"No matter what, it's your fault as a rider" Totally agree, more people would progress faster if they were self accountable and stopped blaming their gear or whatever other excuse they have.
Dylan Bikes & Things this became reality for me when I saw someone on a $300 Walmart bike with components I never heard of, and a kick stand, hitting jumps and berms better then people on 2-6k bikes (including myself) very humbling
As a course conductor for the Professional Mountain Bike Instructor's Association and coach for Zep MTB camps in Whistler, we refer to Chris's 'Prime' position as the 'Neutral' position. As Chris states, it's the starting point for everything positive on a bike. I can echo his analysis that this is something that most riders can improve on.
@@jessehill3780 I'm thinking "proper" is as subjective as much as it is objective - there is certainly a limit on width. Too wide is easy to see when shoulder range of motion becomes limited when you stand up in your "prime posture". This could maybe be measured by the difference between the static position of your shoulder blades and then a measure of upward rotation of shoulder blades when on the bike. "Proper" bar width is a range not an absolute. So trying out anything from 740mm and up is worth while. Bigger riders with large bone structures and good mobility can get away with wider bars and maybe benefit from them. At the World Cup, even though there are so many different shaped riders - bar width is in the 750mm to 810mm range, with only a few outliers.
@@Point1Athletic I always thought the wider the better, but I have 186 cm and very long arms…. Now I started to enjoy and compare different bar widths, since I got myself two more bikes to my enduro, which used to be my only bike. I was used to 800 mm bar width and fully happy. But my DH bike has 820 mm and it gives mi this little extra stability and I do not see any backside in the cornering abilities. Recently I bought DJ bike with 'only' 760 mm bars, but I think it just matches the extremely manouverable and short reach bike.
Please do a behind the tape style rider comparison on postures and how the bikes are handled by the top guys vs the less competitive guys. Ive noticed that Troy Brosnan seems to allow the bike to move just so freely beneath him and his posture stays so composed. If you watch his posture and ignored the terrain you would never guess he was just navigating his way through a rock garden
Super interesting - thanks. I've never really consciously thought about body posture and "the attack position", but will hit the trails and see where I'm at.
Ok first part was for me little bit of blah blah blah...But from minute 6 it starts to get really interesting and enlightening! I once hired a coach for one day and luckily enough he strongly pushed me into this 'basic' posture and it was a great game changer for me! He also helped me in jumping technique by a small but so important detail - strongly push your heels down before the actual jump! It gives you this elasticity that allows you to stand up in the lip and that allows you to get more height, tons of control and it opens you to advance techniques, like whips or tables….
Jordie what you said about the troubleshooting process being cyclical reminded me of a book (also on UA-cam) called "The Goal: A Process for Continuing Improvement". In the book a process is fleshed out for identifying where the bottleneck is and eliminating it. Also part of the theory is that once you eliminate one bottleneck another one always appears and that you only get as much throughput as your slowest resource. Put to an athletic performance setting instead of the industrial production setting it was designed for I feel like it would translate very well.
Amazing video, coached alpine skiing for a long time where the similar concept is called “stacking” where we stack the joints between turns...this video really helped me make the link and make sense of it in biking
A like yuor video guy's of the #dialed #foxdialed . Per siemp is the tod in the mentality of the sujet #ridefox progressives the human body 🤙💯 completions guy's. Chris Kil Murray and Jordi Cortés.
This is timely because I was riding my new bike the other day and three thoughts came into my head: - I'm straining too much on the DH compared to my friend who I just cleaned on the climb up (hint: it's not leg strength holding me back) - Bars feel too wide for me causing straining and bad form - Probably need to build even more arm strength rather than just tweak fork settings
I wonder how he feels about the difference between people with long upper body/short legs vs short upper body and long legs. I've always felt like people with long upper bodies would naturally be more bent over on the bike.
