@TheOneRingcom, this show cannot be saved anymore because the foundation is completely rotten! The "HalRon/Galadriel ship" cannot be unmade. The show-runners managed to destroy two of Tolkien's most important characters - Sauron and Galadriel - in one fell swoop. It's as if someone would tell us that Hitler wasn't as bad as everybody thought he was, and that there was a time when he actually felt truly sorry for having killed six million Jews and initiated WWII. The only way to salvage this show would be to trash the whole show, fire the show-runners and make a fresh start! Unfortunately this show will probably find an audience. Casual fantasy fans will tune in because curiosity is a powerful force, and after a few years the terrible beginning will be ancient news. And mystery boxes have a strange allure! I have to say that l am somewhat curious how Adar's storyline will be continued. Adar was hands-down my favorite character, and IMO Joseph Mawle is a great actor who has this special extra which the rest of the ROP cast doesn't have. When he dropped out of ROP, the show lost it's greatest asset. I would have laughed if someone would've told me that I would root for the. leader of a bunch of orcs in a Tolkien adaptation 😉 But Adar was actually a very intriguing character, and his narrative addressed a conundrum in Tolkien's work which has always irked me: l could never accept that there was a humanoid sentient and intelligent species in Tolkien's universe which was irredeemably bad and whose members could be eradicated and/or killed for sport - l am looking at you, Legolas and Gimli! - without having to feel guilty about it! Tolkien's orcs were mostly cannon fodder for his heroes! I don't think that Tolkien's orcs are cuddly softies underneath there grisly exterior. They are bad news whereever they show up and do bad orcish things. But they didn't choose to be like this! The biggest baddie in Tolkien's universe - Morgoth - made the orcs, and not even the tiniest orc baby had a chance to be different. I can fully understand Adar's motives. He wasn't a bloodthirsty killer, and he actually gave the humans who lived in the area of what eventually became Mordor, the chance to cooperate or to evacuate. When Tolkien's writings became more mature, he actually wasn't happy anymore with his orcs and their alleged origins. He tried out many theories, and he had actually abandoned the idea that the first-generation of proto-orcs were elves like Adar who had been abducted before they were even awake, and these captive elves were corrupted beyond repair by Morgoth. But Tolkien died without having found a solution for his orc conundrum, and the corrupted-elves theory is still the best-known origins story. I have no problems that it was used for the show and Adar's character proves that it's absolutely possible to create new and very compelling characters for stories which take place in Tolkien's universe if the character is designed well, even die-hard Tolkien purists will accept it. I wonder who created Adar's character. It’s hard to believe that the same guys who came up with the ridiculous idea of shipping HalRon and Galadriel, were able to create Adar and his Uruk children!
Rings of power’s Sauron Halbrand is the dumbest villain in film history. Sauron revealing himself to Guyladrial and showing up at Erigion as Halbrand makes little sense. How did Sauron know that Guyladrial didn’t tell Celembribor that halbrand is Sauron? Sauron revealed himself before making the nine and lesser rings.
@@kari8187 Actually they don't bother to check to see if anyone was falling behind: this is because there are around a THOUSAND people moving. What happened to Nori's family was her own fault, and people HATE Nori for it.
I'm so glad you noticed that they named the troll Damrod after...the Ranger of ithilien?! Couldn't they have used the Black Speech to come up with a name? They aren't even showing respect for Tolkien's languages...
It would also imply Damrod Huggins is the ancestor of Damrod the Ranger, which does make sense: the princes of the Haradrim lived in Minas Tirith, the Haradrim married trolls (a reference to the myth that female pongos - a pongo is a hairy ogre in Pygmy mythology, also called a gorilla - could shapeshift into beautiful women and seduce men to get pregnant, which no doubt helped inspire racist portrayals of black people as gorillas), Umbar and it's Harbour would have had increasing Numenorean influence from the settlements to Castamir, the Numenoreans mixed "with lesser men," and we don't know anything about Damrod the Ranger. I though it was stupid, but writing all of this makes surprising sense... although it implies that ALL the Rangers of Ithilien we see (and the Gondor-men we see), have troll and Haradrim ancestry. EDIT: I used a line instead of a bracket, after "as gorillas," which has now been corrected, and I have broken the two sentences apart for clarity.
@@richardwallis9374 Yes, I was hoping it would be Bob, as he is a hill-troll and implied to be the father of the Huggins trio, but to be fair Damrod appears to be an Anglo-Saxon name, which implies that as trolls use the Common Tongue (translated into English), and Damrod Huggins comes from Rhovannion (he IS a hill-troll from the Misty Mountains), Damrod was born there when the Haladin came over the Misty Mountains (as Numenoreans did not dominate Middle-Earth then, this implies he was a changeling raised by Haladin). EDIT: I changed "Damrod Huggins comes" to "and Damrod Huggins comes" and "he was born" to "Damrod was born," as I accidentally made my paragraph unclear otherwise.
There are actually new fans who are thrilled at whatever adaptation thrown at them. They are like "Oh can't imagine the second age on screen, yay!" It's their bliss to be able to enjoy everything - although I don't think most of them read that much or understand the texts at all. Some are cursed to be able to see inconsistency, stupidity, laziness, lack of respect, and lack of talent.
So many lost opportunities in the RoP. Imagine a series where they stuck to the original scale of the timeline. You could have the same Elven characters throughout the entire series while swapping out new human characters every season. That would be a great way to illustrate the different viewpoints (immortal vs mortal) that differentiate humans and elves.
Of course. You make it episodic in an unusual way. But again, the banal writers don't have the imagination enough to go there. Even if they had the rights to all that material. which they don't. That was Amazon's mistake from the beginning, but they thought they could get away with half-assing it.
💯 Each season could be major events... the forging of the rings... the sack of Eregion and victory at Lindon... The Númenorean descent into darkness and capture of Sauron... the destruction of Númenor... The Last alliance... So much opportunity. So much myopia.
But it is clear that they did not _want_ to differentiate Men (including women) and Elves-in this production, the Elves are quite literally nothing more than Men with pointed ears-Halbrand only identified Galadriel as an Elf when he saw them. They have the same motivations, the same world-view, and even such conversation as "you smell of rotten leaves." "No, I don't." "Yes, you do."
That's exactly how they should have done it. In five chapters, with the same seven or eight elves throughout, and then new humans each season (until season 4-5). And they could have had all the diversity in the world, with massive ethnic colonial issues setting up Umbar and the Numenorians first helping, then oppressing Harad. This oppression then leads them to (wrongly) think of Sauron as their saviour, and why they side with him in the wars. So many missed opportunities which would have even hit their modern woke boxes. Simpletons.
Well, it probably means 'metal hammer' in Sindarin, and so would not be an inappropriate name for a troll. If the Elves were to give a name to a troll (the trolls in The Hobbit had names, of course, but Bilbo's reporting on this is unreliable). And if a Ranger were to be named after a famous troll.
Even if Damrod hadn't been used already, it's a dreadful name for a troll. Trolls probably should have names comparable to orcs, like Grishnakh or Shagrath. Not Sindarin names.
As a young lad, after reading and watching the LOTR trilogy, I found the The Silmarillion and other Tolkien books and used to dream and talk with friends how amazing movie adaptations could be for the Fall of Gondolin, The children of Hurin and all the other amazing storylines. Then the advent of high budget well done TV series came around and I thought man that would be even better... What an absolute waste of potential. My wife, who never read any of the books, thought it was dumb. The ROP if you were to change everything so it's not even Tolkien based couldn't even stand up as a decent show. At this point you can't convince me this isn't being used purely as money laundering with how bad it is and how much it costs. A person with any intelligence cannot say this is a good show.
It was like watching my 5 and 3 year old playing with action figures just randomly making up stories… Amazon ordered Tolkien on Temu and the trailer for season 2 looks like they ain’t got much to show for it.
