The 1984 design hasn't aged at all. It is still a beautiful piece of automotive art. It has very few aesthetic flaws, compared with Ferraris, Lambos and the like. In my opinion, GM ruined the original design with the GT big wings, air dams and "snowplow" bumpers that were slapped on it to make it look more agressive to the performance fans.
The parts bin aspect of it always blew me away. They used a lot of parts that already existed, usef on other cars, to build something that a lot of people thought was an attractive car without spending a lot of money
Christmas 1983 I got an about 1/16 scale New Bright remote control Fiero, everything opened and all the lights including the pop-up headlights worked. Guzzled batteries and light shone through the plastic "body" panels (including the backs of the headlights) but it was an awesome toy at age 9.
2:44. The early Fieros wouldn't have disappointed if Pontiac had been allowed to offer the Super Duty version of the 4 cylinder. I believe I've read about a 2.7 and a 3.0 they built, one of them produced 300 HP if memory serves me right. A magnesium block at one point. 🤘 hell yeah, Pontiac engineers could always do amazing things, if allowed to, with what they had to work with
I don’t believe they “rotated” the X car cradle 180 degrees to make the P car but rather brought it straight back to the rear of the vehicle. The drive belts are on the passenger side of both the front drive cars and the rear drive Fiero.
Adam, I just can't believe how the Brits ripped off the totally unique Fiero design with the Triumph TR7 and how the Italians ripped it off again with the Fiat X1/9. Before anyone claims those cars were out a decade before the Fiero, I will just say that is the petty nitpicking typical of jealous GM haters. 😉😉
Great video 👏🙏👍 It is unfortunate what happened to GM. GM competed neck to neck with Pontiac Fiero and Toyota MR2…but nowadays, GM can’t even compete with Hyundai! What happened to GM? They have become disastrous brand for small engine manufacturing. Not one small displacement engine that GM makes are reliable nowadays.
The comment about The black plastic imitating the look of black glass has another function also. At one end, it curves in and openings can be seen. These openings are for the interior flow through air ventilation system that all cars have these days. This car has no hatch and the interior ends at the back of the seats. This is where the air exits the car.
Many SUVs black out the B or C pillar to make it look like more glass area. The current Suburban has a blacked out aft door window frame to make the rear window look bigger, and the C-pillars look thinner.
Thank you Adam. The 1990-1996 Grand Prix sedan especially in STE trim before 1997 did not have a split grille. The 1994-1995 Pontiac Bonneville did not have a split grille either. The Cadillac CT5 has black trim like that to make the c-pillar look thinner. Thank you for the video.
The "fake black plastic" behind the doors that kind of looks like a window reminds me of the hatchback Mustang's from the late-80's. Those do have some actual light pass-through but a lot of that was just glass in front of the C-pillar.
I have never been able to confirm or deny this, but I was told the earliest 1983 Parisienne had a Caprice Classic grille with a Pontiac arrowhead, and did not even offer the Delta 88 Royal Broigham seating. If this said car exists I’ll pay to see a picture of it even if it’s broken in half with rust. I remember the Fiero as a child my father left the auto body field and entered defense shipbuilding and repainting a white Fiero that had been repaired with parts from a red car. In my essential infancy I was allowed to make scratches on an individual my father was friends with’s, car. This was … 35 years ago. I have never seen a Fiero for sale local to me… I’m not lying. These cars are gone in northern New England. They don’t exist. You’re more likely to see a diesel 81 Pontiac than any Pontiac Fiero. I remember the Renault Alliance sedan … red in particular. Chrome package.
A St. Louis dealer led the charge to return a B-body Pontiac to the U. S. Truth is that when Pontiac in the U. S. discontinued the B-body Catalina/Bonneville after the 1981 model year, GM of Canada continued building the big Pontiac Parisienne (which was indeed a Chevy Caprice with a Pontiac grille) and the G-body car was still sold as a LeMans! In 1985, the rear quarters of the old Catalina/Bonneville were restored to the Parisienne...
@@gcfifthgear I agree in hindsight the elimination of various full-size cars was very shortsighted by Detroit. The 81 Chrysler R body stands tall as an example with the success of the 82-89 Fifth Avenue, the momentary deletion and return of the Caprice Classic coupe, the existence of the 1985 Fleetwood Brougham coupe etc. There was a market for these cars, and I personally feel it was disappointing that the 1978 or should I say 1980 Pontiac lineup was not continued thru the mid 1980s as it was at Buick and Oldsmobile just to generate revenue. However I have also watched several of this man’s videos and know now dealers were inundated with unsold inventory and the existence of rwd and fwd midsize cars confused consumers at the time. The 86 Parisienne is a lovely car, I helped restore one but if you ask me Pontiac could have carried its September 1979 offerings until August 1985.
I worked a used car lot back in the 80's We had a 84 Fiero with a check engine light on. It cost me a large pizza to find out where the diagnostic connector was at. (You have to look it up for your self, or, I will tell you for a pizza!
