This is a crazy amount of things done in 8 months. Also, blown away by the X16 running Second Reality that smoothly on the 65C02S. Big fan of the Demoscene myself, since the early 90s.
I used to work at HP manufacturing PCBs, and it was interesting to see the process in action again! The boards start at the Dek machine, where lead solder is applied. Next, they move on to the HSP (High Speed Placement) machines, followed by the Universal Placement (UP) machines, where the ICs and processors are added. After that, they go through the oven, are washed, and then inspected. I enjoyed the "pick n place" phrasing. :D
Holy cow! As an X16 user myself, I am blown away by what the team has done with the machine. I can't wait to upgrade my X16 to the most recent ROM version and have a go with the network card. I also have a game for the X16 in the works, which, once I'm a little more skilled at coding, I'd be more than happy to get it on the X16 platform.
Same but I'll probably get the midi card for mine when I get it set up, my system is still in the box it shipped in because I don't have the space to mess with it right now and I'm missing the US adapter for the universal wall adapter I bought with my pre-order last year, I'll have to check if the adapter is hiding under the box flaps but if it isn't maybe someone can send it or I'll just get a low wattage PC supply that's my plan for it anyway is to put it in a small PC case.
Your videos have inspired me to install the Vice emulator, print out the old Vic 20 Programmer's Reference Guide, and pretend I'm 11 years old again. My original Vic was sold at a church yard sale. It had a monochrome brass badge, used the original 2-prong power supply, but didn't have the PET-style keys. Our games library was limited and to be honest most came from the old Compute! magazine, so my brother and I entertained ourselves writing programs in BASIC. So I've been doing that in the emulator; not playing other peoples' games. I've wondered about whether I'd want a second gen X16, but to be honest I don't think I'm quite the target market. The learning curve for programming graphics and sound looks like it would take more time and effort than I could justify. I browsed the memory map on github for VERA board and it's considerably different from the old VIC and VICII chips. Still, obviously there was considerable interest for your X16 developer boards and I wish you great success with the X16 project.
Those Midi files sound amazing!!! David, this stuff is one of the many reasons why you don't need to worry about content. I'd watch even a video of you retrobriting a product over most anyone else's content.
That sounds awesome! Loved the Jump sound for sure. Takes me back. I’d love more details on the sound capabilities. I’ll see what you have out there on it.
There's also Futuremark (later acquired & dissolved by UL [Underwriters Laboratories] to become UL Benchmarks), which was founded by former members of Future Crew. Skaven, a former member of Future Crew, did the music for Unreal Tournament, and Raptisoft's Hamster Ball
I remember the first video where you said "I have a dream". You actually succeded to make it a reality, now there is a growing X16 ecosystem and more than a thousand units out there. Big props for all the hard work I know it takes.
It was nice meeting you and your wife at the VCFMW! I appreciated that she knows ASL! As for the current video content, the BBS and “modems” sections impressed me the most! I am happy with an audio cassette bag after a trade with a board. Two Thumbs up!
I'm really intrigued by the Commander X16. It's a computer I've been wanting to explore for a while now and I think it could offer a unique experience, especially for those of us who enjoy retro computing.
There are many ways to enjoy genuine retro computing. Unfortunately, not only is the Commander X16 one of the more expensive ones, it isn't really a retro computer. Its not based on any existing or planned historical machine. It's a weird fantasy mash up, sitting in the "8 bit CPU" camp, but with "unique" fantasy graphics capabilities, more similar to those found in the next generation 16 bit machines such as the Amiga. But again, not based on any actual retro graphics hardware. It uses a modified "Commodore C64 BASIC", but it isn't actually one of the CBM versions from the later CBM Plus 4 or C128 machines. It's a fantasy version. Despite David's initial plans, it uses a modern FPGA for the graphics, but relies on a no longer produced or supported, and hard to find, audio chip... which logically should have been implemented in the FPGA too. But then the whole X16 could be done in an FPGA, and it would be cheaper and easier to produce. You could buy a MiSTer and experience any number of real retro machines, or buy an Agon 2 Light or any number of cheaper, modern 8 bits. Or just emulate something from the past, and you would benefit from all the existing software, literature and knowledge that exists for them.
@@another3997 Hi! Personally, I believe the best way to play 80s video games is on my Commodore 64. Sure, technology has left it far behind, but the software designed for this computer, with so few KB, is incredible. I haven't found any other retro computers that can offer as much. I'm still fascinated by the Commander X16, which I think of as a tribute to everything it represents. I’ve never personally tried the Commander X16, and I don’t think I’ll get the chance for quite a while (or maybe never), but, just because I’m a curious person, and also because it's the computer of Mr. The 8-bit Guy, I'm pretty sure it’s a fun computer to try out and play with
@@another3997 Yep. Only a fool designs a modern retro style computer around retro components. It's just contributing to parts shortages meaning real vintage computers and arcade machines will eventually not be able to be repaired with original parts and will have to use an FPGA replacement part.
I think the radio card could be cool to see produced. I think it could probably be used as a sort of noise generator by connecting to an AM station (probably more likely to just be random noise) and playing that
Kind of off-topic but that reminds me of back in the day when I had a WinTV card in my Windows 98 machine. I had the RF out from a Dish Network receiver hooked to it. It was so awesome to be able to watch TV on my PC. Either fullscreen or in a window in the corner while I did other stuff.
Great stuff! I think that software developers will really want something like an FTP service to be integrated into the terminal program so that programs developed on a PC can be quickly downloaded to the X16, and of course in the other direction too. The BBS demo was really impressive: so much so that it seems to me that it might be able to be stretched into a web browser!