The sons of the Inklings need to put a final nail in this coffin of crap. The movies are 25 years old,what generation was this made for I'll never understand.I read the books in the 60's and bought the Silmarillion the day it came out 😮
I have seen Tolkien's fan made stage plays on youtube with almost zero budget that depict Sauron way better and much much closer to the source material than this abomination .
The absolute biggest tragedy about Rings of Power is, the squandered potential. The amount they invested in this, imagine if they took Tolkien at least as seriously as Peter Jackson did? Imagine getting multiple seasons, each season dealing with a different event from the 2nd age? Imagine how awesome it COULD have been? Now, we probably won’t see it in our lifetimes, because it’s going to be sometime before anyone revisits it after Amazon is done with it. It’s sad. Imagine if they planned their 5 seasons like this, with appropriate time jumps? Season 1: Aftermath of the 1st Age, Founding of Grey Havens, Lindon, Numenor, Khazad-dûm, etc. Season 2: Forging of the Rings Season 3: Destruction of Eregion Season 4: Fall of Numenor Season 5: The Last Alliance of Elves & Men
It wouldn't work: 10 episodes each is not enough to tell a story. 25 episodes two-hours long would be necessary to flesh out everything... and since it would be set in the Jacksonverse, it would not be perfect.
@@theshadow7201 I think we cannot judge them until the Mithril Edition comes out, or more accurately after we have a Specialized Edition George Lucas style.
"Give me the meat and give it to me raw" is what girlboss Galadriel really wanted to say to Halbrand in season 1. I've been returning to Tolkien on and off for 30 years, and have probably read the Silmarilion at least 5 times. I was aghast at what Amazon did to the Elvish characters, making them humans with stick-on ears. My only complaint about Jackson's first 3 films was the absence of the Grey Company of Rangers and Elladan/Elrohir - leaving out Tom Bombadil and the scouring of the Shire was necessary, and transferring Glorfindel's role in rescuing Frodo to to Arwen was sensible.
I will always prefer the books, I just like books better, and I like the detail and pace and tone of the books better, but I was not disappointed in the films. They did a good job. I didn't when watch the Hobbit when I heard they made it into a trilogy. My buddy who was always watching all the new movies coming out was like "no no, this is all stuff that Tolkien wrote and meant to put in the book, but left out. His _own son_ added it back in". Sure, if that's what they told you on the promotional materials, you go with that. Thats not The Hobbit, and I don't believe it anyway. Maybe stuff loosely adapted from his notes and crammed into the movies to bloat them so they can make three times the profit. So Amazon isn't the first to ruin LOTR.
It's amazing, now the show is coming back, how MANY things were wrong in season 1. The stupid is all slowly coming back to me. I remembered Galadriel trying to swim from Valinor to Middle Earth. Then the Elves losing their immortality without mithril. Numenor trying to conquer Mordor with three ships. Villagers forgetting to bring food when evacuating their village. Numenorean wine being more explosive than nitroglycerine. The Numenorean Kings Men being worried the elves would tuk dur jerbs. The healer lady suddenly becoming leader of a village where no one likes or trusts her. Celebrimbor discovering what alloys are.
And, notably, even if season one had filed off all the Tolkien serial numbers (names), it still would have been an inferior production. Awful not-hobbits, a 'mithril' spy plot that doesn't make a lick of sense, a seemingly untrained island-nation military who own (as far as we were shown) the only horses in the world, a 'Southlands' so-called kingdom comprising tiny villages but still remembering their royal line (where, please, was the capital?), oh, the absurdities are endless. Honestly, they can hardly do worse in the second season, even if we allow that they can ignore Tolkien's work entirely. As JRRT wrote of the constructed language Novial: "…hideous -- "factory product" is written all over it, or rather, "made of spare parts" -- and it has no gleam of the individuality, coherence and beauty, which appear in the great natural idioms…" Or, in this case, which appear in the great legends.
@@TheOneRingcom You need to read the books first.Then you would get Tolkien's message. Spoilers: He would hate the show. But he also would hate people like you.
@@Meilock Yes, most people overreact to ROP: it is only an average show (and even then only if you give the second season the benefit of the doubt), but they act like Amazon and/or the actors ate a baby.
@@rikhuravidansker its not an average show though? The characters are written very badly. The dialogue tries too hard and fails. The costumes look cheap and glittery. Everything is bad, not just because it deviated from lore but really because its written very badly. I mean what the hell is "THeRe IS a TEmPesT in ME!" Like...what?
@@aurelian2668 "Average" does not mean "good," it just means "passing," as in C- - - (the bare minimum in Commonwealth countries, whereas Americans have D- - - as the minimum, because Americans are even stupider). Amazon, Time Warner, the Weinstein Company, MGM, WingNut Productions, and DreamWorks, did the bare minimum (remember, Amazon got the rights from all of these, these big businesses working on the Hobbit trilogy).
People can like what they want and i generally dont care but i take a hardline stance with tolkiens works. If anyone proclaims to be a tolkien fan and says they like this show they are an abject liar
I could say the same about the movies, if this is your stance on it… if you don’t like people changing tolkiens works, then you must REALLY hate the movies
@@EubyGamingRES There's changing to adapt a book to a film, and then there's the butchering going on in Rings of Power. There's no comparison at all between Jackson's Lord of the Rings, and the breathtakingly bad Rings of Power
It is amazing to me that discussions on another Tolkien site demonstrate how there are still many Tolkien fans who proclaim how much they love ROP despite all of its massive changes to lore etc.
They are not Tolkien fans. They are the I support-the-current-thing type of person. No depth, no thought, just sheep. And, of course, there are the ones that want to garner the giant corporation's money. So, it's a soup of greed and ignorance.
@@gilbertobrandina9487 Exactly. Corey Olsen is Exhibit A. Knows enough lore that he should know better, he was willing to be critical of lore-breaking details in Jackson's movies, but coincidentally when this travesty comes out, he's incredibly forgiving of massive lore changes that PJ would never have dared to even think about. That's when you know people aren't arguing honestly, and something else is going on.
I just don't understand the cognitive dissonance between loving Tolkien's works and being all-in on something that changes what he wrote. Nick Groom, the author of "Tolkien in the 21st Century", is exactly the same. When we interviewed him last year, he told us his favorite character in ALL of Middle-earth was Tauriel! 😬
@@TheOneRingcom OMG! It takes a special kind of obtusity to take the time to learn an author's extensive and detailed lore and don't appretiate it. Why read it in first place, right?
Cringe of Power. Not looking forward to it. Am looking forward to the critics who rightly tear it apart with more intelligence and wit than Amazon writers.
Is it just that Bozo Bezos is so swimming in money that half a million dollars is just a casual fling? What about his son telling him not to f- it up? Does that level of investment not motivate someone to choose the writers and the showrunners as carefully as possible? And from the bit I have read they had a wealth of talent to choose from, who wanted to do it. I believe I heard that Peter Jackson had agreed with someone in the team to be a consultant, and then no one ever contacted him. Surely Bezos had the final decision...maybe he should have consulted his kid more!
I truly cannot stand the bad 80s hairdos all around. But why didn't A company like this do a massive survey to see what the fans wanted, because this type of IP has a generational fan base that automatically gets passed on
They can't learn either the right or wrong lessons from Season one, because they don't have the writing talent/outlook to fix the problem, and they don't have the rights to the actual lore material that could, in theory, fix the problem. They're stuck trampolining off the terrible stuff they already made, so there's really no fix, and no lessons. Everything they will do from here on out is pointless, and just throwing good money after bad.
SS1 has no feeling of Tolkien 's world . No honor no glory no dignity. Just annoying character try to mess things around. And this.... ladies & gentleman ( sorry...no pronoun ) This is LOTR they said they want the following generations to remember.
