CONTRADICTION: The Book of Mormon vs The Bible
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Latter-day Saints claim that the Book of Mormon helps interpret the Bible. 2 Nephi 25:23 says "...for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.” A comparable passage in the Bible, Ephesians 2:8-19, says, "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." These two passages are teaching mutually exclusive things. Though Joseph Smith attempted to make Mormonism out to be the "true" Christianity-restoring those truths that had been distorted over centuries of Christian church history-contradictions like this demonstrate that Joseph Smith was the one who distorted the truth of the Gospel.
The Book of Mormon teaches that the grace of God HELPS us in getting salvation. What Paul is saying in the Bible is that our salvation comes COMPLETELY from the grace of God, and is not dependent on works. Scripture is clear about this issue: salvation is by the grace of God and is to be received by faith, NOT by works.
Mormonism's claim that the Bible and the Book of Mormon reveal the same Gospel is an easily testable claim. The Bible tells Christians to not despise prophecy, but to test everything and hold fast to what is good (1 Thessalonians 5:20-21). But when examined, the LDS Church's claim that the Book of Mormon and Bible are in perfect harmony is refuted.
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Former Mormon here. This was one of the most absolutely liberating things I came to realize when I found Jesus, the real Jesus, 2 1/2 months ago. There is so much rest in knowing I don’t have to earn God’s grace and love myself.
I no longer live to be my own savior, but live to serve and glorify the real true Savior of my soul. I still do many of the same things-church, scripture study, prayer, serve others, ect-but instead of doing them for myself to earn God’s favor for myself, I do them for God and for His glory. That makes those same works infinitely more fulfilling and beautiful to me.
Now that you have left the Church, what purpose have you discovered for the reason your Triune god created mankind?
Praise God sister, thank you for sharing. Jesus is enough.
Praise God! What an amazing thing to here ❤️
The LDS church has never taught and will never teach that we are to become our own saviour. We can never do enough to be our own saviour but we are expected to obey the commandments and that is our works. Sometimes we manage it, sometimes we dont, the main thing is that we try, and by whatever amount we fail by, the Saviour’s atonement makes up for the rest and that is where his grace comes into it if we are sincere in our efforts. If we just sit around saying I am saved by Jesus and do nothing about keeping His commandments then we are going to be disappointed just like the five in the parable of the ten virgins.
@@vinniejones8009 “sometimes we manage it” you mean sometimes you guys manage to keep all the commandments? That’s not right. You either keep them or you don’t. See James 2:10 and Romans 13:8, and Gal 5.
2 Nephi 25:23 is also dubious on its face, because who on earth has done ALL that they can do? That's precisely why Christ had to die, because nobody in human history COULD do all that was possible for them to do. We are stained with our sinful nature. If you take 2 Nephi literally, then we must conclude, "Then NOBODY will be saved!" On the other hand, if you take it loosely to say, "...saved after all that we will end up doing..." then EVERYONE will be saved, at which point the qualifier of "after all we can do" is irrelevant. THANK GOD for his gift of salvation, freely given based on Christ's righteousness, and not our own!
You can tell that Nephi is borrowing this from his brother Jacob in 2 Nephi 10:25 where it's only through the Grace of Christ that we are saved. I think a lot of people get Mormons confused thinking they are trying to perform Works to be saved, but if they learned Mormonism they would learn that Mormons are working on their Glory not their Salvation.
This is the same concept as the 5 - Heavenly Crowns of Glory that other Christians teach as our award for our Works here on earth that we receive in heaven.
@@danite1742 There's a conflict of terms here, as the Christian means something different when they say "saved" than a Mormon does. But as far as what you are saying: 2 Nephi doesn't say "glorified after all we can do," it says "saved..." So why do you think Nephi would say "saved after all we can do" when, in Mormon theology, nearly everyone is "saved"?
I think your approach is wrong… For example, 2 Nephi isnt saying that people should or have done all they have done for righteousness but fallen so we need a savior, because when jesus came no one was even trying to follow God. Grace truly came when we needed it the most (during time of religion, and no one was being saved, wars against the jews, violence etc)
So my point is, the book of moron is saying do good works so then after you will be saved by grace…… Dont add or subtract from that will personal ideology.
thats exactly the point. this video doesnt understand that "after" means despite.
It is all a giant made up scam. JS fabricated all of it for his personal financial, sexual and authoritarian benefit. A bit hilarious that people analyse his absurd writings and find historic inconsistencies when his whole scheme is made up drivel.
Ephesians 2.8-10 awakened me from Mormonism when l was a teen. It would be many years later that this would come to full fruition, but l praise the Lord for this clear gospel verse.
The Bible is the Word of God, and id sufficient for salvation.❤️✝️
I felt defeated yesterday when I try to explain my case to the Mormons but they came back with scriptures and since I don't know my Holy Bible that well they overpower me cuz it was two against one and I felt like I let God down 😔💯 and they came with the same scripture that you explained and I did not know the scripture to back it up like you just did
Be encouraged! You are not ultimately responsible for the salvation of others - that is the work of the Holy Spirit. Remain faithful! A Christian doesn't need to have memorized specific verses that deny LDS doctrine to faithfully preach the Gospel.
Explain what you know, tell of the grace and mercy of our Lord-just be faithful!
And let that experience drive you to grow in your knowledge of Scripture! I'm often in conversations where I don't know how to respond to a point, or have no clue what to say in response to something. That's ok! USE that as fuel to study and delight in the Word of God.
Thank you for explaining that to me because I felt like I was responsible for bringing these lost souls to Christ but now that you clarify it I would definitely stay encouraged and faithful thank you so much
@@GLM yes GOD loves all. But mormons believe Adam was God ? And man can become like God? Pure fake teachings. I don't know anything about mormon but the above said words I saw and read it somewhere. Is that true that mormon believe?
Do not feel defeated :) 🙏
@everyday tenor Brigham young taught that Adam is God but this doctrine was later jettisoned like other blasphemous lds doctrines such as blood atonement
I don't think he understands what Paul is saying. Paul is talking about a remission of our sins through Jesus Christ. This video is saying you don't have to do anything to obtain the grace of God. If you don't have to do anything then I don't have to believe in Christ or Join a Christian Church. You can't have it both ways. Either there is works or there isn't. Belief in Christ is works. Reading the scripture is works. Going to church every week is works. Repenting of our sins when we error, is works. Anyone that says they are saved now, in the middle of their earthly experience, a test, is either perfect or decivied. There is only one man that lived this existence as perfect. The rest of us who are not perfect have to follow the commandments of God (good works) and when we error, repent and Christ will make it possible to obtain our remission of sins. However, if we do not repent our sins will not be forgiven and we will not enter the kingdom of God.
A gift is free you just have to accept it accepting a gift isnt work if someone gives me a present its unconditional however I can refuse the gift and throw it back in someones face the idea that you have to work for a gift is dumb your not making sense
Great point! Is faith a “work”? Most would say that it is. But you need it to be saved. So…
Spot on. Everything you said is congruent with the full new testament teaching amen.
@@manimal4136 you don't seem to understand the gift is a way to life through Christ offered when we were undeserving. We didn't deserve a way to life but this is God's grace to offer life to those that trust in Christ accepted by obeying his word. To accept the gift is to trust in his word. Trusting is a verb which by definition is a work according to the English language.
Faith is NOT a work! Romans 3:28
2 Nephi 25:23
Introduction
Nephi continued to emphasize the importance of Isaiah’s prophecies and shared the purpose of his own writing: “to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God” (2 Nephi 25:23).
He invited all to believe in Jesus Christ and to “worship him with all [their] might, mind, and strength, and [their] whole soul[s]” (2 Nephi 25:29).
Nephi. Summarize 2 Nephi 25:1-10 by explaining that Nephi taught that the spirit of prophecy enables people to understand the words of Isaiah. Nephi also testified that the judgments of God come upon all nations according to God’s word and that the Jews had never been destroyed unless God’s prophets had first warned them against iniquity and called them to repentance. For example, as forewarned by prophets, many Jews were destroyed and others were carried captive into Babylon shortly after Lehi left Jerusalem. (See 2 Nephi 25:9-10.)
When Jesus Christ lived among the Jews during His mortal ministry, why did many Jews not believe He was the promised Messiah? (Help students understand that “many Jews were looking only for a deliverer from the Roman power and for a greater national prosperity; thus, when the Messiah came, the leaders and many others rejected him” [Guide to the Scriptures, “Messiah,”
The words of the Book of Mormon. These words were written “to the convincing of the Jew and Gentile that Jesus is the Christ” (title page of the Book of Mormon)
Jesus Christ is the only name whereby we can be saved.)
In the scriptures, the word name can be used to represent a person or to represent his or her power or authority. Thus, another way of saying that “Jesus Christ is the only name whereby we can be saved”.
"Jesus Christ is the only name by which we can be saved?
2 Nephi 25:21-30
Nephi teaches about the saving grace of Jesus Christ and of the importance of believing in Him
President Dieter F. Uchtdorf of the First Presidency:
“Many people feel discouraged because they constantly fall short. They know firsthand that ‘the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak’ [Matthew 26:41; see also Romans 7:19].
