Learning to Love The Last of Us Part 2
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- Опубліковано 27 тра 2024
- The Last of Us Part 2 is one of the most controversial video games ever released, diving the gaming audience like no other game when it came out in 2020. I was one of many who didn't feel satisfied by the experience...but a lot can change in three years, and that's what we are here to explore today in more detail than anybody asked for!
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Chapters:
00:00 The Last of Us Part II
05:52 The Death of Joel
14:04 Game is Pretty Cool
22:43 Lies
37:22 Truth
46:35 Toxic Internet Gamer Culture
01:02:12 The Breaking Point
01:06:45 A Culture of Crunch
01:09:49 The Redemption of Abby
01:19:29 One Final Mission
01:26:59 I Would Do It...All Over Again...
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#thelastofuspart2 #thelastofus - Ігри
22:26 The thing that interests me most in this moment is that you can actually hear Abby fighting the Rat King on the other side of the door while Ellie is beating Nora to death. When the WLF soldiers chase Ellie and Nora down to that level you can hear them asking aloud why the power is turned on. It's because Abby turned it on.
The entire time Ellie was beating Nora to death trying to find Abby, Abby was on the other side of the door fighting for her life.
That is fascinating. I knew you could hear the Rat King on the other side, but never knew that’s why the power was on or that it was actually Abby fighting it you could hear. Cool bit of trivia, thanks for sharing!
That is horrifying
The parallel stories was brilliantly done.
Anyone crazy enough to send actual hate messages and threats to actors who play fictional characters is not the kind of person you're going to reach, no matter how thoughtful and right your message is. A person like that is unwell and likely can't tell the difference between fiction and real life anyway.
I find myself unphased by harrassment these days. Because here's the thing: harassment is universal, it happens to everybody, but people only care about when it happens to people they like. When it happens to people they don't like they couldn't give less of a damn.
Just look at streamers getting bullied to tears over Hogwarts Legacy and all of the usual suspects ignoring or even supporting it lmao.
@@MrPyroCrabMost of the HL harassers, especially among the ones sending death wishes, are pretenders out to make the whole pro-trans crowd look bad. People are getting wiser and that's the douchebags' counter to that.
It's not so much "they can't tell apart reality and fantasy" as it is "they don't understand how acting works as a process and that small-time actors especially often have to take what roles they can get in order to eat because the job is inherently unstable". They get pissed off when the actor(s) didn't simply refuse to play their direct part(s) in creating the contentious scene(s), thinking they have the liberty to just walk away or push changes because lol they're all rich.
Like the Star wars fans with the sequel trilogy. You can hate and criticize the films,(and I get why people dislike these movies, like mismangement, bad writing, and the overall squandered potential for good films) but sending death threats to the actors and directors does nothing to help the situation. If anything, these kinds of acts are the reason the Star wars fandom gets labeled as toxic, despite the many valid complaints for the new films.
@@PlahaKumarand then that get ofended when the actors and company say “ don’t be racist”
I had a hard time getting into the first game because when his daughter got shot, it reminded me of the loss of my daughter. My friend recommended the game and after seeing that scene I couldn’t touch the game again for several years. I still rightfully can’t play the second one for the same reason. I can accept people talking about it but I can’t personally play it.
Why did your friend recommend the game if he knew about your daughter?????? Seems cruel. Even I cried which never happens to me but that scene brought up some old ptsd wounds. My grandma is the only person I have left because I have lost so many. So I get you. Considering it's your daughter which is basically the theme for both games I probably best to stay away. My condolences brother❤
Your friend sounds like a sociopath If they recommended It to you knowing shit like that would happen
Playing a game that reminds you of a trauma should be avoided, as it's better to focus on your mental health than dealing with even more stress.
i feel like the story to this game was told in the wrong order and not only that, this plot for revenge just for her to not even go through with it and return back to left all alone and have nothing, made me sad. i love everything about the game espically the gameplay but the story, needed some work
@@Sinnahh I can see why some people think like you do, but as someone who had no childhood because of a lot of horrible things, who has had to deal with losing loved ones way too soon, the difference in how I think of it is in the realization that revenge will never fix anything. It usually just makes things worse. Which is, IMHO, clearly evident in this story. You only ever start to move on past the grief when you can let go of the idea of Vengeance. This is something I am still learning myself because sometimes it is nigh impossible to let go, especially when you're feeling guilt or regret and are far too good at blaming yourself for everything, even when it's not warranted. I see a lot of myself in Ellie, and for me, having her not walk away from the need to end Abby would have been so much worse and left me feeling even more empty and hopeless. Walking away is the harder thing to do, but if you can manage it, you eventually see a light at the end instead of more bleak heartache.
Just my perspective on it.
i usually never comment on videos but i just wanted to thank you for stopping the video and talking very openly and honestly about your experiences and how you personally related the story to yourself. i tend to find a lot of comfort in video essays as a means of hearing other people talk about and analyze pieces of media and TLOU is a special story to me, just like it is too many others, and i always found it difficult to understand why SO MANY didn’t like the second story but i think you absolutely nailed the reason. the fact that this story is portraying such a real and human story of love, failure, connection, and struggle we can all relate to it in way one or another and i think it’s very easy to subconsciously see ourselves in characters and because this is such a heavy and uncomfortable story it’s very easy to get dismissive and turn away from what’s being shown and i appreciate you bringing up that very personal realization that you had. the way you talk about this experience is one of passion and deep care for the story and the ways it has shaped and or grown with you and there’s such a beauty to that and it’s very special seeing someone take that approach to reviewing this story.
honestly made my day, thank you :)
This Has to be the greatest TLOU2 video essay of all time. Everything about it is just immaculately spot on. Props.
Abby would have been more likeable if she wasn't all roided up with hulk arms...🤔
@@EroticOnion23 But that's part of her character development. She didn't start out that way when she was a young girl, before her father's death. Her hate and desire to take revenge drove her to train every day, get as strong as humanly possible, so she could take on anyone standing in her way. And later on in the game, we see her weak again, beaten, sickly, which is the only reason Ellie did even stand a chance against her in their final encounter, though Ellie wasn't in the best shape herself.
Exactly. I loved J's personal story bit the most. Just ties this video together perfectly. A lot of the ability to truly understand this game comes down to personal experience.
You can tell who the people are in this comment section that replied before watching the video
I got chills when Senator Armstrong killed Joel with a golf club. Truly the spiritual successor of the smash hit PS3 game Metal Gear Rising.
What we witnessed was the beautiful golf striking technique, passed down by the Armstrong line for generations!
Twisted Metal Gear Rising
@@MrSupersonic2012 This comment is far better than it has any right to be.
@@AdorniWhat a stupid thing you said
@@MrSupersonic2012 I almost died from laughter from this comment lol
57:29 It's actually because Buzz considers it a part of Andy's Room's "culture" to freeze when Andy shows up. It's only a single line so you can easily miss it.
And also, when the toys “freeze” in Toy Story… they’re essentially blacking out or going to sleep. They lose consciousness obviously to not expose themselves in the human world
@@cloudshines812 that just a theory
@@cloudshines812 Except they can still move if they want to. In Toy Story 3, you can tell from Buzz's eye movement when a kid is about to do something he would rather they not. And in Toy Story 1, they do just that to the other, much more deranged kid.
Where’d you hear that? The explanation I heard was Buzz was set to “Demo” during most of the first film and he was set to play mode when he fell in his failed attempt to fly
@@skibot9974 You.. you literally see them move in the first film and make the bully kid absolutely terrified. Remember? They absolutely can move if they want to. And it isn't too much of a logical leap to assume Buzz when he thought he was on an alien world just thought that was the culture of Andy's room.
Talking about your toxic internet gamer culture segment of the video I thoroughly disagree with your take on this whole thing. As a reviewer as a Critic you of all people should understand the necessity of critiquing something. Just because someone makes a comment or even a video about something does not mean that thing is their entire life whether that video or comment happens to be positive or negative. Someone can make a five or six hour video of why Toy Story 4 or Star Wars The Last Jedi or whatever is a horrible movie and still have a wrench productive life just cuz they made a video like that does not mean that they have no social lives or anything and making comments like that is honestly one of the most Petty things that you could do because you're just accusing people who don't like something of having no lives.
Are there people like that? Sure but that doesn't mean that that is the majority and making comments like that as though they are the majority simply is uncalled for. People who don't like The Last of Us Part 2 have good reason for not liking the game but just because someone makes a video on why Last of Us Part 2 is a horrible story that completely assassinates everything people liked about the first game doesn't mean that that is their entire life just as your hour-and-a-half-long video of the same game talking about why you like the game is not your entire life.
Yeah, I was fine with the video until he talked about that part. At the beginning of that part I was like "Yeah, those attacks on those actors and writers is wrong. Don't threaten them."
@@Parooka he doesn't say that, he say don't make your life hating on something. Creating an "hatebase" who want to be on that?
@@JuanPablo-su6vw from my experience most people who made videos or comments on something they don't like are just doing it because they don't like that thing and they want to express why they don't like it they don't make it there entire life. And I would know there's plenty of things that I hate that I have made tons of comments or videos about but those things aren't my life and a lot of his comments on this sort of thing really just come off as stop complaining about stuff go out and touch grass
@@supernew10doh64 its a point to be taken in consideration with how brain dead people can be with something they dislike
@@GerardoFirestorm oh yeah I agree that some people take it way too far but he talks about it like it's the majority of people or nearly everyone does stuff like this when in reality it's most likely just a very vocal minority he also talks about the criticism of Last of Us Part 2 or whatever as though it is all bad faith criticism when there is a very real argument to be made that the only reason Joel even died in the first place is because he was acting out of character when we see that before the Apocalypse he was already shown to be a very Advent Survivor doing things that were seemingly very cruel for the sake of surviving and protecting those close to him it's very hard to believe that he or Tommy for that matter would just willingly give their real names out to anyone not to mention the fact that it's hard to believe that Joel would just stand there and take all this abuse without trying to fight back when he now has something to fight for.
