How to Diagnose a No-Charge Problem on a 1st Gen Cummins. Full Diagnostic Process!
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- Опубліковано 1 лис 2020
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Thank you all for your ideas and suggestions on getting this charging issue figured out. I go through my full diagnostic process in this video. We also get to go for the first official drive in the new crew cab!
Glad you got it fixed. Thank you for sharing keep up the good work and stay safe out there.
Thanks David!
Followed your very detailed instructions
Installed components for the one wire alternator. Found out the crank positioning sensor was not in adjustment.
Thanks for all your videos.
You rock
Feels good when it's such a simple fix!
Thanks for the video! I found another video that just left me confused installing. I have taken my altenator of 3xs, luckily I found your video with clear detail instructions. Now I know what tab end to bend back.
Glad to hear it was helpful!
Definitely big shut out to you definitely just helped me with my issues and my trucks finally charging thanks for everything and thanks for explaining everything to the T!!!!
I'm glad you got it fixed. So there were 2 problems not just the one. A cut start wire and the cps. This just goes to show that even older simpler things can be difficult at times.
Yeah, it was funny too cause when I found the ign. Wire was cut I suspected that that wasn't the only issue.
This video helped me so much on my 93. It subscribed 😊
Man thank you so much for your help! After blowing up two batteries I changed the alternator put a transpo 8315 in it changed my cps and went from a over charging problem to a no charge problem. I opened up my alternator and forgot to put rubber boot back inside the alternator and I moved the ground on the transpo to the screw you mount it to the alternator and it started working..thanks again ...time to do fuseable links next.
Glad it was helpful!
Wiring can be O so much fun. Glad it was just the CPS and a little "Why'd they do that ?" Thumbs Up Tim !
Thanks for the help Ron
Great detailed step by step evaluation, Thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Thanks for all you do! I keep coming back to your channel for my first gen quandaries :)
Glad you like them!
@@decentgarage I had to sus out my charging problems mid-road trip yesterday. Spent the night in the parking lot of Orielly’s and replaced the voltage regulator and alternator the next morning... a thousand miles later and everything is working as it should. Your video helped me narrow down the issue and gave me a little confidence to knock out the job in a parking lot far from home. I did the back-up hood latch release while I was at it, and I filmed a bit :) Thanks for sharing what you have learned. I’ll keep watching!
@@TalkinAboutTheDude Good idea to run a ground wire from one of the bolts that hold the regulator on to a good ground. I went through a regulator about once a year before doing this. Been running the same one for several years now.
@@duanehenicke6602 Good call, I just replaced the voltage regulator again. Only $25 bucks but still... the little bit of driving I did with 18v coming out of the alternator burned out a couple bulbs in the dash and fried an old amplifier I had hooked up. Good advice!
@@duanehenicke6602 Just getting to it now... can the voltage regulator be grounded by bolting a ground wire to the metal body of the VR, and ground that wire to a nearby ground location?
This video has so much wonderful content that covers so many aspects of electrical troubleshooting I cannot even begin to express how helpful this is!
Even though your ECM/PCM was not the problem, I want to ask you about it. I have a '93 and have replaced the module once. These units are nearly impossible to find any longer. You have provided a marvelous fusable link delete video, is it even possible to find a way to eliminate the need for the PCM? I know that it is rudimentary in what it serves (alternator charging, Auto Trans, Speedometer, A/C and maybe more) which gives me hope that it could be bypassed. There must be a way to A) figure out all of what it governs and B) find and implemet work-arounds for each system. My concern is if my PCM goes out I will not be able to find another.
Suggestions/thoughts???
Thanks!
Thankyou Sir for another great video !!! ( explained in understandable fashion )
No problem! 👍
You are a life saver.
Thanks!
Glad to see you got it figured out! Wiring is very tedious and aggravating
The more I learn about wiring the more comfortable I get with doing it.
I have a 1993 w250 auto, and just listening to your truck driving around man makes me want to standard swap mine so bad lol
I love it being a manual now. It's so much more fun to drive
@@decentgarage I can see that, also your videos have helped me tremendously with issues on my truck. Thanks for all the videos you make on a dying breed of trucks
Thank you 🙏 for what u do!!
I appreciate you bro. I have a 2nd gen but ill be using your list to find my charge isssue
another awesome vid! thanks
Thanks sheldon!
Good Deal! Don't know if my Comments about crank position sensor were helpful but it looks like you got it figured out. I should have told you to watch the episode I did on it haha
Duddie, your comments were super helpful. I honestly just didn't think it was the cps. It was really interesting to walk through the process of coming to that conclusion though.