I had the 85 2m4 SE in silver. Aside from the lack of power, for a 6 foot driver the seats were too upright for real comfort, especially as low as the sitting position was, (Imagine a go cart), not the "fall into the car" sports car driving position. The fit and finish were typical for the time, pretty bad. My family also had a first year Citation. I recognize the dog bone engine support in both cars. As an "immobilizer" on the Fiero at least, I remember it was pretty easy to take with you the central distributor cable -if memory serves. We took it on several +100 mile road trips and had a lot of fun with it.
I bought one in 1984 as my first new car. I still own it to this day with only 77k miles on it. White SE (similar to the one in the picture, but with a sunroof.) Mine was actually manufactured in October of 1983.
I had a red 86 just like the one in the initial shots back in the high school, and I felt like I was driving a Ferrari. A very slow Ferrari, mine had the Iron Duke and auto. I'd love to have an 88 GT now.
These were awesome! They came out in 1984 when I graduated from high school and I wanted one bad~! (Well, that and an '82 Toyota Supra....) Dad laid down three facts to me: 1. This was a brand new car and since my college was going to be expensive, a new car was out of the question. 2. This was a first year GM product and as such it would be more than good to STAY AWAY. Let others be the "guinea pigs" 3. The very last thing that a college kid needs is a two seat car. A college student needs a minivan or a station wagon, since they move around a lot. He was completely right. What did I buy in March of 1984? A Bali green '77 Volkswagen Rabbit two door. That really was the best car for me since it had tons of room and got 40 mpg on the highway. The 9.6 second 0-60 times were entertaining too, especially when I embarrassed my friends in their big American cars, even ones with (stock, or course) 455's! But I still loved the notion of a mid engine car, and in 2018 I traded my '85 Porsche 928S2 5 speed for a Guards Red '14 Cayman S. It is a fantastic car, runs mid 12 second quarter mile times, can go 178 mph, and gets 31 mpg on the highway courtesy of the 2976 pound curb weight. Honestly, the only thing I don't like about my red Cayman is the fact that I have nothing to tinker with; With the 928 there was always something non-essential to mess with and the engine was easy to access. Honestly? If I had the garage space I would buy another 928 or a Fiero or an early MR2 just to tinker with. Great video!
I had a flashback when the Alliance convertible came up. The first car I ever bought at 16 years old was a garnet red one with a tan top. Not actually a bad car just a little quirky. I had to either buy my own car or drive a truck my parents owned. That was a 1968 Chevy with a “3 on the tree” and no power steering. Actually, 34 years later, the truck is still around but the Renault is long gone!
I wanted one very badly when they came out, but to clear the roof, I had to lean the seat back, which made it difficult to turn the unassisted steering. The four was pretty dull, but the six was quick. The first year or two they offered real suede and shearling seats for several hundred dollars.
I always thought that the Oldsmobile Quad 4, that came out in 1987 would have been the best engine for the Fiero. Being a 4 cyl it would have been more compact than the 2.8 V6 and at 180 hp., it beat the 100 hp Iron Duke and the 150 hp V6. I suspect that, once again, GM was concerned that another division was threatening the Corvette.
12th gen (2008-14) F-150 (single cab only) also had the fake glass plastic thing too. You can see it on the Wikipedia article specifically for the 12th gen
I currently own an 88 Duke and an 88 Formula. The fake glass plastic area behind the side glass DID HAVE A FUNCTION!... It was the fresh air exit vent for the HVAC system.
It was a cute car, but, terribly underpowered. A friend of mine had one. I drove it several times. You literally had to keep the pedal to the floor to make some of the hills we have in the Northeast.
My 1979 Ford Mustang (Fox body) had a similar trim behind the side windows. The Mustang’s version used a plastic matte black louvered piece as opposed to the Fiero’s glass like application. In later years, Ford changed this to more of a gloss, faux window like piece as in the Fiero. My first new car was a 79 Mustang and I recall being so impressed with those louvers. Although they didn’t serve a single functional purpose.
There's a fellow up the road from me, that has 23 Fieros in his front and back yard. Got "No Trespassing" signs everywhere, leading up to his property.
The main problem day to day with an Alliance was its 1.4L engine that was slow. Acceleration was leisurely. Other than that, they were good cars when new.
@@RareClassicCars They had a serious flaw with the heater core that could suddenly drench the front seat passengers feet with steaming hot coolant They all had to be recalled.
Regarding the "fake" rear side windows - Ford used something similar on their 1979-86 Mustangs and Capris behind their rear side glass - they had fake louvers there, and on some trims this was painted black to help minimize the size of the C-pillars. Weirdly, on other trims it was body colored. BTW: My "dream" car is a 1985 Fiero 2M4/SE with a sunroof, and a Pontiac LT3 2.0L Turbo engine swap and a 5 speed manual. Someday, I'll make it!
