According to my year end UA-cam summary I’m in the top .3% of LSV watchers. Thank you so much for all the content. You’re the best and I hope you and the fam are doing well!!
Figured it out, had to to gaming in the youtube app which I've never used before. Told me LSV was my top creator, but gave me a percentage for someone else. Weird.
I'm struggling to see how talisman of indulgence is the pick over expedition map in a deck that already has academy, tinker, tezzeret, and upheaval. This deck doesnt do any thing at all without academy so the map is an irreplaceable premium effect. On the other hand, talisman is one of the most medium cards in the cube and THE most replacable effect in the cube.
That talisman double fixes for both the splash colors, it's a cheap artifact that ramps and sticks around for academy and it's non zero that maps comes back. As the only person that may want it is whoever took the workshop.
@@RagtagCoach the map also fixes for both colours if you really need that. but more importantly academy is the be all and end all in this deck. and it's even more non-zero IMO that talisman would come back seeing as its so replacable.
I swear manifold key is just air 90% of games i've seen with it, woulda considered cutting that one for sure. Fun vid as always and glad to have you back uploading
In cubes that support it, I like bolstering Academy decks with Depths/Stage. I know it's easier in hindsight, but he could've had Expedition Map + Dark Depths + Thespian Stage relatively for free.
I think it's weird to grab Tinker and then just pass a Blightsteel Colossus for a Chromatic Star. Don't think that's correct, even with an Academy. Okay Portal is the best target but i feel like you could make a good argument that Blightsteel is the second best. Tinker into Blightsteel wins alot of games. I feel like this combo is disrespected just because it's old. It's very hard for very many decks to answer.
@ That's not really the point. Chromatic Star is a fine cantrip. The point i'm trying to make is what is the second best Tinker Target? Triplicare Titan, Coveted Jewel, Bolas Citadel? I mean i'm lower on Tinker then i used to be because i think Portal is the only premium target. But i would argue Blightsteel is the second best and i think it's just wrong to pass a Blightsteel for a star if you have Tinker.
Not even a mention for Blightsteel Colossus to go with the Tinker? I know LSV is lower on it than most people, but to then snap up Triplicate who is comparable or a bit worse seems strange to me. If this deck doesn't want Blightsteel why is it in the cube?
Yeah I didn't get that, this deck is loaded with cheap artifacts + tinker and you pass blightsteel? It'll cut through the bs and win a game where you drew any 0-2 mana artifact + tinker without having to really do much. Answers to it are few in number, just sacrifice effects and plowshare effects.
I think he may have gotten tunnel vision after the tolarian academy pick and forgotten about blightsteel/tinker for a moment. That's my guess anyway. If so, that kind of thing happens to us all.
LSV hates Blightsteel for some reason. Sure you have to pass the turn to win (unless you get Greaves), but aside from playing against the mono white player with swords/path/oust, there's not a ton of ways to interact w/ it.
@@christopher171I mean, that’s a bit of an overstatement. It gets bounced, oko elked, it gets blocked and raced, the occasional treachery or fractured identity clowns you. It’s definitely better than a straight ignore but it’s sure not one of the premium tinker targets anymore
@@shadowphoenixxx sure there's definitely other ways to interact with it, just saying that the WW player generally has the best game against it. Tinker in general isn't the bomb it used to be regardless. All the creatures don't immediately win the game (Blightsteel, Battleball, TripTitan). Portal is a blank against some decks, especially in this powermax cube where everyone is trying to combo. Nexus is cool but doesn't win immediately either, its just card advantage. The best things to Tinker for are Citadel and Time Vault, but Vault doesn't need Tinker to be insane, its just another tutor.
@@shadowphoenixxx All true. I do think Blightsteel is still the best thing to cheese out on turn 2 with Mox Tinker draws. It’s a lot worse once the opponent has creatures or mana.
I think in that one turn where you activated converter turn 2 it would have been better to go talisman into urza if you draw blue, or saheeli + clamp if you dont
Same. Once, ok. But Depths in the last few pics would be a great speculation, knowing for sure that Stage was in the next pack. Makes skipping Treasure Map even more egregious in hindsight.
I think the line game 1 of the last match 3 was to play talisman turn two instead of using converter, and then play Saheeli plus clamp, or Urza if you draw bleu. This gives you more mana and artifacts in play to maybe put something together with Urza, Saheeli and clamp the next turns.
Concerning the final build, what do you (both Luis and other commenters) think about just cutting the red and going mono blue + bowmasters? Would make the mana base much stronger and seems reasonable to me, considering how many cuts were needed anyway. Or are iteration and Dack in any way critical for this deck to work?