8 bit computers did evolve... but they became the Atari ST, CBM Amiga, Sharp X68000, Apple Mac, the 16 bit IBM compatibles etc. The X16 is a weird fantasy computer that uses a moden version of the 8 bit 6502 CPU, but then uses a powerful FPGA to produce graphics capabilities more similar to those of the later 16 bit machines. It uses a modified CBM BASIC, but it's not the BASIC from the C16/Plus 4, the C128 or even the Amiga. The sound chip used is obsolete and no longer produced. The X16 isn't based on any real machine, it has no nostalgic value of it's own, no historic software library, no big collections of books, magazines and literature to explore. And it costs a fortune. Several FPGA machines can instantly become a wide range of "real" 8 bit machines, and still costs far less.
having found the concept video when it was released, and watching each of these releases I'm extremely impressed with the progress and momentum of the progress and following. im a licensed GMRS operator and seeing that radio card was super exciting, expanding the band for a true SDR card could be a really exciting project. not that I know anything about designing an SDR ive only bought them lol. thank you guys for all the hard work.
I used to operate one of these pick and place machines at Hitachi back in 2006. AH! SoundBlaster audio cards! I had such a great experience with those!
This is so cool. I used to work for a company building circuit board. I was part of a crew that would put all the thru-hole parts on boards before they went through the solder wave. Getting to watch the pick and place machines work was amazing. It's so great to see the progress y'all are making on the X-16.
@@MatthewCenance It will apply 5V to the connected MIDI input in the wrong direction. Depending on the type of optocoupler in the MIDI-receiving device, it may work anyway, not work, or get damaged. To be safe, use each device with the adapter it came with. If you connect two TRS MIDI ports together, use both adapters and not a simple TRS cable.
Im a long time watcher of this chanel, thought admittedly i watch very sparsely in recent years. This X16 project is really incredibly impressive. When you said you uad written 5 games and other software tools for it by your self i was like, wow where does he find the time. Congratulations on getting this far. Really.
The idea of an SSH client came up in relation to another new/vintage computer. The problem is the amount of time it takes to do the math related to the encryption/decryption.
This looks like a really nice kit, to the point that I'm considering one and I didn't even grew up with this kind of PCs, it just looks well made and made with love.
Nice to see all the cool new items for the X16. For the serial/network card you should switch the positions of the antenna and the serial port connector. If a serial cable is plugged in with the current design it will get in the way of the antenna. The Pac Man game looks amazing. The pellets moving around is fine while in demo mode. When in the middle of game play (either simulated or during the demo screen) the pellets should stop moving, or move slower, or move less distance.
@@kevincozens6837 I don't have the ability to make brackets, I can only buy them at the moment. This is what I could find that would fit all of the conditions I need to cover. My point is that there was a signifcant amount of thought put into it.
You are a treasure to the community, David. -- I think you've covered it in the past, but some of the reason that later 8-bit computers failed, and the Commodore 64 was such a success was all the software that was written for it. -- Seeing so many dedicated people working on software projects for the Commander X16 is really exciting and has me feeling like it's more than just a passing curiosity. -- Like, this thing really has legs! and I may need to snag one in the next batch...
Sub counts for older channels like this are kind of pointless in a way. How many of those 1.44M subs are dead accounts or people who subscribed 15+ years ago and have forgotten this channel? The Angry Video Game Nerd has 3.84M subs, think how many of those are people who subscribed in the late 2000s when they were like 12 years old and have either made a new account since then or long since moved on from watching AVGN and don't even realize they are subscribed. I'd say it would be fair that when an account hasn't interacted with a channel in 2-3 years it could be auto unsubscribed. It would make the sub numbers more realistic and accurate.
This is an excellent update! I am always amazed a how much work has been done on the Commander X16 platform. The level of work that continues to be done both on the hardware and software sides is wonderful! We also have to keep in mind this work is primarily being done by people in their spare time, there's no multi-million dollar corporation behind all of this.
The Spectrum version of Manic Miner stored all 20 screens as ASCII text in memory in the top 32K. In May 1984, age 16, with a broken collarbone and using only my left hand, I designed 20 new screens that were even harder! I sent them off to Alan Maton of Software Projects with a view to a proper screen editor being made. But he wasn't interested...
@@jinxterx Judo. We were practising being thrown (ippon seonagi). One of my mate's was supposed to *almost* throw me, with another mate holding on tight behind my back. Except he didn't, as he wasn't concentrating. So over I went with the lad throwing me landing heavily on my right side, shattering my collar bone. I couldn't believe the hospital just put a piece of cloth (sling) over my shoulder. It should've been pinned with titanium like motorbike racers get done. It was agony, and took a month to heal - while I should've been preparing for my O levels!
I'm too young to have experienced the 8-bit era and BBS's, but I still find all the work you've been doing so fun and exciting to follow. Keep up the good work, David!
The Internet on the Commander X16, an 8-bit computer, is actually amazing. I'm looking forward to see this thing explode! I've got the virtual emulator, which is currently enough for me, but I might purchase a physical machine in the future.
Those BBS screens remind me so much of the Teletext service we had in the 90s in the UK. Local news, weather, sport results and lottery over analogue TV signals on CRTs.
The same here with "Videotext" in Germany, looked exactly the same. Was a bit slow to refresh and of course "oneway" (you could only select different Textpages), but was a nice addition to radio and didn't cost anything if you had a TV Set capable of receiving this. Later with "Bildschirmtext" some BBS-like means of communication was possible, with costs for the data transfer via Modem of course.
Among many other things, I suspect you're going to begin seeing the CX16 in a **lot** of music studies (i.e. "home studios", etc.), especially in the homes of producers who want to experiment with an idea before going to the trouble of actually going in to the professional studio, etc. I remember reading...I **think** it was Madonna but I could be completely wrong in that...a very well known musical artist who used an Atari 030 as their MIDI music producer into the 00s (if not still using it).
