I think Roxie’s gym has a lot of charm. She really doesn’t have much of a puzzle, but at least the gym has personality to it that none of the other gyms have.
Yeah, I was thinking the same. Her gym is very memorable and the cute lyrics you hear inside. I think they could’ve added a small puzzle, but might’ve actually taken away from the bar/club vibes it has.
@@Oscarsome Exactly. I love that it's this small, dingy bar. Maybe there could've been a maze to navigate through tables and such. Perhaps you would have to find the band members in the back rooms so they would join Roxie on stage, and only then would she battle you? It could've been funny if there was a rhythm game component and you had to help her with a show before she fought you.
My only real issue with it is that it’s one of several gyms that are functionally walking straight to the gym leader after a couple fights, Cheren, Roxie, Elesa, even Drayden
@@Venandi_ That’s a fair point. All of those gyms devolve into hallways to the gym leaders. At the very least some of them have enough personality and theme to make the walk interesting
I find Unova's 1st gym to be interesting and great for newer players. Usually, type effectiveness is just brought up by a npc. Having it be the theme of a gym is a cool idea.
I would agree but playing this when I actually didn't know the type chart, since you aren't punished or slown down after stepping on the worng pannel, you can just step on all 3 pannels and not learn. I didn't even know that there was type effectiveness. I think what would have been great is to make you fight whatever type you picked, and then revealing if you did the right call. Then the final battle could be a triple battle and the order of the gym leaders fight could have been the weak one, the same type one, and then the advantaged one, so we keep the difficulty.
I gotta disagree with your choice of the worst 4th gym. I personally loved the pinball-esque mechanics. The movment took a little getting-used-to but it was sth completely new at least
@@mimikyulover3411 I see where you're coming from, but I suppose that's because they had to pick something representative of both types. Punching for the fighting and the teacups are meant to look like Sinistea! Plus the fact that both gym leaders are pretty young probably contributed to it too, since it's a GAME something kids would enjoy
@@myheartismadeofstars I can get that, bit Gordie and melony's gym felt pretty on point to me. I just think they could have done better, like a dojo and a scare house, where trainers approach you either trying to hit you surprising you or try to scare you. If you dodge them you get a boost and don't have to fight them or something. Plus they could also just,, not make them parallel each other, it's not like they have to, not having a terrible difficulty difference would be the only requirement. And Gordie and melony could also keep their gyms similar as a nod to then being mother and son
Not that I disagree with your comments on Spikemuth's gym, but I'd like to point out that the gym itself was supposed to be a reference to side-scrolling arcade beat 'em ups. There's even a neon sign that lights up at one point and it reads "GO ->"
I won’t deny that Spikemuth could’ve used a bit more intricacy to the layout, but I will wholeheartedly defend the decision to make the whole town the gym. That was my dream concept for a potential dark gym for years before SwSh were ever announced!
2:35 in bw2 you have to battle the other band mates because if you try to talk to Roxie, a message will come up that she can’t hear you, so you battle the band mates to lower the noise level
3:20 yes, the normal gym looks like a fairy type pokemon… except fairy wasn’t added until four generations later, and clefairy was a normal type and one of whitney’s team??? not really an issue
I think it's better to call these things "challenges" than "puzzles" as some of them like Spikemuth or Virbank are going for something aesthetic rather than requiring much problem-solving.
I’d argue that the in lore challenge for the dark gym is literally team yell harassing you the whole game going for quantity of quality considering their state.
Pretty sure that Pier’s gym is meant to be a Streets of Rage reference because when you can proceed in the gym challenge, there’s a sign that lights up saying “go” like in Streets of Rage.
@@emperorcubone Are you referring to Streets of Rage? I played it once and have seen many videos of the series since. It may not be my kind of game, but I can at least appreciate the reference Pier’s gym was going for.
In defense of the first gym of b&w the dreamyard stuff is done AFTER the gym, and you get really fast to the first gym, that city is just the N battle and you only spend like 10 minutes to get to the first gym, not an hour. And the Pan- is there to help you if you cannot beat the gym leader, only if you played before hand you know about the monkey, but if it's first time you just go to the gym, and if is not your first time playing, well, obviously you know type matchups.
I think that out of all of the galar gym challenges, Kabu's challenge was my favorite & it had unique pokemon I could catch for the first time. For my least favorite, I think That Raihan's challenge was a little lackluster after how unique the other challenges were.
All of Jasmine’s gym trainers were actually in the lighthouse. That’s why they give you encouraging words in gen 4, you already beat them. And Piers’ gym is a side scrolling beat ‘em up.
Yet none of the trainers in the lighthouse have Steel pokemon in Gen 2 or the remakes. Heck outside of Jasmine's Steelix and Koga's Fortress you don't see trainers with any other Steel pokemon besides the Magnemite line.
@@jcohasset23 I’m pretty sure the last few are implied to be the gym trainers based on their dialogue. And correct, so few of them use steel type. Though I believe the reasoning for that is it’s newly discovered, with Jasmine’s Steelix being the first. At least that’s how the manga treated it.
@@MagusAgrippa8 As best I remember it the last few trainers comment on the fact they can't battle/challenge Jasmine. Though the pokemon they have do give hints as what to use if you hadn't already figured out a strategy from Magnemite. I will give Jasmine credit however as she actually does have a Johto pokemon on her team, unlike a bunch of the Johto gym leaders.
@@jcohasset23 True facts- it always bothered me that Johto leaders barely had any Johto pokemon. Like. Why in the heck does Morty not have Misdreavus? The manga fixes that, but still. Is it too much to ask for the cutest ghost to get some limelight?
@@MagusAgrippa8 It is frustrating that even the remakes don't fix that issue. Stadium 2 is the only game that's ever given him a Misdreavus. I love Gen 2 but it really does a poor job of letting Johto pokemon shine with so many Johto trainers having Kanto pokemon.
@@PalewhaleN7 He never said he did, it's like if someone said they like most of pokemon ultra moon and I said that they liked all of the unnecessary tutorials.
I think the Hammerlocke gym is by far the worst, considering that it's on the Switch just having a room, and nothing more than a room, is inexcusable. It's the final gym, there's a lot of anticipation and buildup, but you get nothing. The Viridian gym at least has something going on
I agree 10000%. I love all of swsh’s gyms including motostoke (very unique) but the final gym is awful and made me so sad considering i like the gym leader
@@timurtheking I know right! U meet Raihan several times throughout the game, and they gave him the worst gym. Like Hammerlocke looks amazing from the outside, they should've utilized the massive castle in some way
Yeah, definitely agreed. You can have Double Battles be the main theme but also give the player some kind of puzzle to solve or more interesting room design.
This. It could have been a cool museum, one where you'd go through a theater play or a tour or something But nope. Just a room, with priceless tapestries, that are getting exposed to weather like rain & hail The double battle thing i s cool but that's no puzzle. Why aren't we sneaking around in a dragon's den and trying to grab the dragon's treasure?
