295. The astonishing garbage thrown into England's canals

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  • Опубліковано 31 гру 2024

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  • @urbsimp5273
    @urbsimp5273 Рік тому +99

    The sheer amount of rubbish is just appalling. I hate to imagine what it would look like without the effort of those awesome volunteers and organisations. Great video mate.

    • @v1rotait23
      @v1rotait23 Рік тому +6

      I thought that too, especially in just 10 miles of canal! - Imagine the other 2000 miles of canal!

    • @gardenman3
      @gardenman3 Рік тому +8

      If they ever catch anybody dumping stuff they should be made to eat it.

    • @genespell4340
      @genespell4340 Рік тому +2

      ​@@gardenman3 make them wear it by chaining it to their bodies for everybody to see a litterbug and them think twice before they decide to become a litterbug too.

    • @itstayayg193
      @itstayayg193 Рік тому +5

      Companies need to stop producing millions of plastic products every day. Consumers should look at fixing their items as opposed to buying brand new every single time. Too much micro plastics and chemicals poisoning our waters and soil.

    • @reeddeer793
      @reeddeer793 11 місяців тому +2

      @@itstayayg193”consumers should look at fixing items” - companies actively try to prevent this, and will never stop preventing it unless forced by law

  • @annkauffold7049
    @annkauffold7049 Рік тому +7

    Unbelievable! I will likely never cruise the canals but do so enjoy several of the vlogs. Thanks to all who work to keep the canals safe and clean.

  • @Bicyclehub
    @Bicyclehub Рік тому +9

    Hats off to IWA for doing this horrible job. I lived on my boat in Milton Keynes for 3 years and it was a really good place with pleasant moorings all the way. I enjoyed seeing all the Wyvern Shipping boats coming through and it is great that the owner gives his time to keep the canal free of rubbish.

    • @Glostahdude
      @Glostahdude Рік тому

      As everyone should. Everyone who uses it. Even those who just walk it for the views. It’s a community! Everyone should be about helping one way or the other! Everyone gets enjoyment out of it!

  • @floatybyboaty
    @floatybyboaty Рік тому +6

    The amount of rubbish on that small stretch was astonishing.
    Well done to all those volunteers.

  • @shirleylynch7529
    @shirleylynch7529 Рік тому +12

    Unbelievable the rubbish people throw in the canals. Some have no respect for the environment. Those volunteers are do amazing work. Well done them.

    • @CJMVector321190
      @CJMVector321190 Рік тому

      Same near me you clear the verges and within hours all back again. Hate to say it but it is the city folk in their new builds. Throwing stuff out of their cars.

  • @ironmike2732
    @ironmike2732 Рік тому +6

    I have not watched one of your videos in a while (a year), and I realize that not having watched one of your videos in so long, how great your narration is. Well done and well enjoyed!

  • @rkgaustin
    @rkgaustin Рік тому +4

    Thank you to everyone who assists in this effort!

  • @ofagerli
    @ofagerli Рік тому +4

    10 miles, 16 kilometers. And so much garbage! It's just shameful to know that there is so many people that act so neglectful and careless! But a huge thumbs-up for the cleaning crew! Good job well done!

  • @davidoickle1778
    @davidoickle1778 Рік тому +25

    "A nitrous oxide container . . . No laughing matter!" I laughed out loud on that one.

  • @adamshaw1032
    @adamshaw1032 Рік тому +13

    What a fantastic bunch of people!! I take my hats off to them. Keep up the good work 👍🏻

  • @NeverlandSystemAngel
    @NeverlandSystemAngel Рік тому +4

    Love this cleanup work, and love that it's such a volunteer effort.
    I HATE that people throw trash in there like that... but I LOVE that people give time, effort, and work to clean this up. Good for all of them! What an inspiration and show of love for their communities.

  • @Stringtrees
    @Stringtrees Рік тому +5

    I am always dismayed at those who think it is ok to dump their rubbish wherever they feel like it. Brilliant work by the good folks clearing up.

  • @greenspiritarts
    @greenspiritarts Рік тому +4

    What a trashy vlog that was!!! Over 20 years ago, my home state here in the US began a spring-time tradition called “Green Up Vermont” The entire state would come out and clean up the roadsides of trash. Getting it early before the plant life would be obscuring the bottles and cans meant we were all out around this time of year. It has become a great tradition with contests, assemblage art competitions, picnics and pot lucks at the end of the long week-end. Gives one a great sense of community spirit. Lovely to see a similar tradition on the canals. Great video!!!!

