Blizzard isn't anticipating how absolutely broken this class will be once given access to the majority of it's toolkit! Come hangout live! / simplyyghoulish
I don't think it's fair to count both Kidney Shot and Between The Eyes separately, as they share a cooldown. BtE basically replaces KS, as it's the same stun, but ranged with damage for just 10 more energy. Might be very niche times when you need a 25 energy stun, but they should really be counted as a single ability when looking at the rogue toolkit.
your points about rogue are completely valid but you seem to have really little understanding of other classes: for example, you mention hunters getting wyvern sting, trueshot aura, and beastial wrath, forgetting to mention scatter shot and that you can only take 1 of these max (except for trueshot which is irrelevant), then you talk about warriors getting bloodthirst? which is also completely irrelevant compared to MORTAL STRIKE, then you talk about warlocks getting mana drain and show the spell tooltip for dark pact ( another irrelevant talent)... Yeh, so that is all I want to say, maybe just stick to rogue business because the info on other classes was very weak and misleading.
Yeah hunters get feignt and scatter. Shamans get their full 2h enh kit, grounding, ele mastery. Pallas get their 6 second sleep. Everyone gets such a more flushed out tool kit at 40.
I haven't had much experience with them at this bracket for sure. Never leveled one back in vanilla, and never spent much time in the bracket in general. Definitely the class I know the least about. Guess it's time to roll a shaman! :D
As a warlock player you better hope non of you stuns resist. Cause warlocks are tanky as it is now add soul link n reduction of 20% physical damage for having a void walker plus life drain
I understand what you think, but Priest gets shadow form so good luck fighting them. Not to mention that priest will probably get some sick shadow runes, but without runes for example Shadow Priest is no1 PVP class.
Thanks for the video. I would recommend spending some time looking at warriors if you’re planning on doing organized PvP. They typically counter rogues pretty hard and MS is one of the most important talents at that point in the game
Thanks for the video! Opening with sap on your main target isn't really optimal since Sap costs alot of energy, if running the backstab build it makes alot more sense to open with backstab/garrote or even ambush, that would lead to more cp generated and more damage done. Looking forward what season two brings!
"warriors get bloodthirst" Don't think anyone would go fury for pvp at the lvl 40 bracket, however arms is going to be super juicy! Mortal strike, improved hamstring, whirlwind, intercept, shieldwall is basically going to complete the warrior toolkit for pvp! not to mention plate gear aswell! They are going to be killing machines in Bgs! and with the warbringer runes, mages, hunters and other ranged are going to have a hard time kiting warriors with 2 charges in combat lol!
Bubble >> Stun >> Reck Bomb for 1.3x Rogue Health... GG's That said. Reckoning paladins haven always been the ONLY Class Rogues have no chance against.
great video as usual. as gnomeregan will be the next raid, i do think rogues will fall off on the dmg meters due to our bleeds/poisons which are important to use for our high consistent dmg output. with all these mechanical mobs/bosses and their immunity against both, we lose a big part of our dmg. not confirmed at this point, just speculating. what do you think
I expect to see feral and hunter topping next phase tbh, if gnomer dosnt allow bleeds or poisons on msot bosses rogues and warriors will lose quite a bit of dps. Feral get wolfshead helm and MCP next phase as well.
I started with rogue this season but forgot how leveling went......kill, bandage, kill eat, kill eat, kill bandage. Just very slow. Pulling more than 1 enemy requires using cooldowns or even running away.
@@gizmo6606 frustrating how other classes get things that drastically improve leveling and rogue just gets damage alternatives. Penance, victory rush, haunt, lava lash, divine storm.....
Most broken depends on new runes period. Also meta demo warlocks... meanwhile we're talking about rogues... they will be good vs certain classes but existence of meta demo with SL makes it not S tier from a get go. To find S tier class for P2 you need to eliminate physical damage for that reason alone. I think personally there will be no single top class. It will be rock paper scissors - demo meta warlocks loose to ranged non-physical damage that can kite em, outrange the drain - if warlocks get any sort of mobility via rune, something like portal etc then I vote for warlocks. Rogues would need ways to shred healing and pump huge amount of non-physical damage (poisons) to deal with meta demo warlock. Destro lock will have a huge 1 shot potential but it will take skill to get control required for casts. Hunters with beast within if they don't nerf pets hard will also be a contender for very annoying ranged class.
I dont think fire will be that good unless new runes are good. Fireball is lvl 36 so it will be lacking on damage a bit,maybe with full gear it wont make that much difference
Yeah 99.9% of shamans won't get their hand on pendulum of doom, it's incredibly rare drop and will sell for so much only gold buyers could ever buy it.