Great to see this wonderful lovely 8bit computer project rising. With the limitations it has it is a great today manufactured platform for games and software every 40 years and up person loved back in the days. Keep on the good work and greetings from germany.
it feels nostalgic ive last seen it during late 2022 (atleast iirc) and to see youre still working on it it brings a smile to my face thank you 8 bit guy
Well done ! I really enjoyed this comprehensive update. Each year I am closer to getting one of these systems. The graphics, sounds, etc etc ... Are impressive. Thanks again 👍 Much respect for all your work.
@@Okurka.well, he also ran out of content. There are only so many variations of old consumer Casio and Yamaha keyboards to cover, and most share many similarities. There just isn’t much else to say about them that is within his wheelhouse.
Shazam picked up the sleigh bell song :D And also, surprisingly, your rendition of Jump! Apparently you played that so well that Shazam thought I was listening to the song :D
Amazing stuff. I love the UFO game (with hints of 'Choplifter'), just one thing though, I thought the whole point of UFOs was that they are not constrained by traditional physics and can stop and turn instantaneously. It would be cool if you could incorporate this kind of motion into the game (I know you like a challenge).
Yeah this is really awesome and I don’t want to diminish what’s being achieved here at all. But saying, “… it really demonstrates what a 6502 can do” it seems like the fact that it seems like almost all of the IO interacts have coprocessors taking care of the work. Back in the day the 6502 had to bitbang much more, or otherwise interact with lower performance (vs now) co-processors / peripherals.
Yes, but that's because the 8 bit Guy decided on the X16 having no FPGAs, no hard to source, obsolete parts and being cheap enough that almost anybody can afford to buy one... oh wait, just ignore that particular video. 😂
Actually my USR Courier Dual Standard modem had more processing power than my Commodore 64 in the early 1990s. 🤣 P.S. I still have the modem. Sadly, my C64 was lost years ago.
@@another3997sometimes dreams can’t match up with reality - in the end he’s still making his fun, ideal hobby computer, which was the end goal. I have no doubts it will Become affordable! Just not this early in development. Pivoting to a surfacemount construction would go a long way in making it cheaper
Really amazing project! It's not just the passion, but the intense effort to get this thing through all of the product and development stages and out the door.
Yes, in fact I just released a version called "oldrobots" for the X16 that allows you to play the PET and C64 versions (well, at least it looks like the PET or C64 version)
Dang, been following this project from the beginning and keep being in awe of the capabilities. The open, compatibility and performance based set out is really starting to show! Very cool!
Great update. Awesome stuff, David! Brings back great memories of the BBS days and how cutting edge that was at the time. And the demo at the end - man, absolutely brilliant. It's hard for someone today to know the feeling back then when we saw those mind blowing, seemingly impossible demos.
As soon as I saw the little UFOs I knew it was Second Reality. I literally fell out of my chair. So very very cool and worth the wait for these updates. Congrats on all the incredible stuff around Commander x16!
Indeed. Something that could be added to and extended while keeping backward compatibility to, so as to come up with a specification for a hypothetical Commander X24 or X32...
CX16 do sometimes feel like something from an alternate timeline where 8-bit computers stayed a little too long and started evolving to do what the 16-bit computers could.
looks a bit like if commodore made their own IIGS, interesting to think about what things would've been like if apple and commodore never abandoned the 6502
At around 9:00 I borrowed a modem from someone for my C128 at 300 baud and I could read the text faster than the modem received it! 1200 baud came several years later on my PC. Thanks for the video!
Absolutely astonishing. If I hadn't followed its development, I'd never have believed that this sort of project was in any way feasible in the 21st century. Anxiously awaiting the 2nd-generation hardware. Hoping to use your dream computer for my dream software project. It's something I've wanted to do for about 35 years, but life got in the way and computers got way too complicated. My original target was the Apple IIgs, but the Commander X16 (with 65816 CPU) is a much more attractive platform.
Congratulations 8bit guy !!! The screen resolution is excelent .. You were able to modernize the Comodore stuff in a very nice way... In Angola we were more Z80 driven with spectrum, newbrain and casio but I admit that the 6502 had far more software in the game part ... In the business part I think that the Z80 was better, though ... The 80cls/40lines was far more driven to that ... I developed as well what is called today as ERP-CRM in Cobol back then for CP/M and Z80 machines.
Awww... the BBS age... I ran two C64 BBS's back in the early 80's in Toronto, Iron Cobra BBS and Arctic Software Sorce (ASS) BBS.... fun times... So long ago I forget everything about setting them up and operating.
Somewhere around 2008 I tinkered with making a clone of the Atari 2600 game Cosmic Ark in Flash, where you piloted a disc-shaped UFO and abducted humans via a tractor beam that came out of the bottom - and in my clone you could also turn off the beam to drop the humans and have them explode in a silly bloody mess when they hit the ground. I never finished it but often think of revisiting the idea in a modern game engine. It's hilarious to see someone else working on the same idea 15 years later.
The idea of bringing media together outside the Internet is interesting. AM/FM/SW radio + midi + sound synth + other into the computer as a hub. Yeah that is unique. Would be great if you could route different types of audio at the command line. ROUTE SP(eaker)=MP+WT+AM1070 (midiplayback+wavetables) . Something built on that would be yeah... hey that might be a thing!
Just noticed that Crazy Frog uses the Marble Zone song from the first Sonic game, and that the Pac Man demo resembles Pac Man Arrangement, which is a really fun version of the game released in 1996 with a bunch of new levels and mechanics.
It's amazing the work you have done so far. I'm not sure I would want one but the fact that this is what it looks like is pretty awesome. The use of the ESP32 in a lot of applications, not just your project but the fact that I have at least two ESP32 modules in use on my GameCube, one in a memory card emulator and the other in the BlueRetro controller board. Soon another one inside the GameCube as part of the Flippy Drive drive emulator shows what people can really do to keep some of these fairly historic machines alive.
