I think it's more likely to be inconsistency rather than under clubbing. Amateurs know how far they can hit a club with their ideal strike on the ball, but they are much more likely not to get their ideal strike on the ball, which results in a short shot.
No question inconsistency plays a part too but is that because people are setting themselves unrealistic expectations on how far they hit the ball and so swing badly more often as a result and strike the ball poorly?
@@GolfingFocus currently, my approach miss is 26% short, 9% left, 6% right, 6% long. I can 100% say that the vast majority, probably 90-95%, of those that come up short are due to a bad strike. I know that on a normal swing, 81-82 mph, with a center strike that my 8 iron goes 149 yards in the air. If it misses short it’s because I hit it fat/thin/toe/hozel
@@jazzyjay4595 Do you think though any of those short shots can be due to you expecting to hit the 'center strike' more times than you do? Know it may be a chicken and egg but many pros I talk to feel amateurs are expecting to hit their 'best' yardage far too often and this pressure makes them hit bad shots more often than not. Stats seem to back this up but interested to hear your view.
@@GolfingFocus If I can chime in... My experiance is also poor ball striking causing the 'short' approach shots. Are you suggesting we should club for a miss hit? That sounds like insanity.
@@GolfingFocus I’m sure as an 8.3 HDCP, I may expect to hit the middle of the face too often. However, in my case, I know my stock swings pretty well. 7-8 out of 10 shots on a range/simulator with an 8 iron I can expect 148-150, and I can max hit it 157 if needed. If I club up on a 150 yard approach shot to consider not hitting the middle of the face and I hit my 7 iron anywhere near the middle of the face, I’m flying way past that flag. In some instances, where the flag is at the front, that’s a good thing. But a middle or back flag, that’s not a good thing.
I'm trusting the yardage on my Garmin watch and accept that I hit 7 iron about 142 yards (and I'm applying that to everything else too). Definitely hitting a few more greens
Feel this stat is misleading, in my experience and at the cost point I am playing, golf courses have to max out on the use of the available land which places the greens very adjacent to the the boundaries of the course, also tee boxes for the next hole need to be placed quite close to the green, trees, bushes and thick rough being used to protect the teeing up golfer from the over struck ball, in these circumstances playing short would be the percentage play, rather than risking OB penalty or playing from thick rough over bushes and trees
I agree. At my course, I'd say I can't think of one hole where I'd rather be long than short. For the most part I will play it with that in mind and never risk the long shot.
I use golf logix gps app on my phone. This has helped me more than anything in selecting to best club for the shot at hand. I used to select a club based on the best distance, for instance 7 iron 155 yards. When in reality I have a range between 145-155. With the app I see the range and select the most realistic club rather than the one I possibly could hit short.
Think you are absolutely spot on with this approach Shannon! 👍 Looking at the ranges you hit clubs seems undoubtedly to be the way to go and helps massively with choosing the correct club. Picking the club with the ‘range’ which gives you the most room for error and let’s you swing easily is the key and sounds like you’ve got that approach nailed here. Hope it continues to make a difference for the upcoming season!
Since I've been using a range finder, I know exactly how far that I'm trying to hit the ball and I can tell how far it flies when I'm hitting greens from the pitch mark and I can tell how far my clubs are rolling out (or not). So it has been a great tool of discovery for me in game conditions with game balls. The thing about golf is the game reveals all dishonesty. If you are honest with your yardage your game will improve. Mine sure did. Now, I've recently discovered the Decade approach and am rethinking my strategy of flying it at the pin all the time.
That's awesome. We're starting to take a detailed look at Decade also and aiming to have a video out on it soon. Would be great to hear how you are getting on with it too! 👍
The other problem I experience and also see in others is inconsistency for those 60 yards and less shots into the green. Taking a wedge may not necessarily be the best choice. I have come to realize that usually taking the straightest club you can get away with is the best choice. I have found out it can often be easier to chip an 8 iron rather than pitch with a wedge on short distances.
There's no doubt distance control from the shorter distances is a skill that takes a long time to get better at. One of the toughest aspects of the game.
Of course under clubbing is a big factor in things but what about the poor contact golfers make too, that would have to go in there as well. Cos out of that 40% short, at least 10% or 15% if not more would be caused by poor contact.
I agree with this. I use a Shotscope watch and I know how far I hit each club for real but I mis hit a fair number of shots and thus miss short a lot. Taking an extra club gives me a pretty good chance of being off the back of greens or having a difficult chip onto a sloping green or a long downhill putt which has its own consequences.
I keep a little “cheat sheet” on my trolley which lists all my carry and rollout yardages for each club based on Trackman data. I have two sets, one for warm summer weather and one for cold weather and the differences are big!
@@GolfingFocus Well, I don’t know about you but I’m not great at remembering my yardages for 13 clubs, especially when I have four wedges and utilise three different swing lengths for them!
Great video. Shared with my family of golfer Curious of arcos numbers exclude distances when using a Pw for pitching, 3/4 shots, flubbed shots etc? I suppose over 6 million swings it does not make a difference. I was amazed at the 40% short number. As my handicap came down below 10 , my missed shifted from short to left-although I hit more greens by taking more lessons and more club. Since most clubs are designed to where you want to be short vs. long, the 8:1 ratio was ee opening, /when I am between clubs his weekend, I know which iron I will be taking!
Arccos says their distances are 'smart distances' from which they remove the big outliers - fluffs etc - but hopefully as you say the large sample size makes the figures pretty reliable.
I think the replies prove the point Adam Scott when asked the same question said the 2 biggest mistakes amateurs make are under clubbing and expectation never practice and think they should hit every shot perfect
Thanks Derek and didn't know Adam Scott had said that. Seems to be a common theme from pros who have played with amateurs in pro ams. The expectation point is also a big one I think. I'm massively guilty of it myself and seem to think on occasion because I saw Seve Ballesteros play a miraculous shot out of the trees once I can do the same!
