HI Chadi. Kano wanted to merge striking with Judo. When he saw Aikido, he realized it merged striking with throwing. So, he sent Tomiki to learn it and figure out how to merge it in a safe and competitive way. But, Kano died before Tomiki returned with a practical sparring version of Aikido. As a result, only the self defense kata techniques (Goshin-Jitsu) were modified. Kano knew that Judo was incomplete, but he died before he could add in the striking and grab counters.
Firstly, Rokas was going about it wrong. To quote from Lenny Sly from rogue warriors (and the leading man on practical Aikido on youtube) "if you let the attack present itself then Aikido will work". Rokas was looking for an irimi nage and kote gaeshi in his BJJ rolls which I knew it wouldn't work because he was forcing the conditions rather than letting the conditions appear. I have been in sparring situations of where i was in a clinch in which I saw an opportunity to pull off an aikido move. Aikido will work when the situation present itself. Won't work if you force a situation. Why is that...because Aikido is more of a counterattacking art rather than attacking. So in other words it is defensive. Some Aikidokas may not agree with that but then I ask them "if it's not defensive, then why are you praying on the attack?"
Agree with many of your points. Personally I think the best way it to start with the weapons. That's the way I've gone, using a HEMA format, many of the techniques can then be applied. The locks can be built upon on top of that. I think that should be the foundation and after look at sparring with Taijutsu. That's a bit more challenging but I think it can be achieved if like you say its look upon as a grappling art. The rule set needs some thinking about but I share many of your views on the approach that should be taken.
I'm learning judo. My teacher is an 8th Dan Tomiki Aikidoka. The way he demos and explains is that aikido is judo at 2 arms length whereas judo is fighting within a single arms length. The physiological principles are the same. Kuzushi, Tsukuri, and kake. I have options to step off and away at an angle and bring him along. He has to be in motion.
Yes. This has been similar to my study. The aikido way can be understood if you imagine that the opponent has a knife. I think two arms space is what you need to maintain. This also makes sense of the stance since a back step is far superior in an aikido stance. Thank you teaching me the double arms space.
@@rayali6409 @Ray Ali If you're a grappler, try a clinch and drilling pummeling or handfighting and try stepping out and pulling Uke to you or shoving him out. I've found that this is where you can pull off a few of the movements. Waki Gatame, Gedan ate, Ushiro Ate into into Judo Shime waza. I build from pressure. Aikido has some useful skills.
@@vids595 I agree. Tomiki Aikido is Judo with arm locks and Atemi is all it is. Go try a dojo. You'd enjoy it because it's not the flowery flowey crap we commonly see.
I really agreed with you, once I had a aikidoka student in my judo classes and always when we're doing kumi kata in the classes I saw him get some wrist locks so I believe it's might be the way to develop aikido finding gaps on kumi kata
When I visited Wing Chun school during sparring I unconsciously did wrist locks, although the exercises were focused on fast wing chung jabs. So yeah, aikidokas are doing it thanks to years of training. My problem was wing chung practitioners does not push their body into the punch, so I had real issue with them. When I was doing bjj for two years I was able to wrist lock ony few times. So between aikido and working throws and aikido techniques is a long way. I hope to get there some day. Not yet thou.
The ‘mentality’ or ‘meta’ of Aikido works and seems to prove practical. For example, ‘attack with a triangle, take the opponent down with a circle, and pin them in a square.’
In Tomiki Aikido, every wrist lock, arm lock and throw has a kuzushi(break balance) before it. Also, Tomiki saw Judo as Aikido from the clinch and Aikido as Judo from kicking distance. Check out the Tomiki Aikido atemi waza, they're essentially push/trips.
"Everyone can do the same technique, but everyone has a different expression of it", so beautifully put mate, that's why I'm so hesitant to teach advanced Judo principles to my friends, how I perceive a throw is going to be completely different than how they do, especially with most of them being 194cm+ and me being only 185cm
if you teach principles,you are allowing for their individual strengths by definition.You dont perceive any throw,you may execute it a bit differently or set up differently but perception is irrelevant.185 CM is above average height.
Its like teaching the line of best fit for the class, but also then working to explain and give the principles and also the principles of how to make it their own flavour. Same how an how to draw guide helps you learn to draw things but eventually you leave the guide and are able to draw it but with your own slight twist. Same with martial arts here.
I have used aikido waza and Tai Sabaki in judo randori so in some ways I’m on the same page with Chadi. I’d add, 1 having a sense of openings for techniques , and 2 some practical way of sensing uke’s force and using it. This has to be done by feel.
thanks for the nice video, and for me this is a big subject. Im a shodan Aikidoka, started training in 2006, in an "iwama style" dojo. I also train BJJ, judo and , like you said many times in this video, im allways trying to make Aikido "work". So far , i will agree with your conclusions in the video, yes something can be used here and there, but to little for wich i desire. The most sucessefull usage of aikido techniques so far, is to escape from some disadvantageous positions with mostly sankyo and kotegaeshi. Mostly do defend the back and turtle positions, and with no possibility to make the opponent tap, but create oppening to reset guard or escape from back take. Also , "not an aikido technique" but inspired by, i came with a solution to escape the kimura trap, very simple and very effective"really", but strangelly hard to explain it to someone at the mat with no experience in Aikido. That said, im in love with the three schools (aikido, judo, bjj), and the felling i get from training sessions is, from judo and bjj the training sessions are much more mentally relaxed, but physically ill end the training completly wasted, with a big smile, but wasted. Also judo and bjj are far far far more prone to get injuries. From Aikido training, theres a strong "ritual" feeling, with a very mental focus (sometimes after a day working it really sucks ) but since your body warms up and start doing techniques it feels always very good. Also at the end im always much more energized then at the start ... so i think that in the health field, aikido is superior!! When you start to get old, maybe that becomes more important than techniques... Just tho end, i think Aikido is a fight style that is frozen in time, it makes more sense when you used to walk japan towns of the past , with samurai status and weapons, and someone of lower ranks, with no swords or something, is trying to kill or rob you, he has to grab your arms tight to not let you draw your blades. also probably they will not attack you alone . Never. So newaza against two is not smart. So in this time and place i think , aikido makes a lot of sense to me, and i think the objective of Ueshiba sensei was to keep this (treasure) from old times alive. Like kendo or Iaido. A Iaido guy cant do anything against a judoka. In this case im talking about wHat i think to be the true Ueshiba Aikido, not the Aikikai adaptation wich for me, is just martial themed gymnastics. Thanks for the video, nice one.
If in Aikido katas, uke never releases the wrist after the grab, it is because he grabs to prevent tori from drawing a knife from his belt. If he lets the arm go, he's dead. That is why in Aikido, Uke's aim is to never let go the grab. We can't understand Aikido without weapons.
Tomiki Aikido, the style I studied under the great Karl Geis of Houston, Texas, incorporates randori. As you know, Kenji Tomiki was Hachidan Dan in both Kodokan Judo and Aikido, and believed that realistic sparing (randori & shiai) was the best way to develop the application of techniques to practical situations one may encounter in daily life. We had such at the Karl Geis dojo.
@@Chadi yeah so Tomiki Aikido does have some randori - it s not really the best , its very restrictive and from my experience not done a lot. I'm a shodan in Tomiki , shodan in Judo and 1st degree black in BJJ - I don't train Aikido anymore - there is some great stuff in aikido and i catch people with wrist locks and wakigatame in rolling all the time. But when asked i recommend people train judo, bjj, muay thai or boxing
AIkido has everything it needs provided everyone is reminded of its roots and include the 'jujutsu' back into the Aiki. The founder of Aikido knew very well what he was doing having studied many martial arts including Aikijutsu. I found that whole business with Rokas and his experience to be a joke which did generate a lot of commotion meaning a lot of hits and $$$ for his channel. Kudos for him. While there is nothing wrong with generating money and studying other 'martial arts ' to be well rounded I also find it myopic in nature. Why Rokas did not go back to his Aikido 'sensei'? I also listened very carefully to discussions and to my surprise Roy chose 'survival' over liberation at the end of the discussion, even after the claim that he could make anyone tap out. But wait! The whole aspect of a True Martial Way True BUDO is LIBERATION! No fear! I know that Roy also studied AIkido and without a doubt I can see in his videos his very good fluidity of movements in ne waza 'jujitsu' ground work a tribute to his Aikido years. Making space and controlling space is also an attribute of Aiki whether standing or on the ground. However, Liberation is where one should end. Free. I could easily ask any one of the so called experts if they could use this pride of theirs when they are very sick and dizzy with fever unable to stand up. If they could fight then or do if their loved one is held at gun point. Here's a true story. A 'big man' full of pride a drug lord went to New York for 'business'. He was of course staying at a well known prestigious hotel. Late evening he stepped out just a few steps from the entrance to the hotel. Two young black teen agers walked up to him and demanded his wallet and his Rolex watch. His response was something like. " You dare try to rob me? Do you know who I am?" He was shot dead on the spot and he lost his life his wallet and his Rolex watch. Hence false pride leads to nowhere. I trained a young man in Aikido.( including jujutsu) One day while on his motorcycle a police car stopped beside him with two police men inside at the stop light. As the light turned green the police man on the passenger side spat on him and laughed as they sped away. The young man followed them and caught up with them at the next stop light and asked for an apology which he did not get. In fact they stepped out of the car to arrest him! They ended up both wearing their own hand cuffs. He took pictures with the cell phone and called the police. They all ended up to the local police station where statement were taken the two policemen gave the apology and it all ended there. The superior officer promised that they were to be reprimanded for their actions. Now as far as 'pressure testing' that is also a fallacy. Aikido can be as hard or as soft as one makes it. It is said that Chiba sensei's mat sometimes was spattered in blood. The "Ai" in Ai Ki Do has been misconstrued in our times. While care must be taken so as not to end up in silly over exaggerated movements, care must also be taken so as to avoid injuries. I have seen a person who tried to resist shiho nage you know 'pressure testing' and he ended up losing wrist elbow shoulder clavicle acromion and scapula sheared in two pieces along with a concussion as he flew though the air with a scream and landed hard on his head. Perfect tenkan spinning by the 'nage' using ai to control the movement blending in with a block of the shomen real punch stepping in irimi 'ki' and with atemi upper strike to the chin to raise the head of uke up, while putting the finishing touches with shiho nage tenkan mode. The jo's and belts had to be used to tie his body whatever was left of him to rush to the emergency. The doctors were screaming what the f****k did you do to him? You see this is not just a single point injury. It was total devastation over several parts of the skeletomuscular structure. So, harmony has been given this wrong aura of passivity. But this is wrong. Aikido is very dangerous provided one knows how to use it. Ai is the blending of the movement with the opponent 'uke' and works wonders if understood correctly in conjunction with 'ki' i.e using the energy i.e Momentum of opponent. Momentum M = mass * velocity It is wrong to think that in Aikido all moves are from dynamic movement. In fact movement can be initiated just as it is done in judo or jujitsu at clench. But wait! This is noting new. Momentum, it is used in Judo in Karate and Jujitsu etc. In fact Aikijutsu (Aikijujitsu) is where is stands and it was taught in the old times. Aiki 'do' is seen in the films where armies collide where opponents merge very fast with weapons at hand. Rokas and others have had bad experiences and? I laughed at his fist video in the ring with his jujitsu friend. In an instant, this so called 'black belt' in Aikido forgot all about ma ai aiki stances atemi waza irimi and tenkan etc etc He let his friend dictate the rules and the game. But wait this is done also by karate 'black belts' who in an instant forget their Shotokan Tae Kwon Do Goju Ryu Kempo Kenpo Kung Fu etc etc...and start behaving as wrong kick boxers! Where was Bunkai? Nowhere to be found! But wait! There is more! I see black belt Judokas as soon as they get a good ippon they think they won! that it is all over. But alas it is not so. In combat there are no silly jujitsu greco roman etc etc rules or gloves. But for those who know there is truly Budo a path to Liberation a poem waiting to be written a whisper in the wind a flash of the blade or a .357 magnum. What separates Aikido is intent. Once learned one has the authority to chose techniques at high level which provide good defense without causing damage to the other person unless necessary. It takes time to reach this level but it can be done. Pure and simple truth. Aikido gives a path for young and old alike it can be practiced in many ways and it can formulate the basis for any other art.
It’s interesting Chadi that the newsreel you used for this article documents the place, time and characters that were critical in taking Aiki from a jitsu-form to a do-form. The place is Iwama, a rural retreat where Ueshiba isolated himself at the end of the war till the 50’s with Saito ( see 6:57 approx). In Iwama he started to introduce jo & bokken into the syllabus plus much more of the Omoto-Kyo ‘world peace’ attitudes into the syllabus. It was here that the stance was changed to emulate a swordsman and atemi was removed. This is the birth of AikiDO and the the 2 men critical in the popularisation in the West are Tohei (Ki Society) & Kisshomaru Ueshiba ( see 9:49), Moreihi’s son both men were architects of the post-war western boom in aikiDO. Gozo Shioda who was one of the pre-eminent pre-war Ueshiba students was awarded his Dan rankings not in AikiDO but AikiJITSU. Yoshinkan Aikido retains atemi. The Tokyo Riot Police still train in Yoshinkan Aikido not because of its efficacy in a arrest situation of a 1:1 (they have Judo for that) but because it works in a riot or melee or 1:1+ situation. If your interested have a look at ua-cam.com/video/He-OfRI1V-I/v-deo.html. Sensei Andò is a direct student of Shioda. The other man that should be looked at for helping to make some form of Aikido more ‘realistic’ is Tomiki who maintains competitions & sparring as part of his syllabus. The Aiki-Kai style is not all there is to Aikido. Many thanks Chadi for putting your channel up, it’s really excellent material and great topics.....all the best Finally, it’s not styles that contend but people.
@@เด็กพเนจร-ฝ4ษ jitsu is a fighting system and do is a martial 'way' or journey. The Japanese were forced after WW2 to change their militaristic culture by the allies. So a lot of martial arts were changed to a 'do' (Ju Jitsu became Judo) to demonstrate that it was an ethical form of exercise for the body and mind. Usheba who founded Aikido was a war veteran of the Manchurian war (and became very accomplished with the bayonet and hand to hand fighting). He was against Japan's aggression in WW2 and withdrew from public life. He later promoted Aikido as a way of bringing peace and understanding to the world. But it's hard to translate the Japanese words literally and get a sensible meaning in English.
