@@Trisket eh, by the time this “debate” happened it had already been four months since he uploaded anything to his channel and that was just celebrating him reaching 100k. The last actual content where he talks about a piece of media was uploaded almost a year ago now. So he may have just lost interest in doing this... not like with Covid about there is a lot of other things he could be doing with his free time.
I almost find that a bit sad. With people who've come on this show to defend/discuss their content that's being criticized, it's a give and take if they'll improve, give up, or just don't learn from their experience.
Brains conditioned for instant gratification don't care about the journey, just the destination so they can move onto the next dopamine hit. Pay no attention to the frying of your synapses, there's something on twitter you need to be outraged at for 20 minutes before you forget about it entirely.
God I love how twin perfect only shows up cause he wants to know whose posting screenshots, I sincerely doubted he came cause he wanted to debate. Woefully poor explanation throughout
Even then he should’ve been able to have a better discussion. The questions they asked him and the topics they discussed were not complicated and pretty sure they were all things he himself already covered in his own videos. So he should’ve had steel man arguments already loaded in the chamber but he’s a clumsy retard so he fumbled the bag
@@Trisket Yeah, but I grew tired of his schtick over time. Guys like him and Rags are doing the same sh!t for years now. But perhaps they have no choice if they want to stay successful. When they tried something else, their fanbase didn't really dig it. That's the problem when your fans are mostly adolescent boys. Rags is pretty lame anyways, but MauLer has potential for better things. So I hope he'll be able to grow out of this schtick and do more original stuff. Greetings from Germany.
@@Trisket Producing epic rants for adolescent boys whose hormonal status makes them feel that epic rants are the greatest thing there is. But to make every rant huge and epic you have to start nitpicking at some point. You have to go the "Cinema Sins" route. And that's where he's at now with his channel. Producing stuff for people who think they've grown past watching "Cinema Sins" and want more serious stuff now. But all they're doing is watching the same shtick over and over. With their mind still stuck on "Cinema Sins" -level. The fact that you posted this video here, just goes to show that you're one of those little boys. Here's hoping in the near future you can find something that helps you grow. Greetings from Germany.
Ex1: *Scene matter:* Pippin sings a song about the hopeful nature of beginning an adventure, but he sings with a minor key full of dread because he's being forced to do it. At the same time, Faramir leads a fated to fail assault. The scene is interspersed with cuts to Denethor eating without manners, specially focusing on food full of red juice. *Point of the scene:* Show off how horrible and gloom Denethor's madness has made life in Minas Tirith, how his arrogance is leading to the death of his people and even maybe of his only living son. *Used potential:* just about everything. Music, visuals, symbolism of visuals, all converge to hammer home the point of the scene. Ex2: *Scene matter:* Elves kill orcs while the Dwarves and Bilbo are flushed down a stream inside barrels. The Dwarves are constantly almost killed by either side, but wacky highjinks involving the barrels save their lives every time. *Point of the scene:* a thrilling and nail bitting escape of a dangerous situation. *Lost potential:* the scene turns the seriousness of the whole preceeding half hour of the movie regarding the dwarves imprisonment _and_ the overarching threat of the orcs that have been chasing the team since the beginning into an absolute joke. If the elves and orcs could have been defeated by _literal absolute happenstance_ all along, there was never a point into fearing any of them at all. Just to give people who come by what I consider to be 2 good examples of scenes that surely had a _point,_ and why a scene _having a point_ isn't enough to instantly make it good.
>"Oh, I don't want to talk to those guys! They're all cowards!" >starts groveling and insisting he wasn't insulting anyone the moment he's actually confronted
@@auroraSLAP Sounds like EFAP would be out of the market if they answered questions like that with a yes or no. I mean, you do enjoy in-depth analysis right? Yes or no?
@@MillywiggZ I didn’t really mean they would answer with yes or no and stop there. In depth analysis is a little different from talking around the question altogether
I hate his death of the author argument. If a movie is well made it should be able to convey all its ideas on its own. If it completely relies on the director to explain it all to you then it’s not a valuable piece of media. It’s like if you have to explain a joke then it’s not actually funny. Pathetic
"If a movie is well made it should be able to convey all its ideas on its own. If it completely relies the director to explain it all to you then it’s not a valuable piece of media." Me, after any David Lynch film.