  • @nothereorthereoranywhere
    @nothereorthereoranywhere Рік тому +4

    Nice to see everyone "chipping" in to help clean up the waterways. Supporting the community and just making it better. Plus, getting out in good weather is good too.

  • @johnfoote1168
    @johnfoote1168 Рік тому +5

    Thank you all to the workers, i think the canal system is a beautiful part of England's natural environment and should always be protected. I would love to visit there in your summer, please continue the work you are doing

  • @oceana9294
    @oceana9294 Рік тому +7

    Thanks for showing us that there are people who do care enough to clean up what they can.

  • @NewHampshireJack
    @NewHampshireJack Рік тому +6

    I truly admire these good folks for their efforts. Before I sold my hobby farm in northern New England USA, my land was in a program called Current Use. I also accepted the 10% additional recreation adjustment to my tax bill because I allowed sportsmen access to the land. NEVER did we have a problem with these folks leaving behind any refuse. Twice a year I did a roadside walk in the front of my property to clean the ditches at the roadside. That is where I harvested many cans and bottles from passing motorists. My reward beyond a clean roadside was some of the cans and bottles had a deposit refund on them. My state did not do that but several neighboring states did. Whenever I had reason to travel to a state that offered the refund, I cashed in my hoard for the 5 and 10-cent deposits.

  • @benkendall7489
    @benkendall7489 Рік тому +14

    This felt like watching TV (and I mean that as a compliment), fantastic quality production!

    • @CruisingTheCut
      @CruisingTheCut  Рік тому +3

      Thank you so much! 😊

    • @broadsword6650
      @broadsword6650 Рік тому +2

      It's the kind of quality, informative and entertaining TV that few TV companies can be bothered to make any more.

  • @Paggerd
    @Paggerd Рік тому +4

    Something deeply satisfying watching a clean up 😊

  • @andrewstrathdee1469
    @andrewstrathdee1469 Рік тому +2

    Thanks! As a regular Litterpicker, I know how much work this is, so thanks for highlighting an important volunteer contribution!

  • @jamesellsworth9673
    @jamesellsworth9673 Рік тому +8

    THANK YOU for raising our awareness of this issue.

  • @michaelhiggins7365
    @michaelhiggins7365 Рік тому +1

    Kudos to all those volunteers who at great sacrifice, pick up the trash others so flippantly leave behind. Both a sad and a sweet commentary of today's society. It's too bad that our world is full of people who simply lack the moral judgement not to litter. Another awesome video David and well appreciated.

  • @keykeypr8292
    @keykeypr8292 Рік тому +3

    Kudos to those volunteers. Thanks for showcasing them and their work. The perverse love of many people for waste and breakage should never be underestimated. I have to remember to balance that pessimism with the (also true) fact that there are many lovely, generous people who enjoy making the world around them a better place.

  • @sujitsam
    @sujitsam Рік тому +3

    Thanks!

  • @nathanberry4339
    @nathanberry4339 Рік тому +3

    The people volunteers and paid staff doing these clean ups are definitely among some of the most important unsung heroes of the canal network keeping it going , i have a real disgust for people using the canal as a rubbish dump it shows absolutely no respect for our historic canals , our nature and it shows no respect to the people who live on the canals

  • @LongPeter
    @LongPeter Рік тому +60

    Don't suppose they found your camera?

    • @CruisingTheCut
      @CruisingTheCut  Рік тому +8

      Wrong canal!

    • @LongPeter
      @LongPeter Рік тому +8

      @@CruisingTheCut I know, but I couldn't help myself 🙃

    • @chrislaarman7532
      @chrislaarman7532 Рік тому

      @@CruisingTheCut You didn't lose it on Vandemonium, did you? ;-)

  • @Simon_Nonymous
    @Simon_Nonymous Рік тому +5

    Bless those volunteers, they are the finest people out there. But looking at the hopper - "you're gonna need a bigger boat"! Well done the catering boat too :-)

  • @sallydimmock7813
    @sallydimmock7813 Рік тому +4

    My husband works for James as a carpenter.was good seeing Stuart and Shaun .a good job done all of you

  • @PocketTalk916
    @PocketTalk916 Рік тому +3

    Always great videos David ... how rude and disrespectful people are in dumping their rubbish for others to clean up. Love all the volunteers too!

