Bad News For Harley Trans Swaps
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Harley trans swaps are popular and the biggest swap is going from the 5 speed to the 6 speed transmission. The bad news for Harley trans swaps is that the great deal on the 6 speed from the 2007 and newer bikes won't bolt up to a Twin Cam 88 originally equipped with a 5 speed transmission. Now with that out of the way you can still convert a 5 speed to a 6 speed transmission, but it's a bit more expensive than an Ebay special 6 speed transmission. There are gear sets and complete transmission available to convert the 5 speed to a 6 speed, but there are many things to consider before dropping the big bucks to do so.
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Do you prefer the 5 speed or the 6 speed transmission?
I prefer 5 speeds, you always know where you are with them. I've been on someone else's bike before and disappointed that I'm not getting all I think I can out of it until I remember there's a 6th
6 speed only used for long freeway drives on my M8
I ride nothing but 5 speeds.
I agree with Greg Kistner below. Rarely use 6th on my 114. 65 is the minimum before I consider 6th often not unless there are miles to cover.
depends on the bike and the gear set.
Bakers 7th gear is the same ratio as the 6 speeds, 6th gear. All the 7 speed does is tighten up all the ratios and make shifting a bit more dynamic. Also, who wants to "roll on to pass"? Downshifting and cracking the throttle is one of the best sounds and feels great going down the road to pass.
Back in the Shovelhead days before Baker came out, we'd change sprockets instead of swapping out Tranny gears with Andrews as it was the cheap and dirty way to go. A 23-24 on Trans depending upon clearance with the aluminum primary and 49T rear wheel sprocket. Not as quick out out the hole, but smooth as silk at 80 mph. I run a 25T on my '49 Panhead Trans as with the hand shift drum top there is clearance. Stuck with the 51T with the stock drum wheel, but she's smooth on the highway. You young guys will never know the struggle of scrounging parts and keeping dinosaurs on the road. You can buy any trick stuff nowadays over the counter. Good on ya though!
Years ago before they made all this cool stuff that was exactly what you had to do. Change the gearing and give up a little down low for more on top. I bet we see more scrounging when they start trying to force us into electric junk and quit making parts in an attempt to force us out of gasoline engines.
@@GixxerFoo I definitely agree with you brother. Enjoy your content every week glad you're doing better.
Huh.
Question for the group. With a Shovel, would it run better with a higher gear or a 5th gear? I heard they would benefit but I don't really trust the source so I'm asking the subject matter experts. I have had the opportunity to get my hands on a Shovel but I can't afford to go through it more than once so if another chance comes along, I want to do it right the first time.
Gearing swaps and "scrounging" haven't changed for any serious mechanic. I do the same with all my bikes and will the '48 Pan I'm building. Tall finals work a treat and HD engines aren't GP road race machines. (If I want a genuinely sporting motorbike I'll buy one, cruisers with big engines are for cruising and roll-ons.) BTW where trans sprocket clearance is an issue it's easy to order any size custom rear sprocket if someone with a chain conversion wants to experiment. Sprockets are cheap enough to play with.
Here in Brazil we have an idiomatic expression for when a vehicle has all its torque and power on tap, no matter what gear you're in. We say say that the motor is always "full", meaning that you just open the throttle and the thing goes.
My faithfull TC88, compared to the 96ers I've rode always felt "full" in every of is five gears, while the 96ers did not feel so ready in 6th gear, despite being bigger. In one hand that "fulness" of the TC88 is great because you know the machine is just there for you when you ask its capabilities for passing, or just gaining speed for the sake of the pleasures related to acceleration. But, in the other hand, that "fulness" comes with the price that from 90 miles per hour, to above that, the engine feels little stressed, even though it's very capable of reaching 100 miles per our. So, on the open road, I tend to ride most of the time under the "limit" of 80 miles per hour and, for me, that's pretty fine, I like to be able to contemplate the landscape. Therefore, I prefer to live under that 80mi/h "limit" but always have the motor "full", than having that annoying feeling of a slightly sluggish machine that forces me to drop one cog in some situations on which is better to have all the range that goes from torque to power right there, at hand.
Anyway, it's just my opinion based on the differences I felt beetwin the five speed 88cu and the six speed 96cu. I'm pretty sure that with more displacement (from the TC103 to the modern M8 of nowadays) the 6th gear is perfectlly adequate.
Peace from Brazil. ✌
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Good points Gixer. I put a Rivero 6 speed gearset in my hopped up 80 EVO. It did fine until I hit a long hill then I'd have to downshift. Later I swapped the 80 for a S&S 111 and the power problem was solved. For the record, most 6 speeds are 'overdrive' so the first 5 are identical to the 5 speed. If it is too tall for your speed/engine power just don't shift to 6th gear. @3000 rpm I am now doing 80mph instead of 72mph.
I'm running a 34 tooth transmission pully on my old evo. I love it.
I Have 2004 flh with an 88 (1450) stock I do lots of HYW driving. From 1 to 5th gear the ratios are the same as stock I can cruise 85 mph at 3200 rpm in 6th . I love it !! I bought the screaming eagle gear set and did the work myself its all plug N play except a little filing of the case. if your do long rides and want keep your engine purring this is a great option.60mph 2700 rpm saves lots of fuel.