Honestly I don't even think you need a Puzzle to improve the gym, even just letting the Gym Trainers Dynamax while you battle them innthe stadium could have been a good warm-up for how the Champions Cup goes
The Vermillion Gym puzzle isn't that bad, just a little tedious, and it doesn't take that long to beat. At worst, there's a 1 in 4 chance to beat it on each attempt and could be as low as 1 in 2 if you get lucky. Each attempt of checking between 1 and 15 cans goes by quickly, and you only need an average of about 3 of those attempts to beat it. Personally, I find it refreshing as an actual gym puzzle when the half of the gyms didn't have a puzzle at all in Gen 1. Meanwhile, why does the Cut tree need to be removed when you're probably only ever going to be visiting the gym one time, anyway?
I mean, the Lighthouse is designed the same way a gym is. There even is a blocked quick way to get to the leader that only becomes accessible after reaching them so you can leave quickly(basically just like the complaint about Fantina) I feel the counter argument of “is the whole quest one in that case” is kinda weak. If the lighthouse was physically the gym building but we got turned around for the quest, would that then invalidate it too? I mean, Johto is known for its environmental storytelling and I feel the fact most people perceive that section as the actual gym puzzle is a great example of it. Also, gen 4’s gym having the townspeople cheer you on after saving the Pokémon they as a whole rely on is actually very refreshing and fits the small port town vibe Olivine gives off.
My only complaint about using the lighthouse as the puzzle is that we're left wondering how this works for other trainers. I mean if we weren't the protagonist who gets sent on this errand because videogames, what would we experience? Is Amphy just terminally ill and she goes through this with everyone? Is she faking the whole thing just to put trainers through her test? I don't have a problem with it on a gameplay front, but it does kinda make the world feel artificial when you realize that this gym has no in-universe puzzle and only you got one because of special circumstances, especially since this is the game that really tried to have different events going on in the world at different times to make it feel more real, like the world continues to exist even when you aren't around. I have no idea what he was on about with Pryce's Gym, though. That's completely different.
@UCxlX288iqwVh7-1mO9NrK0Q yeah that’s reasonable, was thinking the same while writing my original comment. From a realistic perspective ig you could head cannon that here gym was originally the first gym of the region, considering it’s design and her ace being the evolved form of the original rock type ace. Alongside the fact the town is very much like starting towns in terms of content and positioning, also likely being the main way new visitors get to the region, there is an argument to be made for it, but even that is simply a decent head cannon at the end of the day. I do feel that such is kinda a problem with Pokémon games in general outside the Alola games where there are questions of how things work for other trainers, but this gym is one of if not the best examples of such for sure.
Striaton Gym is actually one of the better first gyms. You don't have to make it easy by getting the monkey, and it's maybe the only example in the franchise of actively teaching you about type advantage instead of just having some NPCs talk about it.
But doesn't anybody really need to be taught types by then? It wasn't even the first generation on that console so most people will have already played a full other game first...
@@emperorcubone Every Pokemon game can be someone's first. No previous game even bothered to do it that way. You either found the right NPC, asked a friend, or did copious trial and error.
@@Compucles Good luck doing that in the 90's. Online searches weren't really an option until gen 4. I suppose you could also buy guide, but the point stands the games are generally bad at teaching you about their own mechanics
And also, if it's you first time playing you wouldn't know about the monkeys unless you explore, so they reward your exploration with a way to beat the first gym, that's supposed to be easy. If is not your first time playing and you know about the monkey you already know about type matchups and you decide if getting the monkey or not. Is the best first gyms, not only teaches you about type weakness, they also teach you to explore on a pokemon game and teaches you how scary Set up moves are, that lillipup was a knightmare the first time i played.
I think the issue with this video is just not all gyms will have puzzles, I think the video should have either as an actual worse gym puzzles showing gyms with bad, weak or maybe frustrating puzzles or fix non-puzzle gyms. I feel that the latter could have been more fun since you could have done some designs for the remakes because there are a ton of single room gym battles with maybe a few trainers. Examples include Brock, Misty, Falkner and all the others you said. The other option was to think of some of the more badly thought out ones like Fantina's or Tate and Liza's original gym or Brawly's weirdly themed gym puzzle. I feel like going through gyms in challenge order just was also a restriction that made this video less fun than could have been. Third thing I think would have been cool is if you made a series out of just redesigning all the gyms. Great Idea but I have to say poor execution overall. P.S I know this video is paired with another one
Lemme just say, the fact that you chose the 4th gym in Galar over the literal hallway in BW2 is ridiculous, I know what the concept of the gym is and yes, it’s cool, but that doesn’t make the PUZZLE better, I’m fine to agree to disagree on the Stow-On-Side gym but at least it actually has a puzzle
- Actually, I would say that, prior to doing the Strialton gym puzzle, it is very possible that the player might not know about the type masshups, after all, the only time that type masshup comes into play is when you fight Bianca and Cheren for the second time, both prior and after all you are fighting are Purrloin, Patrat and Lillipup. So I would say that introducing type masshups by giving the player the Monkey that is stronger to the Gym Leader is a good introduction to said mechanic. The Gyms I would actually change would be Brock's, Roxanne's and Roark's gyms because all the gym trainers are avoidable, nullifying the challenge. The way to fix them would be by taking a page out of Falkner's and Viola's books and giving them real puzzles. - I agree. Castelia city even has the perfect spot for her gym in the back alleys only accessible through the sewers. Only sad part for me is that that would mean replacing Burgh. - I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said here. - Yeah, the teacups. I have to agree that that was the worst one. For fixes, it was simple, really: * Figthing gym: A mini tournament. you need to win a tournament to be able to fight Bea in the Final Match. * Ghost gym: A haunted house. I think the reason why the teacups were chosen is because they wanted to make the gym basically the same thing in both versions (you know, the same reason why the Ice Climbers were cut out of Smash 4). - Okay, yeah, I agree. Math was not a good puzzle for this gym. I mean, I myself had no problem with it, but that might have been because I love the Proffesor Layton series, so that could be just me. - I again have to agree here. If anything, what I would like to add is that my runner-up for worst was Valerie, because her gym is a copy of Sabrina's. - Sorry, but I disagree here, heavily. Piers's gym wasn't the worst one, at all. It is easily one of my favorites thanks to how connected it is to Spikemouth's lore. Is the entire city abandoned? Of course it is, after all, Piers is against Dynamax/Gigantamax, meaning that Spikemouth as a whole is suffering a heavy downturn in turism that basically collapsed the entire economy of the city, making nearly everybody go away. That Spikemouth could be anywhere else? It could not, the mere fact that Piers is against Dynamax/Gigantamax (or in other words, that he is against the system) is what makes both him and his gym the Dark type (better known as the Aku [Evil] type in Japan). No voice-acting? Minor annoyance, nothing more. That it was linear? Again, a minor problem. His gym isn't the worst one at all. The real worst one would be Candice's gym. All of those snowballs were put in such terrible places that, sometimes, it takes me up to one hour to reach her. Easily the worst gym puzzle. - Uh, I have never thought of his gym like that. I have to say, I can see your argument. And I am surprised you didn't add Mina's collectathon "puzzle" as the worst here.
You do have to fight Roxie’s other junior trainers. If you try to fight her beforehand it says “She can’t hear you over the music”. Also it makes sense that a Poison gym leader has a gym that looks like an empty dive bar if she’s playing punk or metal music, you ever been to one of those shows?