The penalty for landing short is usually far less severe than going long, so all people will usually err on the short side unless it’s a hole where you have to carry a hazard right to the green. Golf courses are designed to encourage you to err on the short side.
I'm just not sure the stats back this up or that all golfers are necessarily skilled enough to be deliberately leaving it short as often as they do because they are worried about trouble long. Saw this posted on Lou Stagner's Twitter feed a few days ago which think continues to back this up - "Received this from a tour pro that was stationed on a par 3 at a charity event: Hit tee shots on a par 3 today: 135-yards into 10-15mph wind, Pin was in front, There were 105 amateurs, 100 were short of pin, 9 hit the green" That's a lot of golfers short of the pin for it not be statistically relevant as a mistake.
@@GolfingFocus It’s probably more than one thing going on. Most people I know overestimate their distance for example. But, there’s no doubt that you have fairway short of the green on most holes, but severe rough and penalty areas long. That has to factor in I think.
@@polarbear4612 Absolutely agreed there is more than one thing going on for sure. I'm now going to start paying attention also about where the trouble is on the courses I play now to try and see if we can analyse this a bit more. I'm still not convinced amateurs play deliberately short consistently because they are so conscious of not going over the back but you may be right. Will try and see if there are any stats on this too.
Great numbers , as to why most golfers in particular Amateurs golfers may hit it short could be the reason on many occasions I hit to the front of the greens from a distance, Firstly,Hazards. Very rarely if ever will you find a bunker in the front of a green, mostly on the sides and and back, easier to chip on to a green from the front and get close than to get out of bunkers and get close, secondly elevated greens,miss the green long or wide you then may have to chip it back on to a green running to the front,as all green have drainage slopes ,most to the front.But when a close shot ,got to have a go,that the fun part.
Many thanks Dennis and glad you enjoyed the video. Take your points but I’m not entirely convinced a lot of amateurs play short deliberately for the reasons you give. I certainly for one don’t put as much thought into my approach shots as I should with the corresponding poor results!
I use Arccos and I pick the correct club. However, I will end up either fat or top the golf ball, so distance ends up short. Don't think that has anything to do with club selection.
@@SarahSG1 But isn't club selection a lot of the time based on an amateur's best shot rather than their stock shot? By consistently thinking/assuming they will hit their club their max distance they then hit it fat or top it because they are not playing 'comfortable'?
I use Shotscope so I know my yardages but I still missed 40% of greens short. The problem was that I took my performance average distance and used that distance to the flag. The problem is that my dispersion is big short and long. What I will do this year is add another 5 to 10 yards beyond the flag. That way good strikes will be long and mishits will still catch the front of the green. I think I can hit 20% more greens this way. I learned this using a golf simulator that showed dispersion circles. I could see that good strikes were pin high but half my misses were short of the green.
Great approach and definitely the way to do things looking at ranges rather than averages. Take a look at Scott Fawcett’s DECADE program if you haven’t already. What a lot of the top pros are now following and they are doing exactly the same thing. Fascinating listening to Fawcett how much even the best players are guessing a bit when it comes to yardages and as a result basing your club on your dispersion pattern is a big potential win!
@@GolfingFocus Agreed. You take a hit to the ego when you recognize that your “yardage” for a given club really should be almost 10 yards shorter than your good strikes but I believe this change alone could lower your handicap by several strokes. When I miss greens I get up and down maybe 30 to 40% of the time. When I hit greens I’ll two putt at least 90% of the time.
@@motodiaries8204 couldn’t agree more. Amazing how many argue against on this though and say the stats are wrong because people are deliberately hitting it short what with being wary of trouble over the back!
@@GolfingFocus There is an element of that in my mind too. Over the back is often really bad in the courses I play. But I’ve found on my simulator that you can overshoot the pin and get a lot more balls in the front of the green while rarely going over the back. You could also take a little off your full swing and still reach the pin almost all the time. The simulator really opened my eyes to all of this. The dispersion circles make it so clear what is happening. I used to think of my clubs as a set of discrete distances. Now I know they’re really very overlapping circles.
@@motodiaries8204 Awesome and believe you are absolutely spot on with this dispersion circles approach. Totally ties in with Scott Fawcett's DECADE program and what all the pros are learning now from an early age. Hope you continue to find success with it!👍
Are you sure players aren't intentionally leaving their shots short? You can usually see dangers from the front but you see next to nothing behind the green. Another thing to consider is that shorter clubs are easier to hit. I am much more comfortable with an 8 than 7, 7 than 6, and and so on. Combining the two effects, it shouldn't come as a surprise that people would be more inclined to leave it short. A simple way to check is to filter out longer approach shots and focus on shorter shots. This follows because both effects I mentioned are less pronounced at shorter distance. Personally I DO intentionally under-club. It is a conscious decision in a lot of cases. This is not to say that I never miss it short occasionally. But that is usually a mishit, a toe strike or fatting. Hitting it heavy usually leaves it short by default. FWIW I am around 12 handicap.
It's a popular view definitely Kirati but I'm still just not convinced the skill set of the golfers analysed in this data all have the ability to consciously leave their shots short. That's not to denegrade golfers and their ability but I struggle to believe there is that level of control of iron shots to achieve this to a statistically significant degree. I may of course be proved wrong but I do believe players more often than not either don't take enough club or strike it poorly to leave the ball short more often than not.
I suffer from "Pullitus". I can't remember ever seeing the right side of a golf course. I've been trying to correct it for 45 years, in another 45 years I'm sure I will have it figured out.
I saw an interview with John Daly where he said the biggest mistake he sees in amateur golfers is not using enough club on approach shots. Looks like he knew what he was saying.