Wait, you think warriors will be using Bloodthirst at level 40 for PvP? They will be using Mortal Strike. Still moot but definitely a harder hitting PvP skill.
I have never played a druid but with mangle and all the runes ferals could see along with insane new bis items. I think feral druids are going to be unstoppable in pvp next phase. Also shadowpriests at 40 along with new items and potential for shadowfiend coming rhen they could be unkillable in pvp 1 v 1
We have no idea what runes they'll add for the classes in the next phase. It's impossible to know which class will be most "broken" because of this. What if they decide to give warriors Bladestorm. I would really like to have an AoE rune for my feral druid
I am sorry, but none of your CC does anything against my meta lock that is draining your life and medigating 60%+ of all your melee damage, while you kill yourself from my fire shield
I hope mage gets better for pvp. Sheep, arcane blast x2 if lucky and arcane surge. And it aint oneshooting ppl, unless their gear is terrible. Thinking about making a tank in horde, any sugention?
On my balance I just range rogues lol, Will continue to do it and 100-0 them. Can do it to every single class actually No contest. Rogues will definitely be annoying, But imagine SL tank warlock, that's my other main OH YES.
@@designercaolhoThis video.... A bit incorrect also, Kidney shot and Between the eyes share a cooldown, so as stated in this video, it will not work that way, they will have to choose between the two, they do not get all 3 stuns. I delete rogues, once I have travel form, I will absolutely delete everyone, regardless of "tier lists"
Rogues will be garbage in group pvp because of the hidden resilience. They would need shadowdance and cloak to even be viable in group pvp. The only new class that is going to turn into a monster at 40 is Warrior. Lock is already broken, but it will be more broken and so will hunter. Ele shamans are NOT going to be good like people claim. Melee has more mobility and they have none of the things they were given in WOTLK to counter that. A knockback a shield and farther range on flameshock. In open world? Rogue will always be fine. So will any stealth class. Enjoy open world to 60. SOD ain't lasting at endgame because this dev team knows two things about class design. Jack and sh@%^ and Jack left town. I pity anyone farming gold non stop thinking this is gonna last at 60. No one is gonna play these awful classes endgame. It's gonna be a melee train with paladins, warriors and Alliance queues will be 2 hours long for AV lol.
The wishful thinking is really cute, but it won't stop you from having to deal with Shadow Priests.
I don't think it's fair to count both Kidney Shot and Between The Eyes separately, as they share a cooldown. BtE basically replaces KS, as it's the same stun, but ranged with damage for just 10 more energy. Might be very niche times when you need a 25 energy stun, but they should really be counted as a single ability when looking at the rogue toolkit.
Yeah guy did not read description on BtE, it clearly states that it replaces KS
your points about rogue are completely valid but you seem to have really little understanding of other classes: for example, you mention hunters getting wyvern sting, trueshot aura, and beastial wrath, forgetting to mention scatter shot and that you can only take 1 of these max (except for trueshot which is irrelevant), then you talk about warriors getting bloodthirst? which is also completely irrelevant compared to MORTAL STRIKE, then you talk about warlocks getting mana drain and show the spell tooltip for dark pact ( another irrelevant talent)... Yeh, so that is all I want to say, maybe just stick to rogue business because the info on other classes was very weak and misleading.
Yeah when I saw him open with a sap in a duel against a hunter, I just knew something was off 🤣
Yeah hunters get feignt and scatter. Shamans get their full 2h enh kit, grounding, ele mastery. Pallas get their 6 second sleep. Everyone gets such a more flushed out tool kit at 40.
@@kretin6831 And not mention mortal strike? Mortal strike is definitely up there with one of the most relevant PVP abilities in the game.
@@kretin6831 Yeah I was just explaining why that idea didn't really hold up.
got em
Ohh my sweet summer child. You forgot about the class that shines the brightest at 40. And it's the shaman.
I haven't had much experience with them at this bracket for sure. Never leveled one back in vanilla, and never spent much time in the bracket in general. Definitely the class I know the least about. Guess it's time to roll a shaman! :D
@@gizmo6606 you'll love it at phase 2! Now it's meh. All tools unlock with p2.
EM into an overloaded procced Lava Burst is all you need to know lol
Between the eyes shares cd with kidney shot.
if pyro gets instant i dont think a rogue can duell a mage with block^^ (has rewindtime + block)
As a warlock player you better hope non of you stuns resist. Cause warlocks are tanky as it is now add soul link n reduction of 20% physical damage for having a void walker plus life drain
Ye. Don't worry. Let him think he will dominate the battlefield for a bit 😊
Soul link meta warlock would like a word with your rogue and his silly stuns.
