great video, very informative many thanks. Question on a seperate issue although it relates to noise. There two conflicting videos on youtube ( posted in the last week) when it comes to ISO and noise. One says ISO has no baring on noise and the other says it does with the caveat: when shooting in manual raising the ISO will make no difference as its applied after the image has been taken. When shooting in priority, there will be a difference. I've not heard this before. Assuming you have a decent sized sensor and all things are equal, which is it? Appreciate your technical thoughts.
Cheers Ted 🍻🍻 With regard to your ISO question - Mr Northrup is renowned for posting 'controversial click-bait' type videos that fuel a perpetual misunderstanding amongst those who want to learn ! The simple facts are these: 1. ISO/ASA/DIN USED to be part of the real exposure triangle back in the days of film, where the ISO/ASA/DIN number was a measure of the sensitivity of film to light Fast films had high numbers and their higher sensitivity to light was due to their emulsion containing LARGE silver halide grains - hence when processed and printed the images had a very large and highly visible grain structure - examples would be Kodak TriX and Ilford HP5. Conversely 'slow' films such as Ilford PanF or Kodak PanatomicX had very tiny silver halide crystals which made them slower to react to light but they produced a relatively grain-free image when printed. Grain structure and its visibility impacted detail resolution. 2. While everyone knows sensors have replaced film, there's one thing that most folk fail to grasp - the camera sensor is of a FIXED ISO and is 100% non-variable - so your ISO control does not vary the sensitivity of your sensor. That fixed ISO is refereed to as base ISO. 3. A digital camera/sensor is an electronic device and like all electronics they generate noise when they have power running through them - we can call this the 'base noise floor'. 4. When we take a shot, light strikes the sensor and generates a signal, and in a good exposure (ETTR) where the brightest values of light are recorded just below the point of over exposure we have what called 'good SNR' or a near perfect signal to noise ratio (noise being the base floor noise I mentioned earlier). 5. When we have insufficient light we raise our ISO value BUT the camera still takes the shot at base - so we now have a reduced signal but the same level of base noise - we have a lower SNR. 6. The ISO control on your camera is NOT really ISO but a GAIN control, and it only does its job AFTER the shot has been taken - in other words after the SNR has been fixed. If your camera has a base sensitivity of 100ISO and you take a shot at 800ISO then the shot is really 3 stops under exposed. The gain control (ISO setting) then adds those 3 stops back in during the shots progress through the camera image processors - in other words AFTER the shot is taken but BEFORE it is written to the media card. The upshot of all this Ted is that IF we have a shot with a low SNR then the gain control (ISO setting) lifts the level of BOTH signal and noise floor together - hence the levels of noise in the shot are amplified as well as the input signal level, so our shot looks noisy. So it's not about ISO setting, shutter speed or aperture - it's all about SNR my friend! If you watch my videos then you will see on my wildlife action shots that I shoot regularly in manual exposure and autoISO, and frequently my ISO values are in 4 digits - but they are relatively noise-free. That's because I still have good SNR because I'm shooting in good light. But if I shoot in crap light even at a lower ISO, I get a lot more noise - because the SNR is poor. Priority mode makes no difference in theory, but in practise some camera metering systems tend to lean towards under exposure (bad SNR) than others, so you just have to learn how to compensate for that on any particular camera - usually with the Ev compensation settings. Hope that helps Ted.
@@AndyAstbury Oh my, have to get my head around this. I didn't mention any names, but of course you are correct: Mr Northrup appears to make a number of claims which I have found startling at times. I'm relatively new to this youtube photography output, so am trying to learn who is worth viewing and who to ignore... So, if I have understood you correctly, manual shooting in theory should give you better results regardless of ISO settings, even if shooting in low light levels, which is obviously when you would crank up the ISO...I use a canon 6d but I have never set the ISO more than 1200 for fear of noise.
@@AndyAstbury amazing answer!!! i read a lot of blog/webs about this topic.. and never found anyone talking with such "technicality" (of course.. u could be lying to me and I wouldnt know it haha). but i want to know more.. can u explain me the SNR concept? (or maybe u have a video about that) Regards!!
Who doesn't like these long videos by Andy Astbury, dishing out incredibly useful, knowledgeable and considered advise and guidance?? I couldn't be happier when Andy digs in at length to yet another important topic! Thank you, Andy! :)
I love the long videos ! UA-cam has a lot of people putting out short videos but I love delving deeper into some of this advanced capability like you have done in the last couple of raw therapee videos. Keep it up !
Excellent, informative tutorial, Andy. It is, by far, the most important Raw Therapee tutorial I have viewed to date, and it is already making a massive difference in my raw image processing. Thank you!
I have been watching quite a number of your Raw Therapee videos which are unfailingly detailed and helpful in getting one's head around this fairly tricky programme. Thankyou for all the time and effort you have devoted to teaching those of us who occasionally need to be led by the nose. I became intrigued by an occasional reference to your base setting for all images which I considered to be something I needed to deal with before cracking on with everything else so I started hunting through your video material. I incorrectly assumed it was something you had put up in an early Raw Therapee video so I watched all of those. Nope, couldn't find it there. It is only now that I have found the "mybase.pp3" chapter at the beginning of this video, with further clarification of the process given in answer to Peter Lee's question in the comments above. Can I ask you, on behalf of anyone else new to RT, to make up a video on setting up a base pp3 titled something like 'Do this first before you start to get your head around Raw Therapee. It is the most basic thing of all.' If you do this, you could help others to get going that much more efficiently.
still getting to grips with raw therapee but finding your videos a big help. I'm only a hobbyist and at the moment for most shots just use tiffs from Olympus workspace into gimp ;) You mention the blue and yellow lines in when you're doing detail - noise reduction, chrominance curve - seems they are control points on a bezier curve. When you hover over the circle and just to one side, the cursor changes into a two headed dirctional arrow no the horizontal plane; moving this results in the normal rubber band movement of the bezier curve between the selected point and the one to the left or right of it. don't worry about long videos - easy to jump forwards a bit if we need to ;) those that don't like it are missing out :)
Learned a lot..... well, you taught a lot, whether I learned remains to be seen. Btw those yellow and blue bars in the noise curve look like Bezier handles (for "bending" the curve).