@@borizzle1 Then maybe he should have been a bit less sniveling and cowardly here and actually stood for his perspective on the movie rather than deflecting all the time in this conversation. It doesn't really matter how "unapologetic" his videos are given how they are just him sending his ideas out unopposed. The fact that this is how he responded when challenged proves OP correct.
Twin Perfect, you may wanna rethink Smug Ross. If you're making comments just because you're playing up some kind of Smug Ross persona without making it clear you don't mean what you're saying in that persona, it's gonna make you look bad because the context is muddled. Even in-context, it's pretty distasteful in my opinion. Point is, be careful.
Twin Perfect: “It’s more interesting to talk about the goal of the scene” Then what’s the difference between the events as shown in BvS, versus the screen cutting to black, Zack Snyder walks in and says: “some fight stuffs happen, Superman manages to kill Doomsday, and also dies in the process.” The “goal of the scene” is the same. The execution completely different. And I have to assume that TP would have an issue with the latter execution. Discussing the “goal of the scene” is only as interesting as the execution. Otherwise, you’re reviewing a film that only exists in your head. Edit: I forgot Fringy covered this question. Well played!
The edit was fine overall, but some of the joke-edits (like KotH, Loser) and the ending stinger were much louder than the rest of the video. Juts for future reference though; I like these supercuts of EFAP events and hope to see more of them
Two things: the King of Hill clip audio is normalized to the rest of the video, Hank is shouting in it so it seems louder compared to the group chatting; the end stinger is intentionally louder, a little joke, just for me. I put it in there with the intention of startling people, hoping they would comment on it, which would tell me they probably watched the entire thing. You're the first to do so in almost two years, so thanks.
In Russia, if hand is rotten, you cut off hand. If arm is rotten, you cut off arm. But if heart is rotten... you cut off leg. This is Russian love song.
Its insane to me that twinperfect is so popular from making that twin peaks video compared to when they were just "that guy that made only shitty Prometheus and silent hill videos" i do really appreciate the people that shit on him nowadays tho since i was there day 1 since his channels conception and have always felt the smug
I kinda get what he means about the dead of the auteur. Knowing the intentions of the auteur can show you the view that was « intended ». But I do think that if people get a different « view » that they feel is better that what the auteur had in mind they should keep their « view »
The author can be a crazy schizophrenic mess that doesn't understand the basics of reality, and any number of degrees between that and "correct" so, whatever.
hey, Rags brings up _Space Munity!_ that was a moofie featured on _Best of the Worst._ I'm not sure if Rag's has ever seen that show, though? wonder if he's an RLM fan.
Maybe 1? I can't tell if Rags just likes having a Shiba Inu as an internet persona or if he's a legit furry. Wolf, who used to be part of the show was almost definitely one.
I always feel like MauLer should just do debates one-on-one. This isn’t a point against any of the other guests, and I understand why on EFAP debates are open this way, but A) Fringy, Southpaw, and Rags get way too heated at parts and just get really nasty, or even just make shit arguments and default to examples that distract from the greater points, and B) MauLer better explains everything than the other three do. Theo and the other guy’s quiet most of the time anyways as well. Again, totally get why EFAP does open debates like these, and it’s completely fair, but I feel like nothing advances when somebody’s getting dogpiled and there are people on both sides losing their shit.
@@whiskeyhound lol that’s actually where i found his channel. it’s a long story but they knew each other since high school and short-story-short, he caught wind of him abusing his gf on stream and drove to their place to try and get her out of there. needless to say, he failed. edit: this is the stream ua-cam.com/video/V4DkjcyTxdM/v-deo.html
“Star Wars is about a penguin on a seat and you couldn’t see it” Beyond worthless hypothetical. And I don’t even agree with Ross about death of the author.
It was an intentionally absurd hyperbolic example given on the fly to demonstrate that if an author said something utterly nonsensical and/or wrong about their work you can just dismiss them entirely, showing that you cannot believe "0% in death of the author."
this didn't age too well, for vapid shit videos go look at the efap cast's original work on the level of an untrained AI. Check out TP, Rick Worley, etc. for a little more substance if you're tired of smug smoothbrains stating the obvious.