I have an 03 and an 07 road king. Both have been subject to the usual mods (cams/intake/exhaust/pistons/headwork etc.) to get them both into stage 4 territory. The 03 is now a 96 and the 07 is now a 103. Candidly I prefer the 5 speed in the 03. I find myself going back and forth from 5th to 6th way too often on the 07 at normal highway speeds (65-75 mph). 6th is nice to have if you cruise at 80-85+ but I am usually not in that much of a hurry. Thanks for the great content - appreciate your work!
You are correct about 5speed to 6 speed conversion if the 6 speed is a over drive gearset or complete transmission, but if it is a 6 speed direct drive or 7 speed direct drive gearset or complete transmission it will still be 1 to 1 drive ratio. The nice thing about a 6 or 7 speed direct drive gearset or complete transmission is you are able to keep the motor in the power band so when passing or just hotrodding around you will be doing less down shifting, it's almost like having a gear between the gears
Great video as always! I ride a 2004 HD Road King classic with a TC88 with a 5-speed trans. I was thinking about doing this. but the way you explained the pros and cons of converting your 5-speed bike to a 6-speed, I think I'm going to leave well enough alone. My bike is fine as it is. Keep up with the good work and ride safe.
I hate the 6 speed cruise drive. I’ve had to replace many gears sets due to failure at low mileage. The 5 speed was bulletproof and rarely had issues and when it did it was usually rider error that caused the damage. So much about Harley has gotten worse in the quality department,while some things have improved the scales still weigh in the wrong direction. I’ve been a Harley mechanic/tech for 25 years and I still think the 90’s -2002 was your best quality even though under powered compared to todays Harley Davidson engines .
I eliminated the compensator for a 34 tooth sprocket on my stock 2007 Dyna and pretty much quit using 6th gear unless cruising at 90mph.
Have the 2005 95ci fatboy with a 5 speed now, it's always out of gear lol
Sounds like what I hated about Ford and Mopar but loved about Chevy as a kid. Ford and Mopar changed bell housing bolt patterns with each engine family where Chevy kept the same bolt pattern from four cylinder to six cylinder to the 348/409 to the small block to the big block. It made engine swaps and trips to the salvage yard for parts far less frustrating. While Harley seems to have made some improvements I’m not sure making it so you couldn’t do the six speed swap was entirely necessary and may have been for ulterior motives! My only beef with my six speed in my ‘06 FXDWGI is that I sometimes don’t realize that I’m in sixth and try to shift into another gear or end up tooling along in fifth. I wish Harley had put a top gear indicator on the dash display next to the neutral light since they chose not to include a tach.
Ill admit even with the 6th gear indicator i still bump the shifter at times tryin to find the next gear. I do the same thing with cruisin in 5th too.
I dont even own a 5spd anymore. My shovel will get a 6spd before its done, my evo has the stage 4 from the 90s and my 08s too new.
@@Ulfstigandr, this ‘06 Dyna Wide Glide is my first Harley. I rode dirt bikes as teenager and Nortons and some Jap bikes in my 20’s but I never bothered with getting my motorcycle license until ‘91. I just kept renewing my permit in Wisconsin and finally in ‘91 I borrowed a friend’s Softtail Custom and went and took my test and got my license. When I got the Wide Glide this Spring I realized that I hadn’t been on a bike since I got my license over 30 years before and it showed. All those reflexes and instincts that I had from dirt riding were very rusty. Since I got it I’ve been riding it as I always thought a Harley should be at low rpm and let the torque move the bike but I’m finding out that when you give this Twin Cam some rpm it comes alive. So there I am sometimes at 60 or 65 mph and in third gear when accelerating from a stop and I have to go through the other 3 to cruise. I was going to put in cams and maybe a big bore kit until I started giving this 88 some r’s and now I no longer see the need for it. It does well at low rpms when I’m not on it but comes alive when I want to drop a couple of gears and turn it loose. It surely would hand those old 850 Nortons their ass. But that top gear indicator is something that I surely would find helpful though.
I'm with you on the Chevy stuff. IMHO, the interchangeability is why Chevy swaps are STILL so popular. Hell, you can stick a power glide behind an LS.
Pop's '99 Heritage could use a 6th gear but that thing's a flat out BEAST! But he doesn't use it for really long trips down the HWY. For those few and far between trips, he has his '05 Nomad, which is only a 5spd too but, it's happy to run @80-90 mph, which is way over the limit where he lives. My 900 sounds like it's ready to grenade at that speed. But it really isn't. It likes to rev. I just have really loud Pipes on it. If I knew when I got my pipes what I know now, I would have gone 2-1 but where I lived then, I needed the loudest I could get.
Recently I was watching a UA-cam video of someone test riding an ‘06 FXDWGI that had an optional HD tach/speedo. It didn’t take long for me to order one to replace my stock speedometer and when I got it and I was reading the instruction manual and it said that it had a gear position indicator for transmissions equipped with the required transmission sensor. The 6 speed in my ‘06 Dyna Wide Glide doesn’t have the sensor, but once I learn what RPM it’s turning at a given speed in 6th gear it really won’t be that necessary anymore as then the tach RPM will tell me what gear I’m in. All these guys talking about there TC’s and Evo’s not pulling well in their top gear doesn’t sound like my Dyna. Much of my riding is country roads that are at best secondary roads and I’ll often be tooling around at 50 mph and come to a hill and just let the bottom end torque of my 88 TC pull me up over it. For passing from 50-60 mph it responses much better with 1, 2, or 3 gear drop before twisting the wick, but it does alright with the gear drop(s). It’s really nice to have the versatility when deciding which gear to ride in. When I swap out my HD compensator for a DarkHorse Man-O-War maybe I’ll drop the tooth count to give me a touch lower overall drive ratio and reduce the need to downshift as often. I’ve got a 6 speed manual in my ‘13 VW Jetta TDI SportWagen and I sure glad that it’s behind that torquey turbo diesel as it’s only turning 2k RPM at 75 mph. Since I’ve put a tune kit in it it’s getting up to 51.5 mpg and my Harley’s doing about the same which makes traveling much more pleasant when you’ve got 2 means of transport that get better than 50 mpg.
