An angle closer to 0° means the wedge of the variator and drive face have to work harder to get the belt up to the the outer edge of the variator and drive face. This good if you have limited space to shift the belt from a stop to top speed. If your weights are capable of closing a wider gap, an angle that matches your belt is better. You need grip on the belt to hit hard and rip fast. Inner belt width and space between variator and drive face are best tuned if they match.
polini is always better in variators! i used them all. polini malossi (oversized. multivar 2000 and mhr alu i tried) artec athena stage6 octane101 doppler and all by all polini gave me the best results more agressive more grip and better performance from 0 to top speed for cvt i always use full polini they build the best cvt's
Pls answer to my commemt I've a honda nsc 110 2010 model...my drive belt always cut and I've tried long range and short belt but it always cut and my scooter has lost it pickup speed
#1 : Don't use cheap belts. Sometimes people try to save money with generic belts and they are junk. I've done it myself and had brand new belts fail in just a few miles. #2 : Do a full CVT inspection. If you're seeing markings on the belt, try to figure out where they could be coming from and investigate thoroughly.
What i was thinking also with diffrent angle on the Pulley it will wear out the belt not good for long time use? Example the hole setup is 14 degree angle "Belt" "Rear Pulley" .. and then swap front pulley another angle this will wear out the belt right?
That's what I think. You can probably get a 14 degree (rated 28) belt to wear to 12.5 faces, but not when there's a mismatch in the front and rear angles. If you can get enough grip and it works better, then racing use is fine. Not likely to be good for belt life though.
masz rację przez to niedopasowanie pasek się ślizga a co gorsza nie może się wytrzeć do 14 stopni bo korektor momentu obrotowego (tylny talerz) ma 14 stopni i tak jedno z drugim się nie dogada :)
G'day... first time commenter here! Im in the middle of fixing up a Aprilia Sport City One 50 4T 2V 08-10 E2, is this a decent moped? (I got pre Pandemic, an now just started on it😮💨) Ive got all new Rectifier and Coil/CDI pack, Spark an Battery Cleaned carb and fired right up first go! but found hole in Vacume for throttle needle(Bugger), so ive got a PWK 24 slide carb to replace it ( is this a good idea). Im a 50yr ol bloke downunder whos looking to get around cheap and fix even cheaper( im on a Medical Pension), Finding help an info on my Brand/Model/yr of Scoot-Scoot is non existent on youtube🤔 so ive just been looking at Chinese Scooto-mobile vids like taotao just to get some basics. Next is change oil and change gear oil (i think) in the rear of the CVT gearbox. Cheers on having content i can understand (or i try to) from a New Scootophile here Downunder🙃
I don't know that scoot specifically, but it should be of good quality since it's Aprilia. A PWK may improve throttle response. They're more common for racing, but the CVK carb tends to be easier to tune and keep in tune.
dear sir, is there any idea to modify a CVT for better hill climbing performance? for example: i remember one person in India suggest a CVT system with dual belt system (very complex), or you can mod a fixed low gear for hill climbing and normal CVT for normal ride (switch by hand or automatic) Just my thinking, hehe :)
Most just use a stiffer contra spring or lighter rollers/sliders. A big bore kit would be the next step. These things are much easier than trying to redesign the scooter.
I used to just put it in my pocket, but now I used automotive double sided tape to attach it to a GoPro mount. The GoPro base is attached to the leg shield up front so now it's totally in the open and clips on and off quickly. I did super glue a piece of fishing line around it with a small clip so I have a sort of safety. That saved me once when the sticker on the back of the dragy came off (with the double sided adhesive attached to it).
Need more grip in the cvt, try going back to almost stock spring setup and slightly stiffer contra. Work your way up from their, no need high rpm take off if all that throttle going to spin and not to the ground. Find the torque spot that wants to power wheelie on demand. Grip where you need it, and slips where it is too much, unless your drifting then it’s the angle or something lol. Maybe final gear reduction ie: say if your at 8:1 try 8.5:1 Remember their are a lot of minor sport builds all about the torque and wheelies 🤙🏾😄 I could be wrong 🤷🏾♂️ 🫤 😮😅🍻😄
Usually wheelies are my problem. There's more in it if I didn't have to roll into the throttle so it doesn't wheelie. Occasionally I have issues with slip on launch, generally if the belt is getting worn and sometimes very hot days, but most of the time I couldn't tell you if it would slip WOT from a stop because there's a big chance that it's flipping over if I try that. "Easy" solution is a long low scoot, but I actually like that this thing will power wheelie from 25-30MPH. Someone else noted that in the Euro racing scene they sandblast variators to rough them up for drag racing. Wears belts, but creates more grip. I was actually thinking to go the opposite way and try a numerically lower gear ratio thinking that it could make it easier to launch, but that may make it slip. I'm still not convinced that would let me launch it more aggressively either. If I could ever hammer the throttle from a stop, it should take a good bit off of the ET. A couple tenths in the 60ft could be multiple tenths in the 1/8 mile.