Hey nice work . Same thing happened to my truck and I did all the same testing. First time it was the fusible link. Second time I replaced the cps. I found out that the acdelco or aftermarket cps don’t last long. I put the old stock one back in and it worked. Keep and extra one on the shelf or try to find a cummins cps.
Super helpful video, thanks for sharing your process of working through this issue. I was wondering if you might share some insight, I have a 93 first gen swapped to a 96 p pump engine (so a lot of the wiring has been messed with.) I went on a long 8 hour drive and noticed my battery smoking, looked like it was about to explode, it was totally fried. Would it make sense for the issue to an overcharging problem? I ordered a new voltage regulator and will try that, but I'm curious to hear if you have any other pointers after working with these trucks so much. Thanks, any advice is greatly appreciated!
That means it is overcharging for sure! This video should be really helpful for you. If I had to do it again though I would use Cutterrob's video on converting to a 1 wire alternator for $30 bucks
@@decentgarage Thanks for the input!
appreciate the video.
subbed
Welcome to the channel 👍
Thanks a ton for the Video helped me tremendously...What turbo setup are you running? Sounds awesome
On this truck it's a super b turbo. It's very laggy though.
I think a top shelf battery and a quick connector trickle charge. As you park for night in cold weather particularly plug in for 8 amp boost. Of course get on board charge system in top condition as well.
Diesels start better with rapid turn over to heat compression air best.
Diesels hate below zero weather. Oil, fuel, battery all become problematic.
That big block sucks up cold like a sponge and takes a long time to get up to operating temperature.
Cover grill to stop bitter wind chill. Anti gel additives for fuel and battery insulation and electric warming pad can help.
Video was awsome I'm dealing with this my self I have done everything that you did in the video every thing. The only problem is I'm still not charging I also have a new rebuild pcm. Currently waiting on a second pcm I put two new crank position sensor's just to rule that out . No a/c or Cruz or charging. If you have any other ideas that would rock. Thanks
Dang, my next step in this case was going to be to replace the PCM if the CPS didn't fix it.
2:13
Alternator RPM is a multitude of engine RPM based on pulley ratios.
Example -- a 3:1 pulley spins the alternator three times engine speed.
At 700RPM idle, the alternator is spinning at 2,100RPM.
.
Note -- centrifugal force limits alternator speed, so experimenting with a 5:1 or 7:1 pulley puts you in test-pilot territory... and probably requires an ejection seat.
I have mine wired to the injection pump power works great
Haha now you know how to diagnose where the problem actually is. Had it been a faulty ecm though I would have just wired it to a key on power source too.
Hello man, maybe you can guide me I got the jumper wires on the asd relay and it still didn’t do anything. I got a new alternator put in the transpo, I have a new battery, I put in a new crank position sensor. I even got a new pcm and it’s still not charging. Any further recommendations
Great info. Thanks.
Make sure you read the description of this video before you install yours.
@@decentgarage so I have done like you and check everything and still not charging. Thinking pcm is bad. No AC no overdrive also.
@@edwardpoff575 yep pcm is bad. Go watch ovens garage video on how to fix that
@@decentgarage watching a lot of his stuff now. Thanks for the help on these trucks but thanks for being on the frontlines also.
Tim, will you be able to post the part number for the Napa Commercial Battery
Thanks.< I have a 1991- w250 >
Just ask at Napa and they'll get you set up.
the Quick Start Voltage Regulator Bypass kit , comes with online printed and phone tech help to solve your charging problem
I cant find the little
Box on my 1990 cummins where u put the jump wire any idea where eles to look ?
Good video man, battling the same issue at the moment on my 92. Do you happen to know of anyway to actually confirm the CPS is bad prior to replacing it? (i.e. any voltage/ohm tests while it's still on the vehicle?)
I don't... The only information I could find was to adjust it or replace it to know if it was good or not.
I had a charging problem with my truck I had worked on at a shop over by Atlantic Pennsylvania that’s near Cockerton and all that and he really screwed it up good but anyways to end up being we got the charging system working but it was over charging change the regulator did all that stuff in here come to find out the battery somehow got screwed up I replaced the battery and now I’m charging 14 114 two periodically goes up to 14 five but the soup is amazing the battery works perfectly fine other than that it’s still kick side 1000 cranking amps
Do you have a part number and price for that crank position sensor? It was like 300 bucks at autozone
Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
I didn't realize this was a super thanks comment! I truly appreciate it!