@@N17C1interesting, as I read do was added during growing nationalism in pre war Japan, like aikido and karate-do to meet govermental approval. But I do not study Japans history and it is one statement against the other.
Toshiro Suga and the late Nobuyoshi Tamura's dialectic approach to aikido definitely add a level of realism and logic to how technique should be performed. My teacher trained with them when he was young in Brittany.
Aikido already work. It is people that keep forcing it to be something else. Aikido is an internal art like Tai Chi. Meaning the work is from inside-out. The physical, combat,... comes last or later. In Tai Chi mastering Chi comes first. In Aikido mastering Aiki which first would be Ki comes first. Those that don't want to go this path end up turning them to grappling arts, stripped of almost everything. But made useful for specific purpose other than it's original.
My take on modernizing Aikido is to literally teach the Aikidoka the full range of MMA and then judge their rank by how well they can defend earnest attacks (from Aikidoka who learned MMA, and even at open mats at BJJ, Karate, Judo etc schools) using only Aikido. Not requiring pro MMA athletes, but amateurs who know what they're doing, who can at least place at local tournaments in their own arts It would probably die out if it took that approach (because that's 15-20+ years to black belt, if people can even get there) But that's basically where I am with it, aside from making a pentathlon (or beyond) of specific, live resistance situational sparring situations with scoring (which I think could at least drive home the value in a demo-type way while still being basically honest). IE, as the uke, you get points for resisting well... therefore, uke are going to be doing their best to resist. Aikido makes way more sense in the context of various different situational sparring events than it does one unifying event like Judo randori Kind of like how you can break BJJ up into pass-sweep-submit, or escape-from-mount, or escape-from-side control, or escape-from-backmount etc. Aikido makes way more sense broken up into specific goal type situational sparring sessions, which is basically how 100% of my ten years of Aikido training so far has been (just, not formally recognized as such).
Why MMA?....MMA is not the ultimate criteria on the effectiveness of martial arts...especially in the context of self defense which deals with non-consensual attacks. MMa is a contest so it deals with consensual attacks. If any Aikido school would want to make it effective for self defense then I say follow the ideas of Iain Abernethy.
Historically Aikido techniques are rooted in weapons training. If you try & apply them in a different context than originally intended, then of course they aren't going to work.
Tenshin Gakuen Bugei Aikido was created by Shihan Steven Seagal, by incorporating kara te, reincorporating daito ryu and adding some element like hubud lubud from FMA.
There's sparring w strikes, and sparring without. If something can't work with all grappling aloud without strikes, then it can't work with and doesn't really matter if super isolated. Aikido is a part of Grappling, it's up to Grapplers to add to their toolbox, and up to Aikidokas to you know, actually be good at grappling. Most couldn't even do Random Grab Defense with Aliveness, and they are literally the art the specializing in grab defense.
I see Aikido in MMA all the time! My Aikido instructors were Judo/wrestling coach's first. Many with backgrounds in Karate, boxing, etc.. I tell you this to point out the very common misconception that Aikido is a set of questionable techniques. This is not what Aikido is. Aikido is a set of principles. Anytime one responds to an attack by "blending" or finding/using the path of least resistance it is Aiki. Slipping a punch is Aikido principle... Many of the techniques in Aikido are found in so many other Martial Arts. Martial arts that people don't tend to question so much. The principles of Aikido are sound! They align beautifully with boxing, wrestling, Judo, and even aspects of Karate. Many of the techniques were already proven in combat before O'sensei was born. So, this earned reputation came from somewhere. And, I believe you touched on at least one major contributor. Pressure testing/sparring/randori ... But, I feel the need to point out another glaring reason for this reputation. That reason is the mindset of and the type of people this Martial Art attracts. It is most often people that are looking for something "spiritual" or something to give them some exercise. Most have never been and never plan on being in any type of physical altercation. Let alone voluntarily stepping up to compete in a fight. I can't even count how many ponytailed, skinny, "hippy" types I have witnessed training in this art. Because, it is beautiful and many find some spiritual fulfillment training Aikido. It's traditional, or, "It looks cool"... As we all know it is the Martial artist more than the martial art that really matters. When I went to my Judo coaches as an Aikido black belt in 1994 as suggested by my Aikido Sensei I knew they had a background in Aikido as well. But, I never expected them to tell me that I already had the fundamentals and only needed to learn a few things in order to start competitions. One of the first things I learned was that Aikido does work. If your mind is right. And, your understanding of reality is crisp. That is the big flowing movements are smaller, faster, and sometimes "the path of least resistance" means using atemi! The goal is gentle flowing techniques that sends your opponent crashing to the mat. The reality doesn't always look so nice. And, that is ok. That is still Aikido. O'sensei believed that Aikido was the study of the spirit. He Also believed that Aikido techniques should evolve. Having said this, I believe that is an excellent Martial Art that could benefit or compliment almost anything a martial artist does. What is important is the mindset of the students AND the instructors. If they don't align it's a waste of time. If the instructors are trying to teach a practical self defense through their art they better understand the difference between the beautiful flowing cooperative Aikido training and pressure tested raw physical altercations! The students need to have a clear understanding of what it is they are looking for before picking an instructor. And, ask a lot of questions. Sorry for the book. I could too easily go on and on. If you read this far I appreciate it.
the point is that you cannot make any principle work without contact sparring and aikido never does that so its techs are entirely useless outside self improvement which is a worthy pursuit in itself.The principles used in wrestling ,and boxing have absolutely no relation to japanese nonsense,they were developed through trial and error.
@@scarred10 Shows what you know. It's like you are telling someone that their plane will never fly after they have already landed! We always went hard! Principle is another word for fundamental. With just a little more nuance in this case. The underlying principles are the same in EVERY fighting style! Balance, breathing, timing, focus, coordination, mindset, and so on. We have one head, one torso, two arms, two legs. As for being useless, you are referring to most of the more traditional "protect your opponent" Aikido that most people know. The funny thing is that even in those schools you will find many valid techniques that have been proven in combat and tournament! Do you really think that some old Japanese guy just decided to make up a bunch of new, never seen techniques?! One could look at all martial arts as the strategy, and the "style" or specific techniques as tactics. And, we could argue semantics or whether it's "real Aikido" because of strikes or "aggression". But, it is still Aikido. As I said originally, I see Aikido in MMA ALL the time! Many times it's ignored because it's subtle, or not understood. And, many times because it looks so much like something else, or something else that people are more familiar. "If you know the way broadly you will see it in everything." - Miyamoto Musashi
@@SkorLord where exactly do you see any aikido in mma, given that none of them even train in it.Common principles are found in many styles but only a few can make those principles work due to useless training methods.Yes I do think the old masters just practised and taught hypothetical techniques,most are complete nonsense.
@@simonedwards5437 not my point,If you dont train it with full resistance like mma,it doesmt work.MMA is a fight between skilled fighters so theres a lot that wont work in that that may on the untrained.
@@scarred10 Never got a notice... I could give you a list of solid examples of Aiki techniques and footwork being successfully used in mma. But, without some point of reference or actual knowledge you might just say that they are actually this technique from that martial art, it was a fluke, a coincidence, or it was rather insignificant in the totality of the fight. That is one of the biggest issues here. You might only have half knowledge of what we are talking about. I will be the first to admit that many traditional martial arts schools are like cults teaching watered down crap. Especially, the " soft style " martial arts of which Aikido is included. As mentioned in my original "book", Aikido and other " soft style " martial arts tend to attract a certain type, and what you end up with are 90% of the schools filled with soft people that one way or another do not understand why or what they are really doing. All due respect. Those people then open up schools and before you know it we have tons of crap schools representing the art. I have literally heard an Aikido instructor suggest that "training in any other discipline was a waste of time." HE had never been in a real fight... Heard one say " There are no strikes in Aikido. " also false! So, I can understand a lot of why people hold the belief that Aikido is complete junk. I have seen the same demonstrations on UA-cam and the same soft skinned, weak wristed representatives demonstrating techniques while showing anyone with actual experience they have never been in a real fight inside or outside of a ring. You know, like McDojos. Mike Tyson and Muhammad Ali were both great. Their styles were VERY different, but both still boxers. So was Adam Corolla. It doesn't make him equal or the same! The Karate instructor I had was only a Karate instructor. The Aikido instructors however were originally Judo/Jujitsu guys that sent me to train Judo which was also full of State and national Judo champions along with a couple Olympians. Coaches with wrestling and Karate resumes. Mats filled with cops, parole officers, and prison guards. It was about as hard nosed as you got for the early 90's. We were " mixed martial artists" before the term existed! I say that to press the point that not all schools/gyms/dojos/dojang are created equal. I have done Aikido specific techniques successfully many times. I don't know how many of those guys were trained. I can say that a few were definitely not. But, I can also say some of the techniques work great in Judo competition against resisting opponents as well. I wouldn't suggest Aikido was someones first or only martial arts training. But, it can help improve just about anything else you have trained if you can find a knowledgeable, seasoned instructor.
Just train Daito Ryu. This is the combative art which Ueshiba learned from Sokaku Takeda. Later renouncing violence & fighting, joining a pacifist cult, he created Ai ki do as a form of physical, co-operative, excercise which he stated in his writings as for excercise only and not for fighting. It doesn't work cause it wasn't designed to be for fighting. Daito Ryu is for combat: weapon retention, counter siezing, art for court guards.
It will have the same issues as Aikido when paired with judo or bjj or other martial sport. Like Aikido, those techniques work, in the time of the samura,i with blades involved.
Aikido should be looked as like Krav maga when it was created... Back In the days In israel they didnt teach krav maga until u have reach at least blackbelt In any other martial Art like karate, judo, wrestling, boxing or kickboxing... It was like a "knife" to be added to your arsenal that u already have... Morihei Ueshibas first students was already complete fighters or martial artist.. He wanted to add the opposite of hurting fellow humans.... Thats the major flaw in modern Aikido... In order to make it work,first you need to learn how to fight ...
This was very interesting. I also started with aikido as a little boy... then in high school when I joined the wrestling team, I realized what it was really like to go against a resisting opponent... I agree with a lot of what you said... When I was practicing BJJ/grappling at a MMA school some 10 years ago I would occasionally try wrist locks on the ground when on top and sometimes they worked... There might be a way to make nikkyo type shoulder and elbow locks work too, or irmi throws using momentum... I can't try them now though since I stopped training... But looking at various non-traditional aikido styles on UA-cam that have sparring like Tomiki, Hatenkai, and Aikido SA, they all look interesting but also each with some weaknesses... Probably the best is to combine the aikido techniques in a grappling setting like judo or BJJ as you said.
Ramsey Dewey has a thing about "Drills vs sequencing" If you say "applying in a drill is very different than in sparring" I take that to mean "applying in a sequence is very different than sparring" because in Ramsey's dichotomy, drilling is with live resistance it is different, drilling vs sparring, but not nearly as different. Drilling is basically situational sparring in a narrower range of situations. At my Aikido dojo, we don't spar, but we only sequence at the white belt level. All practice is basically drilling from about 3-6 months in and beyond. And we're one of the rare schools where if you can embarrass a black belt by not being thrown, to a point anyway, you should embarrass that black belt. I would very much count that as pressure testing, just not as complete as sparring It's frustrating in part that Aikido is so fragmented that it's hard to make sweeping generalizations about any of it.
So this only comes from reading about aikido and from certain Japanese teachers I've seen on video, but the most missing part of aikido seems to be the removal of atemi in modern times. Shoji Nishio, who emphasized that the real world effectiveness of any martial art is of utmost importance, even went so far as to say every aikido technique should use atemi. Basically you should strike them before any grappling begins. I'm paraphrasing his words, I can't remember exactly, but I get his point. He was a head instructor in Aikido, but I forget which school, but he also practiced karate, and kenjutsu of some type. What do you think about this? Was this mindset forgotten or phased out of modern aikido?
I think that you are seeing Aikido as a sport. We know perfectly well that somebody holding your wrist is an unlikely attack, and that maintaining that grip while you do all kinds of things to them is unlikely. They hold your wrist because as a beginner you might need a predictable structure to engage with. They hold you because if they fear they are about to be hurt they have the option of letting go, this applies to techniques where a throw is involved, which you might call art but is also training to fall. Kaitennage for instance is usually practised this way but, it is also possible to do this technique or parts of it with tori holding uke who then does not have this choice. Strikes make many techniques possible and of course many techniques are quite possible against an unwilling opponent but something will break. I agree that much of what you see does not work and I groan when I see high dan grade senseis doing their stuff from this contact or thowing light ukes, often women, about. Aikido as Kata does not work but, if you practice Kata, which is what the techniques are, you will arrive at something that will.
Doesn't kata only serve as a memorisation tool where you can extrapolate infinite possibilities to apply the principles taught by them? So learn how to freely use these principles is part of the Kata way. I refer to Iain Abernethys Kata videos. He explains it best. (Btw Roka is also a great fan of him)
Mr Affability: when you say "we know perfectly well that someone holding your wrist is an unlikely attack" i think that youve hit on one of the biggest Aikido misunderstanding in the martial arts world, both by observers and by practitioners. Wrist grabbing IS an unlikely attack when you have two unarmed people who are not trained in a grappling system. When you are trained in a grappling system, wrist control becomes indespensible. Youre never going to be good at grappling, especially standing, no gi grappling, without a stead focus on wrist control. Furthermore, in a situation where one of the combatants has a short sword or a knife in their hands grabbing the wrist - even locking on to it for dear life and not wanting to let go - becomes highly intuitive. My suspicion is that at least some significant amount of Aikido curriculum would become more plausible if Aikidoka would understand them in these contexts - that the uke is either trying to control your wrist because you have a weapon in your hand or because they have some grappling knowledge and are attempting wrist control as the first step to initiating one of their own techniques.