It's funny cause they just wanted him to make a point rather than just dismiss everything. They were perfectly reasonable, not ganging up on him. They didn't cut him off while he was making a good point. He didn't make any good points really.
@@brace110 this is a massive topic that is still under debate. Logical consistency within the plot, characters, and fictional world is normally included under the objective quality banner. Subjective will include things like acting, line delivery, art style. There is also overlap: a shot can be objectively bad, as in unintentionally poorly lit, or just unwatchable, and someone can dislike a shot for subjective reasons, like disliking the use of a handheld camera for a scene vs a static shot.
Liking a movie is one thing. The movie being good is another thing. Do not conflate the two. Rags likes Batman and Robin. Rags also calls it a bad movie. Do you get it?
No you can like what ever you want but you liking it has nothing to do with the quality of it. Like Rags said he loves Batman and Robin but it's still a bad movie.
I wonder if Twin Perfect has been using the nine months since he uploaded a video to finally figure out how to answer a yes or no question.
Damn, if you put it like that it sounds this experience broke him.
@@Trisket eh, by the time this “debate” happened it had already been four months since he uploaded anything to his channel and that was just celebrating him reaching 100k. The last actual content where he talks about a piece of media was uploaded almost a year ago now. So he may have just lost interest in doing this... not like with Covid about there is a lot of other things he could be doing with his free time.
I almost find that a bit sad. With people who've come on this show to defend/discuss their content that's being criticized, it's a give and take if they'll improve, give up, or just don't learn from their experience.
Does he know Lenny?
Also love how everyone is trying to be nice and Rags just rails on him. The doggo is channeling Wolf right there.
Rags can be an asshole, but he's great at calling out blatant deflection when it happens.
@@megashark1013 hes basically the viewers who are frustrated with his takes
How can analyzing a payoff be interesting if you think nothing of the mechanics of how we got there?
Brains conditioned for instant gratification don't care about the journey, just the destination so they can move onto the next dopamine hit. Pay no attention to the frying of your synapses, there's something on twitter you need to be outraged at for 20 minutes before you forget about it entirely.
God I love how twin perfect only shows up cause he wants to know whose posting screenshots, I sincerely doubted he came cause he wanted to debate. Woefully poor explanation throughout
Even then he should’ve been able to have a better discussion. The questions they asked him and the topics they discussed were not complicated and pretty sure they were all things he himself already covered in his own videos. So he should’ve had steel man arguments already loaded in the chamber but he’s a clumsy retard so he fumbled the bag
“Star Wars is about a penguin on a seat and you couldn’t see it” ~ Aristotle Baggins
As someone who believes 0% in death of the author, Lucas would be correct.
“It’s an Aristotle thing”
-Beddlo Bubblbrook
Imagine having Mauler as a therapist, he can seemingly elaborate any concept to a frightening degree.
yeah, but only if you're a 12 year old douche.
...but you're subscribed to Mauler? lol
@@Trisket
Yeah, but I grew tired of his schtick over time. Guys like him and Rags are doing the same sh!t for years now. But perhaps they have no choice if they want to stay successful. When they tried something else, their fanbase didn't really dig it. That's the problem when your fans are mostly adolescent boys.
Rags is pretty lame anyways, but MauLer has potential for better things. So I hope he'll be able to grow out of this schtick and do more original stuff.
Greetings from Germany.
@@moserfugger6363 what is Mauler's "schtick" exactly?
@@Trisket
Producing epic rants for adolescent boys whose hormonal status makes them feel that epic rants are the greatest thing there is. But to make every rant huge and epic you have to start nitpicking at some point. You have to go the "Cinema Sins" route.
And that's where he's at now with his channel. Producing stuff for people who think they've grown past watching "Cinema Sins" and want more serious stuff now. But all they're doing is watching the same shtick over and over. With their mind still stuck on "Cinema Sins" -level.
The fact that you posted this video here, just goes to show that you're one of those little boys. Here's hoping in the near future you can find something that helps you grow.
Greetings from Germany.
