@@robertshea2010 What I'd like to know, in that case, is what did a character of sufficiently high lever to cast wish is doing in prison in the first place?
I'm currently playing a lizardfolk druid along a similar line; we've reflavored my goodberry as "goodlizard," conjuring 10 limply squirming lizards to munch on
Clear Sky Guardian except good berry is 1st level, while food&water is 3rd. And only clerics and paladins can cast it. So until you hit level 9, sacrificing one of your most powerful spell slots is a massive sacrifice. Especially when you have options like revivify or spirit guardians.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb that’s gravity in a vacuum, but it doesn’t account for the force of gravity something experiences. The reason the scale comes up different for a 300 lb beast and a 50 lb child is how much force gravity exerts on them.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb nah, but you're forgetting one crucial thing, theyre on the ground. As you add more weight to a object going down a slope, it adds more gravitation force to the sled, increasing its acceleration. Your example relies on the fact that they're already reached terminal velocity, where as in this scenario, they haven't.
@@yuh7139 Ok, you guys are right! It adds more gravitation force to the object, but it dont increase its acceleration because you will increase the mass of the object too. So it would need more force to move it. The aceleration of the object would change only if other forces come to play (or if you change the inclination of the slope), like air resistence and friction. Friction in the ice we can ignore because it should be too little to make a difference. So it would just be a matter of the air resistence. The air resistence (Av^2) would be less impactating as the mass of the object increase, this is why if we actually throw a feather it doesnt fall at the same speed of something heavier. You can see this through algebra too!! (Ill use words because i dont know the letters you guys use in english). mass x acelleration = [gravitation force pulling the object forward on the slope] (weight x sin a) - [ air resistence ] (Area x velocity^2) - [friction] (weight x cos a x u). You see that the air resist dont rely on the weight, right? So if we have something really heavy the air resistence can be ignored. But as we get the weight down it starts to matter more. This is why we are propense to think that weight makes us faster falling, but in this situation i dont think it would make a difference.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb im glad you put a lot of thought into this but I was literally 5 years old when I realized putting more weight on a sled makes it go down hill faster. I can't clear up your misconception because I can't really figure out what it is you're misunderstanding but anyone who has ever actually used a sled will be able to tell you that it works in practise.
So back in 3rd Edition our Minotaur Barbarian got a Artifact that acted like a amped up ring of regeneration. We never questioned where he kept getting fresh steaks or why he always when in his tent for an hour before our rest. Until someone walk in on him hacking a shoulder and a buttcheek off. It was a quick way to make and adventurer party in to vegans....
@@darkherculeskabuterimon7203 He said an ARTIFACT that ACTED LIKE an AMPED UP ring of regeneration. So an artifact, which are crazy powerful unique items, that acted like, so it was not a ring of regeneration, and in an amped up way, so far more powerful or effective than what one would expect. Words mean things and it seems you missed the meaning of most the operative words.
Forget goodberry, you only need one spell fireball, need to keep warm fireball, need to cook some food fireball, need to kill the trouble some do gooder mucking up your crime spree FIREBALL!!!
You pick Goodberry because it solves sustenance problems. I pick Goodberry because it’s the best first level out of combat healing spell in the game. We are not the same.
@@ImortalZeus13 I know the trick and it ain’t +Wiz mod, Life Cleric’s [Disciple of Life] feature adds 2+spell level to each instance of magical healing, but that still mean each berry heals 4 hp for a total of 40 hp for a first level slot that can be distributed as needed, which is still incredibly powerful. All you need is a muliclass of 1lvl Druid / 1lvl Cleric-Life Domain and out of combat you outheal most other healers. Even in combat 4 hp makes a little impact at low levels. Who the hell needs potions? Not that party.
Eh. Goodberry doesn't actually heal, it just creates objects that do. Allowing Life Cleric's feature to apply to individual berries is like letting Evocation Wizard's Overchannel maximise the damage of a summon's attack. It's definitely not RAW (and I think Crawford's guidelines are often best ignored, including in this case).
It is due to the druids theme compared to the cleric. I would expect a ranger or druid to be able to find food and water no matter what, while I would be surprised if the cleric managed to feed us all with a spell.
@@eric_moore-6126 nope. A background difference would be the cleric being an outlander and knowing were to find food. The ranger and druid are expected to find food regardless of their backgrounds, heck they could be guild artisans and you would still expect them to do so.
@@markhunter3533 Except you wouldn't automatically be right unless it's the Ranger's favored terrain. Druids and Rangers don't automatically have the Outlander background.
I had a character who, as a part of his back story, only consumed Goodberry berries to help him achieve enlightenment. The DM hated him while he was a player character, but when I retired him, the DM took him over.
🙃I'd actually assumed that all spells consumed their components, until I found this video and checked DnD wiki sites. In movies and TV, it's completely normal for brewed potions to use up the thing, or to grind up the eye of newt and sprinkle it on the target or whatever, and non-used-up things like wands seem like the equivalent of a spell-focus in DnD. Heck, DnD even has "spell component pouches" which sort of implies you're using up resources...but then you don't. 🤔
Armies March on their stomach. So a spell like goodberry will literally change a setting. Let's say a kingdom can find 10 people that can only cast the spell once per day. Do you understand how valuable those 10 people would be? That eliminates logistical load of 100 people. And it makes so that no matter what else happens there is a always going to be a supply fo those hundred troops, if you start running low you can start rationing and have two or more groups of 100 troops switch off. One day with food and then one or two without. And that is just 10 casters casting goodberry once a day. Imagine a druid or hospitality hafling.
I think people missing a lot on the point. It isn't about playing survival dnd, it's about adjusting spelling and setting so that it can enhance gameplay and experience. They wanted a survival campaign so they nerfed the spell that makes survival easy In his PvP dnd video, the DM also change up the mechanic for dueling rather than just regular initiative and "counterspell" every turn
Back in 3.5 Goodberry didn't conjure the berries, it enchanted berries that already existed. There were/are other ways to break survival situations but this version of goodberry wasn't one of them.
Except the mistletoe will rot in like a week, and there goes your component. 5e good berry is annoying for survival, but it doesn't solve an entire campaign, not even close. There's also the fact that it just provides nutrients, not hydration or calories, so you still need to eat once in a while, and drink regularly.
@@federicopalacios7439technically it's "nourishment", which is typically defined as "food needed to be healthy and grow". Maybe there's an argument for it not technically including water but I really don't think you can make the case that it's not enough calories to survive. The whole point of the spell is that it prevents malnutrition.
I was in a game once where one of the PCs was a druid who had lived on only goodberries for several years, and was now so sick of them that even the thought of them made him nauseous.
Thing is, if a person randomly came across mistletoe in the wild, it wouldn't just be a single sprig. They grow in big clumps with multiple clumps to a tree and probably multiple trees infested in an area. Literally months of good berry materials in a realistic scavenging situation.
You can houserule whatever you want. If I were running a survival 5e campaign, I'd remove goodberry completely until I could find a suitable homebrew version.
Another barrier to that mistletoe component is that the plant typically grows high up on trees, put the component in a place that will make the players work for it, and you've got an interesting challenge that way too
I don't think that's necessary, it kind of cheapens the success of gathering the components if they worked really hard and sacrificed to get it. High risk should lead to high reward.
I was a druid in a pirate campaign, and I know how these things turn out. So I spent the first day of the campaign finding rotten fruit, even going as far as to train the seagulls to find bad fruit and give it to me in return for good food. Why? Because Purify Food and Drink is a really funny spell which removes rot and decay. So session 1, and we no longer had to worry about scurvy. Pirate crisis averted.
yeah, it's not metagaming, it's expecting future issues, there's no reason his character wouldn't know what scurvy is and wouldn't be smart enough to solve that problem, it's a completely in character action for someone who's expecting to spend long periods of time out at sea
New Monster Idea: Goodberry Ant Swarm. Druids who create a lot of unused Goodberries should be careful about disposal, as regular pests (mites, ants, worms,) can become addicted to and affected by the residual magic left in the berries and can start following stalking the Druid seeking more and more sustenance whilst becoming more and more infused with residual magical energies until they become a danger to the Druid and their parties. *Druid carefully cleaning up the campsite, picking up some discarded goodberries* "Who threw these on the ground? Who was it? Do you want ants? This is how you get ants."
We did a survival/on the run campaign, the paladin stayed naked, forever...... even after the party cleared their names and placed the rightful heir on the EverThrone, he just stayed naked.
Gary Gygax, D&D's primary creator, co-DMed with Robert Kuntz back in the days of their home campaign. So, yeah, it's been an option since close to the beginning.
It can be a great way for someone who is more about character interactions and story to pass off combat encounters to someone who is more creative in map generation, terrain, elevation, environmental hazards, enemy types and varieties, etc.
Imagine you as a player having a relaxing narrative-social gameplay, but suddenly when the fight’s about to start DM shouts: “Alright, Jack, they are fighting!” and then the door slams open with another DM holding a box and a huge battle map: “BUCKLE DOWN, FRIENDS, IT’S TIME. ROLL FOR INITIATIVE!”
I was under the impression that the sprig of mistletoe WAS consumed by a spell... "Components pouch" was just a convenient abstraction for "I don't want to have to keep track of every loose twig and blob of bat poo I am carrying along."
This is why Out of the Abyss is such a wonderful campaign. It's beginning is a survival campaign. You don't fight evil. You flee from it. There's no way you can fight it! Until you get allies, grow powerful, and then you start lashing out. You start to take the fight to your enemies. One by one, the thorns in your side begin to fall until finally, you escape. Then, the campaign shifts. Survival is solved, and you are decently mid level. You've coin, allies, and powerful magic to combat the shrinking list of enemies (Shoor Vandree is a wonderful character, and my DM made us hate him in such a wonderful way I love hating that Drow).
@@FiraDeviant For sure for sure. But if you didn't follow the suggestion here though, you would just need a focus, which is something a wizard should have covered already.
I'm reminded of the game Chrono Trigger. In it, you encounter a point in the game where the entire world is essentially deprived of nutrition and there's no food left. You can fully heal at Enertron stations, which is what humanity is using to stay alive, but after every heal, there's an additional message that goes: "But you're still hungry." Honestly, if Goodberries nourished you but didn't sate hunger, them whether it's a debuff, buff, or just plain player roleplaying, the players should still try to seek actual food as much as they can.
Barbarian: "You won't survive out here a week little wimpy ones! You'll starve bef-" Ranger: (Hand full of berries that will easily sustain them) Barbarian: "You can't start a-" Sorcerer: (uses prestidigitation to make a camp fire) Barbarian: " A bear can rip you limb from bloody LI-" Bard and Druid: (Befriends the bear) Barbarian: (stares in disbelief) "Fuck this, I quite..." Wizard: "If only we had some clean water..." Barbarian: (eyes light up at the chance to flex their survival skills and begins getting the pot ready) Cleric: (Uses Create/Destroy Water to make 10 gallons from thin air) (almost as if by magic, by next weeks session the Barbarian is converted into a Warlock)
@Jimmy De'Souza Aka, a well prepared party wouldn't even need to worry. As most of this can be sustained by a visit to a market. Or having an intelligence above 8. Mistletoe you just buy it when you are in a market like you would most other spell components. Making a campfire... If the wizard has an intelligence high enough to be a wizard, I think its fair to say he knows how lighting stuff on fire works. Food. If someone forgot to buy rations before a multiple day trip, that sounds like they weren't going to live long anyways. And if that was on 1 party member and they forgot, they ARE the rations. Sounds fair to me. Water... You heard of a Canteen right? Revolutionary new tool that lets you carry quite a bit of fresh water. If the DM is that big of a stickler that if you drink from it, you can't use it as the spell component. Carry a spare you don't drink from to fill up a pot big enough to refill everyone's, with a mere drop from it. Then profit. As for the DM, I'd say it just depends. If they really do not care for these things, then fair. Its a boring part of the game not many people appreciate, so it would make sense to just skim over it. As in "skim" I mean: "A full canteen and a day's ration? You live for today so long as you don't do anything else stupid to affect your health." If the DM however wants to run a gritty realism survival campaign, then fair is fair. They can make the wilds as untamed as unforgiving as they please. But they should know its a pretty small market of players interested.