@@harageilucid4352 I am not an expert in the matter of grappling, but breaking a grip is easy even for a much weaker person who knows Aikido properly. If a grip is taken that is something of a gift since then at the least, that hand is not going to hit you and with Aikido a small movement will check the attackers movement. People are critical of Aikido because either they don't understand it or they think that they do. There is Aikido and Aikido and some systems are too limited, fine details are not taught.
I agree. If Akido would remove some of the traditional practices and pressure test the technique and scrap what does not work, it could be an effective system to add to, let’s say an mma fighters tool box. It would be neat if some one with the Akido background would do that and market it.
Interesting video. Thanks for posting. I think the problem with aikido is one of perception and understanding. I think sometimes the techniques appear to be so seductive and beautiful that it's easy to lose sight of what is being supposed to be taught and learned at the heart of the Art. In my opinion techniques are often incorrectly taught as an end in themselves instead of a means to an end and so their real purpose is lost. Also, there is a misconception about the nature of the Art in that it is supposedly primarily an unarmed grappling art in the same way as Judo and jujitsu. This I think is only partly true and leads to the erroneous conclusion that it is optimally designed for grappling distance and applications similar to those other arts. So what is aikido if not primarily a grappling art? In my opinion it is a weapon art trained in an empty handed context. In that sense it's purpose, effectiveness and value can be discerned. Pure Aikido will never be a viable option for the Octagon as it is another type of animal altogether not suited for that environment. That doesn't mean that there arnt things within the system that cant indeed be used in real life physical conflict situations, it just means that its not designed optimally to be a competitive combat sport.. I think if martial artists from.other disciplines try to look at the Art through different glasses they may find some some useful insights that will help them in their own journey.
Both Osensei and Shioda sensei said that Aikido is 70% Atemi i.e. striking the vital points of the opponent! After you have softened up and distracted the attacker, you can apply a suitable throw or lock.
@Susan O'Hara ..I think the atemi and kuzush drilled at the beginning of every basic Yoshinkan technique are not meant to be a means to execute a throw or pin later on. The strike is really meant to take the other guy out. Uke's counter response in protecting the face is really the point at which the aikido pin or throw are applied. In other words the correct martial application to being grabbed is to break the others posture and simultaneously apply a strike in an attempt to knock them out. That is why Ueshiba taught that in a real life and death situation atemi is 90% of aikido effectiveness.
@@eliosanciolo9418 ua-cam.com/video/w67NPPyUouk/v-deo.html I read that both Osensei and Gozo Shioda sensei said that Atemi is 70% Aikido! Its the same with Judo and Jujitsu on the street.
@@susanohara4274 70 or 90% doesn't really matter. The point is that atemi is of primary importance in life and death situation in aikido. I think that unfortunately many mainstream aikido schools sell the spiritual aspect of the Art before the martial application...to a demographic which is by it's very nature, not martially orientated. This has overtime led to the degradation and dilution of the true spirit of the Art. From my understanding old school Judo also had a similar concept. Today strikes have been removed from competitive Judo along with some if the more dangerous throws...and so it has ceased to be the Art it once was.
@@eliosanciolo9418 The focus in Judo and in modern BJJ is sport and not self defence. In Aikido, especially the so-called Ki Aikido, the focus is on the artform and on Ki development. They don't practice Aikido for self defence! Modern Aikido training has no resisting partner or free sparring. It's not effective on the street.
Bit of and old video , but I thought I would add something. One aspect that has helped make my Aikido work (besides practicing against resistance occasionally) is being a bit of a screw up. I mean I have been doing Aikido for a while and I mes up all the time in the dojo. I make it a habit, when I screw up, not to chase after rhe technique I was trying to do, but to immediately improvise a technique from whatever position uke and I happen to be in. This leads to a greater ability to react to resistance. It is not perfect or the only thing ivdo, but it is definitely a part.
Apparently the development of Ki, learning how to read movement and intent, how to test others and harmonize with them in order to guide them into the resulting immobilization by minimal pain didn't result in an understanding of these "training" techniques so that you could apply them to other martial arts. As practice and testing progress it is more than possible to advance them in terms of submission and lethality. As you go up in rank , experience and awareness so are you allowed to use weapons and practice defense and offense in such a way that you understand the potential and consequences of your action. Randori is part of the upgrading of the student in Aikido. Aikido is taken up by many serious Martial artists to give them a greater understand of mind and body flow and they say it fine tunes and deepens their other practices in much the same way taking Ballet helps sportsmen.
Salut Chadi, "Making aikido work" ... My next question will be "work against what? in what situation? What kind of opponent?, For what?" You said it well, "the problem is not the technique, it is how to get to it" ... Everything depends indeed on the purpose and the spirit engaged during the "contemporary" practice of aikido or any other type/style of martial-arts. It is obvious that any style/type is teached and practiced within a sphere of pre-established rules. Making any "style" work "in front" of any kind of other "style" is in my opinion a very unclear "target" ... (as the rules of each "style" can be on/for "both sides" a trap and disadvantage) .... unless the "question" is concerning "ritual" and not "survival" skills and applications .... Merci for the work you're doing !
For any martial art to be combat effective, full contact free style sparring is absolutely necessary. Modern Aikido, Tai Chi and most of the Chinese internal martial arts lacks this! Kata (drills/fixed patterns) are only for learning the techniques. Its impossible to learn to be effective on the street, the battlefield on in an MMA ring without the practice of free sparring.
Just start sparring lite, you will learn what works and what doesn't. In my sparring using aikido. Moves must be short and fast. I mainly use any outside techniques
My problem with aikido or at least the aikido I have been exposed to is its completely unrealistic to real life, it is more based on the idealistic rather than the realistic. Uke's so compliant that they are doing most of the technique for the tori. I have done techniques quite poorly in the past and yet my uke is still flying, just seems like it's purely choreography, rather than pressure tested self defence. If a high percentage of someone's training is mostly to always compliant then that is all they know how to do. This is my experience
I’ve been thinking about this as well .i don’t practice but I find aikido to be very interesting and amazing to watch.there demos have been developed to a very high level to the point that most arts would look basic compared to a top aikido demo. I am very interested in Kung fu and it has similar criticisms but it’s mostly just misunderstood.i do think you contradict yourself by saying you want to keep it aikido and change the system to be like judo rules. The problem is the moves depend on a lot of momentum instead of an equal struggle . My idea is to stress what aikido does best which is evasive footwork.my old teacher once gave us a demonstration of different arts that he knew when he got to aikido he said their footwork is supreme and I agree though Bagua is also very good .i see a simple hack that might fix the art . One thing I noticed is that sometimes the uke will fake with footwork so he’ll start stop and then go in but what they won’t do is fake with the hand technique. Here’s where I differ . If they did it would be easy to foul up the nage’s move. .imagine faking a wrist grab and throwing a punch so this is where the choreographed moves would break down . Now the solution for the nage could be to rely on his footwork rather than his hands. . This way he would be developing his best attribute, his footwork to deal with progressively more realistic attacks . That being said there is a form of aikido that is much more realistic and it is called Shodokan aikido . -Steve
How to make Aikido work. Nishio Sensei already solved that conundrum, and thankfully more Aikidoka are waking up to his ideas. PS Rokas is not a good source for understanding Aikido.
I have to check how aikido works when tori has weapon in scabbard / holster. Maybe the whole idea on aikido is when someone is blocking tori to not take his sword or knife.
You’re right about the need to pressure-test aikido - this was one of the key reasons why aikido, as well as its parent art, Daito-ryu, were held in such high regard in their original forms in the early 20th century. But what makes these arts unique from most other jujutsu systems are the methodologies for developing and utilizing aiki in its original form within both of these martial arts. Aiki is a Taoist internal body skill that allows for the techniques in aikido, which are ineffective as conventional jujutsu techniques, to unbalance uke / opponents with minimal effort independent of timing and waza. Unfortunately the accurate interpretation and understanding of aiki and the training needed to achieve it has diminished over time, but is still preserved by a relatively small number of branches and practitioners of Daito-ryu and aikido. The following video interview provides some introductory insights regarding this topic: m.ua-cam.com/video/mMji6NAFaxg/v-deo.html.
You should name this video: “How to make aikido work … in a way it was never intended to work” Morph aikido in a judo- o BJJ- like sport is a weird sort of idea. Like morph bowling into combat sport. Aikido indeed is an art of smooth rolling the partner (and been rolled by him) with great philosophy and, yes, with some extrapolated implementations in self defense.
@@vids595 millions of people throughout the world are enjoying to practice aikido. Do you really think all of them doing this just because they are deceived by false promise - to become eventually gods of self-defence? Id rather suspected, they already have found their (different) deep reason to stay with the art.
However here is one more element missing and that element is confidents listen i study Kokikai Ryu Aikido i am so confident in my art because i know it works plus i was a fighter before i studied in this system. I mix boxing in it
I was watching the video of OSensei. One thing I have seen him do that when someone is "attacking" him, he always move in the blind side of the uke. but he moves clockwise and counterclockwise. Trying to go in an always defensive position cuts down the timing. Aikido, should cut sown of movements in the technique: Execute the technique as quickly as you can by subduing your opponent as quickly as possible. Do not wait for your opponent to attack, move your whole body like a dynamic sphere and mess up the body axis of your opponent. Lastly have the confidence in your techniques: In the street, your opponents have the mental attitude to control, to rob you and kill you. You can't be "nice" under these circumstances. Chadi, what is your observation of O'sensei on the video?
Aikido was part of the Samurai hand to had combat which include a long sword and a short sword. The meaning behind the attacks on the Aikido person means that he is holding a sword while the attackers are trying to take away his sword from killing them. This is like a Kabuki acting. Aikido was introduced after WW2 during the American occupation of Japan until the 1970s. Aikido, Judo, and Karate were all introduced as self defense instead of a fighting art from the days of the Samurai. Without the sword or other weapons, Aikido is just an exercise routine for burning calories and keeping the human body flexible just like a Yoga exercise. Aikido is like a Cobra snake without teeth and venom to hurt anybody. Aikido was meant to hurt and kill feudal conscripts from farms and streets during wars between feudal warlords. The feudal conscripts had very little experience in hand to had combat or to fight against a Samurai with a sword. Aikido and Judo were called Jiu Jitsu as a generic name for a Samurai’s hand to had fighting techniques. Changing Jiu Jitsu into a modern and non-deadly practice allowed for many people to learn some part of the martial art of a once deadly technique of a Samurai. Modern Aikido has many useful techniques for wrestling against an attacker with little or no knowledge of martial art. Aikido techniques today is difficult to use against a skilled martial art fighter like a boxer or a Greco Roman wrestler. There are many martial art schools today that can fight agains Aikido compared to the feudal days of ignorant peasants with just brute force and a hot temper for a weapon.
As a Japanese jujutsu instructor, I have had several students in law enforcement & corrections officers that have told me that they have used aikido finger, wrist and arm locks many times with success. Many of the throws requiring moving the opponents…not so much. I guess that makes sense. Finger, wrist and arm locks were removed or altered from judo because of safety issues. Meaning that they work very well in self defense. But not useful for sport.
Good thinking, however let's not forget that the striking components teach to keep the right distance. That's a very strong element of the Aikido teaching, it would be a loss not to teach it. It is very clear when practicing weapons. BJJ puts a lot of emphasis on keeping the right distance in different scenarios if I'm not mistaken. Plus, you get to train explosive forwards, backwards and sideways movements that are typical of weapons training and that is a loss too. Mainstream Aikido doesn't teach any of that unfortunately, no explosive power...that would be a loss for Aikido.
Weapon attacks Sword and long (or even blunt) weapons? (The knife being a tricky weapon to deal with) I don't do Aikido but it seems to me it's more suited against the sword. All the "deliberate" attacks seem more akin to weapon attacks. Police? Not a lot is said on this subject. Really great research in martial arts history. Very interesting.
Aikido relies on the swing motion not to defend or work specifically with swords, you imitate the gesture of sword swinging even in open hand in order to move your partner (watch bruno gonzales), but i understand it has many dimensions and philosophical roots, I'm trying to make it a grappling functional art like judo and the others.
Aikido pre ww2 was brutal,after ww2 more spiritual. Funny Bouncers know how to use Aikido.You just have to have a certain mind set.I feel perfectly fine with my yellow/black stripe in Ryu Aikido.Have no Fear.
Morehei Ueshiba, Osensei, the founder, himself wrote that Aikido is for excercise only and not for fighting. Morehei Ueshiba was an expert in the combative art of Daito Ryu but upon joining a pacifist cult he renounced violence and created aikido as an excercise program and partner assisted choreography to propagate trust, harmony and peaceful human interaction. When he taught self defense he taught Daito Ryu. When he taught Aikido he stated it was not a fighting art but was for excercise only. Read The Art Of Peace by Morehei Ueshiba and read Invincible Warrior the biography of Morehei Ueshiba for reference. If the founder himself taught Aikido was not for fighting why do many aikidoka try to prove it's useful for fighting? The few partner assisted choreography joint locks and throws of Aikido are remnants from Daito Ryu. Daito Ryu applies the locks & throws in a combat effective manner so Aikidoka should just train Daito Ryu if they desire to make aikido locks & throws combat effective in counter-grappling.
Aikido works fine for me. Not sure why you are all having difficulty. If someone has taught you that tsuki is a jab, then they don't know Aikido. If you want a sport like MMA, BJJ or Judo, don't try to shoe-horn Aikido into it. But if you want to stay alive then Aikido is perfectly useful it's just no good for scoring points. Really good Ukemi will save you from injury better than knowing perfect Kote geashi. So, rather than viewing Ukemi as some sort of 'fake' way of making people look good, look at the guy who just received a Ju Jitsu style arm lock and throw and survived and stood back up. One thing I recommend to every Aikido dojo is the Jiuwaza after every class is critical to the learning. It's avoided by many dojos but without it, you don't learn the techniques in motion.
I agree a lot with what you say and that's actually how I found your channel in the first place. However there's a channel called chushintani that made me rethink a lot, with what aikidos goals are in self-defense. It would be interesting if you had discussions with other aikidokas about this. Isn't randori supposed to be the pressure testing?
@@Chadi so based on that we can't blame aikido regarding not pressure testing, because that's what the randori is for. Rather we gotta blame the aikidokas misunderstanding what randori is. Just as in karate we have people teaching gedan barai as a low block, while in actuality it means lower sweep.