Revisiting this video today to set up my Raw Therapee and it's transition into PS properly. Since my last comment I've signed up for the Adobe subscription but will only be using Bridge and PS (no LR for me) with Raw Therapee. I dumped PhotoRaw because I wasn't happy with the results from it. It was just okay and RT has the control and results I've been looking for. I've since joined your Patreon club as well.
Excellent as always Andy, learnt a lot today and I'm sure I'll look into bringing some RAW images into RT just to give me the best starting point before further editing in Adobe PS. I used GIMP for several years and there is no way I'd go back. Photoshop is a lot easier to use. Don't get me wrong, it can pretty much do most things PS can do but in a more convoluted way which to me at least seemed less intuitive. Well explained and simple to follow, you are an excellent instructor Andy 👍
This is very interesting, I love these long lessons of valuable content. Are you sure that Lightroom doesn't choose between a number of demosaicing algorithms based on an automated validation of the raw content? Adobe must have realized the advantage of this too.
Must they??!! Lightroom/ACR uses the demosaic algorithm dictated by Adobe in the current process version Eigil - always has, and always will, unless they suddenly wake up and smell the roses! Most raw processor apps use a fixed demosaic, and like Lightroom, only switch if they are greeted with a non-Bayer sensor image. Iridient used to be unique in offering multiple demoz algos for Bayer sensor images. but RT/ART and maybe Darktable are the only ones that offer a wide choice (though can't say for definite with Darktable).
@@AndyAstbury Thanks for clarifying that, Andy ;O) As a beginner with RT I think I can see new and more well defined details in my S-A7R3 files during pixel peeping (though the ARWs have been converted to Adobe DNGs to save half the space on the HD, 86 vs. 43 Mb per file. This reduction without a visible loss in quality is another riddle to me). Would better defined details be due to the higher bit precision in RT's demosaicing? I hope I am not fantazising. I also think I can see a softer transition in general. I hardly dare increase the contrast.
Hello Andy! Thanks a lot indeed for this new oustanding video: plenty of new things to learn as usual. I have noticed you have brought up an example related to the software Capture ONE What do you think about: RawThrerapee vs Capture One? Is it worth the "upgrade" to Capture One OR do you think RawTherapee has all the tools for PRO color corrections? I have read great reviews of Capture One but I always sticked with RawTherapee so far :-) To handle my collections of pictures I run Digikam whereas RawTherapee is run for color corrections, sharpening, noise reduction stuff...
Hi Silvio - I've never been a big fan of CapOnePro, though I used to use it a lot at one time (still have my 2 disk set of v.4!). But with a photography package AdobeCC sub for £10 per month and free RT with pretty much seamless integration with Ps then I can't personally think of any base I haven't got covered. I know some folk find £10 a month 'unaffordable' but for me I'd be happy paying more than that just for Photoshop - hell, I did - for years!!!!! CapOnePro won't do anything for you that RT can't (though I can't comment either way if you shoot XTrans), and Lr has the most easily usable DAM, soft-proof and print utilities out there - IMO of course!
Great video. I think the best take away really was towards the end of the video. A raw processor should be for raw processing there are other tools for everything else. If you use the right tool for each job you will get better results even if it makes the process longer. As for Gimp I agree it is great until it is not. The biggest 2 niggles I have with Gimp is no adjustment layers (these really are necessary) and you can't save a layered Tiff (for me this is also necessary). With Gimp I would need to keep track of too many master files due to the lack of layered Tiff files especially if you start making tweaks with other software for "Creative Styling". Which means if you go back and make tweaks to your XCF you need to go and redo everything else you did afterwards. So unless you are on Linux I would suggest if you don't want Photoshop take a look at Affinity Photo very powerful and cheap and it integrates well with RawTherapee. You can even use the RT Large profiles (Prophoto) without complaints.
Cheers Bill🍻🍻🍻 Many congrats too on watching it all too as the majority of viewers don't get more than 1/3rd through - the instant gratification brigade are everywhere 😱😨 If Affinity gave me the app I'd certainly give it a good going-over, but I'm not paying for something I don't need Bill so I can't comment either way...but if it's working for you that's a great thing.
@@AndyAstbury Long video for sure but good things come to the patient. I have only messed with Affinity a little bit. I believe they have a 30 day trial and right now it is like $25 usd so I picked it up to see how it was. Seems to be pretty darn good in a general sense. Has just about anything you would ever need for photo editing if you are willing to do some things the long way. For instance you need to manually create luminosity masks with temporary layers and desaturation unless you are satisfied with just blend if.... In some cases I found the Affinity InPaint brush to be better then Content Aware Fill but you can't change the sample area so it can be harder to fix when it does not work. Photoshop is well worth $10/Month tbh even if you don't use Lightroom. But not everyone can afford that so it is good that their are other options available. So Photoshop is the way I am going to go Lumenzia is amazing.... Sorry for the long ramble good thing I don't make videos they would be like 3 hrs long.
