The General and The Great Locomotive Chase
Вставка
- Опубліковано 13 кві 2022
- To help keep our lights on: / highironvideos
To continue to see updates, photos, and new videos from High Iron, including San Juan Branch Line, follow us on Facebook: / highironvideos
Music obtained by UA-cam Audio Library and MusOpen. - Авто та транспорт
We were fortunate enough to see the General under steam when it stopped over in Belleville Il. when on it's tour in 63 or 64. Quite a deal for our young eyes. The L&N was a main rail road in this area back then. I always followed the story in the news of the court battle. Years later, I took my wife and young son to visit the south and we stopped at Kennesaw and viewed her again, even had lunch at the same cafe where the crew ate when they misplaced their train! There's a small sign over the bar that plainly stated that the management is not responsible for unattended trains on the line next door to the cafe. Later on that same trip we visited the Cyclorama in Atlanta to see the Civil war museum, and lo and behold there sat the Texas! Before that , I never knew where it was. A trip I will always remember!
Too add a bit more, little mentioned info on the museum at Kennesaw. While Mr Carter was governor, he got the urge to help the state tourism and asked the then management of the L&N about their plans for the General. This was shortly after the litigation was shut down by the courts. The L&N people were open to the museum idea and replied that no one had politely asked for it! So the deal was made and it was decided to put it back in the town where it all started and make an old cotton gin, mill site adjacent to the tracks, the new museum. Under cover of darkness with a state police escort the move was made and the loco was placed inside the building and the track removed and walled in, all before daylight and in secrecy so no other interference could get in the way! After all things were in place and secure , the new museum and display was made public. One of the better things that Mr Carter managed to do while in public office.
The fact there's a sign saying the management is not responsible for any unattended trains is funny
@@frankwurth5375 I've been been to see both! Also got to see the Texas and Cyclorama at the Atlanta History Center!
Hahaha about the unattended trains sign.
My son is obsessed with the General and the story of the Great Chase. Could you tell me where the cafe is that they ate at when the train was stolen? He would die to eat there w/ the history!
This was a very enticing story, and if anything, it must be one of the most famous moments in the history of 4-4-0 locomotives, let alone any American steamers.
No wonder Buster Keaton made a film about The General. And I'm amazed the original locomotive is preserved.
If only the engines used in that film were preserved...
@@jayo1212 especially the locomotive that went for a swim lol
@@mattskey1 but what can you do? We have zero way of knowing what the people of the future will consider valuable.
@@AJSSPACEPLACE true
As I was watching this, I was going "this sounds like that buster keaton scene I watched once" so that explains that
Hard to believe how 160 years ago became so significant. It definitely sped by fast at full steam.
Now it’s 161 years ago.
@@nathancorcoran5347 162 now
Preserved locomotives for static display, mechanically updated replicas for live steam operation. That way the original artifacts can continue to exist without wearing themselves out, but passengers still get to experience riding behind a vintage-looking engine that performs better than it would've if it was built long ago.
The Museum in Kennesaw is well worth visiting not only to see the General but also to see how they use to build locomotives .
A chance meeting! I met a person, DIRECTLY connected to the Great Locomotive Chase. His last name is Pittenger. June of 2015, I was at a 'live steam' meet in Chilaquin, Or. at the Train Mountain facility. As I was loading up my engine and rolling stock, getting ready to leave, I noticed an older man(not as old as me) helping me. His formal hat badge, said his name was So and So, Pittenger. Many miles later, that last name hits me !! There was a William Pittenger in the Andrews party. In one of my books about the great locomotive chase, this name is mentioned. And, it said that he was laid to rest in the San Diego area of California. So, this gentleman helping me, was a direct ancestor of one of the Great locomotive Chase participants. Ya can't make this kind of stuff up !!! Strange incident! Sorry for the long post again.
I think you meant "descendant" rather than "ancestor"!
wow!
Can I get the description of the train you were using when he came
Just a small note, but I love the themetrack you chose for this one. It realy adds to the vibe of period these trains are from. Well thought out and implemented, one of the reasons I keep coming back to this channel
I haven't had a chance to read all the comments here, but I have what might be a unique perspective on this story. I drive by the museum every day when I take my kids to school. I have actually had my picture taken in the cab of The General. We visit the museum a couple of times a year for the model train shows and we always pay The General a visit before we leave. When you live in Kennesaw, The General is like part of your extended family.
