There is a famous German story which involves a Stainer violin. A man awakens in his bed to hear someone playing his violin downstairs. He grabs his revolver and comes down the stairs. The thief is sitting with the violin, playing very beautifully. (I translate.) "Fine violin," the thief said. "Yes, it's a Stainer." The thief said, "I had an Amati. It could laugh, cry, shout and sing. Alas, your violin can only sing."
For over 150 years Jacob Stainer's instruments were admired and collected by both musicians and aristocrat collectors, and were considered the finest in existence even in Florence, Naples, Venice and Rome. No Luthier got near the refinement of workmanship and consistency, not even the Amati dynasty or Stradivari. Up until around the time of Viotti his instruments generally made three to four times that of Stradivari's work and more. Later on, with the larger orchestration demands and soloists such as Viotti, Kreutzer, and Paganini, a more robust temperament was required to fulfil the need for volume and percussive bowing techniques. French Luthiers were converting the necks, bass bars, bridges and soundposts of existing Strads, Guarneri, Amati, Guadagnini violins / Violas and Cello's etc to cater for these demands. Unfortunately Stainer's work has not been evaluated correctly in more recent times. Like most makers, not all of his instruments were constructed the same. Some periods have a less scooped recurve channelling and a slightly more robust build which makes those a little more suitable for more modern playing styles. Gut strings, a more appropriate bridge / fittings, and a more suitable weight of bow opens up the sound with this period of instruments generally. Even Heifetz used three gut strings. Nylon / Perlon strings strangle the speaking voice and volume on violins and violas of this era and do not contribute to more volume. The sound unique to Jacob Stainer was a concise sweet woody flute like tone that bloomed and resonated with a good musician, and could cut through the mix in an ensemble of competing Bass, Tenor, Woodwind / Brass etc. The quality of tone was always highly regarded.
Aw, thank you! We have plenty more to dig through- and some of them are definitely less than savory, but super interesting. We'll get to all of them! :)
Love your history that you place with the violins...yes the tone does not last long. .but then you put into context with Vienna court settings... and l felt you played with more enthusiasm...which brings the thoughts of the relationship that is between violin and violinist...to shape and mold the relationship is Fantastic... Thanks million for inspiring insights... And to hear history through strings...wonderful
Lovely!! You play beautifully. I have a Stainer copy in a 7/8. It is quite old. It has the high arched belly and a wonderful oiled sheen. It has a wooden handmade case with a book cover and spine as the door on the rosin pocket.
I loved the extra history bits in this one! Your videos are always interesting but this one was extra much. You know, Hilary is my favorite violinist, but I could watch you all day long. Grins!
Aw, that's the nicest compliment ever! :) (But if you're looking for more violin videos- have you seen Janine Jansen playing the Four Seasons? I'm obsessed with it at the moment- her playing is incredibly interesting!)
@@aTonalHits Just was watching it again last night! My 5 year-old either wants to hear Hilary, the Four Seasons (always Janine) or a Mozart piano concerto as she falls asleep which means I get them every night, too! Today I'm going to show her this video because we get a great shot of your bow hold and tilt. My Sunshine has a beautiful bow hold, but the tilt comes and goes. This video will help tremendously! I subscribed months ago and watch all your stuff. Thank you, Katha!
Aw! Hope this helps her bow grip, my mom used to put a photo of Joshua bell on my stand so I would be inspired by his bow grip 😅 Honored to be helping out others now!
I found a nice steiner copy here locally that seems really old and has that same sound. I think I'll get it and play older music on it. I actually played it already, and I thought it sounded like crap at first but the more I played it the more I appreciated it
Thank you Katha! I've been studying about the life of Antonio Stradivari from a book writen by Hill. I have read it several times thoroughly. According to Hill, Steiner was better than Sradivari and Amati. I found this hard to swallow. If the example you played is representative of Stainer, I found the sound even and smooth but lacking in power or brilliance. Who knows maybe the bridge or soundpost was off that day. From the build up I read.about Stainer your example left me seriously wanting. You made a great point when you said Stainers were designed for chamber music. As far as I am concerned Stainers were not all that that they were cracked up to be. I will not be seeking out Stainers anytime real soon. Thank you for educating me all about Stainer violins. I think Adolf Hitler may have propagandists the popularity of Stainers and puffed them up. I may be wrong I don't know. I am thankful for your expert assay of the Stainer violin. Of course not every Stainer was the same and humidity as ound post and bridge may have been not ideal when you tested the instrument. However that said you have completly disproved Hills claim that Stainer was a great and sought after violin. I feel educated now and thank you for your help! Most greatful!😅
I think it is crying out to be returned to a low-stress, gut-strung baroque setup :) Any plans to showcase violins from other national traditions? I know that Chi Mei has some great 17th century English or Dutch violins, I think those are interesting as they often fuse Italian or Stainer-like aspects with local violin-making traditions. Thank you for these videos!
Absolutely! We're working our way through the most famous part of the collection, then branching out a bit, with definite plans to look into bows and modern makers as well. Thanks for tuning in- and I think you're right, this Stainer would probably benefit from a back-to-baroque setup!