I remember this car from back when people were actually driving them. I was a kid, but my father's best friend had one. What you have to do is see it in context. It's a goofy looking little thing now, but compared to what most cars looked like at the time, it really was pretty good looking. Personally, I never liked that wedge of pie look. Later my sister had a triumph TR7. After that, when it was my turn, I had a TR6. I am a TR6 kind of guy, when it comes to the looks of things. This car looks a lot like the TR7. It's not bad looking, it's just not my style.
Bought it brand new 1984 right out of showroom window. It got more thumbs up driving than anything I've owned. It was reliable but the iron Duke 4 wheezy and slow. Rode like a lumber truck. Heavy for small car but actually fun to drive
I loved these cars when I was a kid. I remember my aunt telling me they broke in half and would catch fire in a crash.... and me thinking, just don't crash it 😁 I'd still love to have an 88 GT at some point. Maybe a V8 Archie car.
I had 3 Fieros (not at the same time). I had an 86 w/2.5/5-speed, which I put 100k miles on. Sold that to a guy for $2500 plus another Fiero (an 85 w/2.5/4-Speed), which I sold to my cousin for $1000. Lastly, I picked a really nice 87 GT/Auto, which had a little scoop on that side air inlet. I never noticed any noise from those. I kinda wished I could have tried out a GT 5-speed (preferably an 88), but no joy. I never had any real issues with any of them. The 87 had a hard starting issue that I resolved with a new air inlet sensor.
This was my first new car. I absolutely loved it...that is until the breakdowns started. I was posted to Germany in July 1984 and shipped my Fiero overseas with me. I went through three engine rebuilds before I was finally able to flog it to a buddy for a whole lot less than I paid for it. Sad, because I really loved eveything else about it. The iron duke was such a shitty engine in this application.
@@RareClassicCars Unfortunately no. The last time I broke down, I was driving from Baden to Frankfurt and there was a loud bang from the back. I found out later that apparently the crankshaft snapped in half. I never abused the car but even so, it certainly couldn't handle sustained higher speeds.
The major issue with the Fiero Iron Duke was that--to make the X-car powertrain work in a rear-drive setting--the oil pan was redesigned in such a way that the engine only had three quarts of oil when it was full, rather than four. It was, in effect, running a quart low even when new, which contributed to its problems (including vehicle fires that affected all first-year Fieros). I had the same engine in a 1978 Monza wagon, a 1983 Citation, and a 1987 Celebrity wagon, and they were all extremely reliable (and fully lubricated)
An Army buddy had a Fiero GT in 1988 and I was very envious. I would love to have an 88 GT but they are hard to come by and not cheap. I should get any manual model and put a 3800 in it.
The Pontiac Grand Am had a black plastic piece beside the quarter glass to make it look bigger. But it actually did have a glass there. Unlike the Fiero
No power steering made it Armstrong steering in slow and parking lot maneuvers. Almost impossible to steer in those circumstances. Rading the GM parts bin of Cheveete and Cavalier items didn't help. They basically came apart after the warranty expired.
Plenty of room in those wheel wells - particularly on the white car. They even look unfinished. Probably look better with 17" rims to better fill those openings.
Are you sure that triangle quarter window is plastic? I remember seeing these cars in the junkyard years ago and some of those quarter windows were shattered like tempered glass.
Coming from a former owner of an 85 "base", 2.5 & a five-speed...in silver,, something we all seem to overlook...it was a transverse motor/trans configuration. Look at the much bally-hooed C8 Corvette....the whole back half of the car is useless space for us humans...the only recent "mid-engine" car with any hope of having usable space behind the engine is the Alfa 4C.... The Fieros' trunk can swallow a full-sized male in that trunk.!!! All Fieros deserve a 3800, Northstar or SBC engine swap...
GM constantly neutered other cars to prevent them from competing with the Corvette. The Camaro and Trans Am were always equipped with "more restrictive" exhaust to ensure they didn't produce the same horsepower as the Corvette - especially in the late 70's and 80's when horsepower was tough to come by. Only the Buick Regal Grand National was allowed to compete with the Corvette - and that was likely because GM knew the GN was 500lbs (at least!) heavier.
Not only that but in the hierarchy of GM, Buick was 2nd only to Cadillac. Buick was allowed the Grand National because Buick was the premium nameplate that built mid sized cars. Pontiac was supposed to be the performance division of GM but was only the 2nd rung from the bottom (Chevrolet). But Chevrolet obviously had the Corvette. Any time Pontiac came up with performance ideas that surpassed the Corvette, it was mysteriously cancelled. The Pontiac 301 turbo was supposed to be used in the 3rd generation T/A as evidenced by the bulge on the driver’s side of the hood in most 3rd generation T/As that also appeared on the 80-81 Turbo T/A. While the 301 had issues, they would’ve been corrected with the addition of electronic engine management that came a few years later. It’s not unreasonable to assume that the 301 would’ve been making 300+ horsepower by the mid to late 80s especially since Buick was able to do it with the 3.8 V6, which itself was a piece of garbage for many years before its issues were resolved. By the way, the Corvette didn’t eclipse the 300 horsepower mark again until the mid 90s. Chevrolet would have none of that. The 301 was a last minute cancellation by GM just before the 3rd generation T/A went into production. I also believe Pontiac had designed an aluminum V6 for the Fiero that GM cancelled because it would’ve been faster than a Corvette.