Good posture is always a unique solution - each rider is different but will share common "shapes" - like a neutral spine, stable head or hinged hips etc.... Some riders like Reece Wilson have long torso and very short legs and really optimise how they use their anthropomorphic shape. Other riders on the opposite end of the spectrum like Minnaar have a very long pair of legs but still manage to ride relaxed and tall and really use the inherent viscoelasticity in their muscular system very well.
Point1 Athletic Development would you say a certain posture would ultimately be better suited to bike riding? Or would this be compensated by bar height, reach, bb height and so on? EDIT: posture as in relationship between upper and lower body, arm length etc.
Your spine should be straight or "neutral" - a bent back would mean the muscles that support your spine are in a "long" position and thus you'll struggle to really optimise performance on the bike. Like wise if your spine is flexed then your abdominal muscles will be sitting in their flexed / short position thus meaning you won't be able to deal with all of the forces that come from the ground into your handlebars as well. So long story short a straight back allows you to expend less energy to ride well and allows your head /neck to stay neutral so you can see trail features far in advance of having to deal with them,
From Motocross to mountain bikes line choice is important and pre jumping a root to compressing forks on the face of the jump. My suspension never stays on the same setting what I feel and not what Fox says. People don't learn about suspension but rely on someone else.
Suspension setup can have an impact on body position. Im shocked how many people run their forks so soft they ride in the last 1/3 of their travel. Also rockshox forks, absolute balls & pone to it
We need the next stage of analysis of body position. We just watched the two briefly discus as Jordy says Neutral. Now move onto (not sure what term to use) but something that describes putting that center of mass into position that it needs to be after that corner as one enters the corner. Watching Amaury this is what I see him doing. His body is leading. That split second before the turn he positions himself so when he exits the turn he is in his neutral position. I also notice his neutral position is much more of an attack position than most. But as Chris says one needs the strength. Is anybody more fit than Amaury? I have asked Amaury on Instagram (no response) but to me he has had some serious traying in GS or Downhill skiing.
Curious if they can recommend a bar width based on size and wing span". Is a 6 ft 3 tall rider good geometry for a 800 mm wide bar assuming they are fit?
do a press up in the most comfortable position . hands not too spread and not to close together.whatever width you feel you can do a press up most efficiently. measure the width of your hands and thats YOUR bar width.
Sweet vid! In Prime position, what % of body weight are you supporting on arms vs legs? eg 20/80....and how does that weight distribution change when going into an aggressive position going down steep tech?
I wonder what these two think about bikes getting so much longer? Should dh bikes be longer than enduro, is everyone starting to ride bikes that are too big?
I am constantly hearing all manner of professionals debunk all of the market driven trends ie: proper width bar, upright position, buying a bike that actually fits you. But I am still baffled why these ridiculous trends hang around for so long and how they gain such momentum. I personally enjoy a wide variety of MTB content but I more often than not find arguing with the crap they're pushing. Not to single out Pinkbike but it's notorious for enraging me, freakishly long reach, 30% sag and flat tyres and bikes that weigh nothing. Non of this equates to a proper Mountain bike. But it does directly go to what Chris said about the newbi safety posture. This bike model places the rider in that scared laying flat position with very little ability to properly handle the bike, but hey at least it's plush and comfortable.