I think its only supposed to be taught to people with already a backround in martials arts to start with. It's and addendum to what you already know. By it self it doesn't even teach you how to punch so can you know how to dodge? The grips and joint locks are phenomenal however.
I understand that when it was first invented or founded Ueshiba invited top tier martial artists, but in today's age people with no martial backgrounds are training and i want it to adapt so it can at least work on practical level not on a philosophical level only.
@@Chadi I think the main issue with it and alot of traditional M.A. is that it works primarily with join locks on hands and from strikes. Its ALOT easier to get someone in an arm bar on the ground then dodging a punch and applying a wrist grip while on the feet. To this day I've never seen it applied in combat scenario, not sport or real life.
A person trained in Daito Ryu Jujutsu techniques which is for real-life combat fighting, knows that Aikido is a version of the jujutsu that looks ineffective but the possibility and wisdom hidden in its techniques to transform from "harmless" to lethal forms is not lost to him. Aikido is a gift of deception of the martial arts world of Japan for the foreigners and outsiders to train and study, a "face" of their martial arts to show that is "non violent" in creed and acceptable for all to to train. The time came when they decided that foreigners must not learn the original fighting arts, but that they must be given watered down versions of all deadly martial arts techniques of the different martial arts schools of Japan for their honor, prestige and power to survive even after their defeat in the war. So Aikido was introduced, all judos, jujutsus and karates were turned into lame sports, and the ultimate Japanese art of killing using empty hands and weapons was hidden from all except for the original keepers of that knowledge.
I think Rokas is mistaken. Now I am not an expert but studied aikido for a while and talked to many expert practitioners about it. And the conclusion is simple. Aikido as generally teached is for self improvement. The movements are well defined and to be both pleasing and safe. It is in a way a form of dancing. However all of those techniques can be performed tightly and violently. They are mostly moves from jiu-jitsu that we know works. The "problem" with aikido (in terms of fighting) that most practitioners don't learn or practice how to perform the techniques fast to actually cause damage. And they don't practice fighting at all. Rokas certainly didn't. My teacher who was a competing wrestler and kickboxer knew how to get into position to perform aikido techniques. So in essence one has to be pretty good at fighting to use aikido in fighting.
Don't study Aikikia Aikido,lol. Do Yoshikan or something similar. Or do Daito Ryu. Aikido is exercises and self improvement really not a combative. Aikido and Judo are the first martial arts I learned from my dad. He learned in Japan while in military. I learned Taekwondo and kick boxing next. Both Aikido and Judo work well against kick boxing. As long as you don't get hit hard. Atemi is an abosolute must for Judo or Aikido. I'm glad I learned kick boxing and Gracy Ryu Jujutsu techniques. As well as Kodokan and Yoshikan. I'm a very fortunate person to have had a father that encourage me to learn martial arts and science. Good luck in your training and UA-cam stuff. An old Jujutsuka enjoys your channel and thoughts very much.
If you gripfight or newaza your way to a wristlock, you're just doing judo or bjj with wristlocks. No one debates that cranking on a wrist can hurt someone. To validate itself Aikido has to demonstrate it's aiki principle, blending with and redirecting the opponent's motion, in randori.
The truth is, Aikido is inherently fighting an uphill battle. If your goal is to defeat your opponent without harming them, but they have no such limitations, you'll only have a high likelihood of winning if there is a significant disparity of skill (ie, Aikidoka knows what they're doing a lot more than their opponent) I take it for what it is. Martial arts with higher ambitions, that promote growth in different ways. Build on a platform of kickboxing and wrestling for best results. I personally do not plan to quit, but I don't regret my time cross training BJJ and Karate either.
Learn Arnis, Escrima, or Kali to make it function. The issue with most Aikidoka is lack of base, timing, and reaction time. Aikido isn't wrestling, or grappling; it is the meta skill sets of swordsmanship's disarms and police restraints. Most peopt who complain about Aikido don't have to restrain people for a living. In Boxing you're taught how to parry & clinch it is from these defenses that you can establish control of a foe's arm.
I applied Aikido in initial contact situation; for sparring I apply it in stick grappling. Basically wear your utility belt with simunition and training weapons then spar; you can do it from situational drills such as being hoodwinked then when the hood is pulled from your head deal with the situation as presented. This can be applied to randori style bull in the ring.
I think martial art came about as source of being resourceful , so with that being said what if this would be an opportunity to take the theories of aikido and modify them to a modern day style of Aikido as you are implying in your video. Martial arts is an evolution of motion I think, and the study of the practitioner would be paramount to the success of the art regardless of the style . A Lot of thought and meditation has been applied to each style of martial art and to say that one was better that the other would be an insult to the style . I think Bruce Lee said it best " Be water my friend"
I always thought Aikido could work after you have done a strike to someone, particularly the face and then catching their hand as they instinctively go to block it after the fact. In fact as I've seen it Aikido does have lose backhand strikes to people's faces.
Well, the first thing Aikido needs to do is recognize that most of its wrist twists were intended to utilize the weight of a weapon in the attacker's hand, and are, therefore, poorly suited for empty hand-to-hand combat, where it's practically impossible for most practitioners to twist the wrist of a resisting opponent. Take those out and the moves that remain are basically the same as you'd find in Jujitsu, so, what's the point?
Aikido does work ukemi is to make sure you don't get hurt he is not co operating he's moving with him to make sure he's not injured.Go learn aikido from an experience aikido practitioner you'll change your mind.
Aikido I'm sure works if a person really had an expert that really knows what they're doing. Very much like the Bible, one can read it and get different perceptions. Aikido is similiar and anything else. But, read the Bible with understanding of things, it all comes together for a clear picture that works. Aikido, Morehei Ueshiba taught some willing to listen, but as things go on, some were not sure of techniques, but winged it. Time goes on, others do not learn that technique, so they do not learn that as well as what they don't learn on other techniques, as time goes on, the lineage creates a lot of incompetency. Which it happens and applies to anything. Like being pressure tested, original Aikido I bet works 100%. But dilution through time, it loses substance. Which something not seen in kudo's is a fast, powerful, vicious street dog. Where grab one arm, the other is already there, where it knocks a person senseless. Unless a person is really good.
If we don't put the history of aikidō into equation, yes, it doesn't work. Even if we put the history into the equation, that kind of aikidō may be extinct already or will be rejected by most aikidō communities. Aikidōka tends to wait as some of them are taught that there is no attack in aikidō. However, since a lot of aikidō communities have been stating themselves that aikidō is martial arts then, either they realize or not, they have put handicap on themselves. By stating there is no attack in aikidō it could means that aikidō have a very exceptional training method that provides an aikidōka with an ability to determine accurately 100% how the opponent(s) is (are) going to attack - an ability that's seek by all martial artists - or they don't know what they're stating - determining how an attack should be done beforehand is not an attack because any attacker will conceal the attack. If the above mentioned training method do exist and it's learning curve steepness is acceptable then it'll be famous already in many martial arts community such as the MMA communities as fighters will be willingly to queue to pay in order to master it since the mastery of it will determine their career. As long as aikidō keep the above mentioned teaching as is then aikidō will not works. If aikidō is meant only for self development or reconciliation in a sense making peace a verbal argument then it is better stop using the term martial arts - "Aikidō: Lifestyle based on martial principles" seems more appropriate - because like it or not martial arts always involving physical fighting in various forms as the name suggest.
That's also my point of view, aikido has some good stuff like finger wrist and standing arm locks which are usable, thats what akrochirismos in ancient Greece was. If you see for example the wrestling arm drag it begun like a standing arm lock in which you push the arm just a little higher from the wrist and with the other arm you lock the elbow to break the arm. If you test those aikido stuff in grip fighting you will find out that it can be a way for a smaller dude from arm controling to set up openings to throws and kansetsu, the problem now in self defence is that you don't have the time to set up those things with striking involved and using 2 arms in one without having body attachment is like asking to get hit. Be really careful with finger locks etc our fingers in judo take already loads of pressure you don't need that pain for a month or 2.I needed that relaxing music today thank you.
@@Chadi well I think you know already that Roy Dean has made a nice system in which you can use wristlocks and other aikido stuff on the ground , if you want to implement them in live grappling resistance you will have problems with bjj, wrestling or judo rulesets, tomiki aikido is lacking some elements and I don't remember very well the Japanese jj sport rulesets. If you have some friends that would like to test things is best. You need to test the things that are unique in aikido like the wristlocks and finger locks, the pure dodge techniques(like the ones melanchomas was using) that are penalized in sport and the sword techniques, if you try to change the full movement techniques like irimi nage then you will change aikido to something else! By what I see and know aikido is the art of getting uninvolved to use that you need a very specific ruleset environment and someone with very specific set of talends that can make it work which might not be you good luck with that.................
@@nikolaosmandamandiotis8970 i see but Roy put Aikido in bjj i was trying to keep aikido just aikido by adding grip fighting but the finish is aikido only
@@Chadi yep I understand, what I am saying is that what you want to achieve is extremely difficult, you need to be a small athletic guy with extreme reflexes and agility that also have forearm power of a champion arm wrestler to make it work. 😂 You can find some friends and try grip fighting to better yourself using aikido stuff and I tell you now that it's good and you can become fast in it and achive some rare and good ability by doing so, but from some photos of you I can understand that you don't fit the description of being the best in using aikido stuff in competition maybe some student of yours who knows but don't be diss hearted. I also want to add that it isn't like aikido implemented with other stuff doesn't work , its training methods are outdated if you want to add stuff to it, will contribute to its evolution , in the end it will evolve for sure.
Watch the National Geographic documentary on the Kendo 8th dan exams. That's where I learned what Aikido is about. It's all about what happens before the uke tries to strike you.
I'm interested to know if you learned in kotai and if you practiced the omote versions of the techniques with Tissier sensei. When I have visited Aikikai dojos I don't see those things. No kotai, no omote. I think that would "de-fang" Aikido. But I was told that what I was doing was more like Aiki budo. My teachers disagree with that and say that Ueshiba would never show his real Aikido on camera, only the ekitai style demos. Where I train the progression from kotai, to jutai, to ekitai and kitai is considered essential. It looks to me like the Aikikai start with almost ekitai and have missed the hard form.(kotai)
Jiu-Jitsu works. Aikido is uesheba's vision of do. The art of aikido is one of co-operation and the esoteric blending. Practice of those technique with the principle of the founder. Practice the JJ in aikdo as a combat art is different. Any art/system is only as good as the practioners understanding of it's strength and weakness. One must learn to fight before you cannot fight. Learn aikido after.aikido people aren't traditional fighters in my experience.
I don't know why so many Aikidoka are hell bent on trying to make it "Work". What for and why? What's wrong with just accepting the fcat it wasn't meant to be for self-defence.
I think it shouldn't be undereestimated in my opinion, because these throws and joint locks can hurt the opponent really bad...BUT if the practioner using Aikido alone then I agree that it won't work much or at all because Aikido is good for distract an oppenent and that is why I belivie how the made into a self defense martial art. I only heard bad reputation of it and its effectivness is not that effective. I have heard some of former aikidoka stories before they switched to other martial arts. What I've heard and seen, it might not be effective, but I wouldn't dare to underestimanting it like other martial arts.
Rokas "knows all techniques" required for passing a 1st DAN black belt test. But performs them on a beginner level of a 5th Kyu. No idea why you take him as an example :P
HI Chadi. Kano wanted to merge striking with Judo. When he saw Aikido, he realized it merged striking with throwing. So, he sent Tomiki to learn it and figure out how to merge it in a safe and competitive way. But, Kano died before Tomiki returned with a practical sparring version of Aikido. As a result, only the self defense kata techniques (Goshin-Jitsu) were modified. Kano knew that Judo was incomplete, but he died before he could add in the striking and grab counters.
Firstly, Rokas was going about it wrong. To quote from Lenny Sly from rogue warriors (and the leading man on practical Aikido on youtube) "if you let the attack present itself then Aikido will work". Rokas was looking for an irimi nage and kote gaeshi in his BJJ rolls which I knew it wouldn't work because he was forcing the conditions rather than letting the conditions appear. I have been in sparring situations of where i was in a clinch in which I saw an opportunity to pull off an aikido move. Aikido will work when the situation present itself. Won't work if you force a situation.
Why is that...because Aikido is more of a counterattacking art rather than attacking. So in other words it is defensive. Some Aikidokas may not agree with that but then I ask them "if it's not defensive, then why are you praying on the attack?"
Yes if you are attacking it is not Aikido... It is definetly counterattacking
@@ironjavs1182after a year, counter (kaeshi waza) is still Aikido.
Agree with many of your points. Personally I think the best way it to start with the weapons. That's the way I've gone, using a HEMA format, many of the techniques can then be applied. The locks can be built upon on top of that. I think that should be the foundation and after look at sparring with Taijutsu. That's a bit more challenging but I think it can be achieved if like you say its look upon as a grappling art. The rule set needs some thinking about but I share many of your views on the approach that should be taken.
I'm learning judo. My teacher is an 8th Dan Tomiki Aikidoka. The way he demos and explains is that aikido is judo at 2 arms length whereas judo is fighting within a single arms length. The physiological principles are the same. Kuzushi, Tsukuri, and kake. I have options to step off and away at an angle and bring him along. He has to be in motion.
Makes sense
Yes. This has been similar to my study. The aikido way can be understood if you imagine that the opponent has a knife. I think two arms space is what you need to maintain. This also makes sense of the stance since a back step is far superior in an aikido stance. Thank you teaching me the double arms space.
@@rayali6409 @Ray Ali If you're a grappler, try a clinch and drilling pummeling or handfighting and try stepping out and pulling Uke to you or shoving him out. I've found that this is where you can pull off a few of the movements. Waki Gatame, Gedan ate, Ushiro Ate into into Judo Shime waza. I build from pressure. Aikido has some useful skills.
I think there’s a perfect way to think about using Aikido under pressure; judo as two arms length distance.
@@vids595 I agree. Tomiki Aikido is Judo with arm locks and Atemi is all it is. Go try a dojo. You'd enjoy it because it's not the flowery flowey crap we commonly see.