  • @craigw.scribner6490
    @craigw.scribner6490 Рік тому +7

    A "Star Wars" and a "Star Trek" reference in the same video--impressive, David! (Another great video, too--thanks again for all you do!)

  • @ShipHappensUK
    @ShipHappensUK Рік тому +5

    What a load of rubbish! But great episode David 👏

  • @andreamundt
    @andreamundt Рік тому +2

    "The tea boat!" My ears perked up immediately. *Love* the sound of that! ☺ Thx for the video!

  • @graememckay9972
    @graememckay9972 Рік тому +6

    I'm guessing people think canals are the same as railway boundary fences. Both some how lead to a magical recycling plant where anything thrown in or over is miraculously turned into pretty rainbows.
    I'm a train driver and the volume of rubbish along the track side is deeply depressing. Everything from sweet wrappers to wide screen TVs and climbing frames. There's even an old caravan with a child's slide hanging out the window.

  • @everyoneknowsadave3580
    @everyoneknowsadave3580 Рік тому +3

    Well done IWA.... Your voluntary work to clean up the canal is just awesome..... it beggar's belief how some people treat the countryside as their own personal dumping ground 😥... but thank you Dave for bringing the sterling work of these and many other groups trying to keep the countryside clean for everyone to enjoy....

  • @myhillslife27
    @myhillslife27 Рік тому +5

    where would we be without volunteers! I have been for many a day for many things. It's very rewarding!

  • @frankquevedo3453
    @frankquevedo3453 Рік тому +1

    You and the other volunteers FIVE GOLD STARS! FOR THE OUTSTANDING JOB ACCOMPLISHED!

  • @rud
    @rud Рік тому +19

    I have heard a story about some bloke who just tossed his perfectly good video camera in the canal. Madness. 😂

  • @andrewdolinskiatcarpathian
    @andrewdolinskiatcarpathian Рік тому +2

    Hats off to all the volunteers involved. 👏👏👍😀

  • @steveweave2797
    @steveweave2797 Рік тому +5

    In the USA, Tennessee is known as the Volunteer state... well, in Britain - the folks along that stretch of canal should be known as the Vols too!! Job well done! Cheers from Tennessee, USA

  • @jfk64kennedy95
    @jfk64kennedy95 Рік тому +4

    I live on Aquidneck Island, in Narragansett Bay, Rhode Island, USA. It an island of 3 communities connected to mainland by 3 bridges. Every yr, the grass roots organizations, boaters, community groups, individual people come out in spring and do a shore line clean up of the entire Estuary system, beaches...We've even banned single use plastic bags and straws....

  • @xIDarkSideIx
    @xIDarkSideIx Рік тому +3

    The amount of tat you will find in the canal systems is unbelievable, it's the exact same on my local stretch of the Lancaster in Preston bikes, cars, mopeds, guns you name it has been pulled out over the years

  • @555promonkey
    @555promonkey Рік тому +4

    Thank you David for a very informative, interesting vblog 😊
    sadly it is disgusting how many people use the canal for dumping their rubbish 😡
    Well done to all involved in the clean up 👍

  • @kentcostello5286
    @kentcostello5286 Рік тому +4

    That's awesome to see people caring on the waterways.

  • @rightsideupvt
    @rightsideupvt Рік тому +4

    Makes me chuckle a little every time you've said 'Grand Union Canal.' We had a grocery chain here called Grand Union. And it was pretty trashy at the end of it's run.

  • @David-bs6fq
    @David-bs6fq Рік тому +4

    Great work guys and girls. Respect!!

  • @ynys_mon6928
    @ynys_mon6928 Рік тому +2

    Brilliant, as a resident of Milton Keynes, living in an area adjoining the Grand Union, it so good to hear of the efforts that are being made to keep our canal crud free. I’m planning on retiring soon, so appreciate the links to the organisations involved.

  • @iamlalapalooza
    @iamlalapalooza Рік тому +5

    well, this was fantastic! thanks so much, this gave a real sense of just regular folks in community! :D

  • @gabrieletewinkel584
    @gabrieletewinkel584 Рік тому +2

    Brilliant Commentary. A project well worth the attention and support!