Of the three examples I can find, I see that his backs are exceedingly thin around the edges, at around 1.4 mm, and the center section are thick, at nearly 5 mm, and highly arched. This highly arching is also found, as is mentioned here, to the belly of the instrument. This video is very interesting as it allows me to hear various instruments and then, if I can find the geometry of that instrument, to attempt to understand what is going on.
Thats a very fine sounding instrument, im shockingly impressed... i see why they are so revered and desirable. The g, which can too often flop or become heavy and hollow. Its actually perfectly tight and balanced throughout the tonal spectrum. Most people today dont realize that a violin should be a specific tonal range. But because of paganini and such. You have people that pushed violins far beyond their actual purpose. Its a direct tone and has perfect punctuality and presence. Maybe it doesnt have head room, as she is complaining about. But an easy playing violin, that can give itself in softer settings, is much more practical to just about everyone other than concert performers.
I Have a Steiner Violin. It's very clearly and powered sound. It's more difficult to play, but when I'm inspired the sounds look like a heavens's sound.
Sorry to tell you: If you own a Steiner (spelled with an "e") it's not from the famous Jacob Stainer (spelled with an "a") who has been this most influential violin maker in 17th and 18th century violin making across Europe. There were, however, a few violin makers by the name of Steiner (spelled with an "e") in the 18th century, namely Johann Josef and Johannes Anton Steiner.
It kinda reminds me of my violin, a c. 1800 Mittenwald violin possibly by Aegidius Klotz, which makes sense because the founder of the Mittenwald school, Mathias Klotz the first, studied with Steiner!
Thse videos are so educational, I feel most volinists incl me know very little about this wonderful instrument/or its historical background. I think every violin teacher should insist that his students watch all these marvellous videos.
Thank you!! I got into making them for precisely that reason- I didn't realize just how little I knew about my own instrument! The research has been fascinating, and it's great to share it with you all :)
In Stradivaris lifetime Stainer Instruments were praised and more valueable than Strads. Whereas the french idealised Strads, the Englisch favoured to copy Stainers.
Thank you for the videos. I enjoy listening to the various violins you feature, and the history of them. When you comment on how some violins are easier to play than other,s ( I don’t play violin ) is that because you have to put more pressure on the bow to get the instrument vibrating?
I never really thought of it that way, but you may be onto something- on the 1713 strad, for instance, the bow seems to just glide across the strings and have a beautiful tone with barely any effort. I use the same bow for all of these videos to be able to test that effect better!
Hi I have seen many of your videos & really very informative. I have a violin, unable. On my dp you can see it. On the scroll it has a old man head and on back one design lightly seen as if its a symbol of church/wave. Could you guide me about its maker and make. Some are saying its a French violin and some are saying its a Italian man face violin. Do you have any video how to identify old violin. Could you give me your e-mail so that I will send its picture.
Hi Ranjeet, you can contact us through our website, www.atonalhits.com. Although I have to say, it is tough to track these instruments, and I definitely don't claim to be an expert! The best way to identify an instrument is to bring it to a luthier. I study how to play the violin and how to perform, and bring you all my discoveries on this channel, so it's all pretty basic stuff. Luthiers, on the other hand, know the craftsmanship and history intimately, because that is their bread and butter! But I would be happy to have a look and see if I can help! :)
During the 1800s, especially from the1880s on, there were hundreds of thousands of violins made, mostly in Germany, France, and Bohemia, and shipped to the US and elsewhere. Many were decorated, usually cheaply, because they were made on an assembly line (or close to one) and had poor sound. But some had wonderful sound and are very good "players", though that is their only value...none were made by famous makers no matter what the label inside might claim. If you have one of the few that are sweet players count yourself lucky and don't hope for more, because the decorations are almost always a tipoff that your fiddle was made quickly to be sold (then) for $1.00 or $1.25. You are more likely to find a long-lost Rembrandt or da Vinci painting than a real Strad or Stainer on ebay or in a closet.
What an interesting violin. I've heard the name "Jacob Stainer" before but don't think I've ever heard his instruments. Definitely very intimate compared to what has become the modern violin sound and even with the modern fittings and tuning lends itself more to music of it's time. I'd venture to say it's probably a nice instrument for celtic and folk music in general. Absolutely love these instrument videos and am super excited for your upcoming album! As an aside: would you be willing/interested to check out a solo violin piece I wrote some years back? I'm sure the writing is pretty rough (I'm by no means a professional scorer) but I think it's fun and would love a more professional set of eyes on it. No pressure, of course. :)
Spot on about the tone quality! It caught me off guard when I was playing it, and I wish I'd understood the sound earlier, rather than just trying to force it to meet my needs. Oh well, next time! I'd be very happy to take a look! I don't want to write your e mail right here, but google us and there's a contact button on our website. Tell me more about it, and your work with music when you e mail us. Looking forward to it! :)
In a classical guitar the wood chosen for the top make a difference on tone. Cedar is not my first choice for Bach! The maple on the back of that violin looks killer!
I have the only Aluminium violin metallic not the foil glued on wood and is 42 years old a little of work needed a aluminium bridge and sound post needed and be ready for Space Monkey music ha ha .
I love to see your reviews on instruments! It's really nice to see how you get access to all those instruments. Is It because you are in Italy, or you have a sort of agreement with those houses? I ask because I see many remarkable violinist like you have access to test those instruments.