They raise their voices with Nephi in proclaiming, ‘My soul grieveth because of mine iniquities’ [2 Nephi 4:17]”
(Dieter F. Uchtdorf, “The Gift of Grace,” Ensign or Liahona, May 2015,
❤❤❤,and that is fact!! ❤❤❤
Nephi was living approximately 600 years before the birth of the Savior and long before any "saving grace" had yet been offered to the world. Moreover Nephi and his people were busy observing Mosaic Law (over 600 prescribed rules and regulations).
Nevertheless, if you read on, Nephi fully understands where his salvation comes from.
Nephi's remarks are exactly what a true prophet of God might say during this time.
Do you really think that a twenty-three year old Joseph Smith, was considering all of this when he "concocted" the Book of Mormon?
It is good that you use one of our English versions to prove this. The JSV also proves it. JS inserts the word "But," but it does not change the text of the KJV, which JS used and changed. It is important to show the Mormons that the JSV is itself a contridiction of truth.
The Mormon rejection of grace can be traced to Alex. Campbell who founded the Disciples of Christ movement, and to Emmanuel Swedenborg, who hated the doctrine of Justification by faith to the point that he excluded all of the epistles of Paul from his own canon of scripture. Joseph Smith learned what Campbell taught thru Sidney Rigdon. As for Swedenborg, Smith used his material which cost him some of his followers who saw the theft.
This debate between works and grace is an old one, but the bible speaks of both grace and works. C.S. Lewis likewise gives the analogy of a pair of scissors both works and grace are the blades that make the scissors function. They are not in opposition to one another.
They are in opposition to each other. Salvation cannot be earned. This is the point of Eph. 2:8-9. Once saved, not by words, the believer is expected to live out their faith in accordance with "good works." Because works have no place in the justification of a lost person is not the same as a Justified person, having been saved, regarding living out in their lives the principles of Godly living as outlined in the Letters to the Christian church. There are three tenses of "Salvation" 1. I have been saved - Justification, not of works. 2. Sanctification, setting apart: Now that a person is saved meaning justified, that person reads and studies God's word, and if an obedient believer, will do good words. Good words are conforming to the "Fruit of the Spirit." Live a life according to the fruit of the Spirit, and you will be an obedient witness. 3. Glorification is the final stage of one's salvation. Glorification is being absent from the body and present with the Lord.
Well said! I'm thankful that I do not have to earn my own righteousness, but that I have Christ's.
2 Nephi 25:33 states that one is saved by faith after all we can do, in simpler words it means that even though our efforts would be insufficient to merit salvation, we are expected as followers of Christ to play our part by doing our very best in our discipleship. This very sentiment is echoed in James 2: 17-26 where it is made abundantly clear that faith without works is dead. Thus there is no contradiction whatsoever between Ephesians 2, James 2 and 2 Nephi 25; quite the contrary in fact; all these inspired scriptures provide us with a more complete and correct picture of the relationship between faith and works. Why complain about having coherent additional information regarding such an important doctrine?.
Do you know that you have eternal life? When you die and stand before God and He asks, "hide181chef17, Why should I let you into heaven?" What will you say?
Complaining? He is teaching from the words of God.
The church of God was obtained by his own blood. Not by Joseph smith.
Besides there is absolutely no historical evidence that can place any of the happenings of the Book of Mormon in any part of the world. Archaeologists have proven this, LDS ones who searched diligently. The Mormon church website acknowledges this and insists that the members simply have to believe. If the doctrine is true then the Bible should prove it 100% but it actually does a better job of invalidating it and even classifying it into a doctrine of the devil.
Grace is a gift of God and grace is not your own doing for it is God's doing that is what Ephesians 2:8-9 means. Ofcourse Grace is our gift. After everything that we have done comes Grace from God to fill up our gaps.
In the Christian world at the time the Book of Mormon was published nobody had a hard time with that verse. It was universally understood to mean we are saved by grace not works. And actually, the Christian world in general, found no faults in the of Mormon, other than they did not think it should exist. It is a monotheistic traditional Christian text. Since that time, the church of Jesus Christ of latter-day Saints has created additional doctrines, changed the wording of some of the Book of Mormon, and went to great effort to reinterpret book of Mormon versus. But those later doctrines need to stand on their own. They are not supported by the book of Mormon. One can accept the book of Mormon and not accept mainstream Mormonism, or any Mormonism. It is simply another testament of Jesus Christ that God prepared for his children. Thanks for bringing awareness to it.
My question would be that if God was the author or the Book of Mormon, then why did man (you) change Gods Word and its meaning? I think you also need to see the activities and beliefs of early Mormonism which coincides with this verse. With that said, the Mormons DO believe that ADDITIONAL EFFORT is required in order to earn Eternal Life and exalt oneself to the highest celestial glory. Otherwise, the Mormon is at risk that you will not live with God the Father and you will no longer be able to live the law of progression. The law of progression is man's works to ADDED to what Christ has done. In practice, although Mormons tell us that 2 Nephi does not imply that God only gives His grace after all a Mormon does, in practice, the Mormons are STRIVING to do the very thing it is saying!!! It is even in the Mormon Articles of Faith - We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind MAY be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel. That is a works based gospel and is heresy.
2 nephi 25:23 contradicts itself and the Bible, Romans 11:6 If you're saved by works it's no longer grace, or by grace then not of works.
Here's your reminder that member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints read + study the Book of Mormon AND the King James Bible.
And therein lies the problem.
Hi, Missionary for the Church of Jesus Christ here. I used to have a hard time with this verse I used to think that it was a huge contradiction to the Bible. But it wasn't until I read the verse slowly and focused on what it actually says that I was able to understand how it doesn'tcontradict the Bible. Rather it works perfectly with what the Bible says.
"For we labor diligently to write, to persuade out children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do."
2 Nephi 25:23
The verse literally tells us what "All we can do" to be saved is. In the middle of the verse it says "To believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God".
2 Nephi doesn't give us a huge list of "works" that we have to do to be saved. Rather, it simply tells us what the Bible says we must do to be saved.
1. Believe in Christ. (Have faith)
2. be reconciled to God (Repent)
Hi! Thanks for responding!
My question for you: what you do with the word "after"?
2 Nephi doesn't say "all we can do is this: believe and be reconciled." He throws the word "after," and then ends the sentence after that clause (meaning the "all we can do" MUST grammatically go with the "after.")
On its own it seems problematic, but when compared with Ephesians 2:8-9, it says the exact opposite thing. (Note the difference: "after all we can DO" vs. "this is NOT your own doing")
@@GLM Does the Bible say that you can be saved without faith? if it does please let me know. Also, does the Bible say that we can be saved without repentance (being reconciled to God)? Again, let me know if it does. So with the word "after", we imply that we cannot be saved until "after" we "believe in christ, and are reconciled to God".
John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
So first you have to have faith (believe in christ) before you can be saved.
2 Nephi 25:23 - For we labor diligently to write, to persuade out children, and also out brethren, to believe in Christ, and be reconciled to God ; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.
"All we can do" = 1. Believe in Christ
2. Be reconciled to God
@@shaydonburke253 Your answer at first glance sort of sounds like it goes against the interpretation of past church leaders. Marion Romney said, “It will require *maximum effort* for us to bring ourselves within the reach of the atoning blood of Jesus Christ so that we can be saved” in Ensign, May 1979, p. 94. James Faust said, *“After all we can do to pay to the uttermost farthing* and make right our wrongs, the Savior's grace is activated in our lives through the Atonement” in Ensign, Nov. 2001, pp. 18ff.
Your answer *does* fall in line with other statements that are a bit more nuanced by linking this verse with Alma 24:11 and saying that “all we can do” is basically repentance, as you’ve pointed out. However, I’m not sure this is really saying anything different when you consider how LDS doctrine defines repentance.
_Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual_ says, “Repentance must involve an *all-out, total surrender* to the program of the Lord. That transgressor is not fully repentant who neglects his tithing, misses his meetings, breaks the Sabbath, fails in his family prayers, does not sustain the authorities of the Church, breaks the Word of Wisdom, does not love the Lord nor his fellowmen.” _Gospel Principles_ says, “Repentance sometimes requires great courage, much strength, many tears, unceasing prayers, and *untiring efforts* to live the commandments of the Lord.” Isn’t this beginning to sound like the face-value meaning of “after all we can do”?
Biblical faith is trusting solely in the work of Christ on our behalf. Eternal life is not just something in the future to work for. Jesus said you can have eternal life *right now* (notice the present tense in John 3:36; 6:47; and 1 John 5:11-13) if you simply believe, trusting in Him and abandoning your own efforts as a means to that end.
2 nephi 23:25 says we must do all we can in order for God to give us grace for ye are saved by grace after all we can do Ephesians 2:8-9 by grace we are saved and that not of our selfs it is a free gift of God least anyone shall boast. Clear contradiction
The church also demands works you must pay money in order to enter the temple to do indowments stolen from the free masonic temple witch Joseph Smith was a free mason . Jesus said and Paul said the temple is our bodies in John and Corinthians
I have a high school friend who reached out to me last month. I was surprised to find out she was Mormon but decided to hear her out. I received Christ in May 2022 and don't plan on turning my back on Him. I researched a bit before going to her church to play volleyball in case they asked me questions. Since then, l knew that our views on Salvation weren't the same and so when they introduced me to Sister this and Sister that, l would say that l didn't know their names yet but in reality, I doubted being able to call them sister at all because of their faith.