Can you guys make a video about lubricants jordie use and Fox allow to use??? There is no such things as -fox suspension grease- instead I've seen in some -dialed- videos that the guys use slick oleum, RSP slick grease, in PB I've seen one lil bottle is oil called -one ball- for example, now Maxima oils sells a new grease called -assembly grease- I dunno if that grease would work because nobody reviews that sort of things ,you just see a video of -fox 36 lower oil change- and some ppl use white grease, Cristal grease, motorbike fork oils, TF2 grease ,or motorex white grease etc, would be interesting to see Jordie doing some reviews or opinions about these greases because for what I've seen on forums some of the old TI marzocchis reccomended to use Morgan blue calcium grease ,other greases are lithium base others are ptfe base others polyurea like park tools green grease...... Jordie plz give us lights where for years we just try and error 😁
@@lexusstefan927 Ive seen that on some modern manuals but in others A bit more older or from other brands there's a just -apply grease in part xxxx and reassemble- in a world of wide range of options what a better thing like the opinion or experiences from a great in field technician like Jordie, even caterpillar has a soy oil base grease or John Deere, WPL lubes has vetegable base lubes too, now WD-40 has this new range calcium base grease between 3more others and a bike range of cleaners/chain oil, I've read in magazines from 2011 putting chain oil to dust wipers(good???no good??? We dont know) old grey RS seals fall apart if you use GT85 silicone spray, Jordie approves silicone sprays use?? I don't know, that's why this kind of videos about opinions and interviews are very useful targeting many aspects in mtb ,I love this content I just like to develop some more and find useful details ,like hearing from a chef about marinate some meat with a special ingredient and some experiences testing different ones .
What would you recommend for a specialized Levo ebike? I'm currently running a Fox 36 2019. 160mm travel. I'm looking at the new version 36 or 38 at 160mm. But there is just no info on the 38 vs the 36 for an aggressive trail geometry Levo ebike, with downhill carbon rims(We are ones) I am in the Utah mountains, i ride hard for a 43 yr old and will regularly do moderately sized jumps and drop offs. But do not race. I'm 185lbs, 5'11". Will I be giving up small bump sensitivity on the 38? Weight is not an issue, what would be the pros and cons of each for my situation?
Jordi’s awesome but, respectfully, he’s incorrect. Gwin brought motocross talent technique and discipline to WC downhill. IMO Gwin is just the best in every facet of MTB ever and he paved the way for Bruni.
I wish my friends would respectfully tell me how crappy I am and where I need to work on my issues instead of giving me the middle finger for telling them.. 😂🤣
"No matter what, it's your fault as a rider" Totally agree, more people would progress faster if they were self accountable and stopped blaming their gear or whatever other excuse they have.
Dylan Bikes & Things this became reality for me when I saw someone on a $300 Walmart bike with components I never heard of, and a kick stand, hitting jumps and berms better then people on 2-6k bikes (including myself) very humbling
Jordy is such a character we need to get a video call with Loris. I can’t imagine how hard that would be to understand
I guess it'd be fine at first but then Loris would go "Da-Da-Da-Puffff!" or something, just to deliver the thought :P
That could have been an hour longer. SO good.
thanks Jason, we've already spoken about doing a send episode on this topic
This is awesome and the entire Dialed series is GOLD!
As a course conductor for the Professional Mountain Bike Instructor's Association and coach for Zep MTB camps in Whistler, we refer to Chris's 'Prime' position as the 'Neutral' position. As Chris states, it's the starting point for everything positive on a bike. I can echo his analysis that this is something that most riders can improve on.
Thanks Ross! Prime, neutral, call it what we will - we know it when we see it. Especially done well or poorly haha
I'd really like to see an actual demonstration of body position for up hill and downhill.
I'll see what I can do! ;-)
Point1 Athletic Development and a good way to determine proper bar width too?
@@jessehill3780 I'm thinking "proper" is as subjective as much as it is objective - there is certainly a limit on width. Too wide is easy to see when shoulder range of motion becomes limited when you stand up in your "prime posture". This could maybe be measured by the difference between the static position of your shoulder blades and then a measure of upward rotation of shoulder blades when on the bike. "Proper" bar width is a range not an absolute. So trying out anything from 740mm and up is worth while. Bigger riders with large bone structures and good mobility can get away with wider bars and maybe benefit from them. At the World Cup, even though there are so many different shaped riders - bar width is in the 750mm to 810mm range, with only a few outliers.
