Watch Eric Cortina's video "don't chase the lands". Your results demonstrates his method perfectly. Your 50k, 53k and 56 are your best set so you should go to 56k and minus 1k and make your seating depth 55k and as the barrel burns out and opens up you've still got room to grow because you know it groups great at 53k and 50k.
Great video! So about the "flyer" you had with the Hornady brass.... Brand makes a difference. Even though all brands are "SAAMI Spec" each manufacturer has different production methods which results in different case volumes. Hornady, Norma, Lapua etc tend to have thicker walls than the less expensive Remington, Winchester etc so they do have different case volumes resulting in different pressure with the same powder charge. Sorry for the long winded explanation...I've just found keeping lots the same brand results in better consistency. If you really want to go psycho with it you can even separate by internal volume using a 50/50 alcohol and water mix...LOL
Food for thought. When I first run depth. I start at .0020 back off snug measurement. Usually between 3-5 sets of .003 back is first smooth out. Another 3-5 it’ll do it again. Longer the barrel it mite go 4-6. Shorter barrel mite be every 2-4. So in field guns I’ll go .02 back. Start there. And by the 2-3 bump back say .0026 to .0031 is where I know will be first node and I usually just leave it at second farthest from start tight group. Works every time. Only usually bring 5-6 sets of 4 shots.
ya I'm with ya, this caliber is so new to me that I'm a little uncertain on how it will perform, so i don't have a feel for it thus the extra work. I'm learning though.
@@pawild5594 find at least a .009 wide where the Gunn shoots good. Pick the middle one. Sometimes ppl will find a good group but .003 one way or the other and it’s opens way up but they stick to it anyway. And 15 degree difference in temp will put you into one of those timings cause all your trying to do is time the bullet to leave the barrel when the most amount of vibrations are towards the rear and the front is settled. You can time it by powder but that’s not as accurate as .001 of an inch
What I mean is your 53-59 area looks best with the one flyer. I’d load up in .002 increments from like 50-60 now and pick the middle of the best 3. I’ve made the mistake myself of picking a really good depth but sucked quick on both sides and what happens is just outside temp variance of 15 degrees is enough to put the bullets exit timing in one of those crap vibrations. Cause the gun only shot good at 75-80 degrees but terrible at 70 and 85ish if that makes sense. That’s why I don’t chase a small hole only. I chase a good range of .009-.01 range of solid groups. Not one great one surrounded by terrible. It’s more reliable that way. On your gun I’d try that 59 again and run a whole test of 50 52 54 56 58 and 60 then just put it in the middle of the best 3 and done you should be golden for a good 20 degrees up or down
Not quite, the barrel definitely has more life than that...One thing to keep in mind, the powder choice is a huge knob in barrel wear. For example H4350 that I run in my 243's is much more damaging (slower burn rate) than the 8208XBR (fast burn rate), speed isn't the biggest knob...at least as far as i know...lol. Time will tell and honestly barrels in a Remage configuration makes them easily replaced... This 204 is nice but as G out grows the caliber I'll be swapping the barrels anyway.
The saying buy once cry once applies to load development. I load 7 powder charges from max and lower in .2 grain increments. 3 round groups or 4. Measuring FPS I can find the most stable powder charge based on ES and SD. Can usually find the ideal powder charge in 20 or 30 rounds. Then 30 or 40 rounds for seating depth. I buy. Box of 100 then I've got 30 or 40 rounds left that I can verify my seating depth. Then it's time to buy another 100 rounds of bullets :)
If there is a round any harder to group then a 204 I hope I never come across it . That said when I get close I clean the barrel for every three or four round groups to get a round that groups with a clean barrel a fouled barrel and a hot barrel . So when I hunt I know the first three rounds will be an mark .
Do you test these nodes after you find the charge ? Do atmospheric conditions affect these nodes like they do ammo temp ? Is this beneficial for practical accuracy in the field? how much does this tighten groups ? I'm not looking to compete just enjoy developing loads
Ya I test the node all of the time, mostly before I head out into the field. Temperature definitely matters, a load developed in the summer may not perform the same in winter. Which is why I always run in the middle of the velocity node. Seating depth is a little different though, I run that at max length of the node, knowing that the throat will errode.
I just bought a .204 and am looking forward to dialing it in as well. Watching your videos and seeing what you are loading, I wonder what is the twist rate on your rifle?