This is great timing as I am making a project about this for my History Class.
Coincidence, I think not
I just did
honestly, mad respect for the Northerners who hijacked the train. The absolute kahonees on those to steal a train in the middle of the Confederacy, in front of an ENEMY ARMY CAMP, makes them full on legendary. absolute mad lads
The Western & Atlantic #3 “General” is a beautiful locomotive.
Thank you for this very interesting video. I am lucky that I was born and raised in the same city that both the General, and the Texas were built in 1855 and 1856. the General is a Rodgers engine. built in Paterson, NJ. On the SE corner of Spruce and Market Sts. The Texas, was built right across the intersection on the NE corner of Spruce and Market Strs. It is a Grant Locomotive Works engine. The buildings of both locomotive builders still stand to this day. BTW, many yrs ago,(2001) I and a young friend, while retuning home from a live steam meet, were allowed to climb into the cab of the General. (my video on youtube, papasmurf7597) The curator allowed this rare cab visit after I told him that I was from the city where the engine was built . Sorry for the long post. Sincerely, Bruce Raykiewicz.
Not at all, Bruce. Glad you enjoyed the show!
Texas is a Cooke locomotive, not a Grant one.
i’ve seen this locomotive in person, at the Civil War Museum in Kennesaw. truly an incredible story 👍
My brother, sister and I donated the 65th Georgia flag brought home by our Great Great Grandfather after the war to the same museum where the General is and we were given the opportunity to ring the bell of the General at the unveiling ceremony.
This is a fascinating episode of the Civil War. I've seen both Disney's version with Fess Parker (my favorite) and the Buster Keaton version. By the way, the animation is really great!
As a history and railroading fanatic from the time I was in elementary school, this event continues to remain a very captivating one.
It's unlikely that I'll be able to see either the preserved Texas or General locomotives in person, but among my assorted railroad collectibles, I have the Hallmark issued diecast Christmas ornament of the General that was issued years ago as part of their railroading/trains collection. Additionally, I have a 3D blow-molded plastic souvenir of the General, produced from one of those funky/kitchy '60s vintage machines that could/can be found in such institutions like the Pacific Science Center in Seattle (where I obtained mine), where I worked for a number of years as an installer in the Exhibit Department in the "Aughts/early 20-teens". Those will have to continue to serve as placeholders for experiencing the real thing, for now.
Tangentially, the inclusion of Gustav Holst's "Mars" from "The Planets" suite in your presentation brings back plenty of memories of my time as a bass clarinetist in my high school Symphonic Band, 30+ years ago. Like the General and the Texas got a workout through their respective evasion and pursuit, that particular musical selection was a workout through all registers... and remains one of my favorites.
Lastly, I may have read about these various details before, but it's been a number of years and I've likely forgotten a lot, so your video was certainly much appreciated, and serves as inspiration for me to get back into revisiting that dynamic (to say the least) period in our nation's history. Thanks!
Wow. Just wow. This was extremely well done! This is the most in depth story of this event I’ve ever seen! I was fairly familiar with the story before this but I definitely learned a thing or two from watching this. This is definitely a part of American history not well told, but y’all did this event justice! Job well done!
I live in Chattanooga, TN on the Ringgold, GA border. There’s a large monument on Ooltewah-Ringgold Rd. at the spot where the General “died”. That railroad is still very active. My house is about 1 1/2 miles as the crow flies from the monument, up on a wooded ridge, so some of the raiders could have ended up in my yard:) There’s a song I played with a local symphony called The Great Locomotive Chase by Robert W. Smith written in commemoration for this event.
im a cello player and i never thought that id hear new world symphony in a train video. great work!
Ever since I was little, I have loved American railroad history. And then I saw “The General”, a fictional movie made by Buster Keaton, based off of the Great Locomotive Chase. And that’s how I became fascinated with the civil war. And so now, two words that could be used to some up my interests are “railroad” and “America”.
