They have batteries now to keep it pushing so the operator can get into a safe zone to reconnect the poles. Back in the day that wasn’t the case. My mom drove the 22 and trust me if I rode with her and I would get off and make sure she was safe while connecting
This video shows why, if for no other reason than operator safety, newer trolley busses have a battery sufficient to pull clear of an intersection when stuff like this happens. They allow the operator to stop the bus somewhere NOT in the middle of an intersection before they get out to reconnect the buss to the trolley wires! I don't know the details, but I think the newer SF Muni Trolley busses have a battery sufficient to drive a few blocks (at least) - in order to detour around anything (such as construction or an accident) that keeps them away from the overhead wires.
I think the previous Škoda 14/15 TrSF ones also had a battery to allow for this kind of off-wire manipulation: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_San_Francisco#Electric_Transit,_Inc. Batteries are not new anyway. In 1940s they were quite usual in trolleybuses manufactured in Switzerland. What has changed though is the capacity. It was historically not aimed for semi-autonomous operation like nowadays were cities can expand the network without building overhead wires to sections with less frequent operation where batteries make more sense.
Switch didnt throw even though operator had his blinker on to trigger it....looks like the negative tap is off so switch didnt have the electricity to throw
It appears the angle of the poles were the problem the selectric pins on that switch though the poles were taking the straight wire there for the dewirement
How did the bus keep moving? does it have battery back ups? is it a dual mode diesel? as far as I know here in Boston when our trolley busses got off the wires, they had to be pushed (not the sliver line those were dual mode with diesel)
This model trolley bus has a small traction battery to store and use regenerative braking power. It is also used to detach from the overhead lines to get around accidents, construction, or in cases like this were it becomes detached. The operator needs to stop the bus and fully retract the trolley poles before they can use it.
At 0:14, if you look above the “passenger side” wire before the actual switches work, you’ll see a second wire above the current wire: this is an antenna. Depending on what turn signal is being used, a signal is sent via the trolly poles that in turn tells the switches what direction to send the poles. In addition, there’s usually an override switch in the driver’s position they can manually set to compensate for situations where they need to signal one direction while the poles go a different direction, or similar. In this case, the driver either didn’t signal at the right moment, or had bumped that override switch without realizing it and thus the poles went on the wrong path.
@@kilodeltaeight Thanks this is really interesting! I used to drive buses so I've always wondered how trackless trolleys work. My city (Boston) unfortunately just got rid of it's trackless trolley systems. I think for ours it was not remote control--I think the bus had to coast over the switches and pull it a certain way. It was labeled a "cut out".
@@kilodeltaeight When you say "signal sent via the trolley poles." Is this being communicated with the switch wirelessly? Like there is another antenna in the trolley poles sending a signal?
@@kilodeltaeight Actually, the second wire above the switch carries electricity. The switch itself is not copper and does not carry electricity. At 0:12, you can see the two trolley shoes pass through two sensors that are staggered. When the bus makes a turn, the two sensors are struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously. When the bus continues straight without making a turn, the two sensors are not struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously.
At 0:12, you can see the two trolley shoes pass through two sensors that are staggered. When the bus makes a turn, the two sensors are struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously. When the bus continues straight without making a turn, the two sensors are not struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously.
No you can't. A) batteries are also expensive and even less durable than the switches, B) it takes time to disconnect from and reconnect to the wires even if this could have been automated, so it would be inevitably slowing the traffic/ride, C) with the wires in also non-battery equipped buses can operate in that section and not every trolleybus has to drag the additional weight of the batteries. Meaning it is most efficient if only a subset of buses have them and that subset is used for lines which are not 100% covered by wires. D) you can still do vintage rides with old vehicles on the network if it is kept wired in its full scope.
@@MartinKozub I've heard no you can't my whole life. Guess who I've proved wrong every single time ? It's only a matter of time before it's a full battery powered bus.
