Love this guy's videos. Extremely helpful. One slight error Kelly makes on this video is that he says that a 200 grain head is "200 grains per foot". Of course, that should be 200 grains for the first 30 feet of the line, etc. You want to experience the friendliest, most helpful fly shop owner in America? Visit the Slide Inn. We did a few weeks ago and I had a blast. Thanks Kelly.
Mr Galloup I really appreciate your videos, mainly due to the honesty and realness. So many fly fishermen promote and buy into the BS newly established "rules" of fly fishing about gear and techniques. Grateful for those like yourself who are keeping it real and educational.
Suggestion for a tutorial might be something on river, like a tuck cast. Slightly overpowered on forward stroke, low on back cast, higher on forward cast, giving streamer fly or nymph added amount of 'slack line', useful for getting fly down deeper. Don't know how something such as a tuck cast, might fit into Mr Galloup's way of doing his streamer fishing. He did pass comment though in broadcast on leader construction for larger articulated streamer pattern fishing, that leader in his technique of streamer fishing isn't used to 'turn over' the fly for sake of presentation. The idea of power transfer between the fly line and leader doesn't come into equation, as much as it might in dry fly casting say, or in salmon leader construction too, or even something like 'French style' nymphing, in Europe, where lengthy manufactured tapered leaders are sworn by.
What tends to happen, is that with the shorter heads, the loop of cast gets larger. As soon as loop of cast enlarges and wind gets a hold of the cast while in flight, it spells trouble. With the longer heads, on fly lines, the loop of cast can be made a lot smaller, and this prevents wind getting a hold so much of fly line in its flight, and the tighter, narrower loop in the cast, can 'punch' stronger against head winds too. Shorter heads, evolved in rivers where back casting might have been a problem (and also, where deep wading might have been needed), but in those tightly enclosed rivers, gorges, forested banks etc wind isn't always the issue it can be on more exposed rivers.
Love that Brook's Method. I'll be streamer fish with a sinking line and then I find a deep run that's too fast for a streamer retrieve. So I just nip off the streamer, tie a big weighted stonefly on, and high stick that bad boy right through. Works like a charm.
One can imagine, that with thirty feet of 200 grain or 250 grain line outside the top ring of the fly rod, that that is still a considerable amount of weight of fly line outside the rod, that can be used to flex and rod in the cast, and using those narrower loops in the cast, which can help to combat against the 'cross' winds, or the 'head' winds. I might have though first, looking at Mr Galloup's streamer patterns, five inches length and so on, that Pike/Musky type lines on Pike/Musky type rods might be the preference. It's surprising to hear him describe the use of the longer headed fly lines though, and how that all feeds into his strategy with regards to the 'retrieve' of the streamer pattern fly, over the fifteen to twenty yards - and as explained often in broadcasts - that these streamer patterns are unweighted patterns, shorter style of leaders and using sinking fly line to draw the streamer fly patterns down to the correct depth zone to fish.
Now that I do think of it though, Guideline in Norway have taken their 'triple density' system, which they use in salmon lines now (a further development upon an earlier 'dual density' concept, which they had for longer), and they have applied triple density approach to the Pike Musky fly line. What it does, is in addition to the lines that Guideline use for floating Pike Musky, or intermediate work down to two feet in depth, they are now offering a line in triple density, which works down to the four to five feet in depth too. I do understand that Mr Galloup is designing his patterns to be taken by trout coming from below, upwards to attack a streamer pattern. However, it isn't clear as yet from broadcasts, exactly which depth zones of water are being aimed at, in retrieves.
That sweet depth where the trout hold will always be where the water slows as it nears the bottom. If the bottom has cobbles, it would be just above the level of the rocks. Of course the fish will move higher when the fly moves in a way to trigger the strike. Predators want an easy meal; they don't want to chase something that moves like it is healthy and fast.
Hi Kelly, has anyone tried using a bass popper with a small weight a couple feet up line, maybe a micro swivel Carolina style, to keep the popper under water when retrieving and then a pause that lets the popper float slowly back up like a wounded bait fish?
OPST will throw bigger streamers farther than any of the lines Kelly is mentioning. It will perform single hand skagit casts with such ease while these longer head sinking lines Kelly is talking about will not. The only advantage Kelly's lines have is the better feel between the rod tip and the fly since you are adding a sink tip or a floating tip to the OPST shooting head hence creating break points in the line ans little slower reaction and another advantage is you can strip the line in further because there are no loop to loop connections. Try the new OPST SMOOTH intergrated line you will not be disappointed.