I completely disagree with the choice for number 1, I would’ve actually put it near the top, not because it’s good, but because it’s actually one of the first gyms that ACTUALLY has a gym puzzle? Unlike brock or Roxanne, heck you can completely avoid all the trainers in Roxanne and roarks gyms...? And they don’t even offer some sort of puzzle for being able to skip them. I would understand if you don’t like the gym, but this is about the gym puzzles, and when you put the gym puzzle below gyms that don’t even offer a puzzle, you would see where I would get Irritated.
Wallace's gym, I'm not saying it's bad, but as a kid playing ruby/sapphire version for the first time that puzzle took forever to figure out. Whoops, I messed up again, back to the basement for the ninth time
I have a special place for Roxie’s gym specifically bc some of my best nights and coolest people I’ve met were at diy hardcore/punk shows in run-down basements and bars that were falling apart. It’s a hyper-specific scene that only works for some people but it definitely works for me and I really appreciate B&W for replicating that specific niche bc it holds such a place in my heart
My picks: 1- Cheren (just a school backyard, others at least had aesthetics) 2- Bugsy GSC / Misty (no puzzle) 3- Whitney (poor attempt at maze) 4- Erika (usually needs Cut) 5- Fantina DP (stated in video) / Opal (unbalanced quizzes) 6- Jasmine (stated in video) 7- Blaine GSC (literally just a dull room) / Piers (stated in video) 8- Blue GSC (room) / Raihan (consecutives battles in small room, not even in gym)
The Striaton Gym is an excellent gym design, imo. Veteran players take type matchups for granted. For players like me, it’s a really simple gym. But if that was your first game, especially if you were also under the age of 12, that gym provides an excellent way of “showing” you type matchups instead of just “telling” you about them.
I don’t know if we count the light house as part of the “gym”, and the gym itself is very plain, but it was cool being recognized for your actions that help the town
Nope. It's possible to challenge Blue as your first Gym Leader when arriving in Kanto. You just have to do all the Power Plant stuff, wake Snowlax, and get to Cinnabar to get Blue to return to the Viridian Gym. It's just difficult since he's the second strongest trainer in Gen 2 and his pokemon can easily be 15 levels higher than the player's doing so.
I remembered failing Fantina’s math questions on purpose just for exp and cash. XD But yeah, what does math has anything to do with ghosts anyway? XD I especially agree with your comment on Jasmine, which is a shame since she and Morty were my favorite gym leaders of the region. I would suggest maybe a gear based puzzle similar to Tick Tick Clock or something. Btw, thanks for another fun video, Emperor Cubone!
What's even worse about Phantina is the fact that you can easily skip all the trainers. Only issue with that is that the only trainer in the entire game to use a Drifloon is in her gym, and once you defeated her, you can't go back. This led to me having to time travel in the remakes in order to get the national dex, since Drifloon only spawns once a week.
That's a good point; I guess I just wanted a Drifloon so I specifically waited for one but if somebody else didn't know or care they couldn't have gotten their cool new evolutions!
This was a really cool video, what an interesting idea. There are definitely a couple of stinkers I forgot about. I love Roxies gym though and I will fight for that opinion!
Maybe for Blue's Viridian City challenge, there could be an "elite four" of powerful trainers each specializing in a different type since Blue used to be champion and is a multi-type user himself.
I genuinely forgot about the pinball thing in sword and shield. I don't know how I could but I completely did. It didn't ring any bells when you brought it up. I am actually questioning whether or not I somehow skipped it by accident.
Honestly the normal type gym in Black 2 and white 2 needs major remodeling since I kinda remember just avoiding the two gym trainers and the battle field designs honestly look nice but don’t really work for me since the player character can be moved to the left or right far enough to avoid them
With Roxie or Peirs, I think would be interesting if music was applied to the challenge, like maybe having to play some type of right notes or something like that
I hope that we can see Gym leaders that have different types like Blue and Rayhan did and more double battles 2 vs 2 like Tate,Lysa and Rayhan did in generation 9 onwards
I think the comparison between the Lighthouse and the Lake of Rage/Rocket Hideout isn't really valid. With the Lighthouse, Jasmine is actually there and relevant, so there's reason with saying it's the real gym puzzle. With the latter, Pryce has nothing to do with it and you don't even see him. It's like saying the Team Rocket Silph Co. is part of Sabrina's gym puzzle since the situation with her and Pryce is pretty much the same. Random Grunt blocking the entrance until you deal with the evil team
Except none of the trainers in the Lighthouse have Steel pokemon and most of the pokemon they have are 10 levels below Jasmine's as the game intends for the player to do everything in Cianwood and fight all the trainers around the Whirl Islands before challenging her. It's the closest to a gym puzzle but the game flat out refuses to let the player challenge Jasmine until Amphy is cured.
I like the HGSS Viridian. I used to dislike Sootopolis cause of that 3rd path, but I got it eventually. At least there’s a puzzle there. Raihan just puts you thru battles, and while he was able to work in Double Battles, it’s part of Galar’s anticharm to have less than stellar presentation like battle gauntlets such as that elevator sequence.
Roxie isn't able to be challenged immediately because she can't hear you while her band is practicing; you need to challenge her bandmates first to bring the noise down, and then you can challenge her. Because of this, I think Misty's is slightly worse because there's basically no theme (all of the second gyms could be better though)
Okay, a few things: 1) You fight the Striaton Gym before the Dreamyard, but can still get the Monkey before the gym 2) You cannot skip the trainers in Roxie's gym. You need to defeat both of them to battle her. Also putting her in the sewers is a no-go since that isn't a town/city and Castelia already has a gym leader, so that wouldn't work. But more importantly, why wasn't Bugsy put in there? It was like a much easier version of Erika's gym. 3) Fantina's DP/BDSP gym makes more sense once you remember the Calculator App on the Poketch. They probably wanted to give a good reason to use it in-game
I just defeated Crasher wake's Floatzel at full hp in pokemon Diamond with only a buizel at the same level edit: I also defeated fantina's gengar at full hp with only buizel
I agree with everything except the first one. Usually they're just rooms but Brock's is literally just a room. At least the waiter trio had something to do in between trainers and most of the others had different paths to take.
i honestly like the spikemuth gym. once i learned that it was supposed to be a reference to beat em ups, i started to like it. its a shame the rest of the region design is literally hallway after hallway so the gym can't stand out nearly as much. maybe if it was in gen 9 but alas.
I am a fan of you and your videos but this one I was a little confused about. I can’t tell if we didn’t like the puzzle itself or if the puzzle didn’t make sense. I also heard of inaccuracies as well!
the reasons you dont like Roxy are the reasons i like her. and i think you do have to fight the other band members, she won't hear you otherwise or something i feel like the unova leaders generally had more personality of the leader than puzzle, but that paid off as their following involvement in the plot is really cool
I think the only 1 i can really agree on is Jasmine's gym ik itd be abit weird for trainers to say "Thanks for your help, Now FIGHT ME"! but its a gym challenge for a reason and if jasmine can battle so csn the npcs While the surge gym is annoying, wouldnt it actually be a good puzzle because the whole point is to figure it out
Roxie's gym is going for a grunge punk style of underground band... the kind that might play a few local gigs at some local buisnesses run out of a basement and it's empty because they're just practicing... and the sewers are in Castellia... Not virbank
I think Norman's gym is pretty underwhelming. Especially that in gen 3 trainers mons have like only one gimmick they can attack you with. And about Blue - maybe instead of puzzle he could have something like a PMT, where you are pitted against one of his seven trainers (at random - all cool/ace/veteran class), then another and if you win, you can challenge him? That would fit his ex-champion status, multitype gym etc.