@@treehugger1640 That is quite likely, yes. But not yet. There are even new trolleybus systems emerging worldwide because batteries have their own problems and limits. The additional space they occupy, the additional weight meaning higher power consumption, the power losses related to the storing of energy, the overheating problems and the additional danger of fire. Wires are not the ultimate solution to everything and they have their own problems too, however they are a proven technology.
@@MartinKozub Fully battery electric buses are already very extensively used in some places. In Shenzhen all 16 000 buses have been battery electric for 5 years now and London and Moscow both have over 1000 each
@@Gfynbcyiokbg8710 Moscow was a political decision made without any reasoning, similarly to Wellington for instance. And both were/are accompanied with high costs and extremely low reliability and the need to use more standard buses with combustion engines. As far as Shenzhen goes I have not been observing that one so no idea.
What an insanely idiotic stupid system: having a massively restrictive system of overhead electrified wires to power trams/trains/trolleys, that you have to follow all the time.
Electric-powered buses can climb the city's hilly terrain. Combustion engine vehicles constantly breakdown because they simply do not have the muscle power for fully loaded buses to climb the steep hills.
I've always wondered what would happen if this happened. Thanks for the clear, concise video.
They can also continue driving anyways.
@@tinwas_takenif they have a generator
It has on board battery
They have batteries now to keep it pushing so the operator can get into a safe zone to reconnect the poles. Back in the day that wasn’t the case. My mom drove the 22 and trust me if I rode with her and I would get off and make sure she was safe while connecting
This video shows why, if for no other reason than operator safety, newer trolley busses have a battery sufficient to pull clear of an intersection when stuff like this happens. They allow the operator to stop the bus somewhere NOT in the middle of an intersection before they get out to reconnect the buss to the trolley wires!
I don't know the details, but I think the newer SF Muni Trolley busses have a battery sufficient to drive a few blocks (at least) - in order to detour around anything (such as construction or an accident) that keeps them away from the overhead wires.
I think the previous Škoda 14/15 TrSF ones also had a battery to allow for this kind of off-wire manipulation:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_San_Francisco#Electric_Transit,_Inc.
Batteries are not new anyway. In 1940s they were quite usual in trolleybuses manufactured in Switzerland. What has changed though is the capacity. It was historically not aimed for semi-autonomous operation like nowadays were cities can expand the network without building overhead wires to sections with less frequent operation where batteries make more sense.
They can go several miles off wire. The batteries charge while the coach is on the trolley wires.
The batteries in the xcelsiors can go for 1 trips from one end of the terminal to the other.
In a case like this it's enough when battery covers about half a mile.
Strange when someone calls the bus driver an "operator"
That’s actually nothing compared to what happened if it was done on the old 7000-series. Crazy amount of sparks and completely disabled the bus.
Driving safely all the time and focus to driving ....Nice sharing ❤
Switch didnt throw even though operator had his blinker on to trigger it....looks like the negative tap is off so switch didnt have the electricity to throw
I hoped you would show, how the driver reconnect the poles.
Tbus drivers in other cities: *I gotta go reconnect poles fast!*
American tbus drivers: *Uh oh, I've dewired.. well, I'm gonna drive on battery*
It appears the angle of the poles were the problem the selectric pins on that switch though the poles were taking the straight wire there for the dewirement
Looks nice 😊
How did the bus keep moving? does it have battery back ups? is it a dual mode diesel? as far as I know here in Boston when our trolley busses got off the wires, they had to be pushed (not the sliver line those were dual mode with diesel)
This model trolley bus has a small traction battery to store and use regenerative braking power. It is also used to detach from the overhead lines to get around accidents, construction, or in cases like this were it becomes detached. The operator needs to stop the bus and fully retract the trolley poles before they can use it.
It has a battery backup
Battery backups. The T was too cheap to pay for those when they bought their trolley buses. All new trolley buses have them now.
How do they control what switch they go on?