My biggest problem with TLOU2 is the way its story is structured. It builds for Ellie's 3 days up to the confrontation at the theater, but then cuts to Abby's story which doesn't even connect with Ellie's that much and takes several hours to build back up to the same confrontation. I really didn't gain anything from interacting with a lot of the characters cause I knew were going to be killed by Ellie (almost all in justified "kill or be killed" situations). The most interesting part to me was the stuff with Yara and Lev because I didn't know what was going to happen to them and wanted to see them survive. Also, I think a huge missed opportunity in the story was that they never brought up the fact that Abby killing Ellie's dad was basically the same thing Joel did to her (arguably even worse since Joel's death was right in front of Ellie).
Also Joel did it just to save his new "daughter", not wanting to see a second one dying. Abby did it just for osbessive revenge, dragging all his friends to a dangerous trip just to kill one single person that they don't know even if he's still alive or not. And even after, she left Ellie and Tom alive just to suffer the loss of Joel, after she forced them to watch hours of herself torturing Joel just for pleasure, before finally killing it. She was a complete psycho.
@@TheMetalOverlord Actually, she let Ellie and Tommy live because they had nothing to do with her revenge. (Cringes) I feel dirty defending Abby. Don't ever make me do that again. I agree with the rest though.
@@youtubecreators384 Yea but that doesn't make sense, knowing that Abby has just intentionally created another "herself" in Ellie. She kill people for basically no reason when you play her, but that time she left Ellie live, knowing that she was gonna chase her searching for revenge? Why?
I personally quite like the story structure. All the people you killed as Ellie were shown as being “monsters” so making us play as Abby for 3 days makes us realise that they were just people surviving in this world
agreed even tho i love tlou2
just anybody tell me, what the hell was the point of the sex scene? Did it serve any purpose? I'm not too sure.
Just my interpretation but we know that the two characters had history and in Owen’s relationship with Mel he doesn’t feel happy because there is still that lingering spark for Abby - a relationship that was broken because of Abby’s obsession to find Joel almost akin to an addict.
And in the scene where they have sex, Owen is sick of fighting for the WLF and is searching for meaning in the fireflies. Abby is also trying to find meaning as her main purpose in life was avenging her father and now that that’s over, what is there left for her to do? So in this moment of two lost people trying to find meaning in a ruined world, they seek solace in the other trying to find answers within the other.
For Owen, it seems to work. He wants to stay with Abby and he says “We are allowed to be happy”.
But for Abby, we see that she still has nightmares even after killing Joel and even after embracing Owen. Resolving her guilt by saving members of an enemy faction (Yara and Lev) is the key to moving past her trauma.
Ironically they end up at opposite ends from where they were at the start. Abby was stuck in the past and learns to move forward whereas Owen tries to look forward but ends up trying to rekindle the past.
It was pointless so it had no meaning. That simple.
@@christhechilled the replies are literally that meme of the two types of people in the world 😭
To appease those of us who like muscly women? In all seriousness though i think it was just a way to further establish the characters' relationship, even if a simple kiss could've done the job equally as well
@@sweett3253 It further increases Mel hate towards Abby, making the decision on not letting she go to St. Barbara with them justified. You can simply put yourself on her shoes, you also wouldn't like the someone who got buttfucked by the father of your child to live with you the rest of her life.
My oldest brother says he enjoyed the story of Part 1 more, but concluded Part 2 has the better gameplay. That seems like a logical assessment, but I've yet to play it.
I feel part 2 has the better story as well. It's longer and more elaborate and fleshed out story. Part 1 is kinda just The Road but as a game.
@@FraserSourispart 2 is just "revenge bad"
@@Slavic_Snake no
@@Slavic_Snakeevery story is that simple when you boil it down to that much, doing so is reductive and just shows us that you’re an idiot with poor media literacy.
@@Slavic_Snake Hey, congrats, you got the main theme down. Did you happen to get any of the other themes? Or you that simple minded and filled with hare you missed everything else. My guess, you missed everything else
Your feelings on the story and what you took from it align with mine 100%. I also went into part 2 totally blind, had the same disgusted feeling when the perspective changes to Abby midway through, but unlike a lot of people, by the end of my first play through I also didn’t want either of them to die. I just wanted them to talk it out but knew it wasn’t possible. To this day it blows my mind that this game gets so much vitriol….the story was an absolute masterpiece in my eyes.
you don't tell me Joel was a bad influence cuz he wasn't willing to talk to Ellie about Tess
at the end of the game it showed how Joel was morr open towards ellie cuz he started Talking about Sarah when in a previous scene he didn't wanna talk about it to tommy or even take the photo from him
No doubt, I did say in that part that following the farm house scene he was way more open with her, but I just meant that it already been drilled into her that bottling up your emotions is what you do instead of addressing them earlier in the first game. This is only reinforced when Joel gets defensive and shoots her down when she confronts him about the lie. In that case, he’s just defending the lie, when he’d otherwise be okay with her being honest with him. I don’t think Joel is a bad influence on her, just that some of his worse traits have rubbed off on her.
@@JsReviews well that's the thing i think ellie should've been mad at Joel for lying to her all this time
instead of being mad at him for saving her life cuz even then the Fireflies are crap for immediately rushing things instead of doing further tests on her and they didn't even wake her up to give her consent on this or anything
even if that wasn't joels motivation a vaccine would still have not been able to spread worldwide. how do we even know if the fireflies aren't gonna just use it on themselves?
and even then all the vaccine does it protect you from zombie bites and spores. the zombies are still out there tryin to kill you
heck why should i trust marlene at all?
I agree with all those points. The Fireflies definitely weren't to be trusted and also handled it as poorly as humanly possible. I think Ellie's anger with Joel is justified, as I had said in the video, good relationships aren't built on lies. Especially when she gave him a chance to tell the truth in the hotel flashback. I think Joel did the right thing for a plethora of reasons, his lies were the one part where I just think he went wrong. Ellie was totally in the right to be mad about that, but let herself fester in that anger for far too long, since she never stopped caring about Joel, obviously. Just a really complicated dynamic between them.
@@JsReviews can you review the telltale walking dead games?. 2012-2019.
When people say “Joel used Ellie to fill the void left behind by Sarah,” they’re not saying he LITERALLY is trying to turn her into Sarah or thinks they’re the same person. It’s just having a daughter to care for at all is what he wanted back, no one is saying he doesn’t love Ellie for who she is, he does, but the extreme lengths he goes to not to lose her is motivated by not having to feel that pain of losing another daughter. I think you vastly misinterpreted that analysis
I don't feel those things are mutually exclusive. And nobody is saying 'literally' - he isn't putting Sarah's clothes on Ellie nor was the video guy saying that was happening. If feel his main point was that he is learning to love and connect again, and is doing that in good faith of getting to know Ellie herself instead of as a proxy or replacement for Sarah. Ultimately, I believe you two agree, but are parsing context and specific wordage.
Look, I know what they were trying to do with the story. Revenge is a neverending cycle that brings nothing but pain. In the end, no one wins. But the way they were trying to get us to sympathize with both sides, it just didn't work for me.
Like when they were trying to get me to feel bad about killing the WLF dogs as Ellie by having us play with them as Abby; it just didn't work for me. Yeah, I have a dog in real life, but even in real life, if a big dog is trying to kill me, I'm going to defend myself, even if it means ending it. Plus the dogs were kind of annoying enemies, so I felt relief when I got rid of them. And I didn't feel bad about killing Abby's dog, because she belonged to Abby.
And then they try getting us to sympathize with Abby. You see why she killed Joel and usually that would be a very sympathetic motivation. But Joel didn't prolong her dad's death. He stabbed him clean in the neck, dead and done. Abby took her sweet time torturing Joel and beat him to death, drawing out his suffering. And in the end, his death didn't bring her closure, so she killed Joel for nothing.
What really pissed me off was when she tolded Tommy and Ellie that they wasted the chance she gave them when she spared them. "Excuse me? Do you honestly not realize why they would track you down to kill you?" Those were my exact words when I heard her say that. And then she was so eager to slit Dina's throat when she learned she was pregnant, because she wanted to get even for Mel's death. But Ellie didn't know Mel was pregnant, and if she did, I think Ellie would've tried to non-lethally subdue her. She killed Mel in self-defense and was horrified when she realized what she did. Meanwhile, Abby is all for killing a pregnant woman and only stops because Lev gave her a look.
And yeah, Abby's relationship with Lev. I can see they were trying a sort of "Joel and Ellie" 2.0 with them, and I like Lev. He's a good character, and I did want to protect him. I just hated that I had to play as Abby to protect him. To me, it just felt like emotional manipulation. Like "Look, doesn't this remind you of something? They are alike after all, Joel and Abby." When I saw how Abby carrying Lev on the beach reminded me of Joel carrying Sarah and later Ellie, I was unmoved. I just saw what they were doing, and it didn't work.
Mel said it best. Abby is just a piece of sh!t.
Now even if the story didn't work for me, the gameplay is awesome. I absolutely love switching between stealth and aggressive play. It's kinda ironic. The theme is violence is bad, but the violence of the game is the funnest part.
Well Abby didn’t know Ellie didn’t mean to kill Mel for all she knew this was Ellie being a hypocrite
@@skibot9974 That’s fair. But it was her eagerness to kill Dina that makes me dislike her.
The whole game can be summarised with: "You're a piece of shit Abby!". She was just unlikeable character even without the torturing Joel part. Besides she got away with what she did and escaped with Lev, even though revenge was supposed to be bad and all that.
@@gertytk5528 To be fair, her actions were the catalyst to her losing everyone she cared about. Sure she got away with Lev, but she has to live with all her friends being dead. The more I think about it, the more I feel that is a more fitting punishment to her.
But I’d be lying if I said I didn’t want to stab her while she was tied to that pillar.