I like Roxie's because it felt realistic and not like some OSHA nightmare about to kill me at any notice, and I like Piers' because it reminds me of Streets of Rage.
I guess it's been a lot longer than I thought since I've played some of these games. I didn't remember the unova pokmeon league when I was watching someone play that, and I definitely didn't remember the viridian gym in hgss. But I will disagree that these movement tiles don't let yo see where you're going. trace a path from one tile to the next, and most of the time you should be able to rule out tiles that send you back to the start. it works in the rocket hideouts, in sinnoh's fuego ironworks, etc. although I will grant that in the case of viridian, the sheer number of tiles could make it pretty overwhelming to look at. my selections: gym 1: I suppose Brock doesn't deserve it entirely for being literally the first gym leader. but now I think of it, the trio in striaton are pretty boring. I love cheren as a gym leader in bw2 2. Misty. still a pretty plain path. I love Roxie as a character and her gym. 3. gotta be surge. it really made me think now, how faithful pokemon remakes usually are, even for how much may have been added. surge having different puzzles, or gym leaders having different teams in later remakes, could really something else to the new games. 4. I kind of like Morty's gym. but for me it's got to be Ramos. he has a cool slide at the top. but the tower of ropes and swings is somehow not all that interesting. I also just really don't like kalos leaders. 5. Fantina dp 6. Jasmine I guess. but I've never liked Sabrina's warp puzzles, and I like Valerie in kalos even less for both having the same type of puzzle while also being easier than Sabrina's. 7. realized I don't like most of the 7th leader's puzzles! the only exceptions are Tate and Liza, emerald is alright, and Drayden. 8. I straight up don't remember what Wulfric in kalos has. but boy do I not like the guy who got the last spot in bw2. they demoted Drayden to gym 7 and decided to remove Brycen (who wasn't that interesting anyway) but for what? a water guy? yaaaaawwwwn.
2:33 wrong about the Virbank Gym. You can't fight Roxie right of the bat you have to fight her bandmates first. Also the city and Gym are based of the Counter Culture movement Punk Rock that developed in New York city in particular. Not to be confused with British Punk Rock movement that Galar repersented perfectly. Their used to be underground(and I mean littraly underground like they Gym) places where parties took place playing Punk rock and Heavy Metal. Moshpites had their origin in these types of places.
imo the worst 1st gym "puzzle" would be B2/W2's first gym. B/W's 1st gym is actually interesting as well as Fantina's gym in D/P as it is a fun game for children, remember Pokemon is for children. My little cousin played a rom hack and doesn't really read the dialogue so kids would most often not really read the dialogue of NPCs (or would even talk to NPCs for that matter) and she even thought that Water was strong against Grass and Bug because "Water makes plants grow so it is strong" and "water kills bugs" soooo yeah the 1st gym in Unova is interesting to say the least. For Fantina's gym I guess I like it because I love Math butt still it's a pretty interesting gym, the only downside is how to backtrack but other than that it's not the worst lol
For anyone who wants to know (so, no one), during the "Pokémon math" section, there's the Jigglypuff, Pikachu, and Snorlax equations. I'll solve them for ya! Three Jigglies add up to 39, so if we divide 39 by 3, you get 13. 13 plus Pikachu is 16, so Pikachu is 3. Snorlax is two Pikachu, so Snorlax is six. Therefore, two Snorlax is 12.
I remember a trainer in Fantina’s gym accusing you of getting a question wrong on purpose (and to be honest, of course you did if you’re battling them)
I think Roxie’s gym has a lot of charm. She really doesn’t have much of a puzzle, but at least the gym has personality to it that none of the other gyms have.
Yeah, I was thinking the same. Her gym is very memorable and the cute lyrics you hear inside. I think they could’ve added a small puzzle, but might’ve actually taken away from the bar/club vibes it has.
@@Oscarsome Exactly. I love that it's this small, dingy bar. Maybe there could've been a maze to navigate through tables and such. Perhaps you would have to find the band members in the back rooms so they would join Roxie on stage, and only then would she battle you? It could've been funny if there was a rhythm game component and you had to help her with a show before she fought you.
Yeah! I love it and virbank in general. It reflects very well the vibe they were going for
My only real issue with it is that it’s one of several gyms that are functionally walking straight to the gym leader after a couple fights, Cheren, Roxie, Elesa, even Drayden
@@Venandi_ That’s a fair point. All of those gyms devolve into hallways to the gym leaders. At the very least some of them have enough personality and theme to make the walk interesting
You can’t actually battle Roxie without battling her bandmates first, due to the loud sounds they’re making.
ok i thought i was making that up thanks for clarifying
That’s very true. You wont be able to battle her until you battle her bands mates because she can’t hear you while they are playing.
You can't actually battle Roxie at the Virbank Gym until you defeat the other two trainers.
yeah. i think he's wrong on that matter. roxie won't be able to notice you with all the loud sounds.
Yeah plus he ignored the fact that with each trainer you beat an instrument of the song playing in the gym leaves which is really cool a unique.
@@orange6259 and also, the setting of the gym is really good, I would have put bugsy gym in the original GS because of how uninspired and boring feels
yeah thanks for clarifying
Was just about to comment this
I find Unova's 1st gym to be interesting and great for newer players. Usually, type effectiveness is just brought up by a npc. Having it be the theme of a gym is a cool idea.
I would agree but playing this when I actually didn't know the type chart, since you aren't punished or slown down after stepping on the worng pannel, you can just step on all 3 pannels and not learn. I didn't even know that there was type effectiveness. I think what would have been great is to make you fight whatever type you picked, and then revealing if you did the right call. Then the final battle could be a triple battle and the order of the gym leaders fight could have been the weak one, the same type one, and then the advantaged one, so we keep the difficulty.
I gotta disagree with your choice of the worst 4th gym. I personally loved the pinball-esque mechanics. The movment took a little getting-used-to but it was sth completely new at least
Me too! I thought the pinball game was fun!
I liked them, but they felt so impersonal to the gyms
@@mimikyulover3411 I see where you're coming from, but I suppose that's because they had to pick something representative of both types. Punching for the fighting and the teacups are meant to look like Sinistea! Plus the fact that both gym leaders are pretty young probably contributed to it too, since it's a GAME something kids would enjoy
Elesa B2W2 is a corridor Gym.
While the presentation of the catwalk makes it the ideal corridor Gym, it’s still a corridor gym and not a puzzle.
