I appreciate the sensitivity of this topic and understand it can be triggering. I’ve shared my thoughts to contribute positively to this discussion. Let’s approach Jennifer’s story with kindness and respect in our comments. Open, honest discussions and questions are always welcome here. My heart goes out to everyone affected by abuse. In these challenging times, let's offer comfort and stand as pillars of support, embodying the spirit of compassion in our actions. I find solace in my faith in Jesus Christ and in the words from Revelation 21:3-4, reminding us of hope and healing in times of sorrow. “And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.”
One thing that I didn't notice specifically about another filter of 'Swiss cheese' protection, is the bishop has the opportunity to bring in a parent or a trusted peer to the interview by request of the interviewee or by request of the parent/guardian of a child. It wasn't always that way, but this gives the opportunity for accountability. And apparently especially when those sorts of questions need to be addressed, that there is a witness to the "why" it had to be asked. This also of course makes accountability for alone time. With classes and even youth activities now, there has to be 2 or more adults with the youth at all times. I think this has become a great final or nearly final filter. Because those who have this temptation and are in the fence or even those who haven't yet gotten caught and are in stages of premeditation; are much less likely to act upon the sin if there is someone else there to see what is going on.
I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse (my dad was my abuser, even while he served in high church callings). Things are more resolved now (I told my mom when I was iny 20's and she went straight to the stake president, who told my dad to turn himself in to the police station and also my dad lost his church membership pretty much immediately. But I have still felt troubled about ways I thought things could have been handled earlier--prior to telling my mom, I had told three different bishops what my dad did and not much happened. I have always believed in the restored gospel and church but felt so much trauma and difficulty trusting church authority figures. Hearing this interview was hugely important and faith-building for me. Thank you SO much.
You absolutely deserved to have the adults around you looking out for you instead of hiding the continued abuse you experienced. I’m sorry your bishops failed to protect you when they could have.
I'm so sorry you weren't listened to sooner. I'm glad things were finally taken care of, but I totally understand how having to go through so many people before actually being heard and properly responded to is so traumatizing.
I truly understand what you went through personally! But l know our life experiences make us who we are and we are stronger having gone through certain hardships tough though it may seem! People are sometimes disappointing and don't know how to react to shocking life situations! So I'm personally sorry it took time for something to be done. However, the good news is the gospel is still true and it's still a precious source of God's foundation to help us get through the hardships we face in mortality! As a Temple worker, I see miracles every week ,I feel the peace God gives his children that come to visit him and his spirit while gathering Isreal! Always know that we're here on Earth 🌎 because we have our own personal missions here on earth we are God's Heavenly army! Take care, stay strong 💪 you got this! ❤🧡💙💜🤗🙏🏻✨️✨️✨️✨️
On the discernment question, I'd like to add a little more to what Jennifer shared. In the scriptures we find very clear examples of prophet-leaders who can "see into the souls" of wicked individuals. So, I don't think we can skirt this very important question. Clearly there's an ideal set forward by God, through the prophets who were inspired to record certain examples of discernment, and I think we should all try to reach that ideal. That's the point of the scriptures. We should be reading them and trying to live our lives in a way that would allow us to see God's protective power intervene in our lives. We need God's light to shine in all the dark corners, and I believe that we shouldn't make excuses for some particular leader's inability to foresee the future. But, I also don't think we should pass judgement on these leaders who fail to catch predators. We're all fallen, and weak, and we should extend grace to these incredible men and women who are trying to do what God would have them do. We also need to extend grace to ourselves. Bottom line is this. We need to be patient with our leaders, but we shouldn't write-off a leader's lack of discernment as "it's not possible" or, "that's not how discernment works" or, "discernment isn't like magic." We clearly have an ideal set forward in scripture, by prophets and other inspired individuals who were righteous enough, and have enough faith, to receive very clear instructions from the Lord to prevent certain future issues from happening. This type of miraculous intervention didn't (and doesn't) erase, or diminish our agency. We can use our agency to expand the agency of others (e.g. prevent abuse from happening). @Stephen, let's have a conversation sometime!
This popped up in my feed and i watched it again. Very powerful witness of Jennifer Roach. Thank you Jennifer for sharing your experiences. Ive experienced abuse and my mother is a convert as well as my paternal grandmother. Both were Presbyterian who left protestantism to join the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I appreciate your example and faith. I relate with your experiences and i love my membership in the church. Thank you Stephen Jones. I love your interviews.
Rather, she supports the cause of Mormonism😢 or "the Jesus of Mormonism😢", who is HUGELY different from Jesus of the BIBLE, of CHRISTIANITY! Anyone who diligently seeks, studies, understands, & loves THE WORD (the Bible & Jesus) knows this. JESUS is the way, the truth, & the life (as scripture says). PLEASE believe JESUS)--not Mormonism or what any "man, merely human" says.❤🔩🙏 In HIM you find redemption, purpose, & joy.
@@susanburrows810 If you read your bible more you would know that Jesus Christ's prophets also wrote the book of Mormon and that the gathering of Israel is happening now. You don't know what you speak of when you talk about what we believe.
What she is saying about abuse and figuring out how to tell people is spot on. She is a great advocate! Great interview and thanks for bringing this to light!
Jennifer is awesome and I would volunteer to be president of her fan club. The church also started putting windows in the doors of the classroom and a couple years ago leaders couldn’t be one on one driving children to or from activities. They have put so many things in place and decades ago before this was at the forefront. That is a church that cares about children.