They missed an opportunity just setting the show in the east (Rhun) about what happened there, the men of the east getting corrupted, what happened to the blue wizards, etc. They could have forced as much diversity in there as they wanted, and nobody would have batted an eyelid. Heck, you could have even had an exclusively black skinned elf race, like proto elves or something.. because we have never been to Rhun on screen and their culture could be whatever the fuck they want their agenda to be, not change what has already been established.
Note: they gave Sindarin name to a Troll and a primordial fallen elf a Quenya name to Pharazon's son late 3rd age names to middle 2nd age proto-hobbit (when middle 3rd age hobbits have more archaic names - Blanco vs Nori Brandyfoot) sooo lame🤦🏼
@@TheOneRingcom The problem is they literally did, they just ignored all logic behind the names. They cut many of the last names of Shire hobbits in two, randomly reshuffled them, and used them as last names for their Harfoots. So Bolger, Brandy-Buck and Proud-foot became Bolger-buck, Brandy-foot and Proud-fellow. The leader was named "Burrows" even though these Harfoots don't live in burrows. The main character is named "Elanor", even though that's a Sindarin name that Sam gave to his daughter, and it's a special name exactly because it's not a hobbit name. It's noteworthy because it reflects how Sam's life is completely different from all hobbits around him. So other hobbit girls should NOT be named Elanor for that to work. It's almost a feat how much they got wrong here.
fanfic writers were move inventive about proto-hobbit names - they got names of trees and flowers. boys were given names for trees and girls for flowers :)
Only one Elf is known to have remarried Feanor’s Father. That is because Feanor’s mother put so much of her life into his birth and raising that she dies and never makes it to the Halls of Mandos. Galadriel knows her husband is either alive or in the Halls of Mandos awaiting reincarnation. Elves don’t remarry when one dies because thy know they will be reunited. So the most horrendous thing they could do is have them breed. For one thing He is a Maia not an Elf. Which is not unprecedented but considering she’s betrothed it wouldn’t happen any more that the other Don Lemon elf was sleeping with a common woman.
Johnathon, I'm curious. If a show were marketed as "inspired by the works of Tolkien,' what would your criteria for it be in terms of themes or mythological inspirations?
That's an interesting thought... If they made something that was "inspired by Tolkien", using places, events, even people in middle-earth that he didn't write about, that he didn't set out a framework for, I certainly wouldn't be as harsh. I mean, I'd still criticize the writing and the acting and the plotting, but I wouldn't be measuring right up against Tolkien's story. Essentially it'd be glorified fan fiction. So, yeah, I'd give it a lot more grace (in the same way I give a bit more leeway to something like Shadows of Mordor--though I still had problems with it... but it's excellence in execution was top notch).
Reciprocal respect - easy to offer a fair reading to one who says either 'set in Tolkien's world' or 'a story using things Tolkien named and described' but hard to understand the exact commitment of one who claims both @@TheOneRingcom
@@TheOneRingcom All fantasy since Tolkien was inspired by him and the Lovecraft Circle... and 95% of post-Tolkien fantasy is bad. The work of George Lucas and Gene Roddenberry was also inspired by it, and 95% of both is bad.
I read the Hobbit (and watched the animated movie) so long ago now that I can't even remember when it happened. And I read the LOTR and the Silmarillion and the Unifinished Tales in high school (and watched the animated LOTR movie) long before the live actions films were even dreamed of. I love Tolkien's books and Middle-Earth itself. The fact that I haven't watched this series even though I know about it and could watch it at any time is a terrible sign. This should appeal directly to me, but it doesn''t. I doubt I will ever watch it. I know that i am nobody, but there's a lot of people like me who should be excited for this, but are just the opposite.
There's a difference between changing some details but keeping most of the narrative beats of the source material, and making up a totally brand new thing that pilfers names and places but totally transforms the whole thing into fanfiction that JRRT wouldn't even recognize. Amazon has done the latter, not the former.
They only have rights to the appendices so my guess is there is no fleshing out of characters and stories. I’m not in any way defending Amazon, what they are doing should be illegal and someone should be put to jail. My stance is, if the don’t have the rights to all the stories, books then don’t bother
I don't get Amazon prime, but the previews and clips I saw, the interviews with the all gay/lesbian cast members who never read the books were enough for me to insure I'd never want to watch ROP. And the line that really got me was the guy in the town square ranting "the elves are gonna take your jobs ! ! " . . .
So I guess Galadriel "forgot" to tell Celebrimbor that the man who inspired him to make the elven rings was Sauron? Cause one would think that if Celebrimbor was told he'd be on the lookout for anyone wanting to make more "powerful rings".
How did Amazon think they could mess with the 2nd Age Lore this much? The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings are relatively Casual compared to the fans that know about the 1st and 2nd age. I tell people who don't know that The Similrian is the Middle Earth Bible. They could have picked a subject matter that Tolkien dose not cover much of, Like The blue wizards or the Vale of Dorwinian, Where lore inaccurates would have less of an impact. But they chose to cover the forging of the Rings of Power. A topic heavily covered in Tolkien's work. I don't understand why the main characters aren't Celebrimbor and Narvi. Have the focus on Celebrimbor's love of craftsmanship and how it led to blindly trusting Anotaur. You could add a layer of selflessness to his character. He didn't keep one of the 3 elven rings of power he made. He died facing off against Sauron. But no Amazon had to make Galadriel into a Karen, Celebrimbor into the oldest looking elf ever, and Numinorians look just flat unappealing.
I love how Numenorians hate Elves in season 1 seeing their first king was an half Elf.... That is 101 comedy right there... Its like americans hating Washington for being white...wait... Huuuuh
A lot of what you said is decisively Tolkien isn't necessarily 100% accurate. After all, Al-Pharazon usurping his cousin's throne is absolutely part of the text.
@@paddynkorn2109 you're seeing it all wrong. Celebrimbor was deceived by Annatar,ONCE. Celebrimbor is being deceived twice in this show ,by the same guy,who just changed his hair and has the same face. And he's crying like a baby.
@@blletm6029 How so? If he was any smart he would change his face. He has that ability. I know what you're going to say,that he mind tricks Celebrimbor so that he won't recognize him . Wasn't it easier to change his face(he's a shape shifter after all)? This is just the incompetent writers . The deceiving part and making the rings was done in season 1. Sauron coming back is just contrived. The writers probably trying to fix the mess of season 1,but they're making it worse.
We live in an age where the word "Epic!" is invariably a term of approval. I cannot blame Amazon for creating something for that audience. The result does not interest me as a Tolkien fan, and season one was a deep disappointment even as generic-fantasy drama, full of absurd plotting, slipshod world-building, repeated failures to understand and portray time and distances, and few engaging characterizations. Fascinating like a train-wreck, but not bad enough to be funny.
When season 1 was released, I went and reread The hobbit, Lord of the rings and the Silmarillion, to celebrate Tolkien in not! watching the show. Instead of watching season 2, I'm going to rewatch all the Peter Jackson films. I agree, I had my problems when they were first released; especially Faramir, but over time the good elements have definitely outshown the bad, something I've been thinking even before Rings of power, or the start of the modern cultural dark age. We are the Faithful, amazon are the Kings men, let Ar-Bezos send their fleet west to their own destruction, we'll keep faith with the elves, and the past, and honour the Valar and their creator; indeed both their creators, both Professor Tolkien, and; for those who choose to, Eru the one God as well.
The modern cultural dark age began centuries before: Tolkien thought the Matter of England was the last good thing England ever produced, and I agree with him.
IMO even with having only 10% of rights to the materials about 2d Age someone willing is able to make interesting, briliant, and coherent show with all the changes he needs to add. But they did not want to make it interesting, coherent and briliant.