Rolled 93 1st gen over. Put 92 gas cab on frame. Battery No charge. Tried external voltage regulator...reads battery positive. Tried the internal voltage regulator conversion still no charge. Reads battery positive. Jumped ads relay have battery positive with and without vehicle running. Haven't got a known spare cps otherwise I'd try that but this truck is really giving me a run for my money
Hi I'm having the same issue have a brand new alternator and when I use the jumper wire it starts charging the asd relay is ok and I just put a crank position sensor in and gapped it to .05 thousands and still no charge unless I put the jumper wire in, it's a 1992 w250 auto trans would the pcm be my problem
If still no charge after following these videos and the cps didn't fix it my next suspicion would be the ecm. There are ways to test the ecm that I'm not as familiar with but search the forums and you'll find them
My 89 d250 was overcharging I’m pretty sure then I saw smoke come from under the dash and some of the lights on the message center flashed then went out the the truck cut off I took the dash out and couldn’t find any burnt wires but the truck will turn over but won’t fire I don’t know if it’s a fuse or a relay do you have any idea or insight of what it could possibly be
Interesting... My gut reaction would be the starter relay or the fusible links but with smoke coming from behind the message center that doesn't make sense...
All of these trucks from 91.5-93 are nightmares far as electrical goes. My early 91 came from factory without computer. Which I'm very thankful. Blower motor wires are horrible in all the years. Other than that, the fuel shut off solenoid eventually gives up. That was a hard one for me. When the plunger drops, it doesn't shut fuel off completely. Just enough that the engine will not run. I could have replaced the solenoid, but after being stranded i decided to gut it and install pull cable. No electrical to keep my engine from running now. Even if something happens to the cable, i can still pop the hood and kill it by pulling on the fuel shut off lever. As a added bonus i can leave the cable pulled and not many would know how to make it start....
I just started this problem today, my solenoid is bad so going to have to install that cable where’d you find that cable?
@@texasfish9437 I just bought the first cheap choke cable i found. It was too long. So i had to cut some of the metal sheath off and shorten the wire. Used a piece of scrap angle iron for mounting the pull knob. Couple holes drilled for mounting next to the brake release lever, and one to fasten the knob. Shot of red paint to match the interior and i was done.
@@duanehenicke6602 nice!!! I’m going to start making videos as well of my 1st gen I just bought I’m totally new to these diesel trucks.
@@texasfish9437 Good luck with it. That old truck will no doubt give you plenty of content....
I DO have Decent Garage official work boots in 4 colors!!
Nice!
Awesome
Thanks!
Praise God for "persistence " and good mechanucs
It felt good to figure it out!
I am having a charging issue. Went to start but dead battery; albeit, a new battery. Swap the battery and start the truck. It then shuts off when I lift the battery cable to replace the battery. Is this a faulty alternator?
I have some of those boots. We have rubber floors and i got tired of shocking myself and the babies i work with.
Haha
Thank you for all the advices. I have a 1991 been trying to find the crank position sensor can't find it. Do you know if that year came out with that?
I am less familiar with the non intercooled 1st gens. If it has one it will be right above the harmonic balancer
Check this part # out PC87 this is the one my 1991 d250 had on it
@@decentgarage My early '91 does not have one, but it's non intercooled. Maybe the intercooled late '91's have them?
@@Freedomquest08 yeah i think you may be right.
I have a 91.5 and it's got some of both it seems. No PCM but an ECM with an external regulator. So I have no ASD relay that I can find. I have a 93 with a PCM to compare it to and the 91.5 looks like a bare-bones machine on the fusible link firewall. I was way overcharging, bought the relay to fix it and before I could, it goes to no charging. What a headache!!
I have a 1990 Cummins that is over charging it charges 17 volts when the extra voltage regulater is plugged in cannot figure it out any suggestions on the problem
How did you gap the cps? I am about to change mine and hope that is the issue. Thanks man.
I use a credit card and make it fairly tight on the card.
@@decentgarage awesome thanks! I will use a different card. My wife took all my credit cards so I would stop buying truck parts. Thanks for all the great videos.
Great video . I’m chasing it down myself.
Crank position has good reading .
I’m getting power everywhere and ground.
I jumped the asd and Still nothing!
Stumped .
I got an 89 Cummins that I swapped on my 86 dodge. I’m using my 89 wiring for my engine bay wiring and my battery won’t hold any charge for some reason. I’ve tried everything you’ve done and still not charging
Shoot, I think if i had an 89 or 90 I'd install an external regulator.
Noticed the steering wheel off center. Had to deal with that one many times. Drove me crazy if it’s not straight.
Yeah I'll fix that when I get a new steering box
Thanks for the video would it hurt anything to leave the jumper wire at the relay?