I was one of the people who insisted on windows on the door, or doors ajar. People had no idea what was going on. Everything was hush, hushed. We also did not have the medical and scientific knowledge and equipment to know the extent. There was a lot of ‘forgive and forget.’ It was taught that it was in the Bible. Well, it isn’t and no one believed me. They went home from Sunday School to prove me wrong. I got apologies. The world was different then.
If the Bishop thinks there could be something not right but doesn't feel comfortable prying further, he could get another trusted female adult involved
Problem with the preacher sermon about how "people make mistakes" is that applies to going to piss before Saying a morning prayer. That applies to doing something stupid as a leader etc. That doesn't apply to being an unrepentant predator. This pastor just defended a predator like an idiot 🤦🏻♂️
I was a mandated reporter when I worked in healthcare in California. Honestly I never heard anyone say that we should hesitate to push mandated reporting because it could increase caseloads too much, etc.. That part seriously disturbed me. I liked the safeguards that the church does have in place that were highlighted. Boundaries--good point. But I don't think it hurts to examine ourselves from time to time and see where we can improve. Mistakes have been made.
She is conflating the research and stats on universal mandatory reporting (everybody is a mandated reporter) and mandated reporters (certain professionals being mandated to report). The universal mandatory reporting has caused lots of unintended consequences like she mentions. The mandated reporters have not had the level of issues as the universal reporting. She does sloppy research and misunderstands and misinterprets social science research to create her own agenda which is to defend the Mormon church with regards to abuse. I agree that background checks and mandated reporting are not panaceas but they are essential components of safeguarding children and creating abuse safe institutions.
She's intentionally putting out misinformation to convince members to excuse the LDS Church for not protecting children and for LDS abuse coverups. She's on the LDS church's payroll.
Such an amazing story of strength and faith, and such a small world we live in! A little while in I realized that she and I were investigating the church at the exact same time not that far from each other! I was just out of high school at the time and had a lot of friends who were members of the church who had such a profound impact on me. I was invited to a Book of Mormon play at a local stake center and that started it all for me and my love for the Book of Mormon and all scriptures we have for that matter. I was even there at SafeCo field to see the prophet for the first time ever. That event helped me gain a testimony of prophets and apostles that I still have today. I will never forget the tens of thousands of saints singing “We thank thee o God for a prophet”, it still brings me to tears just thinking about it. The Gospel is alive and well in Washington.
I heard her speak earlier this summer at the Latter-day Fair Conferemce and right away, I could tell the work she is involved in is going to help a lot of people and hopefully build a lot of bridges.
Jennifer Roach is such a good soul and inspiring person! What happened to her is beyond terrible. I have to wonder if Satan didn't go hard after her because he knew she was such a good and powerful person.
This interview was so enlightening for a life member. I applaud her for using a traumatizing experience to help others and do some amazing honest research. The idea of all of these predators in the church has often bothered me and it was comforting to hear something more than an amplified rumor. We are blessed to have her join our church. What a strong amazing woman.
Jennifer is on the cutting edge of understanding and dealing with child abuse! I wish every parent and youth leader could see this video!!! Thank you Jennifer!!!
You can go into the room with your child when questions are being asked by a Bishop without any problem at all! Our Stake does everything to put parents and children first, we also have two Sunday school teachers to every Sunday school class! And we have glass windows in every door 🚪 for parents to look in and observe the class at any time! Unfortunately, mental illness is on the rise in society, and it's impossible to know when someone like this works with you or they attend church with you! So everyone has to help keep an eye out for people like this! 👍🏻
Amazing how the Lord’s ways are more protective than we even realize! Ward boundaries, sustaining, strong families, etc. I really appreciate Jennifer’s contributions to the world-to society as a therapist, and to the Church of Jesus Christ through her research, insights, and testimony. The Lord is using her in important ways!
Oh my gosh! When I was a kid I found a very old book of Old Testament stories for children that must have belonged to my Mom or something, because the pages were already brown and crumbling around the edges. Dad caught me reading it under the covers with a flashlight after lights out. He made me put it away, but I didn't get in trouble because it was the Bible.
My life was turned upside down when my ex filed for divorce . My last 20 years has been hard to figure it out. I have been to he'll, I tried to take my life. We had 20 years of marriage and 9 children together. I was so confused this happen. I found out my ex had been sexually abused by her brother. I THINK this trauma my ex had in her life has caused this. I LOVE her so much and my children. I HOPE that God would make this better some how and I wanted my family back. DOES anyone know or can help me understand.
Instituting mandated reporting is not effective. NOT mandating reporting is even less effective. Doing background checks are not effective. NOT doing background checks is even less effective. Teaching kids about abuse is not effective. NOT teaching kids about abuse is even less effective. No solution exists. But we can do some things that help. It’s hard, but that’s the truth.
I haven't read all of the comments, and I have about 10 minutes left of it, but if it hasn't been said already, the other way we can protect children is to do, at a minimum, the Church's Youth Protection training even if you don't have a calling working with the Youth. If you want a better training, do the Youth Protection training the BSA has available for free. It's about 72 minutes long, but it does a really good job of showing how abusers groom children.