  • @mueckenhoeffer
    @mueckenhoeffer Рік тому +5

    Holy Carp! I saw a few volunteers under 60! There's hope for the future.

  • @christophernorton33
    @christophernorton33 Рік тому +1

    where would we be without these amazing Volunteers?: Up to our armpits in you know what . Bravo to all for there monumentel efforts to keep Briton tidy .Exalent video David 👍🐸

  • @vadmal5210
    @vadmal5210 Рік тому +5

    It seems that there is no end of usefull ideas for a good vlogger ... thanks!

  • @Mal_S
    @Mal_S Рік тому +1

    I do miss the cruising videos, but do love these "behind the scenes" type videos. It opens up a world that you don't even think about.

  • @therealzilch
    @therealzilch Рік тому +3

    I'm afraid, at 73 years of age, no garbage that people throw anywhere astonishes me.
    Nice work as usual. Cheers from largely but not completely canal-free Vienna, Scott

  • @sparkybluefox
    @sparkybluefox 10 місяців тому +1

    I am in Love with "Cruising The Cut" video's. David's videos keep me "grounded" with joy.
    sbf

  • @tonyllinx
    @tonyllinx Рік тому +3

    This is the area I live in. Never even knew about this event. What a great thing they do. That is something I would like to help with. Thank you for videoing this. Very interesting and informative.

  • @silasmarner7586
    @silasmarner7586 Рік тому +1

    You all have done yeoman's work. Thank you for what you've done. I worked litter patrol in the summer of 1982 and haven't tossed out so much as a gum wrapper in my life.

  • @phantomtrijder6493
    @phantomtrijder6493 Рік тому +6

    What an amazing video! Thank you so much. Showing both sides of what we humans are; careless selfish entiled types and caring considerate types. How can we swing the balance in favor of the latter?

  • @MrHendrikus1977
    @MrHendrikus1977 Рік тому +1

    Nice to see this team at work, you volunteers make all the difference - and ofcourse the sponsors, great work people!

  • @crazzykanadian2685
    @crazzykanadian2685 Рік тому +4

    Everyday heroes in true form thanks for the video showing their hard work

  • @simon4525
    @simon4525 Рік тому +1

    Quite unbelievable David, it disgusts me how people behave, thank you for highlighting this, and for the fantastic efforts by the volunteers.

  • @kplante7881
    @kplante7881 Рік тому +3

    Great video and kudos to the crew and the service they provided. The little tug looked pretty cool indeed.
    Thanks for sharing!

  • @sidneybowerman558
    @sidneybowerman558 Рік тому +2

    Well that was a real load of rubbish David. Well done, another great video. Takes a really special person to make a successful video about rubbish retrieval. You nailed it my friend.

  • @chulagalappaththi
    @chulagalappaththi Рік тому +2

    Very interesting video! Selfish people are everywhere. These great people set an example to the world .congratulations !

  • @joeshepley151
    @joeshepley151 Рік тому +2

    Nice to see so many volunteers working to make the canal cleaner..

  • @japrods1
    @japrods1 Рік тому +3

    Great work by those folks. Well done. Nice coverage too. C&Lx

  • @gregbolitho9775
    @gregbolitho9775 Рік тому

    Nice 1 David, people have been taught to think,, I can dump it here and some other person'll collect it. Kids are not taught to pick up after themselves anymore the way I was. Parenting is different these days. This Dianne lady did a rippa job keeping everybody fed an watered. Ladies like that are some of the unsung heroes. You did well. Thanks m8!

    • @CruisingTheCut
      @CruisingTheCut  Рік тому

      She and her hubby really did make sure we were fed and watered! It was a fun day. Cheers Greg! 😀

  • @linuxtuxvolds5917
    @linuxtuxvolds5917 Рік тому +4

    What nice and wonderful lovely people!!

  • @BohemianBeatster
    @BohemianBeatster Рік тому +2

    Brilliant work, brilliant people, big hearts, so fantastic and groovy. well done, well done indeed.

  • @cp4512
    @cp4512 Рік тому +3

    Great job by all the volunteers 👍

  • @credenza1
    @credenza1 Рік тому +3

    Well done all concerned. Another great video.

