Turning a Bronze Bearing for a Flat Belt “Loose” Pulley
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- Опубліковано 1 чер 2024
- Turning a Bronze Bearing for a Flat Belt “Loose” Pulley
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From Oilite themselves:
For Oilite® Bearing Materials
There are a few basic machining practices required to optimize retaining surface micro-porosity and the self-lubricating properties of Oilite® bearing materials.
Cutting tools must be sharp. For this reason, PCD-Diamond inserts are very highly recommended since they hold a cutting edge much longer. This preserves the open-pore structure from which oil can flow freely. A dull tool will smear the pores, greatly reducing the self-lubricating qualities of the material.
Turning: Cutting Feed Rate: 0.002-0.006 IPM
Speed: Oilite® Bronze 375-500 SFM
Speed: Super-Oilite® 250-500 SFM
Roller Burnishing is an excellent choice to modify an ID slightly. Ball sizing can also be used on the ID effectively for final sizing.
Honing and grinding are never recommended on Oilite® bearing materials. Using these methods on any surface which will become the bearing surface will introduce grinding media and could easily smear the bronze pores sealing the micro-porosity.
After extensive machining, bearings should be re-impregnated with appropriate/specified oils. Vacuumed impregnation is recommended. If bearings were not lubricated prior to machining and if cutting fluids were used, that medium must be removed prior to any impregnation of the oil selected for the application. Your authorized distributor can provide oils for re-impregnation after machining.
From me: A groove turned into the ID of the pulley could have been machined and packed with felt to hold oil and that oil would pass through the oilite without drilling an oil hole.
At the beginning of the video my first thought was "I'd use Oilite bronze for that job". Glad to see Keith thought the same!
The industrial revolution was wear all of America's Buffalo hides went.... they're thicker and toffee than cow hide and the factories in late 1870s through 1930s l quess had those shafts running the length of the room and in rows above all the machery with Buffalo hide belts dropping down to each machine..... millions of belts billions of feet long.... look at the old 😅pictures inside the manufacturers.....
And that slaughter of Buffalo ended the Indian way of natural life as they had..... big business has been screwing us for almost 2 centuries...... AND now it's few and fewer owners in control....😢😢😢😢😢
Back in the days when I did bushing work, it was common practice to soak the bushings in hot oil. Maybe today that is done during the manufacturing process. We would also measure the bore after pressing it in place to be sure we still had the correct clearance. 😊
I seem to recall an instruction to soak in oil for 24 hours before installation, and they came in finished sizes so you didn't ruin them by machining. I do recall them in sealed bags already oil soaked as replacement spares, but times have changed.😭
@@littleworkshopofhorrors2395 Kieth said that the shaft had an odd diameter. Are you saying that the bearing manufacturer makes custom size bearings for the same price as finished size bearings? The shaft and pulley were likely made before sintered bronze bearings were introduced (1930).
8:45 That set of Bore Mics Keith picked up and just FANTASTIC!!! :)
I worked in a production shop, making punches and dies, and we did NOT have any bore mics.
Because the jobs we did were always repetitive, we used either pin gauges, or shop made (or some times customer supplied) "Go - NO GO" gauges for accurate bore, or ID Ground jobs.
I remember “soaking” oilite in a rather niche oil in a pressure cooker before installing in some military equipment
That is "old school". Oilite uses a special synthetic oil that is forced into the sintered bearing material at high pressure. We were told the only time oil would be (maybe) needed is if there was excessive heat used to install the bearing.
I’ve re-oiled Oilite using a bell jar and a vacuum pump. As much oil that spun out of that bushing, I definitely would have re-oiled it. It does have provisions for lube now so may be moot point.
I was thinking that reoiling the bush before fitting it would be a good idea, that would ensure that when the bush was oiled in service the oil would be at the interface as opposed to just filling the bush up, but just an observation is all.
Looks like there's a need for Keith to make a "General Routine Maintenance for Operators" video to train and refresh the museum's operator staff (and supervisors).
Both you and the bushing are looking good, Keith. Thanks.
Both are quite a bit thinner.