Great presentation on such a delicate topic . Great insights especially in an era when so many love to use this topic to unfairly criticize the church's management of these situations when they arise. I loved her comparison of our church and all its divinely inspired safe guards that it has in place that Protestant churches do not have. I also loved her contrast of understanding that in the restored gospel we have this unique and far more favorable understanding of God, who is literally our Father who loves us and cares about us and is so mindful of us. We often forget at as Latter Day Saints, that Protestant churches do not have that understanding. I am so grateful for my knowledge of my Father and Mother in heaven!!!!
I was in my 50's when i asked my Dad if he knew what happened to me as a 3 or 4 yr old... was surprised to find out that he knew... I had told my mother what happened and then never heard another word my whole life. Never spoke about it to anyone, not even my friends who suffered worst abuse than mine. The post man just took me by the hand a walked off with me. For the rest of my childhood I stressed every time i saw a postman in the neighborhood. I asked my Dad what came of it... He said that after my mom told him, He called the post office to report it and they explained to him that postman was the replacement while the other guy was gone on vacation, He would not be there much longer... that is the year 1967 or 1968 for you.
WOW, Jennifer’s testimony is amazing, and her sharing of her profound knowledge and expertise in the area of child abuse was so very helpful and insightful. Great podcast Stephen
Great conversation so far. I see a situation in myself that reflects what I see in her. A very careful and thoughtful person who sees things literally, and embraces the truth and test the truth that she sees continuously. Let me elaborate, I just embrace what people say to me as being honest and truthful. And therefore I could accept any thing that would be proclaimed as truth. Even the spirit can can confess to me a truth and I will experience or light. Which causes a problem because it's hard to distinguish what is and what is not truth. It's very complicated, but unless you know darkness from light clearly then it is hard to truly distinguish truth from untruth. I went through a period of my life where darkness was my light even though that is impossible. But that's where I was. But once I was exposed to light the true light, then I was able to truly distinguish between light and darkness, truth and untruth without question. I feel that she needed that time of darkness in her life so that she could develop a keen awareness of what true light was and what darkness is when it comes to theology and Doctrine. Again, I love the interview and I think she has a great sense of awareness because of her experience. Thank you for this interview?
I have worked with law enforcement, the Boy Scouts, and other youth activities as coach. It is often perceived that religious institutions offer greater chance of abuse than non-religious. This is a misunderstanding. The religious institutions often have better records, name lists (offender and victim), deeper pockets, and no governmental immunities, which led to more successful law suits. Just some observations for perspective. Anecdotal I concede.
This is an amazing interview with necessary information. Thank you both for your time. 🙏🏼 One thing I was disappointed in because it was not discussed, was the role that p*rn*graphy plays in abuse. As far as I know, p*orn has not been proven to be the CAUSE of abuse, but it has an irrefutable CORRELATION. Obviously, the Church has aways taught to not look at p*orn, & they also have addiction recovery classes, but if you want to decrease this type of abuse, we need stronger & more frequent arguments against p*orn.
Jennifer and Stephen this has been awesome. Jennifer near the end when you said, "God is aware of you." or rather you specifically said, "He is aware of you." I felt that impact in your life. I felt the Spirit. Thank you for this episode. So many more to watch.
When I was called as a Sunday School teacher for children I remember they put windows in all the doors to the rooms in the church. Before that... they were just solid doors. Now I noticed that there has to be two adult men teaching any children in the Primary. I feel both of these things are positive actions in preventing any child abuse from happening.
I really appreciate this episode! Very interesting information and this has helped me with a lot of struggle I have felt after hearing stories about abuse within the church. This also gives some really good information on how to help the situation.
AS A MEMBER OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS, I HAVE A LITTLE DIFFERENT VIEW. I REMEMBER WHEN I SHOWED UP AT CHURCH, I TEACH THE YOUTH, THE CHURCH USUALLY HAVE A HUSBAND, WIFE TEAM OR AT LEAST 2 ADULTS IN THE ROOM. I FEEL SAFE FROM SOMEONE EVER BEING ABLE TO CLAIM I HAVE BEHAVED INAPPROORIATELY, I NEVER HAVE, NEVER FELT THAT A AWAY, CERTAINLY DON,T WANT TOO. BUT NOW I FEEL SAFE AS A TEACHER, LESSON INSTRUCTOR. I NOTICE THE CHILDREN FEEL SPONTANIOUS IN THE CLASSROOM DISCUSSION. PEOPLE, USUALLY KIDS WALK BY AND LOOK IN. SOMETIMES ADULTS. I THINK IT IS A GREAT IMPROVEMENT. IT,S A WIN, WIN, WIN FOR TEACHERS, STUDENTS AND PARENTS. THIS VIDEO BRINGS THESE THINGS TO MY AWARENESS.
Thank you Stephen for asking the hard questions. Glad to know you and can say it is no surprise you are such a partner in Christ. This is a great episode and can’t wait for more.
Don't go to your Bishop, always go to the Stake president, and emphasize the importance and the servarity of what is going on! Usually the Stake president is more refined through the spirit and a little more serious than other callings! That has been my personal experience anyways!
Unfortunately we live in a society where we reward the criminals and punish the victims. If you think about that it the realistically has been happening throughout all of history; it’s just progressively gotten worse and worse as the years have gone by. And she is correct that the past has a way of sneaking up on you and back in your life. Like a black shadow hanging in the background. The horrific things that happened to you do manifest themselves in the future. Which is why it’s very important to really process the things that happened to us. The people who commit the crimes don’t feel remorse or guilt; especially when it comes to sexual abuse, those people have no remorse for the things that they do. And unfortunately they will not see their punishment till christ comes. But you have to learn to let it go because if you don’t the only person who’s being punished is the victim and it will eat you alive.