Knowing your distances is a massive plus Daniel 👍. Puts you well ahead of a lot of golfers in our view especially given the number of people who have an unrealistic view of how far they hit the ball.
I think I make this mistake because I'm more comfortable with the shorter irons so I default to a higher percentage chance of hitting it "well" which usually lands short or a mishit anyway. More argument for working on the longer club approach game so clubbing up comes with confidence.
Definitely worth trying the longer club approach as unfortunately the stats are also clear that you need to keep hitting the ball further to make big impacts on your score.
Surely you are overlooking the fact that a few golfers may deliberately underclub to avoid a deep greenside bunker,and I often choose this option rather than risk a nasty sand shot. I'd sooner face a short 15 yard pitch,from the fairway, than leave a similar distance out of the bunker,perhaps on the down slope Unlike pros,we don't have the opportunity to practice our sand shots for hours every day.
Not sure I agree that lots of golfers deliberately underclub. Abilities are so variable and the game so difficult it just doesn't seem statistically feasible that the majority of amateur golfers would be in such control of their distances to ensure they are coming up short more often than not because they choose to.
Inconsistency has a lot to do practice. Normally our range swing hits the ball further and straighter compared to in round swings. First your repeatedly hitting a specific club under ideal lies with a far more consistent ball position and level footing meaning your ideally in balance with far less effort then on the course. Many ranges distances markers are inaccurate which isn’t optimal for a reliable distance averaging for each club. Take that false knowledge onto the course plus wind/moisture and undulations it’s vary obvious why club selection affects our scores. My problem isn’t correct club selection it’s ball positions that creep around affecting my trajectory and ultimately attack angle.
Great point Alan. Making sure your practice is 'purposeful' is key and can be a difficult thing to do at the range. Practice doesn't make perfect as they say but in reality practice makes permanent so you have to make sure you're working on the right things so you're not just ingraining more bad habits!
Imagine hitting the same club 82 times in one round. And 25 of those shots were putting. Also won a $100 on a bet that I could beat some dude with only one club. Guy almost had a heart attack.
Around my course nearly all the trouble is long rather than short. Pros have lines of spectators to stop long balls where as we just have out of bounds, thick rough etc.
Being short of the flag generally means and uphill putt or an easy chip with a good lie. If you go over the green then you generally have a worse lie, a shot up over a hill onto a green that runs away from you. Hence being short is better than being long.
"Under clubbing" or simply bad ball striking that ends short? How are greens factored that have penalty areas long and sand traps on both sides of the green? If we were all professional ball strikers this would make sense. But the don't show me hitting a 4-iron fat from 175 yards out that ends 30 yards from the green. Play the game your best every time and don't worry about this advice.
There's no doubt Jeff that there will be bad ball striking elements to this but don't think this can explain all the difference in the 'errors' amateurs make. You're absolutely right also that the goal is to play your best every time and hopefully taking account of some guidelines such as to 'play comfy' and try and not assume you will hit your chosen your iron the maximum distance every time helps to do that.
(Golf.com) What is the most common swing fault or game-management mistake you see among average golfers? (Lee Trevino, 6-time major winner) "They never take enough club. They take a 9-iron for a hero shot and don’t realize if you swing harder, the ball is going shorter, because you have more spin."
Also, I use a good app now called precision pro, and that lets me keep a record of when I have no shot at the GiR, and that number is higher for me than short of green. I've traded one problem for another 🙄
That's a great stat to track David and absolutely key. Keeping the ball in play off the tee and giving yourself some sort of shot into the green irrespective of whether its from the fairway or rough will bring your scores down for sure!
I think that stat is a bit misleading - it depends on the intent of the golfer. If the green is inaccessible, small, undulated or for some other reason, makes it the better shot from a course management perspective to come up short, that would not get factored into this stat. I suspect if you could take out the outliers it would still be a significant number, but not that high.
It’s a fair point Alan and suspect there will be a good few outliers in there. Still think as you say though it would still show the coming up short as the ‘majority’ error compared to the others.
@@GolfingFocus Oh I do agree. In many cases it's the old, picking a club based on how far it should go or based on a perfect shot, versus what you can really get from a club based on a normal smooth swing. A lot of golfers have these weird egos when it comes to club distances. Once you get to be a senior golfer, you tend to wise up, put the ego aside and start to play smart.
@alan. yes agree, this data compares golfers against the fictitious standard of PAR or scratch golfer and doesn't show the real course situation. For instance at my course there are 4 holes 370m to 400m (400 to 440 yrd) par 4 's that cannot I cannot reach in 2 shots,(I hit my driver 200m on average (220yrds) so may strategy is to play theses as 3 shot holes.(i get a handicap shot on them anyway so 5 is a good score). (If I play them as 3 shot holes I am on 85% of time for 3 but 100% of time short for 2) There are also 2 tricky long par 3's where it dead over back and other has a big swale green where if hit on front 3 putt, vs hitting short and chipping close, my coach has said hit short and chip close for a par.(get a shot on one of them) . not to mention holes into wind where short is best and rely on a chip and putt will give a par. If i was to take arcross stats it would show minimum of 50% short based on lay up alone.- however if I adopt a Nett GIR I am up around 10 to 11 NGIR and not short at all.(my handicap is 9.1) I see a lot of players I play with come up short because they hit it fat rather than just under club.
@@geoffcohen613 A couple of good examples and good point on the fat shot too. That's one thing about data, it can be interpreted in more than one way. It also does not take into account that a lot of courses are designed to have trouble if you go over the greens - at least I know some I play are, but are more inviting to hitting short. I get the left and right, but not so much the short shots. That said I do agree with the overall concept of selecting the appropriate club based on your skill level versus what distances you should get or others get - play your own game.
Underclubbing is not my problem. Hitting right or left is. I intentionally come up short so I can chip up straight to the pin. I make fewer mistakes with a 52 degree than I do with a mid iron approach. Sorry to disagree but short works to keep me in the fairway.