Tolkien Untangled started to “rewrite” the show using the stuff they had rights to and his version was much better and didn’t abuse the source material. He gave up because the show just went off the rails and there was no saving it.
I think that the timeline compression could have worked if they'd done it in 10 year skips: 10 years after the rings are formed for Numenor to colonise middle earth before the Akallabeth, and 10 years for Arnor and Gondor to be formed. I think that this could serve the purpose of allowing normal humans to be part of the story (the second age being a tale building up to the last alliance of elves and men). The only non-dunedain humans are Theo and Bronwyn, and they're just so boring.
They could have had a winner - sticking with the story or at least close to the story. Instead they made a fan fiction CW activism show under the usual 'blame the fans if they don't like it' bs. On the bright side - it's been good for UA-cam folks.
Good moview. Check the game "The Rings of Powder" if you're on the Tolkien's side. After watching the Amazon production, we are very lost, so much so that one of the team members has not been found to this day..
Even moria look bad in this show you have one shitty cgi shot otherwise it's little space room with no life in it The hall of moria looked majestic in Jackson movie whereas it's was abandoned for years
Yeah, like silencing reviewers will magically improve their TV show. What they show is that they just want to trick someone to watch their garbage to increase some metrics that somehow justifies their poor product
You know what really sticks in the craw of the writers? Having to figure out how to write something heroic without giving credit to the "Men of the West".
How can Celebrimbor crying be dumb. Showing emotions is not a weekness. Especially in the context of Tolkien. Critice guys, allrigt. But do it proper and not in this way.
I weep for the travesty this clownshow of a series has become. To think of what might have been if someone who actually respected the source material had been given the reins.
In this world we can see that today everything is for sale - reputation, fame, intelect, talent, sexuality, intimacy, teachers, students, countries, lands, nature's beauty, art, families, ideals, societies, even religions. Well, I want to tell you smt. Theres still one thing not for sale. Its a fan's soul.
We do not have to watch it. I will not. I may watch one or the other review. They want to make Sauron a conflicted goody who just would like to be good. But Galadriel drags him back into the darkness. I do not want Tatooine Stoors etc. Its just so bad writing.
They are actually trying to make Sauron a combination of the League of Shadows and the Heath Ledger Joker (I would think the second Doomsday as well, which is the Doomsday seen in "Dawn of Justice"), which would make him an ideological Pennywise - what they SHOULD do is make him like the Watchers in the Bible, since he is a fallen angel.
They're already rowing, they couldn't change anything because everything was already written... but next season, then yeah, just watch season 2 and then season 3 will be the way you wanted and if not, yes, season 4 is coming , just look at the crap
God just listening to how much garbage it is is ruining my evening. And I just saw a post by Bear McCreary (who is actually awesome) about this piece of crap and I just want to scream.
I will never forgive them for losing Joseph Mawle as Adar, who was literally the only shining light of the show. The new Adar looks overcooked with makeup, that just ain't it. The new actor is fine, I guess, but Joseph portrayed brilliance.
I completely agree with you. I can’t add anything to it, and I can’t argue against it. All I can say is that I’m a huge Middle-earth fan who has watched the movies countless times, but I’ve never read the books. Personally, I’m okay with watching anything related to topics I enjoy, including this show, no matter how bad it might be. As long as I get to see what I want, and in this case, that’s Sauron. And honestly, I think they’re doing an okay job with him. If the trailers are anything to go by, season 2 should be a bit better than season 1. But who knows, maybe they haven’t learned anything.
You really need to read the books and just soak them in, in all their glory. Your mind will be blown to see how far from Tolkien's work that even Peter Jackson strayed in his adaptation of The Lord of the Rings, let alone his The Hobbit movies (they were flat-out bad, due to excessive studio interference), and especially the godawful mess that is The Rings of Power. Read and marvel!
Perhaps we should start calling this show "Wig on a Pig"...
terrible dilemma - who's the bigger pig?
And maybe lipstick too!
@@TheOneRingcom man I miss average TV
@TheOneRingcom, this show cannot be saved anymore because the foundation is completely rotten! The "HalRon/Galadriel ship" cannot be unmade. The show-runners managed to destroy two of Tolkien's most important characters - Sauron and Galadriel - in one fell swoop. It's as if someone would tell us that Hitler wasn't as bad as everybody thought he was, and that there was a time when he actually felt truly sorry for having killed six million Jews and initiated WWII. The only way to salvage this show would be to trash the whole show, fire the show-runners and make a fresh start!
Unfortunately this show will probably find an audience. Casual fantasy fans will tune in because curiosity is a powerful force, and after a few years the terrible beginning will be ancient news. And mystery boxes have a strange allure! I have to say that l am somewhat curious how Adar's storyline will be continued. Adar was hands-down my favorite character, and IMO Joseph Mawle is a great actor who has this special extra which the rest of the ROP cast doesn't have. When he dropped out of ROP, the show lost it's greatest asset.
I would have laughed if someone would've told me that I would root for the. leader of a bunch of orcs in a Tolkien adaptation 😉 But Adar was actually a very intriguing character, and his narrative addressed a conundrum in Tolkien's work which has always irked me: l could never accept that there was a humanoid sentient and intelligent species in Tolkien's universe which was irredeemably bad and whose members could be eradicated and/or killed for sport - l am looking at you, Legolas and Gimli! - without having to feel guilty about it! Tolkien's orcs were mostly cannon fodder for his heroes! I don't think that Tolkien's orcs are cuddly softies underneath there grisly exterior. They are bad news whereever they show up and do bad orcish things. But they didn't choose to be like this! The biggest baddie in Tolkien's universe - Morgoth - made the orcs, and not even the tiniest orc baby had a chance to be different. I can fully understand Adar's motives. He wasn't a bloodthirsty killer, and he actually gave the humans who lived in the area of what eventually became Mordor, the chance to cooperate or to evacuate. When Tolkien's writings became more mature, he actually wasn't happy anymore with his orcs and their alleged origins. He tried out many theories, and he had actually abandoned the idea that the first-generation of proto-orcs were elves like Adar who had been abducted before they were even awake, and these captive elves were corrupted beyond repair by Morgoth. But Tolkien died without having found a solution for his orc conundrum, and the corrupted-elves theory is still the best-known origins story. I have no problems that it was used for the show and Adar's character proves that it's absolutely possible to create new and very compelling characters for stories which take place in Tolkien's universe if the character is designed well, even die-hard Tolkien purists will accept it. I wonder who created Adar's character. It’s hard to believe that the same guys who came up with the ridiculous idea of shipping HalRon and Galadriel, were able to create Adar and his Uruk children!
Rings of power’s Sauron Halbrand is the dumbest villain in film history. Sauron revealing himself to Guyladrial and showing up at Erigion as Halbrand makes little sense. How did Sauron know that Guyladrial didn’t tell Celembribor that halbrand is Sauron? Sauron revealed himself before making the nine and lesser rings.
Harfoots: no one walks alone!
Also Harfoots: unless you stop walking then we will leave you sitting alone. Byeeeee
The Harfoots warn people to NOT get left behind.
@@rikhuravidansker yup because they know they will abandon anyone 😂
@@kari8187 Actually they don't bother to check to see if anyone was falling behind: this is because there are around a THOUSAND people moving. What happened to Nori's family was her own fault, and people HATE Nori for it.
I'm so glad you noticed that they named the troll Damrod after...the Ranger of ithilien?! Couldn't they have used the Black Speech to come up with a name? They aren't even showing respect for Tolkien's languages...