Remember.. If you use Stage6 R/T fan wheel, then it is not good to use polini V-belt , the reason for this is that the Ceramic that the R/T fan wheel is coated with is destroyed by the type of rubber Polini uses on their V-belts. this applies to the entire Stage6 R/T oversize setup you know the Vario - fan wheel - pulley. really good video.
Hi, its me again😅 do you think the tpr86 would be ok with multivar 2000 and stock pulley untill i can afford an MHR over range? Thank you for the help by the way.
I think you'll have a much easier job tuning it with an OR kit. They are much better at bypassing low RPM because they're made for high rev builds. I'm sure it can work with closer to a stock setup though.
Hi Brent and thank you for your insights and methodical testing. My name is Miguel and I am from Portugal. Could you please tell me what is the app you use for making your time measurements while road testing? Again, thank you for your clarity, humility and open mind posture, that are touching to me. Bests Miguel
I use a dragy for acceleration testing : amzn.to/47Mo3JT (Affiliate Link) I tested it vs a track timing system here : ua-cam.com/video/Pmj3kuwI5v0/v-deo.htmlsi=PQ06vCQA4onhWsEv&t=1075
I've looked at that option some time ago, but my wallet ain't built like that. They aren't cheap in the US and parts availability is not good from what I could tell.
@@49ccscootyes, prices are sky high, prices of parts also, even used, but you can do Piaggio 180cc engine swap on 50cc frame, something like this ua-cam.com/users/shorts0Z_V-rDjtSo?feature=shared
I could be wrong on this theory but I noticed your temps at 9:29 were relatively low during the acceleration test. Have you considered that to be a factor in your testing? The load up you were talking about earlier in the video at low rpm / having to change the plug has me thinking that may be affecting the results you're seeing. My tune is on the richer / safer side on my rc-one but I've experienced the same issue you were talking about if I don't let the engine warm up before getting into it. Although our cooling systems and carb set up / tuning are different and results will vary from engine to engine, for reference I start it let it idle until water temp is 100 F then take off keeping it below half throttle until temp is over 120F then start getting into it. After 135F the motor really seems to be happy and my temps hover around 165F fully warmed up up to 185F on a very hot day. My engine is also out of the box stock with the exception of an mvt ignition.
If I see 165-185F coolant temp, I'm tearing stuff apart to see what's wrong. Mine runs 120-140 most of the time. Colder in winter and hotter if I'm hard on it in summer or stuck in traffic maybe. Mine runs strong there. This is more typical of racing setups. The mixture flows through the cases and cylinder so having them very hot is not beneficial. There needs to be heat in the engine, but it doesn't need to be at what most consider typical coolant temps for other engines. I only watch EGT and log that in my spreadsheet of acceleration runs so I can see if it's roughly where I expect it to be and where it is for my best results.
So I think it's you that I met today. I enjoyed it. Thanks again for flagging me down. Message me on the forum where it's private and easier IMO when you can. Here's a link to my EGT vid with all of the setup info. I've wondered how I went so long without one. ua-cam.com/video/_8izZSO41jo/v-deo.htmlsi=59IhfjZ0ZY8mtthf
@@49ccscoot that was me, glad we got to meet up and ride I’ll jump over to the forum and send you a message asap. Went back and watched your video on the EGT install that’s definitely something I may have to install this off season on my zuma.
@@hookaharehipster Please do. I talked to Matt just in comments and he said he was down to bring the e-bike out. Just didn't get any more response after asking him to find my email on my site (contact tab) or msg me on the forum so we didn't have to talk in public.
![[UA] NAVI проти G2 Esports | Blast Premier Fall Final](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QWlIm4FGESQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Как же мне нравится Ваша дотошность в измерениях. Так держать! Вы большой молодец.
I've found Kevlar belts to be crap, so reverted to an OEM Rubber belt. It eliminated slipping completely.
An angle closer to 0° means the wedge of the variator and drive face have to work harder to get the belt up to the the outer edge of the variator and drive face. This good if you have limited space to shift the belt from a stop to top speed.
If your weights are capable of closing a wider gap, an angle that matches your belt is better. You need grip on the belt to hit hard and rip fast. Inner belt width and space between variator and drive face are best tuned if they match.
polini is always better in variators! i used them all. polini malossi (oversized. multivar 2000 and mhr alu i tried) artec athena stage6 octane101 doppler and all by all polini gave me the best results more agressive more grip and better performance from 0 to top speed for cvt i always use full polini they build the best cvt's
12.5* was considerably faster on my setup. I definitely feel what you're saying by 14°is funner to ride though.
