Is Adam a Myth? | Creation.Live Podcast: Episode 12
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- Опубліковано 27 кві 2023
- Was the Adam of the Bible a real person? Was he just an analogy or a myth? Why does it matter?
Hosts Trey and Michael and ICR scientists Dr. Brian Thomas and Dr. Jeff Tomkins examine these questions and more as they emphasize how crucial this topic really is.
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1 Corinthians 15; 45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit." Without the first Adam, the last Adam "Jesus" does not have the weight of importance. It's so important to restore the basic truths of the Gospel message. Thank you for sharing!
Dr. Thomson, I did shed my intellectual lazyness and dug in 25 years ago and have not been disappointed in God's word ever since, (it has emboldened my faith). When you take the observations and the data at face value, (without the evolutionary rescue storytelling) it is obvious the bible is the true history of the world and explains all we see and experience, so accurately. may God bless your efforts for His sake.
Just read your comment about ditching intellectual laziness. Totally agree and want to amplify your point about God's word being so accurate, it's awesome and humbling if you invest a bit of time and effort.
@@bootycalled2780 Aww, I picture your blissful life sucking on the teat of consensus, bedazzled by science and its manipulated biased slant used to trick the masses into believing everything comes from nothing and complexity does not require intelligent agency, hmmm, doesn't observation play a big role in science? I seem to observe every single day that purposeful complexly ordered information always emanates from a mind, like your attempt at wit, did it require a mind to compose and type that or do you propose it just popped into existence like your entire paradigm. Complexity in this realm requires a mind, danmurphy7429 believes that complex life requires a designer, you on the other hand think the opposite of observation, which is not science.
@@bootycalled2780snarky potshots rather than well-thought out discussion is the epitome of intellectual laziness.
@@bootycalled2780 So says the one whose religion can no longer tell the difference between men and women.
@@bootycalled2780 Is this the part where you tell me biology teaches that men can be women and vice versa. Sorry lady, there is no biologist in the world willing to convert to your nonsense. Apparently neither does the U.S. govt since the men parading around as if they aren't men still have to register for selective service. Let me guess, you don't know what that is? Too much time wasting away on tick tok?
My personal search started some 50 odd years ago when presented with humanistic thinking in biology. It just never made sense to me. Growing up in a Christian church I heard Bible stories from the time I could speak. So talking about a world without God, just made no sense to me at all. The Lord himself came to me, in a very real direct communication to choose life. Long before I ever experienced baptism in the spirit or any concept of giving my life to Christ, I did.
Thank you, Dr. Brian Thomas and Dr. Jeff Tompkins for presenting your knowledge in clear and concise language. The calmness with which you speak demonstrates confidence in your research. Those who try to refute this information will usually present their thoughts with a huge dose of mockery towards creationists. I think their behavior simply reveals their doubts. If they were so confident in their research they would be able to present their findings without verbally attacking all of you. Thanks again for this episode.
I just love the entire conference. Thanks for making it so accessible.
Dr. Nathaniel Jeanson from Answers in Genesis also shows through Genetics that what Dr. Thomson has described is so.
Jeanson does no real research, he says what Ken Ham tells him to say under contract.
@@captivedesk3168 and your scholarly critique of 'Traced' appeared in what journal? We are all dying to read it...
@@theHentySkeptic Jeanson can wipe his tears and unblock me if he wants to chat again. I am happy to shut down his claims as he found out when he engaged with me, till he threw the proverbial game board in the air and stomped away. Later after he blocked me super genius posted a whiny responsecto me I couldnt see cuz he is so smart. Someone else screen shot for me. Hillarious how thin skinned he is against any critique and why he prefers his ken ham cubicle to hide away in. I have seen him engage in one talk with a biologist and he cried about that one in a video with ken ham as his claims are all bad. His bubble bursts outside of AIG s echo chamber.
You guys are great, and it blesses me tremendously. keep it up
This talk was so informative! Thank you for what you're doing 😊
fascinating podcast. loved it, thanks for sharing ❤
Fantastic episode! Keep up the great content here and in short form. Just shared out with my family, friends, and church body.
Thanks for sharing! We appreciate the support.
I wish to thank you for sharing this awesome Podcast #12 video with me .
I really want ICR to tackle Gobekli Tepe and the similar sites in that region.
This was an amazing podcast! thanks Brothers! God Bless!
Look up Hebrew Golem spell
Really good!! Sent to some friends!