@Jimmy De'Souza Frankly, I am just saying "be prepared before you go out in the wild and save yourself a lot of trouble". Then wildlife survival really shouldn't be that hard, unless your DM wants it to be. Don't get why your throwing a fit and a half, unless I have somehow genuinely insulted you in your eyes. Then sorry, for whatever joke I said in response to your little rant that started this whole mess. I figured you'd be able to tell it was one, but in this world you gotta blatantly say when you are joking around I guess. Not really looking to argue. I am just looking to joke around and have a good time. So please turn off the caps lock and calm down.
@Jimmy De'Souza As said, didn't really think you'd take it seriously. Me and my friends method of joking around with each other is actually light teasing. Most people don't take it so seriously, so I am sorry that it came across as genuine insults. And not really complaining at all, just joking around. My original post is literally just a joke. As for my response to your first message I responded to. That was just me explaining how players could prepare against the spell limitations you stated. I wasn't trying to come across as rude, just stated above. I am just used to light teasing as a form of joking around, and sorry it offended you. Guess I do need to watch what I say to internet peoples because they may not be into that sort of thing nor understand in the first place its literally just someone joking around. As for caps lock, over in America it is what people do when being angry or salty, its very seldom used as a joke over here. So completely misread that as I don't really know "UK" jokes on social media. So overall, sorry about the misunderstandings that may have rustled your jimmies in the wrong way. Will probably just stick to memes when joking with people from now on then. As it is probably better understood as jokes.
@@hunterotte4085 I think a survival campaign should use the "points of lights" approach tho the world map, with these extra caveats: - Roads are RARE and rarely in good repair. Most are nothing more than a barely detectable trail. Near big towns the one or two well traveled roads are in better shape. - Many Communities are built next to waterlines. No roads there, people go by boat. - Distances between communities tend to be HUGE. Weeks, not days. Not your typical "definitely a village or hamlet every day" setup. Center of kingdom is Civilized, then Patrolled, then Borderlands, then the Wilderness. MOST of the map is Wilderness. - Only the Civilized center has more small communities like hamlets, around the capital. hamlets are fortified. Further out, Patrolled lands, very few hamlets, only very fortified in easily defended spots, only around towns. Villages are move fortified. Borderlands has no hamlets at all and only a few very fortified villlagers, no towns. Wildderness is that. making the world HUGE and not many communities means traeling can be a challenge.
The first time I played a ranger my dm used this rule, it was a regular game so to cast good berry I had to use survival to find the component, and if I remember correctly the "Up to 10 people" was roll a d10, making it less effort to just hunt with survival, and then we left my favored terrain and went into a swamp that was difficult terrain for several sessions. (My ranger died in there and my new warlock lost his horse on his 1st or 2nd session)
I probably noticed by yourself but the ranger is the worst class of 5e, if the master makes you leave your favored terrain, you're going to became useless. That needs a rework so bad or u could talk to the master asking at the start of the campaign what terrain you're going cross, but D&D is based on the players choices so u could be in a terrain even the master didn't know u would cross of (big sorry for bad English but I'm Italian and I'm learning English)
@@seido_kamishiro English is pretty good no worries. Well Ranger has been reworked in Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, but all those options are still variants that can be ignored.
@@napalmbom32 have to read that manual I'll give it a read and then I will make my conclusions about it, also thanks I'm a little worried about my English cause I want to go to London this summer
I once ran an adventure that started with the characters shipwrecked in a foreign desert land. They combed the beach for whatever gear they could scrounge and went trekking into the arid wastes. All was primed for a hardcore survival arc. Then the following morning, the cleric just cast Create Food and Water, and the wizard cast Phantom Steed. Yay.
Some spells ruin campaings thats why antimagic fields are essential or you can make then nigh-deadmagic zone where only magic that works are consumables and thr ones with charge and they take low amount of damage that adds up because you need to optimize alot
During session zero you can and should blacklist spells, classes, and races before players build their characters around them and they break your campaign idea
If your goal isn't survival, don't use this optional rule. I had a salty DM randomly spring this rule on me after my ranger had been using it for 2 sessions. This was a dungeon crawl hack and slash campaign. I have no idea why he decided this rule was appropriate but it really made the spell a choice that isnt worth it.
I love high survival focused settings, but it's true, many players love hack and slash or NPC interaction over realistic survival. DM should always ask upfront or be clear before starting a campaing. For example, I'm a little loose with spellcasting rules since the players at my table that love spellcasters are very busy during the week since they are health workers in the middle of a pandemic...they just want to relax once every two weeks and I prefer to focus on story telling rather that saying "No, you can't" every 5 minutes
Now this is a bad usage of this rule, if a GM isn't going to use it to augment the survival aspect of their game and instead undermine their spellcaster then being honest that GM is not worth playing with really.
@@Kondai fair warning that I didn't want to play hack n Slash. My first character was a bard with a lot of fun backstory and planning put into it, but instead he one shot me in the first combat without a second thought. So I made a minmaxed ranger with goodberry so we couldn't be starved out. It really sucked to have a DM constantly trying to fight me.
Gotta leave goodberry alone if you're running planescape. The Planeswalker's Handbook even strongly urges the party to have someone who can cast it, as many planes are a lot harder to traverse without a reliable food source.
That's a fairly high-level spell, though. For a game focused on wilderness survival, it makes sense that none of the players were high enough level to cast such a spell.
@@Archimonde259 I wouldn't expect a wilderness survival game to reach level 7; At that point, it would go past the "wilderness survival" part of it, I think.
well the logic behind it was likely that you need to use a spell slot for it, but druids typically are utility classes, and they have the ability to change their spells around
@@Thee_Jadex mistletoe is poisonous, but the good berries aren’t. I guess the spell creators just looked at the mistletoe berries and were like damn that shit looks good, make that both edible and magic
I ruled that goodberries are like the Enertron from Chrono Trigger. You won't die of starvation, but you still feel hungry because your stomach is still empty. This causes morale issues and loud growling.
Im actually running a Survival heavy game. And, oh boy. Oh boy do Rangers make it super fun. I don't mind the party having figured out the loophole but then the Ranger died. and then my fun really started
Sounds like the party just didn’t want to RP foraging. Our Druid uses Goodberry for themselves (we can take one if we want, he’s not greedy) on long journeys, but the rest of us split between rations and foraging to give us that good RP. Like the day our Paladin found mushrooms, but because his roll was low, he didn’t know they were mildly toxic. Cue the NPC traveling with our party never trusting his cooking again.
Survival is fun, if it's the goal. But in many cases it's just a distraction and a drag to stop the plot from happening. If you are traveling across the country to slay the lich king... it kind of sucks to have to micro manage your food and water, hunt for food, worry about frost bite and all that stuff along the way. If any one played 1st addition AD&D there is a ton of rules in there to make DnD "more realistic". Which seems fun, till you have to keep track of it all. Stuff like the Dungeoneer's and Wilderness survival guide that introduces being too hot or cold, thirst, hunger, bleeding, infection, parasites and more.... Not to mention you'd have to possible nerf other spells as well or it seems oddly focused to just stop Druid/rangers. Clerics tend to have create food and water, purify food or water and other such spells to make life easier.
fun fact: mistletoe is poisonous! just because you can eat it in game doesnt mean you should irl. this is mostly for people with children, and not for the children themselves. children who might try eating mistletoe. dont let kids eat anything you arent 100% sure is good for them.
I was in a party that managed to turn a slave rebellion into a booming economic powerhouse based solely on the fact that we were able to use magic crystals to mass produce goodberries. Yeah it's a great spell.
This is why I like the older edition (and Pathfinder) version of Goodberry. Yes, you can cast it for a 1st level slot, BUT it doesn't CREATE magical goodberries, it TRANSFORMS real, mundane berries into goodberries and those berries are required to be freshly picked berries. So you still gotta find the berries, not just a single sprig of poisonous mistletoe. EDIT: In addition, this version of goodberry doesn't give you 10 berries, it gives you 2d4 berries. So there's an outside shot that you only roll two 1's and someone (or multiple someones) in your party of 3+ is going hungry.
I mean... the berries on a sprig of mistletoe are still berries. It’d be a pretty dickish move for the DM to be like “okay you found berries like you’ve been searching but They’re POISONOUS, so you can’t goodberry them”.
@@williaml840 Oh definitely agreed, if I was GMing, I'd allow any type of berry (even poisonous) to become goodberries (the spell in pathfinder/3.5e specifies only that they must be freshly picked not that they must be edible.)
You think Goodberry is bad? Have you looked at Create Food and Water? That provides enough to satisfy 15 people for 24 hours, and has no material components!
Well the big difference there is that goodberry is a level 1 spell while create food and water is 3rd level. If you are starting at level 1 then it will take longer for you to get to the point where you can cast 3rd level spells, and even then, depending on your situation there might be other 3rd level spells you might find more important to cast. If you run into an encounter, you might end up regretting that you used a 3rd level spell slot on food and water. In contrast a first level spell slot is A LOT more expendable and you get them right at the beginning. Also, in survival campaigns, i would say that Rangers and druids (good berry), tend to be a more common choice for players than Clerics, paladins and artificers (create food and water)
I now want to play the opposite campaign and be the trackers on the trail of a group of escaped criminals. Be a great heavy mystery intrigue campaign without courtly politics and such.
I think the Goodberry spell originally required you to pick actual berries and the spell simply imbued them. Made it so you needed to find actually berry bushes to make it useful.
Goodberry is actually a really strong ability for an arcana cleric, their level 6 ability lets you dispel magic whenever you heal someone with a spell, with the dispel being as strong as the slot you use to cast the heal, for instance a lv 2 cure wounds can dispel a heat metal spell. Since goodberry heals whenever domeone eats a good berry, you can give them to the party and eat one for an instant first level spell cleanse, basically shuts down all attempts to charm
Their was a Podcast where a guy had a Dwarf Cleric named Merle. He was generally useless in a fight to the point that it became a running joke that the team wasn’t entirely sure he was actually a Cleric at all. What he was good at was diplomacy in all its many forms (including talking to plant monsters) . His favorite spell was a spell that caused many problems “Zone of Truth” to the point that the DM had to make it so that the Bosses or villains weren’t in the same room until it was time to fight. Talking and taunting them through magical means.
Yep Adventure Zone is probably my favorite DnD podcast. Like Taako the smug asshole Wizard who would rather not try whenever possible. Magnus you classic hero type character, Merle the worthless Cleric but excellent diplomat.
It's funny how every D&D player, myself included, has this false impression of mistletoe as this bush that grows on it's own. Then I moved to Europe and found out that it is a globular parasite that grows high up in the branches of oak trees. Image a fireworks ball frozen in the moment of greatest illumination and that is what mistletoe in bloom looks like.
My DM treats it as basically a magic multivitamin, so if we go without water, we'll still dehydrate, and so long without food will still exhaust us, cause weight loss from starvation, and possibly die from refeeding syndrome when we do get some food again depending on how long it's been.
Because that's basically how it works. People just seem to think "nourishment" means being fed, in reality you still need calories and water, you can't survive on just eating nutrients.