Each to their own Bill and if you think something works for you and leads to lower scores then crack on. My only query though is that if you’re deliberately not going for the green with 2nd shots and always aiming to be short of the green then arent you never giving yourself a chance to hit the green in regulation? Apologies if I’m misunderstanding your strategy though.
@@GolfingFocus your point is well taken about reducing my chances to get on the green, but I just don’t have the skill to approach with that kind of accuracy. I would rather take a par or bogey than get a double or triple , even if the off chance of a birdie came with a perfect shot.
Did you speak to them or are you making an assumption? I come up short on purpose since shirt is better than long in the majority of cases. When I say short I mean less than 5yds.
This is really annoying and shows that the amateur and professional games are very different: 1) Amateurs play on courses that usually have an apron entrance to the greens, but jungle behind them. If we lose the ball behind the green, a) we do not have marshalls, members of the public and tv cameras to help us find the ball; and b) as we do not have sponsors, a lost ball costs us money; 2) Amateurs do not have the power or skill to hit the ball very high with backspin, which professional players do all the time. They can stop a ball on a green; we cannot. This article is a classic case of treating statistics as gospel, instead of making the intellectual effort to interpret the data with more sophistication and understanding of the reasons for the difference. Amateurs, as the name says, play the game for fun; professionals play it for a living: it is their work. There is no fun in spending half an afternoon searching for the ball, then hacking it out of the undergrowth. In few amateur games does the score matter to the extent of not being able to feed your family, so it makes more sense to hit the ball short to a playable part of the fairway (or apron) and then chip, or even putt, it on. Professionals appear to prefer their shortest short to be about 100+ yards from which distance they can make the ball bounce, bounce and then stop beside the hole: magic if you can do it: we can't. In conclusion, please stop bullying us about the 'mistakes' that we make by comparison with your lofty standards; instead, you could try to show us the golf etiquette of either leaving us alone or trying to understand why our game is different from yours. Thank you.
This video is terrible advice. There many holes that hitting it long is much worse than short. Good course management requires that your good shots are on target but your misses aren't in jail. Most golf courses don't have sand, water or hazards just short of the green.
It’s a fair point Marvin about good course management and making sure your misses are ‘good’ ones. Not sure I’m convinced though all the amateurs who hit consistently short at the moment according to the stats do so for ‘strategic’ reasons. Former world no.1 golfers who have played in 1000+ pro ams also doesn’t seem convinced!
What part of you, yes even you pro, leave 40% of your shots short don't you get? the point of the video is not for you to hit 40% of your shots long over the green. The point is, pay attention and accept how far u really carry the ball with every club.
sorry, to say that being short has nothing to do with swing is just wrong--------the average golfer doesn't hit the ball flush, hence they're short on their approach. Being short is as much due to inconsistent swing as it is with not knowing your true distance------the average (16 handicap) has NO true distance but massive swing flaws
100% agreed Al that the quality of the ball striking has something to do with but don't think it's right either to say it's all to do with ball striking. Not sure either why a 16 handicapper shouldn't know their true distances? If they play within their comfort zone and can't see why they can't get their dispersion right down as a lot of the problems all standards of golfers face is trying to hit shots they either haven't practiced or can't hit consistently.
@@GolfingFocus thanks for the response-------your main point about taking more club for the average golfer is indisputable in terms of maximizing your score but it's kind of sad to see the however infrequent flushed shot go sailing over the green
@@GolfingFocus would really be interesting to have stats on handicap correlation to frequency of being short on approaches------I coach a talented high school team(Langley HS in Northern Va), 6 straight state championships, and the better the player the greater the frequency of going too long
@@alberg6290 Very interesting question and one I don't have the answer to at the moment unfortunately. I'll do some digging though and see what I can find out! As a matter of interest also how often are the players re-calibrating their yardages as they improve?
Yep. I’m the only person out of EVERYONE I PLAY WITH that goes long just as often as coming up short. Basically, their ego keeps them from playing good golf. It’s mind blowing to me. lol
Stop saying "AHH" - "ERR" - "AND AHH". Very distracting and sounds nervous and lacking confidence . 1. Slow your speech - every word 2. Every time you feel yourself about to "AHH", replace it with silence. Surprisingly quick and easy to master. You need to feel like you are speaking very very slow and much more concise - pronounce every individual word. Video yourself and get other people's opinions. Cheers, Michael 🇦🇺
I think it's more likely to be inconsistency rather than under clubbing. Amateurs know how far they can hit a club with their ideal strike on the ball, but they are much more likely not to get their ideal strike on the ball, which results in a short shot.
No question inconsistency plays a part too but is that because people are setting themselves unrealistic expectations on how far they hit the ball and so swing badly more often as a result and strike the ball poorly?
@@GolfingFocus currently, my approach miss is 26% short, 9% left, 6% right, 6% long. I can 100% say that the vast majority, probably 90-95%, of those that come up short are due to a bad strike. I know that on a normal swing, 81-82 mph, with a center strike that my 8 iron goes 149 yards in the air. If it misses short it’s because I hit it fat/thin/toe/hozel
@@jazzyjay4595 Do you think though any of those short shots can be due to you expecting to hit the 'center strike' more times than you do? Know it may be a chicken and egg but many pros I talk to feel amateurs are expecting to hit their 'best' yardage far too often and this pressure makes them hit bad shots more often than not. Stats seem to back this up but interested to hear your view.
@@GolfingFocus If I can chime in... My experiance is also poor ball striking causing the 'short' approach shots.
Are you suggesting we should club for a miss hit? That sounds like insanity.