That was the Smug Ross emote, it's an inside joke within my community, guys.
“You see I think we’ve reached the core of the disagreement where you guys believe execution matters whereas I do not”
-Belboshnee Borglenoff
In the age of Longman, before Subjectivity was implied, there was a Smug Ross.
I remember watching this LIVE. This was basically my intro to EFAP. Boy oh boy what a stream and what a way to be introduced to these lads
I think twin perfect needs to understand that “Point of Scene - Logical Execution = Lost Potential”
It’s weird how few people understand that
Ex1:
*Scene matter:* Pippin sings a song about the hopeful nature of beginning an adventure, but he sings with a minor key full of dread because he's being forced to do it. At the same time, Faramir leads a fated to fail assault. The scene is interspersed with cuts to Denethor eating without manners, specially focusing on food full of red juice.
*Point of the scene:* Show off how horrible and gloom Denethor's madness has made life in Minas Tirith, how his arrogance is leading to the death of his people and even maybe of his only living son.
*Used potential:* just about everything. Music, visuals, symbolism of visuals, all converge to hammer home the point of the scene.
Ex2:
*Scene matter:* Elves kill orcs while the Dwarves and Bilbo are flushed down a stream inside barrels. The Dwarves are constantly almost killed by either side, but wacky highjinks involving the barrels save their lives every time.
*Point of the scene:* a thrilling and nail bitting escape of a dangerous situation.
*Lost potential:* the scene turns the seriousness of the whole preceeding half hour of the movie regarding the dwarves imprisonment _and_ the overarching threat of the orcs that have been chasing the team since the beginning into an absolute joke. If the elves and orcs could have been defeated by _literal absolute happenstance_ all along, there was never a point into fearing any of them at all.
Just to give people who come by what I consider to be 2 good examples of scenes that surely had a _point,_ and why a scene _having a point_ isn't enough to instantly make it good.
I love how rags is feeling like the rest of us and just gets increasingly pissed off at him
You can tell rags is getting pissed, it's really funny.
>"Oh, I don't want to talk to those guys! They're all cowards!"
>starts groveling and insisting he wasn't insulting anyone the moment he's actually confronted
33:07
“Do you think it’s a well-written movie?”
Twin Perfect: *waffles around the question for about 20 seconds*
How is that any different from EFAP?
@@MillywiggZ EFAP crew can answer a yes or no question
@@auroraSLAP YES OR NOOOO
@@auroraSLAP
Sounds like EFAP would be out of the market if they answered questions like that with a yes or no. I mean, you do enjoy in-depth analysis right? Yes or no?
@@MillywiggZ I didn’t really mean they would answer with yes or no and stop there. In depth analysis is a little different from talking around the question altogether
I hate his death of the author argument.
If a movie is well made it should be able to convey all its ideas on its own. If it completely relies on the director to explain it all to you then it’s not a valuable piece of media. It’s like if you have to explain a joke then it’s not actually funny. Pathetic
"If a movie is well made it should be able to convey all its ideas on its own. If it completely relies the director to explain it all to you then it’s not a valuable piece of media."
Me, after any David Lynch film.
Well that kind of is what death of the author is. It’s An analysis of the text of a work rather than the input of the author/director
to quote Sir Hammerlock:
"...whever [he] speaks, I feel my braincells committing suicide"
Nothing infuriates me more than people that refuse to stand for anything for fear of it getting questioned.
You simpering jelly, Twin.
Ehhh that’s probably the most inaccurate description of Twin Perfect ever lmao. Their videos are known for being very unapologetic.
@@borizzle1 must've been a poor showing then.
@@borizzle1 Then maybe he should have been a bit less sniveling and cowardly here and actually stood for his perspective on the movie rather than deflecting all the time in this conversation.
It doesn't really matter how "unapologetic" his videos are given how they are just him sending his ideas out unopposed. The fact that this is how he responded when challenged proves OP correct.
@@borizzle1until he gets confronted about his takes *live*
@@TheLevitatingFleem Hopefully someone more grounded will confront him next time, instead of a gang of hooting hollering gibbons
Rags did nothing wrong.