I actually borrow my own instrument from the collection in which these violins are- the Chimei Foundation in Taiwan. They were kind enough to allow me to put these videos up!
Hi! How are you? I just wanted to ask you a question since you are a professional player. Is it still common that violinist have many violins to play?(not like paganini but almost hahaha) if so, do you think is good to play often with two or three different violins? It doesnt affect the tuning? Thanks in advance!
I think most violinists usually have two or more instruments, but they're for more practical reasons than anything. I suppose it depends how much of a big shot you are- Perlman has a small collection, for instance, and different instruments are better for different styles of music. Then you could also have an instrument specifically with a baroque setup, or one you only use for teaching. It is interesting with different instruments though- I use two regularly which I switch off, but I notice some things, like harmonic octaves, are much easier for my hand on my smaller instrument. But intonation is pretty stable, your hand adjusts quite quickly! Half an hr with a new instrument and your hand has adjusted to the size of it, if not the tonal quality and nuances. Hope this sheds some light! :)
@@aTonalHits yes indeed It did! I also asked because I just bought a violin, so now I have two of them and I wouldn't like to get rid of none of them because I appreciate their sound. So now that I read your comment Im fine. Thank you!
What you didn’t account for is that the stained violin sounds completely different with a baroque setup. This one has been modernized and possibly not for the better.
I would not judge Stainer violins from playing one example. After all, I have heard of six Strads going from shop to shop trying to make them playable.
YAHkohb STINEer. From Absam, a village in Tirol, near Innsbruck. He is the only non-Italian rated as the equal of the Greats (the Amatis, Stradivari. Guarnieri del Gesu). Until large concert halls became popular, giving Stradivari's instruments, with their bigger voices, an advantage, Stainer's were in much greater demand and sold for much more money. Hope that helps.
Es evidente que puede tocar el violín, pero desconoce por completo todo lo que se refiere al contexto musical en el que vivió Stainer y el tipo de música para el cual fue diseñado el instrumento.
Thanks for showing this beautiful instrument, but where does the story come from that Mozart had a Stainer? He first played a Mittenwald instrument, later a Dalla Costa. And when can we stop using Hegelian dialectics when talking about music history ('Stradivari and Guadagnini were a step forward in music making')? Why then did so many makers in Florence, Rome, Venice, Genoa, Mittenwald, Markneukirchen, England etc. etc. favour the Stainer model for such a long time over the Cremonese ones, if the latter were apparently such an improvement?
IMHO, ...it might be fairer to judge a violin ‘ωithout’ knowing the luthier who made them {sort of like a type of “blind-test”}. Keep up the nice videos; 🎻🥰‼️
I think it might really be interesting if such an instrument (maybe only the video part where it's played) could be compared to a modern, affordable* instrument with similar tone. In order to show people that also modern, affordable violins can have a similar, of not exactly the same, sound. *Affordable is certainly a flexible term, but I would actually set it between 1000 and 2000 €/ $ - a sum most people would be able to save in a reasonably amount of time. I have the feeling that lots of "violin talk" is only ever about extremes: beginners sounding like squeaking doors, prodigies, cheap, Asian "VSOs", Cremonese Old Master Instruments for millions. It's either torture for the ears or 13year old prodigy or celebrated professional violinist, either Stradivari, Amati, Guarneri, Steiner or worthless old German mass produced violins, either Tchakovsky violin concerto or Twinkle, twinkle. Showing that all they hobby players in between can also make music and play instruments that are not "trash" would be a refreshing approach and motivating to all those hobby players who cannot spend 10,000 $/€ on a violin or even 5000 or cannot learn "the Tchaik" etc.
It has a pretty sound, though somewhat muted and restrained. Good for blending in small ensembles, but perhaps not so good for virtuosic or solo music. Thanks
Just for me to understand: you got a channel about testing different historic violins and just learned after playing it, that Stainer built baroque type violins? I mean, even if you didn't know Stainer, the curvature and general shape just scream "I am a baroque violin". The real issue with those violins is not, that they cannot sound big, but that not all luthiers modernizing them understood how to make them sound big. There are Stainer violins out there perfectly adequate for a Brahms concerto, others are better in a baroque setup. Some are especially great up high on the g string with a lot of power. I must admit, this one does not seem all too impressive, but it is always hard to tell from a video, although I trust in your capabilities as a player to test the instrument and judge it.
Most Stainers have had their necks replaced; only a few are still maintained as Baroque instruments. In some way it seems a pity, even a desecration, to have modernised them.
i love her choice of violin watch moonbase 8 episode 2 rats apisoe 5 mve the base that wWallyii in the christmas tree bike loves iaasac stern hed really adore this girl can she play he does muscle therapy and say he could keep her playing forever i can i mean he would say that it is true
This instrument has a fantastically *sweet sound - it's about the upper registers and overtones, even on the lower strings (if that makes sense). Its airiness needs to let itself be heard and, perhaps, *felt. Certainly with German baroque pieces (for which it was built), its qualities really emerge.
This episode gives me a frowning forehead. Maybe it is advisable to check the history of the Tyrolian (NOT German) luthier Jacob Stainer again and get some facts straight. Check it out: www.jakob-stainer.de/notes-on-jakob-stainers-year-of-birth/ and other pages in this link. His violins are one of the best according to the taste at that time close after the 30 years war. A comparism with later or modern solo instruments is funny.