If they don't believe that Christ is the light, life, and truth, then how can they accept Him as Lord and Savior? If they think they have to work for their Salvation, then how can they receive Christ? We are adopted into God's family through repentance, faith in Jesus' death, resurrection, and accepting Him as He is and said He was: the Son of God. Basically, God the Son. I just don't know what to call them...would they mind if l told them that I'm not comfortable using that title or name?
Bible tells us what we should call them in 1 Corinthians 9:20-22
Phillipians 2:12
When you receive the Holy Spirit your expected to do good works. Good works is not required to enter the kingdom of God.
Mormons have the most grace of any religion, as the ATONEMENT covers even those who do not believe. Good works, when you run it by the LDS theology, are ETERNAL REWARDS, just like in Christianity. Mormons believe in different countries, or levels, of Heaven, which scale with Christeousness.
@@EricSmyth4Christ Christians don't believe in different levels of heaven. The Bible is clear you either go to be with God or you are cast into hades for punishment of the sins you committed in this life. I would encourage you to see that the Bible never teaches that the atonement is given to those who never believe. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life."
John 3:16. Notice that only those who believe will have eternal life and those who don't will perish.
@@EricSmyth4Christ And they are not actually levels in heaven but different degrees of Glory. Mormonism teaches or reward in heaven is 5 degrees of glory, Telestrial Kigdom, Terrestrial Kingdom, and three degrees in the Celestial Kingdom.
Matthew 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
When you inherit a Kingdom what does the king place on your head? That's right a crown.
Christianity teaches that our reward in heaven are 5 Heavenly Crowns of Glory, crown of life, crown of righteousness, crown of glory, crown of rejoicing, and the crown of victory.
👑 5 Heavenly Crowns of Glory
🏰 5 Heavenly Kingdoms of Glory
Because Christ explains that the Kingdom of God is inside of us, then it's not unreasonable for Mormons and other Christians to understand that our inheritance is our Glory which is based on our works and the covenants and promises we make and keep with God.
This changes the idea that a crown is a physical object or that a kingdom is an actual place, but it is actually the same place.
@@1689-Cigars A Christian is a person that believes in the Gospel Of Jesus Christ which is that Christ suffered in Gethsemane by taking the bitter cup, that he Died on the Cross, burried in a tomb, and was resurected on the third day. This is the only Gospel of Jesus Christ that saves and requires no works. This merciful act of GRACE saves us from Hell. This is how even as a Mormon I know I am saved through the blood of CHRIST.
This is also what makes me as a Mormon a Christian, because I am IN CHRIST.
I do not accept or agree with everything in the Mormon church and I do not put my faith and trust in a church, a declared prophet, or a book of scripture, but I only put my trust and faith in Christ that dwells inside me
@@danite1742 2 points for consideration.
1. Can you produce for me a single Bible verse that links the garden of gethsemane to the atonement? I can find plenty linking the cross to the atonement but none with the garden. That's because the garden had nothing to do with the atonement. The cross is where Jesus atoned for our sins.
2. I find you list of things we need to believe about the gospel missing a very important point. Who Jesus is. That would seem, to me to be the most important point. You wouldn't say that someone who affirmed every point of what you said the gospel is and yet denies Jesus is the son of God a Christian would you?
Some good old fashioned hermeneutics will show that the phrase “after all we can do” is a Book of Mormon phrase that means, “to repent”. See Alma 24:11. This whole argument is silly.
But LDS “repentance must involve an *_all-out, total surrender_* to the program of the Lord" (Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual, emphasis added). That sounds to me like "all we can do."
I agree.
This is very interesting, I’ve never read a Mormon “bible”.
Btw you have such an excellent video quality
The BoM preaches the exact same gospel. It tells us within the verse itself what "all we can do" is in order to be saved by grace:
-beleive in Christ
-be reconciled to God
All the sectarian tossers say the BoM doesn't teach the same gospel as the NT, pointing out 2 Nephi 25:23, utterly disregarding the entirety of the book and resting their baseless claim upon an excised isolated verse. Simply read the rest of the chapter, and we see Nephi agreeing with Paul saying that we are made alive in Christ because of our faith, and that the law of Moses is dead.
Is Jesus Lucifer’s brother?
@@bryan922 The Mormon Doctrine is contrary to the Bible, do your research and read the Book of John in the scriptures!!
Yes 💯
As a Mormon for 60 years you are spot on here.
Are you still a Mormon?
Compare 2 Nephi 25:23 to Mark 8:35
2 Nephi 25:23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.
Mark 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.
Saved in both verses means sanctification which requires complete life long commitment to Christ.
Also both the Bible and book of Mormon teach that grace is an enabling power to help bring us to God.
compare:
1 Peter 5:5-6 to Ether 12:27
1 Peter 5:5-6 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
Ether 12:27 And if men come unto me I will show unto them their weakness. I give unto men weakness that they may be humble; and my grace is sufficient for all men that humble themselves before me; for if they humble themselves before me, and have faith in me, then will I make weak things become strong unto them.
Mormon here. After in that verse does not mean because of. It means in-spite of.
We are saved by grace despite all we can do.
Lots of things you can say to dismantle the church of LDS but comparing faith to works is not it. To believe and to act are arguably the same
Nephi is actually borrowing from his brother Jacob in Nephi 10:24 that you are only reconciled with God through the GRACE of Christ. In other words what they are trying to say here is that there is nothing you need to do.
Mormonism teaches that The Gospel of Jesus Christ is that Christ suffered in Gethsemane, Died on the Cross, was buried in a tomb, and was raised on the 3rd day overcoming spiritual and physical death. This is a gift given to all regardless of sex, color, religion, or national origin.
Mormonism focuses on their Works as a way to receive their rewads in heaven which is our Glory in heaven based on our works. This is where a lot of confusion happens because our Glory is constantly changing based on our righteousness, unrightousness, and repentance. Chirst has also made it possible for us to repent when we lose part of our glory and allows us to gain that glory back. As Mormons we also call this salvation but not the same salvation as the salvation from Hell, but salvation of receiving our GLORY.
So to get this summed up there are 2 separate things we are talking about:
1) GRACE - NO WORKS - IN CHRIST
2) AWARDS - WORKS - GLORY
To understand our rewards in heaven research the 5 - Heavenly Crowns of Glory.
You are misrepresenting 2 Nephi 10:24 "Wherefore, my beloved brethren, reconcile yourselves to the will of God, and not to the will of the devil and the flesh; and remember, after ye are reconciled unto God, that it is only in and through the grace of God that ye are saved." As you can clearly see from the verse you must reconcile yourself to God first then can you be saved. So in Mormonism it's
work as hard as you can to obey to the laws and ordinances of the gospel, then grace takes you the rest of the way, and then you are saved. (See 3rd article of faith and Moroni 10:32 along with the verses talked about in the video and my comment).
How about up until the civil rights movements? Was Jesus’ Grace for the African American, according to Joseph Smith or Brigham Young? I know god reversed his curse on African Americans, conveniently, but what about those that came before the lifting of the curse?
Which Christ? The christ that is Lucifer’s brother or the Christ that created everything?
Mormons have the most grace of any religion, as the ATONEMENT covers even those who do not believe. Good works, when you run it by the whole LDS theology, are ETERNAL REWARDS, just like in Christianity. Mormons believe in different levels of Heaven, which scale with the full mixed bag of one's Christeousness (Morality/Works/Fruits/Repentance/Obedience/etc)
In the LDS framework, on what basis is that universal grace applied and punishment forgone? On the basis of your righteousness, or Christ’s righteousness? If it is based on yours, then it is not based on grace. If it is based on Christ’s, then why is Christ’s righteousness not sufficient to elevate someone to the highest level of heaven?
Your position also seems to ignore the many, many warnings in the NT of those who will be turned away at judgment to spend an eternity where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Christians don’t argue that “our grace” is more widely distributed than the “LDS grace.” But ours is a deeper grace, covering more and elevating us higher. The LDS grace allows you to have a resurrected body. Biblical grace imputes the righteousness of Jesus to us, and on that basis alone we are counted as worthy enough to ascend to the highest level of heaven. To attain that honor, a Latter Day Saint would have to work for it.
The LDS grace allows you to Become More. To live with our Heavenly Father and become like Him. And be with our families forever. Not just to have a resurrected body my friend. The LDS grace allows those who die without even knowing who Christ is to enter into the Celestial Kingdom. Mainstream Christianity believes people (even infants) who die without being baptized go to hell. I suggest doing more research on grace before claiming "our grace is deeper".
Yet you gotta keep a temple recommend with all the commandments (no drinking, no sex before marriage, wearing special underwear, follow the prophecy ect) to get to Heavenly Father. So something that Jesus already paid for John 14:6 the LDS members are trying to earn? How is that more grace?
@@shaydonburke253 so how do you respond to Galatians? What happens if you don't complete you're worthiness and complete your temple ceremonies? Exactly. Works cannot save you. You complete works because you are saved. Please do you research. You will not become a god. You will not be become exalted. If you try to live by the law you are cursed to follow all of it. Which no man can do. Jesus is the only one who lived a perfect life and took the punishment we deserved. Through faith and grace you are saved. Read the new testament. There is a contradiction with Mormonism everywhere.
@@shaydonburke253 but the LDS grace is in contradiction to the christian Bible. 1John 5 :12 says, He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son does not have life. Mark16:16, Acts 4:12, John 3:16, and many more verses support that only those who believe in Christ 's atonement will be saved. 1Cor 15: 1-4, Romans 10:9, is the formula for salvation.