Harley had a service bulletin quite awhile ago about changing sprockets on baggers for highway touring. I did it on my '98 FLHT and I consider it my poor mans 6 speed. Basically it was just changing the rear sprocket from a stock 70 tooth to a 65 tooth from a Softail and a different belt. Taking off in first gear is a little sluggish but it really gives it longer legs in each following gear. It dropped my RPM by approximately 600 @ 70 mph. Having a mild cam and some head work, I like to keep it around 2600 most of the time and I have good response, even at highway speeds.
Never had a 6 speed.. Got my 07 Dyna this year and fell in love. Half the time I’m on the highway, I don’t even touch 6th gear. 6th gear doesn’t make sense until like 75 mph on this bike. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve looked down and been at 2900 rpm at 65-70 and thought, holy shit I’m not even in 6th gear lol if you’ve never had one.. get one. Best thing to have on the highway, nothing like low vibration at 2800 rpm cruising at 80mph.
Just finished a nine state, 2481 mile trip on my 2005 Electra Glide. I did a Stage II when the cam tensioners went bad with a S&S 509c cam. I was very happy with the five speed. Ran 60 - 70 mph at 2400 - 2800 rpm all day. Was always in the power curve and rarely needed to downshift….!
A lot of money for an ‘upgrade’ (?) not really needed…..!
I actually liked the cruise drive 6spd. It is an excellent use of the engine torque thru out the gear set. I currently have a custom I built. I scored a used baker od6 and went thru it making it trustworthy for me before install. What and amazing set if gears. They are finely crafted, smooth and tough. Shift oh so sweetly.
My current ride has a Baker OD6. It's the first non-Harley tranny I've had. JJeeeezzus that thing shifts smooth. I'll be a Baker boy for life now. Completely love the feel.
Just a heads up. The Baker 7 speed and HD’s 6 speed share the same final drive ratio. The 7 speed offers lower gear ratios from 1-6 than HDs 1-5.
2008 dyna 96ci tc. It is underpowered at 70mph in 6th. But here in Florida, 70 on the highway will get you run over. Runs good at 80.
Run the unofficial 100mph speed limit down there is hwat I've heard!
My wife has a '14 Heritage with a six speed, so I've ridden it a bit. I ride an '04 Road King Classic with the stock five speed. I live in Western Colorado, so I'm riding at elevation and less power. The RK has a 95" big bore, SE 203 cams, SE hybrid cam plate and high volume oil pump, SE air cleaner with no backing plate and external breather, exhaust is stock headers (no cat) with Kerker slip ons. At 75 MPH, she's turning 3000 rpm. In the mountains, the broad torque of this motor means I'm not shifting much, usually I'm in fourth gear, dropping to third in some of the tighter turns. The bike seems to maintain 48 MPG no matter what (at elevation, less air=less fuel). For my day trips and the occasional overnighter, this setup works well. Now, if I was crossing the Great Plains with any regularity, I'd probably be looking at buying a bike with a six speed and maybe a front sprocket gearing change. And this is what I love about H-Ds, if you've got the skills or the wallet, you can make your bike whatever you like best. Shiny side up, friends!
You said it right there! That's the best example anyone could give is at elevation. The extra gears are awesome on flat desert highway, but anymore than that you are up and down.
When the 6 speed first came out, HD offered a Screaming eagle version that was a direct swap. I sold my house (Ha!), and bought one for my 02 wide glide. I took the opportunity to replace all my engine mounts, and other do it while its all apart bits. I forget what the price was, but I want to say 2k. Not sure if they offer that anymore, but it was worth it. Gear sets always looked like more work than it was worth, so that's why I went with a complete version. The best part with the chicken box was no need to re-calibrate the speed'o. I think I run right at 2100 at 70 mph.
That's not bad at all, the new ones require some case modification. It's not too bad but a direct swap would be great!
Great video. I have an 03 Fatboy 88 and later got an 07 StreetBob 96. I was thinking about a 6 speed when I first had the Fatboy, but after riding the StreetBob I would never put a 6 speed on the Fatboy. As you said in your video you really need to be going 65-70 or above and on flat ground to use 6th gear.
I have a 2005 softtail and I turned it into a106c.I. S&S high performance engine with a Baker 6speed transmission gear set with a Barnett racing lock up clutch assembly. The only original pieces of the 88 c.I. engine is the lower case halves. I also installed a new S&S crankshaft , Conn rods bigger pistons bee hive valve springs ,ported the heads, installed a tune on the ECM.it runs like a scalded dog.