Grash’thok there take that name. Hell Frank would be more lore accurate 🤷♂️
It would also imply Damrod Huggins is the ancestor of Damrod the Ranger, which does make sense: the princes of the Haradrim lived in Minas Tirith, the Haradrim married trolls (a reference to the myth that female pongos - a pongo is a hairy ogre in Pygmy mythology, also called a gorilla - could shapeshift into beautiful women and seduce men to get pregnant, which no doubt helped inspire racist portrayals of black people as gorillas), Umbar and it's Harbour would have had increasing Numenorean influence from the settlements to Castamir, the Numenoreans mixed "with lesser men," and we don't know anything about Damrod the Ranger.
I though it was stupid, but writing all of this makes surprising sense... although it implies that ALL the Rangers of Ithilien we see (and the Gondor-men we see), have troll and Haradrim ancestry.
EDIT: I used a line instead of a bracket, after "as gorillas," which has now been corrected, and I have broken the two sentences apart for clarity.
@@richardwallis9374 Yes, I was hoping it would be Bob, as he is a hill-troll and implied to be the father of the Huggins trio, but to be fair Damrod appears to be an Anglo-Saxon name, which implies that as trolls use the Common Tongue (translated into English), and Damrod Huggins comes from Rhovannion (he IS a hill-troll from the Misty Mountains), Damrod was born there when the Haladin came over the Misty Mountains (as Numenoreans did not dominate Middle-Earth then, this implies he was a changeling raised by Haladin).
EDIT: I changed "Damrod Huggins comes" to "and Damrod Huggins comes" and "he was born" to "Damrod was born," as I accidentally made my paragraph unclear otherwise.
There is zero evidence these people have ever read LOTR. They clearly have no understanding of Tolkien, his worldview or his values.
There are actually new fans who are thrilled at whatever adaptation thrown at them. They are like
"Oh can't imagine the second age on screen, yay!"
It's their bliss to be able to enjoy everything - although I don't think most of them read that much or understand the texts at all. Some are cursed to be able to see inconsistency, stupidity, laziness, lack of respect, and lack of talent.
My point is, they probably read, just not the way you do.
@@eugene8498 those aren't fans, those are idiots.
They do understand, I think. It is just that they despise Tolkien and everything he stood for.
@@aldariontelcontar exactly
So many lost opportunities in the RoP. Imagine a series where they stuck to the original scale of the timeline. You could have the same Elven characters throughout the entire series while swapping out new human characters every season. That would be a great way to illustrate the different viewpoints (immortal vs mortal) that differentiate humans and elves.
Of course. You make it episodic in an unusual way. But again, the banal writers don't have the imagination enough to go there. Even if they had the rights to all that material. which they don't. That was Amazon's mistake from the beginning, but they thought they could get away with half-assing it.
💯 Each season could be major events... the forging of the rings... the sack of Eregion and victory at Lindon... The Númenorean descent into darkness and capture of Sauron... the destruction of Númenor... The Last alliance...
So much opportunity. So much myopia.
But it is clear that they did not _want_ to differentiate Men (including women) and Elves-in this production, the Elves are quite literally nothing more than Men with pointed ears-Halbrand only identified Galadriel as an Elf when he saw them. They have the same motivations, the same world-view, and even such conversation as "you smell of rotten leaves." "No, I don't." "Yes, you do."
Totally agree
That's exactly how they should have done it. In five chapters, with the same seven or eight elves throughout, and then new humans each season (until season 4-5).
And they could have had all the diversity in the world, with massive ethnic colonial issues setting up Umbar and the Numenorians first helping, then oppressing Harad.
This oppression then leads them to (wrongly) think of Sauron as their saviour, and why they side with him in the wars.
So many missed opportunities which would have even hit their modern woke boxes.
Simpletons.
This line was epic: "The sea is always right," a masterpiece of literature!!😂😂😂
lol
Looks like a crossover or bad written fanfic between some copy of LOTR and House of the Dragon
😂😢😂😢😂😢😢😢
Its not better than 'Do you know why a ship floats and a stone cannot?" 🤣
@@Vertigo-66 where's your wife?
She drowned.
THE SEE IS ALWAYS RIGHT!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Damrod was the original name Tolkien gave to Feanor's son Amrod too. And Amazon repurposed it for a troll 😖
Hacks. They're all hacks.
Well, it probably means 'metal hammer' in Sindarin, and so would not be an inappropriate name for a troll. If the Elves were to give a name to a troll (the trolls in The Hobbit had names, of course, but Bilbo's reporting on this is unreliable). And if a Ranger were to be named after a famous troll.
Even if Damrod hadn't been used already, it's a dreadful name for a troll. Trolls probably should have names comparable to orcs, like Grishnakh or Shagrath. Not Sindarin names.
Another middle finger for the fans.
What a whiner@@friedrichjunzt
I think by this point even South Park treated the LotR franchise better and more accurate than Amazon...
They in fact did.
@@richardwallis9374makes me want to go watch the South Park version
As a young lad, after reading and watching the LOTR trilogy, I found the The Silmarillion and other Tolkien books and used to dream and talk with friends how amazing movie adaptations could be for the Fall of Gondolin, The children of Hurin and all the other amazing storylines. Then the advent of high budget well done TV series came around and I thought man that would be even better... What an absolute waste of potential. My wife, who never read any of the books, thought it was dumb. The ROP if you were to change everything so it's not even Tolkien based couldn't even stand up as a decent show. At this point you can't convince me this isn't being used purely as money laundering with how bad it is and how much it costs. A person with any intelligence cannot say this is a good show.
The wig is always right🤡
It was like watching my 5 and 3 year old playing with action figures just randomly making up stories… Amazon ordered Tolkien on Temu and the trailer for season 2 looks like they ain’t got much to show for it.
The sons of the Inklings need to put a final nail in this coffin of crap. The movies are 25 years old,what generation was this made for I'll never understand.I read the books in the 60's and bought the Silmarillion the day it came out 😮
I have seen Tolkien's fan made stage plays on youtube with almost zero budget that depict Sauron way better and much much closer to the source material than this abomination .
The absolute biggest tragedy about Rings of Power is, the squandered potential.
The amount they invested in this, imagine if they took Tolkien at least as seriously as Peter Jackson did?
Imagine getting multiple seasons, each season dealing with a different event from the 2nd age?
Imagine how awesome it COULD have been?
Now, we probably won’t see it in our lifetimes, because it’s going to be sometime before anyone revisits it after Amazon is done with it.
It’s sad.
Imagine if they planned their 5 seasons like this, with appropriate time jumps?
Season 1: Aftermath of the 1st Age, Founding of Grey Havens, Lindon, Numenor, Khazad-dûm, etc.
Season 2: Forging of the Rings
Season 3: Destruction of Eregion
Season 4: Fall of Numenor
Season 5: The Last Alliance of Elves & Men
It wouldn't work: 10 episodes each is not enough to tell a story. 25 episodes two-hours long would be necessary to flesh out everything... and since it would be set in the Jacksonverse, it would not be perfect.
@@rikhuravidansker well Peter Jacksons films aren't perfect as well, but is as good as it can get and it's enough to rewatch it a whole life.
@@theshadow7201 I think we cannot judge them until the Mithril Edition comes out, or more accurately after we have a Specialized Edition George Lucas style.
That would be extremely boring and slow for a tv series.. great for the few die hard fans but not for the majority of casual viewers.
"Give me the meat and give it to me raw" is what girlboss Galadriel really wanted to say to Halbrand in season 1.
I've been returning to Tolkien on and off for 30 years, and have probably read the Silmarilion at least 5 times.
I was aghast at what Amazon did to the Elvish characters, making them humans with stick-on ears. My only complaint about Jackson's first 3 films was the absence of the Grey Company of Rangers and Elladan/Elrohir - leaving out Tom Bombadil and the scouring of the Shire was necessary, and transferring Glorfindel's role in rescuing Frodo to to Arwen was sensible.