The Book of Mormon is in complete harmony with the Bible. Read it and you’ll see it’s not at odds with the Bible at all.
❤Read Moroni 10: 4-5 and receive a witness from God that The Book of Mormon - Another Testament of Jesus Christ, is sacred scripture as well as the Bible. 😊
How does Philippians 2:12 interact with both of these verses?
The works are done by faith, repenting, make sacred covenants and enter into Baptism of Water and Spirit as per John 3:5, become called to receive the Priesthood (if male) as per 1st Peter 2:9, being endowed from on high as per Luke 24:49, and getting married as per Hebrews 13:4 as well as keeping the laws Christ gave us. Keep in mind that at that part of the Book of Mormon, the Law of Moses had not been fulfilled yet and therefore grace comes to fill in where the Law of Moses cannot protect, which is everything. No contradictions but context is extremely important.
Crazy! Don't know how I missed it until now. Just found this proof for the Book of Mormon in the Song of Solomon: The…bo…ok…of…mor…mon…is…tru…e
Works of the law Torah and moral works decided by men are what doesn't lead to salvation. The works of the holy spirit are not these works and DO lead to salvation. People always seem to get these confused. Look up the full English definition of the word WORKS and it becomes obvious that obedience to God through the Holy spirit bestowed by sincere faith(trust) in the messiah will inevitably produce works of God.
NOT BY FAITH ONLY
A man is justified by works,
and NOT By Faith Only ... James 2:24
James’ point here is not that we are saved in part due to the virtue of our works, or not even due to the works at all. He is saying that we can’t have saving faith without it producing works. This is why he says,“...Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works,” (v 18) and “[Abraham’s] faith was complete by his works” (v 22). James is evidencing that you can’t call yourself a believer if you aren’t bearing fruit.
James’ passage can be viewed as “justification before men” (or “how we know the faith was legitimate”), whereas Paul’s account of Abraham is detailing how Abraham was justified before God:
“Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.” - Rom 4:3
Paul goes on to say, “Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. And to the one who *does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly*, his faith is counted as righteousness” - Rom 4:4-5
Works are a necessary outflow from faith, but the works themselves are not prerequisites or conditions to salvation and forgiveness.
Why do you hide your name? you are taking scriptutes out of context
As a Mormon I will tell you that you are taking that Scripture out of context. We are talking about how someone is SAVED. The LDS Church official standing on this topic is that we are saved from the outer darkness of Hell through the GRACE of Christ only and that no works are needed. Our salvation is sealed by the Gospel of Jesus Christ. What is the Gospel of Jesus Christ?
It is that Christ suffered in Gethsemane, Died on the Cross, was buried in the Tomb, and resurected the third day. This is the only Gospel of Christ we teach in the LDS church.
When we go to heaven we are rewarded for our works in the form of Glory based on the things we have done here on earth.
1) Grace = Jesus Christ = Salvation
2) Works = Awards in heaven = Glory
You need to understand that The Gospel of Jesus Christ is for Salvation and the Doctrine in the scriptures is to help us achieve our Glory. For example the Principles and Ordinances of the Gospel is not the Gospel but it's doctrine on what we need to do to make a commitment to God that we will exit our old life of sin and start a new life IN CHRIST and the symbolic method of doing this is through Baptism which represents the death, Burial, and Resurection.
This is why we teach that the Principals and Ordinances of the Gospel are:
1) Faith
2) Repentance
3) Baptism
4) Gift of The Holy Ghost
Its symbolic to the Gospel but it's not the Gospel because, baptism is for our Glory and not for our salvation.
For all you Mormons think about what you were taught were the people that will go to the outer darkness of hell? Now think about the people that go to the lowest kingdom (criminals, murders, rapests, etc.)
Now we just need Mormons to stop thinking that the Kingdoms of Glory are different physical locations because the Kingdom of God is in you and the Glory is also inside of you.
@@danite1742 The issue is that you're using a different definition when you talk about salvation. For the Christian, salvation is salvation from hell, yes, but also is salvation TO something. What is the "something" we are saved to? Eternity in God's presence.
For the Mormon- Christ's death secured resurrection for everyone, for few will experience outer darkness. But the telestial kingdom lacks the presence of Christ and the Father. The terrestrial kingdom lacks the presence of the Father. Only the Celestial kingdom is the "heaven" where a person experiences the full presence of God.
So if we take the Christianity of definition of heaven and salvation- and we say that the parallel to that in Mormonism is where the fullness of God's presence dwells, then the equivalent of Christian heaven (which there's only one, not three, and God is one being, not three beings who belong to the same godhead) is the Mormon celestial kingdom.
Mormons believe that to enjoy the fulness of God's presence for eternity take certain works. That is a works-based salvation. There is no heaven without being able to enjoy God's presence, therefore the other "degrees of glory" in Mormon theology (which don't exist in Christian theology, but I'm tryin to draw the best parallels I can) are not heaven or salvation to the Christian. They are still separation from the full glory of God.
If you believe that you must do certain works and ordinances, belong to a specific church, pay tithing, ect all to be able to be in God's full and eternal presence, then you believe in a salvation based on works.
TO: @@BNichols021
RE: in my opinion vs in your opinion
YOU SAID
James’ point here is not that we are saved in part due to the virtue of our works,
ABEL
James' point here is that, and I quote, word for word,
A man is justified by works.
Nevertheless, Joseph Smith does not reject the efficacy or necessity of grace
Non-LDS Christian Stephen H. Webb wrote:
Two corrections of common misrepresentations of Smith’s theology need to be made at this point. First, Mormons are often charged with denying the efficacy of grace and thus making salvation dependent upon the exercise of the individual’s free will. All theologians use the language of effort, reform, and growth, so this is not a fair charge.... In any case, Smith describes the process of sanctification as being “from grace to grace.” Rather than replicating Pelagianism, Smith is siding with that aspect of the Christian tradition best represented by Thomas Aquinas, which says we can and must cooperate with divine grace in order to permit it to actualize our potential for divinization. (Stephen H. Webb, "Godbodied: The Matter of the Latter-day Saints (reprint from his book Jesus Christ, Eternal God: Heavenly Flesh and the Metaphysics of Matter (Oxford University Press, 2012)," Brigham Young University Studies 50 no. 3 (2011). :96-97)
.
YOU SAID
or not even due to the works at all.
ABEL
That's your opinion.
That's what you say.
James says, "A man is justified by works."
.
YOU SAID
He is saying that we can’t have saving faith without it producing works.
ABEL
That's not what he said in this scripture.
In this scripture, James said, quote"
"A man is justified by works."
.
YOU SAID
This is why he says,“...Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works,” (v 18)
ABEL
In your opinion.
we can't have saving faith without it producing works.
In my opinion.
We can't have saving faith without producing works may be true,
but that is not what this scripture says.
This scripture says:
Show me your faith apart from your works.
IOW, or in other words...
Faith without works is dead.
and I will show you my faith by my works.
IOW, or in other words...
My life is an example of the love I have for the Savior.
My actions are an example of the love I have for the Savior.
I love the Lord,
therefore,
I keep the commandments.
.
YOU SAID
and “[Abraham’s] faith was complete by his works” (v 22).
ABEL
You see that his faith was working together with his works and his faith was perfected by works. (NET)
The New English Translation teaches us that faith is perfected by our works; or, conversely, faith is imperfect without works; or, in other words, faith without works is dead.
.
YOU SAID
James is evidencing that you can’t call yourself a believer if you aren’t bearing fruit.
ABEL
True enough.
.
YOU SAID
James’ passage can be viewed as “justification before men”
(or “how we know the faith was legitimate”),
ABEL
James teaches us how to be justified.
meaning justified.
not being simply justified before men.
but the only kind of justification is ~
Justification before man and God.
IOW, in other words...
If a is justified before men he is not justified, but a man is justified in the true sense of the word when he is justified before man and God.
.
YOU SAID
whereas Paul’s account of Abraham is detailing how Abraham was justified before God:
“Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.” - Rom 4:3
ABEL
True.
.
YOU SAID
Paul goes on to say, “Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due.
ABEL
True, therefore... If you keep the commandments, then you are blessed.
As a matter of fact, the parable of the talent tells that our talents will increase.
The scriptures teach us that we will be judged according to our works, not according to our faith.
Nevertheless,
Our works must be done with an eye single to the glory of God.
.
YOU SAID
And to the one who *does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly*, his faith is counted as righteousness” - Rom 4:4-5
ABEL
James 2:19
Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
IOW, in other words...
Yes ... we agree with Paul and you when you say that faith is a good thing.
But we are saying that there is more to the story than just faith, a good thing ...
The devils believe in Christ. In fact, they do more than believe, they know Christ and the apostles.
Acts 19:15
And the evil spirit answered and said, Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are ye?
Since devils not only believe in Christ, but in fact know Him, we must ask if the devils are saved, because if they are not, then belief will not save us.
.
YOU SAID
Works are a necessary outflow from faith,
ABEL
True
.
YOU SAID
but the works themselves are not prerequisites or conditions to salvation and forgiveness.
ABEL
In my opinion, this is a dangerous thing to say, because it is paramount to saying that keeping the commandments is not a prerequisite or condition of the gospel.
In my opinion,
If you love the Lord, then you will keep the commandments.