Right tool for the job. A lot of photography software tries to do everything. Take Affinity Photo.... the RAW processing is horrible and I feel like it just there to check off a feature box. Now Affinity does some things that Photoshop can't do. To name a few: you can do curves in the LAB color space without converting the entire document to LAB, you can have snapshots of your history and save them with your document, the built in frequency separation plugin is a lot easier to use than trying to use the technique in PS, no needing to support legacy code allows Affinity to take advantage of modern technology (GPU acceleration). As for Gimp, they are in the process of a massive port of some of their core code. Once the port is complete (has been going on for a few years now) they will be able to rapidly improve. One missing feature that will be introduced in a 3.x release is non destructive editing (i.e. adjustment layers). I do like some of the tools in Gimp better (at least the results). I feel like the healing brush tool they have does a cleaner job. They have the wavelet plugin which you can think of as frequency separation on steroids. RT is more than just a RAW processor. It does incorporate other tools that make it more (i.e. lens corrections). I don't do much landscape photography. I tend to do more street these days, some fashion, and events. I need to be able to get a "look" and be able to export jpeg images in bulk (don't always have time to go into PS and edit away). I feel that is where having additional tools in RT really helps. I make use of the camera profiles (I switch between the RT generated profiles and I borrow Adobe's from the DNG converter tool). I also make use of HaldCLUT profiles to get different color pallets. I created a starting point profile based on one of Andy's videos and modify as needed saving new versions. If you want to checkout a bare bones raw processor checkout RawPhotoProcessor (RPP). I won't go much into detail but that is one of my favorite RAW processors. It does not do any lens corrections or noise reduction. All it does is de mosaic, contrast, exposure, white balance, color profiling, and some sharpening if you like. For anything else it tells you to use something else like PS or even LR. Another PS alternative worth mentioning is PhotoLine. It has been around as long as PS but it much quicker and has some interesting features. I still say end of the day PS secret weapon is the vast amount of quality training material. Other apps suffer from a lack of learning material. At least Andy is creating some great RT tutorials (best I see to date).
Andy are you using camera profiles at all? Doesn't every sensor-lens combination render images slightly differently? Wouldn't it make sense to employ profiles (even custom ones created with the aid of color targets) to get 'truer' colors?
Here's the thing about custom camera profiles Dennis - yes, every lens renders a scene differently in terms of colour and contrast. But it's much deeper than that. A custom lens profile is only 100% accurate under the exact light conditions it was produced under. And if you are profiling a zoom lens then the profile is only good for the focal length you used too, because spectral absorption and distribution can change as the different elements move in relation to each other. Custom lens profiling is a can of worms created solely to capture the wallet content of the unwary digital photographer who for the most part shoots under ambient light. Ambient light is a moving feast, so simply chucking a colour checker in the shot will do the job. However, if I still had my studio and I was still doing a lot of commercial copy work then I would create a profile - simply because I had a specialist rail camera which always had the same lens mounted on it and the lights never moved or changed in intensity - the whole lot was fixed. So, horses for course and all that Dennis, but creating custom profiles for use on shots under ambient light really is an object lesson in futility - IMO of course, and far be it from me to convince anyone otherwise. All I feel it is my duty to do is to inform folk of the real facts and details, then let them decide for themselves.
Theoretically RTv4_Large equals ProPhoto, but it's a profile that is NOT recognised by Photoshop, Cap One Pro or anything else software-wise other than Raw Therapee.
You'll notice even in my Lr videos Dennis that hardly ever use any 'lens profile'. It irritates the hell out of me when I see so many demos on YT where they tick and apply an Adobe lens profile and then NEVER check its effect - some of them are complete crap and can result in all sorts of 'pixel stretching' artefacts. These artefacts only show up in folks images when they spend a small fortune on a 30"/40" print. If I'm assembling a pano then I'll manually correct each element if I need to, but slavishly adding a lens correction profile "on auto pilot" so to speak just ain't my bag! Adobe could very well write Lr code to automatically apply a correction profile to every image without any input from you, but they don't - they leave the decision to the photographer. Don't let me talk anyone out of using them, but seeing as you asked you now have my answer - I don't use them very much at all. Remember, I come from a film/print darkroom background and we never had them then!
Question; In RawTherapee 5.8 the Demosaicing/RAW-tab seems only to be adjustable/available in 'File-Browser' mode, in 'Editor'-mode the tab is empty and greyed out, would you know if there'll be an update on that? Or should one adjust these settings before actually opening any image from the file-browser area? (Mac OSX)
Dear Andy can you show me how to load Prophoto Output into Raw Therapy. I've downloaded the profile as per your link. Not sure how to load into the Output Profile. Working off a mac
......THANKs from Bavaria! ...can you recommend a set of - kind of standard Presets/Profiles - for a little sharpening, noice reduction, color improvement? Is there a download page? ...i am not a PRO on RawTherapee , but i want to improof our Family Pictures a little! I would need Improvement for to dark or to bright pictures and for normal pictures. Please Help, cause you are a PRO on this matter ;-)
Cheers! Presets - for Raw Therapee it's so easy to make your own, and no one make any for you to download as far as I know. Processing images in any software is simply a matter of making the image look how you want it - and to do that you use your own eyes! If you want me to do a video to help out with your own images then just send me a few raw files and I'll see what I can come up with.
