was fastest over a lap and Heiki Kovaleinen ended up being one of the fastest of all time lol
My prediction halfway through the video is Alain Prost. Because he went up against a lot of great drivers which would give him a lot of wins. The algorithm might also select someone like Rosberg who has gone up against champions.
All info considered, in my opinion that absolute greatest of all time is Niki Lauda. Won a world championship, almost died in a crash, returned in record time, won another championship the next year, retired and then came back,to beat Alain Prost for his third title. No other champion has won a championship after surviving a life threatening crash and no other driver has come out of retirement and been competitive enough to claim a championship. 🐐
I used to claim myself as a statistics maniac. I dived into MotoGP, F1, and WorldSBK in a detailed manner, to the point that I can name all WorldSBK and F1 champion from its inaugural season to now, F1 runner-ups from 1980 to now, WorldSBK runner-ups from 2000 to now, MotoGP champion from 1976 to now, MotoGP runner-ups from 1980 to now, even naming each race's winner from 2000 to now. But after watching Mr. V's video, he is indeed the undisputed King of F1 Statistics (read: statistics lunatic). 🤝🏼🗿😭
I could have given you the same results simply by having watched The Professor in action during the 1980’s. Senna was stunning, and so much fun to watch, but Prost was simply extraordinary. But imo, one of the most exciting races in F1 was (if I recall correctly) Mansell’s extraordinary drive at Mexico in 90 or 91. One of the best races ever. Had that race on VHS for years,but who has a working VCR anymore 😂?
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Race Position Vs Race Position: for each race placed better than your teammate you get a point. That would be a good starting point for a data set. You then could concider adding Qualifying, championship standings, etc. and compare those numbers as you see fit.
excellent video! I'm new to the f1 world and its videos like this that make me so interested in the history of the sport. I can see the effort you put in this video besides just the graph and research but also the energy you bring and your obvious passion for f1.
No one has had so many world champion drivers as team mates as the professor and he beat them all. Prost came sixth in his first race and out performed his team mate in qualifying. He also would have had more world championships with the modern points system.
Lauda beat Prost in 1984 and Senna beat Prost in 1988. And Senna could've beaten him in 1989 if not for a black-flagged Mansell crashing into him in Portugal and Balestre's shenanigans in Suzuka. That said, the comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Yes, thank you for the history lesson. The 1988 season I think Prost had more points but Senna had more race wins and so won the championship. Prost was very consistent in terms of bringing home points over the course of a season, Senna was the quicker driver but on a clear track without back markers Prost could hold his own. In qualifying and in the wet Senna was an undisputed king, no one could get near him. I remember those days quite clearly, I've been watching f1 since 1985.
I appreciate the work that has gone in to this pointless graph. If it were in a modern art museum, I would definitely spend a good 4.5 minutes looking over it
Funny yet serious-ish video. 👍 Looking forward to the Electric Light Orchestra-version. ;) ELO-ratings would be a fairer way of doing this. You could also measure relative finishing positions rather than points, or (which gets even messier) relative quali pace and/or race pace in %.
literally obsessed with your videos! i love the amount of effort and storytelling techniques you put into them and cant wait to see your channel continue to grow!
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
After watching this video i clearly realized that this channel is severely underrated show much effort and details my friends you earned a life time subscriber
Here's an interesting statistic about Prost. If you take the amount of fastest laps as a percentage of races entered, he was statistically faster in races than Senna. Obviously that doesn't tell the whole story but it does show one reason why Prost was good enough to be in the GOAT conversation.
Ok, this is a work of art. The best part is the fact that you can see other random users examining the chart AND YOU CAN USE YOUR CURSOR TO WAVE AT THEM!
Look at Schumacher's head-to-head battle with his teammate 1. Schumacher Vs De Cesaris (1991) - 1-0 Schumacher Vs Piquet (1991) - 3-2 2. Schumacher Vs Brundle (1992) - 10-5 3. Schumacher Vs Patrese (1993) - 13-2 4. Schumacher Vs Lehto (1994) - 4-0 Schumacher Vs J Verstappen (1994) - 9-0 5. Schumacher Vs Herbert (1994) - 1-1 6. Schumacher Vs Herbert (1995) - 15-1 7. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1996) - 13-0 8. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1997) - 15-2 9. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1998) - 15-0 10. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1999) - 6-2 11. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2000) - 14-3 12. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2001) - 14-3 13. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2002) - 9-5 14. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2003) - 9-7 15. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2004) - 14-3 16. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2005) - 12-6 17. Schumacher Vs Massa (2006) - 14-4 18. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2010) - 4-15 19. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2011) - 7-11 20. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2012) - 9-9 I watched those seasons; he had so much bad luck even though he was beaten by Rosberg at 43 years old, which is just astonishing. In 2012, somehow he finally gained the upper hand against a future World Champion and the guy who beat Hamilton. Simply the Greatest of All Time. Thanks, Michael, for so many years of pure magic on the screen
Yes, schumacher was great, but he had his opponents in different teams, such as hakkinen, alonso, raikkonen, montoya, hill, and briefly initially senna and prost. This means he never really fought top tier team mates in the same machinery, I thought he could've continued a couple of years after 2006, since he was still really fast, and he would've beaten raikkonen, who was highly rated at the time.