@@myheartismadeofstars I can get that, bit Gordie and melony's gym felt pretty on point to me. I just think they could have done better, like a dojo and a scare house, where trainers approach you either trying to hit you surprising you or try to scare you. If you dodge them you get a boost and don't have to fight them or something. Plus they could also just,, not make them parallel each other, it's not like they have to, not having a terrible difficulty difference would be the only requirement. And Gordie and melony could also keep their gyms similar as a nod to then being mother and son
3:20 That's hardly a fair criticism as both the original and remake predate fairy type so it was normal at that point.
Thats the joke.
Not that I disagree with your comments on Spikemuth's gym, but I'd like to point out that the gym itself was supposed to be a reference to side-scrolling arcade beat 'em ups. There's even a neon sign that lights up at one point and it reads "GO ->"
Yes and i found that clever
I won’t deny that Spikemuth could’ve used a bit more intricacy to the layout, but I will wholeheartedly defend the decision to make the whole town the gym. That was my dream concept for a potential dark gym for years before SwSh were ever announced!
I’m sorry but the stow on side gym is one of my favourites of all time because unlike pretty much every other gym in existence, it’s just fun
The thing that’s not to like about the gym is that you can’t redo the gym puzzle afterward haha
It really does feel like something a couple kids came up with. Like Bea and Alister just wanted a mini theme park ride in their Gym.
“The absurdly linear structure is an insult to put on the switch” is a solid one-line review of Sword and Shield
2:35 in bw2 you have to battle the other band mates because if you try to talk to Roxie, a message will come up that she can’t hear you, so you battle the band mates to lower the noise level
3:20 yes, the normal gym looks like a fairy type pokemon… except fairy wasn’t added until four generations later, and clefairy was a normal type and one of whitney’s team??? not really an issue
I think it's better to call these things "challenges" than "puzzles" as some of them like Spikemuth or Virbank are going for something aesthetic rather than requiring much problem-solving.
I’d argue that the in lore challenge for the dark gym is literally team yell harassing you the whole game going for quantity of quality considering their state.
Pretty sure that Pier’s gym is meant to be a Streets of Rage reference because when you can proceed in the gym challenge, there’s a sign that lights up saying “go” like in Streets of Rage.
Does it even do it well though? I've never played that game, and even so, does that make it not boring somehow?
@@emperorcubone Are you referring to Streets of Rage? I played it once and have seen many videos of the series since. It may not be my kind of game, but I can at least appreciate the reference Pier’s gym was going for.
In defense of the first gym of b&w the dreamyard stuff is done AFTER the gym, and you get really fast to the first gym, that city is just the N battle and you only spend like 10 minutes to get to the first gym, not an hour. And the Pan- is there to help you if you cannot beat the gym leader, only if you played before hand you know about the monkey, but if it's first time you just go to the gym, and if is not your first time playing, well, obviously you know type matchups.
I see the stow on side gym puzzle as fun
I think that out of all of the galar gym challenges, Kabu's challenge was my favorite
& it had unique pokemon I could catch for the first time. For my least favorite, I think
That Raihan's challenge was a little lackluster after how unique the other challenges were.
That's kinda why I liked Raihan's. It just seems strait to the point.
I will always loved Kabu's gym because I found a shiny Vulpix in here, was very scared the other trianer was gonna kill it tho
All of Jasmine’s gym trainers were actually in the lighthouse. That’s why they give you encouraging words in gen 4, you already beat them. And Piers’ gym is a side scrolling beat ‘em up.
Yet none of the trainers in the lighthouse have Steel pokemon in Gen 2 or the remakes. Heck outside of Jasmine's Steelix and Koga's Fortress you don't see trainers with any other Steel pokemon besides the Magnemite line.
@@jcohasset23 I’m pretty sure the last few are implied to be the gym trainers based on their dialogue. And correct, so few of them use steel type. Though I believe the reasoning for that is it’s newly discovered, with Jasmine’s Steelix being the first. At least that’s how the manga treated it.
@@MagusAgrippa8 As best I remember it the last few trainers comment on the fact they can't battle/challenge Jasmine. Though the pokemon they have do give hints as what to use if you hadn't already figured out a strategy from Magnemite. I will give Jasmine credit however as she actually does have a Johto pokemon on her team, unlike a bunch of the Johto gym leaders.
@@jcohasset23 True facts- it always bothered me that Johto leaders barely had any Johto pokemon. Like. Why in the heck does Morty not have Misdreavus? The manga fixes that, but still. Is it too much to ask for the cutest ghost to get some limelight?
@@MagusAgrippa8 It is frustrating that even the remakes don't fix that issue. Stadium 2 is the only game that's ever given him a Misdreavus. I love Gen 2 but it really does a poor job of letting Johto pokemon shine with so many Johto trainers having Kanto pokemon.
I think I disagreed with nearly all of these lol. Oh well, always appreciate your lists
Same, I liked a lot of these puzzles and don't understand why he hates them so much
You like lt surge puzzle?..
@@Hydraas Yeah,I Mostly Disagree With His Picks
@@PalewhaleN7 He never said he did, it's like if someone said they like most of pokemon ultra moon and I said that they liked all of the unnecessary tutorials.
@@piranhalettuce joke
I think the Hammerlocke gym is by far the worst, considering that it's on the Switch just having a room, and nothing more than a room, is inexcusable. It's the final gym, there's a lot of anticipation and buildup, but you get nothing. The Viridian gym at least has something going on
I agree 10000%. I love all of swsh’s gyms including motostoke (very unique) but the final gym is awful and made me so sad considering i like the gym leader
@@timurtheking I know right! U meet Raihan several times throughout the game, and they gave him the worst gym. Like Hammerlocke looks amazing from the outside, they should've utilized the massive castle in some way
Yeah, definitely agreed. You can have Double Battles be the main theme but also give the player some kind of puzzle to solve or more interesting room design.
This. It could have been a cool museum, one where you'd go through a theater play or a tour or something
But nope. Just a room, with priceless tapestries, that are getting exposed to weather like rain & hail
The double battle thing i s cool but that's no puzzle. Why aren't we sneaking around in a dragon's den and trying to grab the dragon's treasure?
Honestly I don't even think you need a Puzzle to improve the gym, even just letting the Gym Trainers Dynamax while you battle them innthe stadium could have been a good warm-up for how the Champions Cup goes
"Pokestar studios is doing just fine while the gym looks like it's having trouble keeping the lights on."
Huh, I guess they properly represented LA.
Virbank is supposed to be LA? No wonder it looks horrible...
The Vermillion Gym puzzle isn't that bad, just a little tedious, and it doesn't take that long to beat. At worst, there's a 1 in 4 chance to beat it on each attempt and could be as low as 1 in 2 if you get lucky. Each attempt of checking between 1 and 15 cans goes by quickly, and you only need an average of about 3 of those attempts to beat it. Personally, I find it refreshing as an actual gym puzzle when the half of the gyms didn't have a puzzle at all in Gen 1.
Meanwhile, why does the Cut tree need to be removed when you're probably only ever going to be visiting the gym one time, anyway?