I'd be curious about a lighter rider. but won't be spending the money after your results :-)
makes me wonder what a 16 degree pulley and variator would do, tho i suspect 14 to 12 is where its dialed in and they've already got it sorted.
Pls answer to my commemt
I've a honda nsc 110 2010 model...my drive belt always cut and I've tried long range and short belt but it always cut and my scooter has lost it pickup speed
#1 : Don't use cheap belts. Sometimes people try to save money with generic belts and they are junk. I've done it myself and had brand new belts fail in just a few miles.
#2 : Do a full CVT inspection. If you're seeing markings on the belt, try to figure out where they could be coming from and investigate thoroughly.
What i was thinking also with diffrent angle on the Pulley it will wear out the belt not good for long time use? Example the hole setup is 14 degree angle "Belt" "Rear Pulley" .. and then swap front pulley another angle this will wear out the belt right?
That's what I think. You can probably get a 14 degree (rated 28) belt to wear to 12.5 faces, but not when there's a mismatch in the front and rear angles. If you can get enough grip and it works better, then racing use is fine. Not likely to be good for belt life though.
masz rację przez to niedopasowanie pasek się ślizga a co gorsza nie może się wytrzeć do 14 stopni bo korektor momentu obrotowego (tylny talerz) ma 14 stopni i tak jedno z drugim się nie dogada :)
G'day... first time commenter here! Im in the middle of fixing up a Aprilia Sport City One 50 4T 2V 08-10 E2, is this a decent moped? (I got pre Pandemic, an now just started on it😮💨) Ive got all new Rectifier and Coil/CDI pack, Spark an Battery Cleaned carb and fired right up first go! but found hole in Vacume for throttle needle(Bugger), so ive got a PWK 24 slide carb to replace it ( is this a good idea). Im a 50yr ol bloke downunder whos looking to get around cheap and fix even cheaper( im on a Medical Pension), Finding help an info on my Brand/Model/yr of Scoot-Scoot is non existent on youtube🤔 so ive just been looking at Chinese Scooto-mobile vids like taotao just to get some basics. Next is change oil and change gear oil (i think) in the rear of the CVT gearbox. Cheers on having content i can understand (or i try to) from a New Scootophile here Downunder🙃
I don't know that scoot specifically, but it should be of good quality since it's Aprilia.
A PWK may improve throttle response. They're more common for racing, but the CVK carb tends to be easier to tune and keep in tune.
@49ccscoot cheers m8 appreciate the time and info, on your part. Big cheers from downunder🙃
dear sir, is there any idea to modify a CVT for better hill climbing performance?
for example: i remember one person in India suggest a CVT system with dual belt system (very complex), or you can mod a fixed low gear for hill climbing and normal CVT for normal ride (switch by hand or automatic)
Just my thinking, hehe :)
Most just use a stiffer contra spring or lighter rollers/sliders. A big bore kit would be the next step. These things are much easier than trying to redesign the scooter.
@49ccscoot thank you sir 👍😊
the more power engine, the more hill climbing experience, just that. Or sell it to buy a motorcycle 😁
Do you have a fb I got started on that taotao racer to an aprilia motor like to send ya picks
It'll be obvious which one I am. Brent Blades.
Where do you put your dragy on your bike
I used to just put it in my pocket, but now I used automotive double sided tape to attach it to a GoPro mount. The GoPro base is attached to the leg shield up front so now it's totally in the open and clips on and off quickly. I did super glue a piece of fishing line around it with a small clip so I have a sort of safety. That saved me once when the sticker on the back of the dragy came off (with the double sided adhesive attached to it).
Very nice digestible size
I enjoy riding my Guzzi but you make me want to tinker with my drive again.
а что если нормальная свечка и скорость увеличится.так
I think something is lost in translation or I'm missing something. The spark plug doesn't have much to do with the CVT.
Need more grip in the cvt, try going back to almost stock spring setup and slightly stiffer contra. Work your way up from their, no need high rpm take off if all that throttle going to spin and not to the ground. Find the torque spot that wants to power wheelie on demand.
Grip where you need it, and slips where it is too much, unless your drifting then it’s the angle or something lol.
Maybe final gear reduction ie: say if your at 8:1 try 8.5:1
Remember their are a lot of minor sport builds all about the torque and wheelies 🤙🏾😄
I could be wrong 🤷🏾♂️ 🫤 😮😅🍻😄
Usually wheelies are my problem. There's more in it if I didn't have to roll into the throttle so it doesn't wheelie. Occasionally I have issues with slip on launch, generally if the belt is getting worn and sometimes very hot days, but most of the time I couldn't tell you if it would slip WOT from a stop because there's a big chance that it's flipping over if I try that. "Easy" solution is a long low scoot, but I actually like that this thing will power wheelie from 25-30MPH.