Good points rob..are you going to go see the new animated rings movie?
@Zimisacartoon not really into the idea but probably
I will always prefer the books, I just like books better, and I like the detail and pace and tone of the books better, but I was not disappointed in the films. They did a good job. I didn't when watch the Hobbit when I heard they made it into a trilogy. My buddy who was always watching all the new movies coming out was like "no no, this is all stuff that Tolkien wrote and meant to put in the book, but left out. His _own son_ added it back in". Sure, if that's what they told you on the promotional materials, you go with that. Thats not The Hobbit, and I don't believe it anyway. Maybe stuff loosely adapted from his notes and crammed into the movies to bloat them so they can make three times the profit. So Amazon isn't the first to ruin LOTR.
It's amazing, now the show is coming back, how MANY things were wrong in season 1. The stupid is all slowly coming back to me. I remembered Galadriel trying to swim from Valinor to Middle Earth. Then the Elves losing their immortality without mithril. Numenor trying to conquer Mordor with three ships. Villagers forgetting to bring food when evacuating their village. Numenorean wine being more explosive than nitroglycerine. The Numenorean Kings Men being worried the elves would tuk dur jerbs. The healer lady suddenly becoming leader of a village where no one likes or trusts her. Celebrimbor discovering what alloys are.
If you didn't nope-out after Meteor-Wizard, I fear for your soul. lol
Usually in shows I dislike I can find at least one thing that was ok. Not in this one. Everything's a dumpster fire.
@@frankvandorp2059 this show is built on contrivances and characters' nonsensical decisions. Disastrous writing.
And, notably, even if season one had filed off all the Tolkien serial numbers (names), it still would have been an inferior production. Awful not-hobbits, a 'mithril' spy plot that doesn't make a lick of sense, a seemingly untrained island-nation military who own (as far as we were shown) the only horses in the world, a 'Southlands' so-called kingdom comprising tiny villages but still remembering their royal line (where, please, was the capital?), oh, the absurdities are endless. Honestly, they can hardly do worse in the second season, even if we allow that they can ignore Tolkien's work entirely.
As JRRT wrote of the constructed language Novial: "…hideous -- "factory product" is written all over it, or rather, "made of spare parts" -- and it has no gleam of the individuality, coherence and beauty, which appear in the great natural idioms…" Or, in this case, which appear in the great legends.
@@TheOneRingcom Well, the orcs prosthetics and some wide VFX shots were OK.
"You don't put Tolkien's name on anything but the BEST" DAMN RIGHT‼💯
Celebrimbor is like a less fun and more depressed Mr Brown from Paddington
I am only ok with one Maia/Elf couple, and that's Melian/Thingol. Great couple, dated for hundreds of years, adopted mortal strays into the family .
Yeah. Should've mentioned that in the video!
@@TheOneRingcom You need to read the books first.Then you would get Tolkien's message. Spoilers: He would hate the show. But he also would hate people like you.
@@Meilock Yes, most people overreact to ROP: it is only an average show (and even then only if you give the second season the benefit of the doubt), but they act like Amazon and/or the actors ate a baby.
@@rikhuravidansker its not an average show though? The characters are written very badly. The dialogue tries too hard and fails. The costumes look cheap and glittery. Everything is bad, not just because it deviated from lore but really because its written very badly. I mean what the hell is "THeRe IS a TEmPesT in ME!" Like...what?
@@aurelian2668 "Average" does not mean "good," it just means "passing," as in C- - - (the bare minimum in Commonwealth countries, whereas Americans have D- - - as the minimum, because Americans are even stupider). Amazon, Time Warner, the Weinstein Company, MGM, WingNut Productions, and DreamWorks, did the bare minimum (remember, Amazon got the rights from all of these, these big businesses working on the Hobbit trilogy).
People can like what they want and i generally dont care but i take a hardline stance with tolkiens works. If anyone proclaims to be a tolkien fan and says they like this show they are an abject liar
That's like, your opinion man.
@@meta_haha well....yes?
I could say the same about the movies, if this is your stance on it… if you don’t like people changing tolkiens works, then you must REALLY hate the movies
@@EubyGamingRES There's changing to adapt a book to a film, and then there's the butchering going on in Rings of Power. There's no comparison at all between Jackson's Lord of the Rings, and the breathtakingly bad Rings of Power
Tolkien is timeless, updating his work “disrespects” all written fantasy from today and hundred years ago.
This show has about as much in common with Tolkien's work as the D&D movie. The only difference is one was actually watchable, and it wasn't the show.
Barrow-wigs? The Wig-King of Angmar?
I'm laughing so hard I think that I pulled something in my side!
It is amazing to me that discussions on another Tolkien site demonstrate how there are still many Tolkien fans who proclaim how much they love ROP despite all of its massive changes to lore etc.
They are not Tolkien fans. They are the I support-the-current-thing type of person. No depth, no thought, just sheep.
And, of course, there are the ones that want to garner the giant corporation's money. So, it's a soup of greed and ignorance.
@@gilbertobrandina9487 Exactly. Corey Olsen is Exhibit A. Knows enough lore that he should know better, he was willing to be critical of lore-breaking details in Jackson's movies, but coincidentally when this travesty comes out, he's incredibly forgiving of massive lore changes that PJ would never have dared to even think about. That's when you know people aren't arguing honestly, and something else is going on.
@@peteg475 You nailed it. I find that guy a major hack. And to think he gives lectures as if he was some kind of authority.
I just don't understand the cognitive dissonance between loving Tolkien's works and being all-in on something that changes what he wrote. Nick Groom, the author of "Tolkien in the 21st Century", is exactly the same. When we interviewed him last year, he told us his favorite character in ALL of Middle-earth was Tauriel! 😬
@@TheOneRingcom OMG! It takes a special kind of obtusity to take the time to learn an author's extensive and detailed lore and don't appretiate it. Why read it in first place, right?
"There is a tempest in me..."😂😅😂🤣😅🤪
Season 1 is the foundation for Season 2. With such an awful foundation, Season 2 will also fail.
4:15 that compost metaphor actually had me laughing out loud xD
Cringe of Power. Not looking forward to it. Am looking forward to the critics who rightly tear it apart with more intelligence and wit than Amazon writers.
Is it just that Bozo Bezos is so swimming in money that half a million dollars is just a casual fling? What about his son telling him not to f- it up? Does that level of investment not motivate someone to choose the writers and the showrunners as carefully as possible? And from the bit I have read they had a wealth of talent to choose from, who wanted to do it. I believe I heard that Peter Jackson had agreed with someone in the team to be a consultant, and then no one ever contacted him. Surely Bezos had the final decision...maybe he should have consulted his kid more!
I truly cannot stand the bad 80s hairdos all around. But why didn't A company like this do a massive survey to see what the fans wanted, because this type of IP has a generational fan base that automatically gets passed on
Arondir's hair. I mean.... who's his fricking barber!?
It's Dungeons and Tampons at dawn
I wish there was a steakhouse with a Lord of the Rings steak somewhere so I could say... give me the meat... and give it to me medium rare. 🥩
2500 years in five seasons could possibly work, if you do big time skips between seasons. But that would require actual planning and foresight.
agree on most of what you say but out of curiosity, where did you get the "only 30% who started finished it" from?
That figure was released by streaming services and widely reported in the media.
Member Berry-wights?
Nice :)
They can't learn either the right or wrong lessons from Season one, because they don't have the writing talent/outlook to fix the problem, and they don't have the rights to the actual lore material that could, in theory, fix the problem. They're stuck trampolining off the terrible stuff they already made, so there's really no fix, and no lessons. Everything they will do from here on out is pointless, and just throwing good money after bad.
SS1 has no feeling of Tolkien 's world .
No honor no glory no dignity.
Just annoying character try to mess things around.