A lot of his violins had the lion head, you're right! But not all of them, like this one. I never heard about the black wax, but I'll be sure to look more into it!
I take it you certainly don't mean that "baroque chamber settings" are supposed to sound soft and pretty. Forcing these instruments to produce the results they were not intended for (or at least expecting them to hold to other standards) is not very useful, yet it's commonplace. Most performers sensible to stylistic playing cringe when we see these instruments subjected to such abuse!
I think it would be best if Stainers were either « re-baroqued » or be in baroque set up. In that way, they will be of use to players of Early Music. Clearly, it's of no use in a modern ensemble or orchestra. Definitely not for soloist playing on modern music. Just a thought. 🤔🤔🤔
This instrument has a nice sound, but I was spoiled by the 1713 Strad. You appeared to be somewhat frustrated as you played it. Instruments seem to have a personality of their own and some will not fit a particular violinist while another will. Compared with other instruments you have made videos about, this one does not seem to fit you well at all. However; I still enjoyed the video very much. Thank you for sharing it with us.
You got it- I was a little frustrated! A lovely instrument, but not one that suits my temperament. And yes, I'm totally in love with the 1713 Strad! And, probably, completely spoiled :)
........ it's the fiddler who makes the music , not the violin. A musician who downplays a valid musical instrument is simply revealing their own limitations..look at the human voice :--- there's song and music to fit every human voice's characteristics ,even Lee Marvin.
Türkçe İngilizce Turkey Balıkesirt to exact original Stradivarius violin in 1713 sealed the guarantee I talked to sahipiyl Armenians after a team come across and carbon testing done photocopy machines, such as with anything they measured from all sides have taken samples from the adhesive used on time within which play the violin until brass them 2-3 hours to examine 12 people this orjinalt the saying goes, but The owner, whose price is not understood, is descended from the Sultan Abdülmecitten
I hate Stainer type instruments. They sound like shoebox, good only for practicing. Strads type or Guarneri with deep resonance for ever! Of course i am talking about instruments that are made by specification, not real ones, which I have never played and probably never will.
Me encanto tu Video muchas gracias. Yo Tengo en mis manos un Steiner del 1656 y es verdad, Suenan muy nasal y Su sonido no Camina mucho, es una lastima `porque suenan muy bonitos principalmente cuando tocas Barroco, desgraciadamente hoy se me Despego el brazo y tuve que optar por uno chino para r resolviendo, y me doy cuenta que aunque el chino es mas chillón por supuesto, pues el sonido camina 5 veces mas. Es una lastima `porque hasta la forma de los Steiner son muy peculiares. Saludos y Felicidades por tu Canal.
We shall not forget, that this instrument was "modernized", it was originally built as baroque violin, different nech, shorter fingerbord, different neck angle...And by the way, Stainer was an Austrian
Beautiful, sweet, balanced, and intimate voice on that lovely violin. Perfect for the music of Bach, and the Baroque. Thanks
There is a famous German story which involves a Stainer violin. A man awakens in his bed to hear someone playing his violin downstairs. He grabs his revolver and comes down the stairs. The thief is sitting with the violin, playing very beautifully. (I translate.) "Fine violin," the thief said. "Yes, it's a Stainer." The thief said, "I had an Amati. It could laugh, cry, shout and sing. Alas, your violin can only sing."
Such a nice story. We hope that people are seeing it in the comments. Thanks!
A story says it all.:))
Jakob Stainer was an Austrian violin maker, not German!
@@gerhardprasent3358 I didn't say anything about Stainer except that he made the violin. Story was German.
Thanks for the story. It's funny.
Great! Love the sound of the Stainers. Thanks so much...
For over 150 years Jacob Stainer's instruments were admired and collected by both musicians and aristocrat collectors, and were considered the finest in existence even in Florence, Naples, Venice and Rome. No Luthier got near the refinement of workmanship and consistency, not even the Amati dynasty or Stradivari. Up until around the time of Viotti his instruments generally made three to four times that of Stradivari's work and more. Later on, with the larger orchestration demands and soloists such as Viotti, Kreutzer, and Paganini, a more robust temperament was required to fulfil the need for volume and percussive bowing techniques. French Luthiers were converting the necks, bass bars, bridges and soundposts of existing Strads, Guarneri, Amati, Guadagnini violins / Violas and Cello's etc to cater for these demands. Unfortunately Stainer's work has not been evaluated correctly in more recent times. Like most makers, not all of his instruments were constructed the same. Some periods have a less scooped recurve channelling and a slightly more robust build which makes those a little more suitable for more modern playing styles. Gut strings, a more appropriate bridge / fittings, and a more suitable weight of bow opens up the sound with this period of instruments generally. Even Heifetz used three gut strings. Nylon / Perlon strings strangle the speaking voice and volume on violins and violas of this era and do not contribute to more volume. The sound unique to Jacob Stainer was a concise sweet woody flute like tone that bloomed and resonated with a good musician, and could cut through the mix in an ensemble of competing Bass, Tenor, Woodwind / Brass etc. The quality of tone was always highly regarded.
Thank you very much
I hope these videos continue forever! Please play every instrument in the ChiMei collection...I will watch every one.