It would just make it so the other parts of the relay wouldn't get activated correctly.
Could you see that causing a problem was going to run temporarily since it’s charging that way until I check crank angle sensor and relay. Maybe permanent if it’s the pcm lol
@@alexsantix69 yeah I'd definitely do it to charge up the battery and maybe to bypass the pcm of that turned out to be the issue
@@decentgarage Thank you for your help and the quick reply your video really helped me a lot
@@alexsantix69 no problem!
I never noticed before, the manual shift turns the front seat into a 2 seater, so it's a PITA in a standard cab.
question Tim did the speedometer and AC and everything else work with the bad crank sensor or were those things also not working
Those things were also not working.
@@decentgarage what about your grid heaters? I'm having same problems. I can jump ads and it charges so either bad cps or ECM.
@@levitowne9746 yes, grid heaters are on the same circuit so it's your cps or you ecm.
@@decentgarage Thank you!
When I used a jumper my batt power jump down a bit
21:01 Are those some sort of special driving shoes?
I noticed you said the ac wasn't working, there is a white (I believe) wire that runs over the top of the ducks foot (fusible links) that splits into two wires going toward the battery, this wire should have power when the ignition is turned on it supply's power to the computer for the a/c to work
Sweet, I'll check that out.
Just had my 93 not start with key no heater blower iam thinking the fuseible link
Sounds like fusible Links. Check out my fusible Links videos
@@decentgarage tks i will check it out
Decent garage what did you gap the cps to?
I forgot what spec is with a feeler gauge but I just use a gift card or credit card because it's hard to get a feeler gauge set in there.
@@decentgarage 10:4 thank you
What if you jumper the relay and it still doesn’t charge?
I'd be leaning toward the PCM at that point
What if it didnt charge when you jumped the relay?
I that was that case I would have suspected that it was the fusible link that provides power to the relay.
Is key switch in a 93 same as 95 ?
I think so but im not positive.
Is your check engine light now gone after 51 or so starts?
Ive started it less than 15 times since this video. Just to be sure though I pulled the bulb from the check engine light. I will throw the bulb back in there next time I have the dash bezel out and check.
@@decentgarage gotcha I had a bouncing voltage issue which resolved with an external volt regulator on my 93, now I disconnected that because it stopped working, and installed a 1 wire alternator for pa performance. Will see how that goes, it’s charging at 13.8v.
89-91 has external voltage regulator and 92-93 has internal voltage regulator in the alternator. Just wanted to add that in comments.
Correct, good point to make
That's almost correct. Starting in 91.5 they put computers in these trucks. And that is what tells them to charge.
@@duanehenicke6602 Not exactly. Some may and others may not! I have one that has an ECM and an external regulator. I have a 93 with a PCM and the two trucks electrically are night and day and the 91.5 is the pita!!
@@tobylou8 If you have a 91.5 or above that has external regulator, someone other than the factory put it there. It was a common thing to do back in the day when they stopped charging. Now you can put a one wire alternator or swap the brain out for a new one.
@@duanehenicke6602 Wish I could post pics on YT. The driver side fender wells are two different animals. I don't have an ADP relay and all the wiring looks factory from the VR to the alternator. I sense a self exciting one wire in my future if the other bypass trick common for us doesn't work. I had the PCM rebuilt on my 93 176k ago and haven't had any issues. I will double check again to make sure it's not a PCM. Wish it was, would be easier to fix! ;-)
Forget about the charging system, you need a serious alignment brotha. Lol
Rock rooster slip ons
Looks to me like he's not a fan of work boots, but rather a fan of 'croc martens’...
Mine works fine until I installed the transpo. Now kills the battery and it won’t start
It was charging fine prior to that?
@@decentgarage yes. I installed the transpo because the battery gauge was going crazy back and forth and the lights too. But now every time I start the truck the speedometer goes back slowly and the lights off
@@nynoperales6521 what happens if you uninstall the transpo?
@@decentgarage I was thinking to do that. But when I installed the transpo there is a terminal or whatever it’s called that you have to bend but I broke it. So now I need that part. You know where can I found it?
@@nynoperales6521 the previous owner cut the terminal off of mine so I just tapped in to that specific wire before the black block and put an eye connector on it
Wow that alignment is bad lol
Could be the steering shaft too, mine was like that, and I put in a new steering shaft and now it is nice and straight.
Easy fix. Alignment is good, steering wheel is not aligned which i can realign at the steering shaft.
Just say no to crocks
93 D350 5.9 Cummins crank sensor has nothing to do with cranking. But it does have something to do with the charging SYSTEM !
This video helped me so much on my 93. It subscribed 😊