KG - when using these 30 ft heads, how do you know where the sweet spot is on the head so know when you have the right amount of line out to load the rod and shoot the line utilizing a single Belgium style casting stroke.
Kelly what line would you suggest for wade fishing streamers moderate to fast water 2-5 feet? Im orginally from Michigan and love your lines for big streamers from the boat but up in Alaska im stuck wade fishing. I used floating lines and weighted flies like dolly lamas and leeches last year but want to start incorporating the bigger bugs were used to in MI.
@@TheSlideinn ill be fishing a sage xp 9”6 6 wt for dollys and cutties and got my favorite set up the sage method 8 wt with the shovelhead 330 for silvers!
Kelly had a video where he described a line he designed he sent off - and the guy thought he had it back to front - was a useful vide - anyone got the link ?
This video is older, but I hope you still do monitor comments. I bought the latest Fly Fish TV series in order to learn more about fishing streamers while wading but you didn't seem to talk much about the gear. Rods, lines, and the like. I'm in the southern Appalachians, and often wading is the only option. Do you recommend a heavy floating WF line with a long head or something like your streamer max? I'm sure you've visited, but typical buckets are around five feet, and there are a lot of runs that are one foot depth. What sort of line do you recommend?
I would run either a floating line or if you wanted to go with a sinking line I would run a Streamer Max Long 200grn. For those 5 foot holes a sinking line will definitely help out, in the skinnier stuff it makes it interesting for a little bit until you figure out the retrieve. I am fishing a 250grn on the Madison which has an average depth of about 3 feet. That being said I'll still run that in 6 inches of water, you just have to learn to manage your line when you are swimming it that shallow.
What he is forgetting to mention here is that you could perform single hand skagit casts with a shorter heavier head and sink tips while you can't do that with his 30' and above lines. Especially if the sink rate is higher and higher grainage. Kelly is fishing these open waters with no obstacles behind him or he's on a boat chucking streamers. I would love to see him cast the lines he's mentioning with trees or high banks right behind him. Impossible. If you are looking for an all around streamer set up go with OPST. You can cover much more water swinging streamers with OPST in tight quarters than the lines he is mentioning.
Just started fishing this system a few months ago, its awesome. I fish tight spots throwing heavy streamers in pockets behind logs, surrounded by trees on skinny water here in MI. I'm fishing spots not possible with conventional lines, and its paying off. I move big fish almost ever time I go out. Got my first 20 plus a few weeks ago.
How long of mono or fluro leader do you use ? Im swinging big bugs for halibut and wondering how long to run off my sinking line out to my fly ......thanks
Thanks for the tips ....I tried out a sinking 7 wt. line with your leader and tippet lengths and landed 6 halibut and 5 bass today out in my back yard lagoon swinging streamers in the tide flows .....it works !
Jason- We use them for customers if they only have a floating line, but they are extremely useful if you are swinging streamers rather than actively moving them. The big downside is that they will hinge a little more on the cast than a standard sinking line and will not carry your flies as easily.
Thanks, sinking leaders are my only option right now for my rods good for large streamers but I'm concerned the sink leader has the same problem you described of sink-tips that bugs chase the floating line up out of eat-range. So I feel I need to cast upstream for a slack-sink before a retrieve but I still have little confidence that my bug spends much time in ideal depth.
Jason, I feel like they are really more designed for wet fly swinging than active retreive streamers fishing, there simply is not enough to the sinking portion of the leader to do much, Maybe with small flies but the bigger flies there just is not enough there. You will probably have to add weight to the head of the fly (tungsten bead on the tippet ) may get it down a touch but hard to beat the sinking line. KG
know of any full sinking skagit lines? I like my OPST Commando for 3wt and I think it would shine with casting 6wt but neither OPST nor Rio makes a sinking head, just sink tips. The longest I could get is 12' MOW sink tip.
Guideline in Sweden do have various Pike/Musky lines that have dual densities. Their salmon lines have triple densities, and are sort of the same concept, but applied to the bigger tackle, weights of line. Last time that I looked at Guideline Pike fly lines, I know that they're a lot like the short, very exaggerated tapering like the skagit head concept, except as you explained, with the Guideline lines you're moving away from an all-floating head, and getting into different densities. The portion at the rear of the triple density or dual density guideline lines, is floating or intermediate. Just so that you have a big easier job of handling the line close to bank or both. The middle bit is heavier, and portion near the fly is heaviest sinking. Hence, triple density.
I fish a lot of lakes for bass with conventional tackle but would like to try to fish them on a fly also. The vast majority of my fishing is from top down to 10-15 feet, what is the best was to target those deeper fish or is it possible?