I have a 6spd on my hot evo heritage and I wish I had the 5spd back. it doesn't have that harley ka-thud the oe trans has. I know a lot of people hate that but to me it just sounds solid
Yeah, I have a 2010 96” cross bones with a 6 speed and had to drop a gear if I go up an incline or want to pass somebody. A couple of years ago I put a set of the SE255 in it and it pulls pretty strong now. Vance and Hines fuel pak Vance and Hines 3” slip ons. While doing the cams put an S&S cam plate and high flow oil pump with new lifters and push rods so we get around alright now. It’s amazing how much valve train noise went away. I had it run on the dyno a little after I bought it used… ran 78hp and 84tq with a stage one on it…figured that was pretty much stock. I have not had a chance to dyno it since the cam swap. Found the cams 1/2 price 150$ at a dealership in Houston and couldn’t pass it up. I wasn’t looking to go all out on the cams just a little more than what it had in it at stage one.
I ride my 95 ultra at 70-80 all the time and have never thought about wanting a 6th gear.
My M8 however i couldnt imagine riding on the freeway without a 6 speed.
With a Evo you can put a 6 speed gear case or transmission on one, but to me the Evo needs it's RPM when you're up at 70 to 80.
@@GixxerFoo so true. When I rebuilt Angel's 5 spd I thought about doing a 6innna5 conversion. I just went ahead and rebuilt using Andrews gears and Baker shift forks, etc. The motor is basically a "stage 3" and needs a few revs to make its power. I also dropped from a 24 tooth to 23 tooth comp sprocket. I had already converted from belt final to chain final. With all that done, she rips through the gears and runs right around 3200 rpm at 80 mph. I don't cruise any faster than that, and if I need to pull at that speed it's a piece of cake. Do I SOMETIMES wish I'd done the 6inna5? Sure. But it meets my needs.
Running 32/65 on '97 Bad Boy,runs smooth at 70 on straight highway,, find myself down shifting going thru the mountains
Or..... you could find a 2006 35th anniversary Superglide. They made 3500 of them. Twin cam 88 with a 6 speed and better oil pump and tensiners and an automatic primary tensioner. It's the orphan child of the 88's. I use 6th over 70 mph.
The 6 speed in my 96 works great here in So. Cal. Everybody here ads a minimum of 10 mph to the posted Hwy speed.
Lol yeah the speed limit out there is just a suggestion!
I’ve got a good friend that drives truck and who usually finds himself in California three to four times a month. He would disagree with your “everyone adds a minimum of 10 mph to the posted speed” as he says the California Highway Patrol is just looking for truckers who think that the speed limit for trucks is just a suggestion.
I have an 85 Wide Glide with stock displacement and properly done Andrew's 4 speed, makes 92 hp with a very stout power curve.. It just loves to eat big inch bikes that shift a lot. Goes 50 mph in low gear. You see, we learned at the motocross gate in the 70s that time spent shifting is time spent going backwards. My friend, Bob " Opie" Malloy, a longtime Puma/KZ Top Fuel pilot built a High gear ( no Trans at all) Top Fuel Harley. As far as I know, it's the second quickest Harley on the planet and since Nitro Santa died, there ain't no one to tune the quickest one for Takeshi Shigamatsu.
I have tried to convince so many guys over the years that wanted a 6spd that they really didn’t. Some listened, some spent the coin and were disappointed. A few really could utilize it, those with the power that ran super slabs a lot. But most had to run way faster than normal to keep from lugging. The question is the same as a cam change, “ where do I actually ride most of the time”. Once that question is answered, honestly, the choices are much more clear.
Many times just a re-gear of the final drive ratio is enough to get that little lower cruising rpm, though, again, you’ll want enough power to pull it, because you will give up some bottom grunt going that way. Sometimes a higher ratio final and a lower ration 1st is the answer, but it’s never cheap or easy. So the question is always “ where do I ride MOST of the time.
An occasional high speed run with buddies just isn’t worth the trouble, let them run and when hey slow back down to normal, you’re good to go and saved a ton of $$$.
You for got the other options, you can also change your pully 2 teeth bigger on the drive from the transmission.
Don't forget to recalibrate the speedo after.
wow perfect timing brother I've got an 88 I'm running around 95 horsepower give or take started riding with the club and they run right at 85 mph on the highway and my motor is singing the blues got plenty of motor was getting ready to check into converting to a 6-speed but that's getting all four expensive I could just burn the top end up by new cylinders and pistons when I needed it so I don't know but thank you great info great timing ✌️
Right on! That was pretty good timing! Getting a gear set is pretty expensive, there's some other aftermarket sets out there like Ultima which are bit cheaper.
Change your trans sprocket!!
I’m a bit late commenting, but I have an 06 XL1200, and it most definitely needs an OD6 transmission option. At 80mph with an overdrive I’d still be near peak torque. It’ll still pull with that gear no problem.
BAKER DRIVETRAIN, please be listening!
Hello I have a 1995 Electra glide classic I put a different transmission drive pulley I had a 32 tooth and changed to a 34 tooth replacement pulley worked out very well for me .
Thank you for your great information
Did you have to swap out the belt?
@@mikaldene7146 no I did not I kept the same belt
I put a 6spd into my 5spd and it worked perfect.
If you want details on the build ill get it to you guys next time i have that same dream again😴😖
Great video! This is all the info ive been looking for to upgrade my 2000 Electraglide Twin Cam 5 Spd. You just confirmed everything ive been told up until now. Cheers
Glad I could help! That's awesome to hear! There are some gear sets out there that will fit that 5 speed case but they are pretty expensive since they are from Baker.