@@GolfingFocus I’m sure as an 8.3 HDCP, I may expect to hit the middle of the face too often. However, in my case, I know my stock swings pretty well. 7-8 out of 10 shots on a range/simulator with an 8 iron I can expect 148-150, and I can max hit it 157 if needed. If I club up on a 150 yard approach shot to consider not hitting the middle of the face and I hit my 7 iron anywhere near the middle of the face, I’m flying way past that flag. In some instances, where the flag is at the front, that’s a good thing. But a middle or back flag, that’s not a good thing.
I'm trusting the yardage on my Garmin watch and accept that I hit 7 iron about 142 yards (and I'm applying that to everything else too). Definitely hitting a few more greens
Feel this stat is misleading, in my experience and at the cost point I am playing, golf courses have to max out on the use of the available land which places the greens very adjacent to the the boundaries of the course, also tee boxes for the next hole need to be placed quite close to the green, trees, bushes and thick rough being used to protect the teeing up golfer from the over struck ball, in these circumstances playing short would be the percentage play, rather than risking OB penalty or playing from thick rough over bushes and trees
I agree. At my course, I'd say I can't think of one hole where I'd rather be long than short. For the most part I will play it with that in mind and never risk the long shot.
Agreed, at my local course all but one of the holes have card wreckers past the green and inconveniences short of them.
Love your analytical point of view great videos that will make every golfer better
Many thanks for the feedback. Is much appreciated! 👊
I use golf logix gps app on my phone. This has helped me more than anything in selecting to best club for the shot at hand. I used to select a club based on the best distance, for instance 7 iron 155 yards. When in reality I have a range between 145-155. With the app I see the range and select the most realistic club rather than the one I possibly could hit short.
Think you are absolutely spot on with this approach Shannon! 👍 Looking at the ranges you hit clubs seems undoubtedly to be the way to go and helps massively with choosing the correct club. Picking the club with the ‘range’ which gives you the most room for error and let’s you swing easily is the key and sounds like you’ve got that approach nailed here. Hope it continues to make a difference for the upcoming season!
Since I've been using a range finder, I know exactly how far that I'm trying to hit the ball and I can tell how far it flies when I'm hitting greens from the pitch mark and I can tell how far my clubs are rolling out (or not). So it has been a great tool of discovery for me in game conditions with game balls. The thing about golf is the game reveals all dishonesty. If you are honest with your yardage your game will improve. Mine sure did.
Now, I've recently discovered the Decade approach and am rethinking my strategy of flying it at the pin all the time.
That's awesome. We're starting to take a detailed look at Decade also and aiming to have a video out on it soon. Would be great to hear how you are getting on with it too! 👍
The other problem I experience and also see in others is inconsistency for those 60 yards and less shots into the green. Taking a wedge may not necessarily be the best choice. I have come to realize that usually taking the straightest club you can get away with is the best choice. I have found out it can often be easier to chip an 8 iron rather than pitch with a wedge on short distances.
There's no doubt distance control from the shorter distances is a skill that takes a long time to get better at. One of the toughest aspects of the game.
I do not underclub! I simply cannot hit the ball far enough.
😂
Of course under clubbing is a big factor in things but what about the poor contact golfers make too, that would have to go in there as well. Cos out of that 40% short, at least 10% or 15% if not more would be caused by poor contact.
I was thinking the same thing.
90%
I agree with this. I use a Shotscope watch and I know how far I hit each club for real but I mis hit a fair number of shots and thus miss short a lot. Taking an extra club gives me a pretty good chance of being off the back of greens or having a difficult chip onto a sloping green or a long downhill putt which has its own consequences.
I keep a little “cheat sheet” on my trolley which lists all my carry and rollout yardages for each club based on Trackman data. I have two sets, one for warm summer weather and one for cold weather and the differences are big!
That is awesome Doug! I wouldn't call it a 'cheat sheet' though. I would call it a 'brilliant sheet' that we should all follow as an example!
@@GolfingFocus Well, I don’t know about you but I’m not great at remembering my yardages for 13 clubs, especially when I have four wedges and utilise three different swing lengths for them!
I’ll remember this advice for when I learn how to hit the ball straight lol
Great video. Shared with my family of golfer Curious of arcos numbers exclude distances when using a Pw for pitching, 3/4 shots, flubbed shots etc? I suppose over 6 million swings it does not make a difference. I was amazed at the 40% short number. As my handicap came down below 10 , my missed shifted from short to left-although I hit more greens by taking more lessons and more club. Since most clubs are designed to where you want to be short vs. long, the 8:1 ratio was ee opening, /when I am between clubs his weekend, I know which iron I will be taking!
Arccos says their distances are 'smart distances' from which they remove the big outliers - fluffs etc - but hopefully as you say the large sample size makes the figures pretty reliable.
I think the replies prove the point Adam Scott when asked the same question said the 2 biggest mistakes amateurs make are under clubbing and expectation never practice and think they should hit every shot perfect
Thanks Derek and didn't know Adam Scott had said that. Seems to be a common theme from pros who have played with amateurs in pro ams. The expectation point is also a big one I think. I'm massively guilty of it myself and seem to think on occasion because I saw Seve Ballesteros play a miraculous shot out of the trees once I can do the same!
The penalty for landing short is usually far less severe than going long, so all people will usually err on the short side unless it’s a hole where you have to carry a hazard right to the green.
Golf courses are designed to encourage you to err on the short side.
I'm just not sure the stats back this up or that all golfers are necessarily skilled enough to be deliberately leaving it short as often as they do because they are worried about trouble long. Saw this posted on Lou Stagner's Twitter feed a few days ago which think continues to back this up - "Received this from a tour pro that was stationed on a par 3 at a charity event: Hit tee shots on a par 3 today: 135-yards into 10-15mph wind, Pin was in front, There were 105 amateurs, 100 were short of pin, 9 hit the green" That's a lot of golfers short of the pin for it not be statistically relevant as a mistake.
@@GolfingFocus It’s probably more than one thing going on. Most people I know overestimate their distance for example.