And this.... ladies & gentleman ( sorry...no pronoun )
This is LOTR they said they want the following generations to remember.
They missed an opportunity just setting the show in the east (Rhun) about what happened there, the men of the east getting corrupted, what happened to the blue wizards, etc. They could have forced as much diversity in there as they wanted, and nobody would have batted an eyelid. Heck, you could have even had an exclusively black skinned elf race, like proto elves or something.. because we have never been to Rhun on screen and their culture could be whatever the fuck they want their agenda to be, not change what has already been established.
If I wanted badly written fan fiction, I would watch Fifty shades of Grey.
Don't worry. We will still live long enough to see a real adaptation.
How can season 2 be any different that season 1? They were filming it while season 1 was airing.
Note:
they gave Sindarin name to a Troll and a primordial fallen elf
a Quenya name to Pharazon's son
late 3rd age names to middle 2nd age proto-hobbit (when middle 3rd age hobbits have more archaic names - Blanco vs Nori Brandyfoot)
sooo lame🤦🏼
See, but they went BACK TO THE BOOK for those names!
@@TheOneRingcom The problem is they literally did, they just ignored all logic behind the names.
They cut many of the last names of Shire hobbits in two, randomly reshuffled them, and used them as last names for their Harfoots. So Bolger, Brandy-Buck and Proud-foot became Bolger-buck, Brandy-foot and Proud-fellow.
The leader was named "Burrows" even though these Harfoots don't live in burrows.
The main character is named "Elanor", even though that's a Sindarin name that Sam gave to his daughter, and it's a special name exactly because it's not a hobbit name. It's noteworthy because it reflects how Sam's life is completely different from all hobbits around him. So other hobbit girls should NOT be named Elanor for that to work.
It's almost a feat how much they got wrong here.
fanfic writers were move inventive about proto-hobbit names - they got names of trees and flowers. boys were given names for trees and girls for flowers :)
Actually Sauron feigned surrender so he could destroy Numenor from within
thank you
But hey, they gave Galadriel a braid crown. See? They followed the lore. Back to the books. Back to the books.
Fuck the rings of power... I would sacrifice my life just to prove the Amazon Rings of power that they are wrong
The start of the video is amazing. I was expecting to see this ridiculous cry everywhere lol
Only one Elf is known to have remarried Feanor’s Father. That is because Feanor’s mother put so much of her life into his birth and raising that she dies and never makes it to the Halls of Mandos. Galadriel knows her husband is either alive or in the Halls of Mandos awaiting reincarnation. Elves don’t remarry when one dies because thy know they will be reunited. So the most horrendous thing they could do is have them breed. For one thing He is a Maia not an Elf. Which is not unprecedented but considering she’s betrothed it wouldn’t happen any more that the other Don Lemon elf was sleeping with a common woman.
Johnathon, I'm curious. If a show were marketed as "inspired by the works of Tolkien,' what would your criteria for it be in terms of themes or mythological inspirations?
That's an interesting thought... If they made something that was "inspired by Tolkien", using places, events, even people in middle-earth that he didn't write about, that he didn't set out a framework for, I certainly wouldn't be as harsh. I mean, I'd still criticize the writing and the acting and the plotting, but I wouldn't be measuring right up against Tolkien's story.
Essentially it'd be glorified fan fiction.
So, yeah, I'd give it a lot more grace (in the same way I give a bit more leeway to something like Shadows of Mordor--though I still had problems with it... but it's excellence in execution was top notch).
The plot contrivances, bad acting, and bad storylines mean the show's a failure even ignoring the alleged links to Tolkien.
@@terrystewart1973 couldn't agree more
Reciprocal respect - easy to offer a fair reading to one who says either 'set in Tolkien's world' or 'a story using things Tolkien named and described' but hard to understand the exact commitment of one who claims both @@TheOneRingcom
@@TheOneRingcom All fantasy since Tolkien was inspired by him and the Lovecraft Circle... and 95% of post-Tolkien fantasy is bad. The work of George Lucas and Gene Roddenberry was also inspired by it, and 95% of both is bad.
I read the Hobbit (and watched the animated movie) so long ago now that I can't even remember when it happened. And I read the LOTR and the Silmarillion and the Unifinished Tales in high school (and watched the animated LOTR movie) long before the live actions films were even dreamed of. I love Tolkien's books and Middle-Earth itself. The fact that I haven't watched this series even though I know about it and could watch it at any time is a terrible sign. This should appeal directly to me, but it doesn''t. I doubt I will ever watch it. I know that i am nobody, but there's a lot of people like me who should be excited for this, but are just the opposite.
Not everything has to go by the source material. Even the Lord of the rings movies and Hobbit movies didn't follow the source material
There's a difference between changing some details but keeping most of the narrative beats of the source material, and making up a totally brand new thing that pilfers names and places but totally transforms the whole thing into fanfiction that JRRT wouldn't even recognize. Amazon has done the latter, not the former.
They only have rights to the appendices so my guess is there is no fleshing out of characters and stories.
I’m not in any way defending Amazon, what they are doing should be illegal and someone should be put to jail.
My stance is, if the don’t have the rights to all the stories, books then don’t bother
I don't get Amazon prime, but the previews and clips I saw, the interviews with the all gay/lesbian cast members who never read the books were enough for me to insure I'd never want to watch ROP. And the line that really got me was the guy in the town square ranting "the elves are gonna take your jobs ! ! " . . .
So I guess Galadriel "forgot" to tell Celebrimbor that the man who inspired him to make the elven rings was Sauron? Cause one would think that if Celebrimbor was told he'd be on the lookout for anyone wanting to make more "powerful rings".
I would think the 2-part Fall of Eregion will be a flashback showing that modern Eregion is a shell of it's former self, a la Minas Tirith.
How did Amazon think they could mess with the 2nd Age Lore this much? The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings are relatively Casual compared to the fans that know about the 1st and 2nd age. I tell people who don't know that The Similrian is the Middle Earth Bible. They could have picked a subject matter that Tolkien dose not cover much of, Like The blue wizards or the Vale of Dorwinian, Where lore inaccurates would have less of an impact. But they chose to cover the forging of the Rings of Power. A topic heavily covered in Tolkien's work. I don't understand why the main characters aren't Celebrimbor and Narvi. Have the focus on Celebrimbor's love of craftsmanship and how it led to blindly trusting Anotaur. You could add a layer of selflessness to his character. He didn't keep one of the 3 elven rings of power he made. He died facing off against Sauron. But no Amazon had to make Galadriel into a Karen, Celebrimbor into the oldest looking elf ever, and Numinorians look just flat unappealing.
They are putting Honda parts in a Lamborghini.
You can pretend to be interested in something, but you can´t pretend to be intelligent.
I love how Numenorians hate Elves in season 1 seeing their first king was an half Elf.... That is 101 comedy right there... Its like americans hating Washington for being white...wait... Huuuuh
I thought that Amazon would always struggle since they couldn't lift material from The Silmarrilion? Due to copyrights.
A lot of what you said is decisively Tolkien isn't necessarily 100% accurate. After all, Al-Pharazon usurping his cousin's throne is absolutely part of the text.
What a pathetic character they have made of Celebrimbor. He's useless and stupid
😭😭
I see a strong character deceived like in the lore by Sauron, showing strong emotions.
@@paddynkorn2109 you're seeing it all wrong. Celebrimbor was deceived by Annatar,ONCE.
Celebrimbor is being deceived twice in this show ,by the same guy,who just changed his hair and has the same face. And he's crying like a baby.
@@g.t.werber4476 You underestimate Sauron.
@@blletm6029 How so? If he was any smart he would change his face. He has that ability.
I know what you're going to say,that he mind tricks Celebrimbor so that he won't recognize him . Wasn't it easier to change his face(he's a shape shifter after all)?