@@Satanist-zm2rq I found the weight that Keith lost! I was wondering where that came from...
porkroll
"...20 years ago, it's been a while" 😆
It's not that old, if it's oiled regularly, it could last 50 years or more, but again that is when it's taken care of.
A very good demonstration again ,Keith. In my Mercantile Marine days, I used to watch the ship’s engineers working on those types of bearings.
It had to take years to get all of the machines and tools. Your shop is one of a kind and Knowledge few have.
You have tools never seen. Thanks for your time!
I was going to say the same thing.
Oilite bearings are self-lubricating bearings made of sintered bronze. They contain small, interconnected pores that are impregnated with oil during the manufacturing process. This oil serves as a lubricant for the bearing, providing continuous lubrication to the moving parts.
While Oilite bearings are designed to be self-lubricating, they may require additional lubrication in certain situations, such as high temperatures or heavy loads, to ensure optimal performance and longevity. However, in most typical applications, Oilite bearings do not require additional lubrication beyond what is already impregnated within the material.
An old semi mud flap under your press will help to soften the landing of parts and pushing tools. Every time I hear the sound of parts and pushing tools hitting the shop floor makes me cringe. I love the work you do, not many like you anymore, keep up the good work!
20 years is still not bad for a "simple" bronze bearing.
Even a “quick simple project” makes for a great video.
You can hear the disdain and frustration in your voice when talking about how you only replaced it 20 years ago lol. I feel your pain Keith, it's frustrating when ppl don't take of the tool you service and keep running. Hopefully the operator now knows to oil the bearing on start up to prolong the life.
It's one thing to replace something that's worn out after sixty or seventy years of use, but something like that bushing that's only 20 years old is annoying.
The new bushing won’t need as much oil as the old one but it will need some. Sintered bronze is very abrasive to cutting tools. Needs very sharp inserts to machine it cleanly.
In fairness- it is set up as a set screw hole, complete with threads and access through the pulley surface. I can see where confusion came from. I don't get why it was changed from the original though.
If Keith says 20 years isn’t long enough, 20 years isn’t long enough.
@@marty2872it is an idler pulley for when the flat belt drive is disengaged, Keith explained in the video. It's a common arrangement for line shaft driven equipment, effectively the on/off switch
after machining a Oilite bushing you have tor reload the bushing with oil and retaining surface micro-porosity is very important.
2:15 .. That's an important detail!! .As we an see the inner bearing area is INSET considerably, compared to the flat pulley area .. using even normal pressure to disassemble it .. could shear the inner part out, as it is not designed for any volume of sideways force. !
It really refreshing to watch you work and I'm constantly reminded of the amount of tooling required to undertake working in your profession. Thank you for sharing it with us.
We have signage, diagrams and labels on all our equipment. On all equipment everything needed is on or a few step away. On location we have a traveling walk-in work box with a work station. The work box is organized and inventory and people still don’t grease and oil the equipment.
6:27 IDK What RPM this operates at, but I don't trust that that old cast iron pulley is concentric to the bore.
I'd turn the OD and press the bronze into the pulley, THEN put the entire assembly in the 4 jaw, and pore the ID like that.
BUT if it operates at a slow RPM, (or the pulley is not really very circular?) ... It may not be worthy of the extra effort.
Keith this is such a great small job that although mundane is a huge help to a small time operation. Well done and thanks for sharing!
Seeing you and a pulley with a bushing to remove made me think of your (much) earlier video where you had a bigger pulley with a really really stuck bearing and the immense effort it took remove it. If I watched it right now, I’d still jump a foot in the air when it finally pops loose. Big fan of yours for a long time. 🥸👍👀✅
I really enjoy your videos. And what I like most is that your channel is almost in real time unlike most other channels.
Thank you Keith!
At least that old bushing came out with less trouble that the cap of a certain well known capstan...?
Thanks for the show.
Nice quick project. Is there a place where we can donate an oil can to them? 😂😂
Thanks Kieth, really appreciate your videos, always learning something new. 👍👍👍🇦🇺
I would suggest that a "better" way to press out the bushing would have been to invert the mandrel you were using.
Inverting it would reduce the vertical offset making the setup far more stable and therefore safer and with the smaller diameter section inside the old bushing there is far less chance for something doing the unexpected.