@@federicopalacios7439The dictionary definition of nourishment is literally “the food necessary for growth, health, and good condition.” What are you on about?
@@federicopalacios7439No, it's a problem with the spell description, because "Nourishment" could be interpreted to be mutiple things. According to the definition of Nourishment, I think it's easy to say that it provides all needs provided by food and water, but you could easily rule that it only covers some. Though honestly I like that it is up to interpretation, it can allow for survival mechanics in one game and be used for hand-waving the need to eat in another.
i had a dm that wanted to do survival aspects like this, but instead of doing something where goodberry consumes the material component, they started using a supplemental ruleset that would like. punish our characters for eating goodberries instead of full meals. as the druid player i felt severely nerfed by that because of how much i liked goodberry as a spell, and i think your idea with the consumed material would have made me feel a lot more satisfied. it feels fairer, letting me feel like a badass with goodberry still be the really cool spell that it is, but still requiring the foraging that a survival game thrives on
I think that’s a perfectly fine ruling in a survival campaign as long as it is mentioned up front. Either this, what was mentioned in the video, or outright banning it seems the only way to preserve that kind of campaign. The choice feels like it would depend on exactly what the DM was looking to do.
I quite like the way Pathfinder does it. At least how it limits it. Instead of creating the berries, it enchants the listed number of berries. Specifically, they must be freshly picked berries. And they're listed as the target. Not components. So they must be present.
The problem is, the way survival is handled in Dnd, that being with random encounters and weather, causes the party to almost require goodberry to survive. For example, our party was part of an expedition group sent out to explore the wilderness. We had a Sorcerer, a Bard, a Fighter, a barbarian, and a paladin. We were into about 2 days, as in two rolls of the dice, from our Gm where we encountered a wolf and some deer at most, when our Gm rolled on the weather table, and got a blizzard. He rolled for severity and got a 10, which pretty much meant that travel was impossible and we were forced to hunker down to wait out the blizzard. I supposed that WOTC intended a blizzard or storm to last, probably a day or so. But our Gm rolled for how long it would take to clear, which is a 1d4. He got a 4, that meant we had to spend 4 days hunkered down trying to not freeze to death and constantly rolling Con Saves. When it came time that the blizzard was over, we had to search for food and fire wood, which was hard since because of the heavy snowfall, that was now at disadvantage. The day ended with us getting enough supplies to last he night, our GM rolled on the Weather Table. Another Blizzard. He rolled on how long it would last. Another 4 days. Our characters began to need to make con saves, and we were accumulating Exhaustion due to not eating or having a way to melt the snow and ice to drinking water. The weather cleared, and we decided we couldn't last much longer, so we decided like cowards we'd go back to down and accept the L. It was 2 days of travel to make it back, and our Gm rolled for weather, Another Blizzard. Another roll, 3 days this time. We died from what was, basically, 15 minutes of bad luck rolling. That doesn't sound out of the ordinary, after all 15 minutes of bad rolls in a boss battle for example, or 15 minutes of bad rolls in a stealth mission, would get us killed. But nothing is more dissatisfying then dying to RNG weather, where you are literally forced to wait out your own death. And RNG weather is the exact problem with how Survival is handled in DNd. Because very few GM's ever have the patience to make a weather table that isn't borrowed from their Tomb of Annihilation module, but tweaked so that "Storm" is "Blizzard".
My sympathies, but things like this are *why* the DM exists in the first place- to say "y'know, my party just had to deal with 4 days of blizzard, how about I pretend I didn't just roll 4 more days of blizzard?"
This is why when I DM the dice aren't gods, I am. Gotta be able to change shit for the players, not all the time. I'm not going to save them from death, unless it's a really shitty dumb unsatisfying death caused by random chance instead of their own dumb choices. (If you punch a dragon in the snout you get what you get.)
You ever tried eating all of your food as berries? You know what that does to your digestion? I made that joke as the ranger casting the spell but the DM loved it and made it the main limiting factor.
There is a way around that as well... If the druid plants spriglings all over his staff and casts druidcaft to make one grow... Adding "The staff has 1d10+5 seeds... On a 5, or 6, the sprig also creates an additional shoot" and the Staff of the Good Druid becomes a rather nice near-magical item to aid in survival, with a limited function so that it can be a failsafe to get them started.
Yes, if you alter the rules to add a way around that, you do, indeed, have a way around that. Not sure why you want to alter the rules to reintroduce a flaw you altered the rules to eliminate though. The rules don't include that thought. Druid craft can "instantly make a flower blossom, a seed pod open, or a leaf bud bloom. " This does not allow mistletoe to grow on a dead stick. Mistletoe is parasitic. It requires a living host.
@@seigeengine 1. Have you not heard the story of Moses, how the desert tribe he joined used to plant their staves into the ground and see which one bloomed to elect the next cheiftan? He asked the same thing only to have his staff bloom. Or plants out in the Australian outback that can be seen as dead for years of drout, only to become lively and green after a short rainy season? 2. The Staff if the Good Druid was not convinced just to one-up a DM's house rules, but actually to expand on the RAW lore and consider in what ways a druid's wooden staff differs from one wielded by an arcane spellcaster, to showcase their connection to nature in a way that only adds flavour text to the core build, giving it to a first level druid and saying that is how casting Goodberry works. In fact, in a non-survival style game, such a staff could even be classed a trinket equal to the Wand of Mending. However, as this video DOES talk about a survival-based game, I tweeked it to stay on the lore points by quantifying the seeds and adding a limitation to it's reproduction as the DM with such a houserule would see this as a temporary relief. 3. If you would like quotes: PHB Druid intro - "Holding high a gnarled staff wreathed with holly...", PHB Druid, Sacred Plants and Wood - "Druids often use such plants as part of a spellcasting focus, incorporating lengths of oak or yew or sprigs of mistletoe." So the concept is there in the RAW and not addressed in the house rule forbidding it. As an aside, the example quest did have a stock of supplies that would have made the group's start a lot easier if they had kept it, with what seems as more than 15 days worth of rations (maximum starting amount in my suggestion) and the ability to forage for more resources they would need anyways (chances higher than rolling a 5 or 6 to add one extra day of delay) and would STILL have to portion out such supplies just as they would have hunting. So the Staff of the Good Druid neither breaks nor overrules the adventure, can be tweeked (like the DM rolls for new sprigs) to keep the struggle balanced (cause hunting checks is also at the mercy of the dice) and is just a fun beginner item that can make a character stand out and feel unique among all the other druids in the world without having to rely on the Inheritor's magical item to do so.
I get where he's coming from. It depends on what kind of game you want. I played Serpent's Skull (a game where you're dropped on a tropical island without supplies) three times as a dm. Two times, it was intense because the characters we all city folk, and didn't take as naturally to survival. One time, it was a druid and a ranger, and it was a totally different kind of game. Still really fun, but within two sessions the ranger and druid were planning to completely take over the island because (in their words) "we aren't trapped on the island, everything else on the island is trapped with us."
It's pretty heavily implied that the reason water wasn't a problem wasn't todo with the spell but ALL THE MEGA FUCK TONS OF SNOW which they can melt and drink. That being said even if they were in a desert, hunting for water is just less interesting than hunting for food
Well, if they were in a snow-covered area, wouldn’t they just be able to melt snow for water? They’d have to find something to hold it in, but there is water all over in such places.
There is also Fireball, which is a third level spell dealing 8d6 aoe damage on a dex save and 5th level Flame Strike dealing 8d6 aoe damage on a dex save with a smaller area. Spells in D&D are not balanced compared to one another.
@@KommandoCraftLP my point was a third level spell slot is a greater cost than a first level spell slot, not trying to say good berry should be 3rd level or something. Also worth noting is half of flame strike’s damage is radiant which is a much rarer resist/immunity and can hit creatures higher in the air. Likely not worth it, but still a tangible benefit and difference.
@@nimajneb8897 it is definitely true that Create Food and Water has a much higher cost than Goodberry, even if it doesn't have material components, but the important difference is, just as with my example of Fireball and Flame Strike, that it is unlikely for one PC to ever have the choice between the two. The two classes that are made for survival and would break such a situation anyways get Goodberry and Artificers, Clerics and Paladins get to create Food and Water. There is also the (minor) difference between both spells that Create Food and Water grants you a free Create Water Spell that got upcast to third level, which the berries don't.
Thats why we homebrewed the "Sickness effect" where you cant sustain yourself for more than 3 days with it. After that you have to eat and drink normally for 3 days (or less, 1:1 ratio) to be able to get nourishment from the Goodberry again. Can still eat them for easy HP, but no nourishment comes when Sickness is active. That way it gives enough time for everyone to focus on survival aspects and then switch to something else for a breather.
Maybe it's just me, but I'd make that ration 1:3, 1 day you can eat a good Berry and get nourishment, then you have to find regular food for 3 days (or maybe even more). It still feels powerful, very powerful. Maybe I'm being too harsh or something.
@@hotshowerh2o356 just a number easy to change up to everyones interest really. Just gotta find the optimal balance here for the group to keep them interested and challenged.
@@hotshowerh2o356 i think it depends on how hard you want survival to be apart of your campaign. so if you wanted it to be a main feature so you would want to increase the days in between when they can use good berry but if survival is just a minor aspect then just lower the amount of days.
Yeenoghu: "KILL AND EAT! KILL AND EAT! KILL AND EAT!" Demogorgon: "Yeenoghu, eat a Goodberry." Yeenoghu: "HUH WHY?" Demogorgon: "Because when you get hungry you talk like a troll." Yeenoghu: [transforms into balor] "thanks." Narrator: "You're not you when you're hungry. Goodberry satisfies."
And that's totally fine and why this change to the spell isn't as terrible as people thing. It actually gives the survival skill a purpose when looking for food as you can have the check affect how many usable "sprigs" you scrounge up.
Forget the old tavern, starting a campaign with a prison break is the best fucking idea I've ever heard! 😆 I'm _definitely_ gonna be stealing that! It also forces the players to come up with a background, since I'd ask them to come up with a reason why their character was imprisoned in the first place. It's win/win!
@@alexandriariley5209 RAW says you can use a reaction whenever it's applicable, including your turn, and there's really nothing in the game *harmed* by that
@@duckshallrule6937 there is something harmed by that: the use of counterspell AND the suspension of disbelieve. the reason you can cast counterspell with a reaction against other spells is because counterspell is something you can cast far quicker than any normal spell goes off. so you see the mage casting a spell, but you can still finish off your counter before he is done casting. but how do you counter a counter? they are both equally fast to cast, and he had to start casting before you do, so he also is finished before you are, and also countered your spell before you can stop him. but the problems don't end there. how can you concentrate on casting counterspell, while you are in the middle of casting a spell right now? that would mean you are casting 2 spells at the same time. counterspell is not counterable. anything else completely breaks everything.
What a wonderful series. As someone interested in fantasy but never played dnd (i play the same Red Wizard in every videogame) this makes dnd feel so accessible
Had a similar game once where the original premise was a mainland country was sending some colony ships out to a new land mass that had suddenly appeared in the ocean; no previous records, no known inhabitants, wasn't even supposed to be there. So our party gears up with the stuff we think we're going to need to our jobs on this new island: forge cleric had smithing tools and had dropped most of their starting gold into a forge setup to take over on the ship, artificer alchemist had a lab set etc. So we end up shipwrecked and the DM reveals the actual campaign - a survival game where we need to build up a base, and eventually scour the coast line for all the stuff we originally thought we'd have. When the issue of Food came up, the party started talking about how we could try scouting the forest. While they were talking, my Trition Fighter with the Fisherman background wandered out into the waves, and came back half an hour later with a few days worth of fish on his spear.