Twin Perfect, you may wanna rethink Smug Ross. If you're making comments just because you're playing up some kind of Smug Ross persona without making it clear you don't mean what you're saying in that persona, it's gonna make you look bad because the context is muddled. Even in-context, it's pretty distasteful in my opinion. Point is, be careful.
Trust me, I think he learned that lesson hard during this interaction.
@@Trisket did he tho?
@@texteel He basically abandoned his UA-cam channel after this.
Anyone else think it sounds like he was trying not to cry when he first got on? Lol
I was thinking the same thing! He sounded so floompy when he arrived as if he was bracing for impact
The Limmy part killed me, that was a Boogie2988 way of distraction.....
In fairness, that lighter was pretty damn cool. Would a racist really have such a cool lighter?
I tingle when Rags get this pissed off at someone.
Obligatory interaction to boost the algorithm. Very well edited video of a great highlight. Awesome job.
Yes or No
You guys know Limmy?
I cringed so Hard at that part it still gets me, lmao
It depends.
But you see the smug Ross is implied so……
Ha ha
...What was the question?
Twin Perfect: “It’s more interesting to talk about the goal of the scene”
Then what’s the difference between the events as shown in BvS, versus the screen cutting to black, Zack Snyder walks in and says: “some fight stuffs happen, Superman manages to kill Doomsday, and also dies in the process.”
The “goal of the scene” is the same. The execution completely different. And I have to assume that TP would have an issue with the latter execution.
Discussing the “goal of the scene” is only as interesting as the execution. Otherwise, you’re reviewing a film that only exists in your head.
Edit: I forgot Fringy covered this question. Well played!
Well... That wasn't a perfect debate.
But maybe the real debate were the subscribers we've lost along the way.
I think Ross caught with his leather trousers down emoji would be a better fit for this segment.
The edit was fine overall, but some of the joke-edits (like KotH, Loser) and the ending stinger were much louder than the rest of the video. Juts for future reference though; I like these supercuts of EFAP events and hope to see more of them
Two things: the King of Hill clip audio is normalized to the rest of the video, Hank is shouting in it so it seems louder compared to the group chatting; the end stinger is intentionally louder, a little joke, just for me. I put it in there with the intention of startling people, hoping they would comment on it, which would tell me they probably watched the entire thing. You're the first to do so in almost two years, so thanks.
Most frustrating moment in efap history from my pov. If you think there's a more frustrating moment with a guest, let me know
Remarkable Republican vs. Shadiversity ?
@@baseddugalle1838 which episode was that?
@@RealYARP You can find it as Shadiversity vs. Remarkable Republican I think
@@RealYARP EFAP 65 apparently
@@baseddugalle1838 Yeah, but didn’t it turn out that RR was just a troll all along? Here the frustration is pure XD
Rags is axing him 🪓
Perhaps he gish galloped.
In Russia, if hand is rotten, you cut off hand. If arm is rotten, you cut off arm. But if heart is rotten... you cut off leg. This is Russian love song.
Yes...
Its insane to me that twinperfect is so popular from making that twin peaks video compared to when they were just "that guy that made only shitty Prometheus and silent hill videos"
i do really appreciate the people that shit on him nowadays tho since i was there day 1 since his channels conception and have always felt the smug
the thumbnail is perfect
I kinda get what he means about the dead of the auteur. Knowing the intentions of the auteur can show you the view that was « intended ». But I do think that if people get a different « view » that they feel is better that what the auteur had in mind they should keep their « view »
The author can be a crazy schizophrenic mess that doesn't understand the basics of reality, and any number of degrees between that and "correct" so, whatever.
Twin Perfect hasn’t been the same since Fungo left >.>
oh god he was inspired by cinemasins
that explains so much...
and haha man the best part of this video 1:08:23
Damn Rag’ssssss is in attack mode in this one
hey, Rags brings up _Space Munity!_ that was a moofie featured on _Best of the Worst._ I'm not sure if Rag's has ever seen that show, though? wonder if he's an RLM fan.
I know Mauler is, so it wouldn't surprise me.
yes he loves best of the worst
That was fun.
Man, content is easy
Death of the author is a power play by folks who want to benefit from creative people's work and the arguments for it are vapid and nonsensical.