Wow this was just a good one. It was perhaps the most nuanced take on abuse in churches I’ve heard. It certainly was pro-LDS but she took the time to mention positive features that no one brings up in these discussions and also took time to express obvious disdain. Her authority in many roles also seems unique, between different Christian churches, being a therapist and also a victim of abuse. The section towards the end about asking about the Law of Chastity was also very unique to this episode. That it can sometimes put a leader in harms way to remove the child from harm. To risk appearing as the guy who likes to ask personal questions versus the guy who just wanted to make sure it wasn’t abuse.
This discussion is over an hour long but worth watching every minute. Thank you for the information and perspective of both the abused and the abusers. David, you did a great job listening and letting Jennifer tell her story.
Maybe of a bishop senses abuse or something doesn't sit well with the teenage girl, he could then ask the teenager , could we set up another meeting and have the young women's president and relief society president attend with us? My point here is to get to the truth if there us abuse ehike at the sane time protecting the Bishop having 2 witnesses so to speak and also making it more comfortable for the teenage girl to open up and keeping the Bishops safety, his reputation in tact. The same with a teenage boy but using 2 priesthood holders that work with the young men, teenagers etc. To me the bishop having 2 other people in the meeting woukd be the wisest safest fir the Bishop and make the chikd or teenager feel more comfortable in opening up. I've been sexualky abused twice in my life and even as a member of the church I woukd have never been ok talking to my bishop becsuse g e is a man and it was 2 different men thst physically and sexualky abused me. I've carried this with me since I was 17 yrs old. I'm 69 now. Girls abused by a man ir men are nit going to be comfortable coming forward to another man even if it's the bishop. Just as a male us going to be comfortable going to a man even if it's the bishop because he was abused by a man. These are hard things to talk about. Because of my upbringing in the church when my virginity was formally taken, I did finally tell my dad but not thr bishop. Msybe my dad tokd him in don't know but I was left feeling dirty, that I had list ehat my family, my church had always taught me was special, sacred and only for marriage. I felt I had ket dien myself, Heavenky Father and my dad. There us much mire to my terrible experience but to much to say here. My main reason is I feel that when the bishop is meeting with a single female., fir his protection and to make the girl more comfortable theur shoukd be 2 women present. Just my opinion, the opinion of a victim of physical and sexual abuse.
I completely disagree with everything she says regarding child abuse in the Mormon church, and how the church handles it. I can’t even with this woman. I don’t understand why she goes to such great lengths to defend the Mormon church and its approach to rooting out child abuse. She dances around the hard questions, and dances around how the church handles cases of abuse, and fails to address the elephant in the room. The church will never change or do the right thing. I don’t know why she doesn’t realize this, and why she sticks up for the church.
@@jenniferroach595 Really? What's your salary as a BYUI professor of a 1 unit Online class? Does FAIR provide you money? What about BH Roberts research grant? Are you really going to claim you get $0 from anything LDS-affiliated? Please come clean and disclose how you are financially benefitting from all LDS-related sources.
@@rockergirl873 The church does not pay me for apologetics work. It doesn't pay any of us at FAIR. We're all volunteers. I have a gift to offer, so I offer it. My income comes from my private practice as a licensed mental health therapist. I teach an online class for fun (you can imagine how much adjunct work pays :-) ), and BH Roberts kindly gave me a grant for the historical work I'm doing on how the church has handled abuse in the past. That money covers research costs. I'll be presenting on that next summer a few times if you're interested.
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I appreciate the sensitivity of this topic and understand it can be triggering. I’ve shared my thoughts to contribute positively to this discussion. Let’s approach Jennifer’s story with kindness and respect in our comments. Open, honest discussions and questions are always welcome here.
My heart goes out to everyone affected by abuse. In these challenging times, let's offer comfort and stand as pillars of support, embodying the spirit of compassion in our actions. I find solace in my faith in Jesus Christ and in the words from Revelation 21:3-4, reminding us of hope and healing in times of sorrow.
“And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.”
One thing that I didn't notice specifically about another filter of 'Swiss cheese' protection, is the bishop has the opportunity to bring in a parent or a trusted peer to the interview by request of the interviewee or by request of the parent/guardian of a child.
It wasn't always that way, but this gives the opportunity for accountability. And apparently especially when those sorts of questions need to be addressed, that there is a witness to the "why" it had to be asked. This also of course makes accountability for alone time. With classes and even youth activities now, there has to be 2 or more adults with the youth at all times. I think this has become a great final or nearly final filter. Because those who have this temptation and are in the fence or even those who haven't yet gotten caught and are in stages of premeditation; are much less likely to act upon the sin if there is someone else there to see what is going on.
I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse (my dad was my abuser, even while he served in high church callings). Things are more resolved now (I told my mom when I was iny 20's and she went straight to the stake president, who told my dad to turn himself in to the police station and also my dad lost his church membership pretty much immediately. But I have still felt troubled about ways I thought things could have been handled earlier--prior to telling my mom, I had told three different bishops what my dad did and not much happened. I have always believed in the restored gospel and church but felt so much trauma and difficulty trusting church authority figures. Hearing this interview was hugely important and faith-building for me. Thank you SO much.
You absolutely deserved to have the adults around you looking out for you instead of hiding the continued abuse you experienced. I’m sorry your bishops failed to protect you when they could have.