I would love to hear more about the plot of this campaign. Ive never been in a survival focused game like that and would love to be able to do so, or possibly run one such game.
Unfortunately, when our DM tried to implement the houserule, our smartass druid *immediately* decided to start tending to a mistletoe plant in our cart. So now several days of nothing but goodberry gives you the shits
When i rolled my dices for the weight of my druid when making the character, it was 100 kg and tall 1,62m. I put in the background that he ate 10 good berries at once
@@Petsinwinter2 ahh fair. I looked up mistletoe and it seems to tend towards a lot of branches and leaves, so even with the requirements of sprig needing to be about 4 inches of length and have a decent amount of adornments you'd still be fine for a while (maybe a month or two?).
One setting I really loved was Dark Sun. The survival factor alone made the game super interesting in the fact that you may kill that monster, you may win the day, but the Athasian sun is still beating down on you. Water was worth more than metal in many cases and good characters can turn evil just for a single drink. Environmental hazards are awesome in DnD until a spell makes them trivial, then it just sucks.
This video is an example of quality DMing. Shaping the rules to fit the campaign, and working with the players to produce the most enjoyable experience. I bet that any sprigs of mistletoe they found were as precious as gold and when to use them was a very interesting choice.
Goodberry is incredibly op in that kind of situation, but in most playthroughs its not worth picking up at all when there's so many better ones that fit most situations
Honestly i'd rather have Prestidigitation. No more cleaning. Everything tastes great. You can make people soil their own pants if they annoy you. Always cold pillow. Killer at parties for card tricks. Prestidigitation is the best spell for irl, easily.
I just usually take the outlander background. You find enough food and water for five people provided the land has something to offer, no spell slot required most parties don’t reach ten people as is, and it gives you those opportunities to hunt and discover things.
@@badideagenerator2315 yeah but not water and not if you’re anywhere but a body of water that can sustain fish. Outlander gives you both food and water as long as there’s any to be found.
Oh, wow. I could never imagine using goodberry in that way you describe as the presupposed canon. I've always seen it as transforming the berries you find into the goodberries, so of course it "consumes" the material *and* you can only create as many as you find normal berries to transmute instead of a fixed number. And the berries have to have been freshly picked within the past day. And I'm pretty sure the goodberries lose their magic if uneaten after 24 hours. The thing I would house rule, is that you can transmute poisonous berries instead of the source berries having to be eatable already, since that just makes more sense for an originally divine spell.
That is kinda how the spell USED to work. In 3rd edition, the caster had to find fresh berries to make the spell work. If he could only find 5 berries, then that's the max number of Good berries he could get. If the caster couldn't find any berries, then he was right out of luck. I think issue is under 5E's rules Goodberry will give you up to 10 berries for the price of one sprig of Mistletoe and a 1st lvl spell slot. That means 4-5 man parties can stretch two days worth of nourishment out of one use of this spell if they cast it in the morning and eat the extra berries right before the spell wears off at the next sunrise. So no worries about starvation ever or need for characters to use their survival skills.
The most irksome thing to me about goodberry is that Rangers are one of the two classes that gets it. It makes thematic sense at first blush, but people tend to choose Ranger because they want to be the one who goes and hunts for the party's dinner, and yet they are the very one who makes that skill obsolete.
Another optional rule addition: "Although solely sustaining oneself off of goodberries is possible, it is not advised since eating them for more than three days in a row has a high chance of causing diarrhea and leading to dehydration. DC 10 Constitution saving throws every 2 hours or your character has diahrrea for the next fifteen minutes, every day after the third day of consuming goodberries increases the DC of the saving throw by 1" Seriously nerfed the spell but it'll be hilarious.
At low levels my druid used to give out goodberries every morning as emergency heal from unconsciousness pills. There came a fight where we were getting wrecked and my kobold druid decided to panic cast goodberry again and EAT ALL 17 OF THEM. After the fight he vomited for a few hours and got sick for two days as he ate half a months worth of food in a single mouthful.
@@garret1930 I would just make it that eating goodberry for too long causes you to suffer from exhaustion. I would say "sustain for one day" does not mean it has all your nutritional needs. Just as if you were to try to eat chips every day, whilst you may feel full, you would eventually get very sick.
I hunt for the thrill, not for dinner. Besides, on an adventure, people usually run into a random encounter and I'd prefer to be with the group when that happens.
Gotta hate all these crappy takes in the comments section. This was a nice and elegant fix, rather than something like “You get arbitrarily poisoned” “it was your fault for letting them play that class. You shouldn’t alter Spellcasting” or “You should just just going to softban the spell so your players feel like idiots for choosing it!” Like seriously, it’s a nice fix that makes it so that good berry is a good spell that is still helpful in a survival setting, without changing it into combat only or removing it entirely.
Right? It's like "Oh, why slightly modify the game in a way that's super close to RAW when you could heavily modify the game by changing the function of/banning certain spells?" Not that those couldn't work, but I think this is a better solution.
Yeah this is a decent way to nerf it if you want a survival focus in your campaign. My last DM actually killed his last game by limiting the players too much with their spells. Good berry either turned to rotted food or raisins. Also ruled that alchemist jug would not work.
I mean, older editions had the spell IMBUE berries that you already have with magic to provide more nourishment, rather than make them just appear. You could use that as an alternative too.
It's so funny that people are mad about this slight alterations, but their alternative is an even more BRAZEN change that functionally changes what the spell is. I actually am praying these dms don't find players like Jesus christ.
You talk about these awesome D&D games. You ever think of animating those? It would make for great story! But I can imagine it would require a lot of animation time.
@@josephtheoracle3344 Still have to have fire to warm the snow up though; unless you're warming it up, getting your water from snow is a good way to die faster.
Zee: *proposes material consumption when casting Goodberry*
Me, an intellectual: *casts Goodberry via Wish*
I feel like once you get access to wish. Your already so powerful that the wilderness is no real challenge anyway.
May as well create food and water at that point, no? The pursuing guards keep finding half eaten feasts...
@@robertshea2010 I think that's the joke my man
3rd level create food and water
@@robertshea2010 What I'd like to know, in that case, is what did a character of sufficiently high lever to cast wish is doing in prison in the first place?
Had a Lizard folk Druid who refused to make any good berries as he would only eat meat.
Lizard Folk are always hilarious to play as. Especially if you play on their "Always hunger and will even eat the party if necessary" rules.
I'm currently playing a lizardfolk druid along a similar line; we've reflavored my goodberry as "goodlizard," conjuring 10 limply squirming lizards to munch on
Vegetarian’t
Goodmeatball
Homebrew spell: adequate tumors.
Then the Cleric casts Create Food and Water.
Clear Sky Guardian except good berry is 1st level, while food&water is 3rd. And only clerics and paladins can cast it. So until you hit level 9, sacrificing one of your most powerful spell slots is a massive sacrifice. Especially when you have options like revivify or spirit guardians.
@Keegan Gates nobody asked you
Nobody asked you either.....
@@enbybunny9940 nobody needed to ask him, what he said is valid.
what you said however is pure garbage and you should feel bad for it
@@enbybunny9940
You good buddy?
Everything all right?
Maybe talk to someone
Maybe take a break from the internet
Take care of yourself
The irony is that if they were going downhill on a sled, the crates would give them more speed.
Nooo, It wouldnt make a diference. Remember that story of throwing an apple and a fether to see wich one hit the ground first? So the same apply here.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb that’s gravity in a vacuum, but it doesn’t account for the force of gravity something experiences. The reason the scale comes up different for a 300 lb beast and a 50 lb child is how much force gravity exerts on them.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb nah, but you're forgetting one crucial thing, theyre on the ground. As you add more weight to a object going down a slope, it adds more gravitation force to the sled, increasing its acceleration. Your example relies on the fact that they're already reached terminal velocity, where as in this scenario, they haven't.
@@yuh7139 Ok, you guys are right! It adds more gravitation force to the object, but it dont increase its acceleration because you will increase the mass of the object too. So it would need more force to move it. The aceleration of the object would change only if other forces come to play (or if you change the inclination of the slope), like air resistence and friction. Friction in the ice we can ignore because it should be too little to make a difference. So it would just be a matter of the air resistence.
The air resistence (Av^2) would be less impactating as the mass of the object increase, this is why if we actually throw a feather it doesnt fall at the same speed of something heavier. You can see this through algebra too!! (Ill use words because i dont know the letters you guys use in english). mass x acelleration = [gravitation force pulling the object forward on the slope] (weight x sin a) - [ air resistence ] (Area x velocity^2) - [friction] (weight x cos a x u).
You see that the air resist dont rely on the weight, right? So if we have something really heavy the air resistence can be ignored. But as we get the weight down it starts to matter more. This is why we are propense to think that weight makes us faster falling, but in this situation i dont think it would make a difference.
@@RafaelMartins-fg9rb im glad you put a lot of thought into this but I was literally 5 years old when I realized putting more weight on a sled makes it go down hill faster. I can't clear up your misconception because I can't really figure out what it is you're misunderstanding but anyone who has ever actually used a sled will be able to tell you that it works in practise.
So back in 3rd Edition our Minotaur Barbarian got a Artifact that acted like a amped up ring of regeneration. We never questioned where he kept getting fresh steaks or why he always when in his tent for an hour before our rest. Until someone walk in on him hacking a shoulder and a buttcheek off. It was a quick way to make and adventurer party in to vegans....
That's interesting
that's
disturbing
...
you have any more of that steak left from yesterday?
What I'm getting from this is rings of regeneration were vastly more powerful back in 3e.
@@darkherculeskabuterimon7203 He said an ARTIFACT that ACTED LIKE an AMPED UP ring of regeneration. So an artifact, which are crazy powerful unique items, that acted like, so it was not a ring of regeneration, and in an amped up way, so far more powerful or effective than what one would expect. Words mean things and it seems you missed the meaning of most the operative words.
Forget goodberry, you only need one spell fireball, need to keep warm fireball, need to cook some food fireball, need to kill the trouble some do gooder mucking up your crime spree FIREBALL!!!
Just fireball
Just fireball
*JUST FIREBALL*
Stop using smurf accounts, JoCat! xD
@@MetalGlitch brave words for someone within fireball range
What about Delayed Blast?
@@youtubeuniversity3638 Ah, yes! A few good bottles of that should help prevent the players from catching hypothermia.
You pick Goodberry because it solves sustenance problems.
I pick Goodberry because it’s the best first level out of combat healing spell in the game.
We are not the same.
It’s especially good if you take Life Cleric and just let someone eat each berry one at a time to a full potential heal of 10 + (10xWIS) HP
@@ImortalZeus13 I know the trick and it ain’t +Wiz mod, Life Cleric’s [Disciple of Life] feature adds 2+spell level to each instance of magical healing, but that still mean each berry heals 4 hp for a total of 40 hp for a first level slot that can be distributed as needed, which is still incredibly powerful. All you need is a muliclass of 1lvl Druid / 1lvl Cleric-Life Domain and out of combat you outheal most other healers. Even in combat 4 hp makes a little impact at low levels. Who the hell needs potions? Not that party.
Eh. Goodberry doesn't actually heal, it just creates objects that do. Allowing Life Cleric's feature to apply to individual berries is like letting Evocation Wizard's Overchannel maximise the damage of a summon's attack. It's definitely not RAW (and I think Crawford's guidelines are often best ignored, including in this case).
I pick goodberry because 80% of our party is monkies and a banana is technically a berry
Comparatively, Create Food and Water is a 3rd level spell that restores no HP. It does seem REALLY unbalanced
It is due to the druids theme compared to the cleric. I would expect a ranger or druid to be able to find food and water no matter what, while I would be surprised if the cleric managed to feed us all with a spell.