But, there’s no doubt that you have fairway short of the green on most holes, but severe rough and penalty areas long. That has to factor in I think.
@@polarbear4612 Absolutely agreed there is more than one thing going on for sure. I'm now going to start paying attention also about where the trouble is on the courses I play now to try and see if we can analyse this a bit more. I'm still not convinced amateurs play deliberately short consistently because they are so conscious of not going over the back but you may be right. Will try and see if there are any stats on this too.
Great numbers , as to why most golfers in particular Amateurs golfers may hit it short could be the reason on many occasions I hit to the front of the greens from a distance, Firstly,Hazards. Very rarely if ever will you find a bunker in the front of a green, mostly on the sides and and back, easier to chip on to a green from the front and get close than to get out of bunkers and get close, secondly elevated greens,miss the green long or wide you then may have to chip it back on to a green running to the front,as all green have drainage slopes ,most to the front.But when a close shot ,got to have a go,that the fun part.
Many thanks Dennis and glad you enjoyed the video. Take your points but I’m not entirely convinced a lot of amateurs play short deliberately for the reasons you give. I certainly for one don’t put as much thought into my approach shots as I should with the corresponding poor results!
@@GolfingFocus Thanks for your reply.
I use Arccos and I pick the correct club. However, I will end up either fat or top the golf ball, so distance ends up short. Don't think that has anything to do with club selection.
@@SarahSG1 But isn't club selection a lot of the time based on an amateur's best shot rather than their stock shot? By consistently thinking/assuming they will hit their club their max distance they then hit it fat or top it because they are not playing 'comfortable'?
Good video, I figured this out and started using longer clubs
That's great Guy and glad you enjoyed the video!
Carry vs total?
I use Shotscope so I know my yardages but I still missed 40% of greens short. The problem was that I took my performance average distance and used that distance to the flag. The problem is that my dispersion is big short and long. What I will do this year is add another 5 to 10 yards beyond the flag. That way good strikes will be long and mishits will still catch the front of the green. I think I can hit 20% more greens this way. I learned this using a golf simulator that showed dispersion circles. I could see that good strikes were pin high but half my misses were short of the green.
Great approach and definitely the way to do things looking at ranges rather than averages. Take a look at Scott Fawcett’s DECADE program if you haven’t already. What a lot of the top pros are now following and they are doing exactly the same thing. Fascinating listening to Fawcett how much even the best players are guessing a bit when it comes to yardages and as a result basing your club on your dispersion pattern is a big potential win!
@@GolfingFocus Agreed. You take a hit to the ego when you recognize that your “yardage” for a given club really should be almost 10 yards shorter than your good strikes but I believe this change alone could lower your handicap by several strokes. When I miss greens I get up and down maybe 30 to 40% of the time. When I hit greens I’ll two putt at least 90% of the time.
@@motodiaries8204 couldn’t agree more. Amazing how many argue against on this though and say the stats are wrong because people are deliberately hitting it short what with being wary of trouble over the back!
@@GolfingFocus There is an element of that in my mind too. Over the back is often really bad in the courses I play. But I’ve found on my simulator that you can overshoot the pin and get a lot more balls in the front of the green while rarely going over the back. You could also take a little off your full swing and still reach the pin almost all the time. The simulator really opened my eyes to all of this. The dispersion circles make it so clear what is happening. I used to think of my clubs as a set of discrete distances. Now I know they’re really very overlapping circles.
@@motodiaries8204 Awesome and believe you are absolutely spot on with this dispersion circles approach. Totally ties in with Scott Fawcett's DECADE program and what all the pros are learning now from an early age. Hope you continue to find success with it!👍
Are you sure players aren't intentionally leaving their shots short? You can usually see dangers from the front but you see next to nothing behind the green. Another thing to consider is that shorter clubs are easier to hit. I am much more comfortable with an 8 than 7, 7 than 6, and and so on. Combining the two effects, it shouldn't come as a surprise that people would be more inclined to leave it short. A simple way to check is to filter out longer approach shots and focus on shorter shots. This follows because both effects I mentioned are less pronounced at shorter distance. Personally I DO intentionally under-club. It is a conscious decision in a lot of cases. This is not to say that I never miss it short occasionally. But that is usually a mishit, a toe strike or fatting. Hitting it heavy usually leaves it short by default. FWIW I am around 12 handicap.
It's a popular view definitely Kirati but I'm still just not convinced the skill set of the golfers analysed in this data all have the ability to consciously leave their shots short. That's not to denegrade golfers and their ability but I struggle to believe there is that level of control of iron shots to achieve this to a statistically significant degree. I may of course be proved wrong but I do believe players more often than not either don't take enough club or strike it poorly to leave the ball short more often than not.
I just play with a 3 iron and 2 balls. No wait, three. I only need one golf ball for the round. Just shot my first 82 with just a three iron.
Seve would have been delighted with you trying that!
I suffer from "Pullitus". I can't remember ever seeing the right side of a golf course. I've been trying to correct it for 45 years, in another 45 years I'm sure I will have it figured out.
Unfortunately golf is a maddening game Paul. I suffer from Hookitus myself and like you don't think I'll ever change it!
I saw an interview with John Daly where he said the biggest mistake he sees in amateur golfers is not using enough club on approach shots. Looks like he knew what he was saying.
If I could be as accurate as John, I would hit more club too. However my last name is not Daly.
Hmmmm for once I fall into the realistic category because my 5 iron goes around 170, 7 iron 150 and pw 120
Knowing your distances is a massive plus Daniel 👍. Puts you well ahead of a lot of golfers in our view especially given the number of people who have an unrealistic view of how far they hit the ball.
I think I make this mistake because I'm more comfortable with the shorter irons so I default to a higher percentage chance of hitting it "well" which usually lands short or a mishit anyway.
More argument for working on the longer club approach game so clubbing up comes with confidence.