I'm so sorry you weren't listened to sooner. I'm glad things were finally taken care of, but I totally understand how having to go through so many people before actually being heard and properly responded to is so traumatizing.
I truly understand what you went through personally! But l know our life experiences make us who we are and we are stronger having gone through certain hardships tough though it may seem!
People are sometimes disappointing and don't know how to react to shocking life situations!
So I'm personally sorry it took time for something to be done. However, the good news is the gospel is still true and it's still a precious source of God's foundation to help us get through the hardships we face in mortality!
As a Temple worker, I see miracles every week ,I feel the peace God gives his children that come to visit him and his spirit while gathering Isreal!
Always know that we're here on Earth 🌎 because we have our own personal missions here on earth we are God's Heavenly army! Take care, stay strong 💪 you got this! ❤🧡💙💜🤗🙏🏻✨️✨️✨️✨️
100% have never thought about ward boundaries that way 🤯
On the discernment question, I'd like to add a little more to what Jennifer shared. In the scriptures we find very clear examples of prophet-leaders who can "see into the souls" of wicked individuals. So, I don't think we can skirt this very important question. Clearly there's an ideal set forward by God, through the prophets who were inspired to record certain examples of discernment, and I think we should all try to reach that ideal. That's the point of the scriptures. We should be reading them and trying to live our lives in a way that would allow us to see God's protective power intervene in our lives. We need God's light to shine in all the dark corners, and I believe that we shouldn't make excuses for some particular leader's inability to foresee the future.
But, I also don't think we should pass judgement on these leaders who fail to catch predators. We're all fallen, and weak, and we should extend grace to these incredible men and women who are trying to do what God would have them do.
We also need to extend grace to ourselves.
Bottom line is this. We need to be patient with our leaders, but we shouldn't write-off a leader's lack of discernment as "it's not possible" or, "that's not how discernment works" or, "discernment isn't like magic."
We clearly have an ideal set forward in scripture, by prophets and other inspired individuals who were righteous enough, and have enough faith, to receive very clear instructions from the Lord to prevent certain future issues from happening. This type of miraculous intervention didn't (and doesn't) erase, or diminish our agency. We can use our agency to expand the agency of others (e.g. prevent abuse from happening).
@Stephen, let's have a conversation sometime!
I’ve never seen her before! She’s amazing! She and David Alexander are absolutely a miracle!
There perspectives are very pure in my opinion.
@@LetsGetRealSJ Thatvis what reels me in. David is a miracle to me.
She had done a full year weekly lesson on FAIR on how to talk to your evangelical friends about gospel principles.
@@wendyfoster5579 So cool! I’ll have to look that up!
This popped up in my feed and i watched it again. Very powerful witness of Jennifer Roach. Thank you Jennifer for sharing your experiences. Ive experienced abuse and my mother is a convert as well as my paternal grandmother. Both were Presbyterian who left protestantism to join the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I appreciate your example and faith. I relate with your experiences and i love my membership in the church. Thank you Stephen Jones. I love your interviews.
Thanks for this measured approach in discussing a very sensitive topic.
She is so good for the Cause of Christ!!!
I agree. She has the ability to be honest with respect.
Rather, she supports the cause of Mormonism😢 or "the Jesus of Mormonism😢", who is HUGELY different from Jesus of the BIBLE, of CHRISTIANITY! Anyone who diligently seeks, studies, understands, & loves THE WORD (the Bible & Jesus) knows this. JESUS is the way, the truth, & the life (as scripture says). PLEASE believe JESUS)--not Mormonism or what any "man, merely human" says.❤🔩🙏 In HIM you find redemption, purpose, & joy.
@@susanburrows810 If you read your bible more you would know that Jesus Christ's prophets also wrote the book of Mormon and that the gathering of Israel is happening now.
You don't know what you speak of when you talk about what we believe.
What she is saying about abuse and figuring out how to tell people is spot on. She is a great advocate! Great interview and thanks for bringing this to light!
Jennifer is awesome and I would volunteer to be president of her fan club. The church also started putting windows in the doors of the classroom and a couple years ago leaders couldn’t be one on one driving children to or from activities. They have put so many things in place and decades ago before this was at the forefront. That is a church that cares about children.
:-) :-) :-)
I was one of the people who insisted on windows on the door, or doors ajar. People had no idea what was going on. Everything was hush, hushed. We also did not have the medical and scientific knowledge and equipment to know the extent. There was a lot of ‘forgive and forget.’ It was taught that it was in the Bible. Well, it isn’t and no one believed me. They went home from Sunday School to prove me wrong. I got apologies. The world was different then.
If the Bishop thinks there could be something not right but doesn't feel comfortable prying further, he could get another trusted female adult involved
Problem with the preacher sermon about how "people make mistakes" is that applies to going to piss before Saying a morning prayer. That applies to doing something stupid as a leader etc. That doesn't apply to being an unrepentant predator. This pastor just defended a predator like an idiot 🤦🏻♂️
I was a mandated reporter when I worked in healthcare in California. Honestly I never heard anyone say that we should hesitate to push mandated reporting because it could increase caseloads too much, etc.. That part seriously disturbed me.
I liked the safeguards that the church does have in place that were highlighted. Boundaries--good point. But I don't think it hurts to examine ourselves from time to time and see where we can improve. Mistakes have been made.