Old but different classes do different things mdude. It's not wrong for different classes to have different features.
@@markhunter3533 You're thinking of background differences, not classes.
@@eric_moore-6126 nope. A background difference would be the cleric being an outlander and knowing were to find food. The ranger and druid are expected to find food regardless of their backgrounds, heck they could be guild artisans and you would still expect them to do so.
@@markhunter3533 Except you wouldn't automatically be right unless it's the Ranger's favored terrain. Druids and Rangers don't automatically have the Outlander background.
I had a character who, as a part of his back story, only consumed Goodberry berries to help him achieve enlightenment. The DM hated him while he was a player character, but when I retired him, the DM took him over.
Wait that’s actually such a cool idea and I will 100% be stealing this for my next druid character
@@steamenginealchemist7109 Thanks Jake, where I come from. Idea theft is the highest form of compliment. I am truly humbled.
*takes create food and water later and flavor it with prestidigitation* You doubt my power to be lazy sir.
One of my favourite NPCs is a wizard/artificer who does exactly this in order to be an entirely self-sufficient hermit.
To be honest consuming its material component seems like such an obvious rule for a spell as strong as Good Berry that I'm surprised it isn't RAW.
🙃I'd actually assumed that all spells consumed their components, until I found this video and checked DnD wiki sites. In movies and TV, it's completely normal for brewed potions to use up the thing, or to grind up the eye of newt and sprinkle it on the target or whatever, and non-used-up things like wands seem like the equivalent of a spell-focus in DnD. Heck, DnD even has "spell component pouches" which sort of implies you're using up resources...but then you don't. 🤔
Armies March on their stomach. So a spell like goodberry will literally change a setting. Let's say a kingdom can find 10 people that can only cast the spell once per day. Do you understand how valuable those 10 people would be? That eliminates logistical load of 100 people. And it makes so that no matter what else happens there is a always going to be a supply fo those hundred troops, if you start running low you can start rationing and have two or more groups of 100 troops switch off. One day with food and then one or two without. And that is just 10 casters casting goodberry once a day. Imagine a druid or hospitality hafling.
Good Berry sounds like some kinda franchise. "Welcome to Good Berry, home of the Good Berry, can I take your order?"
Thank you. I'll have the bottomless berry bucket with a side of disappointed DMs.
@@Eddie42023 ONE GOODBERRY! That'll be 8 gold.
@@Nonamearisto sounds like a bargain. lol
@@Eddie42023 It's a play on "ONE GOOD BURGER! That'll be eight bucks."
I think people missing a lot on the point. It isn't about playing survival dnd, it's about adjusting spelling and setting so that it can enhance gameplay and experience.
They wanted a survival campaign so they nerfed the spell that makes survival easy
In his PvP dnd video, the DM also change up the mechanic for dueling rather than just regular initiative and "counterspell" every turn
Back in 3.5 Goodberry didn't conjure the berries, it enchanted berries that already existed. There were/are other ways to break survival situations but this version of goodberry wasn't one of them.
Except the mistletoe will rot in like a week, and there goes your component. 5e good berry is annoying for survival, but it doesn't solve an entire campaign, not even close. There's also the fact that it just provides nutrients, not hydration or calories, so you still need to eat once in a while, and drink regularly.
@@federicopalacios7439technically it's "nourishment", which is typically defined as "food needed to be healthy and grow".
Maybe there's an argument for it not technically including water but I really don't think you can make the case that it's not enough calories to survive. The whole point of the spell is that it prevents malnutrition.
I was in a game once where one of the PCs was a druid who had lived on only goodberries for several years, and was now so sick of them that even the thought of them made him nauseous.
Thing is, if a person randomly came across mistletoe in the wild, it wouldn't just be a single sprig. They grow in big clumps with multiple clumps to a tree and probably multiple trees infested in an area. Literally months of good berry materials in a realistic scavenging situation.
how do you keep them from spoiling?
You can dry them out easily.
Lexaire But then you could say that it undoes the magic as well.
You can houserule whatever you want. If I were running a survival 5e campaign, I'd remove goodberry completely until I could find a suitable homebrew version.
Another barrier to that mistletoe component is that the plant typically grows high up on trees, put the component in a place that will make the players work for it, and you've got an interesting challenge that way too
Or a feature like "A character can only benefit from the nourishing quality of goodberry twice a week" or some other timing.
I don't think that's necessary, it kind of cheapens the success of gathering the components if they worked really hard and sacrificed to get it. High risk should lead to high reward.
And here my DM just let my Ranger buy the damn thing.
I was a druid in a pirate campaign, and I know how these things turn out. So I spent the first day of the campaign finding rotten fruit, even going as far as to train the seagulls to find bad fruit and give it to me in return for good food. Why? Because Purify Food and Drink is a really funny spell which removes rot and decay. So session 1, and we no longer had to worry about scurvy. Pirate crisis averted.
that sounds a lot like metagaming...
Will Ash, in what way is any of this metagaming?
yeah, it's not metagaming, it's expecting future issues, there's no reason his character wouldn't know what scurvy is and wouldn't be smart enough to solve that problem, it's a completely in character action for someone who's expecting to spend long periods of time out at sea
New Monster Idea: Goodberry Ant Swarm. Druids who create a lot of unused Goodberries should be careful about disposal, as regular pests (mites, ants, worms,) can become addicted to and affected by the residual magic left in the berries and can start following stalking the Druid seeking more and more sustenance whilst becoming more and more infused with residual magical energies until they become a danger to the Druid and their parties.
*Druid carefully cleaning up the campsite, picking up some discarded goodberries* "Who threw these on the ground? Who was it? Do you want ants? This is how you get ants."
Druid Archer... Today I learned that I want that too exist...
... You did this just for the Archer reference.
@@bunnybismuth I REGRET NOTHING!
We did a survival/on the run campaign, the paladin stayed naked, forever...... even after the party cleared their names and placed the rightful heir on the EverThrone, he just stayed naked.
I Guess he always wanted his shortsword ready.
Wait, wait, wait...You can co-DM? Wow, a world of possibilities suddenly appears before me :D
Gary Gygax, D&D's primary creator, co-DMed with Robert Kuntz back in the days of their home campaign. So, yeah, it's been an option since close to the beginning.
It can be a great way for someone who is more about character interactions and story to pass off combat encounters to someone who is more creative in map generation, terrain, elevation, environmental hazards, enemy types and varieties, etc.
Imagine you as a player having a relaxing narrative-social gameplay, but suddenly when the fight’s about to start DM shouts: “Alright, Jack, they are fighting!” and then the door slams open with another DM holding a box and a huge battle map: “BUCKLE DOWN, FRIENDS, IT’S TIME. ROLL FOR INITIATIVE!”
I was under the impression that the sprig of mistletoe WAS consumed by a spell... "Components pouch" was just a convenient abstraction for "I don't want to have to keep track of every loose twig and blob of bat poo I am carrying along."
If you have a spell focus or component pouch the only components you have to track that get consumed are any that cost over 25gp
@@Helldragon789 and that's only if it specifies
@@Helldragon789 isn't it anything with a cost marked on it
@@Sip_Dhit Yeah, but if I remember correctly they don't start giving things prices until the 25gp mark
This is why Out of the Abyss is such a wonderful campaign. It's beginning is a survival campaign. You don't fight evil. You flee from it. There's no way you can fight it! Until you get allies, grow powerful, and then you start lashing out. You start to take the fight to your enemies. One by one, the thorns in your side begin to fall until finally, you escape. Then, the campaign shifts. Survival is solved, and you are decently mid level. You've coin, allies, and powerful magic to combat the shrinking list of enemies (Shoor Vandree is a wonderful character, and my DM made us hate him in such a wonderful way I love hating that Drow).
I have seen at least one DM rule that the nourishment from Goodberry is only a replacement for food, but not water.
Cold a problem? (wizard casts tiny hut)
A wizard with tiny hut and mage initate (goodberry) could just live in a safe magic bubble.
Only if you find the components and if you follow the suggestion here, you will have to keep finding the components.
@@FiraDeviant For sure for sure. But if you didn't follow the suggestion here though, you would just need a focus, which is something a wizard should have covered already.
I actually had it like this. For every 1 berry of mistletoe, you get 1 goodberry, so you can go up to 10 at a time, but again there’s a limited supply
I'm reminded of the game Chrono Trigger.
In it, you encounter a point in the game where the entire world is essentially deprived of nutrition and there's no food left. You can fully heal at Enertron stations, which is what humanity is using to stay alive, but after every heal, there's an additional message that goes: "But you're still hungry."
Honestly, if Goodberries nourished you but didn't sate hunger, them whether it's a debuff, buff, or just plain player roleplaying, the players should still try to seek actual food as much as they can.
OMG, Chrono Trigger - the best game I had ever played in my entire life! :D
It doesn't satiate your hunger, goodberry does not do that at all. It is exactly like the enertron.
Barbarian: "You won't survive out here a week little wimpy ones! You'll starve bef-"
Ranger: (Hand full of berries that will easily sustain them)
Barbarian: "You can't start a-"
Sorcerer: (uses prestidigitation to make a camp fire)
Barbarian: " A bear can rip you limb from bloody LI-"
Bard and Druid: (Befriends the bear)
Barbarian: (stares in disbelief) "Fuck this, I quite..."
Wizard: "If only we had some clean water..."
Barbarian: (eyes light up at the chance to flex their survival skills and begins getting the pot ready)
Cleric: (Uses Create/Destroy Water to make 10 gallons from thin air)
(almost as if by magic, by next weeks session the Barbarian is converted into a Warlock)
There is a reason there is no farmer background in the PHB
@Jimmy De'Souza Aka, a well prepared party wouldn't even need to worry. As most of this can be sustained by a visit to a market. Or having an intelligence above 8.
Mistletoe you just buy it when you are in a market like you would most other spell components.
Making a campfire... If the wizard has an intelligence high enough to be a wizard, I think its fair to say he knows how lighting stuff on fire works.
Food. If someone forgot to buy rations before a multiple day trip, that sounds like they weren't going to live long anyways. And if that was on 1 party member and they forgot, they ARE the rations. Sounds fair to me.
Water... You heard of a Canteen right? Revolutionary new tool that lets you carry quite a bit of fresh water. If the DM is that big of a stickler that if you drink from it, you can't use it as the spell component. Carry a spare you don't drink from to fill up a pot big enough to refill everyone's, with a mere drop from it. Then profit.
As for the DM, I'd say it just depends. If they really do not care for these things, then fair. Its a boring part of the game not many people appreciate, so it would make sense to just skim over it. As in "skim" I mean: "A full canteen and a day's ration? You live for today so long as you don't do anything else stupid to affect your health."
If the DM however wants to run a gritty realism survival campaign, then fair is fair. They can make the wilds as untamed as unforgiving as they please. But they should know its a pretty small market of players interested.
@Jimmy De'Souza Frankly, I am just saying "be prepared before you go out in the wild and save yourself a lot of trouble". Then wildlife survival really shouldn't be that hard, unless your DM wants it to be.
Don't get why your throwing a fit and a half, unless I have somehow genuinely insulted you in your eyes. Then sorry, for whatever joke I said in response to your little rant that started this whole mess. I figured you'd be able to tell it was one, but in this world you gotta blatantly say when you are joking around I guess.
Not really looking to argue. I am just looking to joke around and have a good time. So please turn off the caps lock and calm down.
@Jimmy De'Souza As said, didn't really think you'd take it seriously. Me and my friends method of joking around with each other is actually light teasing. Most people don't take it so seriously, so I am sorry that it came across as genuine insults.
And not really complaining at all, just joking around. My original post is literally just a joke.