Which means that the converse is also true.
If you do not love the Lord, then you will not necessarily keep the commandments.
Nevertheless,
to my understanding,
in order to enter into the kingdom of God.
we will have needed to learn to love one another.
and to love God with all our heart, might, minds and soul.
May we all have this kind of love,
Is my prayer,
In the name of Jesus Christ.
Praise Jesus.
You are taking the position of a particular kind of Protestant theology that denies that you have to obey God and keep the commandments in order to have eternal life. Initial salvation, being rescued from sin by believing on Christ, must go on to include obedience to God and keeping the commandments in order to remain saved and enter eternal life. That is what Paul and the other Scriptures teach. The point is that God has made it possible for all to choose whether or not to believe in Christ. His grace enables them to obey Him, but they must cooperate with grace and do good works. The only basis on which this is possible is the atonement of Christ. LDS believe that. Your "once saved always saved" theology is not held by all Christians. According to your theory, you do not have to do anything, but are guaranteed heaven regardless of how you live. That is not Biblical.
Do you keep all the commandments when you obey Christ? James 2:10 says if you break one, you break them all. So, do you keep all 10 commandments?
Do you live up to the Sermon on the Mount? If not, how do you know you are saved? How much of the "Sermon on the Mount" good deeds will get you there? One-fourth? One-half?
Read Romans 4:5 "But to him that worketh not, his faith is counted for righteousness".
1John 5:13 says you can know you are saved. The previous verse 12 says "He who hath the Son hath life".
Where is the list of works that assures you of eternal life, that you hath life? How do you know you have reached the quota of works that satisfies God, and assures you, that you finally reached the heavenly goal, that you finally know you are saved?
1 Cor 15: 1--4 says that you are saved by the Gospel, by believing in the death, burial, and ressurection of Jesus Christ. Ephesians 1: 13-14 says we are sealed with the Holy Spirit after trusting the Gospel of salvation. Philippians 2:13 tells us God then works in us at His pleasure to do works.
Some will do few works; some will do mighty works; some will do no works, like the thief on the cross. It is all at God's pleasure, not ours. Without works, we are ineffective Christians, but we are still sealed by the Holy Ghost.
Works are important. The Book of James says faith without works is dead. He is correct. But, if we can save ourselves, why did we need Christ's atonement.
Isaiah 64: 6 says all our righteousness is like a filthy rag. How many filthy rags does it take to "prop up the cross" of Christ, so we can add to Christ's atonement, since our help is needed? Christ, though He was perfect, needs our help, we who are imperfect, so imperfect we are filthy rags before a perfect God?
We should do good works. Works are very important for our rewards in heaven. But, our entry into heaven is by grace thru faith, and I can quote 112 faith-alone verses in the christian Bible to prove it.
He covered that as well, watch the video again.
A Christian will do good works because he has been saved, not to be saved. As a newborn baby will cry spontaneously, so he who is born of the Spirit will live to please God. Those who think salvation can be lost don’t understand what happens in regeneration.
No one is saved through works, but one who is saved truly through Jesus will have the desire to live Godly and turn away from sin whilst doing good works otherwise they have not been saved that is what the my bible teaches
Praise the one true living god who is from everlasting to everlasting,
If only Evangelicals had any idea who that is. But they can't be bothered to read the Bible and believe it. They always have to add to it, to make it fit their version, instead of taking it at its word.
Do you realize we believe both verses you quoted and we don’t believe that the verse in the Book of Mormon says what you are claiming? There are many scriptures that clarify our beliefs, but these are not convenient to people attacking the Book of Mormon, one example comes to mind, 2 Nephi 10:24 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, reconcile yourselves to the will of God, and not to the will of the devil and the flesh; and remember, after ye are reconciled unto God, that it is only in and through the grace of God that ye are saved.” Now ask yourself, are there other things the content creators are trying to hide? I submit that these guys have an agenda and it doesn’t involve full transparency. They are shooting blanks anyway.
The Book of Mormon is fiction so what it says is irrelevant
Do you know that you have eternal life? When you die and stand before God and He asks, "mdcarson, Why should I let you into heaven?" What will you say?
2 Nephi 25:23 &1 Cor.15:21-22, we are save by Grace, from the Grave, after (all) we can do, not personal sins. Personal sins, requires works.
Thank you for the truth!! God Bless You!!
You want truth? Grace through FAITH. In Galatians 5:6 it says that "Faith worketh by love." James 2: 14-17 "What doth it prophet, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food. And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone." James 2: 22 "Seest thou how that faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect." James 2: 24 "Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." John 14: 15 "If ye love me, keep my commandments." John 14: 21 "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him." 1 John 4: 8 "He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love." The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter-day Saints is by far the most charitable Christian church, even though they don't publish it themselves. They are known for their friendliness. They live on average 10 years longer than any other Christian church. They are the most devout, having high regular church attendance by all ages. And they are the most Bible literate of any Christian church. So when other churches spout the Bible verse, or half Bible verse, out of context, they can show the dozen other verses that make these churches interpretations impossible.
You would be on firmer ground if you used Scripture to challenge the later teachings of Joseph Smith Jr and Brigham Young, in which they made secret rituals necessary for attaining ultimate salvation. Instead, you are taking the distorted faith versus works approach of setting the New Testament Scriptures against each other. LDS theology in the early days seems to owe much to the kind of Arminian theology held by the Methodists known to Smith and Young. I guess you are Calvinists and would have similar arguments against Wesleyan Arminianism.
You are talking about the 2nd endowment. It's not a greater salvation it was actually to achieve a higher degree of glory and just so you this is a private practice that still goes on today.
These are all awards in heaven that are related to the teachings of the 5 Heavenly Crowns of Glory taught in basic Christianity. This is all Mormons are ever tring to work to is achieving Glory which has to be done in the right mindset and that is to Glorify God.
Early Methodists were nothing like Mormons. Not sure why you would say that...
Salvation is not a Rubik's cube; it is simply by grace thru faith. Salvation is so simple a child can grasp it (Matthew 18: 3,4), yet everyone makes it so complicated.
Wouldn't a mormon just point to James 2 or Matthew 19 and conclude that the Bible is inconsistent?
The missionaries I met told me they believe in grace only, and that they dont believe in works for salvation. I dont know how to respond to them
The best book I've found is Responding to the Mormon Missionary Message by Corey Miller and Ross Anderson. They are ex-Mormon missionaries. It helped to understand the tactics missionaries will use and how to respond with love.
All these Churches and we have the same belief Jesus Christ is lord but we're divided because these false prophets and teachers with THEIR books like a part 2 of the Bible. When God said if any man preaches another gospel don't listen.
"Latter-day Saints claim that the Book of Mormon helps interpret the Bible. 2 Nephi 25:23 says "...for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.” A comparable passage in the Bible, Ephesians 2:8-19, says, "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." These two passages are teaching mutually exclusive things."
No man, it's the same thing in meaning, spoken by two different people. (Not by works but by grace.) For instance, if you plant a seed and do all you can until it takes root, grows and produces fruit. After all the work you have done, that it grows and produces fruit is the miracle. But it wouldn't happen if you didn't do your part. Our conduct is integral to our salvation.
Twisting the Bible and the laws of rules
What about James 1:5-8 ? or verses 22-25 ?
Faith Alone is a modern heresy, NO ANCIENT FATHER believed in it. ALL ancient Christians believed that we MUST OBEY God for our salvation. Faith through works. Faithfulness has ALWAYS meant loyalty by OBEDIENCE. Read book of James. Protestant heretics have invented a false doctrine and judge other heretics on it, which is hilarious.
It's also talking about repentance alma 24.11 romans 3.23 6.23 5.8 10.9 john 3.16 1john 1.8 acts 2.38 john 3.3 john 14.
The works spoken of by Paul to the Jewish believers when gentiles wanted to be baptized bit were told to circumcise and become proselytes to Judaism then they can be baptized, it was this " you are not a circumcised Jew therefore you are not a true believer" attitude that Paul was saying is the boast
Thanks God, I'm not a Moron, or mormon.
It is not saying that at all. Look at the rest of the verse in context. They are laboring to teach their children to become reconciled unto Christ. That means repentance. Would you say that if you say you have faith, even if you live a terrible life that God will let Grace lay claim to you? That doesn’t sound like a just God to me. After all we can do is repentance for sin. We know we have sinned, we repent and then the sacrifice of Jesus has claim on us. The concept that grace is a free gift for everyone is also erroneous. If that were true there is no hell and there would be no justice in God. It is through repentance that we qualify for grace. Hence, it is not of our own works that we are saved but by becoming reconciled to Jesus. Look at the full context of the passage. Also, faith is more than belief. There is action that comes from faith. I look at as trust unto obedience.
We still need the grace of god despite all that we can do. Even if we do a lot we still cannot boast because we are still lost without the grace of god. This UA-cam preacher is teaching a false gospel again. We do not do good works because we are saved. Many people who don’t accept Christ do good works. There is also a distinction between the works of the mosaic law and good works. If we mustn’t strive to do anything good then ignore all the teaching in Matthew 25 and why this counsel from the apostle Paul; 1 Corinthians 9:24?
Christians aren't ENCOURAGED to do their BEST or will be accused of "doing works" 🤷 yet bible says "be holy as I am"
The thing is you can't be Holy as he is..