I was following closely when you applied Impulse Noise Reduction and was a little confused when the worst offending pepper pixel failed to disappear. And then I wiped my screen. D'oh
Andy , its a pity that "time saving preset doesn''t work" Every time I open RT 5.8 it opens with the default profile "Auto matched curve ISO low" as per the RT manual.I keep changing it in preferences to My base PP3 and saving it as Default processing profile but every time I go back in it has defaulted to "last saved" , not even "auto matched curve ISO low " which still appears in preferences
Hi Peter - it does. But, go into your Pref>Image Processing and is 'use bundled profiles' checked? If so untick it. There is also a profile fill button to the left of where it says Last Saved - if that is pushed in (dark with 4 light bars) then click it to make it go light grey with light bar top and bottom and the middle two greyed out. It will always say Last Saved (why I don't know) but if you have MyBase set as default, go into the tabs in the dev module to check the actual values are correct. Personally I think it's a bug or oversight in RT - but I just ignore it because it does actually work.
I don't have all the options you show under RAW. For example I can't find 'capture sharpening' anywhere... Is that becaus of my camera en the RAW files it provides me? I shoot with a Sony A6000.
Being that I am transitioning to strictly macro photography I wonder what kind of details we can pull out of a image using RT and a raster editor. Would be a interesting video. I been trying to edit a few shots but I am still struggling with RT here and there.
Not too sure that I understand your question. The contrast mask is present in the file all the time, making it visible just shows it, and un-depressing the button simply hides it - it doesn't turn it off. But when you say export it as a filter, what do you mean?
@@AndyAstbury i really am new when it comes to editing photos in rawtherapee but what i mean to say is the contrast mask for me really just looks like a black and white texture and therefore wanted to export the image WITH the black and white texture which is the contrast mask.
Photoshop (and I presume GIMP if you only want free software) will give you an edge mask. Invert the edge mask, blur it a little, and leave it as the only viewable channel, flatten and save the image - that will give you something akin to what you are after. Another Photoshop route would be Filter>Stylise>Find Edges followed by Image>Adjustments>Invert. Then add Gaussian Blur to taste.
Andy thx for the video. I am new to RawTherapee and tried to save the Profile. When I click the +folder icon at the top right of the save profile screen I named it ...RawTherapee profiles Basic.pp3. I then saved that. Switching to Preferences the Use bundled profiles was ticked which from reading your reply to a question below I see needs to be off. When I look to change the Basic profile from "Auto matched curve ISO low" it adds the name of the photo I had open to the Profile ie Basic ...ORF.I imagine it is when I try to save the profile that I am making the mistake but because you already had the profile in your list I couldn't see what steps I had to take.Should I have not had a photo open in the EditorTab or what have I done wrong?
You're new to RT - we've all been there for sure! Open your image in the editor and then switch the process profile to neutral. Process it to your liking, then click the SAVE profile button - the one that looks like a floppy disc. By default it will carry the name of the raw file + the raw file extension (ORF,NEF,CR2 etc) followed by .pp3 The next time you open that file in RT it will open with the 'last saved' .pp3 settings I have shown in a few videos this 'MyBase.pp3' that I have set as my default for raw files that have no last saved profile. This MyBase profile has all the settings I would apply to ANY raw file - Defringe, Chromatic Aberration correction, default color noise correction and color management output profile set to ProPhoto to match my Photoshop workflow. I initially opened just one image, set it to NEUTRAL, made the above adjustments then saved the profile as MyBase.pp3 Then in preferences I set MyBase.pps as the default profile for all raw files that have no 'last saved' settings. Hope that helps!
Cheers Frank 😀 Download the file, process as per the video in RT then save the processing .pp3 Then download the other .pp3 I sent to Members and apply. Then you can go through all the adjustment panels and compare the two - that'll keep you busy matey !!
@@AndyAstbury cheers... will do but not sure when for editing 👍 I've been keeping very busy in the back putting together a "summer house" for the misses - using up bits of wood and reclaimed upvc doors/window which is taking time - now we've been having this great weather - bonsais to see to as well. Only get the odd bit of time to watch UA-cam but no time at the mo for editing 😞 Maybe when the weather changes... i *need* to find my photography mojo again 😞👍🆘🆘😎
great video, very informative many thanks. Question on a seperate issue although it relates to noise. There two conflicting videos on youtube ( posted in the last week) when it comes to ISO and noise. One says ISO has no baring on noise and the other says it does with the caveat: when shooting in manual raising the ISO will make no difference as its applied after the image has been taken. When shooting in priority, there will be a difference. I've not heard this before. Assuming you have a decent sized sensor and all things are equal, which is it? Appreciate your technical thoughts.
Cheers Ted 🍻🍻
With regard to your ISO question - Mr Northrup is renowned for posting 'controversial click-bait' type videos that fuel a perpetual misunderstanding amongst those who want to learn !
The simple facts are these:
1. ISO/ASA/DIN USED to be part of the real exposure triangle back in the days of film, where the ISO/ASA/DIN number was a measure of the sensitivity of film to light Fast films had high numbers and their higher sensitivity to light was due to their emulsion containing LARGE silver halide grains - hence when processed and printed the images had a very large and highly visible grain structure - examples would be Kodak TriX and Ilford HP5. Conversely 'slow' films such as Ilford PanF or Kodak PanatomicX had very tiny silver halide crystals which made them slower to react to light but they produced a relatively grain-free image when printed.
Grain structure and its visibility impacted detail resolution.
2. While everyone knows sensors have replaced film, there's one thing that most folk fail to grasp - the camera sensor is of a FIXED ISO and is 100% non-variable - so your ISO control does not vary the sensitivity of your sensor. That fixed ISO is refereed to as base ISO.