Screaming eagle no longer makes the 6 speed overdrive anymore. Another option is overdrive your trans pulley or engine sprocket to lower your final drive ratio. Jims also makes a 6 speed overdrive at .86:1 ratio.
Happy with the 5 speed in my Evo Lowrider. It'll easy do 100mph which is plenty fast enough and gets along at highway speed nicely. Just not going to mess with that side of it.
Agreed...same here.....the only thing I have thought about is converting to a chain...so I can take advantage of sprocket sizes that would possibly run at the same speed but with slightly lower rpm...I live on the Prairie so long fast straight rides are the norm...I have to ride six or more hours to get to serious twistiness...sigh
I just installed an Ultima 6 (yes, it's Chineseium) in my '92 FXLR. I had all the internals treated with WPC Treatment in Torrance, CA. So far, I've only test rode it 30 minutes down the freeway. The 6th gear is a nice overdrive gear at 70-75 mph. Cost, with me doing all the work, was about $1600.
If you own a ‘91-‘99 Softail, don’t count out the Ultima LSD6. I got one for my ‘96 Fat Boy 2 1/2 years back for under $700 and it’s awesome. That 6th gear is nice when I’ve got lots of empty highway in front of me and just wanna cruise while saving some gas.
Thanks you set my mind at ease. 5 is where I'll stay with my mildly upgraded Twin Cam 88.
The six speed isn't bad, but there's nothing wrong with a 5 speed. If you got a 4 speed that's worth every penny to upgrade but spending the money from a 5 to 6, my opinion is take that money and spend it on a hell of a suspension upgrade and you'll never look back.
My '05 88 is now a 103 with 100hp and 106Torque at the rear wheel. I'd love to lose a few of those to a sixth gear. I get about 46 mpg at 65, but it drops rapidly after that. I've got lots of grunt from the 570 S&S cams. I just looked at the Baker 6 speed OD........now to save my pennies.
The DD6 might be a better choice.
@Peter Angles I did. It was an Indian Challrnger. It was a turd and is gone. I like my tractor. Scroll on
One hidden secret you never mentioned; people scrap"big dog"motorcycles and other 2000s choppers on ebay. If you do your research on sites like v-twinforum you can pick up a whole transmission built by baker and install in your hog. I swapped the tranny cassette into my fxr with some grinding for about 1200$.. maybe I missed it but there's also the ultima 6 speed. Pretty much all 5 speeds are interchangeable on the trap door side. They're incredibly versatile, the info is out there. You just need to read.
Also all hd 6 speeds are 1:1 ratio anyway. That's the same as a 4 or 5 speed.... so you wouldn't lose rpms with a six speed unless you changed sprockets. Baker builds a true over driven 6 speed and a direct 6 speed.
My 2005 softail has a 5 speed. My 2018 Ultra Ltd. has a six speed. I like them both.
It was stolen, but I had a 99 with the TC88 that was well into stage 4. Made a ton of power and got like 23 mpg on the highway. It was originally a magnetti marelli fuel injected and for whatever reason they had a different compensator to clutch ratio and at 75 I think i was turning like 36-700 rpm. I always wanted a OD sixth for it and was about to pull the trigger when it got stolen. I got a 13 with the 103 and a six speed and that thing is a dog compared to my old road king, but handles the 6th gear just fine. There was the difference between the OD6 and the DD6. I think for most mildy done bikes, the DD6 would be nice. I think if I could've had either version on my road king it would've been exactly what I wanted. When I do highway riding it winds up being long distance and fairly high speed. I didn't get to pass a gas station very often.
Very informative. I had a Heritage Softail with a TC88 and a 5 speed transmission and a Dyna Switchback with a 6 speed transmission. The best part about the 6 speed was that it was great for downhills to avoid using the brakes quite so much. That 2001 Heritage was very smooth and pulled very strong at low RPMs. My son has the Heritage now. I downsized to a 2008 Sportster and I sold the Dyna to a guy that downsized from an Electra Glide. Age has it's limitations.
I have 88-95ci 03 fatboy. My gearbox shtout and needed new internals. So I put the screamin eagle 6. Needed the grind out mod etc. I like it. No complaints.
My 2007 FXST with a 6 speed at factory specifications, I had to down shift one and sometimes two gears to pass someone. I had to fully port and polish my heads to the maximum allowable limit. Lightly port and polish the intake. Largest cam possible. Stage 1, 2. Vance’s Hines street sweepers. Harley programer and Dinoed. Now I am able to roll the throttle and pass with out having to down shift. I’m am pushing 96 HP and 109 Ft Lbs of torque at the rear wheel.
My 05 sportster 1200 XL came with a 5 speed that works just fine. My 08 Electra glide 96 has the six speed. they will both go faster than I need to go. You are right. they both cruise just fine. I do not like to lug the engines for not jerking the belt and to keep the oiling where it should be. Speeding tickets and the nice driver that floats in front of you just is not worth it.
Love your videos! I just need to inform you that ALL HD transmissions have a 1:1 high gear ratio regardless of the number of gears 4,5 or 6. They raise the final drive ratio and make the 1st gear lower to give the same launch from stopped ratio and lower highway rpm. Some manufacturers make overdrive gear sets or different ratio primary drives to lower highway rpm. Or you need to change the pulleys and belt or that 6 speed is going to have the same highway rpm as the 5. Hope this helps.