My personal favorite martial arts videos on UA-cam! The aesthetic and informational quality of your videos is really beautiful and refreshing.
Thank you Cole
I really agreed with you, once I had a aikidoka student in my judo classes and always when we're doing kumi kata in the classes I saw him get some wrist locks so I believe it's might be the way to develop aikido finding gaps on kumi kata
Thank you
I think that in kumi kata you can apply nikyo if they get a lapel grip.
When I visited Wing Chun school during sparring I unconsciously did wrist locks, although the exercises were focused on fast wing chung jabs. So yeah, aikidokas are doing it thanks to years of training. My problem was wing chung practitioners does not push their body into the punch, so I had real issue with them.
When I was doing bjj for two years I was able to wrist lock ony few times. So between aikido and working throws and aikido techniques is a long way.
I hope to get there some day. Not yet thou.
The ‘mentality’ or ‘meta’ of Aikido works and seems to prove practical. For example, ‘attack with a triangle, take the opponent down with a circle, and pin them in a square.’
Sounds like a play station combination lol😝💪
In Tomiki Aikido, every wrist lock, arm lock and throw has a kuzushi(break balance) before it.
Also, Tomiki saw Judo as Aikido from the clinch and Aikido as Judo from kicking distance. Check out the Tomiki Aikido atemi waza, they're essentially push/trips.
"Everyone can do the same technique, but everyone has a different expression of it", so beautifully put mate, that's why I'm so hesitant to teach advanced Judo principles to my friends, how I perceive a throw is going to be completely different than how they do, especially with most of them being 194cm+ and me being only 185cm
Exactly! It's martial ART not martial science
if you teach principles,you are allowing for their individual strengths by definition.You dont perceive any throw,you may execute it a bit differently or set up differently but perception is irrelevant.185 CM is above average height.
Its like teaching the line of best fit for the class, but also then working to explain and give the principles and also the principles of how to make it their own flavour.
Same how an how to draw guide helps you learn to draw things but eventually you leave the guide and are able to draw it but with your own slight twist. Same with martial arts here.
@@Chadi Actually it was Bugei - Martial Sciences. Check how 14th c. Kashimashin ryu is named on their website...
I have used aikido waza and Tai Sabaki in judo randori so in some ways I’m on the same page with Chadi. I’d add, 1 having a sense of openings for techniques , and 2 some practical way of sensing uke’s force and using it. This has to be done by feel.
thanks for the nice video, and for me this is a big subject.
Im a shodan Aikidoka, started training in 2006, in an "iwama style" dojo. I also train BJJ, judo and , like you said many times in this video, im allways trying to make Aikido "work".
So far , i will agree with your conclusions in the video, yes something can be used here and there, but to little for wich i desire.
The most sucessefull usage of aikido techniques so far, is to escape from some disadvantageous positions with mostly sankyo and kotegaeshi. Mostly do defend the back and turtle positions, and with no possibility to make the opponent tap, but create oppening to reset guard or escape from back take. Also , "not an aikido technique" but inspired by, i came with a solution to escape the kimura trap, very simple and very effective"really", but strangelly hard to explain it to someone at the mat with no experience in Aikido.
That said, im in love with the three schools (aikido, judo, bjj), and the felling i get from training sessions is, from judo and bjj the training sessions are much more mentally relaxed, but physically ill end the training completly wasted, with a big smile, but wasted. Also judo and bjj are far far far more prone to get injuries.
From Aikido training, theres a strong "ritual" feeling, with a very mental focus (sometimes after a day working it really sucks ) but since your body warms up and start doing techniques it feels always very good. Also at the end im always much more energized then at the start ... so i think that in the health field, aikido is superior!! When you start to get old, maybe that becomes more important than techniques...
Just tho end, i think Aikido is a fight style that is frozen in time, it makes more sense when you used to walk japan towns of the past , with samurai status and weapons, and someone of lower ranks, with no swords or something, is trying to kill or rob you, he has to grab your arms tight to not let you draw your blades. also probably they will not attack you alone . Never. So newaza against two is not smart. So in this time and place i think , aikido makes a lot of sense to me, and i think the objective of Ueshiba sensei was to keep this (treasure) from old times alive. Like kendo or Iaido. A Iaido guy cant do anything against a judoka.
In this case im talking about wHat i think to be the true Ueshiba Aikido, not the Aikikai adaptation wich for me, is just martial themed gymnastics.
Thanks for the video, nice one.
If in Aikido katas, uke never releases the wrist after the grab, it is because he grabs to prevent tori from drawing a knife from his belt. If he lets the arm go, he's dead. That is why in Aikido, Uke's aim is to never let go the grab. We can't understand Aikido without weapons.
Randori against a live resisting opponent then as bruce lee said keep what works.
Tomiki Aikido, the style I studied under the great Karl Geis of Houston, Texas, incorporates randori. As you know, Kenji Tomiki was Hachidan Dan in both Kodokan Judo and Aikido, and believed that realistic sparing (randori & shiai) was the best way to develop the application of techniques to practical situations one may encounter in daily life. We had such at the Karl Geis dojo.
Shiai is needed in Aikido with a good structure of rules
@@Chadi yeah so Tomiki Aikido does have some randori - it s not really the best , its very restrictive and from my experience not done a lot. I'm a shodan in Tomiki , shodan in Judo and 1st degree black in BJJ - I don't train Aikido anymore - there is some great stuff in aikido and i catch people with wrist locks and wakigatame in rolling all the time.
But when asked i recommend people train judo, bjj, muay thai or boxing
AIkido has everything it needs provided everyone is reminded of its roots and include the 'jujutsu' back into the Aiki. The founder of Aikido knew very well what he was doing having studied many martial arts including Aikijutsu. I found that whole business with Rokas and his experience to be a joke which did generate a lot of commotion meaning a lot of hits and $$$ for his channel. Kudos for him. While there is nothing wrong with generating money and studying other 'martial arts ' to be well rounded I also find it myopic in nature. Why Rokas did not go back to his Aikido 'sensei'? I also listened very carefully to discussions and to my surprise Roy chose 'survival' over liberation at the end of the discussion, even after the claim that he could make anyone tap out. But wait! The whole aspect of a True Martial Way True BUDO is LIBERATION! No fear! I know that Roy also studied AIkido and without a doubt I can see in his videos his very good fluidity of movements in ne waza 'jujitsu' ground work a tribute to his Aikido years. Making space and controlling space is also an attribute of Aiki whether standing or on the ground. However, Liberation is where one should end. Free. I could easily ask any one of the so called experts if they could use this pride of theirs when they are very sick and dizzy with fever unable to stand up. If they could fight then or do if their loved one is held at gun point. Here's a true story. A 'big man' full of pride a drug lord went to New York for 'business'. He was of course staying at a well known prestigious hotel. Late evening he stepped out just a few steps from the entrance to the hotel. Two young black teen agers walked up to him and demanded his wallet and his Rolex watch. His response was something like. " You dare try to rob me? Do you know who I am?" He was shot dead on the spot and he lost his life his wallet and his Rolex watch. Hence false pride leads to nowhere. I trained a young man in Aikido.( including jujutsu) One day while on his motorcycle a police car stopped beside him with two police men inside at the stop light. As the light turned green the police man on the passenger side spat on him and laughed as they sped away. The young man followed them and caught up with them at the next stop light and asked for an apology which he did not get. In fact they stepped out of the car to arrest him! They ended up both wearing their own hand cuffs. He took pictures with the cell phone and called the police. They all ended up to the local police station where statement were taken the two policemen gave the apology and it all ended there. The superior officer promised that they were to be reprimanded for their actions.
Now as far as 'pressure testing' that is also a fallacy. Aikido can be as hard or as soft as one makes it. It is said that Chiba sensei's mat sometimes was spattered in blood. The "Ai" in Ai Ki Do has been misconstrued in our times. While care must be taken so as not to end up in silly over exaggerated movements, care must also be taken so as to avoid injuries. I have seen a person who tried to resist shiho nage you know 'pressure testing' and he ended up losing wrist elbow shoulder clavicle acromion and scapula sheared in two pieces along with a concussion as he flew though the air with a scream and landed hard on his head. Perfect tenkan spinning by the 'nage' using ai to control the movement blending in with a block of the shomen real punch stepping in irimi 'ki' and with atemi upper strike to the chin to raise the head of uke up, while putting the finishing touches with shiho nage tenkan mode. The jo's and belts had to be used to tie his body whatever was left of him to rush to the emergency. The doctors were screaming what the f****k did you do to him? You see this is not just a single point injury. It was total devastation over several parts of the skeletomuscular structure. So, harmony has been given this wrong aura of passivity. But this is wrong. Aikido is very dangerous provided one knows how to use it. Ai is the blending of the movement with the opponent 'uke' and works wonders if understood correctly in conjunction with 'ki' i.e using the energy i.e Momentum of opponent. Momentum M = mass * velocity It is wrong to think that in Aikido all moves are from dynamic movement. In fact movement can be initiated just as it is done in judo or jujitsu at clench. But wait! This is noting new. Momentum, it is used in Judo in Karate and Jujitsu etc. In fact Aikijutsu (Aikijujitsu) is where is stands and it was taught in the old times. Aiki 'do' is seen in the films where armies collide where opponents merge very fast with weapons at hand. Rokas and others have had bad experiences and? I laughed at his fist video in the ring with his jujitsu friend. In an instant, this so called 'black belt' in Aikido forgot all about ma ai aiki stances atemi waza irimi and tenkan etc etc He let his friend dictate the rules and the game. But wait this is done also by karate 'black belts' who in an instant forget their Shotokan Tae Kwon Do Goju Ryu Kempo Kenpo Kung Fu etc etc...and start behaving as wrong kick boxers! Where was Bunkai? Nowhere to be found! But wait! There is more! I see black belt Judokas as soon as they get a good ippon they think they won! that it is all over. But alas it is not so. In combat there are no silly jujitsu greco roman etc etc rules or gloves. But for those who know there is truly Budo a path to Liberation a poem waiting to be written a whisper in the wind a flash of the blade or a .357 magnum. What separates Aikido is intent. Once learned one has the authority to chose techniques at high level which provide good defense without causing damage to the other person unless necessary. It takes time to reach this level but it can be done. Pure and simple truth. Aikido gives a path for young and old alike it can be practiced in many ways and it can formulate the basis for any other art.
Chillout bro, Aikido is fake and gay, you people keep blabbering and lose every challenge and altercation pretending to be enlightened.
Pure bollocks haha
"It's just my two cents"...Your two cents are worth a nickel, Chadi
It’s interesting Chadi that the newsreel you used for this article documents the place, time and characters that were critical in taking Aiki from a jitsu-form to a do-form.
The place is Iwama, a rural retreat where Ueshiba isolated himself at the end of the war till the 50’s with Saito ( see 6:57 approx). In Iwama he started to introduce jo & bokken into the syllabus plus much more of the Omoto-Kyo ‘world peace’ attitudes into the syllabus. It was here that the stance was changed to emulate a swordsman and atemi was removed. This is the birth of AikiDO and the the 2 men critical in the popularisation in the West are Tohei (Ki Society) & Kisshomaru Ueshiba ( see 9:49), Moreihi’s son both men were architects of the post-war western boom in aikiDO.
Gozo Shioda who was one of the pre-eminent pre-war Ueshiba students was awarded his Dan rankings not in AikiDO but AikiJITSU. Yoshinkan Aikido retains atemi. The Tokyo Riot Police still train in Yoshinkan Aikido not because of its efficacy in a arrest situation of a 1:1 (they have Judo for that) but because it works in a riot or melee or 1:1+ situation.
If your interested have a look at ua-cam.com/video/He-OfRI1V-I/v-deo.html. Sensei Andò is a direct student of Shioda.
The other man that should be looked at for helping to make some form of Aikido more ‘realistic’ is Tomiki who maintains competitions & sparring as part of his syllabus.
The Aiki-Kai style is not all there is to Aikido.
Many thanks Chadi for putting your channel up, it’s really excellent material and great topics.....all the best
Finally, it’s not styles that contend but people.
Sorry but what's the difference between -do and -jitsu? Is -do with weapons?
@@เด็กพเนจร-ฝ4ษ jitsu is a fighting system and do is a martial 'way' or journey. The Japanese were forced after WW2 to change their militaristic culture by the allies. So a lot of martial arts were changed to a 'do' (Ju Jitsu became Judo) to demonstrate that it was an ethical form of exercise for the body and mind. Usheba who founded Aikido was a war veteran of the Manchurian war (and became very accomplished with the bayonet and hand to hand fighting). He was against Japan's aggression in WW2 and withdrew from public life. He later promoted Aikido as a way of bringing peace and understanding to the world. But it's hard to translate the Japanese words literally and get a sensible meaning in English.
@@N17C1interesting, as I read do was added during growing nationalism in pre war Japan, like aikido and karate-do to meet govermental approval. But I do not study Japans history and it is one statement against the other.
Toshiro Suga and the late Nobuyoshi Tamura's dialectic approach to aikido definitely add a level of realism and logic to how technique should be performed. My teacher trained with them when he was young in Brittany.
I hear you! And I love the visual content of this video so much. Thank you for this.
habibee..you are a scientist I never saw kuzuzhi like that until you said it how you said It. Thank you
Aikido already work. It is people that keep forcing it to be something else. Aikido is an internal art like Tai Chi. Meaning the work is from inside-out. The physical, combat,... comes last or later. In Tai Chi mastering Chi comes first. In Aikido mastering Aiki which first would be Ki comes first. Those that don't want to go this path end up turning them to grappling arts, stripped of almost everything. But made useful for specific purpose other than it's original.
My take on modernizing Aikido is to literally teach the Aikidoka the full range of MMA and then judge their rank by how well they can defend earnest attacks (from Aikidoka who learned MMA, and even at open mats at BJJ, Karate, Judo etc schools) using only Aikido. Not requiring pro MMA athletes, but amateurs who know what they're doing, who can at least place at local tournaments in their own arts
It would probably die out if it took that approach (because that's 15-20+ years to black belt, if people can even get there) But that's basically where I am with it, aside from making a pentathlon (or beyond) of specific, live resistance situational sparring situations with scoring (which I think could at least drive home the value in a demo-type way while still being basically honest). IE, as the uke, you get points for resisting well... therefore, uke are going to be doing their best to resist.