Exactly. It felt forced. It should of given the player the options instead. Forcing people to relate to something always has a possible negative outcome and that’s what happened with TLoU 2
I didn’t plan on playing tlou2 but now that I know there’s a Pearl Jam song in it that changes everything
The Last of Us Part 2 is a very heavy game, the murder, the violence, can seem like too much, initially I too wanted to avenge Joel, his death was particularly gruesome (but expected, so it didn’t shock me like it did a lot of people) so many times during the story I wanted Ellie to stop, I saw her becoming unrecognizable, and at points I saw her actions to be just as savage as Abby’s, and I think that was the point ND was trying to convey, all things have an opposing force, hate exists because love exists, Ellie was consumed by hate, but in the end it was Joel’s love that saved her… by extension it saved Abby too
"Hate exists because love exists"
I never even played any of TLOU and I grasp this. You hate because you love. You hate to lose what you love. And I love a lot, even people and things I'm not particularly into personally, because I see their value. I see people's value to themselves even if they don't mean much to others. So I hate a lot, too. But I also know to fight only the right fights, and wisely at that, including knowing where I'm out of my depth. I'd gone through much of the same stuff as J. I'd learned how people think and thus how, if possible, to change them if need be. I get that everything's connected and that even the little things can matter. I'm still not perfect in all of this, but damn me if I'm not trying.
THIS. Exactly. ☝
SO GLAD that this was your take away from the game. This was the narrative, this was the intention of the people who made the story. I’m still convinced to this day that the people who hated either didn’t play this game at all and followed the views or were just blinded by their fandom for Joel. Showing that revenge always comes at a cost and that in a world like that, NO one is righteous or inherently unjust. People TRASHED this game simply bc a favorite fictional character of theirs died when anyone with any base understanding of story structure and and fiction could have predicted this would happen. Joel has played his part and this was the next needed step. As much of a cool game that a fanservice-ey game of Ellie and Joel would have been cool it wouldn’t have truly grown the characters and narrative in an effective way like this game did. And people were mad that they didn’t get that fanservice-ey game when in reality that’s all it would’ve been. A fanservice filled game that has no direction and is a rehash on a game they already made. Instead they made yet another genre defining masterpiece. I hated Abby at first too partly bc everyone else did but also bc I was SUPPOSED to hate her bc this is being seen from a different PERSPECTIVE. And this game shows that at its core it’s all about perspectives and you come to empathize with both Abby and Ellie. These base level gaming fans just can not for the life of them appreciate well crafted and cared for art. Just glad you had this takeaway
@@bookerdewitt2022 so you’re saying EVERY single street fight in the history of the world ended in someone dying??? That’s not even close to true. Seems like YOU wanted Ellie to kill her and therefore YOU were unhappy. But in reality the ending stayed true to the themes of the game, Ellie allowing her to live was the much harder decision at that point, she was literally fighting a corpse
If only it saved the hundreds of people she killed along the way. But nope, finally gets to the one person who ruined her life and that's where the rampage stops. What.
I think that Joel's Death (controversial take I know) is probably the best representation of death there is in gaming, because it displays exactly why people are absolutely devastated when something like that happens. Its sudden, quick, unremorseful, and like that everything continues as normal, there is no dramatic build up, no final tearjerking monologue, its there and done. The way Joel died was incredibly realistic too, in the sense that it was for the most absurd reason and it was when he never expected. It kind of reminds me of Rick's Death from the Walking Dead comic, where despite literally fighting a sea of walkers to protect his hometown, some random mayor's kid just dropped him with a silenced pistol while he was asleep. I find that most games or shows have very little understanding when it comes to what makes death so devastating, usually people are conditioned to think that the devastating thing about death is about death itself, and not the lingering meaninglessness of it
It did but these crybabies won’t acknowledge
I agree wholeheartedly. I think popular media has conditioned us to expect gratifying deaths for beloved main characters but The Last of Us is just not that kind of story. There isn’t even a single death scene in the first game that feels heroic or grandiose - it’s all morbid, quick and shocking. The second game makes a big show of Joel’s death for added impact but it’s still consistent with the rules of the universe. And for what it’s worth, it’s a fucking haunting scene - the sound design, music, Ashley Johnson’s acting, the slow camera movements; it all leaves a lasting impression. You’re thinking about Joel the whole game despite how little he’s in it because his absence affects all of the characters.
I love it when stories don’t make a big spectacle out of someone’s death. Succession and The Wire’s last seasons did that exceptionally well for example.
I hear you, man! The way Joel died was tonally consistent with the world of the game.
Look someone who actually understands the game has been found!
In my opinion, Joel's death was super realistic and true to real life. However it's not good for telling a story, because it feels like it comes out of nowhere just for shock value and to start Ellie's journey. It just feels like lazy writing to me. I see where you're coming from, though, and I respect your opinion.
This video is gonna piss people off.
The only thing worse than the reaction to the last of us 2 is the fact Naughty Dog refuses to do much else besides glorify the Last of Us series it feels like.
Word
Every game I play after the last of Us 2 just makes me appreciate it more. The gameplay is so good that you can notice how stiff the player characters are in other games.
The first game was such a warm payoff in this destroyed world that looking back there good and sad memories of it. This game it just feels dull dark and leaves you feeling depressed. Sure you can say its good since it made you feel that way but it not special compared to the first making you feeling satisfied and hopefuly and happy for the characters in a sad world like the first
The first literal ends on a somewhat sour note tho? It ends on Joel lying to Ellie leaving their future and relationship uncertain.
That was the entire point of that ending lol
The original's ending was quite uncertain which made it pretty bleak when you stop to think about it.
Warm payoff? It ends with Joel lying to Ellie about him murdering all the Fireflies and basically destroying any hope of finding a vaccine.
@@WarpChaos Ellie had a suspicion this is confirmed in this game she didn’t fully know thats why she went to the Fireflies hospital
This is such a hilarious comment. I don't think gamers deserve well thought out narratives
bro really just reuploaded it
Getting rid of Joel was necessary since his story was finished in tlou1 and needed to fuel the events of tlou2 but my problem is that they got rid of him way too early just to get you hooked into the story.
I also had a problem with how they executed deaths from side characters. In tlou1 the deaths were spontaneous but they had a lot of build up like Sarah, Tess, Sam, and Henry. Unlike in tlou2 where Jessie is just killed and no one seems to care. Felt the same way with Manny when he was shot and Abby just moved on. They don’t carry the same amount of emotional weight as the first game.
Another thing I noticed is that the ending of both games are structured similarly but tlou2 gets more hate due to how in your face it is. In tlou1 you go through this long journey across the US just to end up changing your mind and killing everyone. Same with tlou2 where you go through this long journey just to end up not doing what you set out to do and leaving but this time with nothing in return. They also tried doing an Ellie and Joel bond with Abby and Lev but it wasn’t anywhere near as compelling or touching. Tlou1 was just better at being subtle which I attribute to Bruce Straley’s (co-director of part 1) contribution.
All in all I have always been in the middle wether I like or dislike tlou2 because I see what they were going for and the gameplay itself was fantastic but it wasn’t a satisfying sequel in my opinion.
I mostly agree with the first paragraph. If Joel HAD to die for the sake of the story they needed to do it in a later stage of the game.
One of the reasons I'm not a fan of the story in part 2 is that I felt like they could've done more with his character to be Ellie's mentor. And he just went out too soon in the beginning. Replace Joel's role in that scene with, let's say, dina- and it could've worked just the same. People would get the themes behind it. What we got instead wasn't necessarily the right way to tell it in my opinion
To be fair, Neil Druckmann IS an egomaniac. His creative output has some progressive messages (although I don’t like how expendable BIPOC characters were in TLOU2)… but in his real life workplace, he is pretty terrible. He overworks his employees and takes credit for their work.
I have a friend who was a freelance writer for TLOU1 and she had such a bad experience at naughty dog that she couldn’t bring herself to watch the TV adaptation.
Bro, that’s terrible. Neil really is a hack!
Tbf even before druckman naughty dog was known for being a terrible place to work. The sad reality is that most dev companies are horrible places. Druckman catches heat because he is in the public eye, but almost every other major company is worse than ND. They are just smart enough to not have a public face.
Hopefully people will watch Grounded Pt 2 - The Making of TLOU2 where this situation is addressed.
I for one like seeing you pop up in the flesh in your videos. Weather you talk about games or bit’s and pieces of your personal life, I feel it adds to your videos. At the end of the day if you like popping up in person in to ur own videos keep doing it. If not, that’s fine too. Rock on dude.
Last of us 2 is like Disney sequel straight to VHS/DVD
Cute bumper sticker.
Shame the video has more to say than you.
I think they fumbled with the time line here. If they wanted us to like Abby so badly and push the same vengeance parallel with Ellie they should have had us play as Abby before she kills Joel. Have her target and reasoning be a mystery till finally killing him at the end of her segment. I get the message they were trying to push but it was too late then, everyone hated Abby already.
joel going out the way he did is the equivalent to capitan levi getting eaten by a random titan.
p.s. levi doesnt get eaten by a random titan dw
Everybody in the saga dies like that. What did you expect?
damn. got spoiled.
@@mruchiha0209 *SPOILER*
That Levi being eaten wasn't a spoiler, he's too cool to die🗿
The manga’s ending still completely destroys Eren’s character.
Exactly! Clumsy design story decisions that lead nowhere.
Yeah this video is going be very controversial. Personally this game had some solid ideas, but overall, it execution left a lotnto be desires and has some major flaws that fans have that can't be shrugged off as "toxic culture."
Well the Nostradamus Js reviews gave us a whole section of the video as to why it is toxic culture. You need to search within to find the Zen of the AbbyZilla and realize this game is a masterpiece.
Can you explain this “toxic culture”???
@@Actionfigure_fit Js reviews does it, I’m not saying I agree with him at all on his stance. I think there can be a over exceeding amount of arguing but then again we all have that right to our opinions. TLOU is still beloved by the majority so for him to be so upset over the “toxic culture” of TLOU is a bit of an exaggeration
@@TB12method”toxic culture” aka facts hurt my feelings
@@unr8ted77 no, angry nerds who kick, scream, and cry about the game. Cough cough
By the very second I read the title I spat out my drink in shock.
But I have loved watching your honest reviews for years. So I'll hear what you have to say.
He kindof took the wind out of your comment by changing the video title
I absolutely love this game its good to see it getting more love nowadays
It's not getting more love, it's as trash as it was when it released.
the game is awful@@thebombsquadtv6151
@@mattmas6628 Oh god, what was the original title?