Isn't there any danger of the wave soldering operation causing the SMT parts to become unsoldered and shift position? Seems like they would go through a second heat cycle, which might not be good for the soldered joints, not to mention a second heat shock to the parts.
No. The placement and soldering proccess is not my field of expertise, but If I'm not mistaken the PCCB will be heated just enough not to melt the solder. And the wave machine (and the reflow for the matter) has gradual heating and cooling as the PCB moves along. (With different possible thermal curves depending on the thermal mass of the PCB.)
No real danger of that. The molten solder that is in contact moves from one side of the board to the other. It isn't in one spot long enough for there to be enough heat transfer to the top of the board to remelt the solder. Even if the top-side SMT parts had their solder melted there is no sudden starting or stopping that would make the parts shift.
I was suprised how much "manual" work is necessary to produce the boards - it's super interesting! I wish you would go back to making videos every other week. Those were the best times.
Oh I remember when you used to make cool videos on retro computer tech stuff... Prior to you becoming another small product sales / ad channel. Those where good times!
@@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer I do too, even if I never see, or use the machine in person.... Stuff like this is so much cooler than most everything "new". Great to see someone try their best with current knowledge, and processes with old technologies....
Seriously yesterday I was watching your last Commander 16 update and I was like man what is this guy going to upload I didn't know I was going to be this early
that midi card sounds great! definitely an awesome mix of new and old technology. can't wait to see the stuff people make with this hardware. gotta get one of these when i have the money.
for a cost reduced variant, like a really low end model, i think making one big FPGA with everything in it would be the cheapest option. you could also remove expantion ports and only have VGA out. a mid range model could have 1/2 expantion ports with all video outs but retain the single FPGA design. and of course it being built in a keyboard like a C64 would be super cool.
This is a crazy amount of things done in 8 months. Also, blown away by the X16 running Second Reality that smoothly on the 65C02S. Big fan of the Demoscene myself, since the early 90s.
@@PhazerSC what got you into this stuff in generally interested
I used to work at HP manufacturing PCBs, and it was interesting to see the process in action again! The boards start at the Dek machine, where lead solder is applied. Next, they move on to the HSP (High Speed Placement) machines, followed by the Universal Placement (UP) machines, where the ICs and processors are added. After that, they go through the oven, are washed, and then inspected. I enjoyed the "pick n place" phrasing. :D
Holy cow! As an X16 user myself, I am blown away by what the team has done with the machine. I can't wait to upgrade my X16 to the most recent ROM version and have a go with the network card.
I also have a game for the X16 in the works, which, once I'm a little more skilled at coding, I'd be more than happy to get it on the X16 platform.
Same but I'll probably get the midi card for mine when I get it set up, my system is still in the box it shipped in because I don't have the space to mess with it right now and I'm missing the US adapter for the universal wall adapter I bought with my pre-order last year, I'll have to check if the adapter is hiding under the box flaps but if it isn't maybe someone can send it or I'll just get a low wattage PC supply that's my plan for it anyway is to put it in a small PC case.
Your videos have inspired me to install the Vice emulator, print out the old Vic 20 Programmer's Reference Guide, and pretend I'm 11 years old again. My original Vic was sold at a church yard sale. It had a monochrome brass badge, used the original 2-prong power supply, but didn't have the PET-style keys. Our games library was limited and to be honest most came from the old Compute! magazine, so my brother and I entertained ourselves writing programs in BASIC. So I've been doing that in the emulator; not playing other peoples' games. I've wondered about whether I'd want a second gen X16, but to be honest I don't think I'm quite the target market. The learning curve for programming graphics and sound looks like it would take more time and effort than I could justify. I browsed the memory map on github for VERA board and it's considerably different from the old VIC and VICII chips. Still, obviously there was considerable interest for your X16 developer boards and I wish you great success with the X16 project.
Those Midi files sound amazing!!! David, this stuff is one of the many reasons why you don't need to worry about content. I'd watch even a video of you retrobriting a product over most anyone else's content.
I love how the beginning feels like watching an episode of "How it's made" but with your twist on it.
I'd call it "How Bit's Made"!
Back in the day, we had 120 X 80 at 5 FPS, and we liked it.
-Grumpy Old Man
Really? Lucky. An array of colored light bulbs as register outputs was my favorite. -Grumpy, probably younger Old Man. :)
Lol. Quite a lot of Atari 2600 games ran at a full 60 fps.
@@jrherita 60 Frames per second, or 60 Fields per second?
1200 baud was good enough in 1985 and doggone it, it's good enough today!
- Another Grumpy Old Man
Because as we all know PCB stands for Popcorn Commander Bucket
😂😂😂
Doesn’t know.
How did you get this comment this early? The video released 7 minutes ago, not five hours ago. Fail.
Well actually it stands for Producing Commander Board's...
Doesn't it?
@@MatthewCenance he's a patreon supporter
and patreon supporter get to watch early
I LOVE the first part of the video with the Vera board manufacturing process. It was done with the quality of How It's Made. Awesome!
The 8 bit guy has 1.44m subs as of now. Size of a 3.5 in floppy.
Will he make that next big leap to becoming a Super Floppy a.k.a. SuperDisk? 😁
@@EgoShredder Maybe and hopefully.👍
That sounds awesome! Loved the Jump sound for sure. Takes me back. I’d love more details on the sound capabilities. I’ll see what you have out there on it.
The 8-Bit Guy throws in a random Van Halen riff. As the biggest VH fan in the world you made my day.
Makes you wonder why they called the wave table card the "Little Dreamer"
Are you Billy Sheehan?
I am just sad the @8BitKeys channel died
JUMP... The same as the plate on my car JUMP
The first sound reminded me of Everdream by Nightwish, if anyone knows the song tell me if I am crazy
For those wondering, Future Crew went on to become Remedy Enertainment!
Thanks I wonder where they went....