Maybe you do not know but that was a really nice data science project involving direct networks and degree centrality! It is also fun to see that closed loops caused problems in your original ranking which is a common issue :D Is the data available in any form? Great work btw!
I have no idea how my intrests in graphical flowcharts as an engineer and F1 as a fan would lead me to this but shoutouts to UA-cam algorithim for putting this in front of me
If I'd have to crunch the numbers on who is the GOAT of F1 UA-cam there's alot of others that beat you in views & subs. But if we add context and emotion we all know that you are the GOAT
Going into this, I knew it would either be Fangio or Prost. On pure speed, there is no doubt that Senna was superior, (AWS's qualifying speed megacomparison, compiled in a similar manner to this, puts him on top), but Prost got results. And against the best drivers of his time.
As someone who works in the construction sector with their hands i can only admire the convuluted aspect of this. Im a massive f1 fan. After studying your work i can tell you its shumacher. Yes i went on emotions. 😂😂😂😂 Brilliant video. Looking forward to the sequel. 👏👏
Now that's a video !!! Well done sir, this had everything that an F1 nerd absolutely loves. Bring on the next one......No seriously Bring it on, I feel I NEED it :)
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
You could improve the graph by adding weight to the arrows, therefore giving a score to the driver. That arrow could be a function of how many championships did the teammate win, or raced or how many race wins........ and still being objetive. That way, for example Alonso wouldnt be as handicaped as it is now
Sir I have a rabbit hole for you: Who is the best driver under adverse conditions? We can start with weather, bad tracks, etc.... add in having non-competitive cars, equipment malfunctions and bad teammates/owners as variables.
It would be interesting but as we start to look even wider it becomes more and more difficult to research and come to a conclusion. I know people who have (literally) written books about how F1 careers would have been different without DNFs, if other events were included, using different points systems.. etc.
Amazing content! I'd be very interested in the content you could create with the preparations you already made for this video. Such as "Which championship titles would have been swapped if the current points system was used?"
I could, but I believe I've seen other people making similar videos. I'd rather find a new angle on it, maybe something like what happens if World Champions aren't allowed to compete anymore
@@MrVsGarage That sounds interesting. The one I suggested was just an example. Since you have all the data now, it should be just a matter of coming up with an idea.
You're absolutely correct. You can't compare drivers of different eras. But, what fun. It, like any method, fails but there is a nobility in trying. So, props for that. The main issue: racing cars used to be way, way, waaaaaaaayyyyyyyy less reliable than the modern era. When does the 'modern era' begin? No idea. But regardless, how do you calculate that in? Create a 'curve' where points are available only to races finished? How do you tell a broken car vs. a driver error created broken car? Oh dear. In any case, Prost is the best, so well done. 😅 (Follower of the sport since 1971.)
The biggest problem with evaluating F1 is that we must assume a level playing field in some capacity. F1 is one of the few sports that's intentionally designed not to have that.
Then you didn't listen to the video carefully. He took into account the instances the drivers could not start a race due to incidents outside of their control. Leclerc did not start in 2021 in Monaco due to a driveshaft system error discovered on the morning. I guess that's why in his point system Leclerc bested Sainz twice then.
Comparing F1 drivers with their teammate is interesting. I see the usual lists in the comments, but then 'the best' may be very surprising. Is a driver who ends 10th in a championship with a teammate who ends 18th a better driver than a driver who ends 1st with a teammate on 2nd?
Without too many spoilers, lots of greats are "worse" than someone else if you use this logic. Hamilton lost to Russell and Alonso Alonso lost to Ocon Schumacher lost to Piquet and Rosberg Etc etc Obviously the video is not entirely serious (like everything on this channel)
@@MrVsGarage both hamilton and schumacher have lost to rosberg in the same machinery Rosberg has lost to Webber in 2006. Webber has lost to Vettel. Vettel has lost to Ricciardo. Ricciardo has lost to Kvyatt. Kvjatt has lost to Gasly. Gasly has never lost to a driver was has driven the same car as him over a whole season. So Gasly is the goat
@@CrashperM well obviously Hamilton beat Rosberg overall in their time together. And not a whole season but Gasly got demolished by Max in his time at RB
@@MrVsGarage You could make it less complicated. I would rate a race between teammates as a +1 for the number 1 and a -1 for the number 2. A +9 for a number one and a -9 for a number 10. And so on. Great content btw!
A chart that I've wanted to see in a head-to-head teammate out-qualifying percentage. Then also a separate graph showing an average of how many grid places a driver out-qualified their teammate by/got out-qualified. Having (weirdly) endlessly looked over F1 stats, I thought that Pierluigi Martini was going to be high on this list! What he consistently did in the Minardi year-on-year was nothing short of phenomenal. If someone was to make a qualifying graph (of either type I've suggested), I think he'd again be very high on the list!
Mate, maximum respect for this. I made a monthly chart tracking the top 100 most popular board games on board game geek since 2001, and while that was a big spreadsheet, it aint nothing compared to this. And Prost was the real deal, i kinda like the idea of him as the GOAT, even though as a senna fan i remember the 88/89 seasons pretty well
That was amazing, man. I think I learned something from this cursed chart though, that I actually already knew. In my opinion, Fangio is the GOAT, because he consistently shows up at the top, no matter what the method to classify is. Oh except on one: wins at a young age, because he was a dinosaur who whooped everybody's rear bumper in style. Just an awesome boss.