My first new car, in 1984, was a Pontiac Indy.Fiero (pace car replica). Iron Duke 4 cylinder with a 4 speed manual transaxle. Objectively, it was slow, unreliable and poorly built. But I liked it a lot. Still have the Official Pace Car door decals and my Nevada "INDY" and California "84 INDY" license plates.
Jackie tended to take the long way there, and she drove a Fiero. ua-cam.com/video/d5ZnXMUXr3w/v-deo.html Seriously, though, the Fiero was beautiful, from the first sketches and grainy spy photos, to the last Formulas and GTs, and the pictures of what was ultimately to never come. I was told that I'd either love it or hate it, but when I finally got to drive one, neither was true...
Another "feature" not often talked about are the 6" wheel gaps that make the Fiero look like it's lifted. I'll always wonder why GM thought the wheel arches had to be so gargantuan. I also wonder if anyone ever put some 33" Dick Cepeks on there for a "LOL"....
6:59 1981 Dodge Challenger had something similar. Only on the Challenger it was to hide part of rear glass Painted white this Fiero looks out of proportion.
It is bizarre that they mounted the engine 180 degrees. I always thought it was straight from the FWD Citation, but no, it has been turned 180 degrees. The reason this is done is to shorten the rear length of the car; Mid engine cars have odd proportions. There is typically a long area between the rear of the door and the rear wheel and this doesn't look right. Lamborghini and Audi disguised this via design and in the R8 case with the "blade", Porsche used an intake and a window with my Cayman. GM simply put the engine right above the rear axle and this is VERY NEARLY a rear engine design.....
The 2.5 Iron Duke (also called the Tech 4) was such an awful engine. I owned a 1986 Oldsmobile Calais with one and because of it I never bought a domestic car with a 4-cylinder again. Loud, unrefined, and pathetic acceleration. 0-60 took 12 seconds on a good day! At stoplights, I would put the car in neutral just to keep the dashboard from vibrating.
1985 Coworker in Southern California did not want to jump off my 1982 Camaro. I left my lights on after a noon lunch on a rare dark rainy day. he said his Fiero had a tiny 2.5 Iron Duke. .he was weirded out that my 82 Camaro had a 2.5 Iron Duke too.. before working at that Computer Company he worked at the NSA.
The 1984 design hasn't aged at all. It is still a beautiful piece of automotive art. It has very few aesthetic flaws, compared with Ferraris, Lambos and the like.
In my opinion, GM ruined the original design with the GT big wings, air dams and "snowplow" bumpers that were slapped on it to make it look more agressive to the performance fans.
Cancelled just after GM sorted it out. Looked the business.
That seems like GM's operational doctrine.
Take a shot every time GM kneecaps a car because it might hypothetically compete with the Corvette..
Especially if it was Pontiac idea.
These were awesome. I remember when they came out.
The parts bin aspect of it always blew me away. They used a lot of parts that already existed, usef on other cars, to build something that a lot of people thought was an attractive car without spending a lot of money
Christmas 1983 I got an about 1/16 scale New Bright remote control Fiero, everything opened and all the lights including the pop-up headlights worked. Guzzled batteries and light shone through the plastic "body" panels (including the backs of the headlights) but it was an awesome toy at age 9.
Once they got them sorted out they were very good cars but once they sorted them out they discontinued them.
GM did that to soooo many cars.
2:44. The early Fieros wouldn't have disappointed if Pontiac had been allowed to offer the Super Duty version of the 4 cylinder. I believe I've read about a 2.7 and a 3.0 they built, one of them produced 300 HP if memory serves me right. A magnesium block at one point. 🤘 hell yeah, Pontiac engineers could always do amazing things, if allowed to, with what they had to work with
C8 Corvette also has a fake plastic piece mimicking glass although much smaller. Miata hard top also has the same.
Catching fire 🔥 will dwindle sales !
2 in one day!? The man is a machine!
I don’t believe they “rotated” the X car cradle 180 degrees to make the P car but rather brought it straight back to the rear of the vehicle. The drive belts are on the passenger side of both the front drive cars and the rear drive Fiero.
That's right. Not rotated, straight back.
That's what I was thinking, because rotating it would have required a different transmission.
Adam, I just can't believe how the Brits ripped off the totally unique Fiero design with the Triumph TR7 and how the Italians ripped it off again with the Fiat X1/9. Before anyone claims those cars were out a decade before the Fiero, I will just say that is the petty nitpicking typical of jealous GM haters. 😉😉
Great video 👏🙏👍
It is unfortunate what happened to GM.
GM competed neck to neck with Pontiac Fiero and Toyota MR2…but nowadays, GM can’t even compete with Hyundai! What happened to GM? They have become disastrous brand for small engine manufacturing. Not one small displacement engine that GM makes are reliable nowadays.