The Book of Mormon has absolutely no credibility. The people and places are not proven to exist, it was written by a man and not God-breathed. Also, the Book of Mormon contains grave errors and contradictions.
Are Mormons Followers of Christ?Mormons are not Followers of Christ. They deny the basic and essential doctrines of the Christian faith. They deny that there is one God, and that God has always existed as He is. They deny the deity of Christ and the eternality of Christ. They also deny that forgiveness of sins is by grace alone through faith alone.
Below, is Scriptual support from the Bible, the God-Breathed true of God.
Colossians 1:15-16 - Referring to Jesus ChristHe is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
Romans 6:23 “For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.”
Romans 10:9-10 “that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.”
Ephesians 2:8-10 “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.”
Initially you stated that the 2 Nephi 25:23 passage could be interpreted in different ways, but then you only give YOUR one interpretation and run with that through the rest of the video as if yours was the correct and only interpretation. I would say you are misinterpreting the passage. For one thing you focus ONLY on the last part of the verse without considering what Nephi says he and other leaders are doing because they know it is by grace they are saved after all they can do. The focus is stated in the verse itself -- they diligently teach belief in Christ and being reconciled to God. He is not saying that because grace only kicks in after all we can do they are emphasizing keeping the commandments or doing all we can ourselves.
Todd, have you shared this concern with LDS leaders as well? From the 1950’s to the 1990’s LDS apostles and prophets often construed it to mean that grace kicks in after the prerequisite of maximal obedience. Do you believe that Bradley has been misled by your leaders?
But didn’t Paul also say this: Phillipians 2:12?
Let me educate you on this. No were does it say work.... thats your interpretation, it says after all we can do. What is it we can do and must do? 1. Have faith. 2 repent. Christ and his apostles taught that repentance is essential. 3 we have to accept the free gift and then do the things Jesus did. It takes some effort to accept Christ's free gift. For most of my life I could not truly accept His gift because I didn't feel worthy of Him. Most of this was because of the depression I suffered with. I could see why God loved others but not me. It took effort for me to believe, to have faith. If you want to call it work so be it, but that precious gift He has for us won't do us an ounce of good if we don't accept it. It has nothing to do with attending church or going on missions or doing anything the church may ask of us. Those things are following His command to do the things He has done. So your understanding is completely false because of your lack of understanding. But I will say there are many members who don't understand this. We as a culture get cought up on the Saviors command "Be ye therefore perfect as your father in heaven is perfect." And we miss that the correct translation of the word "perfect" is "complete ". And completion only comes through him.
Love it.
Thank you for this video. It helped a lot. #subscribing
Im so happy you converted to Christianity
Who is this Paul guy? Was he one of the disciples of Jesus? Did he even meet Jesus in person/face to face? Why do they regard his (who is a man) sayings as of the same worth as God's that they put his sayings as parts of God's words/the Bible?
Wait. Is he God?
Good point, most mistakenly believe he was apostle, but he wasn’t, just a zealous disciple who wrote beautiful and true things well after the there was no longer a need for prophetic scripture-I thought Christians told me there is no need for scripture after Christ. Whatever made his letters scripture, I don’t know. Must have been a close vote.
This is a grave misunderstanding of scripture
No it isn’t.
Isn’t becoming a god is a type of pride?
According to the Isaiah 14:12, Ezekiel 28:14 Lucifer (a simple angel and creation of God Father, Son & Holy Spirit)
he wanted to be LIKE GOD to be worshipped LIKE GOD, to have authority LIKE GOD? Isn’t that a awful SIN before The God of Israel? Wake up People ! the Mormons are very wrong thinking that after they do all they can do, they will become like God to be worshipped!!
Is pride and arrogance!
No matter how much effort they put on that thinking, it will be only to find out that if they die , they will be lost forever! With no SALVATION and wrath of the Holy God of the Bible upon them!
And yes, if they die with that wish , they will go to a place where is no return! Yes, they will see joe smith there but not being praised but being tormented!
Mormon friends! This is the time to wake up and READ THE HOLY BIBLE WITH NO ONE INTERPRETATION! Reading the Bible is a blessed because if you do it with a humble heart NOT attacking the word of God , He will reveal what he means and what He wants US to know of him! All He wants is a humble heart because God’s word doesn’t have any mistake like this LDS church portrays ! You want a “ translation “ that works for you ? Learn Hebrew and you’all know that the word of God is eternal and has NO MISTAKES!
John 6:63-70
King James Version
It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life
Gods love, mercy, and grace, is not the liberty to sin ones way to salvation. It is ever the call to repentance and good works. And after all that we can do, it is by his grace that we are saved or lifted. In fact, this can be said all along the path, from understanding to understanding, concept to concept, weakness to strength, strength to stronger still, and the perfecting of all of our higher attributes of faith, trust, love, patience, etc. To say there are no works in this is to deny that which is self evident.
Yes 💯
You call that a contradiction?!
Talk about using scripture for private interpretation and to satisfy a narrative for haters.
Jesus Christ fills the gap that is always there. We have to at least make effort to do our best. God knows our hearts. It is a better approach than to say “all you have to do is not do anything but say you believe in Jesus Christ.”
I can hurt people and steal but as long as I say I believe in Christ I’m good. Right?!
Am I wrong? Am I interpreting something wrong kind of like you are here.
I think I trust Jesus Christ’s brother James who said faith without works is dead.
I trust him more than I would Paul if I had to make a choice. Just saying.
It’s laughable that you believe people say “I worked my way into heaven “. No, they might say Heavenly Father forgive me for I tried my best but I fell short then Jesus Christ’s atonement filled the gap.
We are in a deep hole Jesus Christ gave us a ladder to climb out of it. We still need to climb it that is where faith comes in.
Faith in Jesus Christ that he built the ladder and that it will hold us as we climb.
Or, do you believe that Jesus Christ not only throws us a rope but you want Him to pull you up also because you don’t want to do any work?
You are just pulling the verse out of context let me give you the context it’s referring to the time when the law of Moses shall be fulfilled. Here’s the context for that scripture and secondly have you ever read the Book of Mormon so many times does it say that we are saved by grace.
23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.
24 And, notwithstanding we believe in Christ, we keep the law of Moses, and look forward with steadfastness unto Christ, until the law shall be fulfilled.
25 For, for this end was the law given; wherefore the law hath become dead unto us, and we are made alive in Christ because of our faith; yet we keep the law because of the commandments.
Also Jesus never claimed to be god or our god for that matter
Read any other Bible and not the JST version. Joseph smith added himself to the JST Bible and changed nearly 3000 verses to accommodate his religion into it. Also he claimed to see two personages; saying they are God and his son Jesus Christ. The problem is that no man can see god or he will die. Joseph isn’t a miraculous exception to that rule. The devil and his angels love to disguise themselves as angels of God.
Is this poor guy serious?
Part 1) What we do to be worthy of the gift of grace.
Part 2) grace.
Yes, we must be worthy or everyone gets it, worthy or not.
The gift is not of our own doing, it is a gift from God. We didn't make the grace, Christ did. And we receive it through faith by doing our best.
This poor guy's suggestion seems to be that God's laws and commandments suddenly don't apply anymore. We can go out and live however we want if we know we have that gift waiting for us.
You are literally betting your soul on whether this guy's interpretation is correct or not.
Does God's law still matter? Where do you draw the line? Because according to this guy there's suddenly no line, no works necessary. That is not what God has said, though it appears to be what this poor guy is inferring.
I Think Works Are Needed. I Dont Think Its Just Given. You Have To Strive For The Grace Of God. I Think You Are Incorrect. You Cant Just Sit There And Recieve. GoD Dont Like Lazy.
This verse gets so misinterpreted by the lazy, looking for get saved quick schemes. It's obvious that the works it's talking about here are only the works of the law of Moses, and not all works, or Paul wouldn't constantly be emphasizing good works with phrases like "Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." Paul clearly didn't believe in automatic guaranteed salvation. "But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I MAY win Christ." "If by any means I MIGHT attain unto the resurrection of the dead. Not as though I had already attained, or were already perfect: but I FOLLOW after, if that I MAY apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. Brethren I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I DO, FORGETTING those things which are behind, and REACHING forth unto those things which are before, I PRESS toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us WALK by the same rule, let us MIND the same thing. Brethren, be FOLLOWERS together of me, and MARK them which WALK so as ye have us for an ensample." Paul didn't assume he was saved just because he prayed some random man made prayer professing himself a sinner and Jesus Christ as his personal Lord and Savior. Paul talked about the Milk of the Gospel, or the first principles of the oracles of God, or the principals of the doctrine of Christ, or Foundation. And what were these basics of the Gospel? "Repentance from dead works, and of faith towards God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgement." And this is very similar to what Peter told the first converts after they were pricked in their hearts for Christ suffering for their sins, and they asked "Men and Brethren, what shall we do?" Did Peter tell them to pray the Sinners Prayer? No! "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For this promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Any that the Lord God calls must do these things. But that wasn't all they did. After they were baptized "they continued stedfastly in the Apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers." All these things that Peter and Paul listed are the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and any church that isn't doing all of them is not the church founded by Jesus Christ, but are imposters. And anything that isn't of Jesus Christ is of the Devil. So it's no wonder the world loves them, they are of the world. But God's church is hated of the world, and constantly evil spoken of and persecuted and called evil by the world. Satan fights hardest against his greatest threat. Look for the church that all other churches are united against, even Atheists and Satanists, and that is God's church.