Definitely worth trying the longer club approach as unfortunately the stats are also clear that you need to keep hitting the ball further to make big impacts on your score.
Surely you are overlooking the fact that a few golfers may deliberately underclub to avoid a deep greenside bunker,and I often choose this option rather than risk a nasty sand shot. I'd sooner face a short 15 yard pitch,from the fairway, than leave a similar distance out of the bunker,perhaps on the down slope Unlike pros,we don't have the opportunity to practice our sand shots for hours every day.
Not sure I agree that lots of golfers deliberately underclub. Abilities are so variable and the game so difficult it just doesn't seem statistically feasible that the majority of amateur golfers would be in such control of their distances to ensure they are coming up short more often than not because they choose to.
Inconsistency has a lot to do practice. Normally our range swing hits the ball further and straighter compared to in round swings. First your repeatedly hitting a specific club under ideal lies with a far more consistent ball position and level footing meaning your ideally in balance with far less effort then on the course. Many ranges distances markers are inaccurate which isn’t optimal for a reliable distance averaging for each club. Take that false knowledge onto the course plus wind/moisture and undulations it’s vary obvious why club selection affects our scores.
My problem isn’t correct club selection it’s ball positions that creep around affecting my trajectory and ultimately attack angle.
Great point Alan. Making sure your practice is 'purposeful' is key and can be a difficult thing to do at the range. Practice doesn't make perfect as they say but in reality practice makes permanent so you have to make sure you're working on the right things so you're not just ingraining more bad habits!
@Golfing Focus
Practice makes permanent! Ain’t hat the truth. 😵💫
Great advice, as I return to golf after a 20 year absence it will be one of the first things I'll be working on!
Delighted you found it useful and hope you have an enjoyable return to the game after all these years!
Imagine hitting the same club 82 times in one round. And 25 of those shots were putting. Also won a $100 on a bet that I could beat some dude with only one club. Guy almost had a heart attack.
Around my course nearly all the trouble is long rather than short. Pros have lines of spectators to stop long balls where as we just have out of bounds, thick rough etc.
Being short of the flag generally means and uphill putt or an easy chip with a good lie. If you go over the green then you generally have a worse lie, a shot up over a hill onto a green that runs away from you. Hence being short is better than being long.
Correction: differences is club head speed and smash factor.
club up and swing easy?
I don’t hit it short because I’m under clubbing. I hit it short because my contact sucks 😂
It's definitely a combination of the two for a lot of people!
Most of that is probably ego club choice. I'd have expected "over the top" to be the #1 amateur mistake
"Under clubbing" or simply bad ball striking that ends short? How are greens factored that have penalty areas long and sand traps on both sides of the green? If we were all professional ball strikers this would make sense. But the don't show me hitting a 4-iron fat from 175 yards out that ends 30 yards from the green. Play the game your best every time and don't worry about this advice.
There's no doubt Jeff that there will be bad ball striking elements to this but don't think this can explain all the difference in the 'errors' amateurs make. You're absolutely right also that the goal is to play your best every time and hopefully taking account of some guidelines such as to 'play comfy' and try and not assume you will hit your chosen your iron the maximum distance every time helps to do that.
(Golf.com) What is the most common swing fault or game-management mistake you see among average golfers? (Lee Trevino, 6-time major winner) "They never take enough club. They take a 9-iron for a hero shot and don’t realize if you swing harder, the ball is going shorter, because you have more spin."
Great channel! The best.
@@aliensarereal7832 Many thanks for the feedback. Delighted you are enjoying the channel!
@@touristguy87 boy are you right. Your comment was really stupid. Who taught you how to form a sentence. Oh wait, you don't know how.
@@touristguy87 my teeth were feeling a little sharp so I just needed something to chew on.
I "once" hit a drive 308 yards, (measured with laser back to the tee), I happily accept 240 yds and use this number as a good shot.
Also, I use a good app now called precision pro, and that lets me keep a record of when I have no shot at the GiR, and that number is higher for me than short of green. I've traded one problem for another 🙄
That's a great stat to track David and absolutely key. Keeping the ball in play off the tee and giving yourself some sort of shot into the green irrespective of whether its from the fairway or rough will bring your scores down for sure!
I think that stat is a bit misleading - it depends on the intent of the golfer. If the green is inaccessible, small, undulated or for some other reason, makes it the better shot from a course management perspective to come up short, that would not get factored into this stat. I suspect if you could take out the outliers it would still be a significant number, but not that high.
It’s a fair point Alan and suspect there will be a good few outliers in there. Still think as you say though it would still show the coming up short as the ‘majority’ error compared to the others.
@@GolfingFocus Oh I do agree. In many cases it's the old, picking a club based on how far it should go or based on a perfect shot, versus what you can really get from a club based on a normal smooth swing. A lot of golfers have these weird egos when it comes to club distances. Once you get to be a senior golfer, you tend to wise up, put the ego aside and start to play smart.
hope your not trying to make excuses ....... we all make bad shots
@alan. yes agree, this data compares golfers against the fictitious standard of PAR or scratch golfer and doesn't show the real course situation. For instance at my course there are 4 holes 370m to 400m (400 to 440 yrd) par 4 's that cannot I cannot reach in 2 shots,(I hit my driver 200m on average (220yrds) so may strategy is to play theses as 3 shot holes.(i get a handicap shot on them anyway so 5 is a good score). (If I play them as 3 shot holes I am on 85% of time for 3 but 100% of time short for 2)
There are also 2 tricky long par 3's where it dead over back and other has a big swale green where if hit on front 3 putt, vs hitting short and chipping close, my coach has said hit short and chip close for a par.(get a shot on one of them) . not to mention holes into wind where short is best and rely on a chip and putt will give a par.