Aw, thank you! We have plenty more to dig through- and some of them are definitely less than savory, but super interesting. We'll get to all of them! :)
Beautiful tone ... so warm and rich.
Love your history that you place with the violins...yes the tone does not last long. .but then you put into context with Vienna court settings... and l felt you played with more enthusiasm...which brings the thoughts of the relationship that is between violin and violinist...to shape and mold the relationship is Fantastic...
Thanks million for inspiring insights...
And to hear history through strings...wonderful
🤔 AN EDUCATION and A JOY TO LISTEN TO 🤗 😞BUT A SAD ENDING 🤗BUT GLAD YOU SHARED IT AND WE CAN ENJOY TODAY THE LABOR OF SO MANY YEARS AGO😍😍😍
Lovely!! You play beautifully. I have a Stainer copy in a 7/8. It is quite old. It has the high arched belly and a wonderful oiled sheen. It has a wooden handmade case with a book cover and spine as the door on the rosin pocket.
I love these videos!
You're so right about Bach on that beautiful instrument.. it just sounds right.
It does have a beautiful sound.
I loved the extra history bits in this one! Your videos are always interesting but this one was extra much. You know, Hilary is my favorite violinist, but I could watch you all day long. Grins!
Aw, that's the nicest compliment ever! :) (But if you're looking for more violin videos- have you seen Janine Jansen playing the Four Seasons? I'm obsessed with it at the moment- her playing is incredibly interesting!)
@@aTonalHits Just was watching it again last night! My 5 year-old either wants to hear Hilary, the Four Seasons (always Janine) or a Mozart piano concerto as she falls asleep which means I get them every night, too! Today I'm going to show her this video because we get a great shot of your bow hold and tilt. My Sunshine has a beautiful bow hold, but the tilt comes and goes. This video will help tremendously! I subscribed months ago and watch all your stuff. Thank you, Katha!
Aw! Hope this helps her bow grip, my mom used to put a photo of Joshua bell on my stand so I would be inspired by his bow grip 😅 Honored to be helping out others now!
Thanks for this cool exploration.
I found a nice steiner copy here locally that seems really old and has that same sound. I think I'll get it and play older music on it. I actually played it already, and I thought it sounded like crap at first but the more I played it the more I appreciated it
Thank you Katha! I've been studying about the life of Antonio Stradivari from a book writen by Hill. I have read it several times thoroughly. According to Hill, Steiner was better than Sradivari and Amati. I found this hard to swallow. If the example you played is representative of Stainer, I found the sound even and smooth but lacking in power or brilliance. Who knows maybe the bridge or soundpost was off that day. From the build up I read.about Stainer your example left me seriously wanting. You made a great point when you said Stainers were designed for chamber music. As far as I am concerned Stainers were not all that that they were cracked up to be. I will not be seeking out Stainers anytime real soon. Thank you for educating me all about Stainer violins. I think Adolf Hitler may have propagandists the popularity of Stainers and puffed them up. I may be wrong I don't know. I am thankful for your expert assay of the Stainer violin. Of course not every Stainer was the same and humidity as ound post and bridge may have been not ideal when you tested the instrument. However that said you have completly disproved Hills claim that Stainer was a great and sought after violin. I feel educated now and thank you for your help! Most greatful!😅
Beautiful playing from a beautiful woman! Just bought a German violin from 1880, can't wait to play it!
I’m sure it’ll sound great, congrats! :)
Well if you do not like how playable instrument is and hiw nazal it is, pass it to me. I haven't such high demands.
I think it is crying out to be returned to a low-stress, gut-strung baroque setup :)
Any plans to showcase violins from other national traditions? I know that Chi Mei has some great 17th century English or Dutch violins, I think those are interesting as they often fuse Italian or Stainer-like aspects with local violin-making traditions.
Thank you for these videos!
Absolutely! We're working our way through the most famous part of the collection, then branching out a bit, with definite plans to look into bows and modern makers as well. Thanks for tuning in- and I think you're right, this Stainer would probably benefit from a back-to-baroque setup!
Absolutely.
@@aTonalHits If they have a Martin Schleske modern violin it would be interesting to try them out. Please, play more on D and G string.
I own a cd with Steiner instruments only, a cello, vila da gamba and two violins. It’s amazing.
I recently picked up a Stainer copy from 1890's. It's a beautiful violin and I'm glad I'm able to keep playing and hearing its sound!
Of the three examples I can find, I see that his backs are exceedingly thin around the edges, at around 1.4 mm, and the center section are thick, at nearly 5 mm, and highly arched. This highly arching is also found, as is mentioned here, to the belly of the instrument. This video is very interesting as it allows me to hear various instruments and then, if I can find the geometry of that instrument, to attempt to understand what is going on.
Thats a very fine sounding instrument, im shockingly impressed... i see why they are so revered and desirable. The g, which can too often flop or become heavy and hollow. Its actually perfectly tight and balanced throughout the tonal spectrum. Most people today dont realize that a violin should be a specific tonal range. But because of paganini and such. You have people that pushed violins far beyond their actual purpose. Its a direct tone and has perfect punctuality and presence. Maybe it doesnt have head room, as she is complaining about. But an easy playing violin, that can give itself in softer settings, is much more practical to just about everyone other than concert performers.