Let's get it! :D
I understand what you think, but Priest gets shadow form so good luck fighting them.
Not to mention that priest will probably get some sick shadow runes, but without runes for example Shadow Priest is no1 PVP class.
Thanks for the video. I would recommend spending some time looking at warriors if you’re planning on doing organized PvP. They typically counter rogues pretty hard and MS is one of the most important talents at that point in the game
Thanks for the video!
Opening with sap on your main target isn't really optimal since Sap costs alot of energy, if running the backstab build it makes alot more sense to open with backstab/garrote or even ambush, that would lead to more cp generated and more damage done. Looking forward what season two brings!
Backstab build with bis gear is melting pvp enemies.
I've been having so much fun!
I think spriest is going to be crazy good
They are pvp gods on 40 and all the way till end plus runes so i wish all rogues good luck on their “stuns” 😂
Shadow priest begs to differ xD. Never losing to rogue, especially dwarf priests. Cant blind em either
"warriors get bloodthirst"
Don't think anyone would go fury for pvp at the lvl 40 bracket, however arms is going to be super juicy! Mortal strike, improved hamstring, whirlwind, intercept, shieldwall is basically going to complete the warrior toolkit for pvp! not to mention plate gear aswell! They are going to be killing machines in Bgs! and with the warbringer runes, mages, hunters and other ranged are going to have a hard time kiting warriors with 2 charges in combat lol!
This!!!
Bubble >> Stun >> Reck Bomb for 1.3x Rogue Health... GG's
That said. Reckoning paladins haven always been the ONLY Class Rogues have no chance against.
Good think i will have 5/5 reckoning at lvl 40... just have to survive de stun chain
Love your rogue content good job. Also would love to see a video of what addons/weakauras/ui etc you use. Really like how clean your ui looks. 👍
Can definitely do that!
Yes please
Hunter, Paladin , Mage , Druid they all can beat Rogues when they know what they be doing.
great video as usual. as gnomeregan will be the next raid, i do think rogues will fall off on the dmg meters due to our bleeds/poisons which are important to use for our high consistent dmg output. with all these mechanical mobs/bosses and their immunity against both, we lose a big part of our dmg. not confirmed at this point, just speculating. what do you think
I think we lose this tier to warriors for sure when it comes to pve. I'm curious if they will have an immune to things like Saber Slash as well.
Saber slash debuff is also a bleed since last patch, so y immune
Community: Stop nerfing hunters
P2 Blizz: removes hunters from game
@@GokuIRLhunters are obnoxiously strong right now
Can’t imagine drs being changed. Side note when did blind give cps? 😮
whatever will be OP, it will get nerfed, play the class you enjoy the most.......
I expect to see feral and hunter topping next phase tbh, if gnomer dosnt allow bleeds or poisons on msot bosses rogues and warriors will lose quite a bit of dps. Feral get wolfshead helm and MCP next phase as well.
Pretty sure kidney/between the eyes gonna share cd
Coldrage Dagger is from RFD, not Uldaman
I started with rogue this season but forgot how leveling went......kill, bandage, kill eat, kill eat, kill bandage. Just very slow. Pulling more than 1 enemy requires using cooldowns or even running away.
Leveling was an absolute pain xD
@@gizmo6606 what do you think about mutilate?
@@mleet3125 if slaughter from shadows affected it, it would be good.
@@gizmo6606 frustrating how other classes get things that drastically improve leveling and rogue just gets damage alternatives. Penance, victory rush, haunt, lava lash, divine storm.....
@@mleet3125warriors are drastically worse to level.
tbh 100% i'd say moonkins are going to own, come back couple of weeks n tell me if im correct or not :)
Dagger is RFD not uldaman
As a tank shaman rogues seems one of the easiest to beat? Maybe Feral is easier I'm not so sure.
Most broken depends on new runes period. Also meta demo warlocks... meanwhile we're talking about rogues... they will be good vs certain classes but existence of meta demo with SL makes it not S tier from a get go. To find S tier class for P2 you need to eliminate physical damage for that reason alone. I think personally there will be no single top class. It will be rock paper scissors - demo meta warlocks loose to ranged non-physical damage that can kite em, outrange the drain - if warlocks get any sort of mobility via rune, something like portal etc then I vote for warlocks. Rogues would need ways to shred healing and pump huge amount of non-physical damage (poisons) to deal with meta demo warlock. Destro lock will have a huge 1 shot potential but it will take skill to get control required for casts. Hunters with beast within if they don't nerf pets hard will also be a contender for very annoying ranged class.