Always nice to see the "colored" metals being machined. Have you ever machined precious metals, like silver, gold, or platinum? If you do, we'd all like to see it and how you save the chips!
@ccrider5398 Good day Sir. I have been machining fine silver (.999) for about 30 years. My collection system is just a dedicated shop vac. I hold the vacuum hose next to the business end of the cutting tool. Pretty unsophisticated, but since the direction of the chips change with each cut on a milling machine, mounting it in one position was useless. Recovering the sawdust from the bandsaw is more challenging, requiring periodic vacuuming the tool and the floor around it. I only machine silver on the dedicated tools in order to avoid contaminating the collected swarf. Still, you do not get back 100% of the you paid for the metal unless the spot price takes a huge jump between the time you bought it and the time you sell it back. When I started in the business .999 fine silver was about $5.00 ozt. (Troy ounce) Today it's $28.62 ozt.
Fine silver is quite soft, so the cutting tools have to be very sharp or they push the material around rather than cut it cleanly. Carbide cutting tools only because silver is very abrasive and quickly dulls the tools.
what a mess, but don't you just love turning bronze. 😁
It would have been nice to see the condition of the shaft 😮
JIM
15:35 .. (with my 20/20 hindsight lol) ... Could have faced the other end of the bushing at this point .. saved Some time, and slightly more acute too.
A nice little epilogue sequence for this type of video, would a few seconds of the part in service.
So, wouldn't the ID shrink a little after it was pressed into the belt pulley?
wouldn't you want to cut the OD, press it in, THEN cut the ID to size?
I guess the tolerance is big enough that it won't matter.
That's what I was thinking. Maybe they will ream to fit the shaft after?
@@KensSmallEngineRepair Oilite shouldn't be reamed, it will smear the pores and stop it from oiling naturally.
Nice work Keith.
I have some K.O.Lee expanding mandrels, I hardly ever use them.
But when you need them they sure come in handy.
Thanks for sharing.
Great Job Thank You for sharing your wonderful life with us. Considering the shop and all the tools in it are yours, and you are the boss/owner, I’m really glad you machine parts the way you see fit.
While I always enjoy seeing another machinists process, you and I do things so simularly that at times I feel like watching and hearing your thought process is just me feeding my ego.
As such I am just putting out there, I atbleast would enjoy non-educational content from you. Just watching the work brings me joy while I am knocked out from the field getting surgeries and just being an enjuner. :-p
Thanks Keith for another great video.
love your content Mr. Rucker!
Happy Friday Georgia!😊⚙️🛠👍👍👍👍✌️
Good morning Keith! Thanks for the videos. Have a great week!
Thank you for sharing.👍
Nice job👍👍
Thanks for sharing 👍
Sounds to me like you need to make a sign for them as well to put right next to the pulley that says oil here daily.
Anyone with a job in a Mill or museum or anywhere there is machines that have parts that rotate on another part, such as a shaft. Should know that there should be some kind of lubricant, unless it's running on a sealed bearing. It's hard to find good help these day's.
Good job
20:14 That size of Brass would shrink about .0005 inches (that's one half of one thousands of an inch) .. It's measurable, and would make a little bit of difference during a .002" press fit ...
I LOVE the idea of using Dark Green Loctite, on these assemblies! .. it acts as a lubricant to press the bronze in ... and makes a difference first for the fit being more secure... AND second keeps corrosion out for when it's time to remove it !! :)
Keith, thank you for for your work with the Gerorgia Museum of Agrculture. How often should this type of bearing be oiled and how much of which oil should have been applied to keep this pulley in good working order?
saved another one!
do not confuse a bearing for a bushing a bushing is just for making a hole smaller
Nice job Keith. Only a simple job, wonder how long in real time it would have taken.
Good morning
It might be a good idea to put an hour meter on the machinery in an inconspicuous location. I find that as I get older, hour meters help me a lot. Equipment like tillers, log splitters, and pressure washers get intermittent use, and the hour meter helps remind me when to go through things. I'd rather spend time doing preventative maintenance than fixing something that I need "now."
good idea to soak oilite bronze before installing
Way back when, the common practice was to soak the oilite brass or bronze in bunker oil. Now a days that might include pulling a vaccum on the soak pan to encourage complete penetration by removing any air pockets within the structure. Capillary action only might not suit in all cases.