I hope for the ELO video, you can show the highest peaks, the highest average/ median (which one you think applies best) and the highest elo's when they retired. Good Luck with the video, I really liked this one!
There is no way anyone has the kind of dedication to fact check this video no one on this platform is that committed🤣🤣.. with that being said excellent video. For sure gotta sub
Ngl the fact Prost beat 10 different teammates, 5 of them world champions is actually fucking ridiculous When you take into account that Senna was the faster of the two, it really was the greatest rivalry of all time and that Senna is probably the closest to the greatest of all time
Prost is on a whole other level when you look at any kind of stats. Obviously not the top of any record tables but when you look into who he had to beat it's mind blowing
@@vincenzomartino5648 very nice! I'm sure it's going to go great. I'm not actually sure who you're talking about ngl but I'd be interested to watch once it's done
I have to point one thing. The pontuation system of 88-91 forced the drives to drive more agressively, because the worst results would be discarted. So, makes no sense to convert the points to the actual points system, because: if the actual points system was the current on that decade, the drivers would drive differently, chasing the best result in the championship
The segment of "Button beat someone who beat someone... who beat Button" made me wonder what's the longest span of years you can get with one of those cycles. Actually, is the spreadsheet available? I think I can figure that one out with some programming
Thank you for using a scientific method to prove what I have always held . Prost, the professor, is the Goat . Remember he did all that in an era where the redbull/ mercedes/ ferrari style dominance wasn't a thing.
I had some other issues with it; - Some teams develop their car more for one driver than the other. - Some drivers had more luck in some races (like Ocon over Alonso in 2021. Alonso was way, way better that season but loses so many points due to mechanical issues like you already said) - Some drivers retired simply too late and had not the best last seasons (like Schumacher in 2010-2012) - Some drivers are late bloomer - When you appliy the current points system, it has some other problems, like driver retired from P7-10 in the early years, because their can't hope for points. Or drivers don't race that hard anymore for P7 or P8, because at this time, there are no points for these places.
Yes When Ferrari had new parts Michael Shcumacher got them, Barichello had to wait a while. Teams will favor a driver and put better people in there side of the garage. People say team mates are equal but it's not true.
haha, I was doing the same, but race by race... saw the Sainz-Hulkenberg issue as well! My favourite drivers were Prost and Alonso, so I think you did some good work here! Alonso beat Ocon in the races that they both finished.
This is waaaaay too much work for a stupid graph that was never going to tell us anything. I like it.
correct - would not recommend - thank you
@@MrVsGaragelmao
But it told us that Button is the GOAT. He is litterally always ahead of himself by many steps. Infinity loops for the win ;)
It is more than a numbers game. It is about being the best with technology of the time and drivers of your own eara. IROC (International Race of Champions) is the best as you have drivers from all levels of motorsport compete in identical vesicles.
Why has this comment got 1k likes and 4 replies💀
Hamiltons the goat
Fun fact: Alain Prost would be a 7-time world champion with the modern points system.
Don't care. Lauda beat him. Therefore Lauda is the GOAT.
@@wingracer1614Jenson beat Lewis, therefore Jenson is the goat
@@wingracer1614Lauda was an amazing driver, however Prost was still growing in 1984. In 1985 Prost beat Lauda convincingly, although Lauda suffered some reliability issues that year as far as I can recall.
Schumacher was way past his prime on his second stint (with that neck injury too) that hurts him in this list. Verstappen had a Renault-engine ruined season too which damages his ranking here... But very nice video-idea :D
@@wingracer1614senna beat them both on a mercedes
Now this is the content I subscribed for, a man driving himself to the brink of insanity for a question doomed from the outset
magma
magmaaa
Ah yes, my favourite UA-cam genre! "Man loses his mind over obscure topic and we all get to watch his pain"
I salute you, sir!
The brian david gilbert special
"This isn't accurate!!"
*Says Prost is the GOAT*
Seems pretty accurate to me
Love this. I've always judged drivers on head to heads with their team mate over a given season and the consistency throughout their career. You always get a better picture that way
I've always used it too. It's ALSO fun to push it to the extreme because you get some interesting but also very silly results
True but I think it isn’t always accurate though. The team isn’t always giving equal treatment and in the past, things like reliability and funding can hamper a head to head outside of how good the drivers really are.
It isn’t really accurate tho. How about rookie drivers (i.e., max vs daniel)
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
@@alexalexan-d6j I agree that Senna was better than Prost later (certainly 1993 showed that - my favourite out of all of his seasons). And he is, still for me, the greatest of all time along with Clark.
I think head to heads like any other method of measurement is not totally reliable because there are always so many variables that come into play. An example of that is the whole Hamilton/Alonso in 2007; both had equal points, Lewis lead on 2nd places, Alonso signed for the team as No.1, conflicts between Ron and Alonso, the politics of Alonso trying to blackmail Ron into giving him No.1 status.....the list goes on and on. Head to heads show Alonso beat Hamilton that season while you'd expect that from a double world champion. Not easy when Ron reportedly said "We're not racing Ferrari, we're racing Fernando!" I suppose that was more to do with the fact that the constructors didn't matter any more and Lewis was his man.