  • @presspound7358
    @presspound7358 Рік тому

    Nice to hear from you David. Volunteers really are a national treasure. And let’s face it … the canals need a good going over on a regular basis. Would be nice to see an awareness campaign on the need to protect these waterways by way of commercial messages and signage every so often along the way.
    All the best!
    Canada’s Eastern Seaboard 🇨🇦

  • @raymondmiller5098
    @raymondmiller5098 Рік тому +5

    Interesting video, David! (Of course, as an American I was slightly amazed that the crew didn't come across a single corpse. :] )

  • @trixierosco
    @trixierosco Рік тому +2

    Who doesn’t enjoy a chat about hedgehogs? Another great video David. Wonderful to hear from the diverse stakeholders in that small section of canal!

  • @aderfigueroa
    @aderfigueroa Рік тому +3

    Thanks good job.. greetings from Texas

  • @campingstoveman
    @campingstoveman Рік тому +2

    Nice to see my Brother doing his bit for the cause.

  • @GreyMannShed
    @GreyMannShed Рік тому +3

    The panning shot along the hopper showing the dumped items was like a dystopian generation game 😂😂

  • @frederickmoller
    @frederickmoller Рік тому +1

    Pigs everywhere in the World! It's a huge problem it my small city in northern Ontario Canada also, and volunteers do spring clean-ups every spring after the winter snow melts. I really commend the Canal Trust and the awesome Volunteers for trying to keep the waterways safe and prestine! Thanks.

  • @RDFContent
    @RDFContent Рік тому +3

    Great work everyone, why some people want to live in a dump and throw rubbish I will never understand.

  • @roflcopterpilot
    @roflcopterpilot Рік тому +2

    Never been on a canal, but I love these videos. Relaxing and informative. Thank you :)

  • @jimbo4375
    @jimbo4375 Рік тому +4

    Good job! Theres perhaps a small amount of value to be recalimed from scrap metal by the bikes and things like the BBQ, the trollies, scooter and definitely its motor. Only a few quid bit still. The state of littering by the roadsides also seems to have got steadily worse over the last few years.

  • @jaimehudson7623
    @jaimehudson7623 Рік тому +2

    Enjoy the way he pronounces 'detritus'. My dad's ancestors were from England & Wales, so I love videos like this!

  • @hughs591
    @hughs591 Рік тому +6

    I think that's one of the most interesting and best produced films you've made. The number and variety of shots led me to wonder whether any (aside from the interviews) were set up but I suspect you just grabbed them all on the fly. It must have been a very, very, busy day's filming. Add to that a witty script, but not a laughing matter, and the whole thing made for great viewing !

  • @wallyclark1895
    @wallyclark1895 Рік тому +1

    It was an amazing video showing how much junk there was in the canal! A great video!

  • @chrislaarman7532
    @chrislaarman7532 Рік тому +6

    1) Thank you for sharing this great video on a great project! :-)
    2) I would suggest (to the people of this and similar projects) that separate barges be used: one for the organic stuff (branches etc.) and one for the rest, if possible with a smaller compartment for harmful (like toxic) waste (including refrigerators) and a larger compartment for the rest (like bicycles).
    This way, the organic stuff could be mulched or so, then recycled into nature or gardens, the harmful stuff could be "disharmed", and the rest (including the "disharmed" stuff) could be disposed of in "proper" ways.
    For comparison, maybe even inspiration:
    3) I live in Amsterdam, the Netherlands. The canals here have been considered waste deposits for centuries, and both dredging and skimming have been part of city life for quite a while. Countless bicycles, sometimes fire arms or grenades.
    Some ten years ago, "plastic fishing" (should I say "fishing plastic" in English?) became a project. Would you believe it: people are (apparently) willing to pay to participate (equipped with grabbers and nets on sticks), and it's promoted as a "team building" event for businesses! Last time I checked, "plastic fishing" in Rotterdam cost as much per boat (sloop) as in Amsterdam per person... (Update: see below.)
    I have twice participated in "plastic fishing" as a member of political teams. I must confess that (the weather permitting) it's a great way of viewing (a small part of) the city, and "plastic fishing" does awake one's hunting instincts. (Plastic tends to drift a bit below the surface. As narrowboaters are likely to know.) I remember at least one of my occasions to coincide with beach cleaning on the North Sea coast.
    As I remember it, the Plastic Whale Foundation, plasticwhale.com/plastic-fishing/, started it, but there may well be others.
    PS: Before you ask: all house boats in Amsterdam are on the sewage system. ;-)

    • @terenceseymour-tf8rptassie725
      @terenceseymour-tf8rptassie725 Рік тому

      difficulty of having additional barges perhaps could be that the canal is open an d extra barges might cause traffic congestion .