This video has me actually excited for the remaster later this year. I wasn’t originally interested since I don’t remember liking the story. But you’ve made me think that I should give it a proper second chance away from all the toxic discourse
*goes on a slaughter spree killing every single person in her path*
*gets to the one person she wanted to kill the whole time* "REVENGE BAD!"
**DEEP**
How do you make that white text?
😂😂😂😂
@@Synchro1000 put a * on each end of what you want boldened
I absolutely HATE this kind of writing trope.
@@dskywalkerw Same, it's just plain lazy
Why did they change the surgical room from dumpy and dirty and sinister, to super clean and well lit?
They wanted to make you think that the evil evil Doctor and the @sshole fireflies are competent and capable. Which they were not. Vaccines do NOT work on fungi.
cause thats how hospital rooms should look like??? use ur thinking skills
@@rileyrichardson2809you sound like a douche bag
I know that I'm over 7 months late and albeit I come and go around this channel, but you're 100% right about this game about its message about not taking the people you care about for granted. I played this game as well back on release except with having prior knowledge to what happened to Joel and loved it for different reasons. I view this game now in a different light. My biological mother died Just over a year ago and never felt more regret for pushing her away while she was still around. Stopped talking to her around 17 and kept my distance and now that she has passed I never felt so regretful about not spending time with her regardless of our horrid past together. I'm glad everything worked out with you and your father and was able to come up with some sort of resolve with each other because I wouldn't wish this kind of pain towards my worst enemies
Love this analysis/review!! I only just got into Last of Us in the last month (knowing absolutely nothing about it beforehand) and now it's safe to say it's my new obsession until the further notice. I've played the first game twice, about to do my second run on Part 2, and have watched the HBO series and most, if not all, the behind the scenes content. At the end of the second game, I was so emotionally exhausted that I was fighting tears through each blow Ellie was giving Abby in the end, just wanting all the anger and violence between them to be over. At the end of the game, I was sobbing, and could have sobbed longer but I was already getting a headache from all the stress. The way you explained the motivations behind both protagonists was totally on point, that although outwardly their perspective enemy were each other, but it was in actuality the hate and anger they felt inside that they couldn't contain and control.
Also, thank you for being so open and honest about why this game means a lot to you with it's theme of forgiveness and moving on. I think I can safely say a great deal of us can relate to having a strained relationship with a family member, and you equating the ups and downs of Joel and Ellie's relationship with your own experience was very well done.
This Game cannot be a Masterpiece just for the main fact that the story is the most important aspect of this kind of games, and this Game not only fails to execute it's main pieces correctly, it fails to understand what kind of story the first Game was trying to tell and by that it fails as a sequel as well. But could we have expected something else after the series of idiotic narrative desitions made in just the first 2 hours?
@@WarpChaos The story of the first game is that "love transforms a person."
That is the story of the second game as well.
@@WarpChaos The fact that Abby bites off Ellie's fingers and robs her of the ability to play music and sing, is beyond disgusting. Her art could have been her saving grace but Abby takes that away too.
Neil simply wanted to write Ellie and Joel out of the story and have Abby supplant them.
Abby doesn't even stand on her own as a a character because she is only negatively defined by Joel and Ellie's story.
Its a huge failure.
@@WarpChaos After you beat the game, the start screen changed to sunrise and shows firefly base in the light.
So Abby literally gets the happy ending and light represents her end of the story.
Ellie puts down her guitar and walks into the distance, alone, miserable and hopeless with no recourse.
Abby, who tortured a stranger after saving her life and enjoyed killing scars for fun, is somehow morally grey.
@@WarpChaos you projecting your views into the creators is the problem, you just take away the most uncharitable conclusions for the characters and then get mad at it
@@WarpChaos you are the one mad at a piece of media lol it can't hurt you
I honestly can't decide which is a worse experience: Last of Us 2, The Last Jedi, or the ending of Game of Thrones.
Find me the people defending the ending to Game of Thrones with as much passion and thought as defenses of the other two?
Your inability to see the difference doesn't flatter your crusade.
The Last of Us part 2 has some of the worst pacing I’ve witnessed in a game. The game's attempts to have you sympathize with Abby and her crew are so blatantly manipulative and fall so flat. The mid-game ability and weapon reset hurts one of the game's few positive aspects. I could go on but time and a reply have only reaffirmed how bad I think this game is.
Honestly this, TLOU2 tries hard to manipulate you into feeling bad about your actions like killing the dog via QTE then seeing Abby happily playing with it in a flashback but jokes on them I felt nothing since the game doesn't give me an option and I am emotional divorced from Elle's actions
That and like how many dogs have you killed at this point? One more isn't going to change anything no matter the amount of manipulation.
I felt worse killing random NPC enemies then any of Abby's crew
Good for you, I think is a pretty good game
None of this bothered my by any means tho. In fact I liked them
The complains about pacing are severely overstated in my opinion. The only plausible critiques of the pacing are the ones that are about the switch to Abby and the epilogue. Other than that, the pacing is fine. Both Ellie’s and Abby’s section individually are paced well, but looking at the whole game, I can see people’s issues with the switch to Abby in terms of the overall pacing. But I personally don’t think the pacing is the worst ever.
what a fantastic video. you've encapsulated my thoughts about this game and them some so well. i adore both of these games and i'm truly sad that so many seem to look for reasons to hate on part II when really they just never gave it a real chance. (a lot of fair criticism aside) thanks for spreading the good word. i hope you got some people to replay it with a more open mind.
part 2 is a terrible game
The Last of Us Part 1 is a game that made me enjoy all the characters. The Last of Us Part 2 is a game that made me hate all the characters. Part two has good gameplay and Graphics but I honestly couldn't give two shits about anyone at the end of that game with exception of maybe lev and Tommy and even then I didn't find them that compelling by the end. When it was all over I hated Ellie and I hated Abbey and I honestly didn't care if either one of them died. It's a pretty unique thing to make me hate a character I once loved but dammit if Neil didn't succeed. I think the only way I'd be interested in a part 3 is if it was just about a whole new set of characters because I don't give a crap about these people anymore.
I rather ND never make another unless they have something unique up their sleeve we are up to our necks in zombie games and having it continue with new characters with more potential sequels is just meh.
Why didn’t you hate Lev and Tommy? They was accomplices!
I say that not as a hater, I loved all the characters and I think your reasoning for disliking them is perfectly valid. I’m just trying to push the envelope a bit
@@someguy9345 I didn't hate Tommy because I can understand his reasoning for wanting Revenge for Joels death. Much like Joel he was already past the point of being a truly redeemable person so I feel his character wasn't mishandled when he went on a Warpath. And lev isn't involved in the whole revenge plot and is just more of an outcast so I didn't really have any reason to hate the character.
A weird take there. Did these characters bully you or something? Why do you hate them lol?
@@FraserSouris it's not really a weird take they're just very unlikable irredeemable people.
Or, you can say a game is good or bad and leave it at that. It’s an opinion; You HAVE to understand that no matter how people talk about any piece of media, it will always, ALWAYS be their opinion, no matter what, whether they like it or not.
Additionally, I see way more folks complaining about people hating the TLOU series than people hating the TLOU series.
Then you are not reading even this comment section
It being good and bad are statements of quality. Whether you liked it or not is subjective.
People can like bad games, movies, or tv shows.
People can not like good games, movies, or tv shows.
Your feelings have nothing to do with the actual quality of something.
@GerardoFirestorm lmao right. Are they blind? This comment section is 90% hating on the game
You can still express the fact you disagree with someone's opinion and poke holes in their argument.
To be fair Abbey wanted revenge 7 years later, Ellie was willing to drop it after a few days!!! Abbey is not a good person, she knowingly put all her friends at risk just for revenge, many year's later in that world? Ridiculous
This is untrue.
@@ClickClickFrick lol okay buddy
Here's the thing with the Last of Us Part 2, it's a game heavily focused on the narrative. Yes, if we're going to go off the gameplay improvements and the graphic and audio fidelity compared to the first one, I would consider this a masterpiece. However, the story, which is the main pillar of the franchise and the game itself is why I don't like Part 2. If Neil and the writing team rearranged a lot of the events in-game and in some cases cut certain story acts to make the narrative flow better and logically make sense to the viewer playing the game, that would've made the game a 10/10 for me.
We not misunderstood the story is ass 😂😂😂
Yeah, I'm really disappointed... 😢
Complete and utter ass
So are your speaking skills
Bro didn’t watch the video
You said that Ellie doesn't enjoy the killing, but I faintly remember hearing her sound grissly satisfied after she offed some people while I was playing as her.
Like, she would slice someone's throat open, and then she'd say "Mmmm, yeh!!!" almost estatic like.
You are insane that never happens😭😭
@@nico_m4I remember she would sometimes say something like "Fucker..." or "Dick." when you would kill an enemy. I think it does happen sometimes.
@ElectrikStatik900 well that's life and death overcoming your opposition, adrenaline and seeing red, being verbalized as "better you than me"
@@ElectrikStatik900that definitely happened. I’m not really a *gamer* per say, but I remember playing it & was like *damn, this game is violent as hell* Rage, anger, etc
From Ellie's perspective, every combat encounter isn't just a natural progression of a video game, but a desperate fight for survival. Focus, anger, and elation at completing the task of not dying are all she's gonna feel with all that adrenaline pumping through her. It doesn't necessarily reflect on who she is as a character.
I’ve only just come across your channel and your videos on TLOU. I don’t think you’ll read this but if you do, I just wanted to say I hope you find peace with your former self. That person, did the best they could under the circumstances. I hope that you forgiveness.
On Ellie and Joel, as we mature we develop a perception of the world that is more in line with truth. One of the harder truths to accept is the flaws of our parents. They are just imperfect human beings. Despite probably knowing all along, this truth was revealed the day she cut Joel off. Ellie was made to wrestle with the fact that Joel stole from her the one thing she believed to be her calling.
Great work man! Appreciate the video!
My favorite J's Review Video. I should of posted this comment when the video came out, I saw it when it came out, and I've rewatched this video a few times and love it, still hit's pretty hard.
Thank you for saying that Joel was a different person since he was living in a "civilization" for a number of years making him not as hard as he was in the first game.