I am impressed with how curated your discussion is. I hope and pray that the subject and presentation have weeded out biases and cultural clouds which will turn off a wider audience.
As far as why people are accepting the no literal Adam storyline I believe it has to do with intellectual bullying in a top down and lateral way placing people in a state of resignation and fear to go there anymore. So sad.
I had no idea major textbook writers for seminaries were ALL convinced there is no literal Adam. The names and ages and events in Genesis are so specific
Thank you, gentlemen, for all you do. Praise God for the evidence he has given us to believe. Like faith this is a gift from God so many things we have here to be thankful for so many things that point to a creator, a loving God.
I found your channel a few weeks ago. Im watching them over and over again to learn and remember.
Acts 22:1 KJV
"Men, brethren, and fathers, hear ye my defence which I make now unto you."
If I am being persecuted for believing in God and believing in creation, then I'm doing something right! I have been persecuted for these beliefs when i was in college, and yeah it sucks, but its my concience, my eternal soul, and vindication that I am on the right path.
Absolutely love these.
So about 15 years ago, after having similar conversations about the trustworthyness of the bible, and the age old arguement of "was it translated right", i realized that if I really was a christian, part of that was believing that the bible truly is the devine word of God and i had to believe it as a whole, not cherry pick the parts that I didnt want to believe. I believe in God the Father, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, and the Holy God-breathed Word of God!
Amen 🙏 to that !
This channel is the real gold🚀🚀 strange it has such a small following 36k is a joke for you guys. Gotta be 36 mil
Well it won't be that many because a literal interpretation of the bible has long been abandoned by most of the rest of Christianity. It's mainly a problem in America and Turkey where people with political motivation seem to want to deprive people of a rational education.
Love from the UK xx
Fantastic!!!
It's because the seminaries are teaching the secular thinking
Thank you Dr Thomas and Dr Jeff tompkins, you guys are real and I Love it. Thanks, Thank you
If it causes one to disbelieve then it is a gospel issue. As you said, if there’s no fall then there is nothing to be saved from
Exactly. No explanation for evil, suffering, & death.
But then “deep time” can be accepted because ppl don’t perceive the dissonance.
Chipping away of Genesis…
Spiritualization of Revelation…
Set up for end times.
God created Evil, suffering, and death. You know. the guy who loves you!
The proof of this is that God created The Evil Serpent and placed him in the Garden.
So Evil EXISTED way before Adam's Fall.
And then God punished the Serpent for acting exactly in the way that God created him to perform.
What a hypocrite!
@@user-xp4fm2st8u you show great lack in understanding the scriptures. God didn’t create those things. Suffering and death are not physical things that can be created. He allowed them to happen because of our rebellion against Him. It shows our need for God. We by ourselves have no control over what happens to us. We can only control how we respond to those situations. We are supposed to realize the folly of our weaknesses and turn to God for help and salvation.
@krakoosh1 And you show a great lack of logic!
The Evil Serpent was in the Garden BEFORE Adam's Fall.
Only God could have created him, and He knew exactly how the Serpent would behave.
Where is the source information for this claim? 13:14 and 24:28 I would like to see that. Why are their no source links? There are a lot of extraordinary claims in this video. Yet no links to the source information. That's very suspicious..
However with all things considered, I think this is my favorite set of videos. This group is a breath of fresh air. But it really needs more physical links so we can click and verify. to truly make its scientific all your sources need to be cited, and displayed to the public with links. Great work so far, loving it.
there is no sources because they dont want anyone to actually examine them... They are bogus of course.
In the greeting of Paul’s epistle to the Romans, in chapter 1 verse 1, Paul says, “set apart for the gospel of God.”
Further down in verse 13 Paul says, “I have often intended to come to you (but this far have been prevented)…So I am eager to preach the gospel to you who are also in Rome.”
Based off of the “greeting” and “longing to go to Rome” section titles, the ENTIRE epistle is the gospel preached by pen and papyrus to the Romans.
If someone has trouble preaching or understanding the gospel of Jesus Christ, you could use just the epistle to the Romans BY ITSELF.
Where can we get more info on the exon research?
Thank you 🙏❤
Very cool
Hey, this is off topic, but what’s the explanation for the extreme dating of ice cores we hear about? Is there a pod-cast that covered this ?
The Bible geography, cultures, nations, languages and persons match up so well with what is observed, when things are reported honestly
Right at the outset, it’s just shocking that none of the four seminary theories were based upon a literal Adam.