Jordan, depends what you want to do. If you want to jig at 10 feet (which is as deep as I like to go with fly gear) then you can floating line it and jig pretty well. If you want to run bait fish imitations then you are looking at a sinking line that will carry the fly and sink it. I really am not a big fan of deep fishing with a fly, did it most of my life on Lake Michigan and pretty much gave up on it after 6 foot. That being said it can be done, just a touch to much wait time for me to get the fly down and then I was fighting fish with a long sinking line and it was just not as much fun for me. I switched back to gear when I went deeper than 6 feet. I would jig fish to 10 feet with a floating line but that is as deep as I would go. thanks for watching, Kelly
Doesn't look like Kelly's lines are in the current lineup from SA. I have been fishing a type V sinking line for 20 years on my 5wt and am now getting an 8 weight for Bass fishing. I usually use a leech pattern but am considering getting into some streamers. I had a humbling experience with some Stripers this week and am upgrading so I don't break another fly rod. You guys have any opinions on the SA Sonar Titan 3/5/7 line. Is it going to sink a lot faster than the stuff I have been using up til now? I would like something that is easier to cast if that is possible. The frequency full sinking line from SA looks like it is pretty much the same as what I have already.
gcmillar I believe Kelly started working with AirFlo a couple years ago. They label their Streamer Max line as the Kelly Galloup Streamer Max. Comes in 200, 250 and 300 grain flavors.
Love this guy's videos. Extremely helpful. One slight error Kelly makes on this video is that he says that a 200 grain head is "200 grains per foot". Of course, that should be 200 grains for the first 30 feet of the line, etc.
You want to experience the friendliest, most helpful fly shop owner in America? Visit the Slide Inn. We did a few weeks ago and I had a blast. Thanks Kelly.
Mr Galloup I really appreciate your videos, mainly due to the honesty and realness. So many fly fishermen promote and buy into the BS newly established "rules" of fly fishing about gear and techniques. Grateful for those like yourself who are keeping it real and educational.
Suggestion for a tutorial might be something on river, like a tuck cast. Slightly overpowered on forward stroke, low on back cast, higher on forward cast, giving streamer fly or nymph added amount of 'slack line', useful for getting fly down deeper. Don't know how something such as a tuck cast, might fit into Mr Galloup's way of doing his streamer fishing. He did pass comment though in broadcast on leader construction for larger articulated streamer pattern fishing, that leader in his technique of streamer fishing isn't used to 'turn over' the fly for sake of presentation. The idea of power transfer between the fly line and leader doesn't come into equation, as much as it might in dry fly casting say, or in salmon leader construction too, or even something like 'French style' nymphing, in Europe, where lengthy manufactured tapered leaders are sworn by.
What tends to happen, is that with the shorter heads, the loop of cast gets larger. As soon as loop of cast enlarges and wind gets a hold of the cast while in flight, it spells trouble. With the longer heads, on fly lines, the loop of cast can be made a lot smaller, and this prevents wind getting a hold so much of fly line in its flight, and the tighter, narrower loop in the cast, can 'punch' stronger against head winds too. Shorter heads, evolved in rivers where back casting might have been a problem (and also, where deep wading might have been needed), but in those tightly enclosed rivers, gorges, forested banks etc wind isn't always the issue it can be on more exposed rivers.
Love that Brook's Method. I'll be streamer fish with a sinking line and then I find a deep run that's too fast for a streamer retrieve. So I just nip off the streamer, tie a big weighted stonefly on, and high stick that bad boy right through. Works like a charm.
One can imagine, that with thirty feet of 200 grain or 250 grain line outside the top ring of the fly rod, that that is still a considerable amount of weight of fly line outside the rod, that can be used to flex and rod in the cast, and using those narrower loops in the cast, which can help to combat against the 'cross' winds, or the 'head' winds. I might have though first, looking at Mr Galloup's streamer patterns, five inches length and so on, that Pike/Musky type lines on Pike/Musky type rods might be the preference. It's surprising to hear him describe the use of the longer headed fly lines though, and how that all feeds into his strategy with regards to the 'retrieve' of the streamer pattern fly, over the fifteen to twenty yards - and as explained often in broadcasts - that these streamer patterns are unweighted patterns, shorter style of leaders and using sinking fly line to draw the streamer fly patterns down to the correct depth zone to fish.
Question ! What’s the sink rate on your shovel head and streamer Max long lines you did with Airflo?