Edited for clarity.
It's impregnated, you can't "soak" it, not unless you have a pressure chamber to force feed it oil.
@@aserta that is the reason to draw a vacuum on the oil pot. After that the pores are drenched and it is good as new. You can also place it under pressure like they did in the original manufacturing, I recommend 5 atmospheres.
@@aserta Did you notice how much of that oil "surfaced" while on the lathe? That would need to be replaced!
Will the oil hole weep lubricant out and on to the belt? Should that have a threaded cap or a press ball plunger/oiler?
Those old flat belts dont go fast enough for it to throw oil like it was doing on the lathe 1500 rpm vs 30 or 40
Wondering how much force can be produced by an arbor press like that Famco, as compared to the 60 ton hydraulic. It must be at least limited by the weight of the person pulling x the mechanical advantage, but the gears and lever arms etc must have some kind of max rating too.
I did notice Keith has significantly de-rated himself, the new slimline version is probably only rated 1/2 the previous 😅
Hi, should you measure the ID after pressing the bushing in to see if the tolerances are still acceptable?
Re: "oddball size shaft" ----- I thought most, if not ALL line shafting was of the Odd sixteenth of an inch in diameter.. Like 13/16, 1 1/16, etc..
Did you measure the bore of the bushing after it was pressed into the hub/pulley?
You beaut Keith have a great day. Cheers from Australia.
Ditto - little beats finding a new Kieth Rucker video to watch before hitting the sack here downunder.
Hopefully oil will be used this time.
Why not put 90 degree Zerk fittings into those threaded holes, so you can inject oil into the bushing, without it leaking back out through the threaded holes?
with oilite bronze do you resoak the bronze in oil after machining to replace what spins out on the lather?
Here’s what may be a dumb question. What is the working time for locktite? Or how long does it take to fully cure?
Loctite cures fully in 24 hours at room temperature but much faster with a little heat. For faster cure apply the product and heat the surface warm to the touch. A little heat sets the product for almost instant use. More heat in the 250 F range wIll release the product for easy removal.
Does that Oilite accept both your one syllable oil as well as my two syllable oil? Just wondering...
Usual interesting and satisfying video. Thank you.
That's pretty good 20 years 😊😊😊 So sorry ! Hopefully they oil it from now on ❄❄❄
After you pressed the bushing in, did you re-check the inside bore diameter?
💛
After discussing the needed ID at about 6 minutes, It occurred to some people ''Why don't you use metric? 36.5633 will be so much easier to work with than 1.4395.' It then occurred to me 'WHY ???'
All the tools in the shop are in Imperial. He would need to convert to Metric adding to era.
It’s only easier if you’re used to working with it directly. Most American machinists would convert resulting in possible errors. Spend some time learning Imperial and you won’t need to wonder why.
Easier for anyone used to metrics. People who uses imperial’s doesn’t understand the beauty and simplicity of metrics. Especially if you need to combine units of measurements. Keep in mind that inches are based on metric measurement (1” is defined as 25,4mm).
Of course, if machines and measuring devices are imperial, it makes sense to use imperials…
will the metric police ever give it a rest?
@@edvig2015 I don't understand them. I offer to switch to metric as soon as they buy me 2 metric lathes, a horizontal mill, a vertical knee mill, and all new measurement tools. Somehow, the truck with those never seems to show up. I have to assume they're not really serious about it.
No oil grooves in the bronze insert?
I get that the museum is trying to maintain the machine as it was originally built, but if that pulley was designed today, would it use the same design? Or, are there better alternatives for bearings that might be hard to reach/oil?
Sealed ball bearings on each end.
At least with you installing that bushing there was no sideways key jamming the shaft.
Any word on the Stoker Engine?
❤️🔥
Question: when you say your taking a 40 thousand cut does that mean your actually taking a 20 thousand cut because you’re removing off two sides? Thanks
Yes that’s correct.
Your asking if he is using "on diameter" or "on radii"/"Absolute"
and the answer is
Doesnt matter, focus on what your lathe or your works lathe uses and is capable of. Most cross slide read out to on diameter but some are absolute/on the radii so always be aware of your equipement and dont worry about others.
