This is my favourite era of GP racing. Simple technical rules that gave free reign to engineers to exert their imagination and push the limits of technology. While Honda was racing a 23,000rpm five cylinder four stroke, Yamaha fielded a 125 V4 two-stroke.
@@QuidamDePopulo Progress was stopped by green thinking. What else could you expect. I'm sad, that this technology was not allowed to goo any further than that. Very old times. It's similar with piston aircraft engines, but for different reasons. No green color there, but technology was astonishing.
I love the super high revs and just pushing the limit of power from little engines. Some of these units push over 4hp per cubic inch. For n/a thats crazy!! Thats equivalent to a 350ci engine making over 1400hp....with no power adder...
It's pretty impressive, at 34 HP with 125cc that would make my ZX-6R produce 173HP (significant improvement over it's stock California emission compliant 134HP). I'm still just amazed how close we get with fewer cylinders and mass produced CHEAP machines that reliably do 50k-100k miles while doing wheelies and very little maintenance. Could you imagine them trying to get 7,500 miles per oil change? They probably have to do a teardown by then! This is almost the exact bike engine I'm wanting to build for my other motorcycle, I was going to make an inline 4 100cc 2 stroke (slap 4x 25cc weedwhackers together), that way it sounds like I'm screaming down the road but without speeding lol!
@@shawnsatterlee6035 I'm not sure when I'll do the oil change, I've got an oil lab kit I'll have sent off at some point so I can see how much contaminants it has in it. That's really the only way to know for sure is to test it and see how many ppm of metals etc it tests at. My car I do every 2k miles, but I don't know how often you ACTUALLY need to change sportbike engine oil besides what it says in the manual. Its about $48 in oil alone (plus filter and time), then crank the oil filter to 13 ft*lb of torque (I have my own custom filter socket adaptor for my torque wrench) and its not that bad. So far with 1500 miles after first oil change the oil in the sight glass still looks pretty new (I'm using synthetic oils), but I prefer to do more maintenance than the manuals call for because I want things to last.
This is one of my favorite motorcycle engine videos because of the excellent presentation of the tiny pistons and their exact measurements. Very remarkable! Thanks for taking the time to present this fascinating content!
You know you're talking serious engineering when your valve is more than twice more light than a sparrow, and when it moves more than ten times faster than the wings of an hummingbird.
I read (somewhere) about a project to remake the Honda 5cyl 125 or 6 cyl 250, but they experienced problems with the magnesium parts. They couldn’t make as good of an engine as the original, even using today’s computer assisted engineering. Maybe just a good story, but those bikes where truly impressive..
You can, it's just probably more than they wanted to spend. Also interestingly I've seen some carbon fiber designs that look awesome, though carbon fiber sucks in compression so I don't know how they are being successful without making duel connecting rod boxer engines. Modern technology we can 3d print titanium parts hollow, once I get my metal 3d printer I can do some cool engine designs and one of my bikes will surely be a rotary just like my car.
Besides the CB350 having some terrible issues with it's oiling system (disintegrates with age, my dad's rebuild 2 of them for oil system failure), then it's not too bad for that engine I don't think. My bike runs 7k rpm just below 70 mph but it sounds happy at 14k to 15k rpm cruising around (will go up to 16k rpm at 152'ish mph, but it needs taller gearing to achieve max speed). Some engines though can't handle much, my last bike I had screaming at 10k rpm (redline is about 8,500 and I thought it had a limiter... It did not, and I found out the hard way). So depends on the engine. Most I've revved an engine to was 18-19k rpm on a 2 stroke grass trimmer engine going downhill at 42-43 mph (12k rpm roughly at 28 mph), so it was way over-sped, but I didn't see any cylinder or piston wear and everything looked fine. So keep them below redline, they may not last long at limit speeds but engines can be replaced.
Its shame people forgot all other brands that raced.. Brands from Czechoslovakia, England and many others European brand forgot in history bc Japanese bikes.. It would be nice if you made some day video about them, From what I know Jawa and CZ from Czechoslovakia raced as well and their engines were worthy of telling their story
I doubt that is easily attainable information if even possible. Besides, its not just the cam timing, but the engine inertia, flywheel and these things that make it unable to idle by itself
Honda was genius!!! Todays prototypes are more ‘spec’ than ‘tech.’ Engineers have been hamstrung by limited rules. Especially the MotoGP class. Street cars are more advanced in many ways, with forced induction allowing for tiny but powerful engines. Wish they would allow more creative interpretations of the rules. Bring back direct-injection 2 strokes, and allow turbos and superchargers. Tiny but MIGHTY motorcycle engines are the future! We have the technical skills to ‘tame’ these beasts with modern digital tech.