I simply cannot imagine those old engines running along those wooden ties and old steel rails at 60 miles an hour
The General is honestly a super funny movie. Buster Keaton's physical comedy is awesome
Its nice to see an unbiased account of something about the Civil War. Thanks for this
The Civil War isn't exactly something you should speak about without bias. There's a very clear objective villain
Call Superman for your comic book problems
@@WasatchGarandMan I'd hardly call treason from a country in the pursuit of legalizing making a racial minority slaves a "comic book problem". But please do keep deflecting
@@Delta-lu5kf I will continue fo deflect
@@Delta-lu5kf What's wrong with low black unemployment?
“A cold locomotive on static display is like propping up a corpse.” However, I will make exceptions!
I believe in this case Paul Merriman would agree
The General is defenetly one of my favorite locomotives ever, as it is one of my childhood favorites. This is because I actually live in Dalton. Yes, I have the Disney movie, I've been through the Tunnel Hill tunnel many times, and, of course, been to the big shanty museum and see the General. I plan on going back again too. So yea, it's apart of my home town's history so the General and the W&ARR is special to me
Have you seen the Texas? I was delivering flowers around Atlanta, and stopped for a break and randomly found the engine parked close to where I parked my truck! Haha.
@@FordHoard Nope, I haven't seen it. I've been to Atlanta many times but I don't know where it is located. But, if I did, it would complete my I guess you would call it, " My Great Locomotive Chase Search" or something like that
@@MaddoxsTrains Haha yeah it would! It's in a museum in Buckhead. I'm going to go back there soon, since I didn't have time to look at it since I was working when I randomly stumbles across it.
Love this iteration. I’ve been to Huntsville which is an hour away from me and have seen the markings on the walls for how long the soldiers were kept prisoner there
Excellent video!! I’d love to see your take on some other famous rail events: Casey Jones’ Last Ride, or the Abbot’s Ripton Train Crash, if I may suggest a few.
I do appreciate how you had The New World symphony playing in the background the whole time.
The Planets (Mars) by Holtz; at least for the chase...
That was in an absolutely AWESOME ,historical presentation! Well done.
This isn't related to the (current) video, but here's a VERY interesting idea for a ("What If...?), the failed Southern Pacific-Santa Fe merger attempts of the 1980s.
So now I know about this engines history! I saw the General in 2019 with my grandparents and honestly I still loved it but now I love it even more!
Very nicely edited and great job documenting this!
Very nice video, @High Iron :)
*sees that Jim Wrinn tribute near the end*
Man.... it's still hard to believe he is really gone.... :(
What a wonderful tribute. Thank you for sharing.
Our pleasure!
I really like the way you’ve moved the Trainz camera in this. Great work
my question is how he fixed the Assets
@@pilotbug6100 I know High iron is really REALLY good with getting Trainz locomotives and routes to work as they did in their previous versions.
Most large American amusement parks have 36” gauge locomotives built to resemble a 19th century 4-4-0. Busch Gardens, Kings Island, Six Flags St. Louis, Worlds of Fun, all have 4-4-0 steam locomotives built by Crown Metal Products. While not exactly replicas in terms of scale, they are probably the closest modern example of an 19th century engine with exception to the Leviathan and the York.
AND they actually made a movie about it! In... 1929 by buster keaton and its called the general! Best train movie ever definitely recomend watching
theirs just something about 4-4-0's that looks so beautiful when the light hits that shiny new paint just right. can anyone else relate?
Just loved it. The Andrews Raid was the first US Civil War story I ever heard, aged about 8 back in 1961. I have the Kitmaster, Mantua and Airfix/MPC models, and both films in my collection, and read Pittinger's book many years ago. Well done, you got the engines right for the Civil War period (they were quite heavily rebuilt/renewed several times in their active lives) - pity the people were not up to the same standard but there must be limitations to this media. John Buchan (39 Steps, Mr Standfast etc) retold the story (the most modern in his 'Book of Escapes and Hurried Journies )and made the point that, although widely known, the incident wasn't really that major an event in the overall history of the war. But, as he said, had it not happened the world would have been short of a marvelous story!
I had the great good fortune to see and ride behind the General when it came through Nashville on its Civil War centennial tour.
Interesting that at the time, both of these engines ran on 5ft gauge track, and were converted to standard after the war. It seems to be something that isn't represented on the digital models that I've seen. It would be interesting to see that in a game.