Panhead Andy
Prestige Custom Cycles in Elmsford NY
Pin his comment. All these guys thinking they get an extra gear "on top" just by changing to a HD six speed, and they're wrong.
$4000 for another gear would be good down payment on a newer bike that was built for 6speed,just my opinion
Your channel has become the best HD channel on UA-cam. Keep up the good work!
I think people actually looking for over drive , 6th gear and 5th gear are all 1 to 1 Ratio Where real overdrive the rear wheel is actually spinning faster than the engine.
The problem as you stated ,engine is off the power do to low rpm and will be sluggish.
might even lower mpg do to slugging And won't defeat the purpose.
This is very informative definitely some things to think about before I drop the bank off at the HD dealer .
I have a 07 Softail std 6 speed just came back from newyork 6095 miles best ride of my life my bike has 91000 miles on it no problems with it haven’t had to do nothing to motor
The ONLY thing I would do to the original gearbox on my bike is a reverse gear set, because that E-glide is getting heavy pushing it backwards. 🤣😅😆
good info. i have an 883 and 1200 and what a difference in transmissions. i did the screaming eagle upgrade on the 883 to 1200 and wow it will slide you off the back seat. i decided to stay with my 5 speed on all. it is like you said it keeps you in the curve. that 883 is definitely now much quicker off the line now though.
I'd love to also see a video on the difference between EFI and carburation. And what it takes to swap out an EFI for a carb.. 👍🏼
ua-cam.com/video/V2WRmZuW1lw/v-deo.html
@Peter Angles maybe ur but isn't a good place for ur head. Think before u talk. Efi. Stands for electronic fuel injection... that's nor a carb.
I just did this on a 1999 FLFRCI. I haven't edited the video footage yet. Not hard to do but there are some tips depending on your parts choices.
@@1AXMRDR thanks
@@dynaordie8083 what year is your bike?
You can do a six speed in a 5. In my 03’ Electra Glide I had a six speed put in. They had to grind out some of the housing to make it fit but I can personally attest that it’s doable.
You can get a gear set to fit in the case, it take some work but it can be done. It's not direct bolt in, but you can do it.
I think Electra Glides have a 37 tooth clutch basket? You can put a 23 front compensator on it for a torque boost.
@@GixxerFoo even after grinding it out after a 2,000 miles it still had a bunch of metal shavings in it. It’s doable but it’s risky too.
@@SparyZWanTuhNayHo I couldn’t tell you sir honestly. Been a couple of years since the project.
@@soldierofmygod he is talking about using the 07 and up trans gears. They have plenty of 6 speed that will fit into a 5 speed case but they are different from the 07 and up design.
If I remember correctly you are mistaken on the Baker 7-speed. I think the top gears don't change. If I remember correctly they basically added another gear in the stock 1st-4th range reducing lugging and giving the rider a more constant pull when accelerating.
I often wished I had a 6 speed in my 1986 FXR! I was going to look into replacing the complete drivetrain with a 103 motor and a 6 speed but Im not sure it would fit in the frame. Then there's reconfiguring the oil lines and all the other modifications. I'm sure that if you throw enough money at it anything is possible. That being said, great video! I can always count on you for top notch information.
A friend of mine had a shovel head he was really wanting to have another gear in his ride. I said that he may not have enough power to justify the cost of another transmission. He would probably be better off to do a cam change upgrade for more power. Much less expensive. Then ride check into other options like sprocket change on his bike. He probably be surprised and saved himself some money also.
I have a friend with a 2003 looking to keep up with the M8's. I told to just sell it and get something newer than 2007. My M8 117 doesn't want to go into 6th until I hit 80 mph. I runs all day at 85 and 90.
Great video.... I have a 06 road glide and i love my 5 speed.. if i needed a trans tho i would put a baker 6 in the bike only because 1-5 r basically the same gearing and 6th gear is a TRUE over drive gear. Right on the money with this video 🤙
The Baker 7 speed does not have an overdrive. It's basically just closer gear ratios and the 7th gear is the same as a regular 6th. I suppose this would be a good idea if you changed your sprocket ratio for a higher top end but didn't want to lose low end torque at city speeds. The Baker Grudge Box 6 speed is a 5 speed trans plus an overdrive but it's a mild overdrive. You drop 250 RPM at 80 MPH, so about $3500 if you do your own work and only get about a 10 MPH higher top speed. Both of these only make sense if you're about 130+ on the horsepower and torque.
I love my evo the way it is, I don’t get it a hurry and avoid the freeways anyway… reverse would be nice tho since I’ve got a vetter sidecar on the bike (Electra glide).
There are reverse gears available and they are a life saver, even on the big touring bikes too!
The Baker DD6 will give you difference gear ratios in lower gears and you get a 27 tooth engine sprocket to give you the 6th gear ratios. If you got the torque just keep your 5 speed and charge sprockets.
you need to check your info you can in fact swap the the gear set from 5 to 6 without issue.
ive got the screeming eagle 6 speed trans. cams and tensioners..on my 03 roadking..bike goes anywhere I point it.very dependable and have enjoyed the bike.i think I just need it remapped.your correct as usall..