So I chose the 50k seating depth because that group along with the 53k and 56k groups were all excellent. The reason why I chose 50k over the 56k is because as my throat wears away the seating depth will move towards the 56k where the 0.13group was. So I want to stay in that node, to do that I chose the shortest seating depth. If I chose the 56k, the longer seating depth, I would fall off the accuracy node once the throat erroded.
That load up is still awesome, horizontal stringing is fine, vertical stringing is the bad one. When you go longer distance the vertical string loads get real bad
Amateur reloader here. Do I find the optimal charge weight first, then shoot for seating depth nodes? Or will changing the seating depth quite a bit from recommended “C.O.L” affect velocities and change the powder charge node? Hope that’s easy to understand. Thanks to anyone who can help
Ah this is a great question and i hope everyone sees it... The reason i selected the 50K group is because as the throat wears out, the seating depth will creep towards the 56K position...so as the barrel throat wears i won't have to change my seating depth right away, the node is 6K long and i want to be on the long side of it. The other way of looking at it is this, let's say i selected the 56K seating depth with a 0.130" group when my throat wears out i'll actually fall off of the node and lose accuracy. The way i do this just gives me a little bit of insurance.
You should choose 51k to give you a little wiggle. As the barrel wears you will further and further off the lands, essentially moving towards the 56k...
Watch Eric Cortina's video "don't chase the lands". Your results demonstrates his method perfectly. Your 50k, 53k and 56 are your best set so you should go to 56k and minus 1k and make your seating depth 55k and as the barrel burns out and opens up you've still got room to grow because you know it groups great at 53k and 50k.
Great video! So about the "flyer" you had with the Hornady brass.... Brand makes a difference. Even though all brands are "SAAMI Spec" each manufacturer has different production methods which results in different case volumes. Hornady, Norma, Lapua etc tend to have thicker walls than the less expensive Remington, Winchester etc so they do have different case volumes resulting in different pressure with the same powder charge. Sorry for the long winded explanation...I've just found keeping lots the same brand results in better consistency. If you really want to go psycho with it you can even separate by internal volume using a 50/50 alcohol and water mix...LOL
Food for thought. When I first run depth. I start at .0020 back off snug measurement. Usually between 3-5 sets of .003 back is first smooth out. Another 3-5 it’ll do it again. Longer the barrel it mite go 4-6. Shorter barrel mite be every 2-4. So in field guns I’ll go .02 back. Start there. And by the 2-3 bump back say .0026 to .0031 is where I know will be first node and I usually just leave it at second farthest from start tight group. Works every time. Only usually bring 5-6 sets of 4 shots.
ya I'm with ya, this caliber is so new to me that I'm a little uncertain on how it will perform, so i don't have a feel for it thus the extra work. I'm learning though.
@@pawild5594 find at least a .009 wide where the Gunn shoots good. Pick the middle one. Sometimes ppl will find a good group but .003 one way or the other and it’s opens way up but they stick to it anyway. And 15 degree difference in temp will put you into one of those timings cause all your trying to do is time the bullet to leave the barrel when the most amount of vibrations are towards the rear and the front is settled. You can time it by powder but that’s not as accurate as .001 of an inch
What I mean is your 53-59 area looks best with the one flyer. I’d load up in .002 increments from like 50-60 now and pick the middle of the best 3. I’ve made the mistake myself of picking a really good depth but sucked quick on both sides and what happens is just outside temp variance of 15 degrees is enough to put the bullets exit timing in one of those crap vibrations. Cause the gun only shot good at 75-80 degrees but terrible at 70 and 85ish if that makes sense. That’s why I don’t chase a small hole only. I chase a good range of .009-.01 range of solid groups. Not one great one surrounded by terrible. It’s more reliable that way. On your gun I’d try that 59 again and run a whole test of 50 52 54 56 58 and 60 then just put it in the middle of the best 3 and done you should be golden for a good 20 degrees up or down
Nice groups
Thanks!
How do you decide on a load to start seating depth testing?? Is it the load with the lowest sd?
Uncle Jim is right, by the time you find that perfect load its time to change out the barrel and start again.
Not quite, the barrel definitely has more life than that...One thing to keep in mind, the powder choice is a huge knob in barrel wear. For example H4350 that I run in my 243's is much more damaging (slower burn rate) than the 8208XBR (fast burn rate), speed isn't the biggest knob...at least as far as i know...lol. Time will tell and honestly barrels in a Remage configuration makes them easily replaced...