Aikido makes way more sense in the context of various different situational sparring events than it does one unifying event like Judo randori
Kind of like how you can break BJJ up into pass-sweep-submit, or escape-from-mount, or escape-from-side control, or escape-from-backmount etc. Aikido makes way more sense broken up into specific goal type situational sparring sessions, which is basically how 100% of my ten years of Aikido training so far has been (just, not formally recognized as such).
Yes and resistance is everything
Why MMA?....MMA is not the ultimate criteria on the effectiveness of martial arts...especially in the context of self defense which deals with non-consensual attacks. MMa is a contest so it deals with consensual attacks.
If any Aikido school would want to make it effective for self defense then I say follow the ideas of Iain Abernethy.
Historically Aikido techniques are rooted in weapons training. If you try & apply them in a different context than originally intended, then of course they aren't going to work.
Yeah, and fully armored sometimes running past each other like in Braveheart.
All the traditional Japanese martial arts were rooted in weapons training and were for the battlefield. The samurai wore armor on the battlefield.
@@susanohara4274 I never said they weren't. However the specific focus of this video is on Aikido.
Tenshin Gakuen Bugei Aikido was created by Shihan Steven Seagal, by incorporating kara te, reincorporating daito ryu and adding some element like hubud lubud from FMA.
Sadly aikikai discourages anything different than them
There's sparring w strikes, and sparring without. If something can't work with all grappling aloud without strikes, then it can't work with and doesn't really matter if super isolated. Aikido is a part of Grappling, it's up to Grapplers to add to their toolbox, and up to Aikidokas to you know, actually be good at grappling. Most couldn't even do Random Grab Defense with Aliveness, and they are literally the art the specializing in grab defense.
Agreed
I see Aikido in MMA all the time!
My Aikido instructors were Judo/wrestling coach's first. Many with backgrounds in Karate, boxing, etc.. I tell you this to point out the very common misconception that Aikido is a set of questionable techniques. This is not what Aikido is. Aikido is a set of principles. Anytime one responds to an attack by "blending" or finding/using the path of least resistance it is Aiki. Slipping a punch is Aikido principle... Many of the techniques in Aikido are found in so many other Martial Arts. Martial arts that people don't tend to question so much.
The principles of Aikido are sound! They align beautifully with boxing, wrestling, Judo, and even aspects of Karate. Many of the techniques were already proven in combat before O'sensei was born. So, this earned reputation came from somewhere. And, I believe you touched on at least one major contributor. Pressure testing/sparring/randori ... But, I feel the need to point out another glaring reason for this reputation. That reason is the mindset of and the type of people this Martial Art attracts. It is most often people that are looking for something "spiritual" or something to give them some exercise. Most have never been and never plan on being in any type of physical altercation. Let alone voluntarily stepping up to compete in a fight. I can't even count how many ponytailed, skinny, "hippy" types I have witnessed training in this art. Because, it is beautiful and many find some spiritual fulfillment training Aikido. It's traditional, or, "It looks cool"... As we all know it is the Martial artist more than the martial art that really matters.
When I went to my Judo coaches as an Aikido black belt in 1994 as suggested by my Aikido Sensei I knew they had a background in Aikido as well. But, I never expected them to tell me that I already had the fundamentals and only needed to learn a few things in order to start competitions. One of the first things I learned was that Aikido does work. If your mind is right. And, your understanding of reality is crisp. That is the big flowing movements are smaller, faster, and sometimes "the path of least resistance" means using atemi! The goal is gentle flowing techniques that sends your opponent crashing to the mat. The reality doesn't always look so nice. And, that is ok. That is still Aikido.
O'sensei believed that Aikido was the study of the spirit. He Also believed that Aikido techniques should evolve. Having said this, I believe that is an excellent Martial Art that could benefit or compliment almost anything a martial artist does. What is important is the mindset of the students AND the instructors. If they don't align it's a waste of time. If the instructors are trying to teach a practical self defense through their art they better understand the difference between the beautiful flowing cooperative Aikido training and pressure tested raw physical altercations! The students need to have a clear understanding of what it is they are looking for before picking an instructor. And, ask a lot of questions.
Sorry for the book. I could too easily go on and on. If you read this far I appreciate it.
the point is that you cannot make any principle work without contact sparring and aikido never does that so its techs are entirely useless outside self improvement which is a worthy pursuit in itself.The principles used in wrestling ,and boxing have absolutely no relation to japanese nonsense,they were developed through trial and error.
@@scarred10
Shows what you know. It's like you are telling someone that their plane will never fly after they have already landed! We always went hard! Principle is another word for fundamental. With just a little more nuance in this case. The underlying principles are the same in EVERY fighting style! Balance, breathing, timing, focus, coordination, mindset, and so on. We have one head, one torso, two arms, two legs.
As for being useless, you are referring to most of the more traditional "protect your opponent" Aikido that most people know. The funny thing is that even in those schools you will find many valid techniques that have been proven in combat and tournament! Do you really think that some old Japanese guy just decided to make up a bunch of new, never seen techniques?! One could look at all martial arts as the strategy, and the "style" or specific techniques as tactics. And, we could argue semantics or whether it's "real Aikido" because of strikes or "aggression". But, it is still Aikido.
As I said originally, I see Aikido in MMA ALL the time! Many times it's ignored because it's subtle, or not understood. And, many times because it looks so much like something else, or something else that people are more familiar.
"If you know the way broadly you will see it in everything." - Miyamoto Musashi
@@SkorLord where exactly do you see any aikido in mma, given that none of them even train in it.Common principles are found in many styles but only a few can make those principles work due to useless training methods.Yes I do think the old masters just practised and taught hypothetical techniques,most are complete nonsense.
@@simonedwards5437 not my point,If you dont train it with full resistance like mma,it doesmt work.MMA is a fight between skilled fighters so theres a lot that wont work in that that may on the untrained.
@@scarred10
Never got a notice...
I could give you a list of solid examples of Aiki techniques and footwork being successfully used in mma. But, without some point of reference or actual knowledge you might just say that they are actually this technique from that martial art, it was a fluke, a coincidence, or it was rather insignificant in the totality of the fight.
That is one of the biggest issues here. You might only have half knowledge of what we are talking about. I will be the first to admit that many traditional martial arts schools are like cults teaching watered down crap. Especially, the " soft style " martial arts of which Aikido is included.
As mentioned in my original "book", Aikido and other " soft style " martial arts tend to attract a certain type, and what you end up with are 90% of the schools filled with soft people that one way or another do not understand why or what they are really doing. All due respect.
Those people then open up schools and before you know it we have tons of crap schools representing the art. I have literally heard an Aikido instructor suggest that "training in any other discipline was a waste of time." HE had never been in a real fight... Heard one say " There are no strikes in Aikido. " also false!
So, I can understand a lot of why people hold the belief that Aikido is complete junk. I have seen the same demonstrations on UA-cam and the same soft skinned, weak wristed representatives demonstrating techniques while showing anyone with actual experience they have never been in a real fight inside or outside of a ring. You know, like McDojos.
Mike Tyson and Muhammad Ali were both great. Their styles were VERY different, but both still boxers. So was Adam Corolla. It doesn't make him equal or the same! The Karate instructor I had was only a Karate instructor. The Aikido instructors however were originally Judo/Jujitsu guys that sent me to train Judo which was also full of State and national Judo champions along with a couple Olympians. Coaches with wrestling and Karate resumes. Mats filled with cops, parole officers, and prison guards. It was about as hard nosed as you got for the early 90's. We were " mixed martial artists" before the term existed! I say that to press the point that not all schools/gyms/dojos/dojang are created equal.
I have done Aikido specific techniques successfully many times. I don't know how many of those guys were trained. I can say that a few were definitely not. But, I can also say some of the techniques work great in Judo competition against resisting opponents as well. I wouldn't suggest Aikido was someones first or only martial arts training. But, it can help improve just about anything else you have trained if you can find a knowledgeable, seasoned instructor.
Very good video. Iam a Genbukan practioner, and you are totally right.
Keep going, man. 🙏🙏
Just train Daito Ryu. This is the combative art which Ueshiba learned from Sokaku Takeda. Later renouncing violence & fighting, joining a pacifist cult, he created Ai ki do as a form of physical, co-operative, excercise which he stated in his writings as for excercise only and not for fighting. It doesn't work cause it wasn't designed to be for fighting. Daito Ryu is for combat: weapon retention, counter siezing, art for court guards.
It will have the same issues as Aikido when paired with judo or bjj or other martial sport.
Like Aikido, those techniques work, in the time of the samura,i with blades involved.
That's martial sports that it may not work for. But for self defense different story.
Shioda Sensei and his students used Yoshinak Aikido effectively on the street.
Aikido should be looked as like Krav maga when it was created... Back In the days In israel they didnt teach krav maga until u have reach at least blackbelt In any other martial Art like karate, judo, wrestling, boxing or kickboxing... It was like a "knife" to be added to your arsenal that u already have... Morihei Ueshibas first students was already complete fighters or martial artist.. He wanted to add the opposite of hurting fellow humans.... Thats the major flaw in modern Aikido... In order to make it work,first you need to learn how to fight ...
This was very interesting. I also started with aikido as a little boy... then in high school when I joined the wrestling team, I realized what it was really like to go against a resisting opponent... I agree with a lot of what you said... When I was practicing BJJ/grappling at a MMA school some 10 years ago I would occasionally try wrist locks on the ground when on top and sometimes they worked... There might be a way to make nikkyo type shoulder and elbow locks work too, or irmi throws using momentum... I can't try them now though since I stopped training... But looking at various non-traditional aikido styles on UA-cam that have sparring like Tomiki, Hatenkai, and Aikido SA, they all look interesting but also each with some weaknesses... Probably the best is to combine the aikido techniques in a grappling setting like judo or BJJ as you said.
Chadi you are spot on in regards to Aikido. 👊👍
Ramsey Dewey has a thing about "Drills vs sequencing" If you say "applying in a drill is very different than in sparring" I take that to mean "applying in a sequence is very different than sparring" because in Ramsey's dichotomy, drilling is with live resistance
it is different, drilling vs sparring, but not nearly as different. Drilling is basically situational sparring in a narrower range of situations.
At my Aikido dojo, we don't spar, but we only sequence at the white belt level. All practice is basically drilling from about 3-6 months in and beyond. And we're one of the rare schools where if you can embarrass a black belt by not being thrown, to a point anyway, you should embarrass that black belt. I would very much count that as pressure testing, just not as complete as sparring
It's frustrating in part that Aikido is so fragmented that it's hard to make sweeping generalizations about any of it.
So this only comes from reading about aikido and from certain Japanese teachers I've seen on video, but the most missing part of aikido seems to be the removal of atemi in modern times. Shoji Nishio, who emphasized that the real world effectiveness of any martial art is of utmost importance, even went so far as to say every aikido technique should use atemi. Basically you should strike them before any grappling begins. I'm paraphrasing his words, I can't remember exactly, but I get his point. He was a head instructor in Aikido, but I forget which school, but he also practiced karate, and kenjutsu of some type. What do you think about this? Was this mindset forgotten or phased out of modern aikido?
I think that you are seeing Aikido as a sport. We know perfectly well that somebody holding your wrist is an unlikely attack, and that maintaining that grip while you do all kinds of things to them is unlikely. They hold your wrist because as a beginner you might need a predictable structure to engage with. They hold you because if they fear they are about to be hurt they have the option of letting go, this applies to techniques where a throw is involved, which you might call art but is also training to fall. Kaitennage for instance is usually practised this way but, it is also possible to do this technique or parts of it with tori holding uke who then does not have this choice. Strikes make many techniques possible and of course many techniques are quite possible against an unwilling opponent but something will break. I agree that much of what you see does not work and I groan when I see high dan grade senseis doing their stuff from this contact or thowing light ukes, often women, about. Aikido as Kata does not work but, if you practice Kata, which is what the techniques are, you will arrive at something that will.
Doesn't kata only serve as a memorisation tool where you can extrapolate infinite possibilities to apply the principles taught by them? So learn how to freely use these principles is part of the Kata way.
I refer to Iain Abernethys Kata videos. He explains it best. (Btw Roka is also a great fan of him)
Mr Affability: when you say "we know perfectly well that someone holding your wrist is an unlikely attack" i think that youve hit on one of the biggest Aikido misunderstanding in the martial arts world, both by observers and by practitioners. Wrist grabbing IS an unlikely attack when you have two unarmed people who are not trained in a grappling system. When you are trained in a grappling system, wrist control becomes indespensible. Youre never going to be good at grappling, especially standing, no gi grappling, without a stead focus on wrist control. Furthermore, in a situation where one of the combatants has a short sword or a knife in their hands grabbing the wrist - even locking on to it for dear life and not wanting to let go - becomes highly intuitive. My suspicion is that at least some significant amount of Aikido curriculum would become more plausible if Aikidoka would understand them in these contexts - that the uke is either trying to control your wrist because you have a weapon in your hand or because they have some grappling knowledge and are attempting wrist control as the first step to initiating one of their own techniques.
@@harageilucid4352 I am not an expert in the matter of grappling, but breaking a grip is easy even for a much weaker person who knows Aikido properly. If a grip is taken that is something of a gift since then at the least, that hand is not going to hit you and with Aikido a small movement will check the attackers movement. People are critical of Aikido because either they don't understand it or they think that they do. There is Aikido and Aikido and some systems are too limited, fine details are not taught.
@Stanly Stud So what's your expertise?
@Stanly Stud QED.
I agree. If Akido would remove some of the traditional practices and pressure test the technique and scrap what does not work, it could be an effective system to add to, let’s say an mma fighters tool box. It would be neat if some one with the Akido background would do that and market it.
Interesting video. Thanks for posting. I think the problem with aikido is one of perception and understanding.
I think sometimes the techniques appear to be so seductive and beautiful that it's easy to lose sight of what is being supposed to be taught and learned at the heart of the Art.