At 0:14, if you look above the “passenger side” wire before the actual switches work, you’ll see a second wire above the current wire: this is an antenna. Depending on what turn signal is being used, a signal is sent via the trolly poles that in turn tells the switches what direction to send the poles. In addition, there’s usually an override switch in the driver’s position they can manually set to compensate for situations where they need to signal one direction while the poles go a different direction, or similar.
In this case, the driver either didn’t signal at the right moment, or had bumped that override switch without realizing it and thus the poles went on the wrong path.
@@kilodeltaeight Thanks this is really interesting! I used to drive buses so I've always wondered how trackless trolleys work. My city (Boston) unfortunately just got rid of it's trackless trolley systems. I think for ours it was not remote control--I think the bus had to coast over the switches and pull it a certain way. It was labeled a "cut out".
@@kilodeltaeight When you say "signal sent via the trolley poles." Is this being communicated with the switch wirelessly? Like there is another antenna in the trolley poles sending a signal?
@@kilodeltaeight Actually, the second wire above the switch carries electricity. The switch itself is not copper and does not carry electricity. At 0:12, you can see the two trolley shoes pass through two sensors that are staggered. When the bus makes a turn, the two sensors are struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously. When the bus continues straight without making a turn, the two sensors are not struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously.
How did the bus just go without the electricty???
There are batteries in the electric trolleybus.
@@RaymondHng ohh ok
Oh no!
Anyway.
How do these switches work?
At 0:12, you can see the two trolley shoes pass through two sensors that are staggered. When the bus makes a turn, the two sensors are struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously. When the bus continues straight without making a turn, the two sensors are not struck by the trolley shoes simultaneously.
you can totally get rid of those expensive electrical junctions if its got a freaking battery on the bus in-between intersections.
No you can't. A) batteries are also expensive and even less durable than the switches, B) it takes time to disconnect from and reconnect to the wires even if this could have been automated, so it would be inevitably slowing the traffic/ride, C) with the wires in also non-battery equipped buses can operate in that section and not every trolleybus has to drag the additional weight of the batteries. Meaning it is most efficient if only a subset of buses have them and that subset is used for lines which are not 100% covered by wires. D) you can still do vintage rides with old vehicles on the network if it is kept wired in its full scope.
@@MartinKozub I've heard no you can't my whole life. Guess who I've proved wrong every single time ?
It's only a matter of time before it's a full battery powered bus.
@@treehugger1640 That is quite likely, yes. But not yet. There are even new trolleybus systems emerging worldwide because batteries have their own problems and limits. The additional space they occupy, the additional weight meaning higher power consumption, the power losses related to the storing of energy, the overheating problems and the additional danger of fire. Wires are not the ultimate solution to everything and they have their own problems too, however they are a proven technology.
@@MartinKozub Fully battery electric buses are already very extensively used in some places. In Shenzhen all 16 000 buses have been battery electric for 5 years now and London and Moscow both have over 1000 each
@@Gfynbcyiokbg8710 Moscow was a political decision made without any reasoning, similarly to Wellington for instance. And both were/are accompanied with high costs and extremely low reliability and the need to use more standard buses with combustion engines. As far as Shenzhen goes I have not been observing that one so no idea.
This seems like such a stupid way to set up your transit. They're already on wheels, why do they need all that junk hanging overhead?
So that the vehicles can be run fully electric
It's for power...it's an electric bus. Alternative would be battery buses which some places do but trolley buses have been around for a lot longer.
Last time I checked rubber wheels don’t conduct electricity
@@dinostudios6579 last time I checked, the wheels don't sit overhead
what’s gonna power the wheels? wind?
What an insanely idiotic stupid system: having a massively restrictive system of overhead electrified wires to power trams/trains/trolleys, that you have to follow all the time.
Yes, you never use stationary electricity, isn't it? Toxic batteries are the best...
Lmao cry
If you are running often, wires are the best. Not expensive and have more power than diesel motor or batteries.
america does it shit. in the eu tbusses are way much better
Electric-powered buses can climb the city's hilly terrain. Combustion engine vehicles constantly breakdown because they simply do not have the muscle power for fully loaded buses to climb the steep hills.