@@Point1Athletic I always thought the wider the better, but I have 186 cm and very long arms…. Now I started to enjoy and compare different bar widths, since I got myself two more bikes to my enduro, which used to be my only bike. I was used to 800 mm bar width and fully happy. But my DH bike has 820 mm and it gives mi this little extra stability and I do not see any backside in the cornering abilities. Recently I bought DJ bike with 'only' 760 mm bars, but I think it just matches the extremely manouverable and short reach bike.
No, no, no. I'm pretty sure I just need an even more expensive bike..
Rafe Maxwell with Fox kashima everything!
Please do a behind the tape style rider comparison on postures and how the bikes are handled by the top guys vs the less competitive guys. Ive noticed that Troy Brosnan seems to allow the bike to move just so freely beneath him and his posture stays so composed. If you watch his posture and ignored the terrain you would never guess he was just navigating his way through a rock garden
This is is episode we wanted!
BIKE CHECK of Jordi's Tallboy. Please.
Pure gold in times like these. If we can’t ride our bikes right now due to lockdown, we can envision how to ride better in the future.
Actual Gold right there! Superb insights from Chris and Jordi
Totally awesome episode!, more with these guys!!
What a great series!!
You just did something awesome. MORE OF THAT
So glad i went back and watched this.
Great episode guys! Nice to touch on how fitness and body posit are as important as bike parts and setup. It all works together. 🤘
Super interesting - thanks. I've never really consciously thought about body posture and "the attack position", but will hit the trails and see where I'm at.
Ok first part was for me little bit of blah blah blah...But from minute 6 it starts to get really interesting and enlightening! I once hired a coach for one day and luckily enough he strongly pushed me into this 'basic' posture and it was a great game changer for me! He also helped me in jumping technique by a small but so important detail - strongly push your heels down before the actual jump! It gives you this elasticity that allows you to stand up in the lip and that allows you to get more height, tons of control and it opens you to advance techniques, like whips or tables….
Jordie what you said about the troubleshooting process being cyclical reminded me of a book (also on UA-cam) called "The Goal: A Process for Continuing Improvement". In the book a process is fleshed out for identifying where the bottleneck is and eliminating it. Also part of the theory is that once you eliminate one bottleneck another one always appears and that you only get as much throughput as your slowest resource. Put to an athletic performance setting instead of the industrial production setting it was designed for I feel like it would translate very well.
Enjoying these videos you guys been producing recently started watching, feel guilty I dont own a fox suspension 🤣
Amazing video, coached alpine skiing for a long time where the similar concept is called “stacking” where we stack the joints between turns...this video really helped me make the link and make sense of it in biking
Zoe from pinkbikes ‘full Enduro’ series should watch this!
A like yuor video guy's of the #dialed #foxdialed . Per siemp is the tod in the mentality of the sujet #ridefox progressives the human body 🤙💯 completions guy's. Chris Kil Murray and Jordi Cortés.
Great content! I hope I'm not the only wierd one who took a screenshot of that doodle depicting "prime posture". Haha
They'll all be on my Instagram tonight! @point1athletic
Sam Hill position on bike look so effortless, it looks close to that draw.
very valuable info, thanks for the tips guys
you are welcome!
This is timely because I was riding my new bike the other day and three thoughts came into my head:
- I'm straining too much on the DH compared to my friend who I just cleaned on the climb up (hint: it's not leg strength holding me back)
- Bars feel too wide for me causing straining and bad form
- Probably need to build even more arm strength rather than just tweak fork settings
that was awesome, big thx!! :)
Really enjoying these little tech vignettes 👍
Great conversation, thank you!
Very interesting, thank you !
Dude, looks like your van is totally DIALD. Would love to see a tour of that bad boy. Great video series also!
I like the intro statement.
I wonder how he feels about the difference between people with long upper body/short legs vs short upper body and long legs. I've always felt like people with long upper bodies would naturally be more bent over on the bike.