I mean, the Lighthouse is designed the same way a gym is. There even is a blocked quick way to get to the leader that only becomes accessible after reaching them so you can leave quickly(basically just like the complaint about Fantina) I feel the counter argument of “is the whole quest one in that case” is kinda weak. If the lighthouse was physically the gym building but we got turned around for the quest, would that then invalidate it too? I mean, Johto is known for its environmental storytelling and I feel the fact most people perceive that section as the actual gym puzzle is a great example of it. Also, gen 4’s gym having the townspeople cheer you on after saving the Pokémon they as a whole rely on is actually very refreshing and fits the small port town vibe Olivine gives off.
My only complaint about using the lighthouse as the puzzle is that we're left wondering how this works for other trainers. I mean if we weren't the protagonist who gets sent on this errand because videogames, what would we experience? Is Amphy just terminally ill and she goes through this with everyone? Is she faking the whole thing just to put trainers through her test? I don't have a problem with it on a gameplay front, but it does kinda make the world feel artificial when you realize that this gym has no in-universe puzzle and only you got one because of special circumstances, especially since this is the game that really tried to have different events going on in the world at different times to make it feel more real, like the world continues to exist even when you aren't around. I have no idea what he was on about with Pryce's Gym, though. That's completely different.
@UCxlX288iqwVh7-1mO9NrK0Q yeah that’s reasonable, was thinking the same while writing my original comment. From a realistic perspective ig you could head cannon that here gym was originally the first gym of the region, considering it’s design and her ace being the evolved form of the original rock type ace. Alongside the fact the town is very much like starting towns in terms of content and positioning, also likely being the main way new visitors get to the region, there is an argument to be made for it, but even that is simply a decent head cannon at the end of the day. I do feel that such is kinda a problem with Pokémon games in general outside the Alola games where there are questions of how things work for other trainers, but this gym is one of if not the best examples of such for sure.
Striaton Gym is actually one of the better first gyms. You don't have to make it easy by getting the monkey, and it's maybe the only example in the franchise of actively teaching you about type advantage instead of just having some NPCs talk about it.
But doesn't anybody really need to be taught types by then? It wasn't even the first generation on that console so most people will have already played a full other game first...
@@emperorcubone Every Pokemon game can be someone's first. No previous game even bothered to do it that way. You either found the right NPC, asked a friend, or did copious trial and error.
@@colinvandenberg3446 ...or looked it up online in advance.
@@Compucles Good luck doing that in the 90's. Online searches weren't really an option until gen 4. I suppose you could also buy guide, but the point stands the games are generally bad at teaching you about their own mechanics
And also, if it's you first time playing you wouldn't know about the monkeys unless you explore, so they reward your exploration with a way to beat the first gym, that's supposed to be easy. If is not your first time playing and you know about the monkey you already know about type matchups and you decide if getting the monkey or not. Is the best first gyms, not only teaches you about type weakness, they also teach you to explore on a pokemon game and teaches you how scary Set up moves are, that lillipup was a knightmare the first time i played.
you gotta change the video title, it should say worst instead of best
Thumbnail:worst
Title:best
I hit myself in my confusion
I think the issue with this video is just not all gyms will have puzzles, I think the video should have either as an actual worse gym puzzles showing gyms with bad, weak or maybe frustrating puzzles or fix non-puzzle gyms. I feel that the latter could have been more fun since you could have done some designs for the remakes because there are a ton of single room gym battles with maybe a few trainers. Examples include Brock, Misty, Falkner and all the others you said. The other option was to think of some of the more badly thought out ones like Fantina's or Tate and Liza's original gym or Brawly's weirdly themed gym puzzle. I feel like going through gyms in challenge order just was also a restriction that made this video less fun than could have been. Third thing I think would have been cool is if you made a series out of just redesigning all the gyms. Great Idea but I have to say poor execution overall.
P.S I know this video is paired with another one
Lemme just say, the fact that you chose the 4th gym in Galar over the literal hallway in BW2 is ridiculous, I know what the concept of the gym is and yes, it’s cool, but that doesn’t make the PUZZLE better, I’m fine to agree to disagree on the Stow-On-Side gym but at least it actually has a puzzle
- Actually, I would say that, prior to doing the Strialton gym puzzle, it is very possible that the player might not know about the type masshups, after all, the only time that type masshup comes into play is when you fight Bianca and Cheren for the second time, both prior and after all you are fighting are Purrloin, Patrat and Lillipup. So I would say that introducing type masshups by giving the player the Monkey that is stronger to the Gym Leader is a good introduction to said mechanic.
The Gyms I would actually change would be Brock's, Roxanne's and Roark's gyms because all the gym trainers are avoidable, nullifying the challenge. The way to fix them would be by taking a page out of Falkner's and Viola's books and giving them real puzzles.
- I agree. Castelia city even has the perfect spot for her gym in the back alleys only accessible through the sewers. Only sad part for me is that that would mean replacing Burgh.
- I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said here.
- Yeah, the teacups. I have to agree that that was the worst one. For fixes, it was simple, really:
* Figthing gym: A mini tournament. you need to win a tournament to be able to fight Bea in the Final Match.
* Ghost gym: A haunted house.
I think the reason why the teacups were chosen is because they wanted to make the gym basically the same thing in both versions (you know, the same reason why the Ice Climbers were cut out of Smash 4).
- Okay, yeah, I agree. Math was not a good puzzle for this gym. I mean, I myself had no problem with it, but that might have been because I love the Proffesor Layton series, so that could be just me.
- I again have to agree here. If anything, what I would like to add is that my runner-up for worst was Valerie, because her gym is a copy of Sabrina's.
- Sorry, but I disagree here, heavily. Piers's gym wasn't the worst one, at all. It is easily one of my favorites thanks to how connected it is to Spikemouth's lore.
Is the entire city abandoned? Of course it is, after all, Piers is against Dynamax/Gigantamax, meaning that Spikemouth as a whole is suffering a heavy downturn in turism that basically collapsed the entire economy of the city, making nearly everybody go away. That Spikemouth could be anywhere else? It could not, the mere fact that Piers is against Dynamax/Gigantamax (or in other words, that he is against the system) is what makes both him and his gym the Dark type (better known as the Aku [Evil] type in Japan). No voice-acting? Minor annoyance, nothing more. That it was linear? Again, a minor problem. His gym isn't the worst one at all.
The real worst one would be Candice's gym. All of those snowballs were put in such terrible places that, sometimes, it takes me up to one hour to reach her. Easily the worst gym puzzle.
- Uh, I have never thought of his gym like that. I have to say, I can see your argument. And I am surprised you didn't add Mina's collectathon "puzzle" as the worst here.
You do have to fight Roxie’s other junior trainers. If you try to fight her beforehand it says “She can’t hear you over the music”.
Also it makes sense that a Poison gym leader has a gym that looks like an empty dive bar if she’s playing punk or metal music, you ever been to one of those shows?
I completely disagree with the choice for number 1, I would’ve actually put it near the top, not because it’s good, but because it’s actually one of the first gyms that ACTUALLY has a gym puzzle? Unlike brock or Roxanne, heck you can completely avoid all the trainers in Roxanne and roarks gyms...? And they don’t even offer some sort of puzzle for being able to skip them. I would understand if you don’t like the gym, but this is about the gym puzzles, and when you put the gym puzzle below gyms that don’t even offer a puzzle, you would see where I would get Irritated.