My o13 96ci can sit on 70 in 6th & pulls like a train . The idea of 6 th is like an overdrive for touring & if you ride like a 5 speed till you get on the highway there great ive swapped gear boxes for people when rebuilding & you can get an adaptor plate to swap 5 to 6 speed & the harley box is best .all these after market parts do is turn your bike into a frankenstine & try getting intenial parts for aftermarket boxes ,they never mention that ask your self Why? I'm 66been riding since I was 16 worked in shops & had my own rebuild business in my garage .trust me I've had to work on Frankenstein bikes because shops won't touch them .remember there s no manual for a Frankenstein bike .
You get into a lot of custom and aftermarket parts especially if you buy one like that getting everything sorted out can be a nightmare.
When I'm in Idaho and Wyoming I love my 6 speed transmission because of the 80 MPH speed limit.
Seems like too much personal preference here, I have a 6 speed and an old evo flt, it loves it especially when you hit the interstate and like cruising 90 allot
I have a 2003 heritage softail. Always looking for 6th gear. I just built the motor to a 98" high torque cams. Ported heads. Tune. Ect. 90hp. 104 to. I put the ultima 6 speed overdrive builders gear set in it. I love the 6th gear. I even use it on back roads and I have enough torque to pull 6th no problem. Only thing I dont like is 4th gear is noisy under load on back roads. 6th is noisy as well but not as bad on highways.
Debating on putting 5 speed gears back in and going with a 34 tooth front belt pully only because of the noisy 4th gear. I put redline 75/250 synthetic shock proof oil in trans after 500 miles and it seemed to quiet it up a bit. Neutral is hard to find and I have to double tap the shifter to go from 6th to 5th gear. That I believe is just shifter paw needing adjusted. Not sure what I am going to do. Will finish out this season with 6 speed.
Just curious if you ended up going back to a 5 speed with the 34 tooth pulley? I was thinking of upping my TC88 to a 98 and doing the 34 tooth since the hotter motor should make up for the torque loss.
Don't sweat it Gixx, we still like you, good information isn't always what you wanted to hear
I appreciate the support! Thank you for sticking with the channel!
Well got a 06 dyna with 6 speed, motor big bore kit but came with 6 speed, it was a 88 ci to 95
Yes when I run cross country I do 90 average speed on my 03 springer I 80 is really lonely and flying through Arizona and new Mexico as well...
I have been thinking about the Baker 6 speed.
I have a TC-88 with cams & a 30 tooth trans pulley. The RPM’s are up there on the freeway.
I needed to do some tyranny work on my 13 Road Glide with a 110 SE stage 4 and low/mod rpm Andrews torque cam and briefly considered replacing the stock with the Baker 7 speed. But your are correct that unless you are riding on a table top flat road(which we have in abundance here in west TX) you are doing a lot of downshifting at the first sight of an incline to climb or pass vehicles.
I also entertained thoughts of putting a six speed on my 97 Evo but the goof advice in your video squelched that thought entirely. My check book thanks you!
Thank you, I appreciate the support! If you've got a hot rod motor they will pull those taller gears but if you've just got pipes and air cleaner you'll shifting quite a bit.
Whatever model your EVO is just change the sprockets
Thanks for a great video. My favorite RPM on the freeway is 3500 to 4000. The motor seams pretty happy to me at that range. And I love my 5 speed.
Would love a 7 speed trans for highway at 100 mph plus!
The problem is no one is riding 70mph on the highway, everyone is doing 80mph at 4000rpm. That just beats the hell out of a V twin. I installed a Revtech 6 speed overdrive in a 2002 Dyna. I dropped the final drive ratio slightly for a lower 1st gear with a chain drive conversion . I could idle at 6mph (compared to 8mph with the OE set up) and dropped about 300 rpm at 75mph in 6th gear OD
I'm satisfied with my 5 speed. I was never into flying down the road. As long as it got me from point A to B im content. If my friends want to haul ass they know I'll eventually catch up.
What a lot of people don't understand is the four-speed 5-speed and twin cam 6 speeds are all direct drive in Top Gear. Harley didn't have a factory Overdrive until the Milwaukee 8. But they did change the pulley sizes and final gear ratios depending on the year and model. So when the 5-speed guys are asking oh can I put a twin cam 6-speed in it really wouldn't solve anything other than adding an extra gear in the middle.
Unless you go after market like baker od6 which is .86:1 final and thr jims od6 which is the same. If you can find the screaming eagle gear set 6th it's overdrive is .89:1 final.
@@ihatesjws1188 exactly. They just added gears in the middle to the factory trans. My 5 speed evo is fine. Could use a bit lower rpms on the highway. But i can get a 65t pulley for that, or swap to a chain drive and have a ton more options.
Great show you always give great info weather we like it or not still good info stay safe
Riding my 88 in Cali I feel like I'm holding up traffic going 70-75 mph when people are going 80-90 mph on average on the freeway. Guess I'll just continue to cruise in the slow lane.
It don't seem to matter how fast you go these days people are still going to try and go faster.
Fuck em
My stage 4 evo has the SE 6spd. I had to swap carbs (S&S to HSR42) in order to minimize the flat spot in my power curve with the cam i got. Runs great in the hills at 60 in 6th with just me. But when i toss my ruck on the sissy bar and roll out it struggles at 75+ in 6th
Only ever had 4 gears, good informative video. Well done.
Ain't nothing wrong with the good old 4 speed, they are solid!
The 06 88 was apparently geared well and made good use of the 6 speed.
I heard some swapped out the 07 up 96 primary internals for the 06 units just for the lower gear ratio
Sounds like a Dyna.