Regardless, much as I rated Senna extremely high, I still rated Prost as another legend as he was incredibly measured and smooth and calculating. Then again that's why I love things like this, it's not perfect it gives you a different perspective and insight
I'm Brazilian, I love Senna, but for me it's clear that Prost is the GOAT.
There's one thing that wasn't mentioned in the video, besides having 4 championships and having won several champions, he was also 2nd in the championship at least 4 times.
It's not just 'who beat who', when some drivers had #1 status in their contract and could never finish 1 place behind their team-mate'. Schumacher is the obvious example.
Schumacher ALSO is the prime example of why the "equal machinery" mentioned in this video is nonsense. In that era there was NO equal machinery for any team all first drivers had better equipment. Also Schumacher for instance had some time with software traction control that his team mates did not have. As that was illegal it was uploaded to the car from the pit wall during formation laps and deleted from the car during the race. It is the reason why communication car to pit wall currently is one directional, car to pit wall only.
This is true but let's be real, Irvine, Rubens, Massa, etc. were not on Michael's level. He had that number 1 status for a reason. If Ferrari could have found someone better, they would have kicked him to the curb in a heartbeat which is basically exactly what they did when Kimi became available.
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Nonsense... He was way better then his teammates therefore they added that clause, not the other way around! Same as giving a teammate a worse car. Why would ANY team do that!?
@@hound83 It's not about giving a driver "a worse car", it's about giving one driver a better one. Schumacher was given updates first. At some races his car would have literally been more advanced, but also he was therefore given addition time to come to grips with these things. Earlier in this current season Perez has beaten Max on track. Red Bull know he's not going to be a true rival to Max over the course of the season (much like with Ferrari and Irvine etc), but they didn't request him to move over in the way that the 2nd Ferrari drivers were requested to (and the same goes for Hakkinen/Coulthard, Hamilton/Bottas etc). Schumacher is obviously a titan in F1, but he still received special treatment that many other legendary drivers haven't been afforded.
the amount of dedication you put in is absurd...ly awesome ! keep it up dude, you deserve sooo many more subs !
Thank you! Honestly when I started this I thought it would take 2 weeks. After 4 weeks had gone I realised I was in too deep to quit 😂
@@MrVsGarage sweet sunk cost fallacy thingy right ?
Watched a video on that topic from someone else, he gave modern points to every season before and Alain Prost turned out to be the GOAT
Which is ridiculous. When the point system changes you'd have to take different decissions in equal circumstances. When you potentially gain 2 points from 8 to 10 for a P2 to P1 move at the risk of a DNF the calculation is a lot different than when it is from 18 to 25. Just plain and simple mathematical game theory. Some outcomes of finishing orders in races form the past would have been different had the point system been todays point system.
@@endthisnonsense7202 i agree with you, tactically it should have changed the championship. But I do believe also that Prost who was an extremely consistent driver would have definitely benefited a lot from the new point system. All in all I am not surprised that Prost is in the discussion for the goat.
It should be considered that there were fewer races in a season back then.
@@alanpassos468 What is measured here is full season wins/draws/losses versus team mates. The number of races is irrelevant for such a comparison.
@@endthisnonsense7202 Well, it certainly influenced strategies, just like you stated it did when the scoring system changed.
As a UX designer, obsessed with this use of Figma
figma balls
Alain IS the most underrated champion. Hands down.
If the point scoring system was the same back then as it is now, Alain might've won 7 titles.
No. Nelson Piquet is the most underrated champion. Prost often receives the credit that he is due. Piquet never receives. People have the guts to put him behind Mansell, whom he beat for the championship as teammates and who only won one title, while Piquet won three. That's actually probably the reason. The British press never forgave him for defeating Mansell in 1987. It also doesn't help that fact that he is a dick.
@@alexalexan-d6j its all based on opinion me thinkz. When you say he's a dick, its already opinion. You have to look at the stats, Nelson was better than Mansell, but not on Prost/Senna level.
@@KevinHwoarang I'm not discussing who was better. I'm discussing who is the most underrated. And it is Piquet. As I said, he never gets the credit he is due. Prost often does. And I think Piquet was more or less on Prost's level. The stats until 87 indicate that. And Prost blocked Piquet in 1988 at McLaren and lobbied for Senna because he shat his pants in fear of having to share the team with Piquet after he saw what he did to Mansell at Williams. Context: Honda wanted to appoint the other driver and wanted either Piquet, Senna or Nakajima. Ron Dennis vetoed Nakajima, so the choice was among the two Brazilians and Prost thought that it would be easier to beat thhe younger, unexperienced Senna.
@@alexalexan-d6jyeah, he’s an idiot but was one hell of a driver…
@@danielsgrunge exactly
As a Brazilian and Senna fan (ofcourse my Top 1), is great to see ACTUAL DATA and AGREE not with the choice of the GOAT, but, the actual GOAT A.K.A Alain Prost. I really like him and he is a great guy. You'll not hear that coming from other Brazilian, the only one who I heard talking great things about him was acutally Ayrton Senna, in the tragic Imola 1994, before the race he saluted Alain who was in the French broadcast TV as an analyst.
"A special hello to our dear friend Alain, we all miss you Alain."
And now I'm almost crying writing this hahaha Thank you for the great vídeo!