Exactly.
I Have a Steiner Violin. It's very clearly and powered sound. It's more difficult to play, but when I'm inspired the sounds look like a heavens's sound.
Sorry to tell you: If you own a Steiner (spelled with an "e") it's not from the famous Jacob Stainer (spelled with an "a") who has been this most influential violin maker in 17th and 18th century violin making across Europe. There were, however, a few violin makers by the name of Steiner (spelled with an "e") in the 18th century, namely Johann Josef and Johannes Anton Steiner.
Reputed to be an airy sound. I really like it. So rare though - hard to find good recordings...
Master performance
This is utterly beautiful, the violin, the sound, and the player....What a joy to see and hear.... thank you.
It kinda reminds me of my violin, a c. 1800 Mittenwald violin possibly by Aegidius Klotz, which makes sense because the founder of the Mittenwald school, Mathias Klotz the first, studied with Steiner!
Thse videos are so educational, I feel most volinists incl me know very little about this wonderful instrument/or its historical background.
I think every violin teacher should insist that his students watch all these marvellous videos.
Thank you!! I got into making them for precisely that reason- I didn't realize just how little I knew about my own instrument! The research has been fascinating, and it's great to share it with you all :)
In Stradivaris lifetime Stainer Instruments were praised and more valueable than Strads. Whereas the french idealised Strads, the Englisch favoured to copy Stainers.
Understanding what a instrument can do and what a musician and composition is, will determine the scope of what can be done
Thank you for the videos. I enjoy listening to the various violins you feature, and the history of them. When you comment on how some violins are easier to play than other,s ( I don’t play violin ) is that because you have to put more pressure on the bow to get the instrument vibrating?
I never really thought of it that way, but you may be onto something- on the 1713 strad, for instance, the bow seems to just glide across the strings and have a beautiful tone with barely any effort. I use the same bow for all of these videos to be able to test that effect better!
Hi
I have seen many of your videos & really very informative. I have a violin, unable. On my dp you can see it. On the scroll it has a old man head and on back one design lightly seen as if its a symbol of church/wave. Could you guide me about its maker and make. Some are saying its a French violin and some are saying its a Italian man face violin. Do you have any video how to identify old violin. Could you give me your e-mail so that I will send its picture.
Hi Ranjeet, you can contact us through our website, www.atonalhits.com. Although I have to say, it is tough to track these instruments, and I definitely don't claim to be an expert! The best way to identify an instrument is to bring it to a luthier. I study how to play the violin and how to perform, and bring you all my discoveries on this channel, so it's all pretty basic stuff. Luthiers, on the other hand, know the craftsmanship and history intimately, because that is their bread and butter! But I would be happy to have a look and see if I can help! :)
During the 1800s, especially from the1880s on, there were hundreds of thousands of violins made, mostly in Germany, France, and Bohemia, and shipped to the US and elsewhere.
Many were decorated, usually cheaply, because they were made on an assembly line (or close to one) and had poor sound. But some had wonderful sound and are very good "players", though that is their only value...none were made by famous makers no matter what the label inside might claim. If you have one of the few that are sweet players count yourself lucky and don't hope for more, because the decorations are almost always a tipoff that your fiddle was made quickly to be sold (then) for $1.00 or $1.25. You are more likely to find a long-lost Rembrandt or da Vinci painting than a real Strad or Stainer on ebay or in a closet.
What an interesting violin. I've heard the name "Jacob Stainer" before but don't think I've ever heard his instruments. Definitely very intimate compared to what has become the modern violin sound and even with the modern fittings and tuning lends itself more to music of it's time. I'd venture to say it's probably a nice instrument for celtic and folk music in general. Absolutely love these instrument videos and am super excited for your upcoming album!
As an aside: would you be willing/interested to check out a solo violin piece I wrote some years back? I'm sure the writing is pretty rough (I'm by no means a professional scorer) but I think it's fun and would love a more professional set of eyes on it. No pressure, of course. :)
Spot on about the tone quality! It caught me off guard when I was playing it, and I wish I'd understood the sound earlier, rather than just trying to force it to meet my needs. Oh well, next time!
I'd be very happy to take a look! I don't want to write your e mail right here, but google us and there's a contact button on our website. Tell me more about it, and your work with music when you e mail us. Looking forward to it! :)
@@aTonalHits Thank you! Message sent. :)
OMG, when you first started playing I thought it also had a nasal tone. Funny we had the exact same description. Like a Strad with a head cold
Precisely!!
That's exactly how Milstein described Guarneri del Gesù: like a Strad with a cold :)
These history episodes are tremendous
In a classical guitar the wood chosen for the top make a difference on tone. Cedar is not my first choice for Bach! The maple on the back of that violin looks killer!
Every component you choose and how you done it in your Instrument make a Difference 😉
3:14 or is it a step back ? Because it's way more intimate ands special if you can play this for a few people 😉
I have the only Aluminium violin metallic not the foil glued on wood and is 42 years old a little of work needed a aluminium bridge and sound post needed and be ready for Space Monkey music ha ha .
I love to see your reviews on instruments!
It's really nice to see how you get access to all those instruments. Is It because you are in Italy, or you have a sort of agreement with those houses? I ask because I see many remarkable violinist like you have access to test those instruments.