The comment about The black plastic imitating the look of black glass has another function also. At one end, it curves in and openings can be seen. These openings are for the interior flow through air ventilation system that all cars have these days. This car has no hatch and the interior ends at the back of the seats. This is where the air exits the car.
Many SUVs black out the B or C pillar to make it look like more glass area. The current Suburban has a blacked out aft door window frame to make the rear window look bigger, and the C-pillars look thinner.
Those are still some of my favorite wheels.
Thank you Adam. The 1990-1996 Grand Prix sedan especially in STE trim before 1997 did not have a split grille. The 1994-1995 Pontiac Bonneville did not have a split grille either. The Cadillac CT5 has black trim like that to make the c-pillar look thinner. Thank you for the video.
I call this the “mother” of the C8 corvette
The "fake black plastic" behind the doors that kind of looks like a window reminds me of the hatchback Mustang's from the late-80's. Those do have some actual light pass-through but a lot of that was just glass in front of the C-pillar.
I came here to say the same thing. Also the earlier fox-body Mustangs had fake louvers prior to the black glass.
I loved my 85 V6 SE Fiero loaded with a 4spd in silver. She was a sweet ride for the day
The rear trim idea is still being used on my C8. It works!
You mean 2nd gen Fiero.
@jeffmellow kinda sorta!
There cant be too many nice ones around with the 6 cyl , collectability wise thinking a fun entry level car that appreciates in value { maybe } 🤔.
The 1988 version was ok when they redesigned the suspension. The earlier ones didn't handle very well from what I've heard.
I have never been able to confirm or deny this, but I was told the earliest 1983 Parisienne had a Caprice Classic grille with a Pontiac arrowhead, and did not even offer the Delta 88 Royal Broigham seating. If this said car exists I’ll pay to see a picture of it even if it’s broken in half with rust. I remember the Fiero as a child my father left the auto body field and entered defense shipbuilding and repainting a white Fiero that had been repaired with parts from a red car. In my essential infancy I was allowed to make scratches on an individual my father was friends with’s, car. This was … 35 years ago. I have never seen a Fiero for sale local to me… I’m not lying. These cars are gone in northern New England. They don’t exist. You’re more likely to see a diesel 81 Pontiac than any Pontiac Fiero. I remember the Renault Alliance sedan … red in particular. Chrome package.
A St. Louis dealer led the charge to return a B-body Pontiac to the U. S. Truth is that when Pontiac in the U. S. discontinued the B-body Catalina/Bonneville after the 1981 model year, GM of Canada continued building the big Pontiac Parisienne (which was indeed a Chevy Caprice with a Pontiac grille) and the G-body car was still sold as a LeMans! In 1985, the rear quarters of the old Catalina/Bonneville were restored to the Parisienne...
@@gcfifthgear I agree in hindsight the elimination of various full-size cars was very shortsighted by Detroit. The 81 Chrysler R body stands tall as an example with the success of the 82-89 Fifth Avenue, the momentary deletion and return of the Caprice Classic coupe, the existence of the 1985 Fleetwood Brougham coupe etc. There was a market for these cars, and I personally feel it was disappointing that the 1978 or should I say 1980 Pontiac lineup was not continued thru the mid 1980s as it was at Buick and Oldsmobile just to generate revenue. However I have also watched several of this man’s videos and know now dealers were inundated with unsold inventory and the existence of rwd and fwd midsize cars confused consumers at the time. The 86 Parisienne is a lovely car, I helped restore one but if you ask me Pontiac could have carried its September 1979 offerings until August 1985.
I worked a used car lot back in the 80's We had a 84 Fiero with a check engine light on. It cost me a large pizza to find out where the diagnostic connector was at. (You have to look it up for your self, or, I will tell you for a pizza!
Under ashtray or cigar lighter panel within centre console.
Interesting 🧐
Wasn't enthusiastic about them at the time ... but time has made them awesome.
C8 Corvette also has a fake quarter window.
I think if they produced this now with a good engine it would sell if it was priced affordable.
I had the 85 2m4 SE in silver. Aside from the lack of power, for a 6 foot driver the seats were too upright for real comfort, especially as low as the sitting position was, (Imagine a go cart), not the "fall into the car" sports car driving position. The fit and finish were typical for the time, pretty bad. My family also had a first year Citation. I recognize the dog bone engine support in both cars. As an "immobilizer" on the Fiero at least, I remember it was pretty easy to take with you the central distributor cable -if memory serves. We took it on several +100 mile road trips and had a lot of fun with it.
The Alliance had co-axial torsion sprung trailing arm. There is no true beam.
GM use to be inspired.
“Reliability” has never been an adjective associated with Renault in general.
I loved that car!
4:08 Cadillac XLR in the background. The Cadillac Corvette
I bought one in 1984 as my first new car. I still own it to this day with only 77k miles on it. White SE (similar to the one in the picture, but with a sunroof.) Mine was actually manufactured in October of 1983.