This is just the incompetent writers . The deceiving part and making the rings was done in season 1. Sauron coming back is just contrived. The writers probably trying to fix the mess of season 1,but they're making it worse.
This guy probably never read the book
They're not fooling anyone who has eyes to see...
Plot what plot?
We live in an age where the word "Epic!" is invariably a term of approval. I cannot blame Amazon for creating something for that audience. The result does not interest me as a Tolkien fan, and season one was a deep disappointment even as generic-fantasy drama, full of absurd plotting, slipshod world-building, repeated failures to understand and portray time and distances, and few engaging characterizations. Fascinating like a train-wreck, but not bad enough to be funny.
When season 1 was released, I went and reread The hobbit, Lord of the rings and the Silmarillion, to celebrate Tolkien in not! watching the show.
Instead of watching season 2, I'm going to rewatch all the Peter Jackson films.
I agree, I had my problems when they were first released; especially Faramir, but over time the good elements have definitely outshown the bad, something I've been thinking even before Rings of power, or the start of the modern cultural dark age.
We are the Faithful, amazon are the Kings men, let Ar-Bezos send their fleet west to their own destruction, we'll keep faith with the elves, and the past, and honour the Valar and their creator; indeed both their creators, both Professor Tolkien, and; for those who choose to, Eru the one God as well.
The modern cultural dark age began centuries before: Tolkien thought the Matter of England was the last good thing England ever produced, and I agree with him.
Many yrs since I read the Silmarilion. Does Galadriel ever pick up the sword for war? I thought not but google did?
I find it funny that anyone thinks that the showrunners and actors have the mental capacity to learn anything. Let alone their own mistakes.
Because it’s a Frankenstein monster of a show
I’m just going to enjoy it for what it is
IMO even with having only 10% of rights to the materials about 2d Age someone willing is able to make interesting, briliant, and coherent show with all the changes he needs to add. But they did not want to make it interesting, coherent and briliant.
Tolkien Untangled started to “rewrite” the show using the stuff they had rights to and his version was much better and didn’t abuse the source material. He gave up because the show just went off the rails and there was no saving it.
@@IUsedToBeAnAdventurerLikeYou thanks for info :)
I think that the timeline compression could have worked if they'd done it in 10 year skips: 10 years after the rings are formed for Numenor to colonise middle earth before the Akallabeth, and 10 years for Arnor and Gondor to be formed. I think that this could serve the purpose of allowing normal humans to be part of the story (the second age being a tale building up to the last alliance of elves and men). The only non-dunedain humans are Theo and Bronwyn, and they're just so boring.
I wish I stayed in my slumber. There is no chance I'll put myself through another awful season of ROP who clearly do not respect Tolkien's Lore.
They could have had a winner - sticking with the story or at least close to the story. Instead they made a fan fiction CW activism show under the usual 'blame the fans if they don't like it' bs. On the bright side - it's been good for UA-cam folks.
Good moview. Check the game "The Rings of Powder" if you're on the Tolkien's side. After watching the Amazon production, we are very lost, so much so that one of the team members has not been found to this day..
Even moria look bad in this show you have one shitty cgi shot otherwise it's little space room with no life in it
The hall of moria looked majestic in Jackson movie whereas it's was abandoned for years
This Show is already dead since season 1. And all the Money that Amazons invests further is lost.
they had the money to do something spectacular from the getgo. but, as we all know. they chose not to. and we then chose not to watch.
Yeah, like silencing reviewers will magically improve their TV show. What they show is that they just want to trick someone to watch their garbage to increase some metrics that somehow justifies their poor product
You know what really sticks in the craw of the writers? Having to figure out how to write something heroic without giving credit to the "Men of the West".
Thanks!
Thanks! 🙏
Celebrimbor crying and not knowing about alloys. Its so dumb. How can a video game, Shadow of War/Mordor, depict him better than this show?
My thoughts exactly and that series played super loose with the lore but lord….
How can Celebrimbor crying be dumb. Showing emotions is not a weekness. Especially in the context of Tolkien. Critice guys, allrigt. But do it proper and not in this way.
@@paddynkorn2109 Him Balling like that is stupid and embarrassing. He is a leader type character, not a bitch.
@@paddynkorn2109 Its cringe and embarrassing. He is a leader type character, not weak and balling in times of distress.
He thought alloys diluted properties.
I weep for the travesty this clownshow of a series has become. To think of what might have been if someone who actually respected the source material had been given the reins.
Wanna yell at Amazon "Keep Tolkien's name(s) out of your f**ing mouth!"
Amazon: The fans are revolting.
ROP directors: Finally, something we agree on.
Well, the fandom is toxic, but the first season would be mediocre if we didn't give the benefit of the doubt for the second.
It is disappointing that so much money was spent to so little effect.
SO we are going the NU-TREK route???
Star Trek was always 95% bad, although 5% of it is good.
We're about to see again what happens when shit hits the fandom
Reading books again ... Just enjoying them before someone bans them one day!
In this world we can see that today everything is for sale - reputation, fame, intelect, talent, sexuality, intimacy, teachers, students, countries, lands, nature's beauty, art, families, ideals, societies, even religions. Well, I want to tell you smt. Theres still one thing not for sale.
Its a fan's soul.
This is so depressing.
We do not have to watch it. I will not. I may watch one or the other review. They want to make Sauron a conflicted goody who just would like to be good. But Galadriel drags him back into the darkness. I do not want Tatooine Stoors etc. Its just so bad writing.
They are actually trying to make Sauron a combination of the League of Shadows and the Heath Ledger Joker (I would think the second Doomsday as well, which is the Doomsday seen in "Dawn of Justice"), which would make him an ideological Pennywise - what they SHOULD do is make him like the Watchers in the Bible, since he is a fallen angel.
"Rings of Prime" says European Lore. Clearly Amazon is operating without any sort of "Tolkien Scholar" involved in the writing.
If u want, you can react to Little Platoons 2 essays about this crap. It's 500x more entertaining and funny.
Would've been better to have Zack Snyder write a series without the Tolkien trademark.
They're already rowing, they couldn't change anything because everything was already written... but next season, then yeah, just watch season 2 and then season 3 will be the way you wanted and if not, yes, season 4 is coming , just look at the crap
God just listening to how much garbage it is is ruining my evening. And I just saw a post by Bear McCreary (who is actually awesome) about this piece of crap and I just want to scream.
Where did he post?
@@MeliceNix think it was Facebook, not sure
I think he just likes making music.
I will never forgive them for losing Joseph Mawle as Adar, who was literally the only shining light of the show.
The new Adar looks overcooked with makeup, that just ain't it. The new actor is fine, I guess, but Joseph portrayed brilliance.
And brilliance knows when it needs to high tail it out of there.
Can't wait to watch season 2 🚀
I completely agree with you. I can’t add anything to it, and I can’t argue against it. All I can say is that I’m a huge Middle-earth fan who has watched the movies countless times, but I’ve never read the books. Personally, I’m okay with watching anything related to topics I enjoy, including this show, no matter how bad it might be. As long as I get to see what I want, and in this case, that’s Sauron. And honestly, I think they’re doing an okay job with him. If the trailers are anything to go by, season 2 should be a bit better than season 1. But who knows, maybe they haven’t learned anything.
You really need to read the books and just soak them in, in all their glory. Your mind will be blown to see how far from Tolkien's work that even Peter Jackson strayed in his adaptation of The Lord of the Rings, let alone his The Hobbit movies (they were flat-out bad, due to excessive studio interference), and especially the godawful mess that is The Rings of Power.
Read and marvel!
@@grossepointemichigan I’ll see if I can purchase them soon! If I buy them, I want to get them in all their glory ;)
#TheWigsOfPower
Of course they learned the wrong lessons. Of course!