Baker is worth every penny! Direct Drive 6 is highway magic!
That's the key! DD6 is great on a 95ci twin cam. It's the OD6 that just doesn't work. Important distinction.
My 2000 road king does just fine at 65 to 75 , 70 being the sweet spot.
2005 HD offered a 6 speed option for $2000.00 almost bought a Electra Glide Standard with one that year .
My tc88 is great riding 75ish all day long decent economy if anyone really cares about that on it's stock 5 speed!
I ride my RG 103 twin cam in 5th gear on the back Rd high way most of the time to have better response if something runs out in front of me. I go to 6th to let bike cool down sometimes.
I agree I put a 6 speed gear kit in my 80' Evo it is useless sometimes but I was thinking on lower the final drive sprockets or go with a 120 ic crate motor
I do have a question why does stroking a 80' Evo hurt it?
@@jamesmillikan2485 i wouldn't say stroking an Evo "hurts" it, but it does increase piston speed. This causes more wear rpm for rpm.
@@wendyvic4046 thank you for the information
FYI..If you live around Eastern Iowa. I got a brand new 120" EVO listed on FB for sale..
@@KarwathKustoms I live in Tennessee i got to see about the witch clutch basket I need to run with as much power I'm going throw it my bike
In the real world given appropriate final drive gearing an extra gear doesn't matter much. I installed a Baker OD 6 in my FXR out of curiosity because the money isn't all that much in 2023. It doesn't make enough difference for me to consider it a must-have but motorcycles are toys so why not? I run much taller than stock five speed final ratios on my stock Evos and four speed Shovels for low RPM highway cruising and would not disturb either if it's working as it should. (If I were a racer I'd buy a drastically different motorbike for racing that began with more HP than a streetable Harley (but spending money is fun so I don't think ill of anyone who goes large!)
My 1988 five speed with well over 100K miles showed near zero wear when I upgraded to a splined shaft bagger box with integral oil tank on my FXR (no more wet sumping is magnificent).
My bros who work on (many) Twinkies at their shop thank failed stock six speeds for thousands of dollars in profits. If one comes my way wrenching is trivial so I've no worries but it would not be replaced with a stock transmission if it were a keeper. After doing this stuff since the late 1970s I note that most HDs were always supplied with "bar bike" gearing to impress test riders while Euro spec final drive ratios were often taller. I always go tall on finals at first chain or belt change.
The only extra gear I need on my TC88 5speed...Is a 3 1/2 gear.
I couldn't afford to put the 6-speed Baker transmission in my five-speed 01 road glide so I changed the primary gearing from 3.39 to 1 to 3.15 to 1 now my bike runs at 70 mph at 3,000 RPM.
That's not a bad idea at all right there!
@@GixxerFoo I got the screaming eagle kit it was like $300 for the three gears it uses the same chain it makes a huge difference cuz it works in every single gear it stretches everything out nicely I highly recommend it I can run 135 140 cuz I got the engine to pull it but since I put that in I've never thought about putting a 6-speed in it again I don't need it I putt down the interstate like a boss at 80 and 90.
Great video Gixxer. Every Friday I look forward to watching your next video. Keep up the good content!
My 01 Road King 5 speed suits me just fine. I used to ride like my head was on fire, now I just want to get out and ride !!!
Well I hate to burst your bubble but the 6 speed swapped 5 speed bikes are pretty common, even using the factory 6 spd tranny. There is some work to be done but people are swapping to a 6 spd in the FXR platform all the time. So do your research and find out how to pair what you want with what you have and you can do it.
You are absolutely correct, it can for sure be done but it's not going to just bolt directly up. If you can do some fab work you can do anything. A lot of people take a chance and just buy a Ebay special 6 speed thinking it will directly bolt up or they can just swap the gear set. Cylinder heads will do that but not the transmissions.
@@GixxerFoo That is a great point I didn't consider. It definitely isn't a plug and play swap. I assumed if someone had the capability to change a transmission on a harley they would have the ability to do the swap you know?
@@randywhitford288 they are not swapping 07 and up gear sets. Those sets that are being swapped are specifically designed to feet into a 5 speed case.
@@ihatesjws1188 I didnt say they were swapping gearsets. I said they are swapping transmissions, which they are. Yes, baker makes a 6 into 5 gearset that fits but I'm not talking about that.
@@randywhitford288 I know what you said, I'm saying that's bs. I have yet to hear anyone ever saying it on any forums, or know of anyone ever doing it. So of it's even possible it's not common. Please post where you have heard of it happening since it's so common. Gear set swaps are common for fxr
Well in my shovelheads I would go from a 51 to the 49 tooth rear sprocket or so it was easy to alter the chain if necessary. Now on my EVO I just put a 34 tooth I believe I found one I must have been saving and I put it on there and it dropped it about 500 RPMs in a given speed now I got a stock 80 cubic inch and it's fine and me if you're ready you just have to know that well you may have to drop a gear if you need to do something on the highway. I thought of looking for a smaller rear sprocket I got a 65 with a 130 belt now but even if you have to buy the tranny pulley it's a lot cheaper than changing the belt and the rear pulley and I don't even know if they make a smaller rear pulley. Thanks for the info
Can't do it for the same reason you can't take a twin cam bike and drop an M8 in it. I should say nothing is impossible, some things are more expensive. Great video Gixx see you next time.