Would otawara have not been a consideration over miscalc given that you needed so many cuts? Just a land that has a free side benefit. I mean miscalc is really good don't get me wrong
I'm not sure Currency Converter is as good as LSV thinks it is. Without any support, you have to spend 3 mana and 2 turns to loot once and get either a 2/2 or a treasure token. That isn't good enough. In order for it to be worth it, I think you need either ways to make yourself discard like Dack or Faithless Looting or you need Saga to tutor it up. Even if you have Academy, if you are just casting and activating Converter normally then it isn't worth it.
Retrofitter Foundry too. The game needs to reach such a specific place for sinking a bunch of mana into these trinkety artifacts to actually be winning.
It's fine as a mana sink/card selection tool and powers up academy. It's also a pretty sick combo with academy. It's a cheap utility knife in a utility deck, hard to ask for more.
Agreed. I also think cards like manifold key are overvalued in decks like this. Yeah its a one mana artifact but alot of the times it is a complete blank of a card
I agree in high power/speed cubes like this one. Games just are less likely to go to the place where the mana you sink into it won't matter. Honestly, Artifacts seems like a really fragile combo/archetype for this Cube with a lot of your cards dedicated to not doing much but powering up one or two cards. In an environment with 2-card combos that can kill in turn 2 or 3 reasonably often, and very forward-facing "fair" decks that punish a turn 2 off, I don't know if the old style Academy decks have much space.
In this version of the cube, converter and foundry are WAY too slow. They're mostly just a 1 mana artifact. The text on the card could be anything and serve the same purpose.
@ oh yeah, it’s any target and he just conceded before the op assigned it to him. I forgot OB did that since he didn’t die immediately like when Sheoldred is in play. Doh!
Very niche and over the top request, but could you upgrade your setup to 1440p, or if it already is, upload them as 1440p as well. I recently got a monitor that supports it and now the card text is kinda blurry :D
i suspect academy got weaker because games where opponents stumble and you durdle until you go over the top are much rarer in these compressed games - both stumbling is less frequent and valgavoth is hard to go over. also, initiative is just a beating. it can still work but reset buttons like balance, upheaval, tinker+portal and even sunfall are paramount now, which in turn make talismans more important and the speed makes currency converter worse. anyhow, greatly appreciate the videos
Dag nabit its not notifying me of your videos for some silly reasons. So you get comments to spark the Gore Rhythm into doing something i want it to do.
Can’t imagine a much better start for the artifact deck sans power. Heartbreaking when Workshop and Opal don’t wheel. Maybe the rare time playing 41 could make sense so you have the jar to tinker for?
Keep pumping out the content LSV! Do not mind all the hate in the comments, most people are unaware of the struggle to be mentally sharp always especially with two brand new babies in the equation.
Damn. Watch all the videos, and never say a peep, as LSV is wayyyy better at MTG then me, but that talisman over map seems way off to me. I know hindsight is whatever, but he didnt draw academy once, and that talisman 4 times or 5? I think he got incredibly unlucky these games as his draws where always the same handfull of cards that didnt do much or land flood, or the opponent drew everycard for every scenario, so at no point am I blamming the losses to the tali pick, but damn I dont get that one. The blighsteel as well, but I think he might have missed it. He usually mentions it, or says it may wheel or another reason why he dosnt like it.
You're right. Also, I think the 'bad luck' element of academy decks is down to the fact that they have a lot of 0 and 1 mana artifacts which really don't look good when you are top-decking in a pinch. Map, and I think Memory Jar as well should have been played, because these are the ways you can make sure the deck works.
I really hope they keep this version of the cube. I'm sure there's people that hate the "I Win" A+B combos, but honestly when there's multiple ways to just win instantly and most of the players in the pod can assemble at least something broken, it kind of all balances out in my mind.
See why youve done so well in life, your so greedy. Unsafe and greedy. Do you see fixing tabling, ever? Players are way better than 10 years ago. Try prioritizing fixing over 2nd rate power u might start winning again with ur team drafting.
LSV prioritizes fixing far more than most players I've ever watched, fetches especially. He just doesn't prioritize fixing in the form of lands with Academy decks he prioritizes fixing through his artifacts instead. He says basically on a daily basis how broken fetchlands are and there a reason he rarely passes them. You either don't watch him very much or don't really pay attention to he's doing to make such an out there claim.
I went into depth about fixing while playing academy decks (and if you watched the very previous video I aggressively took fetch lands). This comment is a nice combo of poor comprehension and baseless claims, well done 👍
I've probably watched every one lsv in the 10+ years channalfireball has been on UA-cam. Did u loss round 1? That's my proof. Buncha simps fukn responding lmfao. Much love...