Good posture is always a unique solution - each rider is different but will share common "shapes" - like a neutral spine, stable head or hinged hips etc.... Some riders like Reece Wilson have long torso and very short legs and really optimise how they use their anthropomorphic shape. Other riders on the opposite end of the spectrum like Minnaar have a very long pair of legs but still manage to ride relaxed and tall and really use the inherent viscoelasticity in their muscular system very well.
Point1 Athletic Development would you say a certain posture would ultimately be better suited to bike riding? Or would this be compensated by bar height, reach, bb height and so on?
EDIT: posture as in relationship between upper and lower body, arm length etc.
How wide should handlebars be compared to shoulder width? Other factors? Can you elaborate please!!!
When I ride my back is bent and somewhat hunched over. Should it be strait or is this posture ok?
Your spine should be straight or "neutral" - a bent back would mean the muscles that support your spine are in a "long" position and thus you'll struggle to really optimise performance on the bike. Like wise if your spine is flexed then your abdominal muscles will be sitting in their flexed / short position thus meaning you won't be able to deal with all of the forces that come from the ground into your handlebars as well. So long story short a straight back allows you to expend less energy to ride well and allows your head /neck to stay neutral so you can see trail features far in advance of having to deal with them,
"Twistin some clickers!"
Legit
I’m trying to get my coordination and strength up for twisting the clickers.
From Motocross to mountain bikes line choice is important and pre jumping a root to compressing forks on the face of the jump. My suspension never stays on the same setting what I feel and not what Fox says. People don't learn about suspension but rely on someone else.
Suspension setup can have an impact on body position. Im shocked how many people run their forks so soft they ride in the last 1/3 of their travel. Also rockshox forks, absolute balls & pone to it
great episode on a very important topic!
posture, posture, posture!
Just watching this after world champs and Maribor rd 1, Vergier’s body position is exactly as he describes and it’s just won him a World Cup!
Hell yeah! Ride fast! Stay Neutral!
We need the next stage of analysis of body position. We just watched the two briefly discus as Jordy says Neutral. Now move onto (not sure what term to use) but something that describes putting that center of mass into position that it needs to be after that corner as one enters the corner. Watching Amaury this is what I see him doing. His body is leading. That split second before the turn he positions himself so when he exits the turn he is in his neutral position. I also notice his neutral position is much more of an attack position than most. But as Chris says one needs the strength. Is anybody more fit than Amaury? I have asked Amaury on Instagram (no response) but to me he has had some serious traying in GS or Downhill skiing.
Curious if they can recommend a bar width based on size and wing span". Is a 6 ft 3 tall rider good geometry for a 800 mm wide bar assuming they are fit?
do a press up in the most comfortable position . hands not too spread and not to close together.whatever width you feel you can do a press up most efficiently. measure the width of your hands and thats YOUR bar width.
Nah cut it to 780-770. 800 is huge
Huh. That explains a lot of the problems I have. I need a new fork but my position is rubbish.
Loris making profiles to dislike the video since Jordi didn't pick him as the rider with best posture 🤣
Sweet vid! In Prime position, what % of body weight are you supporting on arms vs legs? eg 20/80....and how does that weight distribution change when going into an aggressive position going down steep tech?
THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION, it's easy to measure the forces at the feet with pressure insoles but getting accurate hand force data is still a challenge
I wonder what these two think about bikes getting so much longer? Should dh bikes be longer than enduro, is everyone starting to ride bikes that are too big?
I am constantly hearing all manner of professionals debunk all of the market driven trends ie: proper width bar, upright position, buying a bike that actually fits you. But I am still baffled why these ridiculous trends hang around for so long and how they gain such momentum. I personally enjoy a wide variety of MTB content but I more often than not find arguing with the crap they're pushing. Not to single out Pinkbike but it's notorious for enraging me, freakishly long reach, 30% sag and flat tyres and bikes that weigh nothing. Non of this equates to a proper Mountain bike. But it does directly go to what Chris said about the newbi safety posture. This bike model places the rider in that scared laying flat position with very little ability to properly handle the bike, but hey at least it's plush and comfortable.