3. A digital camera/sensor is an electronic device and like all electronics they generate noise when they have power running through them - we can call this the 'base noise floor'.
4. When we take a shot, light strikes the sensor and generates a signal, and in a good exposure (ETTR) where the brightest values of light are recorded just below the point of over exposure we have what called 'good SNR' or a near perfect signal to noise ratio (noise being the base floor noise I mentioned earlier).
5. When we have insufficient light we raise our ISO value BUT the camera still takes the shot at base - so we now have a reduced signal but the same level of base noise - we have a lower SNR.
6. The ISO control on your camera is NOT really ISO but a GAIN control, and it only does its job AFTER the shot has been taken - in other words after the SNR has been fixed. If your camera has a base sensitivity of 100ISO and you take a shot at 800ISO then the shot is really 3 stops under exposed. The gain control (ISO setting) then adds those 3 stops back in during the shots progress through the camera image processors - in other words AFTER the shot is taken but BEFORE it is written to the media card.
The upshot of all this Ted is that IF we have a shot with a low SNR then the gain control (ISO setting) lifts the level of BOTH signal and noise floor together - hence the levels of noise in the shot are amplified as well as the input signal level, so our shot looks noisy.
So it's not about ISO setting, shutter speed or aperture - it's all about SNR my friend!
If you watch my videos then you will see on my wildlife action shots that I shoot regularly in manual exposure and autoISO, and frequently my ISO values are in 4 digits - but they are relatively noise-free. That's because I still have good SNR because I'm shooting in good light. But if I shoot in crap light even at a lower ISO, I get a lot more noise - because the SNR is poor.
Priority mode makes no difference in theory, but in practise some camera metering systems tend to lean towards under exposure (bad SNR) than others, so you just have to learn how to compensate for that on any particular camera - usually with the Ev compensation settings.
Hope that helps Ted.
@@AndyAstbury Oh my, have to get my head around this. I didn't mention any names, but of course you are correct: Mr Northrup appears to make a number of claims which I have found startling at times. I'm relatively new to this youtube photography output, so am trying to learn who is worth viewing and who to ignore...
So, if I have understood you correctly, manual shooting in theory should give you better results regardless of ISO settings, even if shooting in low light levels, which is obviously when you would crank up the ISO...I use a canon 6d but I have never set the ISO more than 1200 for fear of noise.
@@AndyAstbury excellent explanation, thank you!
@@AndyAstbury Extraordinary reply, information and educational way to explain SNR Mr. Astbury!!!
@@AndyAstbury amazing answer!!! i read a lot of blog/webs about this topic.. and never found anyone talking with such "technicality" (of course.. u could be lying to me and I wouldnt know it haha). but i want to know more.. can u explain me the SNR concept? (or maybe u have a video about that) Regards!!
I love your tutorials - I watch you so often , then it seems like you are my .... family
thank you again !!!!!!
Wow, thank you!
Who doesn't like these long videos by Andy Astbury, dishing out incredibly useful, knowledgeable and considered advise and guidance?? I couldn't be happier when Andy digs in at length to yet another important topic! Thank you, Andy! :)
Cheers Mika 🍻🍻 You'll like my answer to muddyboots question I think!
I love the long videos ! UA-cam has a lot of people putting out short videos but I love delving deeper into some of this advanced capability like you have done in the last couple of raw therapee videos. Keep it up !
Awesome! Thank you!
Excellent, informative tutorial, Andy. It is, by far, the most important Raw Therapee tutorial I have viewed to date, and it is already making a massive difference in my raw image processing. Thank you!
Wow, thanks Noel 🍻😆
I have been watching quite a number of your Raw Therapee videos which are unfailingly detailed and helpful in getting one's head around this fairly tricky programme. Thankyou for all the time and effort you have devoted to teaching those of us who occasionally need to be led by the nose.
I became intrigued by an occasional reference to your base setting for all images which I considered to be something I needed to deal with before cracking on with everything else so I started hunting through your video material.
I incorrectly assumed it was something you had put up in an early Raw Therapee video so I watched all of those. Nope, couldn't find it there. It is only now that I have found the "mybase.pp3" chapter at the beginning of this video, with further clarification of the process given in answer to Peter Lee's question in the comments above.
Can I ask you, on behalf of anyone else new to RT, to make up a video on setting up a base pp3 titled something like
'Do this first before you start to get your head around Raw Therapee. It is the most basic thing of all.'
If you do this, you could help others to get going that much more efficiently.
Done Pete, thanks for the kind words and video topic 🍻🍻
still getting to grips with raw therapee but finding your videos a big help. I'm only a hobbyist and at the moment for most shots just use tiffs from Olympus workspace into gimp ;)
You mention the blue and yellow lines in when you're doing detail - noise reduction, chrominance curve - seems they are control points on a bezier curve. When you hover over the circle and just to one side, the cursor changes into a two headed dirctional arrow no the horizontal plane; moving this results in the normal rubber band movement of the bezier curve between the selected point and the one to the left or right of it.
don't worry about long videos - easy to jump forwards a bit if we need to ;) those that don't like it are missing out :)
Learned a lot..... well, you taught a lot, whether I learned remains to be seen. Btw those yellow and blue bars in the noise curve look like Bezier handles (for "bending" the curve).
I would always prefer a long video that explains something in a clear manner.
Well, you're in the right place for long videos - cheers 🍻
Great job as always, love those long detailed videos! Keep them coming!