A little "ole" makes bearings last longer.
No 710 marking?😊
That Bush will be empty by the time you are finished spinning it.... What do you think???
I think I heard him say that the bushing would absorb oil, so it should be okay.
👍👍👍👍
Kieth. Every time you use that press and I hear that "spang" as things hit the floor below, I cringe. Go get a rubber mat and put it on the floor beneath the press. Both your arbor press and hydraulic are magnificent machines, puts my small machines in the shade for sure but I do have a rubber mat on the floor🙂.
It's always a strange feeling working on a job you did 20 years ago.
Especially if it's software.
@@BlankBrain I'd imagine it be like hieroglyphics .With manual trades it makes you either proud or depressed , depending on how good the original job was.
Oil holes?
Did you bother to watch the entire video? I guess not!
@@paulcopeland9035 guess I fell asleep
Thinking you might want to market that as Leo's Golden fishing real, really!_@m ~ ~
why not use oil filled sintering bronze?
The new bearing is oil impregnated"Oilite", he explained at the start, and you could see the material sweating oil when he roughed out the bore, the previous bushing wasn't
I believe oilite is sintered bronze
@@dwightcarlson7136 👍 far more concise than my reply
Wish you would get on with Tally Ho Capstan. Get it done!
How do you know it isn’t done?
@@grntitan1 I don't Do you??
It's gotta be a vintage machine if something only lasted 20 years and was replaced just because someone forgot to oil it. Modern machines would have destroyed themselves right on schedule a month after their warranty expired...
22:52 ... I've never seen a UA-cam machinist properly lubricate Oil Impregnated "OILITE bronze bearing material ... :( .. They should be soaked in hot (over 200°F silicone based oil, for at least One Hour, before being used.
And you just KNOW the end user is not going to do this!! :) ... They couldn't even oil them in the normal fashion.
We have used a lot of "Olite" bearings over the years and oil soaking was the standard practice. However, recently (20 years or so!), "Oilite" does not recommend any further oiling for initial startup. They use a special high quality synthetic that is high pressure forced into the sintered bearing material. This is adequate for most projects. The sales rep told us that the only time additional oil would "maybe" be required is if the bearing was heated excessively during install. So, in the "old days" - yes. Not so much now.
Not that critical on an old flat belt pulley, but to be accurate turning between centers with a 3 jaw, you should turn your center first, other wise it is no more accurate than just gripping the mandrel in the chuck.
So long as your dead center is not so far off that its forcing the part to move in a circle (and that is a very dangerious set up if it is) the largest force involved will be the centripetal force keeping the part on axis.
You can do the round cow calc if you want to, I tried to round cow it enough to fit in a comment but I couldnt.
oooh ... why .... only for money??
What happens when all of you knowledgeable machinist are gone??
*Looks at blacksmithing*
Won't matter because something better will be replacing machining or it wont happen, and it won't happen because hobbiest are hobbiests and are going to hobby.
Hi Keith, do you not think the loctite will capillary and pressure into the oily pores to reduce the bearings oil holding capacity?
Keith is using Loctite 603 and using it between the housing and the bearing
" If you can’t be sure the surfaces of your cylindrical fitting parts will always be clean, try LOCTITE® 603 high-strength retaining compound. It is capable of cutting through light coatings of oil on parts, such as cutting fluids and rust preventative oils. Its low viscosity makes it ideal for augmenting press / interference fits, or slip-fitted assemblies with small clearances. The high-strength adhesive reliably prevents loosening and leakage from shock and vibration on cylindrical parts, such as roller bearings or oil impregnated bushings into housings."
I am not Keith, but I do much the same type of work and with a lot of simular tools and same materials, so I can speak up.
And yes, it does but not by much. Oilite has quite a lot of empty space inside it that gets filled up by oil and some *needs* to be displaced in order for the Loctite to have any grip. And sometimes you can see how much its soaked in by discoloration and. Even when you can see it, the amount is so thin, its like spotting the edge of some phonebook paper or rolling paper by the edge. Just next to nothing
Great video thanks for sharing