I actually liked the Stow-on-Side gym puzzle, honestly.
Edit: Spikemuth was pretty cool too, actually.
Wallace's gym, I'm not saying it's bad, but as a kid playing ruby/sapphire version for the first time that puzzle took forever to figure out. Whoops, I messed up again, back to the basement for the ninth time
I have a special place for Roxie’s gym specifically bc some of my best nights and coolest people I’ve met were at diy hardcore/punk shows in run-down basements and bars that were falling apart. It’s a hyper-specific scene that only works for some people but it definitely works for me and I really appreciate B&W for replicating that specific niche bc it holds such a place in my heart
My picks:
1- Cheren (just a school backyard, others at least had aesthetics)
2- Bugsy GSC / Misty (no puzzle)
3- Whitney (poor attempt at maze)
4- Erika (usually needs Cut)
5- Fantina DP (stated in video) / Opal (unbalanced quizzes)
6- Jasmine (stated in video)
7- Blaine GSC (literally just a dull room) / Piers (stated in video)
8- Blue GSC (room) / Raihan (consecutives battles in small room, not even in gym)
The Striaton Gym is an excellent gym design, imo. Veteran players take type matchups for granted. For players like me, it’s a really simple gym. But if that was your first game, especially if you were also under the age of 12, that gym provides an excellent way of “showing” you type matchups instead of just “telling” you about them.
Very surprised you dislkiked stow on side, I LOVED that gym puzzle, one of ma fvourite of all time
We ALL know the ice puzzle at that Gen 4 Gym should be on this list!
I don’t know if we count the light house as part of the “gym”, and the gym itself is very plain, but it was cool being recognized for your actions that help the town
The Viridian City Gym Puzzle is awesome: you have to beat 15 Gym Leaders and the Johto League to unlock Blue.
Nope. It's possible to challenge Blue as your first Gym Leader when arriving in Kanto. You just have to do all the Power Plant stuff, wake Snowlax, and get to Cinnabar to get Blue to return to the Viridian Gym. It's just difficult since he's the second strongest trainer in Gen 2 and his pokemon can easily be 15 levels higher than the player's doing so.
Literally all of my favorites are on this list 😭
I remembered failing Fantina’s math questions on purpose just for exp and cash. XD But yeah, what does math has anything to do with ghosts anyway? XD I especially agree with your comment on Jasmine, which is a shame since she and Morty were my favorite gym leaders of the region. I would suggest maybe a gear based puzzle similar to Tick Tick Clock or something. Btw, thanks for another fun video, Emperor Cubone!
The funny thing is they litterally have a trainer who asks "Are you getting these wrong because you want to battle?"
They should just make you compete in a contest (not win, necessarily) to battle Fantina
That's good, cause I had so much trouble winning contests as a kid...
Those NPCs in Olivine Gym are trainers you already fought in the lighthouse.
Congrats on almost 100 K!
What's even worse about Phantina is the fact that you can easily skip all the trainers. Only issue with that is that the only trainer in the entire game to use a Drifloon is in her gym, and once you defeated her, you can't go back. This led to me having to time travel in the remakes in order to get the national dex, since Drifloon only spawns once a week.
That's a good point; I guess I just wanted a Drifloon so I specifically waited for one but if somebody else didn't know or care they couldn't have gotten their cool new evolutions!
This was a really cool video, what an interesting idea. There are definitely a couple of stinkers I forgot about. I love Roxies gym though and I will fight for that opinion!
Maybe for Blue's Viridian City challenge, there could be an "elite four" of powerful trainers each specializing in a different type since Blue used to be champion and is a multi-type user himself.
I am surprised that you didn't make a joke about blues gym looking like a giant Lego playground.
With that quality it's more like Mega Blocks...
I would just like to say that I'm so happy there isn't a single 6th gen gym here :D
I genuinely forgot about the pinball thing in sword and shield. I don't know how I could but I completely did. It didn't ring any bells when you brought it up. I am actually questioning whether or not I somehow skipped it by accident.
Honestly the normal type gym in Black 2 and white 2 needs major remodeling since I kinda remember just avoiding the two gym trainers and the battle field designs honestly look nice but don’t really work for me since the player character can be moved to the left or right far enough to avoid them
The worst is outside of Pokémon and it’s in Temtem the mental dojo.
Correction. You do have to fight the others first so they stop playing, else Roxie is just going to ignore you
With Roxie or Peirs, I think would be interesting if music was applied to the challenge, like maybe having to play some type of right notes or something like that
Title says 'Best' if you haven't noticed
Respect for the Space Cadet Pinball! Heck yeah!
I hope that we can see Gym leaders that have different types like Blue and Rayhan did and more double battles 2 vs 2 like Tate,Lysa and Rayhan did in generation 9 onwards
How about ranking the Victory Roads?
Her band might be practicing. You always want to do one set in the place you're going to preform in before the show.
A video about the best 'n' worst moves removed in Gen 8 might be cool.
Way ahead of you my friend!
ua-cam.com/video/tkaoUXBB1Dc/v-deo.html
I think the comparison between the Lighthouse and the Lake of Rage/Rocket Hideout isn't really valid. With the Lighthouse, Jasmine is actually there and relevant, so there's reason with saying it's the real gym puzzle. With the latter, Pryce has nothing to do with it and you don't even see him. It's like saying the Team Rocket Silph Co. is part of Sabrina's gym puzzle since the situation with her and Pryce is pretty much the same. Random Grunt blocking the entrance until you deal with the evil team
Except none of the trainers in the Lighthouse have Steel pokemon and most of the pokemon they have are 10 levels below Jasmine's as the game intends for the player to do everything in Cianwood and fight all the trainers around the Whirl Islands before challenging her. It's the closest to a gym puzzle but the game flat out refuses to let the player challenge Jasmine until Amphy is cured.
Technically, the first example of voice acting in a mainline game is "Pikachu!" right on title screen in "Pokémon Yellow."
I like the HGSS Viridian. I used to dislike Sootopolis cause of that 3rd path, but I got it eventually. At least there’s a puzzle there. Raihan just puts you thru battles, and while he was able to work in Double Battles, it’s part of Galar’s anticharm to have less than stellar presentation like battle gauntlets such as that elevator sequence.
hey you should rank the gym badges from each region next.
Huh, I've never given that as much thought...
@@emperorcubone so cool to see you responding to my comment :)
worst 1st gym puzzle: roxanne
2nd gym: lenora
3rd gym: whitney
4th: gen 2 morty
5th: opal
6th: jasmine
7th: pryce gen 2
8th: wulfric
the stow-on-side gym is really fun
Small mistake is roxies gym you have to fight the other band members to fight roxie
Let's go Pickachu change it so they always spawn next to the red can
Roxie isn't able to be challenged immediately because she can't hear you while her band is practicing; you need to challenge her bandmates first to bring the noise down, and then you can challenge her. Because of this, I think Misty's is slightly worse because there's basically no theme (all of the second gyms could be better though)
Okay, a few things:
1) You fight the Striaton Gym before the Dreamyard, but can still get the Monkey before the gym
2) You cannot skip the trainers in Roxie's gym. You need to defeat both of them to battle her. Also putting her in the sewers is a no-go since that isn't a town/city and Castelia already has a gym leader, so that wouldn't work. But more importantly, why wasn't Bugsy put in there? It was like a much easier version of Erika's gym.