Almost unfortunate that the North didn't get to keep it as a spoil of war. But it's an amazing piece of history and a funny story. I hope to travel to see it, and hopefully get to see it under steam.
Bugger it! This would’ve come so much more in handy when we were preparing to record the musical piece based upon this event! Great video tho, I had no idea that the Texas survives too! That’s certainly something to write home about
It's amazing that the tracks of era could handle 60mph trains...That had to be the "all out" speed for those locomotives.
I saw the GENERAL when she made a stop at Gettysburg during its Centennial in 1963.
This was most certainly a exciting, yet interesting story
Thanks for the story
I had a train poster in my room at my dad’s house in New Westminster, British Columbia. Among the trains were Stephenson’s Rocket, an early electric locomotive, and the General.
The General has also been featured in several video games, such as Railway Empire.
These videos keep getting better and better!
I showed this story to my dad and he loves it
Glad that these engines still exist.
I was delivering plants around Atlanta, and I made a stop one day to take a break, and I had parked right next to the Texas locomotive! I had always heard about the great locomotive chase and wanted to see the engines, but I had no idea they were so close, and it's funny how I randomly stumbled into one of them.
What a wonderful video, thank you so much!
1855 I believe was the year the engine was originally built and first ran
Very enjoyable history beyond the chase story. Thanks Brian.
Glad you enjoyed it, Tom!
I was so excited for this!
Sorry to hear about the death of Jim Wrinn, who did so much in so many areas of rail history and preservation.
North Cobb High School class of 94! Kennesaw Ga ! I loved living there!..funny note, in 1992, we a tornado rip through out town, and it jumped over the Big Shanty and destroyed the store next door..
I remember reading the book about this story in middle school it was such a fun read
what a wonderful tale of history!
The 4-4-0 is a classic design, and I think there will always be at least one steaming somewhere. If nothing else, they're relatively simple compared to modern designs, and the plans for the replicas made for Promontory Point are freely available due to being funded by public money as a government project, so anybody can make a new one if they so desire.
Always a popular design for live steam miniature locomotives, as well as in the smaller scales.
That's true, During the Civil War they were so famous that these featured in countless movies and music.
btw music in background: "A. Dvořák Symphony No.9 From the New World Karajan"
Love steam locomotives, trains in general and absolutely love Buster Keaton and The General.
I have a great history for ya! The Kinzua Bridge in Mckean County Pennsylvania and how it was used to move freight over deep valleys! The bridge even goes uphill in one direction!
Might I recommend doing something about British trains in India
I think it would be cool to see trains as not just a means of transportation but of colonialism aswell.
Thanks for the documentary. Now to watch Buster Keaton's movie.
Seen the general when it went through Pemberville,Ohio the third engineer Wilson W Brown was my cousin
A small bit of trivia pertaining to both the General and the Texas. Both engines were built in Paterson, New Jersey.
The 'General' being a Rogers engine, circa 1856. The 'Texas' a Grant engine, circa 1857. Both engines were built, exactly across the street from each other. ( at the intersection of Market and Spruce Streets, Paterson, NJ).
HELL YEAH I am so happy this one wasn’t scrapped
Ma God comfort the Wrinn family. My condolences. Thank you for this wonderful story!
Hmm, never heard of this story before. Now I have! Interesting!
Awesome video 👍😎🇺🇸
This is a pretty cool engine and a intersting story
It's a shame these old girls aren't the most useful in today's preserved railway scene, it would just be glorious to ride behind a regularly operating American in period stock. I am excited for the Reno to be returned to steam on the V&T so at long last we can have a genuine 19th century American working semiregulary on its home track.
Perfect example of restoring and useing an old steam locomotive and what happens to them after over use is Strasburg railroad engine #31 it was built in 1908 for The Grand trunk western RR in Canada if i remember correctly it's a USRA 0-6-0 or it slips my mind but she worked until the 1950s bought by Strausburg in the 50s restored and returned to steam passenger service on Sept 10th 1960 and became the United States first returned to service steam passenger train. (Not a Heritage line real passenger serivce line) also SBRRs first steam locomotive since the 1920s.