She is conflating the research and stats on universal mandatory reporting (everybody is a mandated reporter) and mandated reporters (certain professionals being mandated to report). The universal mandatory reporting has caused lots of unintended consequences like she mentions. The mandated reporters have not had the level of issues as the universal reporting. She does sloppy research and misunderstands and misinterprets social science research to create her own agenda which is to defend the Mormon church with regards to abuse. I agree that background checks and mandated reporting are not panaceas but they are essential components of safeguarding children and creating abuse safe institutions.
She's intentionally putting out misinformation to convince members to excuse the LDS Church for not protecting children and for LDS abuse coverups. She's on the LDS church's payroll.
Jennifer you need to meet to and talk to David Alexander! Can you imagine a video with the two of you?
He is so cool!! I love David's testimony!
That would be the coolest conversation.
Such an amazing story of strength and faith, and such a small world we live in! A little while in I realized that she and I were investigating the church at the exact same time not that far from each other! I was just out of high school at the time and had a lot of friends who were members of the church who had such a profound impact on me. I was invited to a Book of Mormon play at a local stake center and that started it all for me and my love for the Book of Mormon and all scriptures we have for that matter. I was even there at SafeCo field to see the prophet for the first time ever. That event helped me gain a testimony of prophets and apostles that I still have today. I will never forget the tens of thousands of saints singing “We thank thee o God for a prophet”, it still brings me to tears just thinking about it. The Gospel is alive and well in Washington.
Excellent interview 🕊️
I listen to Sis. Roach every chance I get.
I heard her speak earlier this summer at the Latter-day Fair Conferemce and right away, I could tell the work she is involved in is going to help a lot of people and hopefully build a lot of bridges.
Same!! I just love her.
Jennifer Roach is such a good soul and inspiring person! What happened to her is beyond terrible. I have to wonder if Satan didn't go hard after her because he knew she was such a good and powerful person.
This interview was so enlightening for a life member. I applaud her for using a traumatizing experience to help others and do some amazing honest research. The idea of all of these predators in the church has often bothered me and it was comforting to hear something more than an amplified rumor. We are blessed to have her join our church. What a strong amazing woman.
Totally agree. This popped up on my feed as well!
Secrets are a control mechanism of the enemy of your soul. No secrets is freedom!
Haven’t finished this episode yet. But I can already tell this women is amazing! I would love to be on your podcast sometime
Jennifer is on the cutting edge of understanding and dealing with child abuse! I wish every parent and youth leader could see this video!!! Thank you Jennifer!!!
Every episode of this channel I have seen so far has been full of nothing but Gold. thanks for putting out such great content!
If you expect 30 but get 5, that's not 75% less, that is 83% less.
parents needs to step up, I dont let any man talk to my young children alone behind closed doors, not right I dont care who you are
You can go into the room with your child when questions are being asked by a Bishop without any problem at all! Our Stake does everything to put parents and children first, we also have two Sunday school teachers to every Sunday school class! And we have glass windows in every door 🚪 for parents to look in and observe the class at any time!
Unfortunately, mental illness is on the rise in society, and it's impossible to know when someone like this works with you or they attend church with you! So everyone has to help keep an eye out for people like this! 👍🏻
Amazing how the Lord’s ways are more protective than we even realize! Ward boundaries, sustaining, strong families, etc. I really appreciate Jennifer’s contributions to the world-to society as a therapist, and to the Church of Jesus Christ through her research, insights, and testimony. The Lord is using her in important ways!
Thank you Stephen! This was a wonderful interview
I'm glad you like it. What part was most helpful or insightful for you?
@@LetsGetRealSJ protections for children built into the church and culture
Oh my gosh! When I was a kid I found a very old book of Old Testament stories for children that must have belonged to my Mom or something, because the pages were already brown and crumbling around the edges. Dad caught me reading it under the covers with a flashlight after lights out. He made me put it away, but I didn't get in trouble because it was the Bible.
My life was turned upside down when my ex filed for divorce . My last 20 years has been hard to figure it out. I have been to he'll, I tried to take my life. We had 20 years of marriage and 9 children together. I was so confused this happen. I found out my ex had been sexually abused by her brother. I THINK this trauma my ex had in her life has caused this. I LOVE her so much and my children. I HOPE that God would make this better some how and I wanted my family back. DOES anyone know or can help me understand.
Instituting mandated reporting is not effective. NOT mandating reporting is even less effective.
Doing background checks are not effective. NOT doing background checks is even less effective.
Teaching kids about abuse is not effective. NOT teaching kids about abuse is even less effective.
No solution exists. But we can do some things that help. It’s hard, but that’s the truth.
I haven't read all of the comments, and I have about 10 minutes left of it, but if it hasn't been said already, the other way we can protect children is to do, at a minimum, the Church's Youth Protection training even if you don't have a calling working with the Youth. If you want a better training, do the Youth Protection training the BSA has available for free. It's about 72 minutes long, but it does a really good job of showing how abusers groom children.
Great presentation on such a delicate topic . Great insights especially in an era when so many love to use this topic to unfairly criticize the church's management of these situations when they arise. I loved her comparison of our church and all its divinely inspired safe guards that it has in place that Protestant churches do not have. I also loved her contrast of understanding that in the restored gospel we have this unique and far more favorable understanding of God, who is literally our Father who loves us and cares about us and is so mindful of us. We often forget at as Latter Day Saints, that Protestant churches do not have that understanding. I am so grateful for my knowledge of my Father and Mother in heaven!!!!