According to my year end UA-cam summary I’m in the top .3% of LSV watchers. Thank you so much for all the content. You’re the best and I hope you and the fam are doing well!!
How do you view this if not just a spotify joke.
Figured it out, had to to gaming in the youtube app which I've never used before. Told me LSV was my top creator, but gave me a percentage for someone else. Weird.
I'm struggling to see how talisman of indulgence is the pick over expedition map in a deck that already has academy, tinker, tezzeret, and upheaval. This deck doesnt do any thing at all without academy so the map is an irreplaceable premium effect. On the other hand, talisman is one of the most medium cards in the cube and THE most replacable effect in the cube.
LSV been off lately. Spell pierce, now this. He makes a lot of content, has new born twins and a spouse. Life takes a toll brothers and sisters.
My thoughts exactly. A second copy of Academy that powers if up if you've already drawn it is an easy pick.
That talisman double fixes for both the splash colors, it's a cheap artifact that ramps and sticks around for academy and it's non zero that maps comes back. As the only person that may want it is whoever took the workshop.
@@RagtagCoach the map also fixes for both colours if you really need that. but more importantly academy is the be all and end all in this deck. and it's even more non-zero IMO that talisman would come back seeing as its so replacable.
I hope you are joking@@jackmorehead6611
I swear manifold key is just air 90% of games i've seen with it, woulda considered cutting that one for sure. Fun vid as always and glad to have you back uploading
Had a fun play where a doomsday deck used wish claw and then I used it and untapped it with key to use it again
Not picking Expedition Map was a big error IMO, I feel like I’ve said this a lot on these Academy vids xD
Agree with you. Finally get academy, but doesn't want second copy.
In cubes that support it, I like bolstering Academy decks with Depths/Stage. I know it's easier in hindsight, but he could've had Expedition Map + Dark Depths + Thespian Stage relatively for free.
Invert polarity has been a crazy card in this cube from my games played. Not sure it’s the most “fun” but definitely a strong card
I think it's weird to grab Tinker and then just pass a Blightsteel Colossus for a Chromatic Star.
Don't think that's correct, even with an Academy.
Okay Portal is the best target but i feel like you could make a good argument that Blightsteel is the second best.
Tinker into Blightsteel wins alot of games.
I feel like this combo is disrespected just because it's old.
It's very hard for very many decks to answer.
LSV really historically has never liked Blightsteel - not saying it's right or wrong - just mentioning it's not new that he passes over it.
@@bricelory9534yeah, id say most ppl value it higher than lsv. i dont think theres an overwhelming amount of cards that deal with it well.
i think he really just frowns on cards that dont do anything the turn they come into play or leave play.
@@Stokkeland23 ok yeah but did you see how many games Chromatic Star won him?
@ That's not really the point.
Chromatic Star is a fine cantrip.
The point i'm trying to make is what is the second best Tinker Target?
Triplicare Titan, Coveted Jewel, Bolas Citadel?
I mean i'm lower on Tinker then i used to be because i think Portal is the only premium target.
But i would argue Blightsteel is the second best and i think it's just wrong to pass a Blightsteel for a star if you have Tinker.
"the opponent took the worse line every turn and i still got smashed" lmfao i love the candid recaps GG's man fun deck!
Not even a mention for Blightsteel Colossus to go with the Tinker? I know LSV is lower on it than most people, but to then snap up Triplicate who is comparable or a bit worse seems strange to me. If this deck doesn't want Blightsteel why is it in the cube?
Yeah I didn't get that, this deck is loaded with cheap artifacts + tinker and you pass blightsteel? It'll cut through the bs and win a game where you drew any 0-2 mana artifact + tinker without having to really do much. Answers to it are few in number, just sacrifice effects and plowshare effects.
Passing Blightsteel (not even mentioning it) is crazy.
I think he may have gotten tunnel vision after the tolarian academy pick and forgotten about blightsteel/tinker for a moment. That's my guess anyway. If so, that kind of thing happens to us all.
LSV hates Blightsteel for some reason. Sure you have to pass the turn to win (unless you get Greaves), but aside from playing against the mono white player with swords/path/oust, there's not a ton of ways to interact w/ it.