Thank you
There's also Futuremark (later acquired & dissolved by UL [Underwriters Laboratories] to become UL Benchmarks), which was founded by former members of Future Crew.
Skaven, a former member of Future Crew, did the music for Unreal Tournament, and Raptisoft's Hamster Ball
Did not expect to get a demoscene reunion out of this video. Cool. :-)
Digital Illusions became DICE
I remember the first video where you said "I have a dream". You actually succeded to make it a reality, now there is a growing X16 ecosystem and more than a thousand units out there. Big props for all the hard work I know it takes.
It was nice meeting you and your wife at the VCFMW! I appreciated that she knows ASL! As for the current video content, the BBS and “modems” sections impressed me the most! I am happy with an audio cassette bag after a trade with a board. Two Thumbs up!
Love the chuckle when showing that you can drop people and cows to their doom from the UFO...
"Oh George, not the livestock!"
I'm really intrigued by the Commander X16. It's a computer I've been wanting to explore for a while now and I think it could offer a unique experience, especially for those of us who enjoy retro computing.
There are many ways to enjoy genuine retro computing. Unfortunately, not only is the Commander X16 one of the more expensive ones, it isn't really a retro computer. Its not based on any existing or planned historical machine. It's a weird fantasy mash up, sitting in the "8 bit CPU" camp, but with "unique" fantasy graphics capabilities, more similar to those found in the next generation 16 bit machines such as the Amiga. But again, not based on any actual retro graphics hardware. It uses a modified "Commodore C64 BASIC", but it isn't actually one of the CBM versions from the later CBM Plus 4 or C128 machines. It's a fantasy version. Despite David's initial plans, it uses a modern FPGA for the graphics, but relies on a no longer produced or supported, and hard to find, audio chip... which logically should have been implemented in the FPGA too. But then the whole X16 could be done in an FPGA, and it would be cheaper and easier to produce. You could buy a MiSTer and experience any number of real retro machines, or buy an Agon 2 Light or any number of cheaper, modern 8 bits. Or just emulate something from the past, and you would benefit from all the existing software, literature and knowledge that exists for them.
@@another3997 Hi! Personally, I believe the best way to play 80s video games is on my Commodore 64. Sure, technology has left it far behind, but the software designed for this computer, with so few KB, is incredible. I haven't found any other retro computers that can offer as much. I'm still fascinated by the Commander X16, which I think of as a tribute to everything it represents. I’ve never personally tried the Commander X16, and I don’t think I’ll get the chance for quite a while (or maybe never), but, just because I’m a curious person, and also because it's the computer of Mr. The 8-bit Guy, I'm pretty sure it’s a fun computer to try out and play with
@@another3997 Yep. Only a fool designs a modern retro style computer around retro components. It's just contributing to parts shortages meaning real vintage computers and arcade machines will eventually not be able to be repaired with original parts and will have to use an FPGA replacement part.
I think the radio card could be cool to see produced. I think it could probably be used as a sort of noise generator by connecting to an AM station (probably more likely to just be random noise) and playing that
Maybe add a LoRa capability for city-wide independent networking.
@@christorkildson6472 i would buy it
Use it for a RNG.
@@ericpaul4575 Maybe a full software defined radio
Kind of off-topic but that reminds me of back in the day when I had a WinTV card in my Windows 98 machine. I had the RF out from a Dish Network receiver hooked to it. It was so awesome to be able to watch TV on my PC. Either fullscreen or in a window in the corner while I did other stuff.
Great stuff! I think that software developers will really want something like an FTP service to be integrated into the terminal program so that programs developed on a PC can be quickly downloaded to the X16, and of course in the other direction too. The BBS demo was really impressive: so much so that it seems to me that it might be able to be stretched into a web browser!
A JavaScript engine running on a 6502 is a nightmarish concept
the point of it is to recreate tech from the 80s. While FTP fits, an entire web browser wouldn't. What would be really fitting is a gopher server!
Great update. Can't wait for Rev2 of the X16 to get my hands on the hardware ...
8-Bit Computers never die, they just evolve 🙂Congrats on the project.
No, it’s 8-bit. It’s a 6502 system.
8 bit computers did evolve... but they became the Atari ST, CBM Amiga, Sharp X68000, Apple Mac, the 16 bit IBM compatibles etc. The X16 is a weird fantasy computer that uses a moden version of the 8 bit 6502 CPU, but then uses a powerful FPGA to produce graphics capabilities more similar to those of the later 16 bit machines. It uses a modified CBM BASIC, but it's not the BASIC from the C16/Plus 4, the C128 or even the Amiga. The sound chip used is obsolete and no longer produced. The X16 isn't based on any real machine, it has no nostalgic value of it's own, no historic software library, no big collections of books, magazines and literature to explore. And it costs a fortune. Several FPGA machines can instantly become a wide range of "real" 8 bit machines, and still costs far less.
@@another3997 Modern x86-64 machines can still run MS-DOS on bare metal. “Evolved” is an understatement!
having found the concept video when it was released, and watching each of these releases I'm extremely impressed with the progress and momentum of the progress and following. im a licensed GMRS operator and seeing that radio card was super exciting, expanding the band for a true SDR card could be a really exciting project. not that I know anything about designing an SDR ive only bought them lol. thank you guys for all the hard work.
I used to operate one of these pick and place machines at Hitachi back in 2006. AH! SoundBlaster audio cards! I had such a great experience with those!
I'm surprised you didn't show off Inkbox's version of Minecraft, he could certainly use some love for documenting his development process on video.
That's pretty neat, a mini minecraft for the x16? Xoes he have a youtube video of it?
I think he showed it in a previous X16 video
@@volvo09 He does! UA-cam doesn't like links but it's on the channel "Inkbox". If you search "Inkbox Minecraft" it should show up, it's a 2-parter.
I believe I showed that in the last video, if memory serves. I was just trying to show new stuff.