Glad you like them 🍻
You are an excellent teacher. Thank you! Amazing photo!
Thank you! 😃
I do like and enjoy your long videos.
Revisiting this video today to set up my Raw Therapee and it's transition into PS properly. Since my last comment I've signed up for the Adobe subscription but will only be using Bridge and PS (no LR for me) with Raw Therapee. I dumped PhotoRaw because I wasn't happy with the results from it. It was just okay and RT has the control and results I've been looking for. I've since joined your Patreon club as well.
Thank you John
Excellent as always Andy, learnt a lot today and I'm sure I'll look into bringing some RAW images into RT just to give me the best starting point before further editing in Adobe PS. I used GIMP for several years and there is no way I'd go back. Photoshop is a lot easier to use. Don't get me wrong, it can pretty much do most things PS can do but in a more convoluted way which to me at least seemed less intuitive. Well explained and simple to follow, you are an excellent instructor Andy 👍
Cheers, I try 🍻🍻😆
This is very interesting, I love these long lessons of valuable content.
Are you sure that Lightroom doesn't choose between a number of demosaicing algorithms based on an automated validation of the raw content? Adobe must have realized the advantage of this too.
Must they??!! Lightroom/ACR uses the demosaic algorithm dictated by Adobe in the current process version Eigil - always has, and always will, unless they suddenly wake up and smell the roses! Most raw processor apps use a fixed demosaic, and like Lightroom, only switch if they are greeted with a non-Bayer sensor image. Iridient used to be unique in offering multiple demoz algos for Bayer sensor images. but RT/ART and maybe Darktable are the only ones that offer a wide choice (though can't say for definite with Darktable).
@@AndyAstbury Thanks for clarifying that, Andy ;O) As a beginner with RT I think I can see new and more well defined details in my S-A7R3 files during pixel peeping (though the ARWs have been converted to Adobe DNGs to save half the space on the HD, 86 vs. 43 Mb per file. This reduction without a visible loss in quality is another riddle to me). Would better defined details be due to the higher bit precision in RT's demosaicing? I hope I am not fantazising. I also think I can see a softer transition in general. I hardly dare increase the contrast.
I love long videos and rawtherapee :D
Yes noise grain adds texture to an image, I reduce it less than when I began.
Hello Andy!
Thanks a lot indeed for this new oustanding video: plenty of new things to learn as usual.
I have noticed you have brought up an example related to the software Capture ONE
What do you think about: RawThrerapee vs Capture One?
Is it worth the "upgrade" to Capture One OR do you think RawTherapee has all the tools for PRO color corrections?
I have read great reviews of Capture One but I always sticked with RawTherapee so far :-)
To handle my collections of pictures I run Digikam whereas RawTherapee is run for color corrections, sharpening, noise reduction stuff...
Hi Silvio - I've never been a big fan of CapOnePro, though I used to use it a lot at one time (still have my 2 disk set of v.4!). But with a photography package AdobeCC sub for £10 per month and free RT with pretty much seamless integration with Ps then I can't personally think of any base I haven't got covered. I know some folk find £10 a month 'unaffordable' but for me I'd be happy paying more than that just for Photoshop - hell, I did - for years!!!!!
CapOnePro won't do anything for you that RT can't (though I can't comment either way if you shoot XTrans), and Lr has the most easily usable DAM, soft-proof and print utilities out there - IMO of course!
Great video. I think the best take away really was towards the end of the video. A raw processor should be for raw processing there are other tools for everything else. If you use the right tool for each job you will get better results even if it makes the process longer.
As for Gimp I agree it is great until it is not. The biggest 2 niggles I have with Gimp is no adjustment layers (these really are necessary) and you can't save a layered Tiff (for me this is also necessary). With Gimp I would need to keep track of too many master files due to the lack of layered Tiff files especially if you start making tweaks with other software for "Creative Styling". Which means if you go back and make tweaks to your XCF you need to go and redo everything else you did afterwards.
So unless you are on Linux I would suggest if you don't want Photoshop take a look at Affinity Photo very powerful and cheap and it integrates well with RawTherapee. You can even use the RT Large profiles (Prophoto) without complaints.
Cheers Bill🍻🍻🍻 Many congrats too on watching it all too as the majority of viewers don't get more than 1/3rd through - the instant gratification brigade are everywhere 😱😨
If Affinity gave me the app I'd certainly give it a good going-over, but I'm not paying for something I don't need Bill so I can't comment either way...but if it's working for you that's a great thing.
@@AndyAstbury Long video for sure but good things come to the patient.
I have only messed with Affinity a little bit. I believe they have a 30 day trial and right now it is like $25 usd so I picked it up to see how it was. Seems to be pretty darn good in a general sense. Has just about anything you would ever need for photo editing if you are willing to do some things the long way.
For instance you need to manually create luminosity masks with temporary layers and desaturation unless you are satisfied with just blend if....
In some cases I found the Affinity InPaint brush to be better then Content Aware Fill but you can't change the sample area so it can be harder to fix when it does not work.
Photoshop is well worth $10/Month tbh even if you don't use Lightroom. But not everyone can afford that so it is good that their are other options available. So Photoshop is the way I am going to go Lumenzia is amazing....
Sorry for the long ramble good thing I don't make videos they would be like 3 hrs long.
Right tool for the job. A lot of photography software tries to do everything. Take Affinity Photo.... the RAW processing is horrible and I feel like it just there to check off a feature box. Now Affinity does some things that Photoshop can't do. To name a few: you can do curves in the LAB color space without converting the entire document to LAB, you can have snapshots of your history and save them with your document, the built in frequency separation plugin is a lot easier to use than trying to use the technique in PS, no needing to support legacy code allows Affinity to take advantage of modern technology (GPU acceleration).