@@christopher171I mean, that’s a bit of an overstatement. It gets bounced, oko elked, it gets blocked and raced, the occasional treachery or fractured identity clowns you. It’s definitely better than a straight ignore but it’s sure not one of the premium tinker targets anymore
@@shadowphoenixxx sure there's definitely other ways to interact with it, just saying that the WW player generally has the best game against it. Tinker in general isn't the bomb it used to be regardless. All the creatures don't immediately win the game (Blightsteel, Battleball, TripTitan). Portal is a blank against some decks, especially in this powermax cube where everyone is trying to combo. Nexus is cool but doesn't win immediately either, its just card advantage. The best things to Tinker for are Citadel and Time Vault, but Vault doesn't need Tinker to be insane, its just another tutor.
@@shadowphoenixxx All true. I do think Blightsteel is still the best thing to cheese out on turn 2 with Mox Tinker draws. It’s a lot worse once the opponent has creatures or mana.
I think in that one turn where you activated converter turn 2 it would have been better to go talisman into urza if you draw blue, or saheeli + clamp if you dont
Not developing mana with talisman seems wrong
LSV and drafting blue artifacts in a vintage cube. Name a better duo.
Reid & Jund is a equally epic combo fr fr
LSV+BK, sorry
Hasbro and Greed
Cheons is a close contender haha
Can’t be done, breach is a close second though
Watching Dark Depths and Thespian’s Stage go by in back-to-back packs TWICE hurt my soul.
Same. Once, ok. But Depths in the last few pics would be a great speculation, knowing for sure that Stage was in the next pack. Makes skipping Treasure Map even more egregious in hindsight.
I think the line game 1 of the last match 3 was to play talisman turn two instead of using converter, and then play Saheeli plus clamp, or Urza if you draw bleu. This gives you more mana and artifacts in play to maybe put something together with Urza, Saheeli and clamp the next turns.
Concerning the final build, what do you (both Luis and other commenters) think about just cutting the red and going mono blue + bowmasters? Would make the mana base much stronger and seems reasonable to me, considering how many cuts were needed anyway. Or are iteration and Dack in any way critical for this deck to work?
I am surprised no consideration for mental misstep against the reanimator deck
i was thinking the same!
kind of surprised expedition map wasn't the pick over that one talisman, considering how all-in you are on academy
power MAX cube!!! (ft. moonsnare prototype)
Would otawara have not been a consideration over miscalc given that you needed so many cuts? Just a land that has a free side benefit. I mean miscalc is really good don't get me wrong
That's what I was thinking... take some land slots
good shout
I'm not sure Currency Converter is as good as LSV thinks it is. Without any support, you have to spend 3 mana and 2 turns to loot once and get either a 2/2 or a treasure token. That isn't good enough. In order for it to be worth it, I think you need either ways to make yourself discard like Dack or Faithless Looting or you need Saga to tutor it up. Even if you have Academy, if you are just casting and activating Converter normally then it isn't worth it.
Retrofitter Foundry too. The game needs to reach such a specific place for sinking a bunch of mana into these trinkety artifacts to actually be winning.
It's fine as a mana sink/card selection tool and powers up academy. It's also a pretty sick combo with academy. It's a cheap utility knife in a utility deck, hard to ask for more.
Agreed. I also think cards like manifold key are overvalued in decks like this. Yeah its a one mana artifact but alot of the times it is a complete blank of a card
I agree in high power/speed cubes like this one. Games just are less likely to go to the place where the mana you sink into it won't matter.
Honestly, Artifacts seems like a really fragile combo/archetype for this Cube with a lot of your cards dedicated to not doing much but powering up one or two cards. In an environment with 2-card combos that can kill in turn 2 or 3 reasonably often, and very forward-facing "fair" decks that punish a turn 2 off, I don't know if the old style Academy decks have much space.
In this version of the cube, converter and foundry are WAY too slow. They're mostly just a 1 mana artifact. The text on the card could be anything and serve the same purpose.
“This deck has a lot of action…” Island. Island.
We can start our old men club 'Back In the Day When Blue Used to Be Good and Island GO Put Fear Into The OpPoN3nt!'
game 3 round 1 at end, could you have played mana vault then cast upheaval to buy time? Am I missing something?
@@orpheuskhrystos580 casting draw 7 killed himself, right? OPs bowmaster???
@ oh yeah, it’s any target and he just conceded before the op assigned it to him. I forgot OB did that since he didn’t die immediately like when Sheoldred is in play. Doh!
@lsv is there anyway you could put a link to the cube list ? Thanks and keep killing it ♥️
This particular cube is the one currently on MTGO. The list is on their website.
at 4:50 ish, you completely disregard the blightsteel? May I ask why?
Hi Louis and community! In trying to build a cube (pauper), what would you say is the perfect number of cards for 8 players? 540?