Great video! ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
So you telling me that Book of Mormon it’s lies ?? I always wanted to be baptised by them but they don’t want just they said you need to be married so you can by baptised but in bible says Peter those who believe in lord Jesus christ shout be baptised
You have to work to maintain the gift
This is really funny. You have to take actions (works). You have to strive to keep the commandments. This is so misleading smh. The book of Mormon never says after all we can do, let us go boast then. This is just purely sad
Question so if I believe in Jesus and break his commandments by stealing am I still going to make it to the highest level of heaven
Believing in Jesus and being saved from eternal damnation are not the same thing. Even the demons believe and tremble. You need a personal relationship with Jesus Christ through repentance of sins and accepting him as Lord of your life. ❤
Jesus also said if you love me keep the commandments why call me Lord and not do the things I say does this contradict this video can someone help me find the right answer???
Hi Rob!
We made a video on this exact issue: ua-cam.com/video/smtuVkvF_qQ/v-deo.html
Let me know if you have any questions!
No incorrect in the hebrew after all we can do is repentance witch is 100 percent correct because there is no forgivness of sin with out repenting and when the bible uses the word works its only talking about the works of the law.
amen this helps people out in there trials of life but with christ in our heart it is the true
you should really read all the book of mormon before making a judgment on it
faith is a act james chap 2, and no where in the book of mormon says works will save you
faith is an act of work
makes me said when people spend all this time on studying the scripture, and they don't understand up from down and right from left
Why does 2 Nephi say we are saved by grace "after all we can DO," and Paul says we are saved by grace "...and this is NOT your own DOING...NOT a result of WORKS?"
These two verses teach the exact opposite thing concerning the role our works play in salvation.
@@GLM definition of grace: the love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not necessarily because of anything we have done to earn it
everyone will be resurrected 1cor 15:16-23, and in turn some people might even call that being saved
and technical this is old testament time in the book of mormon, they are still living the law of Moses (559-545bc) they lived by the law of Moses at the time for example animal sacrifices, which some people might consider a work
the church has never preaching works for salvation, we believe and Bible teaches all men will be judged for there own works Revelation 19
I have watch all of your guys videos you take things out of context just as the scribes and pharisees have
and you should define salvation, and what is needed
@@GLM The first part of the verse explains what you can do- BELIEVE IN CHRIST.
Well said. They are taking one part of one verse without regard to the whole teaching of the BoM.
@@GLM Acts 16.30-31 What must I DO to be saved? ...Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Nephi 25. 23: Believe in Christ.
Another contradiction: Galatians 1:8
No they are not I can prove it in the 1830 after all we can do. The after in that text was the same thing as saying despite so first learn your history and second what you are doing is basically saying I agree with the people who went out and murdered thousands of lds members. An example of that would be the Hans mill massacre
Former Mormon here also, but I think that all these religions are B S. !
Hello, I read your comment and just wanted to ask, do you still believe there is a God In heaven watching over you?
This is a silly argument. It is all based in unintentional, and intentional ‘mis-understanding’. By the way God loves not just Mormons, he loves everyone. Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists, ... , and even, perhaps especially Calvinists.
What is misunderstood? I'm simply contrasting the LANGUAGE of two passages, whose wording sounds similar enough to be related, yet different enough to be saying 2 different things.
@@GLM - What is misunderstood? You’re making exactly my point. I maintain that if one could have Nephi and Paul in the same room and discuss this doctrine, one would find them in complete agreement. It might also be interesting to include Jesus’ brother James in the discussion. He spoke on this topic.
I also maintain that the BoM testifies of the divinity of Jesus Christ and supports the Bible.
It literally said the same thing you just wanted to make it sound different. Nephi is saying that they bring their family to God and work doing everything they can do not as in I plowed that field 10 times today to get closer to God. But as in they work on getting closer to God and after everything they do they fall short except by the Grace of God they add up. Same shit the Bible said. I’m not even Mormon. I hate this type of tit for gay bs people do.
Ex Mormon here, and I can tell you with an assurance that Mormons believe they can only reach the highest degree of glory by doing works in the temple, paying tithing, and following the modern day prophets and apostles. So no, they really aren’t saying the same things.
The 501c3 will be revoked.
It's Joseph Smith .Their God is not God. They don't want to talk about God or Christians or Catholics or Christian churches or Catholic churches.
Still waiting for god to show his face.
Their Bible is not Bible their Bible is only Mormon bible. It's totally different from Christian Bible.
Correct, the Book of Mormon is not the Bible. It is different. The doctrine of Christ is taught in both, though I would argue taught more clearly in the Book of Mormon (see 2 Nephi 31 & 3Nephi 11, for instance). If you read those two chapters and come back and tell me that the Book of Mormon teaches another Gospel, I will be shocked”. Members of The Church of Jesus Christ love the Bible and the Book of Mormon. Both lead us to Christ in abundance.
Using your own imagination to interpret the bible, shows you're not guided by the Holy Ghost. In 2 Nephi 25: 23, And what's "after all we can do?". It surely includes repentance and baptism, keeping the commandments, and enduring to the end. Do you have other jobs, I don't think so, you're only interested in the UA-cam money, that's all.
What is it he said that made you accuse him of being greedy?
Mathew 5.48 I made you perfect so be perfect in love.
Search "Evil Religions Unmasked" to know about them.
You can also go straight to the source like any wise person and actually read the Book of Mormon.
They literally say the exact same thing. Only someone with very little intelligence would not see that. Total ignorance here.
Hes explaining a process
Yet another hater with the same old arguments. Do you guys just have chain letters of this stuff going around? You don't understand our doctrine, when it is easy to find online. Is this on purpose? First, we believe we ARE saved by grace. Salvation by grace means we will be resurrected in our body, glorified and never to die again. Without Christ we would be in Satan's grasp. We also have the ability to repent. This is free. But remember those many mansions in the Father's house? Paul talked about them in 1 Cor 15:40. Rev 20:12 says the dead will be judged for what they have DONE, not by faith or grace. Jesus said that they who do the will of the Father will enter heaven (Matt 7:21). Jesus said baptism is essential in Mark 16:16. This is backed up in Acts as people joined Christ's Church. This is the side to being "saved" that is NOT free. If you don't think our actions are important, you might as throw out every Bible story of people who did the will of the Father, including Jesus Christ.
Firstly, 1 Corinthians 15:40 is actually being translated incorrectly by Mormons. In the case of this verse the person two verses before is comparing the types of flesh that exist in the world: bird, man, beast, fish. They are all flesh but different. Then he describes the things of heaven: stars, the sun, and the moon. The example is to prove that even though the flesh and spirit are combined right now, they are two separate things. One being terrestrials (terra, like the clay god formed Adam from,) and spirit, as in his image. “Glory,” is often confused because it can also mean the face of/the true image of.
Moving on;
As much as I want to believe that a different doctrine doesn’t matter, the correct doctrine does in fact matter tremendously.
Romans 16:17
@@kittiemarie1235 A lot to unpack here and I won't bother with 1 Cor 15:40, because there are different interpretations based not just on the definition of the Greek words, but the fact that we don't know the original issue that was being discussed.
If you think there was no loss of doctrine and the Church of Christ survived to this day, where is it now? That ancient church practiced baptism and understood that it was a part of salvation (Mark 16:16). Peter as the head of the church received revelation, as did Paul, John and even a prophet named Agabus. By the time of Clement of Alexandria's life (ca 150-215) we get this quote: “For philosophy is the study of wisdom, and wisdom is the knowledge of things divine and human; and their causes." Wisdom is therefore queen of philosophy, as philosophy is of preparatory culture. For if philosophy "professes control of the tongue, and the belly, and the parts below the belly, it is to be chosen on its own account. But it appears more worthy of respect and preeminence, if cultivated for the honour and knowledge of God.” Philosophy that was so embedded by the Greeks in New Testament culture was now the way to wisdom. From the Greeks came the foundational principles of the Trinity being three beings of one essence of spirit. This view was imposed on the Bible over time. A reading of John 17 makes it very clear that Christ and His Father are not somehow one in physical nature, but in purpose and communication, as the apostles and all believers are to be "one" with them and in them just as Christ is. See mymission.lamission.edu/userdata%5Cschustm%5Cdocs%5CPlatonism_and_EarlyChristEschatology.pdf
"The Mormon churches God and the God of the Bible are different. Same with its gospel and teachings. Not only are they different, but the doctrine is a new one given by an Angel of light."
This statement is totally incorrect and probably something taught by anti-LDS critics to rile Christians. The Book of Mormon is another testament of Christ. It gives more detail. Two great examples: People wonder why there is so much bad in the world. The Book of Mormon says, "For it must needs be, that there is an opposition in all things. If not so... righteousness could not be brought to pass, neither wickedness, neither holiness nor misery, neither good nor bad." In other words, we have to have a choice to be judged, just as Rev 20:12 says. A second clarification in baptism. Jesus states very clearly in Mark 16:16 that salvation is had in part through baptism. Where in the Bible does it tell how to baptize, who should be baptized and what is said? Read Acts. All those who were taught the gospel and joined the Church of Christ were baptized and then received the Holy Ghost. The Book of Mormon gives the missing information, including that baptizing infants is an abomination to God because they are the example of the kingdom of heaven.