If i was to take arcross stats it would show minimum of 50% short based on lay up alone.- however if I adopt a Nett GIR I am up around 10 to 11 NGIR and not short at all.(my handicap is 9.1)
I see a lot of players I play with come up short because they hit it fat rather than just under club.
@@geoffcohen613 A couple of good examples and good point on the fat shot too. That's one thing about data, it can be interpreted in more than one way. It also does not take into account that a lot of courses are designed to have trouble if you go over the greens - at least I know some I play are, but are more inviting to hitting short. I get the left and right, but not so much the short shots. That said I do agree with the overall concept of selecting the appropriate club based on your skill level versus what distances you should get or others get - play your own game.
Underclubbing is not my problem. Hitting right or left is. I intentionally come up short so I can chip up straight to the pin. I make fewer mistakes with a 52 degree than I do with a mid iron approach. Sorry to disagree but short works to keep me in the fairway.
Each to their own Bill and if you think something works for you and leads to lower scores then crack on. My only query though is that if you’re deliberately not going for the green with 2nd shots and always aiming to be short of the green then arent you never giving yourself a chance to hit the green in regulation? Apologies if I’m misunderstanding your strategy though.
@@GolfingFocus your point is well taken about reducing my chances to get on the green, but I just don’t have the skill to approach with that kind of accuracy. I would rather take a par or bogey than get a double or triple , even if the off chance of a birdie came with a perfect shot.
@@billwatkins8227 Fair enough. I can't argue at all with a strategy that aims to keep those big numbers off the card! 👍
Did you speak to them or are you making an assumption? I come up short on purpose since shirt is better than long in the majority of cases. When I say short I mean less than 5yds.
But... if you buy this year's new driver, you can drive it 500 yards straight as an arrow with 1 hand. *If the marketing wank is to be believed
This is really annoying and shows that the amateur and professional games are very different: 1) Amateurs play on courses that usually have an apron entrance to the greens, but jungle behind them. If we lose the ball behind the green, a) we do not have marshalls, members of the public and tv cameras to help us find the ball; and b) as we do not have sponsors, a lost ball costs us money; 2) Amateurs do not have the power or skill to hit the ball very high with backspin, which professional players do all the time. They can stop a ball on a green; we cannot.
This article is a classic case of treating statistics as gospel, instead of making the intellectual effort to interpret the data with more sophistication and understanding of the reasons for the difference. Amateurs, as the name says, play the game for fun; professionals play it for a living: it is their work. There is no fun in spending half an afternoon searching for the ball, then hacking it out of the undergrowth. In few amateur games does the score matter to the extent of not being able to feed your family, so it makes more sense to hit the ball short to a playable part of the fairway (or apron) and then chip, or even putt, it on. Professionals appear to prefer their shortest short to be about 100+ yards from which distance they can make the ball bounce, bounce and then stop beside the hole: magic if you can do it: we can't.
In conclusion, please stop bullying us about the 'mistakes' that we make by comparison with your lofty standards; instead, you could try to show us the golf etiquette of either leaving us alone or trying to understand why our game is different from yours. Thank you.
Most amateurs, only know there beer consumption yardage,
40$ are short because of a bad swing not getting the distance they should be
This video is terrible advice. There many holes that hitting it long is much worse than short. Good course management requires that your good shots are on target but your misses aren't in jail. Most golf courses don't have sand, water or hazards just short of the green.
It’s a fair point Marvin about good course management and making sure your misses are ‘good’ ones. Not sure I’m convinced though all the amateurs who hit consistently short at the moment according to the stats do so for ‘strategic’ reasons. Former world no.1 golfers who have played in 1000+ pro ams also doesn’t seem convinced!
What part of you, yes even you pro, leave 40% of your shots short don't you get? the point of the video is not for you to hit 40% of your shots long over the green. The point is, pay attention and accept how far u really carry the ball with every club.
sorry, to say that being short has nothing to do with swing is just wrong--------the average golfer doesn't hit the ball flush, hence they're short on their approach. Being short is as much due to inconsistent swing as it is with not knowing your true distance------the average (16 handicap) has NO true distance but massive swing flaws
100% agreed Al that the quality of the ball striking has something to do with but don't think it's right either to say it's all to do with ball striking. Not sure either why a 16 handicapper shouldn't know their true distances? If they play within their comfort zone and can't see why they can't get their dispersion right down as a lot of the problems all standards of golfers face is trying to hit shots they either haven't practiced or can't hit consistently.
@@GolfingFocus thanks for the response-------your main point about taking more club for the average golfer is indisputable in terms of maximizing your score but it's kind of sad to see the however infrequent flushed shot go sailing over the green
@@alberg6290 It can be a horribly unfair game at times that's for sure! Not sure why we put ourselves through all the ups and downs at times 😂
@@GolfingFocus would really be interesting to have stats on handicap correlation to frequency of being short on approaches------I coach a talented high school team(Langley HS in Northern Va), 6 straight state championships, and the better the player the greater the frequency of going too long
@@alberg6290 Very interesting question and one I don't have the answer to at the moment unfortunately. I'll do some digging though and see what I can find out! As a matter of interest also how often are the players re-calibrating their yardages as they improve?
Yep. I’m the only person out of EVERYONE I PLAY WITH that goes long just as often as coming up short. Basically, their ego keeps them from playing good golf. It’s mind blowing to me. lol
😂 Happens all the time in the groups I play in too!
@@GolfingFocus My father-in-law is 20 yards short on every single hole 99.999999% of the time. lol
Stop saying "AHH" - "ERR" - "AND AHH". Very distracting and sounds nervous and lacking confidence . 1. Slow your speech - every word 2. Every time you feel yourself about to "AHH", replace it with silence. Surprisingly quick and easy to master.
You need to feel like you are speaking very very slow and much more concise - pronounce every individual word. Video yourself and get other people's opinions. Cheers, Michael 🇦🇺