I thought I was the only one who thought that :)
I love the visuals
I love the gameplay
I f*cking hate the story
Facts
Gameplay is mad fun
The story is OKAY , i think the main thing is that part 1’s story is SO good that almost anything couldn’t live up to the hype . The one thing about TLOU2 that upsets me is there’s no factions
Everyone is gonna watch a UA-cam video in like 2 years and let them decide that this game is good and the story is good.
this but it do be a story driven game
I’m heading through this now for the first time. Game is incredible. Some pacing problems, and a few contrivances? Sure, but I just love being in this world, and the journey of its two protagonists is beautifully explored.
I just wanted to say well done. I loved this video. And I agree both games are amazing and it made me want to replay both. I look forward to a Part 3 if we ever get one. Joel not being in the Last of us is going to be boggling but I am sure naughty dog will figure it out. Stay positive and congrats on your growth (and weight loss I know how hard it is when eating is a coping mechanism. don't give up) I look forward to your next video take care.
Completely disagree with that opening statement but I'll watch the video and let you cook
EDIT: yeah no I just can't agree with most of these points. Lots of reaching to justify the strange story decisions and false marketing. I respect your opinion but calling it misunderstood is not true, everyone knows why this game sucks. Are they toxic about it? Sure, but I don't like the weird gaslight approach defenders of this game seem to take.
And yes, the doctor was originally black. Debugs have proven it. Not sure why you had to lie about that.
I don't believe in the whole false marketing stuff. MSG 2 make people believe they would play other character, it was the only path kojima found to make people interested in playing the game. It then turned out to be one of the best game of all time. False Marketing would be if ND said this game would be a FPS with werewolves.
Also, why people go through such lengths to verified the race of the doctor in the original? Is this even matter? If the devs wish to keep the Doc black they would do it, and abby would probably b black too. I don't know when the casting for TLOU 2 started and I don't care, and I honestly think that considering all things to discuss about this franchise, this is just stupid.
While I’ve never suffered something as traumatic as a loved one’s murder I tend to suffer a lot of self loathing over failures the “if I had done something differently” mentality. I appreciate you highlighting that through that analysis. It provides some comfort for me moving forward
I don't think Abby ever understood... she had a choice in saying she would sacrifice her life, ellie never did
Some people are definitely petty, but I don’t think leaving a big comment that’s negative about something makes you petty. If a franchise you love does something pretty bad of course you’d be pissed about it and vent your frustrations.
This is the best analysis of the game I’ve seen. Even after all these years, I’m still processing this game, because as with you the first one is my favorite game ever. Keep up the amazing work!
I agree with most things you said except for how Abby is presented. Abby’s section of the campaign comes across as very emotionally manipulative such as the WLF dog. The creators of TLOS2 said you’d never have to kill a dog in the campaign but as Ellie it is mandatory and then they immediately have you play with that exact dog as to say “Abby good, Ellie bad”. The problem with it all is that if you feel both characters are justified for wanting revenge then no player will ever care for Abby and her section. So you never stop see it as it’s a new perspective, because arguably they are the same perspective “revenge” and when you invest the player in Ellie’s revenge only to remove that option from them the game feels like it’s message rings hollow and the story picked a favorite that being Abby.
Maybe it's because I don't hold the same level of love/protectiveness of animals like a lot of people seem to do; but I just can't understand the "Abby protect dog, Ellie kill dog" bit.
@@aceofsharks9837 it’s the cheapest way to get players to go “I can’t believe you killed an animal! Let alone a dog! You’re bad and now I hate you cuz I fucking love dogs and dogs are always innocent!” Same thing with Mel, the pregnant lady. Get you to hate Ellie because she killed a pregnant lady. It’s all lazy writing
@@voids4818 Hmm. Guess I just formulate my opinions on characters differently. Like, I never grew to hate Ellie at any point. Every big moment of tragedy/horror just made me think about how it'll weigh on her mind, rather than reshaping my view of her. I came to care about Abby equally to how I cared about Ellie in the first game, though.
Abby had just as much of a reason to kill Ellie in the theater but she let's her go, and nobody says anything. Ellie let's Abby go and everybody freaks out.
And they're not painting one side as good or bad. Ellie kills the dog and Abby's friends and Abby kills Jesse, Joel and shoots Tommy and was going to kill Dina. How is that Ellie bad, Abby good?
Personally a bigger issue with sympathising with Abby is that we forget her father’s organization were not remotely good people. Sure they might’ve had good intentions, but good intentions don’t justify horrible actions, they including Abby’s father was fully willing to dissect and kill a unconscious young girl without her consent or say on the matter for a maybe cure that wasn’t 100% guaranteed. Hard for me to feel bad about Abby’s father’s death when her father was a horrible person.
I feel like this game's story is okay. The problem I have is the pacing and structure.
I think Ellie and Abby's campaigns should've been in a rotation, maybe 3 hours with Ellie then 3 hours with Abby, and so on.
Also if they wanted to make the player truly feel bad for killing those on the opposing sides, give us an option to spare or atleast sneak around our enemies, ESPECIALLY if you're going to have a mechanic where foes will beg for their lives.
I can only imagine the like/dislike ratio 😂
53% dislikes, damn
Haters that probably didnt watched the damn video.
If only the Dislikes weren't disabled...
@@superlombax1561 Y'all DO KNOW you can reenable them, right?
Just a quick heads up for future commenters.
I get the feeling a good portion of the comments I’m reading are written before they even finish the majority of the video or simply based off the title alone. Not all of them obviously.
I have plenty of my fair share of gripes and criticisms for this game but this has been one of the better video analysis of this game so far so I hope you all can actually keep an open mind.
Please be kind, you don’t have to agree with each other in order to be respectful. Thank you ^-^
Unfortunately, they'd rather prove how their anger controls them.
Most of the hate Comments they didn't even watch the video just saw the title. Props to you for being one of the few rational people that actually gives criticism unlike the idiots where their criticism is "WoKe, nEiL sAiD ThIs" nonsense. It's so bad that people would rather discuss games with casuals then so called "fans" gamers need to do better
You talking about how people who act toxic and mean-spirited are just miserable with their own lives kinda reminds me of Clement's review of Sonic 06. In that review, sure, he made some good points, but it was laced with him saying things like: "f*ck the people who say "X/Y about 06 wasn't that bad or just fine, or just outright saying things like: "f*ck you, game!" That, mixed with the yelling and screaming in the video was also a bit much for a game review. He even stated near the end of the review and in his "Why I Like Sonic" video that one of the reasons 06 burned him so bad was because apparently he was going through some tough times during high school (from what I heard, it wasn't even anything super crazy, just him dealing with alot of homework and stuff, but I don't know everything about his personal life, so maybe there's more to it) and said he just wanted to have a good time to make up for how terrible high school was. I'm not saying that if his life was better, then he would've loved the game, because this is 06 we're talking about here, a game that's easy to hate, but it really does feel like he applied his personal problems to his experience with that game and it almsot felt like just a way for him to vent and release his anger out about high school, with him being mean-spirited towards people who say anything positive about 06 other than the music. I think he took it a little bit too seriously. I don't hate Clement or anything, but it's just something I noticed when I watched that review in full, recently.
I had the exact same realization about him a few years ago. I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed that in his Why I Like Sonic video.
Damn haven’t seen like any of your vids since your god tier DCAU stuff. UA-cam was doing you dirty on my end. Granted those aren’t topics I’m necessarily interested in but you think watching 50+ hours of a channel would keep that in your algorithm. Still doing amazing work man keep it up.
Hey J, I don’t think you’ll respond to this comment, but Capcom released a survey for resident evil fans to fill out in their website and asking them which resident evil game should be remake next. So if you want that Resident Evil Code Veronica remake this is your chance. Good video by the way.
My experience with this series is odd. I played the first game, but lost interest and never finished it, not that the first game was bad, it just wasnt my cup of coffee. I wound up using it for a trade-in later.
I started to hear about part 2 from various content creators, mostly bc of the story leaks and all the coverage about the crunch going on at ND. And all these content creators are talking about how awful this game is, and how no one should buy it, and Abby is a monster, and Drukman is a hack writer, etc. It became so ingrained in me that im supposed to hate this game that whenever someone brought it up, my first instinct was to get mad about a game ive never played and have zero interest in playing. To be honest, this video has helped me to let go of these resentments because again, im not into these games and am not interested in going back to them. Im indifferent to the series at best.
But I will be forever salty that TLOU2 robbed Ghost of Tsushima of the awards it rightly deserved! XD
@@William5000000 Dude, are you MAD! Ghost of Tsushima was clearly the best game of 2020 and is an incredible stand-alone game. IMO, the journey of the character was handled so organically with great music, artsyle, combat, charecters, custimization and top tier storytelling. It was def robbed.
Another 'average game' is an insult, just say it wasn't your cup of tea.
ok, a lot of great games came out in 2020.
All of them at some point deserved game of the year. TLOU2 made people mad to emphasise us vs them mentality, final fantasy remade a beloved game to introduce new people to the franchise while keeping old fans happy, doom eternal perfected doom 2016 and was a good ass game. Animal crossing came out at a time people needed it to it provided comfort and social interaction to people because we couldnt go outside. Hades provided a game with a constant addicting gameplay loop for people to get lost in...
Ghost wasnt robbed it just came out in a packed year where games did soo much so this notion of ghost being robbed is lost because all games that year DESERVED that title...
@@William5000000 I was joking with my last comment (I figured the 'xD' on the end would make that apparent).
@@koolerman4443 It wasn't cinematic enough, it had too much gameplay and it didn't look like an hollywood movie, so it wasn't a good enough "moviegame" for the casual audience and the viodegaming critics, sadly.
@@koolerman4443 Its just another open world game,nothing special
In a story/character focused game where the story is bad and the characters are annoying, that makes it a bad game. I've seen fan rewrites of the story that were, and I'm not exaggerating, at least 10x better.
Let me guess. Joel doesn't die in those rewrites? Lol
@@lukerne9260 Typically he does. Joel dying was never the issue, it's the way he died. That shouldn't have to be explained to every single person who did like the game. It was just poor writing. If Druckmann didn't fire ND's lead writer Amy Henning, I can almost guarantee that the game would have been great.