I had a red 86 just like the one in the initial shots back in the high school, and I felt like I was driving a Ferrari. A very slow Ferrari, mine had the Iron Duke and auto. I'd love to have an 88 GT now.
Miata ND retractable hardtop as well
my sister had a red four-banger with the iron duke and it was a blast to drive
Don’t believe I’d have told that😆
@@garysarratt1 see what you did there. hahaha
These were awesome! They came out in 1984 when I graduated from high school and I wanted one bad~!
(Well, that and an '82 Toyota Supra....)
Dad laid down three facts to me: 1. This was a brand new car and since my college was going to be expensive, a new car was out of the question. 2. This was a first year GM product and as such it would be more than good to STAY AWAY. Let others be the "guinea pigs" 3. The very last thing that a college kid needs is a two seat car. A college student needs a minivan or a station wagon, since they move around a lot. He was completely right.
What did I buy in March of 1984? A Bali green '77 Volkswagen Rabbit two door. That really was the best car for me since it had tons of room and got 40 mpg on the highway. The 9.6 second 0-60 times were entertaining too, especially when I embarrassed my friends in their big American cars, even ones with (stock, or course) 455's!
But I still loved the notion of a mid engine car, and in 2018 I traded my '85 Porsche 928S2 5 speed for a Guards Red '14 Cayman S. It is a fantastic car, runs mid 12 second quarter mile times, can go 178 mph, and gets 31 mpg on the highway courtesy of the 2976 pound curb weight. Honestly, the only thing I don't like about my red Cayman is the fact that I have nothing to tinker with; With the 928 there was always something non-essential to mess with and the engine was easy to access. Honestly? If I had the garage space I would buy another 928 or a Fiero or an early MR2 just to tinker with.
Great video!
I had a flashback when the Alliance convertible came up. The first car I ever bought at 16 years old was a garnet red one with a tan top. Not actually a bad car just a little quirky. I had to either buy my own car or drive a truck my parents owned. That was a 1968 Chevy with a “3 on the tree” and no power steering. Actually, 34 years later, the truck is still around but the Renault is long gone!
We all need to learn painful lessons when we are young with the hope we will put them to use in our maturity. 😉
Had my dream car, an 86 with a 2.5
I wanted one very badly when they came out, but to clear the roof, I had to lean the seat back, which made it difficult to turn the unassisted steering. The four was pretty dull, but the six was quick. The first year or two they offered real suede and shearling seats for several hundred dollars.
I always thought that the Oldsmobile Quad 4, that came out in 1987 would have been the best engine for the Fiero. Being a 4 cyl it would have been more compact than the 2.8 V6 and at 180 hp., it beat the 100 hp Iron Duke and the 150 hp V6. I suspect that, once again, GM was concerned that another division was threatening the Corvette.
12th gen (2008-14) F-150 (single cab only) also had the fake glass plastic thing too. You can see it on the Wikipedia article specifically for the 12th gen
I currently own an 88 Duke and an 88 Formula. The fake glass plastic area behind the side glass DID HAVE A FUNCTION!... It was the fresh air exit vent for the HVAC system.
It was a cute car, but, terribly underpowered. A friend of mine had one. I drove it several times. You literally had to keep the pedal to the floor to make some of the hills we have in the Northeast.
My 1979 Ford Mustang (Fox body) had a similar trim behind the side windows. The Mustang’s version used a plastic matte black louvered piece as opposed to the Fiero’s glass like application. In later years, Ford changed this to more of a gloss, faux window like piece as in the Fiero. My first new car was a 79 Mustang and I recall being so impressed with those louvers. Although they didn’t serve a single functional purpose.
There's a fellow up the road from me, that has 23 Fieros in his front and back yard.
Got "No Trespassing" signs everywhere, leading up to his property.
If you rotate a fwd front end reverse becomes forward and forward becomes reverse. Nothing was rotated.
The main problem day to day with an Alliance was its 1.4L engine that was slow. Acceleration was leisurely. Other than that, they were good cars when new.
They were much better once the optional 1.7 was introduced
@@RareClassicCars They had a serious flaw with the heater core that could suddenly drench the front seat passengers feet with steaming hot coolant They all had to be recalled.
4th interesting lateral element: the door latch…totally integrated into the longitudinal car-length strip.
Regarding the "fake" rear side windows - Ford used something similar on their 1979-86 Mustangs and Capris behind their rear side glass - they had fake louvers there, and on some trims this was painted black to help minimize the size of the C-pillars. Weirdly, on other trims it was body colored.
BTW: My "dream" car is a 1985 Fiero 2M4/SE with a sunroof, and a Pontiac LT3 2.0L Turbo engine swap and a 5 speed manual. Someday, I'll make it!
I remember this car from back when people were actually driving them. I was a kid, but my father's best friend had one.
What you have to do is see it in context. It's a goofy looking little thing now, but compared to what most cars looked like at the time, it really was pretty good looking.