The Book of Mormon was not from an "angel of light." It is a record of many ancient prophets in the New World. God spoke with them- the other sheep Christ had. He visited them. The Law of Moses was fulfilled for them when He came. But that record was hidden up to keep it safe, to be brought forth by an angel. This is spoken of in Rev 14:6. The time frame is right before the harvesting of the earth. An angel brings the gospel to not just the people who don't have it, but to all those on earth. That is because of the error that crept in after the apostles were gone. Read 2 Thes 2:3-4. The rebellion had to come before the return of Christ when Satan would be revealed. He would "exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped" and He will proclam himself to be God.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the restoration of what was lost.
"The Bible says that your works do not save you and that you are only saved by the blood of Christ."
I get tired of explaining this. WE AGREE!!! Only through the atonement of Christ and the shedding of His blood can be return to God. That is the basic principle of salvation. Salvation is a gift that ensures we will never die again and be resurrected. But remember that Jesus told His apostles that the Father's house has "many mansions" or apartments? If it's all one place, what does this mean? the Greek 'ouranos' is the "vaulted expanse of the sky" which seemed perfect the dwelling place of God, while the earth was flawed and for imperfect man. It is not a specific term. The "kingdom of God" or kingdom of heaven is more specific to where God dwells, not just where His influence is.
As for works, better read more closely. The Jews were all obsessed with the works of the Law of Moses bringing salvation and needed to be reprogrammed. That is pounded and pounded to get them to see that salvation was through Christ and not daily rituals. Christ did "mighty works" as did His apostles. We are to do the same. What does it mean to "be equally yoked with Christ?" A yoke is a tool for work. When we commit to follow Christ and are baptized, we commit to do His work. We are judged on those works as Rev 20:12 says.
Matt 16:27: For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
John 8:39: They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Acts 26:20 "But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."
Eph 2:10 "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."
Jas 1:14, 17, 20-22: What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
"There is no “wide gate,” of different heavens to enter into. Because the path is narrow.
Matthew 7: 13-14
@@misssue1824 (Part 1:) The Corinthians bit - Paul is discussing the core of the gospel. Jesus died for our sins, and he touches on the perishable and imperishable bodies. He does that by making comparisons. He is also telling people to awake to righteousness. That is the topic. It does not matter which translation you use and I will discuss that portion in a different section.
And of course there was loss of doctrine, but the faith that a Christian has is that God has brought his word through any and all trials and what we receive today from most biblical translations and manuscripts will still provide all we need to know. God knows the beginning to the end, he is omniscient and omnipresent. Do you profess do infer that he is incapable of keeping his promise to preserve his word?
Genesis 46:27
@@misssue1824 (Part 2:) The ancient prophets of the new world do not exist. This points back to the complete lack of evidence that these nations existed amongst the other evidences continually proving Book of Mormon doctrine as a fabrication rather than a true document. The gospel of Mormonism was given to Joseph smith by two personages of light: one calling himself God and claiming that the one he was with was with his son. The problem with that is in the Bible God said that any who see his face shall die. (Exodus 33:20)
So either God is a liar or Joseph Smith is a liar. I am not willing to trust man over God here. Remember that Satan and his Angels can and do mimic God in order to spread their narrative to the world. Satans deceptions are not easy to spot but this is one of them I have no doubt of. The Angel in revelation will fly directly overhead and testify to every nation, tribe and language and people proclaiming an eternal gospel. If you look at the accounts of biblical angels most have to announce themselves (“be not afraid,”)as an Angel because they are rather terrifying. I doubt there would be any question about an angels appearance especially if it is flying overhead and spreading the Gospel to everyone. Joseph Smith did try to exalt himself. He added verses to the JST version of the Bible as well as changed nearly 3,000 verses to accommodate his doctrine into it:
Genesis 50:33 JST "And that seer will I bless, and they that seek to destroy him shall be confounded; for this promise I give unto you, for I will remember you from generation to generation; and his name shall be called Joseph, and it shall be like unto you, for the thing which the Lord shall bring forth by His hand shall bring my people unto salvation."
Let it be noted that Genesis 50 in the Bible ends at verse 26.
Your doctrine agrees with salvation through Jesus Christ yes, but it also depends on a persons works in the temple to dictate which kingdom they belong to. As I have already mentioned in my previous post, the multiple kingdoms do not exist in biblical text anywhere. (Refer to the first paragraph of both my posts for the explanation of this,) by saying there is plenty of room for those who go to the kingdom God. Simple as that.
Yes and no. We are judged based on our works BY faith, it is simple really. Works do not save but they are the result of faith which does save. If you have faith in God you keep his commandments, you do good by others, you help your fellow man and care for the poor, needy, sick and imprisoned. You do these things by faith because God commands it. Going to the temple to do sealings, baptisms for dead, etc is not the same as works for God. You do that out of your own selfish desire to obtain a celestial spot in heaven. Not because God said to do it.
Jesus was asked this and his response was clear. “John 6:28 Then said they vnto him, What shall we doe, that we might worke the workes of God?
John 6:29 Iesus answered, and said vnto them, This is the worke of God, that ye beleeue on him whom he hath sent.”
Your works therefore, are to have faith in HIS WORD and to do as his son commanded. Joseph Smiths works are not the same as Gods works.
The kingdom of God is the only place that one can go to aside from hell. You are either going to hell or to heaven. There is absolutely no other places. This is good vs evil not good, somewhat good, and only a little good vs somewhat bad and evil. The idea that your salvation and the kingdom you go to is based on how well you performed is only complicating gods simple instructions. There is a heaven and hell. That’s it.
To believe that the Bible is missing anything that God has ordained it to have is a testament of your lack of faith, not a lack of Gods infinite promise to preserve the words. So you are calling God a liar in not believing he can and has preserved his word and therefore your works are dead. God has provided, like mana from heaven, the words we need in this day and age in the Bible.
No matter if you worry about other gods, you are again calling God a liar by not believing his word. Your works are truly dead. For there are no other Gods nor will there be after him. He said this and yet you choose to pick a verse to prove that you can be elevated to Christs level? Being joint heirs simply means we have the assurance of eternal life, and a relationship with God that brings eternal life. Why take simple understand and add interpretations that change the narrative?
God is omnipotent and omnipresent. So why did he create any of us knowing we would sin? He answered this. Because he is sovereign, knowing we have the choice to sin and choosing not to is OUR decision. Instead of trying to control us he made us with love and does his best to guide us, but inevitably he allows us to make our own decisions. The same applies to Satan who makes his own decision to rebel against God.
God and Jesus both believe women are incredibly valuable. They were made for man, because God loved Adam so much he wanted him to have a companion. God makes it clear however that we are made like unto himself. Nobody actually knows what God made us from clay. He did not need a woman to help him do so. The word (Jesus,) is who was with him from the beginning. That is where the “we,” comes from.
There is division. And sadly that means that not everyone who says “lord, lord,” will be going to heaven. As I said earlier the road is very narrow that leads to the kingdom of God. This is why, for many of us, all we can do in works is to have faith in Jesus Christ and Gods words.
You have, and I want to share that I was born and raised a Mormon, and God brought me out of the church. I knew the Book of Mormon much better than the Bible when I was a member. Ultimately I was left with too many questions because naturally I am and always have been a follower of truth. And let me tell you, that gets you into a lot of trouble as a child in the church. I was constantly told I was being unreasonable for stating facts. You see I have never had a fear of the truth from the moment I was born. But I fear lies and I hate deceit. This is how I have always been. God made me this way and brought me out of the church. For what purpose I do not know but I have faith that his plan for me is far better than the plan Joseph Smith could promise.
@@kittiemarie1235 If I had a fear of truth I wouldn't be out here.
You think you have proof from things like DNA? I have done DNA testing and my percentages keep changing as more people are tested. DNA is far from an exact science.
You claim to be a seeker of truth and fear and hate lies and deceit. Yet you embrace the misinformation and dishonesty out here and regurgitate it. If you have left the Church, why can't you move on and find peace in your new faith? Why do you return and engage in criticism instead of glorying in your new understanding of truth?
There is a biblical reason: The do-nothing, lip-service grace taught today is very comforting for those who think they can be a true disciple by walking on their lips. The gospel of Christ is far more. It is being one with God through the Spirit in such as way that one KNOWS as Peter and the apostles did. (But I don't know that, right? I'm crazy, deluded, brainwashed). Not after decades of answered prayers, instruction, warning, "coincidences" and "tender mercies." My denial of my spiritual experiences would be a denial of God himself.
I am nearing the end of my life. I testify that I will hardly know my Lord better when I meet Him face to face than I know Him now. I didn't learn to know Him from "flesh and blood."
I sense there is something else that lies at the base of your choice to leave the Church. Thorns left in place tend to fester.
Sodom and Gomorrah
The BofM contradicting the Bible is roughly equivalent to the easter bunny arguing with santa claus.
Or you commenting on a video for something you don’t believe in. Lol, do you feel better? Has this brought you fulfillment?
Jesus said (the real Jesus ) "he that OVERCOMES shall I grant to sit with me on the throne as I OVERCAME and sit next to the Father" Revelation 3:21... you do not teach what Jesus taught.. these guys who made this video need to read Jesus' words. .
Over came the tribulation and persecution read the whole chapter.
@@sammysolis8495 Victorious i.e "Overcome" means to conquer sin. best study up.