This was good fun 😁 Going into it, I felt like one of the biggest issues was going to be the bell curve that is an F1 driver's career. Beating 2012 Schumacher is not comparable to beating 2000 Schumacher.
And for this reason, Rosberg made sure he beat Hamilton in his prime.
This video is basically the STFU card to all the new fans who uses points stats to determine a driver’s greatness instead of using their abilities and other variables
There were some scientists that used this logic for their study to calculate who was fastest over a lap and Heiki Kovaleinen ended up being one of the fastest of all time lol
🐐
Fun fact- he’s the only teammate Hamilton has never out-qualified at Silverstone
Sounds right to me. BASED KOVALEINEN MOMENT
Damn Prost was a boss.
True. That time was something magical.
The Professor!
Senna watching this video up in heaven “I know In my heart i am the fastest man to live”
Prost não podia ver chuva , Senna era lendário sobre a agua
My prediction halfway through the video is Alain Prost.
Because he went up against a lot of great drivers which would give him a lot of wins. The algorithm might also select someone like Rosberg who has gone up against champions.
Brother you r real goat in the f1 yt creators community.
Gonna make sure u get ur deserved views.
Thank you! Just making the best stuff I can, I'm glad I can be considered along with the top guys
As a software engineer, knowing you could’ve automatically generated this graph by reading the spreadsheet in a little bit of code is so painful
Yeah, but this was more entertaining 😂
All info considered, in my opinion that absolute greatest of all time is Niki Lauda. Won a world championship, almost died in a crash, returned in record time, won another championship the next year, retired and then came back,to beat Alain Prost for his third title. No other champion has won a championship after surviving a life threatening crash and no other driver has come out of retirement and been competitive enough to claim a championship. 🐐
@@innes_82You could say he wouldn't have crashed and had to deal with the near death experience if his skill level was higher
@@DeLaCroix1211 name a driver that hasn’t crashed.
Moreover, he didn't even need to plot the graph. With the proper algorithm he could get the desired conclusion from the spreadsheet
I used to claim myself as a statistics maniac. I dived into MotoGP, F1, and WorldSBK in a detailed manner, to the point that I can name all WorldSBK and F1 champion from its inaugural season to now, F1 runner-ups from 1980 to now, WorldSBK runner-ups from 2000 to now, MotoGP champion from 1976 to now, MotoGP runner-ups from 1980 to now, even naming each race's winner from 2000 to now.
But after watching Mr. V's video, he is indeed the undisputed King of F1 Statistics (read: statistics lunatic). 🤝🏼🗿😭
nah bro you're the maddest lad I've ever seen because what the fuck
As a fellow F1, MotoGP & WorldSBK enthusiast and also a stats nerd, I salute you!
I could have given you the same results simply by having watched The Professor in action during the 1980’s. Senna was stunning, and so much fun to watch, but Prost was simply extraordinary. But imo, one of the most exciting races in F1 was (if I recall correctly) Mansell’s extraordinary drive at Mexico in 90 or 91. One of the best races ever. Had that race on VHS for years,but who has a working VCR anymore 😂?
3:15 F1 History is MESSI! So, the guy is not only the GOAT in football but also in Formula 1
I can honestly get behind Prost being the GOAT. The man was insane
According to ChatGPT The goat of F1 is Michael Schumacher
According to me I’m the goat of F1
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Prost was the better driver in every year they raced together.
Prost was more consistent hauling in more points. But Senna was the quicker driver, especially in the wet and qualifying.
Imo the fact Prost topped this list, and the fact Senna clearly bested him as teammates, confirms to me that Senna is really the true GOAT
An ELO engine, Prost is gonna win so hard and I'm here for that.
No
@@joshharrison619 Yesss
Race Position Vs Race Position: for each race placed better than your teammate you get a point.
That would be a good starting point for a data set.
You then could concider adding Qualifying, championship standings, etc. and compare those numbers as you see fit.
excellent video! I'm new to the f1 world and its videos like this that make me so interested in the history of the sport. I can see the effort you put in this video besides just the graph and research but also the energy you bring and your obvious passion for f1.
No one has had so many world champion drivers as team mates as the professor and he beat them all. Prost came sixth in his first race and out performed his team mate in qualifying. He also would have had more world championships with the modern points system.
Lauda beat Prost in 1984 and Senna beat Prost in 1988. And Senna could've beaten him in 1989 if not for a black-flagged Mansell crashing into him in Portugal and Balestre's shenanigans in Suzuka. That said, the comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Yes, thank you for the history lesson. The 1988 season I think Prost had more points but Senna had more race wins and so won the championship. Prost was very consistent in terms of bringing home points over the course of a season, Senna was the quicker driver but on a clear track without back markers Prost could hold his own. In qualifying and in the wet Senna was an undisputed king, no one could get near him. I remember those days quite clearly, I've been watching f1 since 1985.
@@alexalexan-d6j couldn't have said it any better 🤝
@orvilleclisby6748 it was also drop scoring so it favored aggressive race craft
Shumi, Hamilton, Senna are my top 3. I was only 5 days old when Senna passed away. I wish I could’ve seen him with my own eyes.
The fact that prost isn't in your list 🇬🇧🤡
@@zbou23 It´s his opinion. A lot of drivers even don´t have Prost in their top5.