As for my response to your first message I responded to. That was just me explaining how players could prepare against the spell limitations you stated. I wasn't trying to come across as rude, just stated above. I am just used to light teasing as a form of joking around, and sorry it offended you. Guess I do need to watch what I say to internet peoples because they may not be into that sort of thing nor understand in the first place its literally just someone joking around.
As for caps lock, over in America it is what people do when being angry or salty, its very seldom used as a joke over here. So completely misread that as I don't really know "UK" jokes on social media.
So overall, sorry about the misunderstandings that may have rustled your jimmies in the wrong way.
Will probably just stick to memes when joking with people from now on then. As it is probably better understood as jokes.
@@hunterotte4085 I think a survival campaign should use the "points of lights" approach tho the world map, with these extra caveats:
- Roads are RARE and rarely in good repair. Most are nothing more than a barely detectable trail. Near big towns the one or two well traveled roads are in better shape.
- Many Communities are built next to waterlines. No roads there, people go by boat.
- Distances between communities tend to be HUGE. Weeks, not days. Not your typical "definitely a village or hamlet every day" setup. Center of kingdom is Civilized, then Patrolled, then Borderlands, then the Wilderness. MOST of the map is Wilderness.
- Only the Civilized center has more small communities like hamlets, around the capital. hamlets are fortified. Further out, Patrolled lands, very few hamlets, only very fortified in easily defended spots, only around towns. Villages are move fortified. Borderlands has no hamlets at all and only a few very fortified villlagers, no towns. Wildderness is that.
making the world HUGE and not many communities means traeling can be a challenge.
The first time I played a ranger my dm used this rule, it was a regular game so to cast good berry I had to use survival to find the component, and if I remember correctly the "Up to 10 people" was roll a d10, making it less effort to just hunt with survival, and then we left my favored terrain and went into a swamp that was difficult terrain for several sessions. (My ranger died in there and my new warlock lost his horse on his 1st or 2nd session)
I probably noticed by yourself but the ranger is the worst class of 5e, if the master makes you leave your favored terrain, you're going to became useless.
That needs a rework so bad or u could talk to the master asking at the start of the campaign what terrain you're going cross, but D&D is based on the players choices so u could be in a terrain even the master didn't know u would cross of
(big sorry for bad English but I'm Italian and I'm learning English)
@@seido_kamishiro English is pretty good no worries. Well Ranger has been reworked in Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, but all those options are still variants that can be ignored.
@@napalmbom32 have to read that manual I'll give it a read and then I will make my conclusions about it, also thanks I'm a little worried about my English cause I want to go to London this summer
I once ran an adventure that started with the characters shipwrecked in a foreign desert land. They combed the beach for whatever gear they could scrounge and went trekking into the arid wastes. All was primed for a hardcore survival arc. Then the following morning, the cleric just cast Create Food and Water, and the wizard cast Phantom Steed. Yay.
Some spells ruin campaings thats why antimagic fields are essential or you can make then nigh-deadmagic zone where only magic that works are consumables and thr ones with charge and they take low amount of damage that adds up because you need to optimize alot
During session zero you can and should blacklist spells, classes, and races before players build their characters around them and they break your campaign idea
Goodberry and Create Good/Water are DPS spells.
Delicious
Pastry
Supplier
If your goal isn't survival, don't use this optional rule. I had a salty DM randomly spring this rule on me after my ranger had been using it for 2 sessions. This was a dungeon crawl hack and slash campaign. I have no idea why he decided this rule was appropriate but it really made the spell a choice that isnt worth it.
I love high survival focused settings, but it's true, many players love hack and slash or NPC interaction over realistic survival. DM should always ask upfront or be clear before starting a campaing. For example, I'm a little loose with spellcasting rules since the players at my table that love spellcasters are very busy during the week since they are health workers in the middle of a pandemic...they just want to relax once every two weeks and I prefer to focus on story telling rather that saying "No, you can't" every 5 minutes
Now this is a bad usage of this rule, if a GM isn't going to use it to augment the survival aspect of their game and instead undermine their spellcaster then being honest that GM is not worth playing with really.
@@Kondai fair warning that I didn't want to play hack n Slash. My first character was a bard with a lot of fun backstory and planning put into it, but instead he one shot me in the first combat without a second thought. So I made a minmaxed ranger with goodberry so we couldn't be starved out. It really sucked to have a DM constantly trying to fight me.
Gotta leave goodberry alone if you're running planescape. The Planeswalker's Handbook even strongly urges the party to have someone who can cast it, as many planes are a lot harder to traverse without a reliable food source.
Create Food and Water: Am I a joke to you?
That's a fairly high-level spell, though. For a game focused on wilderness survival, it makes sense that none of the players were high enough level to cast such a spell.
@@jime7001 I wouldn't call a tier 3 spell "high level"
@@Archimonde259 I wouldn't expect a wilderness survival game to reach level 7; At that point, it would go past the "wilderness survival" part of it, I think.
Can’t believe good berry doesn’t consume its material by default
well the logic behind it was likely that you need to use a spell slot for it, but druids typically are utility classes, and they have the ability to change their spells around
Well the component is a sprig of mistletoe, it doesn’t actually require berries to cast it
@@evilsquirrel0573 aren’t mistletoe berries poisonous? I know its magic but this just keeps getting weirder and weirder
@@Thee_Jadex mistletoe is poisonous, but the good berries aren’t. I guess the spell creators just looked at the mistletoe berries and were like damn that shit looks good, make that both edible and magic
I ruled that goodberries are like the Enertron from Chrono Trigger. You won't die of starvation, but you still feel hungry because your stomach is still empty. This causes morale issues and loud growling.
That kinda tracks, actually.
When you're fed via IV drip, you get sustenance but your stomach is empty and you still feel hungry.
Im actually running a Survival heavy game.
And, oh boy.
Oh boy do Rangers make it super fun.
I don't mind the party having figured out the loophole
but then the Ranger died.
and then my fun really started
You can just, change ranger features through brew, or UA it, change the feature to not be a sledgehammer but instead a climbing set.
Sounds like the party just didn’t want to RP foraging. Our Druid uses Goodberry for themselves (we can take one if we want, he’s not greedy) on long journeys, but the rest of us split between rations and foraging to give us that good RP. Like the day our Paladin found mushrooms, but because his roll was low, he didn’t know they were mildly toxic. Cue the NPC traveling with our party never trusting his cooking again.
Survival is fun, if it's the goal. But in many cases it's just a distraction and a drag to stop the plot from happening. If you are traveling across the country to slay the lich king... it kind of sucks to have to micro manage your food and water, hunt for food, worry about frost bite and all that stuff along the way. If any one played 1st addition AD&D there is a ton of rules in there to make DnD "more realistic". Which seems fun, till you have to keep track of it all.
Stuff like the Dungeoneer's and Wilderness survival guide that introduces being too hot or cold, thirst, hunger, bleeding, infection, parasites and more.... Not to mention you'd have to possible nerf other spells as well or it seems oddly focused to just stop Druid/rangers. Clerics tend to have create food and water, purify food or water and other such spells to make life easier.
Goodberry sounds like a cereal from the Forgotten Realms. "Goodberries, part of this nutritious breakfast!"
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO you can't just avoid hunger by making some berries appear
hehe goodberry go squish squish
fun fact: mistletoe is poisonous! just because you can eat it in game doesnt mean you should irl. this is mostly for people with children, and not for the children themselves. children who might try eating mistletoe. dont let kids eat anything you arent 100% sure is good for them.
It's also a parasite. It kills trees it grows on.
You don't eat mistletoe in the game. You use mistletoe to cast a spell that magically produces edible berries.
I was in a party that managed to turn a slave rebellion into a booming economic powerhouse based solely on the fact that we were able to use magic crystals to mass produce goodberries.
Yeah it's a great spell.
This is why I like the older edition (and Pathfinder) version of Goodberry. Yes, you can cast it for a 1st level slot, BUT it doesn't CREATE magical goodberries, it TRANSFORMS real, mundane berries into goodberries and those berries are required to be freshly picked berries. So you still gotta find the berries, not just a single sprig of poisonous mistletoe.
EDIT: In addition, this version of goodberry doesn't give you 10 berries, it gives you 2d4 berries. So there's an outside shot that you only roll two 1's and someone (or multiple someones) in your party of 3+ is going hungry.
I mean... the berries on a sprig of mistletoe are still berries. It’d be a pretty dickish move for the DM to be like “okay you found berries like you’ve been searching but They’re POISONOUS, so you can’t goodberry them”.
@@williaml840 Oh definitely agreed, if I was GMing, I'd allow any type of berry (even poisonous) to become goodberries (the spell in pathfinder/3.5e specifies only that they must be freshly picked not that they must be edible.)
You think Goodberry is bad? Have you looked at Create Food and Water? That provides enough to satisfy 15 people for 24 hours, and has no material components!
I mean it IS from the "Jesus/Moses" class... Remember clerics used to have "Sticks to Snakes" on the spell list too.
That's 5 more people than goodberry for a 3rd level slot.
If you can get up to third level spells in that environment.
Well the big difference there is that goodberry is a level 1 spell while create food and water is 3rd level. If you are starting at level 1 then it will take longer for you to get to the point where you can cast 3rd level spells, and even then, depending on your situation there might be other 3rd level spells you might find more important to cast. If you run into an encounter, you might end up regretting that you used a 3rd level spell slot on food and water. In contrast a first level spell slot is A LOT more expendable and you get them right at the beginning.
Also, in survival campaigns, i would say that Rangers and druids (good berry), tend to be a more common choice for players than Clerics, paladins and artificers (create food and water)
"Welcome to Goodberry; home of the Goodberry."
Best comment
I now want to play the opposite campaign and be the trackers on the trail of a group of escaped criminals. Be a great heavy mystery intrigue campaign without courtly politics and such.
Run two games, one table is the criminals, the other are the trackers trying to get them
@@Silvainius001 that requires enough players for both.
Goodberry, creates 10 edible berries from a poisonous plant.
Such is the incredible power of spells.
I think the Goodberry spell originally required you to pick actual berries and the spell simply imbued them. Made it so you needed to find actually berry bushes to make it useful.
Reminding me fondly of the time I pacified a hungry bulette by throwing a Goodberry down its throat.
I as a Druid used goodberries to try to make wine out of them once. I succeeded
Tell me more of this Goodberry Wine
Goodberry is actually a really strong ability for an arcana cleric, their level 6 ability lets you dispel magic whenever you heal someone with a spell, with the dispel being as strong as the slot you use to cast the heal, for instance a lv 2 cure wounds can dispel a heat metal spell. Since goodberry heals whenever domeone eats a good berry, you can give them to the party and eat one for an instant first level spell cleanse, basically shuts down all attempts to charm
Holy cow that’s awesome
G O O D B E R R Y ! welcome to the goodberry, home of the goodberry, may I take your order!
Their was a Podcast where a guy had a Dwarf Cleric named Merle. He was generally useless in a fight to the point that it became a running joke that the team wasn’t entirely sure he was actually a Cleric at all. What he was good at was diplomacy in all its many forms (including talking to plant monsters) . His favorite spell was a spell that caused many problems “Zone of Truth” to the point that the DM had to make it so that the Bosses or villains weren’t in the same room until it was time to fight. Talking and taunting them through magical means.
You're thinking of The Adventure Zone.
And man could he seduce some plants, much to everyone else in the party's experience.
Creatures in zone of truth do not have to answer questions.
Yep Adventure Zone is probably my favorite DnD podcast. Like Taako the smug asshole Wizard who would rather not try whenever possible. Magnus you classic hero type character, Merle the worthless Cleric but excellent diplomat.