Someone else noted that in the Euro racing scene they sandblast variators to rough them up for drag racing. Wears belts, but creates more grip. I was actually thinking to go the opposite way and try a numerically lower gear ratio thinking that it could make it easier to launch, but that may make it slip. I'm still not convinced that would let me launch it more aggressively either. If I could ever hammer the throttle from a stop, it should take a good bit off of the ET. A couple tenths in the 60ft could be multiple tenths in the 1/8 mile.
Remember.. If you use Stage6 R/T fan wheel, then it is not good to use polini V-belt
, the reason for this is that the Ceramic that the R/T fan wheel is coated with is destroyed by the type of rubber Polini uses on their V-belts.
this applies to the entire Stage6 R/T oversize setup
you know the Vario - fan wheel - pulley.
really good video.
The front pully plate doesn’t have any plating only the variator has it u can clearly see it in his video
:3
Hi, its me again😅 do you think the tpr86 would be ok with multivar 2000 and stock pulley untill i can afford an MHR over range?
Thank you for the help by the way.
I think you'll have a much easier job tuning it with an OR kit. They are much better at bypassing low RPM because they're made for high rev builds. I'm sure it can work with closer to a stock setup though.
@@49ccscoot thank you verry much
Have you not tried using a different gearbox 🤔🤔🤔
Not yet.
Hi Brent and thank you for your insights and methodical testing.
My name is Miguel and I am from Portugal.
Could you please tell me what is the app you use for making your time measurements while road testing?
Again, thank you for your clarity, humility and open mind posture, that are touching to me.
Bests
Miguel
I use a dragy for acceleration testing :
amzn.to/47Mo3JT (Affiliate Link)
I tested it vs a track timing system here :
ua-cam.com/video/Pmj3kuwI5v0/v-deo.htmlsi=PQ06vCQA4onhWsEv&t=1075
Thanks. I will see it. 🙏
Get a Gilera runner 180cc 2 stroke or a Piaggio skipper 125 2 stroke With Malossi 172cc kit its really fun
I've looked at that option some time ago, but my wallet ain't built like that. They aren't cheap in the US and parts availability is not good from what I could tell.
@@49ccscootyes, prices are sky high, prices of parts also, even used, but you can do Piaggio 180cc engine swap on 50cc frame, something like this
ua-cam.com/users/shorts0Z_V-rDjtSo?feature=shared
Have you tried stiffer contra springs?
I switched from the Malossi spring that comes with the OR kit to the Polini spring that comes with their variator, which is a little stiffer.
yet again another banger!
Nice vids as always
I could be wrong on this theory but I noticed your temps at 9:29 were relatively low during the acceleration test. Have you considered that to be a factor in your testing? The load up you were talking about earlier in the video at low rpm / having to change the plug has me thinking that may be affecting the results you're seeing. My tune is on the richer / safer side on my rc-one but I've experienced the same issue you were talking about if I don't let the engine warm up before getting into it. Although our cooling systems and carb set up / tuning are different and results will vary from engine to engine, for reference I start it let it idle until water temp is 100 F then take off keeping it below half throttle until temp is over 120F then start getting into it. After 135F the motor really seems to be happy and my temps hover around 165F fully warmed up up to 185F on a very hot day. My engine is also out of the box stock with the exception of an mvt ignition.
If I see 165-185F coolant temp, I'm tearing stuff apart to see what's wrong. Mine runs 120-140 most of the time. Colder in winter and hotter if I'm hard on it in summer or stuck in traffic maybe. Mine runs strong there. This is more typical of racing setups. The mixture flows through the cases and cylinder so having them very hot is not beneficial. There needs to be heat in the engine, but it doesn't need to be at what most consider typical coolant temps for other engines.
I only watch EGT and log that in my spreadsheet of acceleration runs so I can see if it's roughly where I expect it to be and where it is for my best results.
So I think it's you that I met today. I enjoyed it. Thanks again for flagging me down. Message me on the forum where it's private and easier IMO when you can. Here's a link to my EGT vid with all of the setup info. I've wondered how I went so long without one.
ua-cam.com/video/_8izZSO41jo/v-deo.htmlsi=59IhfjZ0ZY8mtthf
@@49ccscoot that was me, glad we got to meet up and ride I’ll jump over to the forum and send you a message asap. Went back and watched your video on the EGT install that’s definitely something I may have to install this off season on my zuma.
@@hookaharehipster Please do. I talked to Matt just in comments and he said he was down to bring the e-bike out. Just didn't get any more response after asking him to find my email on my site (contact tab) or msg me on the forum so we didn't have to talk in public.
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
1st💪