I keep getting cracks through my forks when I do jumps and braking into a stoppie so I want to know if this is my forks or not?
Awesome content, but why cut to a view of the laptop showing Chris with substandard audio when he has a camera? It's annoying
Bohoo.
Rubbing of that mustache... that's magical.
Is Jordi messing with us by hanging his bike by the saddle with his dropper at midstroke?
how reverbs die
Cody Brown no
@@jordicortes4993 play on, Playa
Epic
Can you guys make a video about lubricants jordie use and Fox allow to use??? There is no such things as -fox suspension grease- instead I've seen in some -dialed- videos that the guys use slick oleum, RSP slick grease, in PB I've seen one lil bottle is oil called -one ball- for example, now Maxima oils sells a new grease called -assembly grease- I dunno if that grease would work because nobody reviews that sort of things ,you just see a video of -fox 36 lower oil change- and some ppl use white grease, Cristal grease, motorbike fork oils, TF2 grease ,or motorex white grease etc, would be interesting to see Jordie doing some reviews or opinions about these greases because for what I've seen on forums some of the old TI marzocchis reccomended to use Morgan blue calcium grease ,other greases are lithium base others are ptfe base others polyurea like park tools green grease...... Jordie plz give us lights where for years we just try and error 😁
Slick honey is approved by fox from what I know
@@lexusstefan927 Ive seen that on some modern manuals but in others A bit more older or from other brands there's a just -apply grease in part xxxx and reassemble- in a world of wide range of options what a better thing like the opinion or experiences from a great in field technician like Jordie, even caterpillar has a soy oil base grease or John Deere, WPL lubes has vetegable base lubes too, now WD-40 has this new range calcium base grease between 3more others and a bike range of cleaners/chain oil, I've read in magazines from 2011 putting chain oil to dust wipers(good???no good??? We dont know) old grey RS seals fall apart if you use GT85 silicone spray, Jordie approves silicone sprays use?? I don't know, that's why this kind of videos about opinions and interviews are very useful targeting many aspects in mtb ,I love this content I just like to develop some more and find useful details ,like hearing from a chef about marinate some meat with a special ingredient and some experiences testing different ones .
What would you recommend for a specialized Levo ebike? I'm currently running a Fox 36 2019. 160mm travel.
I'm looking at the new version 36 or 38 at 160mm. But there is just no info on the 38 vs the 36 for an aggressive trail geometry Levo ebike, with downhill carbon rims(We are ones)
I am in the Utah mountains, i ride hard for a 43 yr old and will regularly do moderately sized jumps and drop offs.
But do not race.
I'm 185lbs, 5'11".
Will I be giving up small bump sensitivity on the 38?
Weight is not an issue, what would be the pros and cons of each for my situation?
There is nothing wrong with your current fork. Carry on riding it.
I believe Laurie has a perfect posture on the bike
I wonder who the physically unfit World Cup riders are 😄
Did you see the dialed suspension setup? obviously its Kaos
Nah, kaos is quite fit. Be careful with calling people out, even in fun
@@jordicortes4993 he called someone out because you asked lol
Jordi’s awesome but, respectfully, he’s incorrect. Gwin brought motocross talent technique and discipline to WC downhill. IMO Gwin is just the best in every facet of MTB ever and he paved the way for Bruni.
He wasn’t dynamic enough. Bruni has a little more separation.
LAURIE GREENLAND ALSO HAS GREAT POSTURE
I wish my friends would respectfully tell me how crappy I am and where I need to work on my issues instead of giving me the middle finger for telling them.. 😂🤣
Why does Chris Kilmurray seem like the John Kavanagh of MTBing?
is jordi wearing an anime shirt?
Jake Taylor shredders digest. They did a few shirts for us recently
А можно по русски?