As for Gimp, they are in the process of a massive port of some of their core code. Once the port is complete (has been going on for a few years now) they will be able to rapidly improve. One missing feature that will be introduced in a 3.x release is non destructive editing (i.e. adjustment layers). I do like some of the tools in Gimp better (at least the results). I feel like the healing brush tool they have does a cleaner job. They have the wavelet plugin which you can think of as frequency separation on steroids.
RT is more than just a RAW processor. It does incorporate other tools that make it more (i.e. lens corrections). I don't do much landscape photography. I tend to do more street these days, some fashion, and events. I need to be able to get a "look" and be able to export jpeg images in bulk (don't always have time to go into PS and edit away). I feel that is where having additional tools in RT really helps. I make use of the camera profiles (I switch between the RT generated profiles and I borrow Adobe's from the DNG converter tool). I also make use of HaldCLUT profiles to get different color pallets. I created a starting point profile based on one of Andy's videos and modify as needed saving new versions.
If you want to checkout a bare bones raw processor checkout RawPhotoProcessor (RPP). I won't go much into detail but that is one of my favorite RAW processors. It does not do any lens corrections or noise reduction. All it does is de mosaic, contrast, exposure, white balance, color profiling, and some sharpening if you like. For anything else it tells you to use something else like PS or even LR.
Another PS alternative worth mentioning is PhotoLine. It has been around as long as PS but it much quicker and has some interesting features. I still say end of the day PS secret weapon is the vast amount of quality training material. Other apps suffer from a lack of learning material. At least Andy is creating some great RT tutorials (best I see to date).
Andy are you using camera profiles at all? Doesn't every sensor-lens combination render images slightly differently? Wouldn't it make sense to employ profiles (even custom ones created with the aid of color targets) to get 'truer' colors?
Here's the thing about custom camera profiles Dennis - yes, every lens renders a scene differently in terms of colour and contrast. But it's much deeper than that. A custom lens profile is only 100% accurate under the exact light conditions it was produced under. And if you are profiling a zoom lens then the profile is only good for the focal length you used too, because spectral absorption and distribution can change as the different elements move in relation to each other. Custom lens profiling is a can of worms created solely to capture the wallet content of the unwary digital photographer who for the most part shoots under ambient light.
Ambient light is a moving feast, so simply chucking a colour checker in the shot will do the job.
However, if I still had my studio and I was still doing a lot of commercial copy work then I would create a profile - simply because I had a specialist rail camera which always had the same lens mounted on it and the lights never moved or changed in intensity - the whole lot was fixed.
So, horses for course and all that Dennis, but creating custom profiles for use on shots under ambient light really is an object lesson in futility - IMO of course, and far be it from me to convince anyone otherwise. All I feel it is my duty to do is to inform folk of the real facts and details, then let them decide for themselves.
In Raw Therapee 5.9 I can save a personal profile, but the profile is not present in the list of 'image processing'. So I can not choose it. ??
I think one can use also built in rawtherapee output profile rvt4-large that should be equivalent of prophoto?
Theoretically RTv4_Large equals ProPhoto, but it's a profile that is NOT recognised by Photoshop, Cap One Pro or anything else software-wise other than Raw Therapee.
Fascinating! I was going to ask if RT was a good all in one solution but you covered that. I may have to bite the bullet and get a PS subscription.
Cheers John 🍻🍻
Also what about (profiled) lens corrections (vignetting, distortion)?
You'll notice even in my Lr videos Dennis that hardly ever use any 'lens profile'. It irritates the hell out of me when I see so many demos on YT where they tick and apply an Adobe lens profile and then NEVER check its effect - some of them are complete crap and can result in all sorts of 'pixel stretching' artefacts. These artefacts only show up in folks images when they spend a small fortune on a 30"/40" print.
If I'm assembling a pano then I'll manually correct each element if I need to, but slavishly adding a lens correction profile "on auto pilot" so to speak just ain't my bag!
Adobe could very well write Lr code to automatically apply a correction profile to every image without any input from you, but they don't - they leave the decision to the photographer.
Don't let me talk anyone out of using them, but seeing as you asked you now have my answer - I don't use them very much at all. Remember, I come from a film/print darkroom background and we never had them then!
Question; In RawTherapee 5.8 the Demosaicing/RAW-tab seems only to be adjustable/available in 'File-Browser' mode, in 'Editor'-mode the tab is empty and greyed out, would you know if there'll be an update on that? Or should one adjust these settings before actually opening any image from the file-browser area? (Mac OSX)
Dear Andy can you show me how to load Prophoto Output into Raw Therapy. I've downloaded the profile as per your link. Not sure how to load into the Output Profile. Working off a mac
Watch this older video on my channel ua-cam.com/video/310rCQZe0NI/v-deo.htmlsi=aJlvE7ySLRsg2m6f Rob
......THANKs from Bavaria! ...can you recommend a set of - kind of standard Presets/Profiles - for a little sharpening, noice reduction, color improvement? Is there a download page? ...i am not a PRO on RawTherapee , but i want to improof our Family Pictures a little! I would need Improvement for to dark or to bright pictures and for normal pictures. Please Help, cause you are a PRO on this matter ;-)
Cheers!
Presets - for Raw Therapee it's so easy to make your own, and no one make any for you to download as far as I know.
Processing images in any software is simply a matter of making the image look how you want it - and to do that you use your own eyes!