@@The8BitGuy Ahh gotcha! It's been a while since the last video, so I must've forgotten.
Thanks for adding actual captions for the Deaf ❤
You're welcome. I have been doing my captions manually since the beginning, and still do.
This is so cool. I used to work for a company building circuit board. I was part of a crew that would put all the thru-hole parts on boards before they went through the solder wave. Getting to watch the pick and place machines work was amazing. It's so great to see the progress y'all are making on the X-16.
FYI there are two different pinouts of MIDI to mini-TRS adapter in circulation. Make sure you and your users know which type you chose!
That's very good to know, what problems could occur if there's a mismatch?
I did not know that. But I think TexElec will be shipping the adapters with it.
@@MatthewCenance It will apply 5V to the connected MIDI input in the wrong direction. Depending on the type of optocoupler in the MIDI-receiving device, it may work anyway, not work, or get damaged. To be safe, use each device with the adapter it came with. If you connect two TRS MIDI ports together, use both adapters and not a simple TRS cable.
Also, be aware that the MIDI signal will be extremely loud if you plug in headphones there.
Im a long time watcher of this chanel, thought admittedly i watch very sparsely in recent years. This X16 project is really incredibly impressive. When you said you uad written 5 games and other software tools for it by your self i was like, wow where does he find the time. Congratulations on getting this far. Really.
I hope someone ends up writing an SSH client for the X16. It would be super cool to SSH into a modern computer on an X16.
Surprisingly, the encryption used by SSH is fairly demanding, hardware-wise
The idea of an SSH client came up in relation to another new/vintage computer. The problem is the amount of time it takes to do the math related to the encryption/decryption.
can an esp32 do it? Offloading the work to thee expansion card sounds viable.
@@jsmythibyes the zimodem firmware on the network card even supports “dialing” using SSH already
Zimodem on the network card already supports SSH. You could do that in ROMTERM right now.
This looks like a really nice kit, to the point that I'm considering one and I didn't even grew up with this kind of PCs, it just looks well made and made with love.
Seriously, about an hour before this dropped I asked aloud, "We ever gonna get a new 8-Bit Guy episode?" And here you are. Magic!
So impressed with everything the team is doing for Commander X16. Want one SO MUCH ! Love it !
Nice to see all the cool new items for the X16. For the serial/network card you should switch the positions of the antenna and the serial port connector. If a serial cable is plugged in with the current design it will get in the way of the antenna. The Pac Man game looks amazing. The pellets moving around is fine while in demo mode. When in the middle of game play (either simulated or during the demo screen) the pellets should stop moving, or move slower, or move less distance.
Can't. that's how the brackets are made.
@@TexElec My point is the bracket should not have been made that way in the first place.
@@kevincozens6837 I don't have the ability to make brackets, I can only buy them at the moment. This is what I could find that would fit all of the conditions I need to cover. My point is that there was a signifcant amount of thought put into it.
You are a treasure to the community, David. -- I think you've covered it in the past, but some of the reason that later 8-bit computers failed, and the Commodore 64 was such a success was all the software that was written for it. -- Seeing so many dedicated people working on software projects for the Commander X16 is really exciting and has me feeling like it's more than just a passing curiosity. -- Like, this thing really has legs! and I may need to snag one in the next batch...
OMG! Time Pilot! Man, I used to blow a lot of quarters on that game in the arcade. Looks great!
Congrats on hitting 1.44M subs! Same as the number of bytes on a 3½" floppy
I didn't know he reached that before I read this comment. A true classic!
Next goal 1.76M subs
Sub counts for older channels like this are kind of pointless in a way. How many of those 1.44M subs are dead accounts or people who subscribed 15+ years ago and have forgotten this channel? The Angry Video Game Nerd has 3.84M subs, think how many of those are people who subscribed in the late 2000s when they were like 12 years old and have either made a new account since then or long since moved on from watching AVGN and don't even realize they are subscribed. I'd say it would be fair that when an account hasn't interacted with a channel in 2-3 years it could be auto unsubscribed. It would make the sub numbers more realistic and accurate.
This is an excellent update! I am always amazed a how much work has been done on the Commander X16 platform. The level of work that continues to be done both on the hardware and software sides is wonderful! We also have to keep in mind this work is primarily being done by people in their spare time, there's no multi-million dollar corporation behind all of this.
The Spectrum version of Manic Miner stored all 20 screens as ASCII text in memory in the top 32K. In May 1984, age 16, with a broken collarbone and using only my left hand, I designed 20 new screens that were even harder! I sent them off to Alan Maton of Software Projects with a view to a proper screen editor being made. But he wasn't interested...
How did you break your collarbone?
@@jinxterx Judo. We were practising being thrown (ippon seonagi). One of my mate's was supposed to *almost* throw me, with another mate holding on tight behind my back. Except he didn't, as he wasn't concentrating. So over I went with the lad throwing me landing heavily on my right side, shattering my collar bone.
I couldn't believe the hospital just put a piece of cloth (sling) over my shoulder. It should've been pinned with titanium like motorbike racers get done. It was agony, and took a month to heal - while I should've been preparing for my O levels!
I'm too young to have experienced the 8-bit era and BBS's, but I still find all the work you've been doing so fun and exciting to follow. Keep up the good work, David!
You did Van Halen's 'Jump', flawlessly! I'm so proud of you!
Also, you ported Pac-Man?! That's crazy!
A nice 8-Bit Keys flashback
The Internet on the Commander X16, an 8-bit computer, is actually amazing. I'm looking forward to see this thing explode! I've got the virtual emulator, which is currently enough for me, but I might purchase a physical machine in the future.
Those BBS screens remind me so much of the Teletext service we had in the 90s in the UK. Local news, weather, sport results and lottery over analogue TV signals on CRTs.