They still make the fireblade 1000 RRRRRRR double R (Arg! Me pirate edition!). It's still one of the fastest production bikes that's road legal. They are also known for dependability, so that's not a bad reputation. He might be more impressed with Kawasaki pushing boundaries a bit more with things like supercharged production motorcycles, but emissions kind of ruin what you can achieve, they didn't have much emission regulation back then
Sorry. Not any research before asking my dumb question...but I'm surprised Japanese motorcycle companies wouldn't want Japanese riders who could probably be smaller and lighter..??
They did use Japanese riders, but the factories usually went for established riders from Europe and other countries as well. In the 1963 250 IOM TT Fumio Ito riding a works Yamaha twin came second to Jim Redman on a works Honda 4. But for a catastrophic pit stop of over 40 seconds, Ito would have won the race and become the first Japanese rider to win a TT.
The stroke is very short, same as the super high rev F1 engines back in the day, all HP and no torque. They have no practical application as an engine produced for the masses therefore the mfrs killed them.
The 1978 Honda CBX 1000/6 was a directly derived from the GP bikes of this era and was actually designed by Shoichiro Irimajiri, the same engineer who gave us the 50/2, 125/5, and 250/6.
@@UncleKennysPlace CBX's were raced in production endurance races in New Zealand and Australia. I personally witnessed several of them exploding on the track at the Castrol 6 Hour in NZ.
This is my favourite era of GP racing. Simple technical rules that gave free reign to engineers to exert their imagination and push the limits of technology. While Honda was racing a 23,000rpm five cylinder four stroke, Yamaha fielded a 125 V4 two-stroke.
@@QuidamDePopulo Progress was stopped by green thinking. What else could you expect. I'm sad, that this technology was not allowed to goo any further than that. Very old times. It's similar with piston aircraft engines, but for different reasons. No green color there, but technology was astonishing.
And Suzuki had a 50cc triple the RP68 with 19.1 hp (382hp/litre) at 20,000rpm using 14 gears !
@@neilparnell5712 Yes, but it never raced.
I love the super high revs and just pushing the limit of power from little engines. Some of these units push over 4hp per cubic inch. For n/a thats crazy!! Thats equivalent to a 350ci engine making over 1400hp....with no power adder...
A 350cc engine only has about 21 cubic inches. If your number of 4hp per cubic inch is correct, then a 350cc engine could produce 84hp.
@@yodasbff3395 You misread my 350ci as 350cc... but your math is correct.
It's pretty impressive, at 34 HP with 125cc that would make my ZX-6R produce 173HP (significant improvement over it's stock California emission compliant 134HP). I'm still just amazed how close we get with fewer cylinders and mass produced CHEAP machines that reliably do 50k-100k miles while doing wheelies and very little maintenance. Could you imagine them trying to get 7,500 miles per oil change? They probably have to do a teardown by then!
This is almost the exact bike engine I'm wanting to build for my other motorcycle, I was going to make an inline 4 100cc 2 stroke (slap 4x 25cc weedwhackers together), that way it sounds like I'm screaming down the road but without speeding lol!
@@jakegarrett8109 could u imagine anyone actually waiting to do oil change at 7.5k miles? Oh yeah, that's u! 🤣
@@shawnsatterlee6035 I'm not sure when I'll do the oil change, I've got an oil lab kit I'll have sent off at some point so I can see how much contaminants it has in it. That's really the only way to know for sure is to test it and see how many ppm of metals etc it tests at.
My car I do every 2k miles, but I don't know how often you ACTUALLY need to change sportbike engine oil besides what it says in the manual. Its about $48 in oil alone (plus filter and time), then crank the oil filter to 13 ft*lb of torque (I have my own custom filter socket adaptor for my torque wrench) and its not that bad. So far with 1500 miles after first oil change the oil in the sight glass still looks pretty new (I'm using synthetic oils), but I prefer to do more maintenance than the manuals call for because I want things to last.
Everyone in our house loves your channel. I miss your intros, thanks for the content!
naaah i like the straight to the point video now..