3) Fantina's DP/BDSP gym makes more sense once you remember the Calculator App on the Poketch. They probably wanted to give a good reason to use it in-game
Iirc he put Bugsy as the BEST second gym in another video.
@@bird_obsession Bugsy's HGSS gym which is an inarguable upgrade from the original GSC gym
Fun fact; I used to think that the vermilion gym was ON the S.S.Anne
Might as well be!
I just defeated Crasher wake's Floatzel at full hp in pokemon Diamond with only a buizel at the same level
edit:
I also defeated fantina's gengar at full hp with only buizel
I agree with everything except the first one. Usually they're just rooms but Brock's is literally just a room. At least the waiter trio had something to do in between trainers and most of the others had different paths to take.
You can’t battle Roxie until you beat the other two trainer my dude
Lol hoenn and Kalos have the best puzzles.
i honestly like the spikemuth gym. once i learned that it was supposed to be a reference to beat em ups, i started to like it. its a shame the rest of the region design is literally hallway after hallway so the gym can't stand out nearly as much. maybe if it was in gen 9 but alas.
I am a fan of you and your videos but this one I was a little confused about. I can’t tell if we didn’t like the puzzle itself or if the puzzle didn’t make sense. I also heard of inaccuracies as well!
the reasons you dont like Roxy are the reasons i like her. and i think you do have to fight the other band members, she won't hear you otherwise or something
i feel like the unova leaders generally had more personality of the leader than puzzle, but that paid off as their following involvement in the plot is really cool
I think the only 1 i can really agree on is Jasmine's gym ik itd be abit weird for trainers to say
"Thanks for your help, Now FIGHT ME"!
but its a gym challenge for a reason and if jasmine can battle so csn the npcs
While the surge gym is annoying, wouldnt it actually be a good puzzle because the whole point is to figure it out
So are we not gonna talk about raihan just not having a puzzle at all
Oh my god I did love Math Blaster though!
Roxie's gym is going for a grunge punk style of underground band... the kind that might play a few local gigs at some local buisnesses run out of a basement
and it's empty because they're just practicing...
and the sewers are in Castellia... Not virbank
I think Norman's gym is pretty underwhelming. Especially that in gen 3 trainers mons have like only one gimmick they can attack you with.
And about Blue - maybe instead of puzzle he could have something like a PMT, where you are pitted against one of his seven trainers (at random - all cool/ace/veteran class), then another and if you win, you can challenge him? That would fit his ex-champion status, multitype gym etc.
I think the Striaton gym is fine, it's better to have a puzzle then no puzzle at all.
Dude, I'm pretty sure Roxi's band is just practicing when you challenge them
Also the sewers are in Castellia City, not Virbank
Yeah i know there aren't actual in-game sewers in Virbank, I'm saying add them and put the gym there.
I like Roxie's because it felt realistic and not like some OSHA nightmare about to kill me at any notice, and I like Piers' because it reminds me of Streets of Rage.
The Virbank Gym is actually great, that's a cold take
I guess it's been a lot longer than I thought since I've played some of these games. I didn't remember the unova pokmeon league when I was watching someone play that, and I definitely didn't remember the viridian gym in hgss. But I will disagree that these movement tiles don't let yo see where you're going. trace a path from one tile to the next, and most of the time you should be able to rule out tiles that send you back to the start. it works in the rocket hideouts, in sinnoh's fuego ironworks, etc. although I will grant that in the case of viridian, the sheer number of tiles could make it pretty overwhelming to look at.
my selections:
gym 1: I suppose Brock doesn't deserve it entirely for being literally the first gym leader. but now I think of it, the trio in striaton are pretty boring. I love cheren as a gym leader in bw2
2. Misty. still a pretty plain path. I love Roxie as a character and her gym.
3. gotta be surge. it really made me think now, how faithful pokemon remakes usually are, even for how much may have been added. surge having different puzzles, or gym leaders having different teams in later remakes, could really something else to the new games.
4. I kind of like Morty's gym. but for me it's got to be Ramos. he has a cool slide at the top. but the tower of ropes and swings is somehow not all that interesting. I also just really don't like kalos leaders.
5. Fantina dp
6. Jasmine I guess. but I've never liked Sabrina's warp puzzles, and I like Valerie in kalos even less for both having the same type of puzzle while also being easier than Sabrina's.
7. realized I don't like most of the 7th leader's puzzles! the only exceptions are Tate and Liza, emerald is alright, and Drayden.
8. I straight up don't remember what Wulfric in kalos has. but boy do I not like the guy who got the last spot in bw2. they demoted Drayden to gym 7 and decided to remove Brycen (who wasn't that interesting anyway) but for what? a water guy? yaaaaawwwwn.
Not you calling Fantina’s gym puzzle of elementary school math Algebra 2 lol
2:33 wrong about the Virbank Gym.
You can't fight Roxie right of the bat you have to fight her bandmates first.
Also the city and Gym are based of the Counter Culture movement Punk Rock that developed in New York city in particular. Not to be confused with British Punk Rock movement that Galar repersented perfectly. Their used to be underground(and I mean littraly underground like they Gym) places where parties took place playing Punk rock and Heavy Metal. Moshpites had their origin in these types of places.
You can’t fight Roxie immediately
6:30
And people will probably use THE CALCULATOR IN THEIR POKETCH ANYWAYS OR A CALCULATOR AT ALL
There really should be more than just a hallway.
Like, two hallways?
@@emperorcubone an actual puzzle to solve, or navigate through.
imo the worst 1st gym "puzzle" would be B2/W2's first gym. B/W's 1st gym is actually interesting as well as Fantina's gym in D/P as it is a fun game for children, remember Pokemon is for children.
My little cousin played a rom hack and doesn't really read the dialogue so kids would most often not really read the dialogue of NPCs (or would even talk to NPCs for that matter) and she even thought that Water was strong against Grass and Bug because "Water makes plants grow so it is strong" and "water kills bugs" soooo yeah the 1st gym in Unova is interesting to say the least.
For Fantina's gym I guess I like it because I love Math butt still it's a pretty interesting gym, the only downside is how to backtrack but other than that it's not the worst lol
For anyone who wants to know (so, no one), during the "Pokémon math" section, there's the Jigglypuff, Pikachu, and Snorlax equations. I'll solve them for ya!
Three Jigglies add up to 39, so if we divide 39 by 3, you get 13.
13 plus Pikachu is 16, so Pikachu is 3.
Snorlax is two Pikachu, so Snorlax is six.
Therefore, two Snorlax is 12.
I love that, in Clemont's gym, if you keep getting the questions wrong to gain more experience points, one of the trainers actually calls you out.
I remember a trainer in Fantina’s gym accusing you of getting a question wrong on purpose (and to be honest, of course you did if you’re battling them)
By the way, Snorlax + Snorlax = 12. That was easier than I thought it was going to be, no linear algebra actually required.
10:6 ¿So if a a theme song having a singer in it is considered voice acting does that mean the Alola games also had voice acting? 🤔