In my opinion techniques are often incorrectly taught as an end in themselves instead of a means to an end and so their real purpose is lost.
Also, there is a misconception about the nature of the Art in that it is supposedly primarily an unarmed grappling art in the same way as Judo and jujitsu.
This I think is only partly true and leads to the erroneous conclusion that it is optimally designed for grappling distance and applications similar to those other arts.
So what is aikido if not primarily a grappling art? In my opinion it is a weapon art trained in an empty handed context. In that sense it's purpose, effectiveness and value can be discerned.
Pure Aikido will never be a viable option for the Octagon as it is another type of animal altogether not suited for that environment. That doesn't mean that there arnt things within the system that cant indeed be used in real life physical conflict situations, it just means that its not designed optimally to be a competitive combat sport..
I think if martial artists from.other disciplines try to look at the Art through different glasses they may find some some useful insights that will help them in their own journey.
@chadi
When are you going to make an video about Judo and Hapkido?
Both Osensei and Shioda sensei said that Aikido is 70% Atemi i.e. striking the vital points of the opponent! After you have softened up and distracted the attacker, you can apply a suitable throw or lock.
@Susan O'Hara ..I think the atemi and kuzush drilled at the beginning of every basic Yoshinkan technique are not meant to be a means to execute a throw or pin later on.
The strike is really meant to take the other guy out. Uke's counter response in protecting the face is really the point at which the aikido pin or throw are applied.
In other words the correct martial application to being grabbed is to break the others posture and simultaneously apply a strike in an attempt to knock them out.
That is why Ueshiba taught that in a real life and death situation atemi is 90% of aikido effectiveness.
@@eliosanciolo9418 ua-cam.com/video/w67NPPyUouk/v-deo.html
I read that both Osensei and Gozo Shioda sensei said that Atemi is 70% Aikido! Its the same with Judo and Jujitsu on the street.
@@susanohara4274 70 or 90% doesn't really matter. The point is that atemi is of primary importance in life and death situation in aikido.
I think that unfortunately many mainstream aikido schools sell the spiritual aspect of the Art before the martial application...to a demographic which is by it's very nature, not martially orientated. This has overtime led to the degradation and dilution of the true spirit of the Art.
From my understanding old school Judo also had a similar concept. Today strikes have been removed from competitive Judo along with some if the more dangerous throws...and so it has ceased to be the Art it once was.
@@eliosanciolo9418 The focus in Judo and in modern BJJ is sport and not self defence. In Aikido, especially the so-called Ki Aikido, the focus is on the artform and on Ki development. They don't practice Aikido for self defence! Modern Aikido training has no resisting partner or free sparring. It's not effective on the street.
@Stanly Stud ua-cam.com/video/E5FEAXTyYLE/v-deo.html
Bit of and old video , but I thought I would add something.
One aspect that has helped make my Aikido work (besides practicing against resistance occasionally) is being a bit of a screw up. I mean I have been doing Aikido for a while and I mes up all the time in the dojo. I make it a habit, when I screw up, not to chase after rhe technique I was trying to do, but to immediately improvise a technique from whatever position uke and I happen to be in. This leads to a greater ability to react to resistance. It is not perfect or the only thing ivdo, but it is definitely a part.
Apparently the development of Ki, learning how to read movement and intent, how to test others and harmonize with them in order to guide them into the resulting immobilization by minimal pain didn't result in an understanding of these "training" techniques so that you could apply them to other martial arts. As practice and testing progress it is more than possible to advance them in terms of submission and lethality. As you go up in rank , experience and awareness so are you allowed to use weapons and practice defense and offense in such a way that you understand the potential and consequences of your action. Randori is part of the upgrading of the student in Aikido. Aikido is taken up by many serious Martial artists to give them a greater understand of mind and body flow and they say it fine tunes and deepens their other practices in much the same way taking Ballet helps sportsmen.
Salut Chadi,
"Making aikido work" ...
My next question will be "work against what? in what situation? What kind of opponent?, For what?"
You said it well, "the problem is not the technique, it is how to get to it" ...
Everything depends indeed on the purpose and the spirit engaged during the "contemporary" practice of aikido or any other type/style of martial-arts.
It is obvious that any style/type is teached and practiced within a sphere of pre-established rules.
Making any "style" work "in front" of any kind of other "style" is in my opinion a very unclear "target" ... (as the rules of each "style" can be on/for "both sides" a trap and disadvantage) .... unless the "question" is concerning "ritual" and not "survival" skills and applications ....
Merci for the work you're doing !
I love this, thank you for the video
Thank you
For any martial art to be combat effective, full contact free style sparring is absolutely necessary. Modern Aikido, Tai Chi and most of the Chinese internal martial arts lacks this! Kata (drills/fixed patterns) are only for learning the techniques. Its impossible to learn to be effective on the street, the battlefield on in an MMA ring without the practice of free sparring.
Just start sparring lite, you will learn what works and what doesn't. In my sparring using aikido. Moves must be short and fast. I mainly use any outside techniques
"Aikido is a grappling art".....Yes it is...and should be taught that way.
My problem with aikido or at least the aikido I have been exposed to is its completely unrealistic to real life, it is more based on the idealistic rather than the realistic. Uke's so compliant that they are doing most of the technique for the tori. I have done techniques quite poorly in the past and yet my uke is still flying, just seems like it's purely choreography, rather than pressure tested self defence. If a high percentage of someone's training is mostly to always compliant then that is all they know how to do. This is my experience
I’ve been thinking about this as well .i don’t practice but I find aikido to be very interesting and amazing to watch.there demos have been developed to a very high level to the point that most arts would look basic compared to a top aikido demo. I am very interested in Kung fu and it has similar criticisms but it’s mostly just misunderstood.i do think you contradict yourself by saying you want to keep it aikido and change the system to be like judo rules. The problem is the moves depend on a lot of momentum instead of an equal struggle . My idea is to stress what aikido does best which is evasive footwork.my old teacher once gave us a demonstration of different arts that he knew when he got to aikido he said their footwork is supreme and I agree though Bagua is also very good .i see a simple hack that might fix the art . One thing I noticed is that sometimes the uke will fake with footwork so he’ll start stop and then go in but what they won’t do is fake with the hand technique. Here’s where I differ . If they did it would be easy to foul up the nage’s move. .imagine faking a wrist grab and throwing a punch so this is where the choreographed moves would break down . Now the solution for the nage could be to rely on his footwork rather than his hands. . This way he would be developing his best attribute, his footwork to deal with progressively more realistic attacks . That being said there is a form of aikido that is much more realistic and it is called Shodokan aikido . -Steve
How to make Aikido work. Nishio Sensei already solved that conundrum, and thankfully more Aikidoka are waking up to his ideas.
PS Rokas is not a good source for understanding Aikido.
I have to check how aikido works when tori has weapon in scabbard / holster. Maybe the whole idea on aikido is when someone is blocking tori to not take his sword or knife.
You’re right about the need to pressure-test aikido - this was one of the key reasons why aikido, as well as its parent art, Daito-ryu, were held in such high regard in their original forms in the early 20th century. But what makes these arts unique from most other jujutsu systems are the methodologies for developing and utilizing aiki in its original form within both of these martial arts. Aiki is a Taoist internal body skill that allows for the techniques in aikido, which are ineffective as conventional jujutsu techniques, to unbalance uke / opponents with minimal effort independent of timing and waza. Unfortunately the accurate interpretation and understanding of aiki and the training needed to achieve it has diminished over time, but is still preserved by a relatively small number of branches and practitioners of Daito-ryu and aikido. The following video interview provides some introductory insights regarding this topic: m.ua-cam.com/video/mMji6NAFaxg/v-deo.html.
You should name this video: “How to make aikido work … in a way it was never intended to work”
Morph aikido in a judo- o BJJ- like sport is a weird sort of idea. Like morph bowling into combat sport. Aikido indeed is an art of smooth rolling the partner (and been rolled by him) with great philosophy and, yes, with some extrapolated implementations in self defense.
@@vids595 millions of people throughout the world are enjoying to practice aikido. Do you really think all of them doing this just because they are deceived by false promise - to become eventually gods of self-defence? Id rather suspected, they already have found their (different) deep reason to stay with the art.
Chadi hello suppose we mix it with Aikijutsu OR Aikibudo? Or Boxing??
Yes that's good too
However here is one more element missing and that element is confidents listen i study Kokikai Ryu Aikido i am so confident in my art because i know it works plus i was a fighter before i studied in this system. I mix boxing in it
So if I cross train in Judo I won't just add a more functional martial art, but actually make my aikido more functional?
Combine Kumi Kata from Judo with Tomiki Aikido Hanasu Kata....grips and releases.
Its simple, if you know how to fight u can make Aikido work👌
Is steve segal all show no go? Is he theatre or reality? C van damme was my hero as kid until I found out his style no work against judo/bjj.
I was watching the video of OSensei. One thing I have seen him do that when someone is "attacking" him, he always move in the blind side of the uke. but he moves clockwise and counterclockwise. Trying to go in an always defensive position cuts down the timing. Aikido, should cut sown of movements in the technique: Execute the technique as quickly as you can by subduing your opponent as quickly as possible. Do not wait for your opponent to attack, move your whole body like a dynamic sphere and mess up the body axis of your opponent. Lastly have the confidence in your techniques: In the street, your opponents have the mental attitude to control, to rob you and kill you. You can't be "nice" under these circumstances. Chadi, what is your observation of O'sensei on the video?
Aikido was part of the Samurai hand to had combat which include a long sword and a short sword. The meaning behind the attacks on the Aikido person means that he is holding a sword while the attackers are trying to take away his sword from killing them.
This is like a Kabuki acting.
Aikido was introduced after WW2 during the American occupation of Japan until the 1970s. Aikido, Judo, and Karate were all introduced as self defense instead of a fighting art from the days of the Samurai.
Without the sword or other weapons, Aikido is just an exercise routine for burning calories and keeping the human body flexible just like a Yoga exercise.
Aikido is like a Cobra snake without teeth and venom to hurt anybody.
Aikido was meant to hurt and kill feudal conscripts from farms and streets during wars between feudal warlords.
The feudal conscripts had very little experience in hand to had combat or to fight against a Samurai with a sword.
Aikido and Judo were called Jiu Jitsu as a generic name for a Samurai’s hand to had fighting techniques.
Changing Jiu Jitsu into a modern and non-deadly practice allowed for many people to learn some part of the martial art of a once deadly technique of a Samurai.
Modern Aikido has many useful techniques for wrestling against an attacker with little or no knowledge of martial art.
Aikido techniques today is difficult to use against a skilled martial art fighter like a boxer or a Greco Roman wrestler.
There are many martial art schools today that can fight agains Aikido compared to the feudal days of ignorant peasants with just brute force and a hot temper for a weapon.
Chadi, I think you should create a new art, Chadikido 😃, that's Aikido that works. 😃
Hahaha thank you but i believe that there people that are far more better than me that can do that
@@Chadi haha. Ok, thank you for replying 😃
As a Japanese jujutsu instructor, I have had several students in law enforcement & corrections officers that have told me that they have used aikido finger, wrist and arm locks many times with success. Many of the throws requiring moving the opponents…not so much. I guess that makes sense. Finger, wrist and arm locks were removed or altered from judo because of safety issues. Meaning that they work very well in self defense. But not useful for sport.
Aikido works. Have to use atemi waza.
thats critical!! Ueshiba sensei some time said, aikido is 90% atemi.
Good thinking, however let's not forget that the striking components teach to keep the right distance. That's a very strong element of the Aikido teaching, it would be a loss not to teach it. It is very clear when practicing weapons. BJJ puts a lot of emphasis on keeping the right distance in different scenarios if I'm not mistaken. Plus, you get to train explosive forwards, backwards and sideways movements that are typical of weapons training and that is a loss too. Mainstream Aikido doesn't teach any of that unfortunately, no explosive power...that would be a loss for Aikido.
Check out Hein's approach to Aikido
Weapon attacks
Sword and long (or even blunt) weapons?
(The knife being a tricky weapon to deal with)
I don't do Aikido but it seems to me it's more suited against the sword.
All the "deliberate" attacks seem more akin to weapon attacks.
Police?
Not a lot is said on this subject.
Really great research in martial arts history.
Very interesting.
Aikido relies on the swing motion not to defend or work specifically with swords, you imitate the gesture of sword swinging even in open hand in order to move your partner (watch bruno gonzales), but i understand it has many dimensions and philosophical roots, I'm trying to make it a grappling functional art like judo and the others.
Your comment on my recent video disappeared, I'm not sure if you deleted it or UA-cam did, but yes i should also review the movie
Aikido pre ww2 was brutal,after ww2 more spiritual. Funny Bouncers know how to use Aikido.You just have to have a certain mind set.I feel perfectly fine with my yellow/black stripe in Ryu Aikido.Have no Fear.
This is exactly the same take that I have.
Morehei Ueshiba, Osensei, the founder, himself wrote that Aikido is for excercise only and not for fighting. Morehei Ueshiba was an expert in the combative art of Daito Ryu but upon joining a pacifist cult he renounced violence and created aikido as an excercise program and partner assisted choreography to propagate trust, harmony and peaceful human interaction. When he taught self defense he taught Daito Ryu. When he taught Aikido he stated it was not a fighting art but was for excercise only. Read The Art Of Peace by Morehei Ueshiba and read Invincible Warrior the biography of Morehei Ueshiba for reference. If the founder himself taught Aikido was not for fighting why do many aikidoka try to prove it's useful for fighting? The few partner assisted choreography joint locks and throws of Aikido are remnants from Daito Ryu. Daito Ryu applies the locks & throws in a combat effective manner so Aikidoka should just train Daito Ryu if they desire to make aikido locks & throws combat effective in counter-grappling.
Aikido works fine for me. Not sure why you are all having difficulty. If someone has taught you that tsuki is a jab, then they don't know Aikido. If you want a sport like MMA, BJJ or Judo, don't try to shoe-horn Aikido into it. But if you want to stay alive then Aikido is perfectly useful it's just no good for scoring points. Really good Ukemi will save you from injury better than knowing perfect Kote geashi. So, rather than viewing Ukemi as some sort of 'fake' way of making people look good, look at the guy who just received a Ju Jitsu style arm lock and throw and survived and stood back up. One thing I recommend to every Aikido dojo is the Jiuwaza after every class is critical to the learning. It's avoided by many dojos but without it, you don't learn the techniques in motion.