@@justinharper6909 A lot of people are retarded, what's youre point?
@@justinharper6909 a lot of drivers are wrong
@@realdaddydagoth69 brother thinks his opinion matters more than ACTUAL drivers who have driven ACTUAL REAL F1 Cars 💀
I appreciate the work that has gone in to this pointless graph. If it were in a modern art museum, I would definitely spend a good 4.5 minutes looking over it
Funny yet serious-ish video. 👍
Looking forward to the Electric Light Orchestra-version. ;)
ELO-ratings would be a fairer way of doing this.
You could also measure relative finishing positions rather than points, or (which gets even messier) relative quali pace and/or race pace in %.
I coooould but at that point we're in danger of going from "silly idea" to "actual work"
@@MrVsGarageI feel like you probably already crossed that threshold by most people's assessment
literally obsessed with your videos! i love the amount of effort and storytelling techniques you put into them and cant wait to see your channel continue to grow!
Absolutely loved this! I’ve actually wondered about this a lot in the past so I was super excited for someone to actually figure it out.
This channel is for taking small F1 ideas like this and spending months pushing them to the extreme!
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
I think this guy is my favourite UA-camr in history and this is the first video i’ve ever seen from him
After watching this video i clearly realized that this channel is severely underrated show much effort and details my friends you earned a life time subscriber
Damm UA-cam recommended right thing for right audience like me for the first time!
I'm happy with prost being at the top. With modern points, I believe he wins 8 championships? Legendary driver.
Here's an interesting statistic about Prost. If you take the amount of fastest laps as a percentage of races entered, he was statistically faster in races than Senna. Obviously that doesn't tell the whole story but it does show one reason why Prost was good enough to be in the GOAT conversation.
As a Prost fan, i find this bringing me a smile on my face, Alonso comes close as he also won in multiple different racing sports
Ok, this is a work of art.
The best part is the fact that you can see other random users examining the chart AND YOU CAN USE YOUR CURSOR TO WAVE AT THEM!
Look at Schumacher's head-to-head battle with his teammate
1. Schumacher Vs De Cesaris (1991) - 1-0
Schumacher Vs Piquet (1991) - 3-2
2. Schumacher Vs Brundle (1992) - 10-5
3. Schumacher Vs Patrese (1993) - 13-2
4. Schumacher Vs Lehto (1994) - 4-0
Schumacher Vs J Verstappen (1994) - 9-0
5. Schumacher Vs Herbert (1994) - 1-1
6. Schumacher Vs Herbert (1995) - 15-1
7. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1996) - 13-0
8. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1997) - 15-2
9. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1998) - 15-0
10. Schumacher Vs Irvine (1999) - 6-2
11. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2000) - 14-3
12. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2001) - 14-3
13. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2002) - 9-5
14. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2003) - 9-7
15. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2004) - 14-3
16. Schumacher Vs Barrichello (2005) - 12-6
17. Schumacher Vs Massa (2006) - 14-4
18. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2010) - 4-15
19. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2011) - 7-11
20. Schumacher Vs Rosberg (2012) - 9-9
I watched those seasons; he had so much bad luck even though he was beaten by Rosberg at 43 years old, which is just astonishing. In 2012, somehow he finally gained the upper hand against a future World Champion and the guy who beat Hamilton. Simply the Greatest of All Time. Thanks, Michael, for so many years of pure magic on the screen
Yeah, but Lewis Hamilton had better teammates ;)
@@harmkuijpers6642and they ALL beat him. So Lewis is not even on the list.
Yes, schumacher was great, but he had his opponents in different teams, such as hakkinen, alonso, raikkonen, montoya, hill, and briefly initially senna and prost. This means he never really fought top tier team mates in the same machinery, I thought he could've continued a couple of years after 2006, since he was still really fast, and he would've beaten raikkonen, who was highly rated at the time.
Maybe you do not know but that was a really nice data science project involving direct networks and degree centrality! It is also fun to see that closed loops caused problems in your original ranking which is a common issue :D Is the data available in any form? Great work btw!
This is the your first video I have ever watched. Loved it. Keep it up!
I have no idea how my intrests in graphical flowcharts as an engineer and F1 as a fan would lead me to this but shoutouts to UA-cam algorithim for putting this in front of me
Man thank you for doing this insane work, the video was amazing
I’ve been thinking about doing this for so long! I’m so glad somebody actually did it
all this madness has earned you a new subscriber , fantastic work mate
If I'd have to crunch the numbers on who is the GOAT of F1 UA-cam there's alot of others that beat you in views & subs. But if we add context and emotion we all know that you are the GOAT
Going into this, I knew it would either be Fangio or Prost.
On pure speed, there is no doubt that Senna was superior, (AWS's qualifying speed megacomparison, compiled in a similar manner to this, puts him on top), but Prost got results. And against the best drivers of his time.
As someone who works in the construction sector with their hands i can only admire the convuluted aspect of this. Im a massive f1 fan. After studying your work i can tell you its shumacher. Yes i went on emotions. 😂😂😂😂
Brilliant video. Looking forward to the sequel. 👏👏
Now that's a video !!!
Well done sir, this had everything that an F1 nerd absolutely loves.
Bring on the next one......No seriously Bring it on, I feel I NEED it :)
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
Leclerc was literally beaten by sainz in 2021 and will be in 2023 so how is he undefeated??