@@Fullmetal1776but Amy Hennig had nothing to do with the first game.
@@Fullmetal1776 Amy Hennig being fired by Neil is a rumor there was never any confirmation i ever found unless i am wrong.
I could’ve sworn i even read somewhere where she herself said she wasn’t fired she quit on her own.
Oh rewrites to cater to their whims. Oh boo hoo, a game did not pan out the way it did in my head. These people are a step away from becoming Annie Wilkes. All they need to do is kidnap and torture Neil Druckmann because he is the devil who ruined their game. Fan rewrites, really? what a joke.
1000% agree with your J. Stories like these take time to truly come to appreciate. I hope more gamers around the world will decide to give it another shot and see the story for what it really is.
If Ellie dies in the first 2 hours and I have to play as Abby for the rest of the game I’m not playing
The problem is with Abby is that one she and her are completely unsympathetic considering that Jerry was willing to kill an unconscious Ellie for the suppose sake of humanity but when he was question by Mel if he would do it if Abby was the one on the table and he hesitates and never gives Mel an answer meanwhile Abby is listening to this and agrees with his plan. This is also based the fact that Ellie never give consent to them to do this. This kinda makes Joel actions against the firefly’s pretty justified since they were willing to sacrifice someone just for thier happiness and yet Joel is somehow the bad guy in this story for doing the same thing? Not too much mention how pretty inconsistent Abby is like Joel saves her from a zombie horde but then bashes his brain in but she doesn’t do the same to two Scar children, a group that she has hated for years, kill thier members and even condone killing said children. And there is the fact that Abby never gets punished for her revenge.
Abby's revenge got a bunch of her friends killed. Including Owen, who she still clearly loved. I'd say that's pretty harsh punishment.
@@commie_maybe one, Abby immediately abandons WLF and even call them "you people" clearly casting aside any feelings for them for a person she barely met. With Owen she pretty venomously told him to get over his trauma meanwhile has spent years searching for Joel and the game pretty much acts she was justified. With Mel, she was pretty much cheating on her husband while she was pregnant. It pretty obviously that Abby plays with "Loosely".
That wasn’t Mel it was Marlene
Abby has a personal hatred towards Joel there is a reason why she would bash his head in.
She may dislike Scars but its clear Abby has always had doubts about the cause she fights for and its like a war dude its not that personal she kills to defend and conquer she doesn’t personally hate them enough to torture them like Joel also they were kids too.
@@MrSupersmash93 Its probably implied that Abby only was close to her friends she never actually liked the WLF or its cause similar to Owens deal.
She and her group probably joined them because it was a big resource filled militia to be fair.
I'm going to save anything that I have to say about the story, because I've talked about this game far longer than I should have, and I'm done trying to explain why the story is bad. If people got a better experience out of it than me, then whatever. However, I will say this, Laura Bailey did not deserve the hate she got for this role. She's wonderful, still one of the best female voice talents in the industry, and on behalf of the overall community, I apologize to her for the backlash she received. And the other thing I want to say, is that this game should not have won game of the year. Not because I think it's a bad, but because a game that caused so much hatred, so much arguing, and literally split an entire fanbase in half, should not have won. So many people were hurt and angry because of this game, and caused so many people to attack each other because they either liked it or hated it. Ghost Of Tsushima, a game that came out the same year, had nothing but universal praise and did nothing, but bring people together to talk about how awesome it was. I also hate calling media a masterpiece. The only thing that I would say in the last 5+ years that could genuinely be called a masterpiece, was Into The Spider-Verse. Nothing is perfect, and a game as flawed as TLOU2, certainly should not be called, a masterpiece.
Popularity isn't an objective measure of quality.
Love the vid and also loved your recent vid on whether or not joel was right. I gotta say it’s very easy to relate to this story for a lot of people because of just how real the dialogue is between the characters. Obviously none of us have had beef like Ellie did with Joel for killign a bunch of people but we all have probably had our moments of rage at something a parent did. For myself I remember my mother caused something that led to a falling out between myself and a girl I was dating when I was younger and she was my first love and I struggled for a long time to truly forgive my mom for what happened but like you said how Ellie not talking to joe caused her nothing but pain it was the same with my mom until I forgave her. Again it’s nothing to much like the game but just that moment where a parent did something for a right or wrong reason but in the end they do care about you and never wanted to hurt you. That to me is one of the big points of this story joel never wanted to hurt Ellie but him lying did and he faced the consequences for it.
I don't know that this video aged well given the first one I've watched was more recent and about Joel making the right call in the first game. Ironically, the comment I left there referenced how the apologists for this game present it in a way that is beautifully moving and realistic, but once more, people try to galvanize "how dare you not like I what I like" without looking in the mirror. From the ending of the first game, before even a whisper of the sequel was considered, I felt the story was complete. People need to accept the end of things being ambiguous and uncertain, because that is life. A second story in the series would've been better served with a new cast of characters or at the least, exploring Ellie coming to terms with the truth of what Joel did.
Now that happens in this game, but at the cost of intentionally inflicting pain to the player and following up with a heavy handed justification. The notion of exploring what happened in the first game doesn't require Joel to die, but even if it is the right call to make, intersecting these things was done poorly from many accounts. So much so, that I refute the classic misdirect/avoidance tactic to declare criticism as trolling. I don't care that there are pieces of shit that do it, because it happens from all sides of the aisle. Tune them out and focus on what is really going on. It was a sequel that was mishandled and only by looking at it in specific lights, does it make sense. It still doesn't vindicate it, but that doesn't mean people can't like it and it doesn't mean that it will cease to exist.
Just like in real life, we're subjected every day to the consequences seen and unseen by choices made, whether they are our own or the product of others. Let what is, be. When I see people "defend" a game or movie, they are not really defending it, they are defending their own opinion from others and I think it's important to call it what it is. Analyses should be objective and left for interpretation of the viewer, not an essay that amounts to little more than "I like thing, please like it too".
It's not misunderstood, we just dislike the characters/story. Which is the whole point why you play TLOU2.
thats the point.. ALOT of people love tlou2 for its charchters and story. and we easily think its misunderstood
@@teamwork_videogamer Bingo!!!!
The "Return UA-cam Dislikes" extension is very useful for videos like this.
What’s the current count?
@@juanddg4737 (for some reason my reply is deleted) it's 522 likes vs 454 dislikes. Install the extension, it's a helpful feature.
@@juanddg4737 Balanced, as all things should be.
Because it validates your hivemind?
I'm not against the extension btw, just making an observation.
TLOU2 really isn't that bad.
If the lie in tlou1 was the catalyst for tlou2, then the apology in this game is the catalyst for tlou3.
Please tell me what the song you use when you rant
This had to be one of my most favorite video games reviews ever. I’m one of the few who actually really loves this game and yo put everything into words so perfectly, I also relate A LOT to not taking for granted someone who truly loves you with all of their heart until they’re gone. It’s something I try to remind myself of with my father when we get into disputes. Anyone can disappear at any moment in life so make sure you enjoy that time with them because they won’t be there forever
This is my first time on the channel and i typically don't leave multiple comments but I'm choosing to for your vids. Just watched the truth section of your vid and wow, just wow. That's an amazing story of rising above personal issues and how you reflected on your own experiences. It's tough to bring up certain things, a very difficult decision to make in regards to including the outside in your art. There is certainly a fine line but hopefully, someone will see this and appreciate the gesture. 👏💪🔥🙌
One more note, I'm your 200k subscriber! Congratulations on hitting that milestone 🎉
I've played it twice and I'll play it again when the PC version comes out. Mostly because I think it's one of the best action games ever made. Kind of crazy that all people want to talk about is story when the gameplay is that good
Nice to see that this video's about as polarizing as the game itself
This was a really nice video dude, thanks for giving your perspective and going into things in a very genuine way.
Okay, before I write my critisism about this game, I don't like that toxic culture too, it just ruins solid argument and discussion opurtunities. Nowadays its all around you are PC vs you are delusional conspiracy theorist. You can't properly argue about anything. Can I argue about this game's story? Can I say anything about Abby's design? People shouldn't judge others for their opinions. Of course, people shouldn't turn it a personal attack. Sending death threats to voice actress or director is dumbest thing I've ever heard. By the way that resident evil 4 remake comment is hilarious, yeah, most people haven't played it when it come first because it was a freaking gamecube exclusive and saying they suck at the game, come on dude it is easiest game in the franchise. Here is another thing, unlike you I never liked RE4, I was a classic fixed camera style fan, back than I was very vocal about it, I did many heated arguments with RE4 fanboys, now I see my hate for RE4 is ridiculous and empty. I changed and not really care anymore and I still dislike RE4. You shouldn't ashame from your old videos, everybody has that kind of period in life, hating everything and being harsher, just move on. Lastly seeing these RE4 fanboys meltdown is sweet revenge, they blamed classic lover wearing nostalgia googles and blind to everything but who are blind now?
Now for last of us, I always heard that game, wanna try it but after the part II controversy I became hesitant. Thankfully PS+ come fr my help. I played first game, it is okay just not my cup of tea. While gameplay is not my cup of tea but on the other hand I really liked story up until finale part. Games final part sucks. Neil Druckman claim whatever he want about cure but I'm not buying it. Firefly has full of shit, their plan have zero success rate. That's why I never tought Joel is wrong in his final actions. Now problem is making a sequel based around that decision. They couldn't sell the idea Joel is wrong the whole time. Because they created a distopian apocalypse that no hope. Could cure heal Critters or Bloaters? Absolutely not, they can't gave them shot without dieing. How could they distribute this cure, is other factions don't gonna try take it for their adventages? There are so many questions remain. By the way is Ellie's ofsprings become immune as well? They made her lesbian but she still could bear child, without experiments they immediately tried to chop her. And developers really tought I should feel sympathy for this hack of a doctor.