Along the same line of reasoning, the law of Moses 'Thou shall Not Kill' must mean Not just humans, but 'Any living being' this is in harmony with God giving Adam and Eve and the animals only vegetarian food.
Men who claim to be God's ministers but deny his word disgust me.
The scientists and the theologians think creationists are speaking nonsense. Thanks for clarifying that
If a person who calls himself/herself, a Christian and doesn't believe that ADAM existed, than that person doesn't believe in God,,for If there was no ADAM, then where did man come from Jhon 20:29
I accepted Adam into my heart.
And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.
However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual.
The first man was of the earth, made of dust; the second Man is the Lord from heaven
Amen ICR
Excellent presentation. However, I think thete needs to be greater emphasis on the dangers brought in by false teachers. And allowing old age and evolution to be compatible with the gospel is false teaching from my perspective. Also, how about calling out some of the big name falsr teachers by name? Who's teachings do we need to be wary of?
You are literally listening to false teachtu
I have difficulty believing that a person can be a true Christian without accepting Adam and Genesis Creation Account as Written
Excellent, we need much more of this. Deluded, secular conjecture is delivered with such gloss and professionalism.
Too often truth is delivered unprofessionally and in a manner that shows little clarity and rigor.
Marvelous video. Keep it coming!
Me too, Scientific Creationism!
This is a pretty good one. Still, you're letting dogmatic assumption leak in.
Where in any Scripture does God say creation is now bad because of the fall?
He doesn't.
Creation Incorporated everything that would exist because of and during the fall into creation.
God did not look down on creation and say, it is very good and there will never be disease, or pestilence or war and death.
He looked down on creation and said it is very good, knowing what Adam and Eve were going to do.
Creation was never intended to be a perfect garden of Eden for two people forever. Our creation happened for the plan of salvation.
The bible doesn't say that creation is ever bad, but it is cursed by God himself and then judged. Adam and Eve were meant to tend the creation with the Lord but whatever world that then existed was all fundamentally changed the day of the fall. Perhaps it was that entropy and decay was introduced.
But God certainly condemns it. First at the flood where everything alive at the time is destroyed and wiped out, except for those on the ark. The bible says that the world will again be be destroyed but this time it will be by fire. The future is described as Christ returning and making a new heaven and a new earth where all sin has been removed.
Here are a few of many passages:
Genesis 3:17 "“Cursed is the ground because of you"
Romans 8:20 "For the creation was subjected to futility, not by its own will, but because of the One who subjected it..."
Hebrews 6:8 "But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless, and its curse is imminent. In the end it will be burned"
2 Peter 3:10 "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up."
@@preoccupied4800
Exactly.
Yet so many of these young Earth creationists commonly say that creation was very good until the fall and then it was bad. Bad was not my choice of word, and I argue against it because it is not in the Bible in this context.
I do have a problem with these Young Earth Creationists who continue to tell people that creation was bad after the Fall. It wasn't. It isn't. We still have much beauty and goodness in the Earth with us.
"Cursed" and "bad" aren't synonymous here...
@@jennifertrussell5711
Exactly
I don’t understand how one cannot believe in the real Adam and yet still claim to be saved ? What’s their hangup ?
Amen brothers!
Too much liberal thinking in the church today. Stick to the bible. That's what we need to do.
❤
Gee, I thought I only had to believe what God said in the Bible.
Amen
Adam and Eve have a lot of apologizing to do.
56:30 Open theism, and of itself, does not necessitate or assume millions of years. I know open theists that hold to a creationist position.
When carbon 12 dating was explaining to me trade, I thought that it sounds like circular reasoning. Of course I said nothing. I just thought in my head that I had misunderstood.
William Craig has lost all credibility
The Bible is the Word of God, the opinion of men with scientific titles and nothing is the same. God spoke, recorded in His Word, that's enough.😊
Amen brother
Why do some models show that we came from a pool of 10,000 or so humanoids? Is that Swamidass' model?
Population bottleneck
But before Adam, 1/3 of the angels and Lucifer rebelled
Did exist not one but as many as are married couples..
Do you really think that this Genesis account given to Moses by God on the mountain is all myth and fairytale ... or do we CHOOSE TO ACCEPT GOD'S CHOSEN ACCOUNT to be exactly what it is .. For a reason ??
Since there is NO proof that Moses actually existed, I guess that kind of answers your question.
These vids need million views not some fake monkey to man cartoon
20:40
Why did the writing of the Bible beginning of man
you can thank the Catholic Church for all the issues present.