He had beaten him in 22 the win and loss cancels out leaving him wigh a draw and draws dont count
Amazing dedication, looking forward for the next project!
I admire the effort spent on making the graph manually instead of shelling out to an automatic graph renderer.
This is the content I'm here for. Stats, absolute lunacy and agreeing with me on the overall GOAT of F1. Very entertaining.
The comparison between Senna and Prost is very telling of the shortcomings of this method. Senna and Prost were teammates in very different phases of their development as drivers. Prost was the best version of himself, while Senna was still a long way to achieve his peak. The Senna of 1991 to 1994 was arguably the most skilled F1 driver the world has ever seen. Had they been teammates in this period, Senna would have blown Prost away. And Prost knew it. That is why he retired so gracefully when Renault (who was looking to enter the Brazilian market) forced Frank Williams to take Senna for 1994. He didn't want to have Senna as teammate again because he knew he would face a much better Senna and there would be no doubt as to who was the best.
You could improve the graph by adding weight to the arrows, therefore giving a score to the driver. That arrow could be a function of how many championships did the teammate win, or raced or how many race wins........ and still being objetive. That way, for example Alonso wouldnt be as handicaped as it is now
I fully thought you were going to imply for one of US to make the elo system, but no YOU MADMAN. Really looking forward to the next video
Sir I have a rabbit hole for you: Who is the best driver under adverse conditions? We can start with weather, bad tracks, etc.... add in having non-competitive cars, equipment malfunctions and bad teammates/owners as variables.
It would be interesting but as we start to look even wider it becomes more and more difficult to research and come to a conclusion. I know people who have (literally) written books about how F1 careers would have been different without DNFs, if other events were included, using different points systems.. etc.
Amazing content! I'd be very interested in the content you could create with the preparations you already made for this video. Such as "Which championship titles would have been swapped if the current points system was used?"
I could, but I believe I've seen other people making similar videos. I'd rather find a new angle on it, maybe something like what happens if World Champions aren't allowed to compete anymore
@@MrVsGarage That sounds interesting. The one I suggested was just an example. Since you have all the data now, it should be just a matter of coming up with an idea.
@@MrVsGarage Also, I appreciate your unique content and trying new approaches. So please keep doing what you're doing!
You're absolutely correct. You can't compare drivers of different eras.
But, what fun. It, like any method, fails but there is a nobility in trying. So, props for that.
The main issue: racing cars used to be way, way, waaaaaaaayyyyyyyy less reliable than the modern era.
When does the 'modern era' begin?
No idea.
But regardless, how do you calculate that in? Create a 'curve' where points are available only to races finished?
How do you tell a broken car vs. a driver error created broken car?
Oh dear.
In any case, Prost is the best, so well done. 😅
(Follower of the sport since 1971.)
The biggest problem with evaluating F1 is that we must assume a level playing field in some capacity. F1 is one of the few sports that's intentionally designed not to have that.
Very respectable effort for a content from a smaller F1 channel unlike many other click bait small F1 channels
and senna stuck it over a second faster than prost in monaco
Charles Leclerc was beaten by Sainz in 2021. So he is not undefeated...
Then you didn't listen to the video carefully. He took into account the instances the drivers could not start a race due to incidents outside of their control. Leclerc did not start in 2021 in Monaco due to a driveshaft system error discovered on the morning. I guess that's why in his point system Leclerc bested Sainz twice then.
And Leclerc beat Sainz in 2022 by a larger points difference, so they drawn on wins, Leclerc takes it on points I assume
@@piwo647 you mean the driveshaft error that was caused BY A DRIVER ERROR CRASH the day before? it's 100% Leclerc's fault he did not start Monaco
@@Jwm367t
He beat Sainz 14-6 in race results that season, he was clearly better in 2021
Comparing F1 drivers with their teammate is interesting. I see the usual lists in the comments, but then 'the best' may be very surprising. Is a driver who ends 10th in a championship with a teammate who ends 18th a better driver than a driver who ends 1st with a teammate on 2nd?
Without too many spoilers, lots of greats are "worse" than someone else if you use this logic.
Hamilton lost to Russell and Alonso
Alonso lost to Ocon
Schumacher lost to Piquet and Rosberg
Etc etc
Obviously the video is not entirely serious (like everything on this channel)
@@MrVsGarage both hamilton and schumacher have lost to rosberg in the same machinery
Rosberg has lost to Webber in 2006.
Webber has lost to Vettel.
Vettel has lost to Ricciardo.
Ricciardo has lost to Kvyatt.
Kvjatt has lost to Gasly.
Gasly has never lost to a driver was has driven the same car as him over a whole season. So Gasly is the goat
@@CrashperM well obviously Hamilton beat Rosberg overall in their time together. And not a whole season but Gasly got demolished by Max in his time at RB
@@MrVsGarage well as a dutch person I will gladly accept max being on top
@@MrVsGarage You could make it less complicated. I would rate a race between teammates as a +1 for the number 1 and a -1 for the number 2.
A +9 for a number one and a -9 for a number 10. And so on.
Great content btw!
Love it, great job mate!