The same here with "Videotext" in Germany, looked exactly the same. Was a bit slow to refresh and of course "oneway" (you could only select different Textpages), but was a nice addition to radio and didn't cost anything if you had a TV Set capable of receiving this.
Later with "Bildschirmtext" some BBS-like means of communication was possible, with costs for the data transfer via Modem of course.
I'm really excited about the AM/FM/SW card and the ozmoo interpretor!
Among many other things, I suspect you're going to begin seeing the CX16 in a **lot** of music studies (i.e. "home studios", etc.), especially in the homes of producers who want to experiment with an idea before going to the trouble of actually going in to the professional studio, etc. I remember reading...I **think** it was Madonna but I could be completely wrong in that...a very well known musical artist who used an Atari 030 as their MIDI music producer into the 00s (if not still using it).
Great to see this wonderful lovely 8bit computer project rising. With the limitations it has it is a great today manufactured platform for games and software every 40 years and up person loved back in the days.
Keep on the good work and greetings from germany.
lol Crazy Frog lifting Sonic music really takes me back to the DOS days
it feels nostalgic ive last seen it during late 2022 (atleast iirc) and to see youre still working on it it brings a smile to my face thank you 8 bit guy
Yes!!! Yes, yes yes! The Commander X16 gets me so excited.
Well done ! I really enjoyed this comprehensive update. Each year I am closer to getting one of these systems. The graphics, sounds, etc etc ... Are impressive. Thanks again 👍 Much respect for all your work.
6:30 So is the X16 going to make an appearance on 8-Bit Keys?
One can only hope.
He always abandons channels that stop generating money.
@@Okurka.well, he also ran out of content. There are only so many variations of old consumer Casio and Yamaha keyboards to cover, and most share many similarities. There just isn’t much else to say about them that is within his wheelhouse.
Awesome! Congratulations to all the folks involved.
Shazam picked up the sleigh bell song :D And also, surprisingly, your rendition of Jump!
Apparently you played that so well that Shazam thought I was listening to the song :D
Amazing to see so much energy put into this - we love you here in Coeur d’Alene!
Amazing stuff. I love the UFO game (with hints of 'Choplifter'), just one thing though, I thought the whole point of UFOs was that they are not constrained by traditional physics and can stop and turn instantaneously. It would be cool if you could incorporate this kind of motion into the game (I know you like a challenge).
Actually, it would have been EASIER to do it like that. I had to write extra code to handle the regular physics.
Whoa! When I saw the networkcard and the radiocard it made me realize that it could be combined and perhaps useful for amateur radio (digital modes).
Hilarious that your wifi card has more processing power than the main computer 😂😂😂
Graphics FPGA as well
Yeah this is really awesome and I don’t want to diminish what’s being achieved here at all. But saying, “… it really demonstrates what a 6502 can do” it seems like the fact that it seems like almost all of the IO interacts have coprocessors taking care of the work. Back in the day the 6502 had to bitbang much more, or otherwise interact with lower performance (vs now) co-processors / peripherals.
Yes, but that's because the 8 bit Guy decided on the X16 having no FPGAs, no hard to source, obsolete parts and being cheap enough that almost anybody can afford to buy one... oh wait, just ignore that particular video. 😂
Actually my USR Courier Dual Standard modem had more processing power than my Commodore 64 in the early 1990s. 🤣 P.S. I still have the modem. Sadly, my C64 was lost years ago.
@@another3997sometimes dreams can’t match up with reality - in the end he’s still making his fun, ideal hobby computer, which was the end goal. I have no doubts it will Become affordable! Just not this early in development. Pivoting to a surfacemount construction would go a long way in making it cheaper
Really amazing project! It's not just the passion, but the intense effort to get this thing through all of the product and development stages and out the door.
I prefer the PETSCII character graphics version of PETSCII robots. I hope that version's still available. UFO looks awesome!
Yes, in fact I just released a version called "oldrobots" for the X16 that allows you to play the PET and C64 versions (well, at least it looks like the PET or C64 version)
They are PETSCII robots, afterall, not Bitsky robots!
@@The8BitGuy I love this video it's like How it's made with The 8 Bit Guy and all of your videos are great as well
Dang, been following this project from the beginning and keep being in awe of the capabilities. The open, compatibility and performance based set out is really starting to show! Very cool!
I look forward to playing with this.
Great update. Awesome stuff, David! Brings back great memories of the BBS days and how cutting edge that was at the time. And the demo at the end - man, absolutely brilliant. It's hard for someone today to know the feeling back then when we saw those mind blowing, seemingly impossible demos.
I wish I could afford the X16, I want to feel what this is about first hand.
But alas, I might have to wait untill the third or fourth gen model
This intro music always takes me to my happy place
As soon as I saw the little UFOs I knew it was Second Reality. I literally fell out of my chair. So very very cool and worth the wait for these updates. Congrats on all the incredible stuff around Commander x16!
ITs a good day when we get a 8bit guy video to watch !!!
Ooh an X16 MiSTer core would be cool. 😅
Indeed. Something that could be added to and extended while keeping backward compatibility to, so as to come up with a specification for a hypothetical Commander X24 or X32...
Those Pacman graphics are beautiful! Props on the outstanding progress with your dream project, David. It's always a pleasure to check out your work.
CX16 do sometimes feel like something from an alternate timeline where 8-bit computers stayed a little too long and started evolving to do what the 16-bit computers could.
Like PC-Engine.
Like the C65.
looks a bit like if commodore made their own IIGS, interesting to think about what things would've been like if apple and commodore never abandoned the 6502
@@amirpourghoureiyan1637 You mean like the C65?
@@Okurka. was thinking more the IIGS with the expandability
David should get a yellow golf shirt with a single large thick black triangle wave zig zag form horizontally around the middle.
Tell you how young I am... My bbs connections were at 14.4... 9600 on a rainy day (copper country bell lines)
Been a fan of ur channel for many years. Seeing ur progress and Development over the years is awesome. Keep it up. Greetings from Kenya
If Commander 16 came out in the 1980's it would have dominated the market.