This 204 is nice but as G out grows the caliber I'll be swapping the barrels anyway.
@@pawild5594 brab a bore scope my teslong was like 140 ,400 rounds in my tikka and lands,look like new,
The saying buy once cry once applies to load development.
I load 7 powder charges from max and lower in .2 grain increments. 3 round groups or 4.
Measuring FPS I can find the most stable powder charge based on ES and SD.
Can usually find the ideal powder charge in 20 or 30 rounds.
Then 30 or 40 rounds for seating depth.
I buy. Box of 100 then I've got 30 or 40 rounds left that I can verify my seating depth. Then it's time to buy another 100 rounds of bullets :)
If there is a round any harder to group then a 204 I hope I never come across it . That said when I get close I clean the barrel for every three or four round groups to get a round that groups with a clean barrel a fouled barrel and a hot barrel . So when I hunt I know the first three rounds will be an mark .
Do you test these nodes after you find the charge ? Do atmospheric conditions affect these nodes like they do ammo temp ? Is this beneficial for practical accuracy in the field? how much does this tighten groups ? I'm not looking to compete just enjoy developing loads
Ya I test the node all of the time, mostly before I head out into the field. Temperature definitely matters, a load developed in the summer may not perform the same in winter. Which is why I always run in the middle of the velocity node. Seating depth is a little different though, I run that at max length of the node, knowing that the throat will errode.
Great shooting rifle dude. Who wouldn't be happy with that.
Regards...........Rotas
awesome! need to find a nice range, just moved out to de
I just bought a .204 and am looking forward to dialing it in as well. Watching your videos and seeing what you are loading, I wonder what is the twist rate on your rifle?
1:11 is what I've got it can pretty much handle everything
To help me learn Im curious why you didn't choose the .130" group searing septh since it shot smaller?
So I chose the 50k seating depth because that group along with the 53k and 56k groups were all excellent. The reason why I chose 50k over the 56k is because as my throat wears away the seating depth will move towards the 56k where the 0.13group was. So I want to stay in that node, to do that I chose the shortest seating depth. If I chose the 56k, the longer seating depth, I would fall off the accuracy node once the throat erroded.
@@pawild5594 ok, thanks.
i have a couple of questions:
-what is your shooting distance in this video?
-by 50k do you mean 0.050" inch?
why the 40s & 50s for test ?
How has that 50k load been holding up? What do you think of the horizontal stringing on tthat group?
That load up is still awesome, horizontal stringing is fine, vertical stringing is the bad one. When you go longer distance the vertical string loads get real bad
@@pawild5594 hmm interesting, ive seen horizontal stringing have problems in my f-class guns. Thanks for the video!
Amateur reloader here. Do I find the optimal charge weight first, then shoot for seating depth nodes? Or will changing the seating depth quite a bit from recommended “C.O.L” affect velocities and change the powder charge node? Hope that’s easy to understand. Thanks to anyone who can help
Always find the velocity node first (powder charge) then tune the load with seating depth.
You probably mentioned this and I missed it, ..... how much did you change the seating depth by for each step?
0.003" is where I test.
The Cortina method...
@@kenginter6112 he has a great video on this way of doing it.
No doubt...I can't wait to get primers and try it out for myself...
@@kenginter6112 heck ya buddy, man primers are so hard to get here.
hey, what cheek riser are you using?
It's an Elite Kydex...sorry I just saw this comment.
When you guys shoot like this and show your targets why not write in the top corner the distance you are shooting at ?
Your smallest group was at 50k (0.130") yet you selected 56k (.290")...why not choose the node with your smallest group?
Ah this is a great question and i hope everyone sees it... The reason i selected the 50K group is because as the throat wears out, the seating depth will creep towards the 56K position...so as the barrel throat wears i won't have to change my seating depth right away, the node is 6K long and i want to be on the long side of it.
The other way of looking at it is this, let's say i selected the 56K seating depth with a 0.130" group when my throat wears out i'll actually fall off of the node and lose accuracy. The way i do this just gives me a little bit of insurance.
@@pawild5594 THANKS.
You should choose 51k to give you a little wiggle. As the barrel wears you will further and further off the lands, essentially moving towards the 56k...
@@kenginter6112 ya that's exactly what I'm doing...seating at 50k...erosion will move towards 56k.
You’re probably shooting at 100 which tells you nothing need to be doing min 200 yards. Bullet hasn’t even stabilized yet…
Cold test 7 to 10 days, your done.
Good luck