It's funny how every D&D player, myself included, has this false impression of mistletoe as this bush that grows on it's own. Then I moved to Europe and found out that it is a globular parasite that grows high up in the branches of oak trees. Image a fireworks ball frozen in the moment of greatest illumination and that is what mistletoe in bloom looks like.
I'm now going to looks this up, figured it was like an Ivy where it latches onto stuff and grows using nutrients either from the host or the roots
@@richmondvand147 Do look it up. It's actually beautiful.
speak for yourself, not everyone on the internet, nor every DnD player, is a north American
@@joda7697 That is true. I currently play online with people from Ireland, England, Georgia, the Netherlands, and Czechia.
It'd be especially difficult to acquire mistletoe in cold environments, where deciduous trees such as oak wouldn't be present.
My DM treats it as basically a magic multivitamin, so if we go without water, we'll still dehydrate, and so long without food will still exhaust us, cause weight loss from starvation, and possibly die from refeeding syndrome when we do get some food again depending on how long it's been.
Because that's basically how it works. People just seem to think "nourishment" means being fed, in reality you still need calories and water, you can't survive on just eating nutrients.
He’s fully within his right to rule it that way, but that is absolutely not how the spell works as it was intended or as it was written.
@@federicopalacios7439The dictionary definition of nourishment is literally “the food necessary for growth, health, and good condition.” What are you on about?
@@federicopalacios7439 Take it up with oxford dictionary then, galaxy-brain
@@federicopalacios7439No, it's a problem with the spell description, because "Nourishment" could be interpreted to be mutiple things. According to the definition of Nourishment, I think it's easy to say that it provides all needs provided by food and water, but you could easily rule that it only covers some.
Though honestly I like that it is up to interpretation, it can allow for survival mechanics in one game and be used for hand-waving the need to eat in another.
i had a dm that wanted to do survival aspects like this, but instead of doing something where goodberry consumes the material component, they started using a supplemental ruleset that would like. punish our characters for eating goodberries instead of full meals. as the druid player i felt severely nerfed by that because of how much i liked goodberry as a spell, and i think your idea with the consumed material would have made me feel a lot more satisfied. it feels fairer, letting me feel like a badass with goodberry still be the really cool spell that it is, but still requiring the foraging that a survival game thrives on
I think that’s a perfectly fine ruling in a survival campaign as long as it is mentioned up front. Either this, what was mentioned in the video, or outright banning it seems the only way to preserve that kind of campaign. The choice feels like it would depend on exactly what the DM was looking to do.
I quite like the way Pathfinder does it. At least how it limits it. Instead of creating the berries, it enchants the listed number of berries. Specifically, they must be freshly picked berries. And they're listed as the target. Not components. So they must be present.
The problem is, the way survival is handled in Dnd, that being with random encounters and weather, causes the party to almost require goodberry to survive. For example, our party was part of an expedition group sent out to explore the wilderness. We had a Sorcerer, a Bard, a Fighter, a barbarian, and a paladin.
We were into about 2 days, as in two rolls of the dice, from our Gm where we encountered a wolf and some deer at most, when our Gm rolled on the weather table, and got a blizzard. He rolled for severity and got a 10, which pretty much meant that travel was impossible and we were forced to hunker down to wait out the blizzard.
I supposed that WOTC intended a blizzard or storm to last, probably a day or so. But our Gm rolled for how long it would take to clear, which is a 1d4. He got a 4, that meant we had to spend 4 days hunkered down trying to not freeze to death and constantly rolling Con Saves. When it came time that the blizzard was over, we had to search for food and fire wood, which was hard since because of the heavy snowfall, that was now at disadvantage.
The day ended with us getting enough supplies to last he night, our GM rolled on the Weather Table. Another Blizzard. He rolled on how long it would last. Another 4 days. Our characters began to need to make con saves, and we were accumulating Exhaustion due to not eating or having a way to melt the snow and ice to drinking water. The weather cleared, and we decided we couldn't last much longer, so we decided like cowards we'd go back to down and accept the L. It was 2 days of travel to make it back, and our Gm rolled for weather, Another Blizzard. Another roll, 3 days this time.
We died from what was, basically, 15 minutes of bad luck rolling. That doesn't sound out of the ordinary, after all 15 minutes of bad rolls in a boss battle for example, or 15 minutes of bad rolls in a stealth mission, would get us killed. But nothing is more dissatisfying then dying to RNG weather, where you are literally forced to wait out your own death. And RNG weather is the exact problem with how Survival is handled in DNd. Because very few GM's ever have the patience to make a weather table that isn't borrowed from their Tomb of Annihilation module, but tweaked so that "Storm" is "Blizzard".
My sympathies, but things like this are *why* the DM exists in the first place- to say "y'know, my party just had to deal with 4 days of blizzard, how about I pretend I didn't just roll 4 more days of blizzard?"
This is why when I DM the dice aren't gods, I am.
Gotta be able to change shit for the players, not all the time. I'm not going to save them from death, unless it's a really shitty dumb unsatisfying death caused by random chance instead of their own dumb choices.
(If you punch a dragon in the snout you get what you get.)
I'd love to hear the entire tale of this adventure.
@Alien Alien If I could, I would.
Play conditions; the sign of a well seasoned DM.
Welcome to goodberry home of the good berry
moral of the story: do a session zero, and explain the premise of the campaign.
You ever tried eating all of your food as berries? You know what that does to your digestion? I made that joke as the ranger casting the spell but the DM loved it and made it the main limiting factor.
When he said that they went looking for mistletoe, I thought, "Ah, group suicide, that's a new one for DnD"
There is a way around that as well... If the druid plants spriglings all over his staff and casts druidcaft to make one grow... Adding "The staff has 1d10+5 seeds... On a 5, or 6, the sprig also creates an additional shoot" and the Staff of the Good Druid becomes a rather nice near-magical item to aid in survival, with a limited function so that it can be a failsafe to get them started.
That's pretty awesome!!! I think I'll start growing mistletoe in my hair or on my cloak...🤣🤣🤣🌳🌰🌳
@@Karina-Loves-Andreas I'd allow it as a DM, especially as a warforged druid.
Yes, if you alter the rules to add a way around that, you do, indeed, have a way around that. Not sure why you want to alter the rules to reintroduce a flaw you altered the rules to eliminate though.
The rules don't include that thought. Druid craft can "instantly make a flower blossom, a seed pod open, or a leaf bud bloom.
" This does not allow mistletoe to grow on a dead stick. Mistletoe is parasitic. It requires a living host.
@@seigeengine 1. Have you not heard the story of Moses, how the desert tribe he joined used to plant their staves into the ground and see which one bloomed to elect the next cheiftan? He asked the same thing only to have his staff bloom. Or plants out in the Australian outback that can be seen as dead for years of drout, only to become lively and green after a short rainy season?
2. The Staff if the Good Druid was not convinced just to one-up a DM's house rules, but actually to expand on the RAW lore and consider in what ways a druid's wooden staff differs from one wielded by an arcane spellcaster, to showcase their connection to nature in a way that only adds flavour text to the core build, giving it to a first level druid and saying that is how casting Goodberry works. In fact, in a non-survival style game, such a staff could even be classed a trinket equal to the Wand of Mending.
However, as this video DOES talk about a survival-based game, I tweeked it to stay on the lore points by quantifying the seeds and adding a limitation to it's reproduction as the DM with such a houserule would see this as a temporary relief.
3. If you would like quotes: PHB Druid intro - "Holding high a gnarled staff wreathed with holly...", PHB Druid, Sacred Plants and Wood - "Druids often use such plants as part of a spellcasting focus, incorporating lengths of oak or yew or sprigs of mistletoe."
So the concept is there in the RAW and not addressed in the house rule forbidding it. As an aside, the example quest did have a stock of supplies that would have made the group's start a lot easier if they had kept it, with what seems as more than 15 days worth of rations (maximum starting amount in my suggestion) and the ability to forage for more resources they would need anyways (chances higher than rolling a 5 or 6 to add one extra day of delay) and would STILL have to portion out such supplies just as they would have hunting.
So the Staff of the Good Druid neither breaks nor overrules the adventure, can be tweeked (like the DM rolls for new sprigs) to keep the struggle balanced (cause hunting checks is also at the mercy of the dice) and is just a fun beginner item that can make a character stand out and feel unique among all the other druids in the world without having to rely on the Inheritor's magical item to do so.
I get where he's coming from. It depends on what kind of game you want. I played Serpent's Skull (a game where you're dropped on a tropical island without supplies) three times as a dm. Two times, it was intense because the characters we all city folk, and didn't take as naturally to survival. One time, it was a druid and a ranger, and it was a totally different kind of game. Still really fun, but within two sessions the ranger and druid were planning to completely take over the island because (in their words) "we aren't trapped on the island, everything else on the island is trapped with us."
Goodberry only does food. Source: Crawford. DM's can rule that it does water too, but that's the houserule/optional/variant rule.
Norishment is norishment
@@100nodog No water is still death
It's pretty heavily implied that the reason water wasn't a problem wasn't todo with the spell but ALL THE MEGA FUCK TONS OF SNOW which they can melt and drink. That being said even if they were in a desert, hunting for water is just less interesting than hunting for food
Well, if they were in a snow-covered area, wouldn’t they just be able to melt snow for water? They’d have to find something to hold it in, but there is water all over in such places.
Create water? level 1 spell? 10 gallons...
I like the AD&D version of the spell.
It doesn't CREATE berries, but it does enchant ones you already have.
So its extra tasty and fills more?
@@kinamiya1
Turns a regular berry into a 1 HP filling berry.
But main point was, still requires finding the berries in the first place
AlmightyK yep its tastier and fills more :D
Good berry sounds like a nice spell for healing in a pinch
That's even more balanced
My druid always kept a pouch of Goodberries handy.
They're great for making friends.
Or for accidentally keeping a hostage alive for the ride.
Well, there's also create food and water.
Which is a third-level spell, meaning it's a lot more of a cost than good berry's first level.
There is also Fireball, which is a third level spell dealing 8d6 aoe damage on a dex save and 5th level Flame Strike dealing 8d6 aoe damage on a dex save with a smaller area.
Spells in D&D are not balanced compared to one another.
@@KommandoCraftLP my point was a third level spell slot is a greater cost than a first level spell slot, not trying to say good berry should be 3rd level or something.
Also worth noting is half of flame strike’s damage is radiant which is a much rarer resist/immunity and can hit creatures higher in the air. Likely not worth it, but still a tangible benefit and difference.
@@nimajneb8897 it is definitely true that Create Food and Water has a much higher cost than Goodberry, even if it doesn't have material components, but the important difference is, just as with my example of Fireball and Flame Strike, that it is unlikely for one PC to ever have the choice between the two. The two classes that are made for survival and would break such a situation anyways get Goodberry and Artificers, Clerics and Paladins get to create Food and Water.
There is also the (minor) difference between both spells that Create Food and Water grants you a free Create Water Spell that got upcast to third level, which the berries don't.
At fifth level, the party is probably going to have bigger fish to fry
I thought that was how the spell worked in the first place. Mistletoe berries aren't edible.
Thats why we homebrewed the "Sickness effect" where you cant sustain yourself for more than 3 days with it. After that you have to eat and drink normally for 3 days (or less, 1:1 ratio) to be able to get nourishment from the Goodberry again. Can still eat them for easy HP, but no nourishment comes when Sickness is active.
That way it gives enough time for everyone to focus on survival aspects and then switch to something else for a breather.
Maybe it's just me, but I'd make that ration 1:3, 1 day you can eat a good Berry and get nourishment, then you have to find regular food for 3 days (or maybe even more). It still feels powerful, very powerful. Maybe I'm being too harsh or something.