I was in my 50's when i asked my Dad if he knew what happened to me as a 3 or 4 yr old... was surprised to find out that he knew... I had told my mother what happened and then never heard another word my whole life. Never spoke about it to anyone, not even my friends who suffered worst abuse than mine. The post man just took me by the hand a walked off with me. For the rest of my childhood I stressed every time i saw a postman in the neighborhood. I asked my Dad what came of it... He said that after my mom told him, He called the post office to report it and they explained to him that postman was the replacement while the other guy was gone on vacation, He would not be there much longer... that is the year 1967 or 1968 for you.
WOW, Jennifer’s testimony is amazing, and her sharing of her profound knowledge and expertise in the area of child abuse was so very helpful and insightful. Great podcast Stephen
Great conversation so far. I see a situation in myself that reflects what I see in her. A very careful and thoughtful person who sees things literally, and embraces the truth and test the truth that she sees continuously. Let me elaborate, I just embrace what people say to me as being honest and truthful. And therefore I could accept any thing that would be proclaimed as truth. Even the spirit can can confess to me a truth and I will experience or light. Which causes a problem because it's hard to distinguish what is and what is not truth. It's very complicated, but unless you know darkness from light clearly then it is hard to truly distinguish truth from untruth. I went through a period of my life where darkness was my light even though that is impossible. But that's where I was. But once I was exposed to light the true light, then I was able to truly distinguish between light and darkness, truth and untruth without question. I feel that she needed that time of darkness in her life so that she could develop a keen awareness of what true light was and what darkness is when it comes to theology and Doctrine. Again, I love the interview and I think she has a great sense of awareness because of her experience. Thank you for this interview?
I have worked with law enforcement, the Boy Scouts, and other youth activities as coach. It is often perceived that religious institutions offer greater chance of abuse than non-religious. This is a misunderstanding. The religious institutions often have better records, name lists (offender and victim), deeper pockets, and no governmental immunities, which led to more successful law suits.
Just some observations for perspective. Anecdotal I concede.
This is an amazing interview with necessary information. Thank you both for your time. 🙏🏼
One thing I was disappointed in because it was not discussed, was the role that p*rn*graphy plays in abuse. As far as I know, p*orn has not been proven to be the CAUSE of abuse, but it has an irrefutable CORRELATION. Obviously, the Church has aways taught to not look at p*orn, & they also have addiction recovery classes, but if you want to decrease this type of abuse, we need stronger & more frequent arguments against p*orn.
Jennifer and Stephen this has been awesome. Jennifer near the end when you said, "God is aware of you." or rather you specifically said, "He is aware of you." I felt that impact in your life. I felt the Spirit. Thank you for this episode. So many more to watch.
I keep wanting u to mention the church double leadership ! All classes have 2 adults ! Also how wise that the church cut ties with the Boy Scouts…..
When I was called as a Sunday School teacher for children I remember they put windows in all the doors to the rooms in the church. Before that... they were just solid doors. Now I noticed that there has to be two adult men teaching any children in the Primary. I feel both of these things are positive actions in preventing any child abuse from happening.
I really appreciate this episode! Very interesting information and this has helped me with a lot of struggle I have felt after hearing stories about abuse within the church. This also gives some really good information on how to help the situation.
AS A MEMBER OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS, I HAVE A LITTLE DIFFERENT VIEW. I REMEMBER WHEN I SHOWED UP AT CHURCH, I TEACH THE YOUTH, THE CHURCH USUALLY HAVE A HUSBAND, WIFE TEAM OR AT LEAST 2 ADULTS IN THE ROOM. I FEEL SAFE FROM SOMEONE EVER BEING ABLE TO CLAIM I HAVE BEHAVED INAPPROORIATELY, I NEVER HAVE, NEVER FELT THAT A AWAY, CERTAINLY DON,T WANT TOO. BUT NOW I FEEL SAFE AS A TEACHER, LESSON INSTRUCTOR. I NOTICE THE CHILDREN FEEL SPONTANIOUS IN THE CLASSROOM DISCUSSION. PEOPLE, USUALLY KIDS WALK BY AND LOOK IN. SOMETIMES ADULTS. I THINK IT IS A GREAT IMPROVEMENT. IT,S A WIN, WIN, WIN FOR TEACHERS, STUDENTS AND PARENTS. THIS VIDEO BRINGS THESE THINGS TO MY AWARENESS.
I have a question... if childhood abuse is rarely reported until age 52... is that across all ethnicities and cultures?
Thank you Stephen for asking the hard questions. Glad to know you and can say it is no surprise you are such a partner in Christ. This is a great episode and can’t wait for more.
He is not asking hard questions. He is asking faithful questions.
What a great perspective! Thanks for sharing your insights and testimony!
Wow, very informative. Such an amazing story!
What a powerful voice Jennifer has!
And Stephen, you are a gifted interviewer
This is really important and needed messaging!
@@jesmalley He is so good. He makes it look easy. @LetsGetRealSJ
Convert here, I get it! Down to the detail of the thoughts we have before and after
❤
Who can a member go to when leaders don't care or believe someone is depressed?
Don't go to your Bishop, always go to the Stake president, and emphasize the importance and the servarity of what is going on! Usually the Stake president is more refined through the spirit and a little more serious than other callings! That has been my personal experience anyways!
Unfortunately we live in a society where we reward the criminals and punish the victims. If you think about that it the realistically has been happening throughout all of history; it’s just progressively gotten worse and worse as the years have gone by.