Now that I do think of it though, Guideline in Norway have taken their 'triple density' system, which they use in salmon lines now (a further development upon an earlier 'dual density' concept, which they had for longer), and they have applied triple density approach to the Pike Musky fly line. What it does, is in addition to the lines that Guideline use for floating Pike Musky, or intermediate work down to two feet in depth, they are now offering a line in triple density, which works down to the four to five feet in depth too. I do understand that Mr Galloup is designing his patterns to be taken by trout coming from below, upwards to attack a streamer pattern. However, it isn't clear as yet from broadcasts, exactly which depth zones of water are being aimed at, in retrieves.
That sweet depth where the trout hold will always be where the water slows as it nears the bottom. If the bottom has cobbles, it would be just above the level of the rocks. Of course the fish will move higher when the fly moves in a way to trigger the strike. Predators want an easy meal; they don't want to chase something that moves like it is healthy and fast.
Hi Kelly, has anyone tried using a bass popper with a small weight a couple feet up line, maybe a micro swivel Carolina style, to keep the popper under water when retrieving and then a pause that lets the popper float slowly back up like a wounded bait fish?
What line should I use for salt water fishing in the surf or from a kayak in waters off Montauk NY
Thank you very much Kelly 😀
Any thoughts about the OPST heads for larger streamer tactics?
OPST will throw bigger streamers farther than any of the lines Kelly is mentioning. It will perform single hand skagit casts with such ease while these longer head sinking lines Kelly is talking about will not. The only advantage Kelly's lines have is the better feel between the rod tip and the fly since you are adding a sink tip or a floating tip to the OPST shooting head hence creating break points in the line ans little slower reaction and another advantage is you can strip the line in further because there are no loop to loop connections. Try the new OPST SMOOTH intergrated line you will not be disappointed.
Just do a weld ..
KG - when using these 30 ft heads, how do you know where the sweet spot is on the head so know when you have the right amount of line out to load the rod and shoot the line utilizing a single Belgium style casting stroke.
Mark it with black pen.
Great info as always , thanks for posting
do u need to add any weight to a sinking line if your fishing beadhead nymphs?
Kelly what line would you suggest for wade fishing streamers moderate to fast water 2-5 feet? Im orginally from Michigan and love your lines for big streamers from the boat but up in Alaska im stuck wade fishing. I used floating lines and weighted flies like dolly lamas and leeches last year but want to start incorporating the bigger bugs were used to in MI.
Donovan, depending on the rod, either a 200 or 250 long Airflo. Hope AK is treating you well. KG
@@TheSlideinn ill be fishing a sage xp 9”6 6 wt for dollys and cutties and got my favorite set up the sage method 8 wt with the shovelhead 330 for silvers!
Kelly - what would be your go-to sink tip on the upper Madison year round? Shovelhead the way to go? Thanks...Eric.
200 streamer max long is my favorite for the Upper Madison... I usually use the shovel head on big water
@@TheSlideinn Appreciate it Kelly - Thanks.
Kelly had a video where he described a line he designed he sent off - and the guy thought he had it back to front - was a useful vide - anyone got the link ?
This video is older, but I hope you still do monitor comments. I bought the latest Fly Fish TV series in order to learn more about fishing streamers while wading but you didn't seem to talk much about the gear. Rods, lines, and the like. I'm in the southern Appalachians, and often wading is the only option. Do you recommend a heavy floating WF line with a long head or something like your streamer max? I'm sure you've visited, but typical buckets are around five feet, and there are a lot of runs that are one foot depth. What sort of line do you recommend?
I would run either a floating line or if you wanted to go with a sinking line I would run a Streamer Max Long 200grn. For those 5 foot holes a sinking line will definitely help out, in the skinnier stuff it makes it interesting for a little bit until you figure out the retrieve. I am fishing a 250grn on the Madison which has an average depth of about 3 feet. That being said I'll still run that in 6 inches of water, you just have to learn to manage your line when you are swimming it that shallow.
No better person to explain!
What he is forgetting to mention here is that you could perform single hand skagit casts with a shorter heavier head and sink tips while you can't do that with his 30' and above lines. Especially if the sink rate is higher and higher grainage. Kelly is fishing these open waters with no obstacles behind him or he's on a boat chucking streamers. I would love to see him cast the lines he's mentioning with trees or high banks right behind him. Impossible. If you are looking for an all around streamer set up go with OPST. You can cover much more water swinging streamers with OPST in tight quarters than the lines he is mentioning.
Just started fishing this system a few months ago, its awesome. I fish tight spots throwing heavy streamers in pockets behind logs, surrounded by trees on skinny water here in MI. I'm fishing spots not possible with conventional lines, and its paying off. I move big fish almost ever time I go out. Got my first 20 plus a few weeks ago.
OPST is a game changer!! turned my switch rod into a sports car!!. they ROCK!!