If you want me to do a video to help out with your own images then just send me a few raw files and I'll see what I can come up with.
I was following closely when you applied Impulse Noise Reduction and was a little confused when the worst offending pepper pixel failed to disappear. And then I wiped my screen. D'oh
Been there!!!
Andy , its a pity that "time saving preset doesn''t work" Every time I open RT 5.8 it opens with the default profile "Auto matched curve ISO low" as per the RT manual.I keep changing it in preferences to My base PP3 and saving it as Default processing profile but every time I go back in it has defaulted to "last saved" , not even "auto matched curve ISO low " which still appears in preferences
Hi Peter - it does.
But, go into your Pref>Image Processing and is 'use bundled profiles' checked? If so untick it. There is also a profile fill button to the left of where it says Last Saved - if that is pushed in (dark with 4 light bars) then click it to make it go light grey with light bar top and bottom and the middle two greyed out.
It will always say Last Saved (why I don't know) but if you have MyBase set as default, go into the tabs in the dev module to check the actual values are correct. Personally I think it's a bug or oversight in RT - but I just ignore it because it does actually work.
I don't have all the options you show under RAW. For example I can't find 'capture sharpening' anywhere... Is that becaus of my camera en the RAW files it provides me? I shoot with a Sony A6000.
You need the latest version v5.8 and capture sharpening is at the bottom of the raw tab.
Being that I am transitioning to strictly macro photography I wonder what kind of details we can pull out of a image using RT and a raster editor.
Would be a interesting video. I been trying to edit a few shots but I am still struggling with RT here and there.
I'll do a video featuring a close macro of a perched Brown Hawker dragonfly if you like Bill.
@@AndyAstbury That would be awesome thanks.
I don't find the folder MyBase. where can I find/ create it. please help!
Watch this ua-cam.com/video/310rCQZe0NI/v-deo.html
but how do i export a raw file with the sharpening contrast mask as a filter? just asking cause i really love the look!
Not too sure that I understand your question. The contrast mask is present in the file all the time, making it visible just shows it, and un-depressing the button simply hides it - it doesn't turn it off. But when you say export it as a filter, what do you mean?
@@AndyAstbury i really am new when it comes to editing photos in rawtherapee but what i mean to say is the contrast mask for me really just looks like a black and white texture and therefore wanted to export the image WITH the black and white texture which is the contrast mask.
Photoshop (and I presume GIMP if you only want free software) will give you an edge mask. Invert the edge mask, blur it a little, and leave it as the only viewable channel, flatten and save the image - that will give you something akin to what you are after.
Another Photoshop route would be Filter>Stylise>Find Edges followed by Image>Adjustments>Invert. Then add Gaussian Blur to taste.
@@AndyAstbury the result was a little wonky but thank you for the suggestion!
Andy thx for the video. I am new to RawTherapee and tried to save the Profile. When I click the +folder icon at the top right of the save profile screen I named it ...RawTherapee profiles Basic.pp3. I then saved that. Switching to Preferences the Use bundled profiles was ticked which from reading your reply to a question below I see needs to be off.
When I look to change the Basic profile from "Auto matched curve ISO low" it adds the name of the photo I had open to the Profile ie Basic ...ORF.I imagine it is when I try to save the profile that I am making the mistake but because you already had the profile in your list I couldn't see what steps I had to take.Should I have not had a photo open in the EditorTab or what have I done wrong?
You're new to RT - we've all been there for sure!
Open your image in the editor and then switch the process profile to neutral.
Process it to your liking, then click the SAVE profile button - the one that looks like a floppy disc.
By default it will carry the name of the raw file + the raw file extension (ORF,NEF,CR2 etc) followed by .pp3
The next time you open that file in RT it will open with the 'last saved' .pp3 settings
I have shown in a few videos this 'MyBase.pp3' that I have set as my default for raw files that have no last saved profile. This MyBase profile has all the settings I would apply to ANY raw file - Defringe, Chromatic Aberration correction, default color noise correction and color management output profile set to ProPhoto to match my Photoshop workflow. I initially opened just one image, set it to NEUTRAL, made the above adjustments then saved the profile as MyBase.pp3
Then in preferences I set MyBase.pps as the default profile for all raw files that have no 'last saved' settings.
Hope that helps!
@@AndyAstbury Thx Andy Will try.
Yep!... "superb"... Cheers "Prof" ;)
Cheers Frank 😀 Download the file, process as per the video in RT then save the processing .pp3 Then download the other .pp3 I sent to Members and apply. Then you can go through all the adjustment panels and compare the two - that'll keep you busy matey !!
@@AndyAstbury cheers... will do but not sure when for editing 👍 I've been keeping very busy in the back putting together a "summer house" for the misses - using up bits of wood and reclaimed upvc doors/window which is taking time - now we've been having this great weather - bonsais to see to as well. Only get the odd bit of time to watch UA-cam but no time at the mo for editing 😞 Maybe when the weather changes... i *need* to find my photography mojo again 😞👍🆘🆘😎
Ignore people that want short vids.
Will do, cheers Mars 🍻🍻👍
?! we love long videos!
😂🍻👍
Why use Rawtherapee at all if you have Photoshop/Lightroom?
Because RawTherappe is a better raw processor than Lightroom/ACR!
i would like to know how to shut down raw therapee
Can we do this magic in photoshop?
Simple answer is NO! Only in Raw Therapee!
I've gone through the video 5 times and the options never save.
Andy's reply to Peter Lee might help.
I love long videos and rawtherapee :D