In 2009 #31 went for her 1472 day inspection. Where the locomotive is disassembled and inspected. Due to use as a fright and passgenger train for the Grand trunk and western then a passenger service for SBRR there was alot of wear and tear and much of the locomotive needed repair or replacement parts. It is 2022 and #31 still sits in pieces next to the Heritage line parking lot rotting and rusting away. Not from neglect no no no, just the shear amount of money It would cost to repair and rebuild herb which got the project side tracked (since 2009). if it was restored in 09 it would be up for another 1472 day in 2024. Over the years parts from #31 were used to repair the locomotives that they do run. Sad but it's the truth. And the worst part is most people enjoy looking at and rideing vintage trains but won't donate toward efforts to help restore them.
I like the music in the beginning
I still feel like General and Texas need To share a home someday. If they could ever work that out. It jus seems wrong to have the two separated
Missed opportunity to use the song based off of this story “the great locomotive chase”
Copyright reasons would've prohibited the use of it. :/
@@HighIron oh ok 👌
There is a bit of Irony to this story that exists that not very many people know about. Private Jacob Parrott was the first man to receive the Congressional Metal of Honor for his role in the Great Locomotive Chase. However he was born and raised in a town in Ohio known by the name of Kenton. Over 100 years later, Kenton, Ohio would be famous again for becoming the location of where they stopped 8888 after it got away in 2001.
oh the irony
dont mind my name btw
I remember building paper models of both those locomotives when the movie came out. There was a third locomotive model in the set, but I don't remember what it was,
Nice Video!
To add to this saga. If the general were to be re-built back to operating condition, CSX would have the rights to retain or claim the locomotive. This coming from documents in the CSX files located in jacksonville fl. The condition of the General remaining in the museum where she resides now, is stipulated in these documents still to this day.
The use of steam locomotives during the Civil War by both north and south was so famous that it inspired the song Chattanooga Choo Choo which was written in the 1940s and first covered by Glenn Miller
RIP Jim Wrinn, thanks.
Love this event in Civil War history 👏
I lived next to the golden spike for a couple years and literally never went to see it. I didn’t know about railroad history as a kid now I just wished I railfanned Ogden
Nice Video
Something I think could be a good compromise regarding the whole operational use of the General and the Texas is leaving the originals in as original condition as possible and preserving them, and then *also* building modern replicas to use for events where steaming up is needed.
I have a hallmark version of the 2nd Lionel 4-4-0 introduced :D
Most railroads in the south during the Civil War were 5 foot gauge, so undoubtedly the General was too. At some point it would have to have been modified to standard gauge, along with the rest of the changes made.
One thing I wish you did cover was the song "the great locomotive chase" which was inspired by these events
Can you make a video of the history of the ET&WNC railroad?
Three cheers for the L&N!
I know this is quite an old video now and you probably won’t check the comments, but I absolutely love this video, it was one of the best I’ve ever seen and made me fall in love with the channel on the spot. Do you know which song the dramatic music you use a lot during this video is? You can hear it at 3:12 and I’d love to be able to listen to it without commentary. *EDIT:* Never mind my music question, I found it literally 3 seconds after. It’s Movement 4 of From the New World.
Yes
Ah I remember playing “the great locomotive chase” in highschool
What a nice billboard at 13:33! I wonder what it's a reference to. Must be a very insightful, thought provoking, and useful advertisement for something that can change my life forever while watching a video with a clip of 1960s Kingston, Georgia! Oh boy! Oh golly gee whiz! How interesting and insightful! I just do wonder what that could be. Hmm... Would you look at that! I just must really have a tinge of interest as to what the context of this billboard must be! Ho ho ho! Hee hee hee! Ha ha! I do wish to know what that must be! Hmmm... How insightful. How intriguing and perhaps even mind-boggling! This must be quite a charming piece of kit to be advertised in 1960s Kingston, Georgia, along the right of way of the Great Locomotive Chase, on the Louisville and Nashville Railroad! Yes, of course! Quite an interesting billboard! I do wish to know what this billboard is.
🤔
Every year I watch the disney movie to celebrate its anniversary. Of course only now did I learn that there was some differences between this and what actually happened
high iron is the best youtuber 😀
The music at 3:02 reminds me of the 1936 BBC Television film called Television Comes to London. I wonder what it's called.