I actually borrow my own instrument from the collection in which these violins are- the Chimei Foundation in Taiwan. They were kind enough to allow me to put these videos up!
@@aTonalHits Oh, thats really nice. I thought that was in Italy. Really interesting place in Taiwan
Hi! How are you?
I just wanted to ask you a question since you are a professional player.
Is it still common that violinist have many violins to play?(not like paganini but almost hahaha) if so, do you think is good to play often with two or three different violins? It doesnt affect the tuning?
Thanks in advance!
I think most violinists usually have two or more instruments, but they're for more practical reasons than anything. I suppose it depends how much of a big shot you are- Perlman has a small collection, for instance, and different instruments are better for different styles of music. Then you could also have an instrument specifically with a baroque setup, or one you only use for teaching. It is interesting with different instruments though- I use two regularly which I switch off, but I notice some things, like harmonic octaves, are much easier for my hand on my smaller instrument. But intonation is pretty stable, your hand adjusts quite quickly! Half an hr with a new instrument and your hand has adjusted to the size of it, if not the tonal quality and nuances. Hope this sheds some light! :)
@@aTonalHits yes indeed It did! I also asked because I just bought a violin, so now I have two of them and I wouldn't like to get rid of none of them because I appreciate their sound. So now that I read your comment Im fine.
Thank you!
I love it. Can you play the melody that I made?
Melodies
What you didn’t account for is that the stained violin sounds completely different with a baroque setup. This one has been modernized and possibly not for the better.
I was agreeing with the idea that it should be returned to its original set up.
I would not judge Stainer violins from playing one example. After all, I have heard of six Strads going from shop to shop trying to make them playable.
YAHkohb STINEer. From Absam, a village in Tirol, near Innsbruck. He is the only non-Italian rated as the equal of the Greats (the Amatis, Stradivari. Guarnieri del Gesu). Until large concert halls became popular, giving Stradivari's instruments, with their bigger voices, an advantage, Stainer's were in much greater demand and sold for much more money.
Hope that helps.
Don't forget about Matthias Alban, who was equal footing with Stainer.
Confused here. The Steiner German violin is not considered as good as a Austrian made violin from stainer. Do which one are we hearing?
The lionhead shown at 3:30 is not a Stainer. It might be from Saxonia with a fake neckgraft. The only thing they have in common is the tongue.
is it odd that the back is not bookmatched?
Stainer or Steiner???
Es evidente que puede tocar el violín, pero desconoce por completo todo lo que se refiere al contexto musical en el que vivió Stainer y el tipo de música para el cual fue diseñado el instrumento.
Can I ask this price?
Thanks for showing this beautiful instrument, but where does the story come from that Mozart had a Stainer? He first played a Mittenwald instrument, later a Dalla Costa.
And when can we stop using Hegelian dialectics when talking about music history ('Stradivari and Guadagnini were a step forward in music making')? Why then did so many makers in Florence, Rome, Venice, Genoa, Mittenwald, Markneukirchen, England etc. etc. favour the Stainer model for such a long time over the Cremonese ones, if the latter were apparently such an improvement?
I have one tagt is from the 1707
IMHO, ...it might be fairer to judge a violin ‘ωithout’ knowing the luthier who made them {sort of like a type of “blind-test”}. Keep up the nice videos; 🎻🥰‼️
I think it might really be interesting if such an instrument (maybe only the video part where it's played) could be compared to a modern, affordable* instrument with similar tone. In order to show people that also modern, affordable violins can have a similar, of not exactly the same, sound.
*Affordable is certainly a flexible term, but I would actually set it between 1000 and 2000 €/ $ - a sum most people would be able to save in a reasonably amount of time.
I have the feeling that lots of "violin talk" is only ever about extremes: beginners sounding like squeaking doors, prodigies, cheap, Asian "VSOs", Cremonese Old Master Instruments for millions. It's either torture for the ears or 13year old prodigy or celebrated professional violinist, either Stradivari, Amati, Guarneri, Steiner or worthless old German mass produced violins, either Tchakovsky violin concerto or Twinkle, twinkle.
Showing that all they hobby players in between can also make music and play instruments that are not "trash" would be a refreshing approach and motivating to all those hobby players who cannot spend 10,000 $/€ on a violin or even 5000 or cannot learn "the Tchaik" etc.
Ich habe alte violine Jacobus Stainer in Absam 1744 Jahre.
Ver hat interese Bitte melden
It has a pretty sound, though somewhat muted and restrained. Good for blending in small ensembles, but perhaps not so good for virtuosic or solo music. Thanks
My thoughts exactly!
Yes, my Jacob Stainer is also nasal.... and belly/arching is very exaggerated.... I would call it a pregnant Strad. lol
Come on, man...😄
And why is it hard to play on it?
I knew a guy that bought a strainer for five thousand when I was 15. Now they cost a lot more than that.
Just for me to understand: you got a channel about testing different historic violins and just learned after playing it, that Stainer built baroque type violins? I mean, even if you didn't know Stainer, the curvature and general shape just scream "I am a baroque violin". The real issue with those violins is not, that they cannot sound big, but that not all luthiers modernizing them understood how to make them sound big. There are Stainer violins out there perfectly adequate for a Brahms concerto, others are better in a baroque setup. Some are especially great up high on the g string with a lot of power. I must admit, this one does not seem all too impressive, but it is always hard to tell from a video, although I trust in your capabilities as a player to test the instrument and judge it.