Very niche and over the top request, but could you upgrade your setup to 1440p, or if it already is, upload them as 1440p as well. I recently got a monitor that supports it and now the card text is kinda blurry :D
i suspect academy got weaker because games where opponents stumble and you durdle until you go over the top are much rarer in these compressed games - both stumbling is less frequent and valgavoth is hard to go over. also, initiative is just a beating. it can still work but reset buttons like balance, upheaval, tinker+portal and even sunfall are paramount now, which in turn make talismans more important and the speed makes currency converter worse. anyhow, greatly appreciate the videos
Was there only 2 matches or did I miss something?
No I think he just decided not to play the last match.
Dag nabit its not notifying me of your videos for some silly reasons. So you get comments to spark the Gore Rhythm into doing something i want it to do.
A league of true misfortune
“I talked a lotta crap about forge…..that’s cause it’s bad mostly”
I really thought there was gonna be something nice in there lol.
Can’t imagine a much better start for the artifact deck sans power. Heartbreaking when Workshop and Opal don’t wheel.
Maybe the rare time playing 41 could make sense so you have the jar to tinker for?
kappa layline ax in white blue with all the good interaction
You know a deck is sketchy when you can't remove a creature if your Upheaval gets dealt with
No argument here 😬
50:17
I mean, you didn't draw it even once. So it might not be the academies fault ;)
Everytime I draft this academy build. I always just lose to just more busted combos and there’s so much artifact hate
Keep pumping out the content LSV! Do not mind all the hate in the comments, most people are unaware of the struggle to be mentally sharp always especially with two brand new babies in the equation.
can you call it an academy deck if you don't draw academy?....
That's the classic academy deck! You never draw it and now you're left with a bunch of random artifacts that don't impact the board.
clearly should have drafted the mystic forge (totally joking).
Drawing academy zero times does in fact make the card not do anything.
he drew academy on a stick a few times tho
Lunch time. I have twins as well. Yes 1 day u will be able to sleep again
To be fair, I don’t think you drew academy a single time this entire video. I’d say most of those games are a W if that card shows up. It happens.
Damn. Watch all the videos, and never say a peep, as LSV is wayyyy better at MTG then me, but that talisman over map seems way off to me. I know hindsight is whatever, but he didnt draw academy once, and that talisman 4 times or 5? I think he got incredibly unlucky these games as his draws where always the same handfull of cards that didnt do much or land flood, or the opponent drew everycard for every scenario, so at no point am I blamming the losses to the tali pick, but damn I dont get that one. The blighsteel as well, but I think he might have missed it. He usually mentions it, or says it may wheel or another reason why he dosnt like it.
You're right. Also, I think the 'bad luck' element of academy decks is down to the fact that they have a lot of 0 and 1 mana artifacts which really don't look good when you are top-decking in a pinch. Map, and I think Memory Jar as well should have been played, because these are the ways you can make sure the deck works.
lsv ur a god bro but the level of play the last few videos has been scg tier :( congrats on the kids tho
Ya when I get more sleep I’m sure I’ll be a bit sharper
I really hope they keep this version of the cube. I'm sure there's people that hate the "I Win" A+B combos, but honestly when there's multiple ways to just win instantly and most of the players in the pod can assemble at least something broken, it kind of all balances out in my mind.
tolarian academy deck not drawing the academy
ua-cam.com/video/Xad36gnUZ7Y/v-deo.html
great deck, bad draws.
I'm starting to think lsv isn't that good at deck building
hi
See why youve done so well in life, your so greedy. Unsafe and greedy. Do you see fixing tabling, ever? Players are way better than 10 years ago. Try prioritizing fixing over 2nd rate power u might start winning again with ur team drafting.
Saying this to LSV shows that you know nothing about LSV. Such an arrogant nonsense comment it hurts just to reply to it.
LSV prioritizes fixing far more than most players I've ever watched, fetches especially. He just doesn't prioritize fixing in the form of lands with Academy decks he prioritizes fixing through his artifacts instead. He says basically on a daily basis how broken fetchlands are and there a reason he rarely passes them. You either don't watch him very much or don't really pay attention to he's doing to make such an out there claim.
I went into depth about fixing while playing academy decks (and if you watched the very previous video I aggressively took fetch lands). This comment is a nice combo of poor comprehension and baseless claims, well done 👍
@@LSVargas he's either a troll or never watches any of your other vintage cube uploads. Not even worthy of being acknowledged.
I've probably watched every one lsv in the 10+ years channalfireball has been on UA-cam. Did u loss round 1? That's my proof. Buncha simps fukn responding lmfao. Much love...