@@hotshowerh2o356 just a number easy to change up to everyones interest really. Just gotta find the optimal balance here for the group to keep them interested and challenged.
@@hotshowerh2o356 i think it depends on how hard you want survival to be apart of your campaign. so if you wanted it to be a main feature so you would want to increase the days in between when they can use good berry but if survival is just a minor aspect then just lower the amount of days.
Welcome to Good Berry, Home of the Good Berry , can i take your spell component?
The first rule about DM-ing or running your own campaign:
Steal other ideas.
That's the first rule for any creative endeavor, really.
Yeenoghu: "KILL AND EAT! KILL AND EAT! KILL AND EAT!"
Demogorgon: "Yeenoghu, eat a Goodberry."
Yeenoghu: "HUH WHY?"
Demogorgon: "Because when you get hungry you talk like a troll."
Yeenoghu: [transforms into balor] "thanks."
Narrator: "You're not you when you're hungry. Goodberry satisfies."
More likes are required.
Then Hethradiah kills Yeenoghu thanks to Aameul's clever Goodberry trick. lol
*collects a backpack full of mistletoe since it spreads like wildfire on trees*
And that's totally fine and why this change to the spell isn't as terrible as people thing. It actually gives the survival skill a purpose when looking for food as you can have the check affect how many usable "sprigs" you scrounge up.
Forget the old tavern, starting a campaign with a prison break is the best fucking idea I've ever heard! 😆 I'm _definitely_ gonna be stealing that!
It also forces the players to come up with a background, since I'd ask them to come up with a reason why their character was imprisoned in the first place.
It's win/win!
They tried to cross the border and walked right into the imperial ambush, same as the rest of us and that horse thief over there.
@@Shaderox there is no thief class, so it's definitely a horse rogue.
You could also start in the prison and have them figure out how to break out themselves.
The real spell that can ruin an entire playstyle:
Counterspell
Not it all the villains have counterspell as well. You both use your reactions to counterspell, the original spell goes off
@@duckshallrule6937 can't use a reaction on your turn in a round. not sure if this is RAW or not, but it's a rule i've implemented to make more sense.
@@alexandriariley5209 RAW says you can use a reaction whenever it's applicable, including your turn, and there's really nothing in the game *harmed* by that
I like it when my players use Counterspell.
@@duckshallrule6937 there is something harmed by that: the use of counterspell AND the suspension of disbelieve.
the reason you can cast counterspell with a reaction against other spells is because counterspell is something you can cast far quicker than any normal spell goes off.
so you see the mage casting a spell, but you can still finish off your counter before he is done casting. but how do you counter a counter? they are both equally fast to cast, and he had to start casting before you do, so he also is finished before you are, and also countered your spell before you can stop him. but the problems don't end there. how can you concentrate on casting counterspell, while you are in the middle of casting a spell right now? that would mean you are casting 2 spells at the same time.
counterspell is not counterable. anything else completely breaks everything.
What a wonderful series. As someone interested in fantasy but never played dnd (i play the same Red Wizard in every videogame) this makes dnd feel so accessible
Had a similar game once where the original premise was a mainland country was sending some colony ships out to a new land mass that had suddenly appeared in the ocean; no previous records, no known inhabitants, wasn't even supposed to be there. So our party gears up with the stuff we think we're going to need to our jobs on this new island: forge cleric had smithing tools and had dropped most of their starting gold into a forge setup to take over on the ship, artificer alchemist had a lab set etc.
So we end up shipwrecked and the DM reveals the actual campaign - a survival game where we need to build up a base, and eventually scour the coast line for all the stuff we originally thought we'd have. When the issue of Food came up, the party started talking about how we could try scouting the forest. While they were talking, my Trition Fighter with the Fisherman background wandered out into the waves, and came back half an hour later with a few days worth of fish on his spear.
I still come back to these comments to harvest salt.
RIGHT?!?!? why the fuck is everyone so against a nature survival setting?! fuck city settings where the characters fight humans and elves .... >>
I know, I just got here. What is everyone's problem with a survival setting? Fun things can still happen in a setting like this.
In my games city is a rare sight, walking around in a forest is interesting to a point
I would love to hear more about the plot of this campaign. Ive never been in a survival focused game like that and would love to be able to do so, or possibly run one such game.
1:32 I’ve visited this video hundreds of times, and this is the first time noticing Pickle Zee.
Same and ive been down in the comments before too didnt notice it either
Good Berry, the senzu bean of D&D
Unfortunately, when our DM tried to implement the houserule, our smartass druid *immediately* decided to start tending to a mistletoe plant in our cart.
So now several days of nothing but goodberry gives you the shits
Plants don't usually produce berrys daily unless more magic is involved, that sounds like someone who doesn't know how plants work...
When i rolled my dices for the weight of my druid when making the character, it was 100 kg and tall 1,62m.
I put in the background that he ate 10 good berries at once
@@slBrelaz 5e doesn't require mistletoe berries to work, just a sprig
@@Petsinwinter2 ahh fair. I looked up mistletoe and it seems to tend towards a lot of branches and leaves, so even with the requirements of sprig needing to be about 4 inches of length and have a decent amount of adornments you'd still be fine for a while (maybe a month or two?).
alternatively, you could do the opposite, d&d mre's, if you will
One setting I really loved was Dark Sun. The survival factor alone made the game super interesting in the fact that you may kill that monster, you may win the day, but the Athasian sun is still beating down on you. Water was worth more than metal in many cases and good characters can turn evil just for a single drink. Environmental hazards are awesome in DnD until a spell makes them trivial, then it just sucks.
This video is an example of quality DMing. Shaping the rules to fit the campaign, and working with the players to produce the most enjoyable experience. I bet that any sprigs of mistletoe they found were as precious as gold and when to use them was a very interesting choice.
Wow after all this time I *JUST* noticed Pickle Zee.
Goodberry is incredibly op in that kind of situation, but in most playthroughs its not worth picking up at all when there's so many better ones that fit most situations
That's honestly the biggest problem with it. It has no purpose other than to remove roleplay options and stakes from a situation.
I think it's super good in any game, you can just sell the food you get
If I could have one spell IRL, it would be GoodBerry.
i'd have speak with animals
I'd have Speak with Dead
@@erdrickx784 so you can have a blssoming career as a homicide detective
I'd have Wish...
Honestly i'd rather have Prestidigitation. No more cleaning. Everything tastes great. You can make people soil their own pants if they annoy you. Always cold pillow. Killer at parties for card tricks.
Prestidigitation is the best spell for irl, easily.
Wait, there's a non-demigod style playstyle in D&D?
Imagine not having at least a 17 in every saving throw. Could not be me
I just usually take the outlander background. You find enough food and water for five people provided the land has something to offer, no spell slot required most parties don’t reach ten people as is, and it gives you those opportunities to hunt and discover things.
Fisher Background lets you catch enough fish for 10 people every day
@@badideagenerator2315 yeah but not water and not if you’re anywhere but a body of water that can sustain fish. Outlander gives you both food and water as long as there’s any to be found.
Oh, wow. I could never imagine using goodberry in that way you describe as the presupposed canon. I've always seen it as transforming the berries you find into the goodberries, so of course it "consumes" the material *and* you can only create as many as you find normal berries to transmute instead of a fixed number. And the berries have to have been freshly picked within the past day. And I'm pretty sure the goodberries lose their magic if uneaten after 24 hours. The thing I would house rule, is that you can transmute poisonous berries instead of the source berries having to be eatable already, since that just makes more sense for an originally divine spell.
That is kinda how the spell USED to work.
In 3rd edition, the caster had to find fresh berries to make the spell work. If he could only find 5 berries, then that's the max number of Good berries he could get. If the caster couldn't find any berries, then he was right out of luck.
I think issue is under 5E's rules Goodberry will give you up to 10 berries for the price of one sprig of Mistletoe and a 1st lvl spell slot.
That means 4-5 man parties can stretch two days worth of nourishment out of one use of this spell if they cast it in the morning and eat the extra berries right before the spell wears off at the next sunrise. So no worries about starvation ever or need for characters to use their survival skills.
Only a set number of good berries huh?
*Laughs in druid craft.
The most irksome thing to me about goodberry is that Rangers are one of the two classes that gets it. It makes thematic sense at first blush, but people tend to choose Ranger because they want to be the one who goes and hunts for the party's dinner, and yet they are the very one who makes that skill obsolete.
Another optional rule addition:
"Although solely sustaining oneself off of goodberries is possible, it is not advised since eating them for more than three days in a row has a high chance of causing diarrhea and leading to dehydration. DC 10 Constitution saving throws every 2 hours or your character has diahrrea for the next fifteen minutes, every day after the third day of consuming goodberries increases the DC of the saving throw by 1"
Seriously nerfed the spell but it'll be hilarious.
At low levels my druid used to give out goodberries every morning as emergency heal from unconsciousness pills. There came a fight where we were getting wrecked and my kobold druid decided to panic cast goodberry again and EAT ALL 17 OF THEM. After the fight he vomited for a few hours and got sick for two days as he ate half a months worth of food in a single mouthful.
@@garret1930 I would just make it that eating goodberry for too long causes you to suffer from exhaustion. I would say "sustain for one day" does not mean it has all your nutritional needs. Just as if you were to try to eat chips every day, whilst you may feel full, you would eventually get very sick.
I hunt for the thrill, not for dinner. Besides, on an adventure, people usually run into a random encounter and I'd prefer to be with the group when that happens.
@@floofzykitty5072 the spell literally says it sustains your nutritional needs for a day
Gotta hate all these crappy takes in the comments section.
This was a nice and elegant fix, rather than something like “You get arbitrarily poisoned” “it was your fault for letting them play that class. You shouldn’t alter Spellcasting” or “You should just just going to softban the spell so your players feel like idiots for choosing it!”
Like seriously, it’s a nice fix that makes it so that good berry is a good spell that is still helpful in a survival setting, without changing it into combat only or removing it entirely.
Right? It's like "Oh, why slightly modify the game in a way that's super close to RAW when you could heavily modify the game by changing the function of/banning certain spells?" Not that those couldn't work, but I think this is a better solution.
Yeah this is a decent way to nerf it if you want a survival focus in your campaign. My last DM actually killed his last game by limiting the players too much with their spells. Good berry either turned to rotted food or raisins. Also ruled that alchemist jug would not work.
I mean, older editions had the spell IMBUE berries that you already have with magic to provide more nourishment, rather than make them just appear. You could use that as an alternative too.
It's so funny that people are mad about this slight alterations, but their alternative is an even more BRAZEN change that functionally changes what the spell is.
I actually am praying these dms don't find players like Jesus christ.
@@captaincapitalis1205 Why raisins? Why do people hate raisins? Raisins are good and have done nothing to earn being comparable to rotten food.
I like how this is actually animated, not 5 frames repeating over and over.
"It's much and it's honest work."
You talk about these awesome D&D games. You ever think of animating those? It would make for great story! But I can imagine it would require a lot of animation time.
good berry can sustain the tarasque
stale memes holy shit
Wait, when a Tarasque is satiated/full what happens?
Does it go back to sleep?
I’ve always ruled that “nutrition” doesn’t mean water. That’s he hydration. So water is still an issue
Water is technically nutrient though
In this situation it doesnt matter. Snow exists so dehydration is all but impossible
@@josephtheoracle3344 Still have to have fire to warm the snow up though; unless you're warming it up, getting your water from snow is a good way to die faster.
@@aaronsirkman8375 they had a sorcerer, they had a way to make fire, presitdiation can make a small fire
@@josephtheoracle3344 fun fact: eating snow actually dehydrate