I agree a lot with what you say and that's actually how I found your channel in the first place. However there's a channel called chushintani that made me rethink a lot, with what aikidos goals are in self-defense. It would be interesting if you had discussions with other aikidokas about this.
Isn't randori supposed to be the pressure testing?
I'll check it out and yes Randori is sparring and pressure testing.
@@Chadi so based on that we can't blame aikido regarding not pressure testing, because that's what the randori is for. Rather we gotta blame the aikidokas misunderstanding what randori is. Just as in karate we have people teaching gedan barai as a low block, while in actuality it means lower sweep.
@@IbrahimKhalil-bt9yh i agree
I think its only supposed to be taught to people with already a backround in martials arts to start with. It's and addendum to what you already know. By it self it doesn't even teach you how to punch so can you know how to dodge? The grips and joint locks are phenomenal however.
I understand that when it was first invented or founded Ueshiba invited top tier martial artists, but in today's age people with no martial backgrounds are training and i want it to adapt so it can at least work on practical level not on a philosophical level only.
@@Chadi I think the main issue with it and alot of traditional M.A. is that it works primarily with join locks on hands and from strikes. Its ALOT easier to get someone in an arm bar on the ground then dodging a punch and applying a wrist grip while on the feet. To this day I've never seen it applied in combat scenario, not sport or real life.
Sakaruba Genius
A person trained in Daito Ryu Jujutsu techniques which is for real-life combat fighting, knows that Aikido is a version of the jujutsu that looks ineffective but the possibility and wisdom hidden in its techniques to transform from "harmless" to lethal forms is not lost to him. Aikido is a gift of deception of the martial arts world of Japan for the foreigners and outsiders to train and study, a "face" of their martial arts to show that is "non violent" in creed and acceptable for all to to train. The time came when they decided that foreigners must not learn the original fighting arts, but that they must be given watered down versions of all deadly martial arts techniques of the different martial arts schools of Japan for their honor, prestige and power to survive even after their defeat in the war. So Aikido was introduced, all judos, jujutsus and karates were turned into lame sports, and the ultimate Japanese art of killing using empty hands and weapons was hidden from all except for the original keepers of that knowledge.
Can you make a video about Real Aikido and about Ljubomir Vracarevic?
Sure I'll add it to my list
@@Chadi thank you
there is no real aikido and ive seen the ridiculous videos your talking about
@@scarred10 There is a martial art called "Real Aikido", and it was invented by Ljuba Vračarević... How realistic it is, its very questionable.
@@nikolauricic2641 that's what I mean aikido isn't real and you can't make it so
To see how Aikido works in Real grappling vs MMA/BJJ/Judo Pro's here ua-cam.com/video/n6BaK-huDRU/v-deo.html&t=
Thank you for this
Would Aiki-jutsu be more relevant? Maybe it needs more interest paid to it, if it is more useful.
I think Rokas is mistaken. Now I am not an expert but studied aikido for a while and talked to many expert practitioners about it. And the conclusion is simple.
Aikido as generally teached is for self improvement. The movements are well defined and to be both pleasing and safe. It is in a way a form of dancing. However all of those techniques can be performed tightly and violently. They are mostly moves from jiu-jitsu that we know works.
The "problem" with aikido (in terms of fighting) that most practitioners don't learn or practice how to perform the techniques fast to actually cause damage. And they don't practice fighting at all. Rokas certainly didn't.
My teacher who was a competing wrestler and kickboxer knew how to get into position to perform aikido techniques. So in essence one has to be pretty good at fighting to use aikido in fighting.
Good appraisal. I like aikido but I don't think it's a complete art. I think wing Chun or Wadi Ryu would be a good blend. And judo of course.
Don't study Aikikia Aikido,lol. Do Yoshikan or something similar. Or do Daito Ryu. Aikido is exercises and self improvement really not a combative. Aikido and Judo are the first martial arts I learned from my dad. He learned in Japan while in military. I learned Taekwondo and kick boxing next. Both Aikido and Judo work well against kick boxing. As long as you don't get hit hard. Atemi is an abosolute must for Judo or Aikido. I'm glad I learned kick boxing and Gracy Ryu Jujutsu techniques. As well as Kodokan and Yoshikan. I'm a very fortunate person to have had a father that encourage me to learn martial arts and science. Good luck in your training and UA-cam stuff. An old Jujutsuka enjoys your channel and thoughts very much.
I didn't know you took aikido, which style did you do? I knew a few people that done Yoshinkan aikido which is Gozo shioda style.
I did aikikai
If you gripfight or newaza your way to a wristlock, you're just doing judo or bjj with wristlocks. No one debates that cranking on a wrist can hurt someone. To validate itself Aikido has to demonstrate it's aiki principle, blending with and redirecting the opponent's motion, in randori.
The truth is, Aikido is inherently fighting an uphill battle. If your goal is to defeat your opponent without harming them, but they have no such limitations, you'll only have a high likelihood of winning if there is a significant disparity of skill (ie, Aikidoka knows what they're doing a lot more than their opponent)
I take it for what it is. Martial arts with higher ambitions, that promote growth in different ways. Build on a platform of kickboxing and wrestling for best results. I personally do not plan to quit, but I don't regret my time cross training BJJ and Karate either.
Learn Arnis, Escrima, or Kali to make it function. The issue with most Aikidoka is lack of base, timing, and reaction time. Aikido isn't wrestling, or grappling; it is the meta skill sets of swordsmanship's disarms and police restraints. Most peopt who complain about Aikido don't have to restrain people for a living. In Boxing you're taught how to parry & clinch it is from these defenses that you can establish control of a foe's arm.
I applied Aikido in initial contact situation; for sparring I apply it in stick grappling. Basically wear your utility belt with simunition and training weapons then spar; you can do it from situational drills such as being hoodwinked then when the hood is pulled from your head deal with the situation as presented. This can be applied to randori style bull in the ring.
@@kevionrogers2605 yes i agree but i think it can be turned into a grappling art due to the techniques foubd in the repertoire
Hey comments on my last videos are disappearing youtube is throwing everything off for some reason, can you post it again??
Very good take on that Chadi, but as you said on another Aikido video, Aikido is not for that purpose.
I think martial art came about as source of being resourceful , so with that being said what if this would be an opportunity to take the theories of aikido and modify them to a modern day style of Aikido as you are implying in your video. Martial arts is an evolution of motion I think, and the study of the practitioner would be paramount to the success of the art regardless of the style . A Lot of thought and meditation has been applied to each style of martial art and to say that one was better that the other would be an insult to the style . I think Bruce Lee said it best " Be water my friend"
Thank you
I always thought Aikido could work after you have done a strike to someone, particularly the face and then catching their hand as they instinctively go to block it after the fact.
In fact as I've seen it Aikido does have lose backhand strikes to people's faces.
Well, the first thing Aikido needs to do is recognize that most of its wrist twists were intended to utilize the weight of a weapon in the attacker's hand, and are, therefore, poorly suited for empty hand-to-hand combat, where it's practically impossible for most practitioners to twist the wrist of a resisting opponent. Take those out and the moves that remain are basically the same as you'd find in Jujitsu, so, what's the point?
Rokas is not a reference for serious martial artists. Sorry...
Absolutely!
Aikido does work ukemi is to make sure you don't get hurt he is not co operating he's moving with him to make sure he's not injured.Go learn aikido from an experience aikido practitioner you'll change your mind.
But even after get into bjj he still cant use bjj to fight, until a year ago when he find the right coach for him though
Aikido I'm sure works if a person really had an expert that really knows what they're doing. Very much like the Bible, one can read it and get different perceptions. Aikido is similiar and anything else. But, read the Bible with understanding of things, it all comes together for a clear picture that works. Aikido, Morehei Ueshiba taught some willing to listen, but as things go on, some were not sure of techniques, but winged it. Time goes on, others do not learn that technique, so they do not learn that as well as what they don't learn on other techniques, as time goes on, the lineage creates a lot of incompetency. Which it happens and applies to anything.
Like being pressure tested, original Aikido I bet works 100%. But dilution through time, it loses substance.
Which something not seen in kudo's is a fast, powerful, vicious street dog. Where grab one arm, the other is already there, where it knocks a person senseless. Unless a person is really good.
If we don't put the history of aikidō into equation, yes, it doesn't work. Even if we put the history into the equation, that kind of aikidō may be extinct already or will be rejected by most aikidō communities.
Aikidōka tends to wait as some of them are taught that there is no attack in aikidō. However, since a lot of aikidō communities have been stating themselves that aikidō is martial arts then, either they realize or not, they have put handicap on themselves.
By stating there is no attack in aikidō it could means that aikidō have a very exceptional training method that provides an aikidōka with an ability to determine accurately 100% how the opponent(s) is (are) going to attack - an ability that's seek by all martial artists - or they don't know what they're stating - determining how an attack should be done beforehand is not an attack because any attacker will conceal the attack.
If the above mentioned training method do exist and it's learning curve steepness is acceptable then it'll be famous already in many martial arts community such as the MMA communities as fighters will be willingly to queue to pay in order to master it since the mastery of it will determine their career.
As long as aikidō keep the above mentioned teaching as is then aikidō will not works.
If aikidō is meant only for self development or reconciliation in a sense making peace a verbal argument then it is better stop using the term martial arts - "Aikidō: Lifestyle based on martial principles" seems more appropriate - because like it or not martial arts always involving physical fighting in various forms as the name suggest.
That's also my point of view, aikido has some good stuff like finger wrist and standing arm locks which are usable, thats what akrochirismos in ancient Greece was. If you see for example the wrestling arm drag it begun like a standing arm lock in which you push the arm just a little higher from the wrist and with the other arm you lock the elbow to break the arm. If you test those aikido stuff in grip fighting you will find out that it can be a way for a smaller dude from arm controling to set up openings to throws and kansetsu, the problem now in self defence is that you don't have the time to set up those things with striking involved and using 2 arms in one without having body attachment is like asking to get hit. Be really careful with finger locks etc our fingers in judo take already loads of pressure you don't need that pain for a month or 2.I needed that relaxing music today thank you.
Yes i agree self defense is complex but I'm trying to make Aikido somewhat good against live resistance, and second yes i needed to change that music.
@@Chadi well I think you know already that Roy Dean has made a nice system in which you can use wristlocks and other aikido stuff on the ground , if you want to implement them in live grappling resistance you will have problems with bjj, wrestling or judo rulesets, tomiki aikido is lacking some elements and I don't remember very well the Japanese jj sport rulesets. If you have some friends that would like to test things is best. You need to test the things that are unique in aikido like the wristlocks and finger locks, the pure dodge techniques(like the ones melanchomas was using) that are penalized in sport and the sword techniques, if you try to change the full movement techniques like irimi nage then you will change aikido to something else! By what I see and know aikido is the art of getting uninvolved to use that you need a very specific ruleset environment and someone with very specific set of talends that can make it work which might not be you good luck with that.................
@@nikolaosmandamandiotis8970 i see but Roy put Aikido in bjj i was trying to keep aikido just aikido by adding grip fighting but the finish is aikido only
@@Chadi yep I understand, what I am saying is that what you want to achieve is extremely difficult, you need to be a small athletic guy with extreme reflexes and agility that also have forearm power of a champion arm wrestler to make it work. 😂
You can find some friends and try grip fighting to better yourself using aikido stuff and I tell you now that it's good and you can become fast in it and achive some rare and good ability by doing so, but from some photos of you I can understand that you don't fit the description of being the best in using aikido stuff in competition maybe some student of yours who knows but don't be diss hearted. I also want to add that it isn't like aikido implemented with other stuff doesn't work , its training methods are outdated if you want to add stuff to it, will contribute to its evolution , in the end it will evolve for sure.
Watch the National Geographic documentary on the Kendo 8th dan exams. That's where I learned what Aikido is about. It's all about what happens before the uke tries to strike you.
I'll check
@@Chadi You'll love it!
I'm interested to know if you learned in kotai and if you practiced the omote versions of the techniques with Tissier sensei. When I have visited Aikikai dojos I don't see those things. No kotai, no omote. I think that would "de-fang" Aikido. But I was told that what I was doing was more like Aiki budo. My teachers disagree with that and say that Ueshiba would never show his real Aikido on camera, only the ekitai style demos. Where I train the progression from kotai, to jutai, to ekitai and kitai is considered essential. It looks to me like the Aikikai start with almost ekitai and have missed the hard form.(kotai)
You did as always a good job Chadi :D
Thank you Felix for your support man
It would be good if you showed examples of what you are talking about instead of simply running the old films.
I know Aikido works cos I a corotid artery choke hold on.someone and they passed out
Jiu-Jitsu works. Aikido is uesheba's vision of do. The art of aikido is one of co-operation and the esoteric blending. Practice of those technique with the principle of the founder. Practice the JJ in aikdo as a combat art is different. Any art/system is only as good as the practioners understanding of it's strength and weakness. One must learn to fight before you cannot fight. Learn aikido after.aikido people aren't traditional fighters in my experience.
I don't know why so many Aikidoka are hell bent on trying to make it "Work". What for and why? What's wrong with just accepting the fcat it wasn't meant to be for self-defence.
The clinch...
I think it shouldn't be undereestimated in my opinion, because these throws and joint locks can hurt the opponent really bad...BUT if the practioner using Aikido alone then I agree that it won't work much or at all because Aikido is good for distract an oppenent and that is why I belivie how the made into a self defense martial art. I only heard bad reputation of it and its effectivness is not that effective. I have heard some of former aikidoka stories before they switched to other martial arts. What I've heard and seen, it might not be effective, but I wouldn't dare to underestimanting it like other martial arts.
Rokas "knows all techniques" required for passing a 1st DAN black belt test.
But performs them on a beginner level of a 5th Kyu.
No idea why you take him as an example :P
Exactly!
There's only one way to make Aikido work in the real world:
Force *EVERYONE* to ride horses and carry katanas.