I dont think fire will be that good unless new runes are good. Fireball is lvl 36 so it will be lacking on damage a bit,maybe with full gear it wont make that much difference
Ive heard that level 39 twinks are shamans. That's their bracket. I don't know why though. Haven't played one in classic
I'm stoked to see that! I haven't ever touched one, and I didn't spend much time pvping in that bracket back in the day!
Lava burst, Chain lightning, earth shock.... not to mention Pendulum of doom windfury crits. Shamans can global people like nothing else
they delete people on that bracket.
It’s because pendulum of doom with wind fury totem is BiS
Yeah 99.9% of shamans won't get their hand on pendulum of doom, it's incredibly rare drop and will sell for so much only gold buyers could ever buy it.
and a shadow p runs past and puts 6 dots on you :
Wait, you think warriors will be using Bloodthirst at level 40 for PvP? They will be using Mortal Strike. Still moot but definitely a harder hitting PvP skill.
In concern to PvE :)
@@gizmo6606 gotcha, your video made it seem more PvP focused. That makes sense.
I have never played a druid but with mangle and all the runes ferals could see along with insane new bis items. I think feral druids are going to be unstoppable in pvp next phase. Also shadowpriests at 40 along with new items and potential for shadowfiend coming rhen they could be unkillable in pvp 1 v 1
We have no idea what runes they'll add for the classes in the next phase. It's impossible to know which class will be most "broken" because of this. What if they decide to give warriors Bladestorm. I would really like to have an AoE rune for my feral druid
i like druidsand rogues, because they can sneak up people, and knock someone down.
I’ll still eat rogue for breaky on my hunter lol
I am sorry, but none of your CC does anything against my meta lock that is draining your life and medigating 60%+ of all your melee damage, while you kill yourself from my fire shield
how are you so clueless to miss spriest and bm hunter?
Dwarf wars will still stomp. And we ant going bloodthirsty lol. Mortal strike >
Oh they also get ww axe
do u know theres a skill called MORTAL STRIKE...
I definitely didnt transition well. I was going into PvE talk. Failed horribly
Dude is clueless about pvp lol
Fuck Rogues will beat them regardless with my warlock
Level 40 bracket=ele sham
mages bustin’
I hope mage gets better for pvp. Sheep, arcane blast x2 if lucky and arcane surge. And it aint oneshooting ppl, unless their gear is terrible. Thinking about making a tank in horde, any sugention?
having no problem recking in pvp with my fire mage tho :S
On my balance I just range rogues lol, Will continue to do it and 100-0 them. Can do it to every single class actually No contest. Rogues will definitely be annoying, But imagine SL tank warlock, that's my other main OH YES.
Sl/sl is tbc bro
@@designercaolhoThis video.... A bit incorrect also, Kidney shot and Between the eyes share a cooldown, so as stated in this video, it will not work that way, they will have to choose between the two, they do not get all 3 stuns. I delete rogues, once I have travel form, I will absolutely delete everyone, regardless of "tier lists"
Cant get SL SL in classic
Nerf Rogues
Ret/Reckoning pala: *muahahahaha*
Worst video about sod ever.. this is one of the worst rogues ever no cao
All of this doesn’t matter lmao. Lock remains the king of pvp
Rogues will be garbage in group pvp because of the hidden resilience. They would need shadowdance and cloak to even be viable in group pvp. The only new class that is going to turn into a monster at 40 is Warrior. Lock is already broken, but it will be more broken and so will hunter. Ele shamans are NOT going to be good like people claim. Melee has more mobility and they have none of the things they were given in WOTLK to counter that. A knockback a shield and farther range on flameshock.
In open world? Rogue will always be fine. So will any stealth class. Enjoy open world to 60. SOD ain't lasting at endgame because this dev team knows two things about class design. Jack and sh@%^ and Jack left town. I pity anyone farming gold non stop thinking this is gonna last at 60. No one is gonna play these awful classes endgame. It's gonna be a melee train with paladins, warriors and Alliance queues will be 2 hours long for AV lol.
Nerfing hunters will help im sure
They’ve already been nerfed so much :(
But considering the only dps chart topper I've ever seen is hunter...
Not the hunter themselve but the freaking pet@@gizmo6606
@@gizmo6606it’s crazy how busted hunters are, nerfed to hell and still the undisputed meta for open world PvP and bgs
@@TheDwarburton what rogues and warriors on the top not hunters ... we can never pass rogue in bfd