Personally, I never liked that wedge of pie look. Later my sister had a triumph TR7. After that, when it was my turn, I had a TR6. I am a TR6 kind of guy, when it comes to the looks of things.
This car looks a lot like the TR7. It's not bad looking, it's just not my style.
Bought it brand new 1984 right out of showroom window. It got more thumbs up driving than anything I've owned. It was reliable but the iron Duke 4 wheezy and slow. Rode like a lumber truck. Heavy for small car but actually fun to drive
Didn't the Chrysler Fifth Avenue have the most rearward side window blocked off to make the car look more upmarket?
Love this video. Very informative. I have mine ('84 black SE) on Hemmings right now if you want to see a nice, low mileage example. Thanks.
I loved these cars when I was a kid. I remember my aunt telling me they broke in half and would catch fire in a crash.... and me thinking, just don't crash it 😁 I'd still love to have an 88 GT at some point. Maybe a V8 Archie car.
It think it’s cool the door handle and rub strip clash , in a way the door handle is hidden
4th gen Firebird didn't seem to have a grille.
Neither did the 3rd.
GM could have used an Opel sourced 4cyl engine 😢
My mom had an '89 Bonneville LE and you are correct, it did not have a "soft nose" or split grill. How did I not notice that?
I had 3 Fieros (not at the same time). I had an 86 w/2.5/5-speed, which I put 100k miles on. Sold that to a guy for $2500 plus another Fiero (an 85 w/2.5/4-Speed), which I sold to my cousin for $1000. Lastly, I picked a really nice 87 GT/Auto, which had a little scoop on that side air inlet. I never noticed any noise from those. I kinda wished I could have tried out a GT 5-speed (preferably an 88), but no joy.
I never had any real issues with any of them. The 87 had a hard starting issue that I resolved with a new air inlet sensor.
The 1989 and later GM A Sedans and the last Hyundai Accent Sedan have plastic fake rear quarter windows.
Oh Fiero, what could been if GM didn't screw up...
Hello. Had a V6.
My folks had a 4 door Alliance in the 80s. It was our "nice car" because it had air conditioning and the Ford Tempo did not
The C7 Corvette Coupe and both the Coupe and HTC C8 has a fake rear quarter window.
Took a page from the Toyota MR2 and the Fiero it failed badly from the start. Last batch were better
This was my first new car. I absolutely loved it...that is until the breakdowns started. I was posted to Germany in July 1984 and shipped my Fiero overseas with me. I went through three engine rebuilds before I was finally able to flog it to a buddy for a whole lot less than I paid for it. Sad, because I really loved eveything else about it. The iron duke was such a shitty engine in this application.
It certainly wouldn’t have lasted on the autobahn.
@@RareClassicCars Unfortunately no. The last time I broke down, I was driving from Baden to Frankfurt and there was a loud bang from the back. I found out later that apparently the crankshaft snapped in half. I never abused the car but even so, it certainly couldn't handle sustained higher speeds.
@@CyberScenicDrone no. That engine couldn’t handle sustained rpm north of 4k.
The major issue with the Fiero Iron Duke was that--to make the X-car powertrain work in a rear-drive setting--the oil pan was redesigned in such a way that the engine only had three quarts of oil when it was full, rather than four. It was, in effect, running a quart low even when new, which contributed to its problems (including vehicle fires that affected all first-year Fieros). I had the same engine in a 1978 Monza wagon, a 1983 Citation, and a 1987 Celebrity wagon, and they were all extremely reliable (and fully lubricated)
Black piece: Adam, Volkswagen did this on the "B" pillar of Scirocco's from 1985 forward. It was done with a black sticker.
The current Cadillac CT5 has the black plastic piece to mimic a window in the c-pillar
They do that black plastic on all of them now, to try to give the window 'opening' a different or bigger shape.
An Army buddy had a Fiero GT in 1988 and I was very envious. I would love to have an 88 GT but they are hard to come by and not cheap. I should get any manual model and put a 3800 in it.
The Pontiac Grand Am had a black plastic piece beside the quarter glass to make it look bigger. But it actually did have a glass there. Unlike the Fiero
No power steering made it Armstrong steering in slow and parking lot maneuvers. Almost impossible to steer in those circumstances.
Rading the GM parts bin of Cheveete and Cavalier items didn't help. They basically came apart after the warranty expired.
Plenty of room in those wheel wells - particularly on the white car. They even look unfinished. Probably look better with 17" rims to better fill those openings.
Are you sure that triangle quarter window is plastic? I remember seeing these cars in the junkyard years ago and some of those quarter windows were shattered like tempered glass.
The 2015 Toyota Camry has similar black plastic trim to mask the shape/size of the c-pillar.
There were some GM midsized sedans, post Aeroback, that had fake rear quarter windows.
Mazda MX-5 RF has a similar black filler panel.
The Cadillac CT5 actually has a fake rear quarter window too.