Most Stainers have had their necks replaced; only a few are still maintained as Baroque instruments. In some way it seems a pity, even a desecration, to have modernised them.
i love her choice of violin watch moonbase 8 episode 2 rats apisoe 5 mve the base that wWallyii in the christmas tree bike loves iaasac stern hed really adore this girl can she play he does muscle therapy and say he could keep her playing forever i can i mean he would say that it is true
1656年製にしてはきれいやな。あなたもきれい。
you can not try or play or judge each different with the same bow you have to try all different boys and if you do then the violin may surprise you
Who are Today's Master Violin Makers?
Kind of sad that you didn't discover the instrument's qualities on your own, you had to research them.
It’s pronounced Shtainer.
This instrument has a fantastically *sweet sound - it's about the upper registers and overtones, even on the lower strings (if that makes sense). Its airiness needs to let itself be heard and, perhaps, *felt. Certainly with German baroque pieces (for which it was built), its qualities really emerge.
This episode gives me a frowning forehead. Maybe it is advisable to check the history of the Tyrolian (NOT German) luthier Jacob Stainer again and get some facts straight. Check it out: www.jakob-stainer.de/notes-on-jakob-stainers-year-of-birth/ and other pages in this link.
His violins are one of the best according to the taste at that time close after the 30 years war. A comparism with later or modern solo instruments is funny.
Stainer's violins should have a head like a little lion, and all his violins covered with black wask.
A lot of his violins had the lion head, you're right! But not all of them, like this one. I never heard about the black wax, but I'll be sure to look more into it!
@@aTonalHits correction not the wax but black colour. Wrong word I have used. I've heared that only 16 violins left after him.
Only the fakes.
I take it you certainly don't mean that "baroque chamber settings" are supposed to sound soft and pretty. Forcing these instruments to produce the results they were not intended for (or at least expecting them to hold to other standards) is not very useful, yet it's commonplace. Most performers sensible to stylistic playing cringe when we see these instruments subjected to such abuse!
Not only it is of chamber music volume, but it seems to me of lower level of harmonics.
I think it would be best if Stainers were either « re-baroqued » or be in baroque set up. In that way, they will be of use to players of Early Music. Clearly, it's of no use in a modern ensemble or orchestra. Definitely not for soloist playing on modern music. Just a thought. 🤔🤔🤔
This instrument has a nice sound, but I was spoiled by the 1713 Strad. You appeared to be somewhat frustrated as you played it. Instruments seem to have a personality of their own and some will not fit a particular violinist while another will. Compared with other instruments you have made videos about, this one does not seem to fit you well at all. However; I still enjoyed the video very much. Thank you for sharing it with us.
You got it- I was a little frustrated! A lovely instrument, but not one that suits my temperament. And yes, I'm totally in love with the 1713 Strad! And, probably, completely spoiled :)
........ it's the fiddler who makes the music , not the violin. A musician who downplays a valid musical instrument is simply revealing their own limitations..look at the human voice :--- there's song and music to fit every human voice's characteristics ,even Lee Marvin.
Only true to a point. Some instruments are clearly superior
Türkçe
İngilizce
Turkey Balıkesirt to exact original Stradivarius violin in 1713 sealed the guarantee I talked to sahipiyl Armenians after a team come across and carbon testing done photocopy machines, such as with anything they measured from all sides have taken samples from the adhesive used on time within which play the violin until brass them 2-3 hours to examine 12 people this orjinalt the saying goes, but The owner, whose price is not understood, is descended from the Sultan Abdülmecitten
SHTY-ner, not STAIN-er 🤦🏼♀️
You must have them adjusted your playing habits before you grab any violin and just play an unknown setup against your expections and skill level.
His name is pronounced "Sh-tiner", like miner ... with an Sh + T at the beginning.
Сомнительный экземпляр. Сильно🧐
If she would stop talking over it...
Please.... don't americanize the pronunciation of his name too much!
Am1 din1737
Come to see me.. I am violin in love...I have,,/Rafael & Antonio gagliano.../ Hannibal fagnola./..ansaldo poggi/ Antonio guadagnini /..Antonio Rocca /
I hate Stainer type instruments. They sound like shoebox, good only for practicing. Strads type or Guarneri with deep resonance for ever! Of course i am talking about instruments that are made by specification, not real ones, which I have never played and probably never will.
Austrian violin, not exactly German.
Me encanto tu Video muchas gracias. Yo Tengo en mis manos un Steiner del 1656 y es verdad, Suenan muy nasal y Su sonido no Camina mucho, es una lastima `porque suenan muy bonitos principalmente cuando tocas Barroco, desgraciadamente hoy se me Despego el brazo y tuve que optar por uno chino para r resolviendo, y me doy cuenta que aunque el chino es mas chillón por supuesto, pues el sonido camina 5 veces mas. Es una lastima `porque hasta la forma de los Steiner son muy peculiares. Saludos y Felicidades por tu Canal.
We shall not forget, that this instrument was "modernized", it was originally built as baroque violin, different nech, shorter fingerbord, different neck angle...And by the way, Stainer was an Austrian