So is a sinking tip the same as sinking leader?
How long of mono or fluro leader do you use ? Im swinging big bugs for halibut and wondering how long to run off my sinking line out to my fly ......thanks
SB, usually I use a 3 to 4 foot leader total length, 12 inches of 20lb butt and 18 to 36 inches of 12 lb tippet, thanks for watching. KG
Thanks for the tips ....I tried out a sinking 7 wt. line with your leader and tippet lengths and landed 6 halibut and 5 bass today out in my back yard lagoon swinging streamers in the tide flows .....it works !
in socal??
No the line will sink what ever fly you have,.KG
+TheSlideinn
what's your opinion of sinking leaders on floating lines
Jason-
We use them for customers if they only have a floating line, but they are extremely useful if you are swinging streamers rather than actively moving them. The big downside is that they will hinge a little more on the cast than a standard sinking line and will not carry your flies as easily.
Thanks, sinking leaders are my only option right now for my rods good for large streamers but I'm concerned the sink leader has the same problem you described of sink-tips that bugs chase the floating line up out of eat-range. So I feel I need to cast upstream for a slack-sink before a retrieve but I still have little confidence that my bug spends much time in ideal depth.
Jason, I feel like they are really more designed for wet fly swinging than active retreive streamers fishing, there simply is not enough to the sinking portion of the leader to do much, Maybe with small flies but the bigger flies there just is not enough there. You will probably have to add weight to the head of the fly (tungsten bead on the tippet ) may get it down a touch but hard to beat the sinking line. KG
know of any full sinking skagit lines? I like my OPST Commando for 3wt and I think it would shine with casting 6wt but neither OPST nor Rio makes a sinking head, just sink tips. The longest I could get is 12' MOW sink tip.
Guideline in Sweden do have various Pike/Musky lines that have dual densities. Their salmon lines have triple densities, and are sort of the same concept, but applied to the bigger tackle, weights of line. Last time that I looked at Guideline Pike fly lines, I know that they're a lot like the short, very exaggerated tapering like the skagit head concept, except as you explained, with the Guideline lines you're moving away from an all-floating head, and getting into different densities. The portion at the rear of the triple density or dual density guideline lines, is floating or intermediate. Just so that you have a big easier job of handling the line close to bank or both. The middle bit is heavier, and portion near the fly is heaviest sinking. Hence, triple density.
Damn... so knowledgeable. Awesome
I fish a lot of lakes for bass with conventional tackle but would like to try to fish them on a fly also. The vast majority of my fishing is from top down to 10-15 feet, what is the best was to target those deeper fish or is it possible?
Jordan, depends what you want to do. If you want to jig at 10 feet (which is as deep as I like to go with fly gear) then you can floating line it and jig pretty well. If you want to run bait fish imitations then you are looking at a sinking line that will carry the fly and sink it. I really am not a big fan of deep fishing with a fly, did it most of my life on Lake Michigan and pretty much gave up on it after 6 foot. That being said it can be done, just a touch to much wait time for me to get the fly down and then I was fighting fish with a long sinking line and it was just not as much fun for me. I switched back to gear when I went deeper than 6 feet. I would jig fish to 10 feet with a floating line but that is as deep as I would go. thanks for watching, Kelly
Thanks for the reply and the videos, they really do help a lot.
what sort of line set-up would you recommend for LM in the fall from shore? Will be going for shallow browns and lake trout. Thank ye xoxo.
200 grains per ft ? are you saying a 30 ft head weighs 6000 Grns? (200 x 30 = 6000) that's nearly a pound . I don't think that's right .
Blue, no I misspoke meant to say they line is 200 grains, not sure what the per foot thing was about but that would be like a 900 weight line, my bad.
Doesn't look like Kelly's lines are in the current lineup from SA. I have been fishing a type V sinking line for 20 years on my 5wt and am now getting an 8 weight for Bass fishing. I usually use a leech pattern but am considering getting into some streamers. I had a humbling experience with some Stripers this week and am upgrading so I don't break another fly rod. You guys have any opinions on the SA Sonar Titan 3/5/7 line. Is it going to sink a lot faster than the stuff I have been using up til now? I would like something that is easier to cast if that is possible. The frequency full sinking line from SA looks like it is pretty much the same as what I have already.
gcmillar I believe Kelly started working with AirFlo a couple years ago. They label their Streamer Max line as the Kelly Galloup Streamer Max. Comes in 200, 250 and 300 grain flavors.
Tying sinking leader to fly li e
4:51 You said 250 grain/feet ?????? Did you mean the whole line?
Scientific Anglers grain weights are for the first 30 feet.
The head.