    • @A_nony_mous
      @A_nony_mous Рік тому

      The video states only one barge was available this year.

  • @daphniastley8641
    @daphniastley8641 Рік тому

    Thanks everyone.
    We are just boating through that stretch & really appreciating how lovely and clean it is - thanks to all your efforts.
    Well done 👏

  • @wallacegrommet9343
    @wallacegrommet9343 Рік тому +5

    A chipper shredder mounted on a hopper barge would greatly reduce the plant matter to a manageable pile. Junk goes in the other barge.

  • @chrisrand5185
    @chrisrand5185 Рік тому +1

    Great work by the volunteers. Great to see James Griffin on Ocean Princess. I first met James when he was in short trousers (as was I), in 1967 when we hired Bridget, a converted 'Severner' working narrowboat. That was the same year that Milton Keynes was officially announced as the site for a new town. It was then a series of small villages with Bletchley at its southern end and industrial Wolverton at its northern end.

  • @LongPeter
    @LongPeter Рік тому +7

    11:14 you matched the vector on that top-down drone shot pretty bloody well!

    • @CruisingTheCut
      @CruisingTheCut  Рік тому +1

      Thanks. However … I confess, I didn’t. Weirdly, the metal of the boat affected the drone’s positioning and - I swear I’m not making this up - it followed the boat without me touching the controls. I was so pleased! 🤣

    • @LongPeter
      @LongPeter Рік тому

      @@CruisingTheCut if it uses cameras for positioning and collision avoidance, it might have decided that the slow-moving boat was a stationary point of reference. Probably slow enough to be within its GPS margin of error. Or you just got really lucky :p

  • @stephenpegum9776
    @stephenpegum9776 Рік тому +2

    Another fascinating video David - some sterling work by all the clean-up crew.

  • @michaelcase8574
    @michaelcase8574 Рік тому +3

    A great event! Maybe you could add some magnets to troll along the bottom. Magnet fishing is very popular and very effective.
    Cheers!

  • @tomayrscotland6890
    @tomayrscotland6890 Рік тому +1

    well done folks nice to see the folk all helping and mucking in...Tom Ayr Scotland.

  • @plunder1956
    @plunder1956 Рік тому +3

    One of the most interesting jobs I have seen done around the Fleet stretch of the Basingstoke canal was the construction of two coffer dams and pumping out between them, to expose the canal bed under two bridges and carry out repairs. I was trained in civil engineering, yet I had never seen it done before.
    It is sad to see how many reasonably usable bicycles get dumped in the canal, possibly because they were nicked. Some could fixed and used again.

  • @roberthennel
    @roberthennel Рік тому +1

    Interesting video, thanks for showing us the "back office" of canal and narrowboating, I have been enjoying them just as much as the cruising ones. Btw, as an HSE guy, I highly appreciate the very responsible health and safety approach at work, very British indeed!

  • @GW-yz8fo
    @GW-yz8fo Рік тому +4

    As important as any episode. Thanks.

  • @freddypflugbeil6
    @freddypflugbeil6 Рік тому +2

    That's great. Wishing I was there to help. Thanks for the show From Highland falls New York

  • @walterfechter8080
    @walterfechter8080 Рік тому +3

    I can only offer a guess that metal garbage in the canals wasn't a problem during The Second World War. I remember my grandmother telling me about refuse metal and rubber collections during the war. Very good work on the part of the canal crews and residents. 👍

  • @alycespoto2099
    @alycespoto2099 Рік тому +1

    Bravo to all who helped. We live on the Mississippi River and have similar clean ups.

  • @geoffwoodgate7450
    @geoffwoodgate7450 Рік тому +10

    That solar panel will still be usable. Metal is always recyclable so it should be separated out.

  • @Temptation666
    @Temptation666 Рік тому +2

    16:22 Thank you Diane for taking so good care of the boy

  • @7892rl
    @7892rl Рік тому +6

    Humans at their WORST. Humans at their BEST. That canal system is a marvel and NOT a garbage dump !