It would've been too expensive to dominate
@@DS9TREK it's too expensive now
At around 9:00 I borrowed a modem from someone for my C128 at 300 baud and I could read the text faster than the modem received it! 1200 baud came several years later on my PC. Thanks for the video!
Absolutely astonishing. If I hadn't followed its development, I'd never have believed that this sort of project was in any way feasible in the 21st century. Anxiously awaiting the 2nd-generation hardware. Hoping to use your dream computer for my dream software project. It's something I've wanted to do for about 35 years, but life got in the way and computers got way too complicated. My original target was the Apple IIgs, but the Commander X16 (with 65816 CPU) is a much more attractive platform.
Congratulations 8bit guy !!! The screen resolution is excelent .. You were able to modernize the Comodore stuff in a very nice way... In Angola we were more Z80 driven with spectrum, newbrain and casio but I admit that the 6502 had far more software in the game part ... In the business part I think that the Z80 was better, though ... The 80cls/40lines was far more driven to that ... I developed as well what is called today as ERP-CRM in Cobol back then for CP/M and Z80 machines.
Awww... the BBS age... I ran two C64 BBS's back in the early 80's in Toronto, Iron Cobra BBS and Arctic Software Sorce (ASS) BBS.... fun times... So long ago I forget everything about setting them up and operating.
Somewhere around 2008 I tinkered with making a clone of the Atari 2600 game Cosmic Ark in Flash, where you piloted a disc-shaped UFO and abducted humans via a tractor beam that came out of the bottom - and in my clone you could also turn off the beam to drop the humans and have them explode in a silly bloody mess when they hit the ground. I never finished it but often think of revisiting the idea in a modern game engine. It's hilarious to see someone else working on the same idea 15 years later.
I love how 'exit to basic' is considered an application. :D
The idea of bringing media together outside the Internet is interesting. AM/FM/SW radio + midi + sound synth + other into the computer as a hub. Yeah that is unique. Would be great if you could route different types of audio at the command line. ROUTE SP(eaker)=MP+WT+AM1070 (midiplayback+wavetables) . Something built on that would be yeah... hey that might be a thing!
Just noticed that Crazy Frog uses the Marble Zone song from the first Sonic game, and that the Pac Man demo resembles Pac Man Arrangement, which is a really fun version of the game released in 1996 with a bunch of new levels and mechanics.
Yeah I thought I recognised that music. Sega wants to know your location.
@@wasitacatisaw83 Nah they don't really care, they're not Nintendo, after all.
It's amazing the work you have done so far. I'm not sure I would want one but the fact that this is what it looks like is pretty awesome.
The use of the ESP32 in a lot of applications, not just your project but the fact that I have at least two ESP32 modules in use on my GameCube, one in a memory card emulator and the other in the BlueRetro controller board. Soon another one inside the GameCube as part of the Flippy Drive drive emulator shows what people can really do to keep some of these fairly historic machines alive.
Isn't there any danger of the wave soldering operation causing the SMT parts to become unsoldered and shift position? Seems like they would go through a second heat cycle, which might not be good for the soldered joints, not to mention a second heat shock to the parts.
No. The placement and soldering proccess is not my field of expertise, but If I'm not mistaken the PCCB will be heated just enough not to melt the solder. And the wave machine (and the reflow for the matter) has gradual heating and cooling as the PCB moves along. (With different possible thermal curves depending on the thermal mass of the PCB.)
No real danger of that. The molten solder that is in contact moves from one side of the board to the other. It isn't in one spot long enough for there to be enough heat transfer to the top of the board to remelt the solder. Even if the top-side SMT parts had their solder melted there is no sudden starting or stopping that would make the parts shift.
I was suprised how much "manual" work is necessary to produce the boards - it's super interesting! I wish you would go back to making videos every other week. Those were the best times.
Great to see all new games development! Would be cool to see a port of Shadowgate for the Commander X16 if I'm allowed to make a wish.
Hi David, an new 8-bit Guy video is always a great way to start the week end!
Oh I remember when you used to make cool videos on retro computer tech stuff... Prior to you becoming another small product sales / ad channel. Those where good times!
I really like the idea of that radio card.
Does anyone here actually care about the Commander X16?
To be honest I don't. I would love to watch more actual retro computers in action like C64 or Amiga.
I do, but that's just me.
@@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer I do too, even if I never see, or use the machine in person.... Stuff like this is so much cooler than most everything "new". Great to see someone try their best with current knowledge, and processes with old technologies....
Yes. Old computers are cool but we know them already. This is something completely new.
Awesome update! Thanks for sharing!
The software and the extension boards look very good!
I’m 45 I LOVED Hero!! I played that game so much when I was a kid.
Seriously yesterday I was watching your last Commander 16 update and I was like man what is this guy going to upload I didn't know I was going to be this early
that midi card sounds great! definitely an awesome mix of new and old technology. can't wait to see the stuff people make with this hardware. gotta get one of these when i have the money.
Utterly magical and heartwarming to see all this, you deserve success!
This has to the culmination of quite a few dreams and goals for you! Congrats to you and all those involved! What a deal!
for a cost reduced variant, like a really low end model, i think making one big FPGA with everything in it would be the cheapest option. you could also remove expantion ports and only have VGA out.
a mid range model could have 1/2 expantion ports with all video outs but retain the single FPGA design. and of course it being built in a keyboard like a C64 would be super cool.
I work at one of those factories (PCBA factories) as a test engineer, never had I thought my job would be documented
Neat stuff! It's super interesting to see how this progresses. Keep it up!
Happy 1.44M Subscribers! :)
Electronic drafting and design, this is EXACTLY whati went to school for!!
I LOVE the radio card with the loopstick antenna!