"it would stall if allowed to drop below 17000 rpm"
that's the ultimate flex
Proceeds to show it at 11,000 rpm and responding to throttle input
@@francislutz8027 maybe he meant 1700 rpm ?
which is high but nothing crazy
especially for a race bike
@@madwarrior3771nope, 17,000 rpm
@@francislutz8027maybe the throttle has a lot of play despite the stable idle point being so high
I just can’t believe that metal can change direction so fast in a cylinder and stay uniform
Check the piston speed!
Very short stroke.
The wonders and beauty of mechanical engineering
We need more oldschool honda motorcycle history.
Historical info on Honda as a whole is almost always fascinating
This is one of my favorite motorcycle engine videos because of the excellent presentation of the tiny pistons and their exact measurements. Very remarkable! Thanks for taking the time to present this fascinating content!
Modern moto gp bikes are absolute beasts but the early Japanese racers are my favourite, thanx Mr Visio!
Can’t believe those RPM’s let alone the narrow power band! Stalls at 17,000? Whoa! 😂😂😂😂😂
You know you're talking serious engineering when your valve is more than twice more light than a sparrow, and when it moves more than ten times faster than the wings of an hummingbird.
We need an update on the new Mercury outboard engines. They got a new v10 400r, and a v8 500r. I'd like to see a vid from you.
Guess what? There is a new video scheduled in a two week time that is going to be about the V10 Verado
@@VisioRacer 👍
Another quality video. How about doing one on the factory MX bikes before the production rule was introduced in 86. Very interesting builds there 👍
10:22 that engine is wild!
Great detail. Thanks for the deep dive
The day’s when we had the best music in the world from motorsports, sadly missed 😢
135 on bicycle tires, these guys were fearless 🐾✌️🇺🇸
That's what freaked me out. Those guys are racing on those skinny treads? Ye gods.
man your videos are just awesome keep going
Im from slovakia too btw😄
Ďakujem a pozdravujem 🤚🏻
aye VisoRacer
your content is underrated!
Thank you!
I read (somewhere) about a project to remake the Honda 5cyl 125 or 6 cyl 250, but they experienced problems with the magnesium parts. They couldn’t make as good of an engine as the original, even using today’s computer assisted engineering.
Maybe just a good story, but those bikes where truly impressive..
the ancient technology using secret recipe of 13 herbs and spices calculated with an abacus mustve been lost..
You can, it's just probably more than they wanted to spend. Also interestingly I've seen some carbon fiber designs that look awesome, though carbon fiber sucks in compression so I don't know how they are being successful without making duel connecting rod boxer engines.
Modern technology we can 3d print titanium parts hollow, once I get my metal 3d printer I can do some cool engine designs and one of my bikes will surely be a rotary just like my car.
Another great video, thanks for sharing 👍.
An excellent documentary, as usual from you...
Thanks Visio, very interesting.
It's hard to imagine my life before Visio racer channel
That’s some crazy numbers but possible with small engines.
So sad we won't see these bikes again my favourite era 1964 till 1968.
The term MotoGP was not in use during the time covered by this excellent video. It only appeared near the end of the 20th century,
Great episode but..
What about Mike Hailwood, and the 6 cylinder Honda 250cc?
So my hotrodded 1971 CB350 twin revving to 7K at highway speeds is just fine, then?
Besides the CB350 having some terrible issues with it's oiling system (disintegrates with age, my dad's rebuild 2 of them for oil system failure), then it's not too bad for that engine I don't think. My bike runs 7k rpm just below 70 mph but it sounds happy at 14k to 15k rpm cruising around (will go up to 16k rpm at 152'ish mph, but it needs taller gearing to achieve max speed). Some engines though can't handle much, my last bike I had screaming at 10k rpm (redline is about 8,500 and I thought it had a limiter... It did not, and I found out the hard way). So depends on the engine.
Most I've revved an engine to was 18-19k rpm on a 2 stroke grass trimmer engine going downhill at 42-43 mph (12k rpm roughly at 28 mph), so it was way over-sped, but I didn't see any cylinder or piston wear and everything looked fine. So keep them below redline, they may not last long at limit speeds but engines can be replaced.
Its shame people forgot all other brands that raced.. Brands from Czechoslovakia, England and many others European brand forgot in history bc Japanese bikes.. It would be nice if you made some day video about them, From what I know Jawa and CZ from Czechoslovakia raced as well and their engines were worthy of telling their story
Thanks again
May be the basis of modern Honda Motors both in bikes and cars with extra ordinary quality
For me the best TT gp Honda is the mighty rc166 with Mike the bike hailwood
Those tires!