+++YES+++
Even greater earth works or abundant in the northern panhandle of West Virginia, demonstrated along what is now called the warrior trail. Between the Ohio river and the Monongahela River, that’s where Eden resides, and the evidences are clear terraces earthworks.
Sin is an interesting subject. Sin is conviction under the law. When Jesus died for our sins, He lifted the conviction/condemnation. I believe there were lots of people living on Earth before God Almighty intervened, forming Adam. God from Genesis 1 created man in a reductionist way of creating. The LORD formed Adam in a adding to sort of way. If that's not true then that's not what the word says. But it is what the word says. "On the 7th day God rested and blessed His creation for these are the generations in which the LORD GOD created the heavens and the Earth." You could say that little creator God mimicked the LORD's expansive creation for a purpose that was not the LORD's. Satan is the god of this world; is that not biblical? Adam being formed meant the flesh party's days are numbered.
Very compelling arguments here, though. However, there is more evidence that doesn't fit either world view that is ignored by both sides. I would live if these men would research Brian Forester's elongated skulls and come together for another discussion! Will they?
The short answer is, well, NO!
short answer....Genesis 1 to 11 is literal...
Another reason to believe Adam was real, is his presence in end times prophecy. The Ancient of Days (Daniel 7:22) is Adam.
(edit) Great video.
That's very interesting. I've never heard of this before. Is there any supporting text (apart from Daniel 7:22)?
“…until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High…”
- I think the Ancient of Days is the Son (in this verse)
- the Son comes & judges in our favor🙏🏻
- this is the high point - chiasma - of Book of Daniel
- the Son is given dominion in v. 14
- I do not think this refers to the First Adam. Adam died. Dust. Back to the earth.
- we are all descended from the first Adam.
- we look to the Last Adam = Jesus. The life giving Spirit.
@@007gracie I see how you can come to your conclusions with the limited information available to yourself. But, it clearly describes the Son of Man in Daniel 7.
I already put the place where the Lord explicitly identified The Ancient of Days. It isn't here. I don't know if it was computer blip or if Creation Research Institute is against people discussing evidences.
"Spring Hill is named by the Lord Adam-ondi-Ahman, because, said he, it is the place where Adam shall come to visit his people, or the Ancient of Days shall sit, as spoken of by Daniel the prophet." is what the Lord said on May 19, 1838 about a hill in Davies County, Missouri.
We all know that the Bibile is all alegory and nit literal. Thise people never existed.
It's too bad Eve thought it a good idea to go outside of the order God designed--with Adam as the leader. If she'd "consulted" him first, perhaps he'd have been able to talk her out of her foolish desire. But it appears that after losing her to sin, he felt he "had" to follow in her footsteps which then also made her the leader as they chose to eat from the tree of THE KNOWLEDGE OF good AND EVIL.
They were equals before the fall. In fact Adam was standing right there watching it unfold and did nothing to support or encourage her to do the right thing.
@@jennifertrussell5711 Neither of those claims is anything I read in my Bible.
"And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an HELP MEET for him."
Genesis 2:18 KJV
The unique word used for help meet is only used in a handful of other places, and often it's in the context of God being the help meet in time of trouble for Isreal. More Wonder Woman, less Joan Cleaver. Nothing of this "identifier" is subordinate.
But unfortunately, she abused that power and...
"Unto the woman he said... thy desire shall be to thy husband, and HE SHALL RULE OVER THEE."
Genesis 3:16 KJV
It was the climax of the curse on her. "Now, he will rule over you."
Adam observed and mistakenly trusted Eves' lead on this one
"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her HUSBAND WITH HER; and he did eat."
Genesis 3:6 KJV
Other translations are even more blatant with the wording: "Who was there with her" etc
Jesus was culture-shockingly scandalous about His stance on the worthiness and redemption of women. I think He was making a point that we should be careful not to miss as we identify ourselves and our roles as wives and mothers and raisers-up of the "quiver full of arrows." 🙏🏻
@@bootycalled2780 Loving sin and rebellion against God is no laughing matter. It's *asking for* the eternal lake of fire. Jesus *died* to keep you out of that fire, but you must repent of ALL rebellion and choose to serve Him, your creator, now and from here forward.
@@bootycalled2780 You have to have your head stuck in the sand and be demon possessed to think all of that.
Adam is an ancient Hebrew Golem spell. You're welcome.