Can an author be incorrect about his own creation?
I can see why people look down on EFAP. This and the YMS call are pretty illuminating.
Yeah, dumb assholes that can't make good points typically look down on handsome intelligent non losers, in my experience
I like TP. But i needed to see this
How many furries are on that livestream
Maybe 1? I can't tell if Rags just likes having a Shiba Inu as an internet persona or if he's a legit furry. Wolf, who used to be part of the show was almost definitely one.
I always feel like MauLer should just do debates one-on-one. This isn’t a point against any of the other guests, and I understand why on EFAP debates are open this way, but A) Fringy, Southpaw, and Rags get way too heated at parts and just get really nasty, or even just make shit arguments and default to examples that distract from the greater points, and B) MauLer better explains everything than the other three do. Theo and the other guy’s quiet most of the time anyways as well. Again, totally get why EFAP does open debates like these, and it’s completely fair, but I feel like nothing advances when somebody’s getting dogpiled and there are people on both sides losing their shit.
What shit arguments did fringy soutpaw or rags make?
@@GigaChadh976yeah i wanna know the answer to this lol
Especially in regards to fringy
they're bad debators and from what I've heard in this upload smug and childish, too.
What a shitshow
does ross talk about his beef with fungo in this video?
His what?
@@Trisket lol not that kind of “beef”
i mean his drama with fungo
I'm aware of what "beef" means, I just have no idea who Fungo is.
I only know fungo from his bloodborne lore videos, why would ross have beef with him?
@@whiskeyhound lol that’s actually where i found his channel. it’s a long story but they knew each other since high school and short-story-short, he caught wind of him abusing his gf on stream and drove to their place to try and get her out of there. needless to say, he failed.
edit: this is the stream ua-cam.com/video/V4DkjcyTxdM/v-deo.html
“Star Wars is about a penguin on a seat and you couldn’t see it”
Beyond worthless hypothetical. And I don’t even agree with Ross about death of the author.
It was an intentionally absurd hyperbolic example given on the fly to demonstrate that if an author said something utterly nonsensical and/or wrong about their work you can just dismiss them entirely, showing that you cannot believe "0% in death of the author."
@@Trisket Yeah... that's not what death of the author is, tho.
@@mxed1916it is. To the letter
@@chaplincrabtree no
Twin Perfect's vid on Twin Peaks explained was dope tho...
And apparently this guy talks about Twin Peaks on his channel as well. Can't imagine how vapid and shit those videos are.
this didn't age too well,
for vapid shit videos go look at the efap cast's original work on the level of an untrained AI.
Check out TP, Rick Worley, etc. for a little more substance if you're tired of smug smoothbrains stating the obvious.
Yooo, these dudes are so mad lmao. Bunch of cortisol addicts.
feel sorry for ross for having to argue with 14 years old..maybe if he did not have people ganging on him for visibility he would post something new
They “ganged” on him because he’s retarded and makes bad points
It's funny cause they just wanted him to make a point rather than just dismiss everything. They were perfectly reasonable, not ganging up on him. They didn't cut him off while he was making a good point. He didn't make any good points really.
So according to Mauler and everyone else, the fans are wrong for liking the DCEU movies, i guess.
Missing their point entirely. Nothing wrong with liking what you like, just don't equate your enjoyment of something with it being objectively good.
@@Trisket I've watched EFAP for a while know, what is the definition of objectively good? how would would you separate objective and subjective
@@brace110 this is a massive topic that is still under debate.
Logical consistency within the plot, characters, and fictional world is normally included under the objective quality banner.
Subjective will include things like acting, line delivery, art style.
There is also overlap: a shot can be objectively bad, as in unintentionally poorly lit, or just unwatchable, and someone can dislike a shot for subjective reasons, like disliking the use of a handheld camera for a scene vs a static shot.
Liking a movie is one thing. The movie being good is another thing. Do not conflate the two. Rags likes Batman and Robin. Rags also calls it a bad movie. Do you get it?
No you can like what ever you want but you liking it has nothing to do with the quality of it. Like Rags said he loves Batman and Robin but it's still a bad movie.