Coming from a former owner of an 85 "base", 2.5 & a five-speed...in silver,, something we all seem to overlook...it was a transverse motor/trans configuration. Look at the much bally-hooed C8 Corvette....the whole back half of the car is useless space for us humans...the only recent "mid-engine" car with any hope of having usable space behind the engine is the Alfa 4C....
The Fieros' trunk can swallow a full-sized male in that trunk.!!!
All Fieros deserve a 3800, Northstar or SBC engine swap...
Since when did GM care about competing with itself? (In reference to competing with the Corvette).
GM constantly neutered other cars to prevent them from competing with the Corvette. The Camaro and Trans Am were always equipped with "more restrictive" exhaust to ensure they didn't produce the same horsepower as the Corvette - especially in the late 70's and 80's when horsepower was tough to come by. Only the Buick Regal Grand National was allowed to compete with the Corvette - and that was likely because GM knew the GN was 500lbs (at least!) heavier.
Not only that but in the hierarchy of GM, Buick was 2nd only to Cadillac. Buick was allowed the Grand National because Buick was the premium nameplate that built mid sized cars. Pontiac was supposed to be the performance division of GM but was only the 2nd rung from the bottom (Chevrolet). But Chevrolet obviously had the Corvette. Any time Pontiac came up with performance ideas that surpassed the Corvette, it was mysteriously cancelled. The Pontiac 301 turbo was supposed to be used in the 3rd generation T/A as evidenced by the bulge on the driver’s side of the hood in most 3rd generation T/As that also appeared on the 80-81 Turbo T/A. While the 301 had issues, they would’ve been corrected with the addition of electronic engine management that came a few years later. It’s not unreasonable to assume that the 301 would’ve been making 300+ horsepower by the mid to late 80s especially since Buick was able to do it with the 3.8 V6, which itself was a piece of garbage for many years before its issues were resolved. By the way, the Corvette didn’t eclipse the 300 horsepower mark again until the mid 90s. Chevrolet would have none of that. The 301 was a last minute cancellation by GM just before the 3rd generation T/A went into production. I also believe Pontiac had designed an aluminum V6 for the Fiero that GM cancelled because it would’ve been faster than a Corvette.
Little cheap manual 4-Bangers are so much fun to drive.......
My first new car, in 1984, was a Pontiac Indy.Fiero (pace car replica). Iron Duke 4 cylinder with a 4 speed manual transaxle. Objectively, it was slow, unreliable and poorly built. But I liked it a lot. Still have the Official Pace Car door decals and my Nevada "INDY" and California "84 INDY" license plates.
Jackie tended to take the long way there, and she drove a Fiero. ua-cam.com/video/d5ZnXMUXr3w/v-deo.html
Seriously, though, the Fiero was beautiful, from the first sketches and grainy spy photos, to the last Formulas and GTs, and the pictures of what was ultimately to never come. I was told that I'd either love it or hate it, but when I finally got to drive one, neither was true...
Fiat X/19 rip
I think the Callan Lyriq uses the same c pillar visual trick
Another "feature" not often talked about are the 6" wheel gaps that make the Fiero look like it's lifted. I'll always wonder why GM thought the wheel arches had to be so gargantuan. I also wonder if anyone ever put some 33" Dick Cepeks on there for a "LOL"....
6:59 1981 Dodge Challenger had something similar. Only on the Challenger it was to hide part of rear glass
Painted white this Fiero looks out of proportion.
My sister's first car!....it burned itself to the ground.
Hodgepodge car.
Yeah the Iron Duke engine was the down fall of this car what a piece of crap engine! Other than that it was a cool design and the 6 was better!
It is bizarre that they mounted the engine 180 degrees. I always thought it was straight from the FWD Citation, but no, it has been turned 180 degrees. The reason this is done is to shorten the rear length of the car; Mid engine cars have odd proportions. There is typically a long area between the rear of the door and the rear wheel and this doesn't look right. Lamborghini and Audi disguised this via design and in the R8 case with the "blade", Porsche used an intake and a window with my Cayman. GM simply put the engine right above the rear axle and this is VERY NEARLY a rear engine design.....
Ugly fake quarter window?
Yep, C8 Corvette 🤮
My brother had a ‘87 GT. He built the motor and it was fast but the handling absolutely sucked. It drove like a mid engined Chevette. 🤢
I wanted the 88 GT so bad........was not to be. Broke then and now.
The 2.5 Iron Duke (also called the Tech 4) was such an awful engine. I owned a 1986 Oldsmobile Calais with one and because of it I never bought a domestic car with a 4-cylinder again. Loud, unrefined, and pathetic acceleration. 0-60 took 12 seconds on a good day! At stoplights, I would put the car in neutral just to keep the dashboard from vibrating.
JUNK!
1985 Coworker in Southern California did not want to jump off my 1982 Camaro. I left my lights on after a noon lunch on a rare dark rainy day.
he said his Fiero had a tiny 2.5 Iron Duke.
.he was weirded out that my 82 Camaro had a 2.5 Iron Duke too..
before working at that Computer Company he worked at the NSA.