And she is correct that the past has a way of sneaking up on you and back in your life. Like a black shadow hanging in the background. The horrific things that happened to you do manifest themselves in the future. Which is why it’s very important to really process the things that happened to us. The people who commit the crimes don’t feel remorse or guilt; especially when it comes to sexual abuse, those people have no remorse for the things that they do. And unfortunately they will not see their punishment till christ comes. But you have to learn to let it go because if you don’t the only person who’s being punished is the victim and it will eat you alive.
Wow this was just a good one. It was perhaps the most nuanced take on abuse in churches I’ve heard. It certainly was pro-LDS but she took the time to mention positive features that no one brings up in these discussions and also took time to express obvious disdain. Her authority in many roles also seems unique, between different Christian churches, being a therapist and also a victim of abuse.
The section towards the end about asking about the Law of Chastity was also very unique to this episode. That it can sometimes put a leader in harms way to remove the child from harm. To risk appearing as the guy who likes to ask personal questions versus the guy who just wanted to make sure it wasn’t abuse.
This discussion is over an hour long but worth watching every minute. Thank you for the information and perspective of both the abused and the abusers. David, you did a great job listening and letting Jennifer tell her story.
She is absolutely incredible!!! I’ve followed her and watched her podcast forever! Thanks for the fantastic interview!
Great interview - thank you for doing this, and keep it up!
I didn't tell anyone about the abuse that happened to me until i was an adult, married. Had zero contact or connection with any of my abusers.
So sad for her abuse and her divorce, but excited about her mission in life. Thank you! ❤
Interesting.
Wow what a wonderful podcast! I really enjoyed listening to her.
Parents with teens really need to talk to their kids. Keep the door of communication open. Take them out to eat and make them talk.
Stephen you are a very talented interviewer. Youre a great listener
Thank you for sharing your story Sister Roach!
Thank you to both of you for doing what you are doing.
What a GREAT interview
Amazing people!
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The ❤😂❤❤😅😂
I’m 😅❤
Maybe of a bishop senses abuse or something doesn't sit well with the teenage girl, he could then ask the teenager , could we set up another meeting and have the young women's president and relief society president attend with us? My point here is to get to the truth if there us abuse ehike at the sane time protecting the Bishop having 2 witnesses so to speak and also making it more comfortable for the teenage girl to open up and keeping the Bishops safety, his reputation in tact. The same with a teenage boy but using 2 priesthood holders that work with the young men, teenagers etc.
To me the bishop having 2 other people in the meeting woukd be the wisest safest fir the Bishop and make the chikd or teenager feel more comfortable in opening up.
I've been sexualky abused twice in my life and even as a member of the church I woukd have never been ok talking to my bishop becsuse g e is a man and it was 2 different men thst physically and sexualky abused me. I've carried this with me since I was 17 yrs old. I'm 69 now. Girls abused by a man ir men are nit going to be comfortable coming forward to another man even if it's the bishop. Just as a male us going to be comfortable going to a man even if it's the bishop because he was abused by a man. These are hard things to talk about. Because of my upbringing in the church when my virginity was formally taken, I did finally tell my dad but not thr bishop. Msybe my dad tokd him in don't know but I was left feeling dirty, that I had list ehat my family, my church had always taught me was special, sacred and only for marriage. I felt I had ket dien myself, Heavenky Father and my dad. There us much mire to my terrible experience but to much to say here. My main reason is I feel that when the bishop is meeting with a single female., fir his protection and to make the girl more comfortable theur shoukd be 2 women present. Just my opinion, the opinion of a victim of physical and sexual abuse.
She still traumatized.
I suppose everyone who has been through trauma carries some of it with them for life. Most days I'm at peace with that.
@jenniferroach595 thanks for the response 👍. I appreciate it. Right now I'm just investigating the LDS church ⛪️ and I found your video 📹.
@@1JOHNCALVIN Wonderful. I hope you are feeling the love of God as you search him out.
@@jenniferroach595 I love this response so much. It is something I pray for that anyone and everyone to feel as they seek after God ☺️
I completely disagree with everything she says regarding child abuse in the Mormon church, and how the church handles it.
I can’t even with this woman. I don’t understand why she goes to such great lengths to defend the Mormon church and its approach to rooting out child abuse.
She dances around the hard questions, and dances around how the church handles cases of abuse, and fails to address the elephant in the room.
The church will never change or do the right thing. I don’t know why she doesn’t realize this, and why she sticks up for the church.
She's on the LDS Church's payroll.
@@spagoli7430 I'm not. The church does not pay me in any way.
@@jenniferroach595 Really? What's your salary as a BYUI professor of a 1 unit Online class? Does FAIR provide you money? What about BH Roberts research grant? Are you really going to claim you get $0 from anything LDS-affiliated? Please come clean and disclose how you are financially benefitting from all LDS-related sources.
@@rockergirl873 The church does not pay me for apologetics work. It doesn't pay any of us at FAIR. We're all volunteers. I have a gift to offer, so I offer it. My income comes from my private practice as a licensed mental health therapist. I teach an online class for fun (you can imagine how much adjunct work pays :-) ), and BH Roberts kindly gave me a grant for the historical work I'm doing on how the church has handled abuse in the past. That money covers research costs. I'll be presenting on that next summer a few times if you're interested.
Focus on Christ. He is always our savior. All people sin. Jesus Christ is everyone savior. Focus on Jesus.