I'm kind of V-twin Ducati who IS the exact opposite if those engine. But the smaless of those engine fascinantes me. Like the sound too!
In the dame example, you can found the 6 cylinder in line of Guy Coulon that hé create himself!
I wonder how much timing advance was required for such high rpms.
Wonderful sound, Honda is the four stroke master! 🙂
And later became the 2 stroke master actually!
Interested to know cam timing specs on an engine that revs to 23k and stalls at under 17k
I doubt that is easily attainable information if even possible. Besides, its not just the cam timing, but the engine inertia, flywheel and these things that make it unable to idle by itself
1:47 I’ve seen bigger pistons in RC aircraft engines
Your title is INCORRECT.
This bike is NOT MotoGP era. Get your facts right.
love the 350 6 cylinder one they made
I do believe it was only 300cc's, but competed in the 350cc class.
@@fredtracy3931 You are correct!😉
@@danw1955 cool, a VW bus Mystery Machine! 👍
Yes, maby it was so 👍🏻😎🤘🏻🏁
@@mariusfridlund55 it was the Honda RC 174 riden by Mike Hailwood.
Man, the video is good, but suzuki stole so darn much from mz. Yet, not a lot of people know.
Anyone else get urked by the center cylinder not firing in the demo at 5:20 lol
yep....me
UA-cam rarely gets your subtitles correct, but they always get one thing right...[Music]
Honda was genius!!! Todays prototypes are more ‘spec’ than ‘tech.’ Engineers have been hamstrung by limited rules. Especially the MotoGP class. Street cars are more advanced in many ways, with forced induction allowing for tiny but powerful engines. Wish they would allow more creative interpretations of the rules. Bring back direct-injection 2 strokes, and allow turbos and superchargers. Tiny but MIGHTY motorcycle engines are the future! We have the technical skills to ‘tame’ these beasts with modern digital tech.
amazing era where riders wore an eggshell for a helmet when racing 🙀
I miss old-timey Honda. Soichiro Honda must be turning in his grave over how far his once great company has fallen.
They still make the fireblade 1000 RRRRRRR double R (Arg! Me pirate edition!). It's still one of the fastest production bikes that's road legal. They are also known for dependability, so that's not a bad reputation.
He might be more impressed with Kawasaki pushing boundaries a bit more with things like supercharged production motorcycles, but emissions kind of ruin what you can achieve, they didn't have much emission regulation back then
23,000 rpm😊
Gud vid 😍
did not Shaun Connery make a film called NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN
What a shame the FIM changed the rules. What might've been...
When Honda lost his mind 😅
a rc 141 tinha a mesma potencia da r15 de hoje mas bem mais leve
Sorry. Not any research before asking my dumb question...but I'm surprised Japanese motorcycle companies wouldn't want Japanese riders who could probably be smaller and lighter..??
They did use Japanese riders, but the factories usually went for established riders from Europe and other countries as well. In the 1963 250 IOM TT Fumio Ito riding a works Yamaha twin came second to Jim Redman on a works Honda 4. But for a catastrophic pit stop of over 40 seconds, Ito would have won the race and become the first Japanese rider to win a TT.
Check put what MZ did with their engines for the GP and experimentation.
Not the MZ you know
23,000 RPM
👍💪✌
Once again, stupid rules killed the fun of it.
The stroke is very short, same as the super high rev F1 engines back in the day, all HP and no torque. They have no practical application as an engine produced for the masses therefore the mfrs killed them.
I demand the next video by Visio to list all the deepest ocean going Submersibles made.. ⚓🐱👍🏿
Ho-weather?
MotoGP?
✋🏼🇦🇺👍🏼
Please use a robot voice instead!
Absolutely not
Pretty dumb request
fake accent always does tho.
there was never a commercial derative so nothing of value was lost...
The 1978 Honda CBX 1000/6 was a directly derived from the GP bikes of this era and was actually designed by Shoichiro Irimajiri, the same engineer who gave us the 50/2, 125/5, and 250/6.
@@CaptHollister I had three CBX's. They were awful as motorcycles, and nothing similar was ever raced. They had split rods and solid cranks, etc.
@@UncleKennysPlace CBX's were raced in production endurance races in New Zealand and Australia.
I personally witnessed several of them exploding on the track at the Castrol 6 Hour in NZ.
@ktkace that's not how that works.