A chart that I've wanted to see in a head-to-head teammate out-qualifying percentage. Then also a separate graph showing an average of how many grid places a driver out-qualified their teammate by/got out-qualified. Having (weirdly) endlessly looked over F1 stats, I thought that Pierluigi Martini was going to be high on this list! What he consistently did in the Minardi year-on-year was nothing short of phenomenal. If someone was to make a qualifying graph (of either type I've suggested), I think he'd again be very high on the list!
Thank you for your dedication to madness. I love it
Mate, maximum respect for this. I made a monthly chart tracking the top 100 most popular board games on board game geek since 2001, and while that was a big spreadsheet, it aint nothing compared to this.
And Prost was the real deal, i kinda like the idea of him as the GOAT, even though as a senna fan i remember the 88/89 seasons pretty well
Whoever followed F1 in 80’s knew Alain Prost was the one to be beaten in sport.
Stat crunching is an art. A stat master can create any result he needs.
That was amazing, man. I think I learned something from this cursed chart though, that I actually already knew. In my opinion, Fangio is the GOAT, because he consistently shows up at the top, no matter what the method to classify is. Oh except on one: wins at a young age, because he was a dinosaur who whooped everybody's rear bumper in style. Just an awesome boss.
I hope for the ELO video, you can show the highest peaks, the highest average/ median (which one you think applies best) and the highest elo's when they retired. Good Luck with the video, I really liked this one!
A comment with a titbit... ELO is not an acronym. It's a name and is written like Elo
This is the greatest thing I have seen in the past hour.
Ah happy Friday! Great timing Mr V
This is such a great video, I love the dedication. Keep it up!
There is no way anyone has the kind of dedication to fact check this video no one on this platform is that committed🤣🤣.. with that being said excellent video. For sure gotta sub
Ngl the fact Prost beat 10 different teammates, 5 of them world champions is actually fucking ridiculous
When you take into account that Senna was the faster of the two, it really was the greatest rivalry of all time and that Senna is probably the closest to the greatest of all time
Prost is on a whole other level when you look at any kind of stats. Obviously not the top of any record tables but when you look into who he had to beat it's mind blowing
This was amazingly, congratulations on this beast video. Entertaining and interesting
This is a great video. I admire you for pursuing a goal that is quite impossible to achieve. The story was very well told. Thanks!
I came here expecting to see it. Interesting UA-cam video. I walked away with a new piece of software to download this is a win
I don't want to sound too much like an advert but it's good yeah!
@@MrVsGarageI literally just got hired by a certain spectacled. Irish F1 UA-camr to write a crime podcast so this is going to be very useful
@@vincenzomartino5648 very nice! I'm sure it's going to go great. I'm not actually sure who you're talking about ngl but I'd be interested to watch once it's done
@@MrVsGarageyeah I had to leave it vague because I'm not allowed to say yet
This is a great video I think it will get this channel to the hundreds of thousands of subs
amazin video man , appreciate the work put into it
13:03
“HE BEAT YOUR FAVORITE DRIVER”
- Denny Hamlin
In 3 days, I have checked your channel around 20 times to see if the elo video is out. Well played.
Sadly I can't edit that fast 😅
@@MrVsGarage Damn, I feel that. But you can reply to comments fast
I dont usually comment ever but HOLY FUCK YOUR DEDICATION IS UNBELIEVABLE 😭
Great watch 11/10
I'm not sure who is crazier, you for making this or Scott Mansell for trying to drive a car upside down.
Subscribed for the sheer dedication to conclude absolutely nothing. Sounds like my daily life 🤩
I have to point one thing. The pontuation system of 88-91 forced the drives to drive more agressively, because the worst results would be discarted. So, makes no sense to convert the points to the actual points system, because: if the actual points system was the current on that decade, the drivers would drive differently, chasing the best result in the championship
The segment of "Button beat someone who beat someone... who beat Button" made me wonder what's the longest span of years you can get with one of those cycles.
Actually, is the spreadsheet available? I think I can figure that one out with some programming
Thank you for using a scientific method to prove what I have always held . Prost, the professor, is the Goat . Remember he did all that in an era where the redbull/ mercedes/ ferrari style dominance wasn't a thing.
I had some other issues with it;
- Some teams develop their car more for one driver than the other.
- Some drivers had more luck in some races (like Ocon over Alonso in 2021. Alonso was way, way better that season but loses so many points due to mechanical issues like you already said)
- Some drivers retired simply too late and had not the best last seasons (like Schumacher in 2010-2012)
- Some drivers are late bloomer
- When you appliy the current points system, it has some other problems, like driver retired from P7-10 in the early years, because their can't hope for points. Or drivers don't race that hard anymore for P7 or P8, because at this time, there are no points for these places.
Yes When Ferrari had new parts Michael Shcumacher got them, Barichello had to wait a while. Teams will favor a driver and put better people in there side of the garage. People say team mates are equal but it's not true.
This deserves much more views.
Prost was awesome. Plus he was calm, which led to fewer mistakes. Over the course of a season that adds up.
haha, I was doing the same, but race by race... saw the Sainz-Hulkenberg issue as well! My favourite drivers were Prost and Alonso, so I think you did some good work here! Alonso beat Ocon in the races that they both finished.
I'd agree with this! I'd also have Alonso up there with Prost, and just a bit behind, Schumacher, and now Verstappen.
You've got a new subscriber! love the idea and the montage 😁