Now for part II's plot, I get interested thanks to excellent adaptation, I looked more about the part II's story but everything I heard not make it any good. I should say it first Abby's design sucks. What the hell is this hulking monster ? She seriously looks like a male, maybe she was a male in first drafts but they changed female. If that character was a male, maybe story would be better. Or make her transgender, I have n problem with that as well, actually how Lev could be transgender? It is a complicated operation, at least Abby's father is a doctor he could change Abby. Okay enough with design argument. Biggest problem of this game the revenge plot. Honestly, it makes no sense. This world is dark depressive hell hole, peoples make everthing fr survival, many people did so much atrocity, people thinking about revenge is just silly idea. Even in first game Joel and Tommy fall apart and not saw each other years, they didn't know each other alive or death, now you trying to say if one of em killed other one tried to take revenge. Nope, I don't buy it, firefly caused deaths, other factions caused deaths now peoples suddenly go revenge madness while there are tons of monsters out there. Abby's motivation is not belivable, her friends motivation is not belivable they are suddenly go for a revenge trip and risking their lifes because they are friends. Abby killing Joel not makes sense becuase he saved her minutes ago, none of her friends bring this or tried to stop her. That's why I have no sympathy for her group. Ellie's eye for eye case makes a little sense but still not great either. Joel never want her endanger herself and she defeated in conflict and spared second time. After all that shit she went for revenge again for the cost of leaving Dina. Ellie turned straight up horrible person and after all that nonesense she spared Abby. She killed so many less guilty people. Sorry, but this story is horrible.
You know you actually fixed main problem of story in your review. Abby didn't know about cure and made it for personal revenge. Why not make it about cure? These people could be remnants of fireflies or relatives. You could make them belive cure so much that their life ruined because of Joel's action. Abby not have to be that stupid doctor's daughter, she could be random guard or even better one of the nurse's daughter. They were much more innocent than that fraud doctor. Maybe this doctor gave everybody false hope, Abby and her co. had infected relatives and desperately waiting for a cure and fireflies gave them false hope after all fireflies are full of shit. It was a much belivable scenario, now you have people truely hate Joel and risk their life for revenge. After they killed Joel make them realise fireflies giving them false hope, make Abby's redemption much more belivable.
They wanted to make a vaccine which would stop people turning, not a cure which would reverse the infection.
firstly, sorry for my bad english, and secondly this comment will be very long.
I remember Neil saying that they wanted people or to hate or to love the game, but never to just find mid, and ironically, this is exactly my spot, it's a 7 out of ten for me.
First about the story, the are a lot of problems with logic and consistency.
For example, Joel's death, in that scene he agile very strange, how did he trust these guys? , it seems that the developers just wanted to finish him off quickly to continue the story, and I know, that he may have changed and become more innocent, but the palyer never sees that, you never have a phase or talk about someone saying that Joel has changed, I know that not everything has to be said, but in this case I think it would help a lot, at that time I just kept thinking "Why are you trusting this people so much?"
I think if he were caught off guard, without going into a room with a lot of armed people, maybe in the forest just being kidnapped, it would worked better.
Another thing, i couldn't connect with , Jesse and Dina, I think they act like sidekicks, in the first game the other characters had their own goals and stories, that's why it was so cool to follow them, for example Tess wanting Joel to continue the journey even when he didn't want to, or Henry abandoning Joel to his death, in this game the characters seem to just follow Elli agreeing with what she’s doing, and because they don't talk much and Ellie passes most of the time alone, it just make it worse, it would be nice to have a scene with Dina saying why she is following Ellie, why she is so important to her, what she thinks about Joel's decision, etc, if i'm jumping something that she or other characters said that deny what i'm talking about, please say.
In the Abby campaign, I liked the characters more, Owen, Lev and Yara, because they had their own stories, they disagreed with Abby, fought with each other, commented on what they thought of the situation, these were the things I miss Ellie's pespective.
Ellie in this game, i don't hate her but the fact that she lost her funny way makes her felt more boring, and this makes it worse in parts like exploration because there's no dialogue in this parts like the first one
And i really believe that Tommy was not handed well, I think his character is underutilized, it would be nice to see what he thinks about Joel.
The way he changed in the end is strange, like "hey, I know we almost died on the last adventure, and now you have a family, but could you go and avenge us?"
to see it in contrast to him at the beginning is just weird, i think that if he was presented earlier in Ellie's campaign and having him talking with Dina and Jesse, world make him work better in my opinion.
About Abby, I like her character, I agree on some points that the game forces you to like her in some cases (Ellie kills dogs, abby pet dogs, I'm not saying that Ellie shouldn't kill dogs, but maybe make Abby dosen't play with them would made this a lot less forced, maybe it's just me nitpicking), and her gamepaly is also more fun, like having better characters, better weapons and better parts.
But there are things in her story that don't make sense to me, the pregnant woman, I really don't see a good reason, I know they are at war and need doctors, but she is eight months pregnant, she could have nausea in the middle of the fight, I know they said they didn’t expect an attack, but in that world would they risk it, and making her sit in the back of the truck, really?
The scene with Abby and owen kissing, is bizarre, I know they are showing that they are only human, but the scene goes and goes, I think they should have cut the scene earlier, and the way they start is like .. ., wtf ?, they were fighting and suddenly they kiss, it seems unreal, like in a romance instead of a game with a realistic proposal, but the reason I really don't like this scene is because it overshadows a scene in the beginning, when Owen says why he killed the other guy, this speech is soo good, did something I wanted in the Ellie campaign, gave the other characters depth, Owen is a guy who just wanted to be happy in this horrible world, he was tired of the army's life and all this bullshit war, and this scene clarifies that, for a few seconds later they bang in a weird way, it makes me sad, because a lot of people seem to ignore this and just focus on the sex.
Abby killing her own group, I know she says "you are my people" to Lev, but she could at least say something when you start killing WLFs, I'm not saying that she had to regret killing them (or Joel, I don’t think it’s a mistake that she didn’t regret after killing him, Joel for her, it was just a guy who killed her father), my problem is that she said nothing, I wish I could have heard what she thought at that time.
Continuing talking about Abby, something that I think is strange is why making the doctor the reason for her revenge, and not Marlene, for me to make Marlene become her maternal figure and symbol of hope, and then have it all destroyed because of Joel, would make the story better in my opinion, would definitely make people stop saying, "all this because a random doctor had a strong daughter", I think they did it because they wanted joel's exact decision to save Ellie to be the reason for Abby's revenge, but Marlene's murder was just like that, but worse, because unlike the doctor, he could let her live, he killed her in cold blood, so I think it would make people like her more.
Making the doctor a nice guy who likes animals, was kind of forced in my opinion, making Marlene Abby's "mother" would make things more natural.
About characters deaths, I know that the world of the last of us is apocalyptic and characters die out of nowhere, but in the first game it was not like that, in the first game if someone died it was not out of nowhere, death was well built and always made the story ahead somehow, in the second game, deaths happen out of nowhere without warning, and some of them don't make any difference (like Manny, his character could be removed from the entire game and it wouldn't make a difference) .
The tone of the game is much darker than the first, it certainly upset some people, in my opinion they should have done it gradually, start the game with the tone of the first game and then slowly make it darker until the end become totally dark.
About the end, I was indifferent, (not in the fight part, I wanted Ellie to stop a lot, but in the last scene), i was like "is that it ?!", because in the first game you have characters and you have message,and in the in the end everything is resolved, you know how the characters are and the message about love and moving on trauma is resolved , in the second no, you have the revenge plot being resolved, but the characters not, you don't know what will happen to Abby after she leaves Ellie, (maybe she found the fireflies, but then why not there was a scene right at the end?) and Ellie, the only thing I could think of at the end was: "now I have to wait another seven years to know what will happen to them", it's not a conclusive ending like the first one.
About the gameplay stuff, I have a theory, because they made the story so different from the first game, they made the gameplay similar to the first, without daring too much, the combat is better, of course, but everything is so similar, the new zombies are not that different, just two new tipes.
other example, fighting humans and zombies in the same area, you only have this 4 times in the entire game, maybe 5, but it is very little.
And also the pace, the first game was shorter and there’s more variety in what you do, in this game, if you’re going to explore, you explore for a long time, without fun dialogues like the first one and with a lot less puzzles (that "open world" area for example, I think it was boring, it would be nice if there were patrols for example "), the game is sometimes boring, and bored was something I never went to in the first game.
that's it, my complete analysis, you can disagree with anything i said, and sorry for any english mistakes, it's not my native language.
No creo que 7 de 10 sea muy mid. Podés tener emociones fuertes con un juego que es solo un 7
Brother. I have noticed you've lost weight and although I never saw it as a thing to focus on, I'm glad you are self improving and you're at a better place. Kudos to you bud .
The backlash this game got just shows people didnt actually play the first game for its gameplay...
I have to say I completely disagree with your assessment of Joel's death. At least the execution of it.
1. Just because he is in a better mind set now then before doesn't mean he's less cautious and more trusting.
A) there's a difference between trading with people inside your home base. Where you have the home field advantage with lots of security. Its another when surrounded by well armed strangers while with your brother you care for immensely. This is not a situation Joel or Tommy should be letting their gaurds down.
B) it was never shown that Joel was the type to risk himself or those he cares about to save someone else. Especially not someone with a horde of clickers on top of them
In fact it's the opposite, Joel is the type to make cruel choices to take care of the people he loves. All the way up to the end of the first game. And if this characteristic is changed in that time in between and isn't shown to us adequately, and this is one of the factors that gets him killed the way he is. Thats bad writing. You don't get to change one of a characters core traits in a time jump to allow something of major consequence.
C)arguably he should be more protective and untrusting, because he has more to protect and more to lose. It's not just his survival and well being he has to worry about, but a whole community. Including his surrogate daughter, brother, and sister in law.
D)He doesn't live in general peace and security. He often goes out on patrols. So he still often faces life and death situations. Whether that be clickers or raiders. So he should still be very cautious, especially around strangers.
2. Even if he had no reason to suspect an ambush (despite being surrounded by well armed strangers, with the knowledge of raiders around Jackson) he should've been prepared for one. Taken some precautions like
A) not leaving his weapons equipment behind (which absolutely could have changed the outcome, especially in conjunction with my next few points)
B)not stand in the middle of all these strangers he just met, allowing himself to be surrounded. He could've put his back to a corner. Allowing him to keep an eye on as many people as possible. And as soon as they seem to get suspicious he is the first person to be armed. Which even if outnumbered gives him some advantage.