Taking into account the creation of man from the earth and the breath of life from the divine. Yes, the line of variability started from that date. Now Eve came from the DNA of Adam from the rib of the man. We must remember the now famous DNA back tracing of the female that can get to a single female. How is that different from back taking to single common male ancestor?
Only mothers dna is stored in the mitochondria so only female lineage can be traced with this method
If God is what you think He is then He should have made it clear.
He did
@@jennifertrussell5711 You can delude yourself should you want to. Ever thought why there are over 1000 Christian religions...?
@dongee1664 Lots of religions call themselves funny things. But straight reading from the collections of writings we were left paints a picture about our origins that's clear and accurate, unless you start weaving fake science and hybrid doctrine into it. That was my point. Theology behind the rest of our story gets messier, but this aspect shouldn't be the clusterschmuck it is.
@@jennifertrussell5711 You are strengthening my point Jennifer....
@@dongee1664 you're missing mine
You can't create
anybody who reads the genesis creation week, and doesnt accept it for what it is, are to be pittied, from my point of view. I read it years ago, and immedately knew it was truth. which is true. Hang in there and keep doing what you are doing, may God richley bless you.
It is absolutely hilarious to watch these bible literalists desperately scramble for damage control when scientists and historians have discovered that their origin story is pure fantasy, AND a lot of other Christians have learned to live with this simple fact!
Eve heard and understood Gods plain instruction "if you eat of it, you'll surely die".... enter the serpent "you wont surely die". Our choice = believe Him / refuse to take Him at His word
What a dopey question! "Is Adam a Myth"? How can he NOT be! His name means "red earth" or "red clay" - - a clear synonym of the "dust" he returned to when he died. So whoever the individual actually was, unless he's still living, he is indeed DEAD, and his body has indeed returned to the dust of the earth just like God said.
I mean, none of us were around then to witness him being *named* Adam - - I doubt he kept a diary or the like - - so, whatever name his family called him is now moot: to *US* he's "Adam" - - Mr. Earth, aka Mr. Dust. Quite evidently NOT a myth as long as he actually died and decomposed.
Perhaps what you meant to say was something more like, "Can anything that was written about Adam actually be verified?"
At the beginning you say how can he NOT be a myth but at the end you say the opposite. In between is a alot of disconnected statements. Your position is muddled at best
Before the video even starts let's be clear about something... All evolutionist believe every species that exists starts with just 1... Not even 2.....🤣🤣🤣
And yet somehow 2 always *magically* evolved the same mutations while simultaneously diverging enough to be different sexes but not diverging so much that their sex organs or gamete were incompatible. Oh wait. And all that had to happen in close enough proximity for the creatures to seek one another out since the majority of the (non existent) transitional forms of animals would have been too crippled to get far without being eaten 😮
Again, the answer is No.
My search began as a search for Eden, the evidence of the real place. I had to this day, believe that not the entire earth was covered with the remains but a special place was protected by the ice sheet that fell from the sky, the firmament. And it covered, the evidence the mounds, the earth works in central Ohio the Ohio valley. So I came to believe by seeing these things like the serpent mound the Great Circle, Mound, the Octagon, Mound, and the Mound’s before them.
What?
I think Jerusalem is a better candidate for Eden with 4 rivers flowing from underneath the Temple Mount. That fact is not well known and flows through underground aqueducts so it doesn’t show up on a map. It would make sense for God to use this place where the temple was later built. I can’t say for certain but it’s the best candidate I can find.
Eden was wiped off the earth in the flood. God said it was the entire world, so it WAS the entire world. And now the supporting geological proof for that level of destruction is overwhelming
What? I got some of that, but not all of it. Would you mind editing what you wrote so it makes more sense?
@@jennifertrussell5711 If Eden was the entire world, then how were Adam and Eve driven from it?
Yes. Adam is a myth.
Creation research? Is that real science?
Sure is. Exciting huh! Do you accept abiogenesis even though there is zero evidence for it? You call that science?
Jake
A provable paradigm!
The human invention of fake transitional forms (a lizard bird with feathers, etc) and other unreproducible, therefore non-scientific notions, simply confirms the foolishness and willing ignorance to deny our Creator.
If the theory is that 1 became 1.000000001 then 1.000000002 then 1.000000003 all the way until it reached 2, then in the same way from 2 to 3 and 3 to 4, but all you ever find is 1, 2, 3, 4, etc. and never any 8.35467854357 then OBVIOUSLY that theory is wrong. End of discussion.
Did Adam have a bellybutton guys, or someone please respond, thank you... Love the vids... 🎉