C) don't go into the other room with all the other people, and stay with the horses. Your means of transportation and a quick get away in case things go south.
D) dont go into the house. The zombies were already behind a gate, unable to reach you. Going into the house allows you to just become more vulnerable.
If Joel had just done the first one, he probably still would've died. Just not as long and painfully. Likely being shot after taking out at least one person himself. Completely changing the story.
If he did the first two, it would likely be similar, but with one or two more kills before going down.
If he had done three, the chances of survival are possible. If he's quick and lucky, him and Tommy could possibly escape. Though not likely. But again he wouldn't have died slow and painfully.
If he had done all four, the likelihood of survival sky rockets.
All of these foundationaly change how things went down.
3. You don't address multiple contrivances and full on holes that lead to Joel's death
A)the odds of Joel and Abby being in the same place at any point in this blizzard. If Joel and Tommy had gone out an hour later or an hour earlier. Or decided to take a different turn. Or if Abby and her friends arrived a day earlier or a day later. All of this wouldn't have happened. It was astronomically lucky that she bumped into him.
B)the horde happens to leave an openening leading to the cabin. Any other direction and they would have been fine.
C) Tommy giving out their real names to a stranger. Despite knowing that many people might have a vendetta against him and his brother. Especially his brother who massacred a bunch of people from an extremist group. You'd think they'd come up with a contingency for this. Like using faje names while on patrol. Or hell just start going by different names. Making you almost impossible to find in a world like this. As this is one reason Abby finds a lead.
4. Id say he absolutely regrets it. Because in the end he probably thought Ellie and Tommy were next. Given Joel's character i think he'd rather go through all kinds of pain and suffering so that Ellie could be safe and happy. Yet in his final moments as he stared into her eyes he was probably blaming himself. Because of one action he caused his daughter to die again. He died thinking he failed to protect the person he loved the most, again. That he failed Sarah, again. Despite all he's learned. Despite all he did to survive. He definitely didn't think those four years were worth this. That because of one stupid choice Ellie would never get to be his age, to have a family, to see the world get better. I bet those last few seconds were just as painful (emotionally) as the day he lost Sarah. If not more.
All in all. You're just wrong about the context of his death. It is horribly written making no sense. You seem to have made the same mistake many of the initial defenders did. Instead of focusing on the execution and thinking deeper than the first explanation given and whether theh really make sense, you focus on the intent. Ignoring a lot of contrivances, holes, and contradictions in character, instead focusing on "why" this happened and not the "how." Which both are needed to make it truly compelling. Because once you closly take a look at the "how" the "why" becomes meaningless and cheap.
I don’t think he’s wrong I think you’re wrong. But maybe I have to read it all again.
As for the rest of the video
@@mysticgamer476 can you give me the same courtesy as I did him and tell me how or why you think I'm wrong?
Because you just saying you disagree literally does nothing.
@@skibot9974 if that's a question. I'd say from what I remember the rest of the video is the same. I just didn't want to go over every disagreement or agreement. I felt it was better to focus on something more important and foundational to the story and his review.
As getting something as important as the set up for the story wrong negates most of the other points that stem off of it.
@@justadude3789 I didn’t think you would reply.
No just no. I wish i could see it. This is a letdown of a game. I have the $250 ellie edition. Unopen still. It has good moments but its like dlc.
Here it is folks J's most Polarizing video of ALL TIME!
Ehh, I went into this game preparing for the worst and with a massive preconceived notion about how much I'd hate it. By the end of the game, I not only ended up liking the game, but I preferred playing as Abby more than Ellie. Interestingly enough though, I find myself skipping Abby cut scenes, but watching the Ellie ones.
With the LOU2, I was one of the people who looked into the leak and found it really bad and did not want to play. Then I saw reviews and I still didn't want to play. I absolutely loved the first game. Then late in 2022, I decided to have closure and try to play the game. The gameplay still is pretty great, except you feel very inferior when playing with Ellie than Abby as your weapons aren't that great.
I honestly couldn't care less about Abby. The way the story pacing was just left a bad taste imo. At the end, I hated Ellie's decision. She had everything she could've wanted at that time, but just throws it all away .
I didn't care if Joel died. In fact I was kinda expecting him to die. But to have it in the first 15 minutes of the game, sure shock value was there, but it didn't really feel...right.
In the end, my only beef with TLOU2 was the story. Everything else was pretty solid and graphics were amazing, but the story is what drove me to play the 1st game like you said in your last video.
that WAS THE POINT!! death is never supposed to feel,"RIGHT" or "EARNED"
I remember the leaks over exaggerating some things though too.
Like i heard people say the cult was christian so therefore it was anti christian and of course Abby being trans came from that too.
@@chandllerburse737 yeah I heard that too about Abby being trans. Abby's look didn't bother me, but the other rumors/leaks were blown away out of proportion now that I think about it. I just knew a lot of people hated Abby back then because of that trans rumor.
@@teamwork_videogamer sure, again shock factor is there. But I think it would've been more impactful if it was built up and pacing of the story was different imo. I remember hearing rumors that Joel was going to die in this game, but I didn't care. Joel should die according to certain perspectives of those he hunted down or hurt.
@@Parooka People still may think shes trans i argued with a woman (stupidly on my part) for like over a day lol about how she’s clearly not meant to be trans and even when i proved it she just said she was originally suppose to be trans.
Uh oh there might be a war in the comments.
It’s already started and the video’s been out for 2 minutes!!!
Its just a game lol. I find it funny when people get so angry over things like games or movies.
Can we start playing “Duel of the Fates” from Star Wars?
This aint a war, its a massacre.
Now face the wall.
Not a war a slaughter
I couldn't get into this game at all. I got it day of release when it came out and dropped it after 4 hours due to finding it extremely boring and finding all the characters annoying and unlikeable. Just not my cup of tea.
Recently got introduced to your videos b/c I was looking for interesting game commentary that I could play in the background as I handle some chores. Seen less than a handful of your other reviews and recognized your channel. I missed the train the first time around and just beat TLOU2 a few days ago, enough to join the Part II Remaster bandwagon. Was looking for a helping hand to help me process all that surfaced from this wild story. Little did I know, that what I was hoping to find would come paired with something more. I had heard a few other breakdowns of this game and was craving something more insightful, but your seemingly benign segment of going off of script and adding your own personal confessions to this review really brought the narrative home for me.
I suffered a stroke a couple of years ago that upended my life. I am on the path of recovery but as I heal I am noticing that many of my old hurts and wounds resurfacing--things I thought I had already fully dealt with. Grief is tricky like that. Anyways, I have trouble trusting my own mind/thoughts due to my brain injury, and your thoughtful commentary and willingness to be vulnerable really helped reinforce the takeaways I got from the game. Got to relive the entire game with provoking insights and even more compelling questions. Also really appreciate your own personal message and takeaways from the game. Thanks for putting yourself out there, J. You got yourself a new subscriber 🤘
I got into your videos from your metalgear series and am still here because your personality is so genuine. It's super cool to see you have a deeper personal connection to the subject matter. Keep up the great work my guy.
I was at that PSX in 2016. Best moment ever. So much fun..I wish they'd bring PSX back.
No simply no.
For me this was the game that finally broke Naughty Dog’s back as a developer, the story is far too complicated and the length of the game is way too long and honestly the fact that Joel dies doesn’t really bother me it made me super pissed yeah but what annoyed me more was how ND enticed fans of the character back and literally dangled him in front of us so we would fork over our cash only to just kill him off and THEN make us play his killer, I will never understand how people can be fans of Abby and anyone who says she’s a better character than him is fucking delusional
It's also the reason that if Jak comes back, I want Insomniac Games at the helm.
@@Signerdragon123Jak will never come back ND only cares about the stupid tlou series and i mean even the first the fact they remade that over any other game proves to me that this series is overblown even to them
It didn't help in the marketing they showed Joel in a cutscene that was actually a different character in the final game to hide his death. But another factor to me that breaks Naughty Dog's back is also the intense crunch they went through in this game. I also feel the game is too long and would gladly have a shorter game if it meant there was less crunch for developers.
@@WarpChaos Days Gone was okay it was too generic and sold too little to be chosen that was obvious.
@@EricHernandez-vx8cv ND has done intense crunch a bunch many devs do RDR2 also did its common in the industry unfortunately
I had to let Abby die in the Ellie boss fight. Happy ending
dang I liked the on camera bits, but whatevs I also like all the bits of a J's Review
10:44 I just can't defend the 2019 state of play trailer, The whole point of that trailer and the money shot was to see Joel again and it got me SO damn excited back then, just to replace him with different character in the final game. It's such disgusting false advertising, hiding stuff like making it seem like Dina was the one to die is fine but DON'T create entirely new false scenes just to ensure sales, this trailer alone makes me despise the game even more
It was to avoid people figuring out te story, why are you so sensitive is just marketing
@@yosos2 Because they lied to me with false promises to get my money (they opened the pre-orders right after this trailer aired). Regardless of the game's quality they did not have to outright lie like this. It's deceitful and scummy.
@@szero7429All the signs were there they showed you joel coming in as a ghost first trailer they dont talk about him for ages everyone's like where's joel he probably dead people were still excited about the game.
They drum up that trailer to throw everyone off. Movies and games do this all the time are you angry at marvel movies for doing the same thing? Or even the first TLOU for saying you never play as ellie when you actually do? its just due to fact that you didnt like the direction they went in and thats fine but there was nothing wrong with the marketing. Joel is still there in some capacity thats what the trailer shows and thats what the game gives.They did not promise anything they did not deliver...unlike other games
@@szero7429 they didn't lie to you, are you a child? You have control over your own money, they showed a gameplay segment with that trailer also, apparently they did have to lie because when people found out that Joel died they lost their shit and send death threats to the creators and actors
@@yosos2 I never said I actually paid for it, thanks to the leaks that came out I knew what what was actually going to happen so I just borrowed the game. But the trailer's intention was to get me excited for things that never happened